Do people realize there is a war against natural medicine going on?

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   Debby Bruckposted 14 years ago

   There are a number of organized groups with vehement leadership who want to subdue those who want to boost their immune systems with natural methods. They use circular reasoning and illogic. They do not connect the mind/body system. My recent hub warns against these ultra negative persons. See "Beware Articles Against Homeopathy" and speak up before it is too late.

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      double_frickposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      my boyfriend and i were JUST talking about this!
      is this in reference to the bill being proposed by senator mccain regarding the FDA and dietary supplements?!
      
      http://www.lef.org/featured-articles/Di … f-2010.htm
      
      honestly knew this was coming though...
      
      
      
      oh...and we decided that people are just willfully ignorant. the information is there, and the motivation (look at the average person's health and diet!) but people don't want to know. and don't you dare tell them, because they don't. want. to. know. lol
      
      until it effects them...
      then its...."waaaaaaahhhhhhhhhh! someone (big government) save me!"

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         Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         true enough
         
         What's up Double_Frick? How are you today?

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            double_frickposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            and i'm mighty fine today, thanks.
            and yourself?

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               Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               I forgot to mention to double_frick how much I liked her fun sunglasses!

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         Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Thank you for providing this link to upcoming legislation.

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      (Q)posted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Homeopathy is bunk and causes more harm than good. Why would you be surprised about those articles?

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         Sarahtomposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Prejudice is a form of ignorance and clearly you are as, if you had any experience and knowledge of homoeopathy, you would not make sweeping statements.   Exactly WHAT harm does it do?

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            gobsmackedposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Try reading this
            
            http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/se … ple-jailed
            
            Their use of homeopathy  killed their own baby.
            
            Instead of insulting people who disagree with you why not try reading round the subject a little more.

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            (Q)posted 14 years agoin reply to this

            While it is commendable that Hahnemann may have brought the quackery of leeches and bloodletting to light as nonsense, he merely replaced one form of quackery with another.
            
            This isn't a matter of prejudice and making sweeping statements, it is a matter of homeopathy not producing results beyond a placebo.
            
            Hence, the harm it does is dissuade people from getting treatment for their ailments causing them to get worse or die.
            
            Water does little to cure those ailments.

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               Tatjana-Mihaelaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Well, homeopathy saved my life, and if appropriate remedies are taken it  can be the best possible cure  - tender but powerful, without side effects - just perfect.  All my close family is great on homeopathics.
               
               I started to practice homeopathy AFTER I  tested how beneficial it can be to many people. Nobody got worse while on homeopathy - ONLY BETTER.

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                  gobsmackedposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Explain this then: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/se … ple-jailed

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                     Tatjana-Mihaelaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     About your link: there are fanatics everywhere. This has nothing to do with homeopathy - this couple are bad parents, and they would do mistake with any other way of healing... this is type of the people who just do not know how to treat baby.
                     But homeopathy is not important  in this article: f.E Jehova wittnesses  do not want to receive blood transfusion even when dying and do not allow that their children receive it.  There are many such examples.
                     
                     I can give you list of examples I know where Doctors almost killed (or killed) or gave completely wrong dyagnosis to the people and completely wrong medicines and treatmants (especially surgical) , but what would be the point of that? It does not mean that all doctors are killers. 
                     
                     Anyway, in my country many Doctors practice homeopathy. ..so no further comment.

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                        Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                        An example of "one" does not account for an entire earthly population of homeopathic practitioners and all the families who use homeopathy. Besides, this particular set of parents had some problems with both the allopathic approach and homeopathic approach in healing this child.
                        
                        In all forms of medicine there is not always 100% success rate.

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                        gobsmackedposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                        Yes you are right, they were very bad parents-for treating their child with form of "medicine" based on an unproven theory and for not seeking help before it was too late.
                        
                        You also accuse them of being fanatics which is exactly what the judge implied when he sent them to jail.
                        
                        And yes Debby one example means very little but it means a lot more than the wealth of anecdotal "evidence" littering this hub.
                        
                        As you know the UK government Science and Technology Select Committee demolished the evidence put before them by homeopaths.  Have you got anything better to offer?
                        
                        Feel free to huff and puff and throw insults, lies and quite frankly paranoid rambilings back.  As I told you before I find your comments really funny.

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         She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         HA, ha, ha! I agree, Sarahtom, ignorance is bliss! Lets hope (Q) doesn't ever end up with something the doctors can't find or fix. I just published a series on my rare autoimmune disorder, that took docs 24yrs to find. I had to use all natural treatments and have been able to go into remission by doing so. Experimental surgery was my other option. I prefer to say natural treatments or alternative medicine instead of "homeopathy". Wonder if (Q) ever takes vitamin C, vitamins, or drinks OJ  when a cold is coming on?! We all know that would never help the common cold!

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            (Q)posted 14 years agoin reply to this

            I read your hubs and noticed that you gave all of your kudos to your immunologist and gynecologist, who clearly have nothing to do with homeopathy.
            
            So, what is your point?

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               Daniel Carterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Responsible solutions to health problems are a collaboration between patient and Dr. So if a patient has a Dr who will *consult* instead of just dictate prescriptions, that's rare. But we need much more of this approach than any other.
               
               It's not rocket science to figure out that a lack of nutrients in the body causes disease. Therefore, the first order of business in any treatment of any disease is to address nutrition, which the Drs., don't seem to get to in many cases. There must be a "whole" plan to get the person back to a "whole" state. As patients, we have to take responsibility for our part of the healing process. If we hand it off to someone else, we are only lab rats.

