Asians are better at math

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   janesixposted 11 years ago

   I thought I wasn't a racist. But after picking apart my beliefs, I realize now that I am. I thought I wasn't because I thought "everyone is equal". But still, I think in colors. I think in terms of race. I had the epiphany moment "there ARE no races". There is only an arbitrary distinction made about people based on skin color. There are no real differences in people. None at all. There are a few minor genetic differences, concerning physical structure. But no innate differences. No differences in intelligence, personality, or anything else. There can only be differences in culture. And anyone can belong to any type of culture.
   
   I tended to characterize people by color. "Asians are good at math" or "Black people are self confident". I thought I wasn't a racist, because I characterized people in positive terms. I didn't realize that that is just as bad. Because if Asians are are "naturally" good at math, then the rest of us are naturally "less good" at math. Which, of course, isn't true.
   
   There are also things that I realize might be keeping racism alive. When we fill out forms for things, there are often boxes to put in your race, for things like census taking etc. And when you look at information for cities, it will break down the population by race in the demographics.

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      calculus-geometryposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      You make a lot of good points.  I also think that racial stereotypes can hurt the people they are intended to compliment.
      
      I've tutored a lot of Asian students in math over the years, and most of them have told me how embarrassed they felt to be an Asian who's bad at math; they too were brought up with the stereotype that they were supposed to be natural math whizzes.  Part of me wanted to reassure them that I had encountered tons Asians who were bad at math.  But then they might have taken that the wrong way, so I just kept my mouth shut!

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      Quilligrapherposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Hello Jane.
      
      I see that you have introduced a subject that has spawned a huge number of studies, countless printed volumes, and endless discussion and disagreement. A review of the literature reveals some racial distinctions are NOT arbitrary. There ARE innate and other differences, including intelligence, between racial and ethnic groups.
      
      If comparing people on a small scale, for example a dozen or less, you are right to expect little or no predictable differences between races. However, as the sample group grows larger, more and more traits become more common and statistically consistent based upon race. There is no widespread consensus on the causes of many differences still, while it may not be politically correct to say, the facts remain. There are consistent, detectable gaps between races when measuring brain size, intelligence, cognitive ability, aptitude, achievement, creativity, reaction time and more.
      
      For a broad discussion of the issues and arguments see
      http://en.metapedia.org/wiki/Race_and_intelligence
      
      Thank you, Jane, for your interesting threads.
      

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         janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         "while it may not be politically correct to say, the facts remain. "
         
         I am the last person in the world to care about being politically correct.
         
         Your "facts" are wrong.
         
         Scientists don't even know if things like larger brain size equate to higher intelligence.

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            Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Yep. Studies in the 50s and 60s indicated that Africans had larger heads but MUCH less capacity for learning. SLANT SLANT SLANT
            During that time Black scientists were throwing down in the operating room, with inventions, and ground-breaking technologies. Though many considered those Blacks to be some sort of exception. They refused to see that the barring of that race from education created those "exceptional" circumstances.

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               janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               So true. Crappy schools, biased tests,  plus probably things like poor nutrition lower "intelligence" where there is the same real potential.

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                  Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  The "lot" of cultural upbringing in a nutshell. "The Butler" highlighted once again those cultural differences. Black labeled bus seats; restaurant counters; water fountains; differences in pay rate; sub-standard this and that. People lining the streets just waiting for the opportunity to harrass the Black faces. It's amazing that they made it through that really harsh time. No penal punishment for lynching or otherwise killing Blacks. It was often congratulated. God gave the people a resilience unmatched (other than the Jews who likewise suffered some of the same punishment for having their heritage)

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            Quilligrapherposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Hi Jane. Me back.
            
            You are correct when you say, “Scientists don't even know if things like larger brain size equate to higher intelligence.” After I provided you with evidence that some traits vary across different races, you presume my “facts” are wrong. My facts are not wrong. Your interpretation of the facts is wrong. Clearly you misunderstood my post.
            
            You, Ms. Cgenaea, and the entire research community engaged in these studies (and I) all agree that the underlying causes are unknown. Is it due to brain size, culture, nurturing, environment, nutrition, society, economics, etc. etc.? No one really knows.
            
