Punitive measures by Obama. This is over the top. He must hate me.

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   Ericdierkerposted 11 years ago

   Obama Administration Forces Hundreds of Privately Funded Parks to Close Amid Shutdown
   By Diane MacedoPublished October 03, 2013FOXBusiness
   http://www.foxbusiness.com/government/2 … -hundreds-
   privately-funded-parks-to-close-amid/
   
   Why would any man order such a thing? How wrongful can Obama get. These parks were, are paying the government. And their parks are awesome and provided jobs and benefits to the communities.
   These orders came direct from the White House not the agencies.
   
   I now can feel confident that Obama is to blame for our shutdown. No one could act this evil and spiteful hurting citizens for political gain like this without being seriously misguided.
   
   Perhaps those of us with kids that camp should start putting together care packages for the families so abused by the White House.

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      wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      The link doesn't work.
      
      I can only speculate without the link, but shutting down independently funded parks coincides with the purpose of the general shutdown: to show everyone how politically powerful those involved are.  To convince everyone that the other side is wrong.  To sling mud on the other party and show them to be evil.

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         Ericdierkerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Wilderness, Here is another one that shows 32 sport programs shutdown even though independent revenues from football pays for them.
         
         "Football revenue funds Navy's 32 other sports teams."
         
         hopefully this works for the link: http://www.foxbusiness.com/government/2013/10/03
         
         
         http://news.yahoo.com/navy-set-weekend- … --spt.html

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            wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            The first doesn't work, the second says Army, Navy, etc. will be playing football this weekend.   ???

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               Ericdierkerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               That is the article but reading it shows that Obama shut down other programs that the gov. did not fund.

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            Ericdierkerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Yes they did indeed shut down or move that link.
            It was about private parks that lease government land and pay rent being shutdown on orders direct from the White House, One group the police evicted from places they stay and live within the parks.

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               wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Were I renting a piece of land from Uncle Sam and he suddenly declared I could not have access to it because the govt. shut down there would most definitely be a lawsuit in the making.  For one day's rental, loss of income, pain and suffering, illegal eviction or anything else I could dream up.

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      MelissaBarrettposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Without reading the article, I do have to say that while those parks may be funded in part with private money, the staff (including security and maintenance) are paid with federal funds.

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         AnalogousMethodposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         You're wrong. These are privately-managed. They have no federal employees, no federal staff, and no federal funds. They actually generate revenue and that goes to the government.

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            Ericdierkerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            I wonder who pays to insure the parks when they are closed. I wonder who pays electricity and water which must be kept on for fire prevention.

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               wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Probably the renter.  It would for anything else.

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                  Ericdierkerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  Interesting question. The insurance aspect is interesting as is the question of Force Majeur
                  hope this link works: http://ppp.worldbank.org/public-private … le-clauses

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                     wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     Although Obama will certainly disagree, I certainly do not see it as a Force Majeur.  "Beyond the control of the Authority and the Operator [government] does NOT mean actions resulting from fully voluntary actions of that Authority [government].
                     
                     Government shut down government.  That it was begun by a small number of politicians is irrelevant, as is that it took half the politicians to implement it or stop it.  Government, the signing entity, the "Authority" referenced, did it without outside force being used.  Not Force Majeur.

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               AnalogousMethodposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               The management company handles everything. Just one of these companies employs something like 700 people, and those people can't work now, for absolutely no reason. They weren't closed because the government shut down, they were closed because the Obama administration is trying to hurt people so they can blame it on the Republicans.

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                  bBereanposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  The sequester shut down white house tours?  That says it all.

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      Electro-Denizenposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      It looks like someone on the inside, deep inside the system, wants the gov't as we know it to go kaput - put that alongside the endless printing of money which we now have (dubiously called 'quantitive easing' - and which even 1st year Economics students are warned about) to prop up the economy (from the completely unpayable debts)... and what we have is... something not very pretty, but also highly engineered...

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         Ericdierkerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         I hate to admit it, but this combined with Obama's tactics of saying the Republicans will cause us to default is kind of pursuasive.

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   Kathleen Cochranposted 11 years ago

   All the people who aren't going to get their paychecks to take care of their families, federal employees who are now stranded in foreign countries without the funds to pay their rent, children whose head start programs are closed, and others who are fighting deadly diseases and are being turned away from treatment - and your greatest concern is going to a park?  Seriously?  The House could reopen the government with a single vote.  All the rest of it is theater.

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      Ericdierkerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Kathleen, these parks pay the government to operate -- that would be revenue. Get it. The family in France or the head start program is an expense - get it? your argument belongs someplace else.
      And what about the families of the closed privately run parks -- they do not count?
      I am not talking about the shutdown here though. I am talking about senseless hurtful administration conduct.
      I hope you understand the difference between shutting down something that requires funding and Gov. employees and shutting down something that does not and actually pays the Gov.

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         wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Cannot agree that it is senseless.  The clear intent is to cause as much ill will against the R party as possible - the more people hurt and the worse the hurt, the more ill will.  It's a political game, at least as bad as the original blackmail.

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            Ericdierkerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            But how can someone now blame that on either party? It is clear that it is now completely bi-partisan. I guess finally the politicians have something they can get together on.

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               wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               I never said it made sense, only that it is what we see.
               
               Blame the R's because they blackmailed Obama to get rid of Obamacare.
               
               Blame the D's because they didn't give in to the blackmail and (most reasonably ) put off Obamacare for only one more year.  Or, after one year, whatever more it takes until the R's have a majority large enough to get rid of it completely.
               