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               She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               No, they clearly do not have anything to do with homeopathy! The only thing they did was NOT treat me like I had a mental disorder and ran the tests to get me diagnosed leading to possible treatment options. They are willing to do surgery to remove my female organs or do experimental injections, that is what they want to do. I do give kudos to them for testing and finding the Autoimmune disorder and giving me the opportunity to research treatment on my own and for listening to me without trying to send me to mental health like the other 15 specialists that I have seen in the last 3 yrs. I felt that I stereotyped the whole medical community as being IGNORANT in my hubs due to my anger and frustration but those are the only 2 doctors that would even listen to me and I appreciate them for that. My Ob/gyn and Immunologist have both researched my condition, my treatments that I have chosen, and have both agreed that it's worth a try. Their offered treatment options are also experimental with possibly more complications than the natural treatments I have chosen. They even communicate amongst each other. My OB/GYN and/or  nurse practitioner are on call for me at all times if I end up in an ambulance again. Them and my Immunologist are to be contacted and see me in ER. They have actually been willing to help me in any way possible and for that I give them kudos.  Just not the other doctors I have seen, lol!

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                  She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Oh my point, sorry, Point is that I do need medical doctors for testing until I learn how to draw my own blood but I don't need their drugs or surgery, yet that is. Who knows what the future holds?!

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      rebekahELLEposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      a friend just posted this on facebook and it's worth a listen, especially if you drink cows milk or watch fox news. I do neither. I drink soy milk but many americans drink milk. after watching this, it all goes back to money and control, in this case the fox media and a huge agriculture company.
      the video was made in 2008 but It appears the cows are still being injected with this growth hormone that is harmful to our health.
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JL1pKlnh … r_embedded

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         Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         There is another monsanto documentary that I think would be of interest to you. Take a look ~> http://ning.it/7Qpdic

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            rebekahELLEposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            thanks for the link, it looks like a series, I'll take a look.
            
            in response to some of the posts, I think many people oppose anything that is out of the mainstream, even though much of our society lives in utter ignorance of what they are consuming when they eat, or seem to not care, as long as they like it.
            
            it's strange about human behavior how people tear down that which they don't agree with. why does it happen more so with some than with others? maybe fear of being wrong? closed, rigid minds.. ?
            

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         Valerie Fposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Or you could get your milk from a local organic dairy....

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      lelanew55posted 14 years agoin reply to this

      hello there. I haven't participated in these discussions before so I am new to you guys. but I have been on hub pages a while. So anyway, What I want to say is that they have always tried to suppress and get rid off natural and alternative medicine, because it is against their interests of untold profits. if more people used alternative medicine people will be much more healthier and they wouldn't need those expensive drugs or expensive invasive tests and treatments. It might kill the system of health care for profits. One way to do something about it is vote with our dollars and use more natural and alternative modalities more often and spread the news.

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         Home Girlposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Money - Power - Control - Profits - all comes to that. Doctors need to pay their mortgages too! By the way, organic or not, we are not cow babies, why the heck we are drinking cow's milk???

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      Dominique Tengposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I spent the last few years in Germany where the situation is quite weird. While natural supplements such as DHEA and melatonin are illegal there, homeopathy and herbs are widely used and prescribed. Vitamin supplements come in useless doses, but you can legally use mistletoe to cure cancer.
      Codex Alimentarius regulates much of the way natural and alternative medicine is being used in Europe and legislators are trying to impose new laws in countries such as South Africa and USA. Many people are unaware of the process or do not really care. This is sad because I believe that we have all the right to chose our medication even if it is not as profitable as the drugs that make people even sicker.

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      Sab Ohposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      OK, who are these people at 'war'?

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         gobsmackedposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Really isn't worth the bother, you won't get a decent answer.  Check out her other hub and comments for the wealth of logical fallacies, lies, and vicious attacks. 
         
           Great suggestions from Marsh at the Merseyside Skeptics Society that if homeopaths honestly believe their mumbo jumbo then
         
             * Anyone who uses animals to prove homeopathy works to be henceforward treated exclusively by vets
         
             * Anyone who genuinely believes that the process of diluting liquids makes them stronger to be banned from working in cocktail bars
         
             * Subscribers to the notion of ‘like cures like’ to be forbidden from becoming firefighters
         
             * Tate and Lyle to be forced to carry warnings on their packets stating ‘Granulated sugar containing no homeopathic vibrations’

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      LiamBeanposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Funny since "Big Pharma" bases many of their drugs on research of NATURAL compounds. The big push lately is compounds from ocean life.

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         cosetteposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         
         
         'k, this is weird. the other day i was looking at hubs and thought 'what ever happened to LiamBean' and here you are. i must be psychic. well, imma go by a lottery ticket now

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      Len Cannonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Hopefully a war we win.

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   Michael Willisposted 14 years ago

   Of course they are against it. It could hurt the profits of the Pharmaceutical Companies.

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   rebekahELLEposted 14 years ago

   Big Pharma.  $$$$

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   Madame Xposted 14 years ago

   Yep.

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5. 70

   Cagsilposted 14 years ago

   The Drug Manufacturers and the FDA are the problem.
   
   These two organizations are bent on keeping herbal remedies down for as long as possible, so as to absorb as much profits as possible.
   
   It's a proven fact- there are plenty herbal supplements that work in combination with others to create cures for many different diseases and other health related issues.
   
   Much of America's society continues to endorse their doctors and the drug manufacturers, instead of doing due diligent research into their own issues. Many simply accept prescriptions and antibiotics to help them heal when ill.
   
   Unfortunately, many people don't realize that they are being taken advantage of or being manipulated into thinking a specific way.
   
   It's simply another level of control, so as to usurp power and wealth.

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6. 71

   thisisoliposted 14 years ago

   To be honest when it comes to homeopathy I cant help but think it's nothing but the placebo effect (Something that has been proven in impartial studies).
   
   I would rather have a pill with active ingredients than a pill that contains sugar, and maybe if I am feeling lottery lucky, a single particle of a compound.
   
   Homeopathy is a huge business in itself, it has insanely low manufacturing costs and high sales value.

