The Moral Reason For The Rejection Of Christianity.

1. 61

   Link10103posted 9 years ago

   So another hubber a little while back decided to come onto my hub (http://link10103.hubpages.com/hub/Angry … hats-Funny) and tell me the true reason as to why I do not believe in Christianity, which is the moral reason.
   
   His post consisted of telling me that my reasons for non belief were based on lies, false interpretations of the bible/cherry picked bible verses, or something to that degree, to then give a video link where an interview takes place and discusses the moral reason for the rejection of Christianity. I deleted the post, told him the reason I deleted the post, and told him he needed permission to post video links on my hub but was free to tell others what to google to view it, yet my actual reason according to him is because the video was the truth and I was trying to censor him...after telling him he was free to say the name of the video. Several times.
   
   Contrary to what he actually believes, I watched the video for a few minutes before just stopping it altogether. One of the guys goes on to say that the reason most if not all atheists do not accept jesus as their lord and savior and give their live over to god is because they wish to remain in control of their life, that they do not want to be held accountable for their sins and as such purposefully choose to deny god. I stopped at the part where something about sexual freedom/identity/something came into play, since that had absolutely nothing to do with what was being said at the time.
   
   Now keep in mind, I do not believe in any one religion, because none have ever been proven to be true. That is the one core reason of my non belief, all the contradictions of religion in general are essentially additional reasons.
   
   According to this hubber though, It seems that the moral reason is why I supposedly run away screaming from Christianity specifically, that I do not want to be held accountable for my sins and such. With this in mind, I posed a counter question to him, which asked if that same moral reason can be applied to all the other religions that I do not believe in, even ones that do not condemn me for doing what I want with my life. It took a while to get an answer, but he asserted that it was the moral reason that I reject Christianity, to then suddenly become speculative and unsure as to why I would reject other religions, especially those that do not condemn my "sins".
   
   Am I the only one who sees the arrogance in this? I have no problem believing that a god exists, yet since none have ever come forth to prove themselves, I do not believe in any particular one. Even with this repeated countless times throughout the hub and comments, the assertion that it is the moral reason remains the same.
   
   I wasn't aware that the person being disagreed with had the right to tell the person disagreeing what their "true" reasons for disagreeing are, directly after ignoring the reason that was given.
   
   What are your thoughts on the moral reason for the rejection of Christianity SPECIFICALLY, since the moral reason falls completely apart when compared to all religions.

   replyreport
   1. 72

      lone77starposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      There are many flavors of Christianity. Nearly all of them are filled with Ego -- the "enemy" of Christ.
      
      The moral reason for rejecting each denomination can be based on the moral absolute of Ego as the source of all evil. Ego is division and separateness. Ego is the essence of "me versus you."
      
      To reject the core of Christianity, however, would be a moral obscenity.
      
      Who would hate "Love?" Who would hate "Peace?" Who would hate "Prosperity for All?"
      
      Ego corrupts all activities of man. It has corrupted religion, government, science and more.
      
      Most Jews and Christians have no idea that the core of the Bible was written in code by Kabbalists. So, every biblical literalist (atheists and believers) simply don't have a clue about what it's saying. Every claim is garbage. Every claim. Without that code, every discussion is nonsense, because it misses the real meaning.
      
      Rejecting the perversion of religion is a good thing. Thinking that you know the true religion without the code is a falsehood. Rejecting that truth has no moral basis.

      replyreport
      1. 77

         Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         Have you written any articles about the Kabbala?  - what you wrote here is very interesting.  Do you think Jesus taught advanced techniques of self-realization?

         replyreport
      2. 0

         Rad Manposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         But I suppose you feel YOU have the code and the understanding of the truth, much like most (but not all) believers. What a joke.

         replyreport
   2. 77

      Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I would say the true reason you don't believe in Christianity is because you see no reason to believe in it. The problem is that you listen to others. Just stop listening to them. When the student is ready, the teacher appears. Thats what I believe.

      replyreport
      1. 0

         Rad Manposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         Wow, if he listened to others (the majority) he'd be a believer.

         replyreport
      2. 61

         Link10103posted 9 years agoin reply to this

         I dont find reason to believe in any religion, let alone christianity, because again, none have been proven to be true over the other.
         