            However, there is one “fact” in my post that is not wrong regardless of your opinion. When researchers measure traits like brain size, intelligence, cognitive ability, aptitude, achievement, creativity, reaction time and much more, they find consistent and detectable gaps between races.
            
            Speculate forever if you like about the reason(s) they exist. However, you can not deny the recorded gaps that have been measured and document. You have been consistently trying to explain and minimize the significance of these gaps, which of itself is an admission that the gaps exist. To admit the gaps exist is NOT to say one race is superior to another. Rather, it acknowledges the gaps are being measured and there are no explanations as to why the gaps are present.
            
            To say all races can solve complex problems at the same speed is the equivalent of saying all races can run at the same speed. With predictable certainty, both research testing and stopwatches have proven both claims are false. 
            
            In 2012, an article in Forbes Magazine featured Jon Entine, author of Taboo: Why Black Athletes Dominate Sports and Why We’re Afraid to Talk About It , taking stock of the DNA London Olympics where, as usual, African-descended athletes swept the running events while whites and Asians dominated in the water sports, field competition and strength events. {1}
            
            Thank you once again for the interesting threads.
            
            {1} http://www.forbes.com/sites/jonentine/2 … -all-care/

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               janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               It's your choice to believe what you wish.
               
               Scientific "facts" are overturned all the time. We always find out we are wrong about things. We always find new information, and theories change decade by decade.

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               Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               My point was that the tests are more often than not, culturally biased. Complex problems can also be biased based upon exposure to learning which is also biased in this entire country.
               On an episode of Good Times, an old sitcom based upon ghetto Blacks; the child wad asked on a standardized test the amount of people who could sleep in a home with a certain number of beds and bedrooms. Culturally, Blacks live communally with multiple households under one roof. So by the time the Black kid counted all sleeping spaces (including two in the bathtub) his # was way off; according to dominant culture standards where families can afford to live one per household.
               His POTENTIAL (something rarely tested) is of course as apt as others.
               Running is a Black persons thing culturally. There are not many swimming pools in the hood if any. Exposure is important, see???  Hide and seek is a favored game for poor kids. Running is what we Black kids do for fun. The skill is honed from childhood. Other children have access to swimming pools and GOOD EDUCATION. See???
               If standardized testing were presented using Negro slang, we would probably have a different set of geniuses.

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                  Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  Culturally biased? Do we claim that the Kenyans long distance running ability is culturally biased? Within Kenya these athletes come from one small region within Kenya at low altitude. They have long skinny limbs to help them stay cool and when they train at high altitude they excel and dominate the sport better than any sport has ever been dominated. Does that mean black can out run white? No. It means people from this particular region can out run everyone. The Jamaican's dominate the sprinting but not long distance. When humans adapt for a particular climate changes occur in both the body and the brain. We all have advantages given to us by genetics. Some are better at math. But I think it's important to remember that we try not to form opinions of people about their appearance. I live in the most diverse city in the world and see all of the stereotypes. In particular we are having problems with Somali youth dropping out of high school and forming gangs. So the talk is to put money into keeping these youths in school. But how can you say to the struggling black kid from another region or any other group that they can join this publicly funded after school group because they are not of Somalia descent?

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                     Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     As for the Kenyans running ability, you spoke some truths. The abilities they have are most likely due to their location and limbs Not innate ability. If you put a British baby there to grow up. The culture cultivation and location will more than likely give him an advantage in running ability over the Brits

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                        Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                        No sorry, growing up there will not make the British better long distance runners. It's not culture it's genetics. Moving there doesn't make your limbs longer and skinnier.

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                           Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                           Well, long and skinny legs may not be the"thing". I would say that even short legs can be faster than long legs. Running with those Kenyans from childhood would probably make a huge difference from the Brits who do not. It just seems plausible to me.

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                              Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                              Well, it's not plausible, if it were than the Brits would be winning all the races as they too train at high altitude and posses better training facilities.
                              
                              Let's look at Michael Phelps. He is built for swimming. Verry long torso, short legs and long feet, arms and legs. I can train with Phelps all I like, as could the Kenyans but his body type is ideally suited for swimming. It has nothing to do with the colour of his skin, but it has everything to do with genetics. At the elite level genetics matters.