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      double_frickposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      well, i can say that most major pharmaceuticals are derived from the substances used in alternative medicines.
      there are old wives' tales on the surface, so it seems to some that its based on them. there are things like st. john's wort which in studies has shown to be more effective than many SSRI's and with less side effects. however, these things should be used responsibly and very awarely just as with pharmaceuticals and this is not always the case. also these thing are not tested as much as pharmaceuticals so their values and benefits are not as scientifically verifiable, but for those who experience them the proof is there.
      
      
      and i agree that homeopathy is full of swindlers and products that do not work or are not a quick fix as advertised. (what is?)  but mainstream medicine is strangling the life out of the people it is claiming to help...if not by their medicines that are full of awful side-effects and toxins and preservatives, things that only treat some symptoms then we need more medicine to treat those side effects. and ten years later we need more medicine for the permanent damage caused by those drugs. and of course all this medicine is costing you nearly your life, which apparently has a price these days.
      did we "choose" to be born here in that we should have to pay to just survive? we should have to pay more than we have to just not die???  but thats the state of our healthcare system. and the only relief i've found from mainstream medicine is herbs and though its not life threatening, the things i take that i buy or grow myself are much more helpful than any anti-depressant or mood stabilizer. touche.

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         Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         double_frick: ..., i can say that most major pharmaceuticals are derived from the substances used in alternative medicines.
         
         Debby says: Drugs started from observation of nature and natural products. Today, many drugs are synthetics. Interestingly, I believe pharmaceuticals may move closer and closer to homeopathy in terms of using the "minimum dose," as they are seeing less side-effects with less of the substance taken.
         
         there are old wives' tales on the surface, so it seems to some that its based on them. there are things like st. john's wort which in studies has shown to be more effective than many SSRI's and with less side effects. however, these things should be used responsibly and very awarely just as with pharmaceuticals and this is not always the case. also these thing are not tested as much as pharmaceuticals so their values and benefits are not as scientifically verifiable, but for those who experience them the proof is there.
         
         Debby says: Today, we return in a circle to what our grandparents and great-grandparents wisdom taught about health and healing. A major problem with pharmaceuticals are that they are not tested in all cases. This means that drugs that were tested on a small group of men are given to women or children.
         
         
         double_frick: and i agree that homeopathy is full of swindlers and products that do not work or are not a quick fix as advertised. (what is?)  but mainstream medicine is strangling the life out of the people it is claiming to help...if not by their medicines that are full of awful side-effects and toxins and preservatives, things that only treat some symptoms then we need more medicine to treat those side effects. and ten years later we need more medicine for the permanent damage caused by those drugs. and of course all this medicine is costing you nearly your life, which apparently has a price these days.
         
         Debby says: There are swindlers in every part of society. People trying to make a quick buck. However, if you knew the thousands of people working in homeopathy as I do, you would learn that most of them make a meager living and charge a very small amount for care compared to the enormous amount spent in training at professional institutions and investment of life-long study time. Most of the homeopaths that I know give a tremendous amount of volunteer time to the poor and needy freely. 
         
         double_frick says: did we "choose" to be born here in that we should have to pay to just survive? we should have to pay more than we have to just not die???  but thats the state of our healthcare system. and the only relief i've found from mainstream medicine is herbs and though its not life threatening, the things i take that i buy or grow myself are much more helpful than any anti-depressant or mood stabilizer. touche.
         
         Debby says: This is a profound question and probably deserves its own space in a discussion thread. Some may say, "yes" your soul energy did choose to be born here. But, to pay just to survive. To that, I have no answer. We all must pay in some way. By our service to mankind. Is that not why we were born? To improve the earth and humankind.
         
         It is interesting to learn that you are getting good results from herbs for emotional balance. Wishing you all the best.

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            (Q)posted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Not likely, homeopathy relies on the memory of water and insignificant amounts of substance. It is essentially water.
            
            
            
            They are tested and the findings indicate that the more rigorous the testing, the less consistency in the results.
            
            
            
            Do you have evidence to back up that claim?
            
            
            
            
            Nonsense. There are no "professional" institutions for homeopathy, one can get a so-called "doctorate" in ten months. No, they are not real doctors, they are pretend doctors.

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               Tatjana-Mihaelaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               BTW, do you know that Samuel Hahneman was MD? (Doctor of Medicine?). It is good to know that homeopathy is created by doctor of medicine...

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               She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Bard of Ely (credit to you) actually gave me this thought but wanted to use this as an example of homeopathy.
               Salicylic acid comes from the Willow tree (Salix).
               Possible homeopathic treatment for a headache!
               Take the bark or leaves from this willow tree and simmer them for a few hours in water and then put a few drops under your tongue every 1/2 hour until the headache goes away. The pain killing properties of the willow are infused/ leached into the water and the 1/2 hour wait ensures no overdose.
               Will it work? Probably because you just made liquid ASPIRIN using water and part of the willow tree that aspirin is derived from, only the homeopathic version is liquid form and not patented, approved by the FDA, or tainted with chemicals or preservatives. It is a proven/tested fact that everything you apply anywhere on your body sinks in and goes into the blood. Placing the drops under your tongue bypasses digestion of a pill and immediately enters your blood stream. Works just like nicotine, morphine, or estrogen patches prescribed by Dr.'s. Thru the mucous membranes of the mouth is faster,  more effective than thru the skin. But it works just the same. Minute amouunts of the substance is needed in this manner because the properties are not destroyed in the stomach.
               This is a theoretical example of course, but I do my hormonal treatments in the same fashion and it is working.

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                  Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Thank you for this beautiful explanation. Perfect!

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                     She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     Thank You Very Much Debby!

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                     gobsmackedposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     I can't believe you claim to be a doctor and praise she-rah for that dangerous nonsense.
                     
                     Why don't you explain the difference  between homeopathic and herbal "medicine" ?  This hub is littered with comments showing the writers have no idea what the difference is. 
                     
                     Also do you sing the lyrics for the Hokey cokey as you succuss your remedies?

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                  gobsmackedposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  You forgot to dilute until there's no active ingredient left and ofcourse what about  the special magic shaking.
                  
                  Surely it won't work until a homeopath gives it the supernatural shake rattle and roll.

