I just read this hub by Lisa HW
and there's no comment box. so I thought I'd start one here.
I think it's a serious issue,
but as she said many people are misunderstood and thought they have it. Some examples she gave were: if one child was mistreated more tahn the rest, or domestic abuse, etc.
What other ways do you think people could have this , it being situational?
schoolgirlforreal, hi. I saw your thread here and thought, "Hey - I wrote a Hub on that!" I was surprised to discover what the thread is. (I took most of my comments off most Hubs for reasons I just posted about a little while ago).
Anyway, I'm not sure I have much to offer here; but based on the research for that Hub, it's not really clear what exactly causes it. I'm not sure if I'm interpreting "situational" the way you intend it to be, but I do know that PPD (like the other personality disorders) has an "official" definition with a set of behaviors/symptoms/traits - and someone either has it or doesn't.
Why someone has it may not be exactly known, but they either really have it or else don't.
What I'm about to say here is only my own impression, but I think there's a difference between something like depression and something like PPD. Depression can exist without obvious cause, or it can result if a person is in a miserable situation for so long his chronic misery turns into "legitimate" depression.
With PPD, I'm under the impression that, maybe, some situations could make a person APPEAR to show signs of PPD to someone who doesn't understand the whole picture; but I think if that person (who only APPEARS to exhibit signs) were to be seen by a qualified doctor long enough, and often enough; and if that person were willing/able to really share what was going on in his life, the doctor would easily be able to see that the behavior only appeared "off". In fact, it might become clear that the behavior was actually appropriate for the situation.
One thing I've seen with just people I've known (who don't have PDD) is how a person can grow up believing what he's told in his family. I know one set of parents who firmly believed that "doctors are only out for the money, and the only reason they order tests is to make more money". If kids are told that kind of thing, and if they're the kind of people who generally buy a lot of what their parents tell them, they can grow up firmly believing the same kind of thing. That would amount to one of PPD symptoms (not trusting doctors), but it wouldn't necessarily be part of the cluster of symptoms/behaviors/beliefs required for a diagnosis of "genuine" PPD.
In your example of a child who is mistreated more than others, that child may be someone who sees the parents as "mean" or "not trustworthy". If the parents have always been great to the other siblings, the other siblings are likely to think, "Hey, they're great parents and great people. If someone thinks they're mean that person must 'be paranoid'".
I'm not sure if there are other ways people can have PPD. I do know that there are traits/symptoms in PPD that are common to other personality disorders, but then the traits branch off into their own set of things.
With most mental health conditions, it's possible for people to exhibit signs of one thing or another that would seem to indicate the person has one condition or another; but upon better understanding of the whole picture (including the person's situation, and the people he's dealing with), it becomes clear that anyone in that situation would be likely to show the same traits/behaviors.
Most mental health conditions are a matter of inappropriate response to things, rather than "negative" response to things. A negative response is, maybe, being sad when something bad happens. That's no an inappropriate response, though.
What's awful is that when there's a kid, it's the parents who tell the doctor "what's wrong with the kid", and then the doctor (at least at first, but sometimes all through) will listen to what the kid is doing, and try to diagnose by factoring in what parents/family members say.
When I left my marriage I got the "mental health goons" coming after me, because people in my immediate family (the husband I was having trouble with, and the relatives my husband had been talking to about my "strange" behavior) called the department of mental health and said they were "worried about me".
So, once I got dragged to the mental-health place and was in complete and utter shock (not to mention being terrified to have "goons" show up "out of blue" to pick me up), if I let the people there know that I was angry at "everyone" in my immediate family (other than my kids, of course - and that "everyone else" amount to only four people, with one remaining uninvolved in the fiasco), I pretty much came across like someone who didn't trust my husband, my own mother, or my own sister. Well, that would look like a "sign" to anyone who didn't know the dynamics in place in the family at the time.