         I am flabbergasted as to how many times i have been told the "true" reason as to why i do not believe in someone's specific religion, all the while completely ignoring that i do not believe in any other religion either

         replyreport
         1. 77

            Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            I am allowed to think for myself. Aren't you?

            replyreport
            1. 61

               Link10103posted 9 years agoin reply to this

               Everyone is.
               
               What exactly does this have to do with what has been said though? You gave your thoughts in regard to the OP only to tell me that the problem resides with me listening to other people. Like Rad Man said, if that was the case, I would already be a theist.
               
               The problem is that people think for themselves and believe that they can think for others as well, in this case simply because they believe they are on the side of the winning deity with nothing to actually prove that to be true.

               replyreport
               1. 77

                  Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  You are allowed to think for yourself. Just ignore anyone who doesn't let you. Thats what I do. Been doin' it for years… years and years...

                  replyreport
   3. 79

      Say Yes To Lifeposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      "One of the guys goes on to say that the reason most if not all atheists do not accept jesus as their lord and savior and give their live over to god is because they wish to remain in control of their life, that they do not want to be held accountable for their sins and as such purposefully choose to deny god."
      This is the bull$#it I was fed from Day One.  Ultimately, we are responsible for our lives, whether we choose to admit it or not.  Also, the laws of Cause and Effect apply to EVERYONE, regardless of their religious beliefs.
      When I was a devout Christian as a child, anyone who considered another way of living was immediately confronted with questions about whether or not they would screw everything that moved.  As if we were too dumb to realize the results of disease and unwanted pregnancy!
      My recent agnosticism has nothing to do with my sex life.  Likewise, I don't do drugs or drink myself into the gutter.  The only real change in my life is that I no longer make stupid, illogical decisions based on religion.  So far, I'm doing quite well.
      Last year, when I started getting serious flashbacks, I posted a question, "I'm Beginning to Wonder if Christianity Itself is a Cult!"  HubPages advised me to move it to the Forums, so I tried to do so, with scattered results.  But here's what I would have chosen for Best Answer, by RealityTalk, who has since left HubPages:
      "I am not going to do what so many do & argue semantics. I know exactly what you mean by your question. The answer you are looking for is "yes." What is ironic is that Christians, Jews, Muslims and so many other religions will refer to their religion as some solid believable fact of life. They are not. They are all fantasy, pure and simple. The only difference between the legitimacy of one religion and another is which side of the fence you are on. Every religious group believes they are in direct contact with a creator and that their group has all the answers to the big questions. They are going to a life after death and all other religions are not - because they are obviously wrong. All other religions are fantasies made up garbage, but "not mine."
      
      Say Yes To Life, you are the source of your strength. You are the source of peace in the world. You are the love and the light that helps others. The hands of man heal the injured. The hands of woman house us and protect our families from the weather. The hands of man provide the food that feeds our babies. The heart of humans helps those unable to help themselves. No invisible make-believe god. You!
      
      I understand exactly what you mean by your definition of a cult. And I understand exactly where you are coming from in posing your question as such. Forget convincing those lost in make believe otherwise. They will use their loving faith to insult you and spew hatred at you; all the while telling themselves how godly they are.
      
      Yes, Christianity is a cult. A make-believe non-factual childish cult taught children by their parents; children who grow stunted mentally or who are too lazy or unwise to think for themselves or grow up and realize that Santa Claus is not the only lie told them as children."

      replyreport
      1. 0

         Lybrahposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         I don't know what kind of crazy thing you were involved in when you were little, but stop calling Christianity a cult, it is so annoying.  Whatever it was, it probably wasn't even Christianity.  It's a shame you don't know Jesus.
         
         God is the reason you exist.  God is the reason you have the hands to heal the injured, the hands of the woman to protect....God is the light.  God is the alpha and omega.  Give glory to God, not yourself!

         replyreport
         1. 61

            Link10103posted 9 years agoin reply to this

            So do you want to go over the arrogance of this comment now, later, or just ignore it?

            replyreport
            1. 0

               Lybrahposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               It just really pisses me off...and I am on a rampage right now.  The second part of my message is not to sound arrogant, you should give Glory to God, and not yourself.
               