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                                 wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                 "At the elite level genetics matters"  Yes it does.
                                 
                                 And at the very top of the elite level (Think Olympic gold medal) so does culture, facilities, funding and health care.  Along with a dozen other things.  They ALL have to come together except in very rare cases where one (usually genetics) overrides the others.

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                                    Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                    In the case of the Kenyans genetics has overridden the others. They have poor training conditions.

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                                       Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                       Yes, we are given a deck of cards. It is one thing to say we are all equal on some initial level. It as quite another to admit that we are not equal in the long run, (or the long legged run, LOL.)

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                                          Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                          Lol! Yes it seems that we all have the same abilities at birth. Then, our environment takes over shaping and pruning and teaching or NOT teaching...

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                                       wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                       I'd agree with that, although it doesn't take a lot of facilities to run long distances.  An open savanna should do pretty well.  Shoes, however, are a different story.

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                                 Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                 Sounds good. But isn't our main point that race never necessarily means ability. It is culture (how, where, with whom you were reared), body make-up, exposure and/or effort

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                                    Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                    I never said anything about race. This small group of Kenyan do not equate to all Africans.

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                                       Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                       You go boy... but from my understanding the conversation was about race being a "factor" when actuality states that we all are a big ol whining, snotty, pottying lump of clay when we are born.
                                       Get born in the "right" environment, things happen...

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                                          wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                          Being a "big ol whining, snotty, pottying lump of clay" does NOT have anything to say about the innate potentialities of that lump.  While environment certainly plays a part, so does genetics, and races (or even cultures) have differing average potentials built into their DNA.  Just ask the Iowa blond on the beach, burned from head to toe, as she watches that beautiful black lady move about comfortably in intolerably bright sunshine.

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                                             Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                             Foul!!!
                                             The burned blonde and the beautiful black lady could very well have the exact same IQ.
                                             Yes skin has a burnable factor when it is pale. But my beautiful black aunt has been sunburned. See??? We break ALL barriers. Lol!!!
                                             Ability is not a race thing. Ability is an individual variable. It varies from person to person. Not race to race.
                                             HA!!!

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                                                wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                "Ability is not a race thing".  Some abilities are most definitely a race thing, such as the ability to survive extreme sun without harm.  And IQ - IQ may be the same.  You claim differently, but have nothing to back you up on that, while studies have repeated shown there IS a race difference.
                                                
                                                I do not agree with those tests, but am unable to definitively state they are false. either.  And neither can you, regardless of how PC or even-minded you might wish to be.

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                                                   Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                   I aint PC. I say what I feel without regard for sounding "acceptable" you know me!
                                                   Studies can show whatever from one study to the next. If we start with junk; we end junky. you cannot prove to me that I am smarter than you simply because I am black and you're not. No matter how many circles I run around you in Spelling or Ebonics, or snowball making. you cannot prove to me that I run faster than you because I am Black and you are not. no matter how many circles I run around you.

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                                                      wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                      Yes, I know you.  I know that truth is not necessary to you, only belief and desire.  Which is kind of what I said; you cannot truthfully say that all races are equal in all respects but that doesn't stop you from saying it.  You wish to believe it, don't care if it is true or not, so you say it and present it as truth whether it is or not.

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                                                         Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                         Don't get mad. And you do NOT know me to lie or be otherwise untruthful, Sir. And honestly speaking. Every last race on God's green (and in your case, sandy, hot, and dry) earth is equally blessed with the very same ooey gooey insides. No leg length; nor IQ test can prove different.
                                                         They say Blacks are rhythmic. But you cant prove it by a few of my friends. Put em on a dance floor with Suzy nem, you get the same off-steppin'; wrong snappn; stiffnecked party.

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                                                            wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                            "Ability is not a race thing"
                                                            
                                                            As far as I have ever seen, that is unproven, and we both know various tests have claimed to prove it false.  Certainly you do not have the evidence to prove it as true.  Although you may use a different definition of the word, that makes it a lie in my book when presented as truth rather than opinion. 
                                                            
                                                            And no, outside of identical twins no two people on the face of this planet have the same DNA; a part of those ooey gooey insides.