               Blame everyone but the politicians that comport themselves as little children that can't play together .

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      Act 3posted 11 years agoin reply to this

      I think you are right on target Kathleen. There is a lot of theater in this forum thread, too!

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   Kathleen Cochranposted 11 years ago

   I think my argument is right where it belongs, and there seems to be no shortage of misunderstanding on anything pertaining to this subject.  Get it?

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      Ericdierkerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Yep I do get where you are coming from.

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   Reality Bytesposted 11 years ago

   Not closing parks near Democratic senators’ houses.
   
   Sources tell TheDCNF that Lincoln Park in D.C., which maintained by the NPS, was not closed down, nor were any signs put up that indicated it was closed due to the government shutdown. According to the same source, it’s close to the homes of “quite a few” Democratic senators, and the source has previously seen Montana Democratic Sen. Max Baucus walking in the park.
   
   While Lincoln Park remains seemingly open for Baucus and other senators to go for a walk, national parks all across Montana have been closed down and thousands of tourists have been turned away.
   
   
   Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2013/10/02/seven … z2ghU98TSW

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   Seth Winterposted 11 years ago

   In my area we have Whiskeytown Lake which is Federal. They shut the entire place down. All the hiking trails, beaches, etc. They still have the same number of rangers on driving around giving people tickets who try to use the lake or hiking trails. The shutdown is designed to hurt the people plain and simple.

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   alexsaez1983posted 11 years ago

   I think this whole thing is disastrous. I'm glad I live in Canada where people don't start calling each other communists/fascists just because they have different political views, and there's a consensus about providing healthcare for all. Sadly, this shutdown could eventually affect things up here, the way George Bush's little economic foul-up caused an educated guy like me to work retail for lack of jobs.
   
   It's not that this shutdown is meant to hurt the people, but rather it's a way to make the other party look bad. The people are simply collateral damage in a pissing match between a child who can't stand losing and another child who can't get anything done.

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   Wayne Brownposted 11 years ago

   I just heard a gentleman on the radio today .  He operates a hotel concession on the Blue Ridge Parkway.  The Parkway is open and patrolled but he has received word from the Federal government that he must shut down even though the government does not expend one dime for his doors to be open.  He has refused and now Park Rangers are blocking the entrance to the hotel so that they cannot do business.  The man has potential customers and the Parkway remains open but the government refuses to allow the business to function.  The business employs 100 people who will receive no pay because they government continues to call the presence of the Park Rangers out front "essential services"  This is indicative of the game being played by Obama and Company to bring pain to the lowest level and paint the conservative side of the aisle wrong.  It is amazing what happens when someone attempts to bring some level of fiscal responsiblity to this federal government.  It is also quite amazing what the government can get away with when someone is operating a concession on government lands.  ~WB

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      Ericdierkerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      I spoke with a die hard Democrat today. And they are still blaming Republicans for this kind of nonsense. Wow! These closures of operators that take no services and pay the government is so bizarre and yet wacky partisans just refuse to see that Obama is not required to shut down concessionaires and it has in fact never been done.. Head shaking is the rule of the day.

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   hfortinberryposted 11 years ago

   This may seem out of place, but let me expound to you the inner workings of our Commander-in-Chief.  How could I know that? you may ask.  Well, let me tell you that i was married to a sociopath for ten years and it wasn't until eighteen years of living around him, due to the fact that we share a son, that his condition became apparent.  I won't go into the details of my sordid life, but I will say that the games that are being played out are games that I myself have lived.  Sociopaths cannot lose; they have to win at someone else's expense.  This is a primary motive.  There is no reasonableness in a sociopath because they cannot empathize with others; they are born without the fundamental ingredient that makes humans distinctly different from other species.  They lack conscience, and therefore have very little opportunity to actually be self-aware.  They instead flit from one crisis to another crisis (I lived it!) because they really have no ability to think about consequences, personal or otherwise.  The only thing that they know how to do is manipulate and lie to their constituents, which are referred to as their accomplices, which always turn into their eventual victims.  They act like their constituents are their best friends, and joke with them, belittling others who may have become suspect of their lies (sound familiar?), but because they have no empathy, they can easily turn on these same people if they should wise up and become suspect as well.  They become angry and will become passive aggressive, like what is going on with the parks, etc. right now.  They inflict as much passive pain so that their enemies will be blamed.  I've lived it all, and didn't know what was going on.  You CANNOT expect any reasonable response from them, because they really are not human, they are lacking in that department. Anyway, welcome to my life of lessons learned and my perspective

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      Ericdierkerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Very interesting comparative analogy. Very strange conduct. And I dare say it seems to fit your pattern.

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      Zelkiiroposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      ORRRRRRRR...
      
      A sociopath is someone who cannot naturally empathize, so they have to rely on their knowledge of culture and social norms to guide them rather than their unconscious mind. Heck, even most autistic people (including high-functioning types like myself) are sociopaths, because their brains don't develop empathy (or many other useful social tools) as the rest of you do. It just means that we have to rationalize empathy to ourselves rather than experience and act on it automatically. Thus, a sociopath raised largely in solitude without being taught societal norms will naturally behave without adherence to societal norms.

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      A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      That sounds a whole lot more like the 80 Republicans who signed that letter.

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         Electro-Denizenposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         yup, it does

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   hfortinberryposted 11 years ago

   I'm sorry, you're right.   When you live with certain behavior, it becomes glaringly obvious to you.  But I am sorry.

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    hfortinberryposted 11 years ago

    Please read "The Sociopath Next Door" by Martha Stout, Ph.d; it may help you to know that I am not alone in my analysis.

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