               Some people need to stop saying the same thing over and over again.  Not you, others.

               replyreport
               1. 69

                  JMcFarlandposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Every time I see you,  you say you're in a rampage.   Is that part of being slow to anger and abounding in kindness that the Bible talks so much about?
                  
                  Why keep going to atheists threads,  hubs and questions if they make you so angry?   No one is forcing you to,  and that much anger is simply not good for you.   No one has the right to not be offended,  and you seem to continually seek things out to purposely be offended by.   Why?

                  replyreport
               2. 61

                  Link10103posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  I wasnt talking about the second half of your comment. Thats your belief, which you are entitled to. Doesnt make it true, but you are allowed to think that.

                  replyreport
               3. 61

                  Link10103posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Actually forget that comment. Do you want to address this one instead?
                  
                  http://hubpages.com/forum/post/2668147
                  
                  None of us are even involved in that thread and you say something like that, but its not your intention to be condescening right? Yet you are flabbergasted why people have a problem with you specifically and call you on your crap?
                  
                  I would try to make the request again that you no longer comment on my posts, and in turn i would do the same for you since i see the gradeschool comeback in the works already, but i cannot stop you from commenting and your word cannot be taken seriously anyway since you already broke it. Twice.
                  
                  So how do we proceed Lybrah? Your lies, hypocrisy, and overall arrogance is starting to tickle my nerves a bit. And please, if you say the same about me point out a specific instance that proves it. This is a forum post where you have all the space you need to do so. Every time i have said something similar i have pointed out where and why i said it.
                  
                  Can you finally do the same for once? Or are you just going to call me a hateful child and ignore everything that was said and the cycle repeats?

                  replyreport
                  1. 0

                     Lybrahposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                     Link, as a Christian, I believe in prayer.  I believe it helps.  I know you don't want to hear that, or you think I am some evil person, but there is a whole lot more to me that I unfortunately don't get to show too often.  When I made that request, I meant it. 
                     
                     I still don't agree with you that to pray for someone is condescending.  To me, it is an act of love, and helpful. 
                     
                     Link, we are all the same.  We all sin.  I would point out several times where you have been tactless and rude, but I would be on this computer all night.

                     replyreport
                     1. 61

                        Link10103posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                        I asked for one specific instance and you cannot even provide that. Its sad how i dont recall you ever mentioning a time where i blindsided you and started insulting you for no reaaon, yet thats all you imply that i do. Its funny that's all you ever seem to do when atheists come into the picture, me in particular. You even tag team with other people who are blatantly insulting others but have the nerve to cry about being persecuted and attacked for their beliefs.
                        
                        I never said praying for someone is condescending, i said YOU praying for ME is condescending, since every time you say it it is directly after you insult me, or in this case a whole group of people. It would be much easier to believe that your prayers are an act of love and helpfulness if you werent calling people fools, hateful children, and demented because they call you out on your own actions that you cant even own up to.
                        
                        So again. Point out an example so we can go over it like i have asked you to do countless times already, otherwise you are just sticking your foot in your mouth.

                        replyreport
                        1. 0

                           Lybrahposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                           Link, I have read some of your other comments on here to others, and you talk down to them, telling them they cannot comprehend stuff.  It's ridiculous.  Go back and reread your comments. I'm not going to list them.  Sometimes you are anything but nice!
                           But then again, we all get petty once in a while.  People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, right Link?

                           replyreport
                           1. 61

                              Link10103posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                              When i explain something 20 times in 10 different ways, each time getting simpler than the last, just to have the person keep saying the complete opposite of what i am explaining, then yes i am going to point out that they cannot comprehend simple concepts.
                              
                              Perfect example is right now. I have asked you three times to give ONE specific example, yet you keep saying that you arent going to list a bunch of them. ONE clearly is not MANY.
                              
                              So...fourth time? Can you give one specific example of your claim so we can go over it? The more you avoid giving one, the less credibility you end up having. If there are so many, choosing one shouldnt be a problem.