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7. 71

   thisisoliposted 14 years ago

   Although can I point out I think herbal remedies in general are a great way to deal with problems, I just dont have anything inparticular against mainstream medicine either. They both have certain levels of effectiveness, they both have side effects.
   
   (although I disagree with the effectiveness I will still be selling some homeopathic medicines on Hubpages soon, for the challenge. I may not agree with homeopathy but I do agree with commercialism )

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      She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I wondered why I just read your new hub on UTI's and then found what you wrote here!  Yes,"commercialism", making me giggle. Your cure for the UTI does work though, been doing it for years and have avoided many antibiotics, kidney infections, and other complications. Cranberries contain a natural sweetener called D-Mannose that attaches to E. coli (the bacteria) so that it can't attach to the walls of the urinary tract  and the water flushes it out. I've also just purchased the D-mannose powder which seems to work better for bad infections and prevention. Thought you might want to add that to your hub to sell. Not sure if amazon/ebay has it or not but it's a big seller for those who suffer UTI's. I can't tolerate antibiotics which is dangerous for someone who is autoimmune and I only treat naturally. Still alive, I might add, and no side effects from Cranberry juice. : )

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         Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Natural ingredients from plants, minerals and animals have been used for thousands of years to heal. Slowly over centuries, and more recently over decades, research scientists have found a way to derive, measure and separate and create synthetic ingredients from these WHOLE natural substances. They feel that those derivations are more effective that the original natural substances.
         
         The main point is that people should have the right to choose which system of medicine works best for them.

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   earnestshubposted 14 years ago

   I agree with Q. Homoeopathy has been shown to be bunk in several studies.
   
   Having said that, the best prostate treatment out there is herbal, and St. Johns wart has been shown to be better than SSRI's for dealing with depression especially for those who do not handle SSRI's well.

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   mcbeanposted 14 years ago

   "Circular reasoning and logic"
   
   Thats a touch ironic.
   
   Most Alternative or Natural Therapies have repeatedly been shown to be ineffective. The 'Industry' responds with their own special logic with my all time favorite being "they haven't invented a test yet to show it works"
   
   Hmmm.
   
   Tests are easy.
   
   Take 2 groups with you chosen affliction, double blind and control with placebo.
   
   Regardless of your theory on why something works, if it works it will be proven to be so in a test structured like this.
   
   The conspiracy is that apart from a very small group (such as St John's Wort mentioned by Earnest)they have been shown to be useless. Worse than that, the only effect many have is interacting with commonly taken medications (such as Warfarin) with potentially serious consequences. In other cases valuable time is lost trying natural remedies in serious diseases such as cancer, with a potentially life threatening increase in risk.
   
   A nice summary can be read here: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRel … homeo.html
   
   Oh, by the way. Before the usual statements come out:I don't work for a drug company, don't have drug company stocks or any other reason for my views other than the fact I don't believe everything someone preaches to me. I evaluate the evidence myself and I am still waiting for even the smallest amout to support the majority of claims.

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      She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Tests are very expensive and the only ones who really run tests on natural treatments are Big Pharma to steer people away from natural options, or major universities doing research studies.  The natural medicine industry doesn't have the money like Big Pharma to test and retest and most of it's sales/proof are based on personal testimonies, scientific studies from universities, and a history of hundreds of years of use.  Although I agree that some treatments, especially herbal, can cause serious complications when mixed with prescriptions like Warfarin, drugs like Warfarin are toxic and deadly by themselves.  I have cured fibrocystic breast disease (start of breast cancer) by only using iodine (no side effects) AND early stage cervical cancer that I've had 2 previous surgeries for by using bio-identical hormones called phyto estrogens from a very specific plant. I've read a lot at quackwatch and if I had trusted those morons, I could quite possibly be dead from anaphylactic shock due to a lifethreatening autoimmune disorder that I was born with. I am currently in remission only using natural treatments. Granted I was not part of a test and just someone who took a chance by doing my own research but do the test subjects have to be part of a paid study, written out in a reputable medical journal, or listed on quackwatch?! Valuable lives could be lost not testing and trying natural remedies in serious diseases such as cancer. Chemo, surgery, and radiation are not full proof either causing serious complications even if one does survive and many have taken the chance with natural remedies and are still alive to tell their stories, too bad they weren't part of a study though. The biggest problem with not testing is that natural treatments can not be patented so there is no money that can be made even if something natural proves to be a cure. This could put the medical industry out of big bucks if they did prove something natural worked. Fiber and fruit doesn't help with constipation, steam doesn't help with chest congestion, yogurt doesn't cure yeast infections, they're all natural so they must not help with any medical condition, hmmm. Not preaching, just saying!

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    caravalhophotoposted 14 years ago

    Glad to read that some of the hubbers on this forum have an open mind.
    Heart Disease, Cancer, Obesity, High Cholosterol and Diabetes can all be "prevented", by changing your diet and lifestyle...they go hand in hand and you can be off all medication (pharmacutical) in a fairly short time.  Any "pharmacutical medication" have side effects, such as liver and kidney disease when taken for a long period of time, not to mention the other 2 pages of side effects that come with them.
    I went the "old-fashioned" way when it came to my cancer and took the pills and had the chemo injected into my body...it was the most awful and worse thing I did.
    It took almost 2 years to get rid of the smell of chemo coming out of my pores and the meds that I had to take play'd hell on my mind...(never took pills before).  I am know off all medications and changed my diet and lifestyle...all numbers are in the "good" column...and believe a more natural approach to life and illness is the better way to go. Hope my experience helps just 1 person, then it was worth the hell.

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       Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       I empathize with you completely. Been there, done that.

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       gobsmackedposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       So the chemo cured your cancer and it was the "worse thing you did". 
       
       The meds played hell on your mind-not the stress of a terrible life threatening disease?
       
       And you smelled funny.   
       
       So what are you proposing, people with cancer don't take chemo incase they smell funny?  I think they'll smell a lot funnier when they die of untreated cancer don't you?