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                                                               Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                               So you're saying that Asians have a good-math gene??? Lol
                                                               What HAS been assessed is the way people "good education or no" perform on tests...
                                                               If I put you in a room with me and give you an assessment on how regular your menstrual cycle is and compare it to mine, you would probably fail miserably. And I would pass with flying colors. My point: I cannot test you on information that you have NEVER been exposed to and expect you to do as well as someone who has had periods for years. We're talking exposure. Each culture has ways about them that make them somewhat vulnerable to certain things. Blacks are vulnerable in the area of education in large numbers. Our schools are different. Both our parents (in very lucky families that include 2) usually work to make ends meet; and often times not far past the poverty level. They are gone when we get home from school. And in large numbers, very tired and frustrated by the time they get home.
                                                               Are there any tests that compare black and white students of the same school with the same household circumstances? We wanna make sure the testers start off on the same foot. Even keel-like. same push; same motivation; same opportunity before we judge the results.
                                                               If you have a study with each of those variables in consideration, please let me know. My race does not predict my test scores. Each race contains a good percentage of geniuses. Some of them are not tested.
                                                               Now my all my other conditions?...

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                                                         Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                         Wilderness, I'll have to disagree with you. It's impossible to determine the potential of an individual by race. There is simply to much variation in each race and incredible diversity among Africans. Within the studies of IQ tests whites vary depending on the region that they come from, as do Africans and Asians. We see the same thing among athleticism, we have a small section of Kenya that can out run the world in long distance and we have Jamaicans who can out sprint the world. So if we take skin colour out of the scenario we are left with evolution and genetics. The smartest and most creative person I've meet to date was a black girl from Trinidad who I had a massive crush on in high school.
                                                         
                                                         http://www.thestar.com/entertainment/vi … entre.html

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                                                            wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                            For shame.  You understand very well that only averages and overall performance can be found by race ("race" meaning local groupings, not Africa as a whole).  Your creative friend means exactly nothing in that context.
                                                            
                                                            You will find very, very few Japanese basketball players of top caliber, and the one or two that exist do not change the fact that Japanese do not make good basketball players.  They aren't tall enough, on the average. 
                                                            
                                                            IQ differences - there has never been an IQ test designed that can accurately measure the intelligence of both a native Australian bushman and an upper class Harvard graduate.  Until there is, we will not know whether there is a difference.
                                                            
                                                            However, re-reading your post, it seems that we may be in agreement; that genetics makes a difference and that genetics can result in a small sample of the species that are different.  Better in specific traits, or worse in others.

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                                                               Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                               I suspect she represented plenty. It's best to make assumptions on race.
                                                               
                                                               
                                                               You've made my point perfectly. An isolated group that didn't evolve to be tall may not make good basketball players, but they excel at Judo and Gymnastics. Simply need to take the race out the equation and look at the genetics.
                                                               
                                                               
                                                               There have been studies done that measure the various races, but we find that breaking the races down to smaller groups changes the results, thereby making the results useless and dangerous.
                                                               
                                                               Bingo.

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                                                            Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                            That's all I'm saying too. well ya know, 'cept the parts about crushes on lil black girls... lol

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                                                               Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                               She past away a while ago. So sad, she finally got married and had a little perfect girl.
                                                               
                                                               Google Denyse Thomasos and hit the images link.

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                                                                  Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                                                  She was pretty. ...

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                                          Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                          Race does have nothing to do with anything, but genetics does. It's certainly possible that asians are good at math because only the well off smart ones are making there way here. The Kenyans are good at long distance, the Jamacians are good at sprinting and Russians can drink vodka like no others. The tallest peoples on average in the world are the Scandinavians, the shortest the African Pygmies. Race means nothing but genetics means plenty.

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                                             Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                             Genetics??? I guess, Rad... though genes come from parents (and so does rearing). Deadlock!!!

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         janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Brain size may have very little to do with intelligence. It may have as much to do with food digestion, or other things, than intelligence. If size equated to intelligence, elephants would be four times smarter than humans.
         
         More likely, it's how the brain is "wired". Brain size has shrunk over the last 20,000 years in humans. But is increasing again as body size are getting bigger. May just mean better diet, or some other factor we haven't thought of yet.