                              replyreport
         2. 79

            Say Yes To Lifeposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Lybrah - I guess not many people have had to leave a wonderfully supportive church behind, due to their own personal inadequacy (which Jesus chose not to fix), and sit helpless while their niece drops out of high school to join a cult, complete with compound, run by an assistant pastor she had a crush on, who had no interest in her but used her crush towards his own ends.  If Jesus had healed me, I could have told my brother to send her to live with me in Seattle, which is full of excellent churches and schools.  But that did not happen.
            
            To  add insult to injury, when I finally gave my Seattle pastor a full description of what happened, I never heard from him again.  Apparently, his wonderfully supportive church is backed by a myth.  That may not be true, but he certainly is not denying it!
            
            That is why I keep referring to Christianity as a cult.  It's not the religion itself; it's the way it's practiced.  Church magazines won't print stories like mine; they only show the success stories.  People are supposed to accept Christianity as absolute truth.  That's what makes it a cult.  Jim Jones and David Koresh used the same tactics, and you know what that led to.

            replyreport
            1. 60

               Cat333posted 9 years agoin reply to this

               Sounds rough. I'm sorry you and your family have had to go through such hard times.
               
               Those who say they are telling you an "absolute truth" can either 1) be deceiving you (intentionally or unintentionally), or 2) be telling you the truth. If that sounds too obvious to even state, consider the point intended that declaring something as truth does not constitute cult-like behavior IF what is being said is in fact the truth.
               
               Please understand that Truth is determined by the Lord, not us. It was Jesus himself who said to us all, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." (John 14:6)

               replyreport
            2. 79

               Say Yes To Lifeposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               Thanks, Cat333.  But here are some additional factors to consider:
               
               The Bible is full of stories of miracle healings from leprosy.  Here are some examples:  2 Kings 5: 1-19, Matthew 8: 2-4, and Luke 17:11 - 19.  In those days, leprosy was the most dreaded disease because it was highly contagious and incurable.  A similar case would be Ebola today, but at least we know what causes it, and how to prevent its spread, plus it's treatable to a degree.  Wouldn't it be fabulous if we had a Great Healer who could heal Ebola simply by telling a sufferer to bathe in a river 7 times, or by touching them, or merely speaking the words that they are healed?  No wonder such stories abounded in the Bible, back in the days when very little was known about medicine!
               
               In 1873, Father Damien was moved to serve the leper colony on the island of Molokai, HI.  He contracted the disease, which was still incurable, and died from it in 1889.  He has since become a Saint.
               
               Thanks to knowledge and technology, we no longer have to rely on fantasy and longing.  Leprosy is now curable; the cause and cure was discovered in 1873 by a human being named Dr. Hansen.  This is the same year Father Damien began serving Molokai, but since mass media was a lot slower in those days, knowledge didn't reach him in time.
               
               It's becoming more and more apparent to me that religions were formed to teach people how best to live in the age of ignorance.  Modern discoveries have proven some theories true, and some false.  When people cling to the old theories regardless of whether or not they're true, they make their religion a cult.  Regarding my niece; it is one thing if a person cannot finish high school for various reasons, and an entirely different matter if they throw away their opportunities for no good reason because of fear of an afterlife no one has ever visited.
               
               That's why I am now an agnostic.

               replyreport
               1. 60

                  Cat333posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  I hope your niece will yet take hold of opportunity! Prayers for her and your whole family!
                  
                  God created our bodies wonderfully and he created them to heal. Some diseases present more difficulties. Most of the time the natural order will take course because we live in the natural world. So either the wonderfully created body will heal, or we will remain sick until death, or we will get medicine to heal us. Still, God is our Healer - He created our bodies to heal, he created our minds with the ability to discover, create and use medicine, and he even at times heals miraculously. The miraculous healing is rare compared to the natural healing because God has set us as natural beings in a natural world, and because miracles are brought about only by faith and for the demonstration of God's glory.
                  