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    prettydarkhorseposted 14 years ago

    organized war againt natural ant traditional meds because of imperial capitalism and pharmaceuticals, medical corporatiions are the big indusrty

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    gobsmackedposted 14 years ago

    I'm confused, everyone's ranting about big pharma, expensive drugs etc, do homeopaths treat people for nothing?
    
    The industry is worth £1.5 billion in Europe selling treatments which contain no active ingredients. Not exactly "little pharma" is it?
    
    The best weapon to use against the homeopaths and their ilk is to let them speak for themselves. I'v never seen such bile and hatred spouted by people claiming to be doctors, it's really shocking.

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       mcbeanposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Agreed.
       
       Homeopathists are painted as noble curers of disease saving humanity out of the goodness of their hearts.
       
       I'm surprised there are not more. Its a great business model. What are their overheads? Nothing. They use treatments that, by their own admission, contain next to nothing. They spend zero on research to prove their products as they are aware any well constructed study will show no benefit.
       
       They do spend a lot of time promoting the usual conspiracy theories. Big Pharma etc.
       They aggressively campaign against modern medicine but i wonder if they would say no to insulin if they had Type I Diabetes, antiretroviral medication if the were HIV positive, or antibiotics if they had pneumonia. Were these developed by homeopathy practitioners?
       Where is the list of homeopathy breakthoughs that work for the majority of people. With governments around the world struggling with ever increasing medical costs, do you not think they would welcome all these miracle cures for cancer rather than the current expensive treatments.
       
       The argument that "you can't patent homeopathy" and make millions from it is rubbish. Saving millions is just as good as earning millions. If homeopathy works, you have added just about every government in the world to your conspiracy of Big Pharma.
       
       I wish it worked. Any sane person does. Drink this, cure cancer. Eat this, no heart disease. We all want that. Unfortunately, no matter how you position your smoke and mirrors, a placebo effect is just that.

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          earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          You seem to possess an uncommon amount of  common sense.
          The same argument applies to car economy and fuel saving devices. If any of them worked even a little every new Honda would be fitted with it. They would then control the car industry.
          Illogical bunk, all of it.

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    Debby Bruckposted 14 years ago

    She-rah ~ You've taken the steps to find the healing methods that work best for you. That's all we ask.
    
    prettydarkhorse ~ We know that the bottom line always comes down to money in a capitalist system or monopoly. It is also true that there are ethical loving individuals who are moving in a new direction. Where there is darkness there is also light. Two opposing forces creates the balance in nature. Within each of us, we carry both sides and hope that the moral side of justice and righteousness prevails.
    
    mcbean ~ There are hundreds of thousands of homeopaths. Most have been trained and practice in India, Pakistan, Malaysia, Canada, Cuba and other countries where homeopathy is accepted and part of the medical system. Most of them do treat thousands of patients for next to nothing. It's a cultural difference.
    
    It is a myth that they do not do research and that it costs nothing. These healers devote their lives each and every day. They wake early begin at the clinic at 7 or 8 AM and take a break for dinner at 6 PM. Then they go back to the clinic for night hours until 9 or 10PM every day.
    
    Their motto is to take "Homeopathy First" before having to go to heavy drugs. If the body can heal itself, it is a gentler, quicker, more efficient way to heal.

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       Home Girlposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Bravo, I like that last one!

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    thisisoliposted 14 years ago

    Debby I think you are vastly over exagerating the number of homeopaths in the other countries.
    
    I agree that people should be able to take what they want, however I also think people should be arrested for fraud.  I have just ranted about homeonpathy in another thread, and I really find it hard to believe how people can fall for a con such as homeopathy, which is by the way, a very big business, with some of the top producers raking in hundreds of millions every year.

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    Explosive INKposted 14 years ago

    Homeopathic & Homophobic, People are afraid of things they do not understand or that can make you feel better and healthier.

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       Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Ah! Nice saying. Yes. When people do not understand something, they become afraid.

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    She-rahposted 14 years ago

    I have taken many, many prescription drugs that I truly believed would work because the doctors told me they would work and I wanted them to work. BUT they did not work and only caused more damage and worsening of symptoms. Now I have liver disease from prescription drugs. Why was there no placebo effect when I took drugs from the doctor and I thought with all my heart and mind they would cure me??? My natural treatments, currently approved through my immunologist and Ob/gyn, were also experimental. I never got my hopes up with natural treatments for my autoimmunity because there were so many failures in the past. BUT now I'm in remission using only natural treatments that I didn't think would even work.
    Placebo effect? And NO you can not get a patent on unaltered natural treatments, only derivatives. I'd like to see someone try and get a patent on prunes for constipation and make millions!

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       MyQuteposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       "I'd like to see someone try and get a patent on prunes for constipation and make millions!"  Well-said!  Tweeting this so more ppl can read Debby's articles and also your comments!

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          She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Oh, Thank You! I would like for people to read my articles also, lol. The series on my autoimmunity that I only treat naturally has brought me in a few responses, mostly emails because of the sensitivity of discussing female problems.  I actually received one this morning from a lady who suffers the same thing as me just without anaphylaxis and she has yet to be diagnosed and treated, doctors are making fun of her. She was crying from happiness when she read my series on Progesterone induced anaphylaxis because she has so much hope now in getting diagnosed and treated. I'm just ecstatic to be able to help one person, cried the whole time I read it. Really would love to spread more awareness for this condition but I don't know how to "tweet" or much else with my articles for that matter. I so much appreciate your comment!

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       Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       She-rah ~ My thoughts are with you. I pray that you will continue to heal. That over the coming months and years your liver will renew itself with your loving care, herbs and tinctures.

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          She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Thank you for your lovely comment and email Debby! I will check out your Twitter hub and be on there shortly. I do appreciate your encouragement!
          Yes, milk thistle and fresh celery juice for my liver, lol, when I remember to take it. I'm on so much stuff and the daily routine for me is hard to keep up with. If I don't do the routine though, I become nonfunctional  for at least 2 weeks a month and would be on disability and drugged for the rest of my life. Took me forever to get a good combo of treatments for myself but well worth it!!!