I had the advantage of being able to explain all the dynamics for myself (and even then it wasn't easy), but imagine if a child has to speak for himself. Besides knowing that whatever he said was likely to be discussed with a parent, children don't always even understand how, exactly, some things affect them. They see themselves and the whole picture from a child's point of view. Fortunately, I was 38/39 when it happened. Even then, though, when I made no effort to hide how disgusted I was, and how "stupid" I thought it was that anyone would ever drag me to the mental-health place based on what an angry husband told people; I came across as arrogant and "over-confident" to anyone who thought I had no right to be that sure of myself. Inappropriate confidence is a SIGN of a mental health problem - but then again, appropriate confidence is a sign of good mental health.
Another complication is this: If someone like an expert says to a child (or an adult who doesn't have much confidence), "You have a mental health problem.," there's a good chance the child (or older person) will believe it. After all, most people know that's it's reasonable to respect what a doctor says. A child may know the doctor clearly doesn't understand what he's living with, and he may see that the doctor doesn't seem to have it right. A child may not be able to express that, or he may feel he has no right to question what an adult (especially a doctor) says is true.
It doesn't help that not accepting what an expert says, or that denying that one has a problem, is also a sign of having mental problems. So you can have a person "accused" of having problems when, really, he doesn't have any at all; and that person can try explaining and "denying" what's being presented. Then, though, the fact is that a lot of people with mental problems actually refuse to consider that they may have them.
Basically, just about anything can look like a sign of a mental problem if someone doesn't truly understand the individual in question and the situation under which he lives, the people around him, and/or some things he's been through. A capable doctor should be able to recognize disorders-versus-none for the most part, but sometimes doctors are in a hurry, or else, when it comes to children or others who can't speak well for themselves, doctors can be at a disadvantage.
You're right. This is a serious issue. I'm convinced that a whole lot of people who have been told they have one problem or another just don't really have that particular problem. Some have other mental health issues. Some may not really have any at all.
When I had that whole fiasco go on with me, if I'd "satisfied" a few people by acting like a quivering little basket of inferiority and insecurity, it would have matched my story better; but the fact that I wouldn't "make everyone happy" by saying how inferior and mentally ill and damaged I was threw some people off (because when you're dealing with people who want you to be subserviant, subordinate, and do what they think you ought to do) they see it as you being "out of line" and "over confident" when you're not willing to take your "rightful place" as "less than them".
I knew someone who dealt with a lot of teen foster girls; and - boy oh boy - were so many of them thought to have mental health problems when, if anyone understood them better, it was clear their only problem was being young and having to deal with some pretty overbearing adults.
I don't know if any of this is at all the kind of information/discussion you had in mind; but I agree that it's a serious issue, and I'd love to see this particular discussion go on for a long time, with, hopefully, a lot of people participating.
" (As you can see, I'm "succinct-challenged." Since you've got a score of 100, you must be doing something right.
Hi Lisa HW,
I'm really sorry to hear what you had to go through. Truly.
As for me...I had a very over bearing father, well he's 83, and he frightened me by yelling alot, he had no social skills at all, was very very shy. My Mom is the opposite but says inappropriate things ALOT. Growing up in a home like this, you can imagine the kinds of social skills I DID NOT HAVE.
Yes, it sucks. Even before I was diagnosed bipolar, I had the stigma of my family. Nuff said there.
When I was diagnosed I was 16 and I don't think I was manic so I question the diagnosis. As for now, I'm so stuck on my pills after so many years, 18 actually, that I don't know. I tried to decrease them with some success and w/ others like Lithium, I lowered it but still have to be on some or I was manic. So....
As for the social thing thou,,,,it really sucks becasue for one I'll prob always have an issue cause of my upbringing as I believe all my 9 siblings do too for the "abuse emotionally.." thou one or two are super chatty like my Mom with charisma.
It's really hard to go through life that way, also having mental illness stigma, but worst of all I don't have a "real" job and that makes me feel like crap.
I don't like being looked over my shoulder -like my dad always did which mad me very uncomfortable- and I get nevous even by myself I inherit a nervous nature cause of my Mom...so working around people is hard unless it's cleaning or in an office where I can be left alone.
I love to be around people thou and that depresses me when I have this issue, cause I just love being around people. I'm the youngest of 10 kids and used to being around people and the people I know and trust I am very fun and outgoing with.