                  It is true that as we advance medically we become more self-sufficient and self-reliant. This leads us to often call on doctors more readily than on the Lord. There is nothing wrong with seeing a doctor and making use of medical advancements. But we should not forget that God is our ultimate Healer and that we can call on his name in faith. Some with the gifts of healing travel to various countries and find that in some countries many are filled with the faith for healing and healings do take place, while in other countries there is a lack of faith and a lack of healings. I confess that I am often short on faith, as most of us are.
                  
                  Sickness and disease is a part of the earth and will continue to be experienced until the old order has passed and the new one has replaced it. But don't lose heart. Even as God's people "outwardly waste away, yet inwardly we are being renewed day by day"!
                  
                  Take care and may God bless you!

                  replyreport
                  1. 79

                     Say Yes To Lifeposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                     Thanks, Cat333 - except my niece's life is already ruined.  She dropped out of high school over 10 years ago.  She managed to get into a private university (no public one would accept her), and racked up 6 figures in student loan debts for a degree she can't use.

                     replyreport
                     1. 59

                        Righteous Atheistposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                        Goddunit fer a reason.

                        replyreport
                        1. 79

                           Say Yes To Lifeposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                           LOL!

                           replyreport
                        2. 0

                           Rad Manposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                           I guess he likes taking from the poor and giving to the wealthy private universities.

                           replyreport
                           1. 79

                              Say Yes To Lifeposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                              I guess so.  The best way to keep people oppressed is to have them be poor and uneducated.  Any religion that promotes ignorance should be suspected as a cult.  Why don't they want us to explore and know things?

                              replyreport
                              1. 0

                                 Rad Manposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                                 Well, right from the beginning God is said to have said that we shouldn't eat from the tree of knowledge, and Jesus has been quoted as saying we should be like children if we wish to get into heaven.

                                 replyreport
                                 1. 77

                                    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                                    ...it would have been so easy to have just stayed in Bliss consciousness. Children have it made because they have natural love in their hearts and joy of life in their souls. Don't knock it 'til you try it.

                                    replyreport
                                    1. 0

                                       Rad Manposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                                       Don't knock being uneducated. Okay?

                                       report
                                       1. 77

                                          Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                                          Knowing God is beyond the intellect, anyway… have fun with all that education.

                                          report
                              2. 60

                                 Cat333posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                                 I'm not familiar with those who discourage education as a part of Christianity, and I'm sorry your niece had such an experience. Everyone in my family has much education and everyone is/was faithful - My maternal grandmother (who lived with me, my mother and sisters while I was growing up) was born in 1903 yet had a college degree and a career unlike most women of her time, and she was strong in faith. My mother, a faithful woman who passed on at the age of 54, overcame clinical depression and returned to college as a middle aged woman and obtained her graduate degree. My father has a PhD. My older sister and I have graduate degrees, and my younger sister a college degree, and we are all strong in faith. I will encourage my son and daughter to educate themselves, reach their potential and use the gifts God has given them, following whatever dreams He puts in their hearts.
                                 
                                 But Kathryn also makes a good point.
                                 
                                 I don't find education (my own or anyone else's) very impressive, and education is only of value as it allows us to do good in this world. True wisdom from above is what matters. "The wisdom from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, reasonable, full of mercy and good fruits, unwavering, without hypocrisy" (James 3:17) Whatever our education or lack thereof, let's strive for this wisdom from above!

                                 replyreport
                     2. 60

                        Cat333posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                        Sorry to hear that. My heart goes out to her.

                        replyreport
         3. 59

            Righteous Atheistposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Interesting. Surely if god is the alpha and omega it is also teh reason there are injured and the the reason for the threat the woman needs to be protected from. God is the dark. Why don't you give glory in private where Jesus told you to proclaim your righteousness?

            replyreport
2. 77

   Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

   "Say Yes To Life, you are the source of your strength. You are the source of peace in the world. You are the love and the light that helps others. The hands of man heal the injured. The hands of woman house us and protect our families from the weather. The hands of man provide the food that feeds our babies. The heart of humans helps those unable to help themselves. No invisible make-believe god. You!"
   
   Wow!
   Totally worth repeating!
   Thanks, Yes to Life

   replyreport
   1. 79

      Say Yes To Lifeposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      You're welcome.  Glad that helps you!

      replyreport