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    aoiffe379posted 14 years ago

    I found this discussion quite interesting. As one who lives in a remote community with no doctor stationed here[but who can be reached by telephone] and the clinic is the only 'pharmacy' I favour the natural alternative to prescription drugs. We have two centenarians[100 years] and one soon to be.The 95 year old, a pastor, is very spritely; and his only complaint seems to be a cranky knee. People go into the bush for medicine; and they have done well.Electricity and paved roads are less than two decades old.
    
    I believe that the quality of life and health depends on many factors. Pollution is minimal where I live as there are less than 300 cars,buses and trucks.The mailboat with the freight could not unload recently because of rough seas.Having a backyard garden is an advantage.Most people live with pollution but can walk or drive to the supermarket and find an ample supply of food and produce.
    
    My response was generated by the comment about prunes. Prunes have no effect on me.I would probably need to eat a whole box of them! However, two ripe sapodillas[naseberries] guarantee I do not need to eat a box of prunes!I believe our bodies become 'acclimatized' to food. I know I cannot eat mushrooms, no matter how good they are for my health. Nor can my cousin eat  fresh fish or shellfish. One man's cure can be another man's poison. Everything we use results from trial and error; and even then, what is good for the goose may kill the gander.

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       thisisoliposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       This kind of situation actually interests me a huge amount. Vegetarians and vegans often say how it takes a couple of weeks to get used to,but afterwards they feel much more healthy, and that meat alsways makes them feel worse.
       
       I actually believe this is true, though it may be true that it's only a matter of perspective.
       
       The human body is incredibly adaptable, and is designed for a wide range of diets, however if you restrict yourself to a single diet the human body will become adept at dealing with the single diet, but may become inefficient with other food groups.
       
       Much like an unused muscle will waste away, and an unused brain will begin to lose it's neural pathways, I would not be surprised if the same could happen with the digestive system. If only I had some time to research it all

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          rebekahELLEposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          thisoli, have you heard of michael pollan? he has done a lot of research and studies and written numerous books. one of his best books is The Omnivore's Dilemma. http://www.michaelpollan.com/
          
          the body adapts, but the body also needs certain nutrients to function at its best.

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       She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Wow, I want to live where you live! I hate traffic and pollution. Yes, I agree that what may be good for one may be harmful to others. Trust me, I've had my fair share of trial and error. Really messed myself up on a few occasions before I was diagnosed, didn't know what was wrong with me,  and was left to experiment on treating symptom after symptom. I got it now though, everyone is different genetically and currently one's own research and trial is about the only way to go with natural treatments. The prunes comment was just to make a point, surely it won't work for everyone. I don't even like prunes and I'm certainly not going to eat a box of them, YUK, but Triphala sure does the trick for me.

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          Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          You do paint a lovely picture of living in nature. Living close to the earth in an unspoiled and unpolluted country would be divine.
          
          As for prunes. They're quite yummy.

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    Bard of Elyposted 14 years ago

    Yes, I am very well aware of this and the ongoing poisoning of our food with aspartame and msg etc. Already Colloidal Silver is banned from sale in Europe. I dread to think what it could become like if the Codex plans are brought into force.

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       She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Hi Bard of Ely! That's too bad about the colloidal silver. Banning is coming in the US too, I'm sure. That is one that I've always been very careful with due to the scam products and discoloring of the skin. The good stuff sure does do the trick though! It's been my life saver from infection on many occasions. Antibiotics always cause severe side effects in me. I've had staph on a few occasions, no MRSA thank goodness, I have read about Manuka honey for MRSA and it seems to me that it's safer than the silver. MRSA is spreading like wild fire in the US due to the overuse of antibiotics and antibacterial soaps, etc. and Colloidal silver would more than likely get rid of the infection. Antibiotics are ineffective at this point. That little bug is getting stronger and stronger!

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       Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Thank you for jumping in on this discussion. We really do need to make more of the general population aware of the potential loss of health freedoms in this day and age.

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    Daniel Carterposted 14 years ago

    The issue is less about herbal remedies and more about nutrition. If the FDA and big pharma companies have their way, they will eventually regulate vitamin and mineral supplements, inferring that they are "mood altering substances."
    
    Pharma companies use *synthetic* substances to address *symptoms*. Nowhere in any information do you ever find in their materials that they *cure* anything. Prescription meds is about management, not cure, and the way they manage it is by dumping synthetic, toxic substances into our bodies.
    
    Before I go any further, let me say that I do believe that prescrip meds DO save lives. However, using any of them on a long-term basis is a deadly idea. Several of my family members never died from the disease being treated, they died from the awful side effects of the medications. I just think long-term use is wrong.
    
    Herbal remedies and homeopathy do have their place, but so many of those remedies can have disastrous side effects unless you know how they interact with other substances, including many foods. I've used herbal combinations in the past. I don't use herbs hardly ever now. But I do use a lot of other natural, helpful things and have written hubs about them.
    
    If we stick with basic whole nutrition, a good exercise regimen, we can stay off a lot of ills. For those things we need additional help with, that's when pharmaceuticals can be of value.
    
    But really, how many of us are truly aware of the long-term side effects of prescrip meds? Just start reading the side effects of some of the most common ones.
    
    It's a proven fact that you can have panic and anxiety attacks from the meds that are prescribed to prevent them. You can read tons of accounts all over blogs and message boards on the internet.
    
    Cancer is a COMMON side effect from *most* new meds.
    
    Since when was cancer *ever* a side effect?
    So then death is also a side effect of prescription medication as well?
    
    We do need to preserve our rights to have the nutrients we need without being prohibited from obtaining them.