I also grew up in a snobby town too.
This is about all I can say for now. I don't belive I have PPD or whatever it's called , I know I don't....I also have some symptoms of paranoia occasssionally like you said we can have from other things like depression etc.
But...when I worked full time I felt alot better about myself or even part time and I -need desperately to get back to work with a job I feel good about.
I reallly hope that happens soon as now I'm on here-which is great-and lviing w/ my 78 yr old mom with limited socail life which obviously sux.
Quit feeling bad. If you can write like this
you should be able to overcome anything. Admit all the bad things you think about yourself, and tell and compare it with others. This can be done surreptitiously or
flat out. The idea is to get it from the inside to the outside.
schoolgirlforreal, thanks for your kind words about what happened when I left my marriage. It was a long time ago; and, actually, even some of the police involved saw how ridiculous it was. I did learn a few things from that experience, though.
As far as not feeling good about not having a job goes, I don't think there's too many people who don't have a job and who don't feel kind of crummy about themselves because of it. I guess all anyone who doesn't have a job can do is keep looking for one that's right for them; but also, not let whether or not they have a job define them. We aren't defined by whether we have a job or not (or at least we shouldn't allow ourselves to be defined by that).
As far as shyness goes, I'm not horribly shy; but when I was young I had some shyness that I needed to overcome. My first job was at a super-busy supermarket, and I had to figure out how to be comfortable meeting one person after another as they came through my line. I took my thoughts off myself and, instead, tried to focus on making people feel comfortable (since I was the one working in the store, and I figured that was part of my job). I made it a point to treat each new face the way I'd hope someone would treat me. Doing that really helped me overcome a lot of that shyness. I got really skilled at, and comfortable with, meeting new people. It didn't completely get rid of all shyness (because I don't think a person ever completely gets rid of his own nature), but I'm far more comfortable with strangers than a lot of people are.
I'll never be the life of the party and wear a lampshade on my head, or dance on tables - or anything like that. Nobody has to be, though. As long as a person just feels friendly and comfortable with strangers. A whole lot of people feel exactly as you do, so it can feel kind of good (and be confidence-building) to be the one who tries to make other people feel comfortable. It doesn't have to be any big gesture or a lot of talk. I just started with an a couple of friendly-seeming words related to whatever the situation was. If you like being with people, chances are you're someone they like being with too.
Oh well. It seems like you've overcome your share of stuff, so I hope you can find some extra confidence in knowing you've been able to do that (besides having your writing skills).
I like your part about being caring and friendly to strangers in the checkout line, focusing on helping them, sounds good.
I'm interesting in pursuing a career as a peer counselor
Whenever I think of how much that cashier job helped me get past a lot of shyness (or whenever I bring it up in conversations about shyness), I always think how silly it seems; because it was just a part-time cashier's job. Since I'd just turned 16 when I got it, I imagine there may have been other jobs/situations that would have helped with the shyness. I wanted that job, and I wanted money. But, when I stood at that register and saw whole, big, long, lines of people who were pretty much staring at me, waiting for the line to move, it was intimidating. THEN I got word that I'd have to use that mic to page people over the PA system!! OMG!!! Of any jobs I've ever had, that one would seem to be the "least important", but - boy - it was a valuable job for a shy-ish kid to have at the time. I took it seriously and aimed to get really competent at it, and it was from that simple, part-time, job that I got to feel what it feels like to have people see you as a capable "adult" who can be trusted, who can help other people, who became quite the "diplomat" and "social butterfly" (at least there ).
I'm not sure, no matter what kind of parents/family we have, that we can ever get some kinds of confidence-building experiences from our childhood families. Sometimes we're kind of like the characters in the Wizard of Oz and have to get out there, get some experiences, and see for ourselves how we're able to call upon our own skills and get confidence from doing that.
It would be great if you do pursue that career you'd like. In the meantime, I'd think any number of situations that let would give you the chance to take small steps toward practicing "pretending" you're a little more comfortable might help some. (Of course, if you've been doing that kind of thing all along ignore my idea. I'm just throwing out ideas in case they might be useful. )
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