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       She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Yes, very deadly idea. I have seen it first hand. My 29 yr old sister in law passed away because of the way doctors treated her (like a hypochondriac)and the drugs they put her on for mental disorders. She was legitimately ill, just like myself but we took different paths as far as treatment. I fought with the doctors and refused most of their drugs, did my own research. She listened to them, took the drugs, and died so young. I have several family members that are on statin meds for high cholesterol and are now completely disabled and on more meds to treat the painful side effects from statins. My dad is one of them!  Now the meds for pain are causing  large amounts of weight gain, and Alzheimer symptoms. Again, doctors are just giving them more and more drugs and loving it!

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    MikeNVposted 14 years ago

    I'm all for natural cures and treatments.  Unfortunately the Vitamin Industry is not very good at self regulation as they too are in the game for profit.
    
    It really comes down to ethics.  And there are many examples of pharmaceutical companies and vitamin companies putting profit ahead of people.
    
    The Neurontin was one example of "Big Pharma" putting profits over people.
    
    On the flip side this story on Fish Oil broke yesterday.
    
    Lawsuit Claims Fish Oil Supplements Contain Toxic Compound
    
    Wednesday, March 3, 2010 at 02:29 PM
    In a lawsuit filed in a San Francisco court on Tuesday, an environmental group alleged that 10 types of fish oil and shark oil supplements contain a toxic substance that may cause cancer.
    
    The group, Mateel Environmental Justice Foundation (MEJF), claims that California's Proposition 65 mandates that the producers and sellers of the supplements in question are legally required to inform consumers that their supplements contain the substance, polychlorinated biphenyl (PCB), the San Francisco Chronicle reports.
    
    The more than 100 brands of fish oil are currently available, MEJF tested only 10 products, all of which had some level of PCB.
    
    "People buy fish oil to improve their health," David Roe, the plaintiff's attorney, told the news source. "We have no way of knowing if all of the other fish oil products have PCB, too."
    
    PCBs, which were once used to insulate electrical devices, were banned more than 30 years ago after scientists found that exposure to the compound was linked with cancer, reproductive problems and damage to the nervous system.
    
    The defendants named in that case include CVS, GNC, Now Health Group, Omega Protein, Rite Aid, Solgar, Twinlab and Pharmavite.
    
    Doctors have also noted how consuming large amounts of fish oil can create a significant drop in blood pressure, Myomancy.com reports.
    
    The solution of course is for Corporations to behave ethically and put people ahead of profits.  Until that happens... which is probably never... we will have opposing sides.
    
    The problem is the same as in any industry... profits over people.

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       She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       I completely agree MikeNV. I do not buy the "combined" treatments that I use. I buy the whole natural ingredients and infuse them to avoid buying something that might or might not be an honest claim in both the Pharma and/or natural treatment industry. Hard to explain, I developed my own bio identical estrogenic transdermal cream for my Progesterone Induced Anaphylaxis. It works like Immunotherapy (allergy shots) by causing my body to build up a resistance to my hormones and stop reaction. My side effects have been remission and breast growth. I wouldn't by the hormonal concoctions/balancers on the market due to unwanted added ingredients.   Even looking at the ingredients of most lotion bottles that claim to be all organic and natural, most of them contain chemicals like parabens or something else as a preservative. When I started treating myself for my condition, I decided to just make the treatments on my own to make sure that they contained no added chemicals or anything that I would react to. ESPECIALLY parabens! I think that both worlds (natural/ pharma) are profit over people to cut corners regardless of the impact it has on consumers. YES, I like natural treatments and defend them, I believe they work, but I sure do  wish I could just pop a pill a be all better. I doesn't work that way for me. My problem with this whole homeopathy/ natural treatment issue is not that I disagree with anyone that chooses Prescriptions over natural treatments or vice versa, it has to do with what works best for the individual and how they CHOOSE to treat they're condition. It truly infuriates me that the gov't and others would try to take away my health choices or discriminate against how myself and others have decided to treat ourselves for various conditions.  2 people with high blood pressure- 1 CHOOSES to take a prescription beta blocker, the other decides to change their diet, and cut out salt and caffeine. Which one will have the side effects and yet STILL criticize the other that accomplished the same goal naturally. I've heard that the FDA is giving the makers of Cheerios a hard time because it has the potential to lower cholesterol and they put a heart on the box. Because Cheerios is not a prescription drug, the FDA thinks that Cheerios should never mention any health benefits unless the FDA approves it as a drug. Not sure if that's true but I read it somewhere. They better not take away my Cheerios or there will be war, lol! I have no problem with people who choose the prescription drugs over natural and they should not comment, criticize, or take away my personal choices either. Somewhere, somehow, those same people that are being critical are doing something healthy and NATURAL for themselves, even if it is just eating prescription Cheerios (my drug of choice) for breakfast.

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       Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       "People buy fish oil to improve their health," David Roe, the plaintiff's attorney, told the news source. "We have no way of knowing if all of the other fish oil products have PCB, too."
       
       Response: Thank you for your thoughts. This is the best reason why people take responsibility for their health and what they put into their body. This is the reason why it is smart to be a wise consumer and check out the different types of products [whether it is buying a rated car or washing machine], including vitamins and supplements.

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    Lynda Garyposted 14 years ago

    Wow.
    Let me first admit that I did not read every single post, verbatim; I only skimmed and then focused more acutely on the various comments that stood out (for me).
    
    I DO wish I'd found this thread earlier today, BEFORE I posted this hub: http://hubpages.com/hub/Getting-More-ou … ood-Health
    
    How ironic that I spend a few hours writing on this very topic today, and then the FIRST forum thread I come to is all about it.
    
    Because my full story and underlying opinions are posted in the hub, I won't repeat them here.

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    donotfearposted 14 years ago

    I heard this too. It's baloney that natural remedies are useless. No telling what cures are out there we don't know about because of the madness.

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       Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Hello DoNotFear ~ Thanks for jumping in the thread here. Always good to have another voice. There are a number of organizations that believe many natural products and foods that cure different diseases are not well-known because it would reduce the reliance on the drug industry. But, if people take the initiative, they can find out this information and begin introducing them into their lives. Many people I know are trying the 'raw-foods' diet, juicing, using many berries (anti-oxidants), and some herbs/essences to clean out the system and reduce stress (a great source of illness).

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    thisisoliposted 14 years ago

    I don't think anyone says natural remedies are useless, though a lot of people may say homeopathy is useless, myself included.
    
    Medical advances have refined natural remedies to increase their potency, this can increase the same side effects that the natural remedies posses. The medical industry is one of the few businesses looking for new natural remedies, searching through nature to find what treats us the best.
    
    The medical businesses take a lot of flack, but lets face it, how esle woudl the medical world proceed?

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    Lynda Garyposted 14 years ago

    Thisisoli,
    
    The medical industry is not searching through nature to find natural remedies to MAKE us better.  If it is searching, it is doing it to compete with the natural-remedy industry which is growing in popularity.  With the exception of those individual doctors and nurses and other health-care providers working within the traditional med industry who genuinely want to see and want to have a hand in helping people get well, the industry itself (and the ins. co.'s who run it) have NO motivation to treat patients to the point of "cure" and "good health." 
    
    Money is made by people seeking treatment for illness.  If those illnesses had "cures," the money machine would break.  Keeping people sick, on the other hand, keeps the money flowing.
    
    Also, the "natural remedies" being sought by the traditiona med. industry are then turned into manufactured products, mixed with patented materials (for no purpose other than to patent them), and then the price is jacked up.  I take a daily injection called Lovenox.  It is an anticoagulant.  It is made from the lining of a pig's intestine. Gross, yes.  Natural, yes.  But then it is formulated, etc. until the pharmaceutical company "justifies" charging $8000.00 (yes, thousand!) dollars a MONTH for it.  A month!
    
    Though I've managed to wean myself off of most of my medications, it scares me to stop the Lovenox.  I'm told that it is what is keeping me alive.  The good news is, by eliminating most of my other meds, I am finally healthy enough to return to work -- something I haven't been able to even consider for more than a decade (while under medication treatment), but that is now possible (without most meds). 
    
    It's sort of like an automobile running on air or water.  Even if it would work, "they" would say it doesn't -- because there's no money to be made from it.

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       ACappposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       There's an old saying to "follow the money trail". This is one of those cases when dealing with the mainstream medical industry. I couldn't agree more to this topic because the fat cats are interested in one thing above all else...profits. If everyone was healthy, there would be no money to be made from surgery and medications. Thankfully, more and more people are waking up and realizing this. One site to beware of is quackwatch.com. I heard that the guy who started the website never even passed the medical exams and isn't a real doctor. This is just heresay so I don't want this to be regarded as true, but the point is anyone can claim to be an "expert". Many of the alternative medicines and techniques that claim to be "quackery" by this site have helped countless people to find relief from a number of ailments. I have personal experience in using mind/body methods and have found that my inner peace has never been stronger than it is now. So yes, beware of anyone trying to debunk holistic remedies. Realize what the main motive is....that someone's pockets won't be filled as much if more people were aware of the true benefits of natural healing.

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          Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          We need more people who use these alternative, CAM and integrative methods to speak up and SHOUT OUT that they have been helped and continue to seek these types of treatments. This is the only way our governments will know this is our right.

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       Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Lynda ~ I admire your strength and courage in fighting the medical war machine. I'm so happy to hear that you have improved enough to return to work. It is truly catastrophic the fees that are asked for medications that are supposedly made to help people. Unfortunately, many medications are for a life-time and not really curative so that a person can rely on their own immune system.
       
       Wishing you continued healing on your journey to complete health.

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    daughtersonposted 14 years ago

    When I was in Switzerland Living in a Camphill community I got a kidney infection.  I had been diognosted with chronic kidney infection in America.  I had seen several doctors and they gave me medicine to combat the infection each time it occurred.  While at the Camphill community I was treated with homeopathic medicine.  This treatment cured the immediate problem  and I never had an infection again.  I was very impressed with homeopathic medicine after the experience of being cured of a chronic problem.
    
    I think gentle treatment of many aliments is better.  As I said in my hub garlic can wipe out herpes (cold sores) much cheaper than abeiva $18.00. It kills the virus -- abreva does not kill the virus is blocks it -- so you have to buy it over and over again.  How many other ways can we cure ourselves with simple things that we do not know about?
    
    Of course there are times when we need heavy duty medicine, but much money could be saved with kinder and gentler ways such as homeopathic medicine.

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       ACappposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Debby, I would like to add that many of these so called "medications" from big pharma actually weaken the immune system over time. The result? More medications needing to be taken in order to combat any new "illnesses" which develop. Now, there are medications that are useful for getting someone over the hump, so to speak. However, we need to keep in mind that the body was designed to naturally heal itself, and any unnatural chemicals stunt this process over extended use. I encourage you all to watch the youtube clips for the upcoming movie called "Food Inc." This movie exposes the deceitful ways in which food is manufactured in order to gain higher profits. And then what happens? This constant stream of unnatural food breaks down the body's defenses and then medication is needed (more profits). The U.S. apparently has the best health care system, but one of the highest rates of illness like cancer, diabetes, obesity, etc. Hmmmm makes one wonder. Hopefully this movie will wake up enough people and put our natural farmers in more business and this madness will stop and health and vitality will prevail like it was meant to be. The more natural I am, the more energy and vitality I seem to have. I even recently cut out caffeine for the most part, and feel better from that. In closing, I would like to add that I am part of a healing community where we get together once a week and do group healings. I am ecstatic to say that there are 2 women in our group who were diagnosed with cancer, and since reguraly coming to the group for some time, their doctors cannot find any traces of it left in either of their bodies. There's 2 points right there for all of us "hocus pocus quacks" LOL
       
       Namaste!!!

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          She-rahposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Getting ready to publish a hub on this actually. Yes, the more natural I am the better I am but it's impossible to go all organic for us at the moment. $$$ Hoping to get it on here today. I has some pretty good examples and personal experiences that pertain to your above comment.

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