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   maxoxam41posted 11 years ago

   When I look at the trends in international mathematics and science study I can't help notice the failure to show data from Africa, south America and Asia. Does it mean that they don't have access to the data and if so, doesn't question the objectivity of your assertion?

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      janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      I'm not sure what you're saying here. Are you saying that the evidence doesn't support what I'm saying? (That there isn't enough data to make my claim)

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   Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years ago

   Rip the skin off of anyone and realize we are all the same bloody red. Aside from that, the soul has no color.

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      janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Charming way to put it.

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         Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Racism is not charming either.

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            janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Of course it isn't.
            
            Luckily, I can look in the mirror, find my faults, and work to change them.

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               Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Evolution explains all differences.

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                  janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  What differences? Beyond a bit of skin pigmentation, maybe a minor difference like lactose tolerance?

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                     Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     Skin color, hair texture, body frame. Survival required certain phenotypic changes for certain climates, terrain, elevation. We adapt. Always have.

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                     Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     ...well, would *variations on a theme* be a better way to put it? Even the dinosaurs were similar to us as far as the basic design of bone structure, (but as I learned on the HP Forums, the bones were more bird-like in composition than human like…) anyway, the basic structures of dinosaurs seem to be a variation on a theme.  Do you know that I think of Our Form as the Original Form God designed for himself and then all other designs (which manifested slowly through evolution,) came from variations of that first blueprint?
                     (I have explained it before to the dismal dismay of others here on HP Forums.)

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                        janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                        "There are a few minor genetic differences, concerning physical structure. But no innate differences. No differences in intelligence, personality, or anything else"
                        
                        That's the only point I'm trying to make.

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                           Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                           ...not even personality? or intelligence?   Actually there are a lot of differences. it is just dangerous to paint with a broad brush. For instance. they say that cancer is probably a genetically induced propensity. No? There are huge genetic computers designed to determine physical characteristics leading to various diseases. I mean, I am the first one to say that spirit animates us, but the manifestation of individual will does point to nothing BUT differences!

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                              janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                              Not in my opinion. Do you think different races have different personalities? Seems like everyone has they same types of personalities. Individuals have different personalities.

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                                 Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                 huh?

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                                    janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                    Did you even actually READ my post?

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                              janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                              Individuals differ widely. Not races.
                              
                              Do you agree with that?

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                                 Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                 On the one hand: Individual personality and intellectual differences could be partially based on genetically inherited traits. No? We all make the best of the deck of cards we are given.
                                 
                                 On the other hand: I agree with the purity of soul. I agree that at the bottom (or top) level we are, in essence, the light of God (and will return either eventually or "in the twinkling of an eye,") and become one again. Let us not argue this point. (I do like to argue/ debate either.)

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                                    janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                    I don't think so. At all.

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                                       Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                       How about with *on the other hand.* Isn't that the point you were making?

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                                          janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                          No. The point I am making is that we are all the same species, with no separate races. There are NO races. There are only humans.
                                          
                                          No division.
                                          
                                          Same.

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   Cgenaeaposted 11 years ago

   Yeah, I know LOTS of Black people with little to no self-confidence. It was surprising to hear you say it the other way around.  Ironically, a past Cultural Diversity course made me to feel as if I had very little awareness of my own race. I was made to study. However, I feel that we make too much of race where it does not matter one bit.
   I do understand the Census counts. We like to know the demographics. But to me, it makes little sense to stereotype. Though i do it. How in the world will we escape the necessity in our minds? It really is a complicated matter.

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      janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      I don't know how we escape it. But the realization in my mind that there were no real differences made it clear for me.

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         Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Right, no real differences. However culturally, differences are highlighted. But I think that gap is closing too.

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   Cgenaeaposted 11 years ago

   No. Those tests are very culturally biased and slant to tilt the results. Studies have been done about that too. Culture plays a huge part in how/when/why^ and what a person thinks. It is not cut and dried. Asians are reared differently than Europeans and/or Italians. Academics is instilled/ingrained. Authoritative parents (dads) who 9/10 are both at home push in that direction. When the kid doesnt cut some mustard, he is often shunned. (For lack of a better term) he usually "HAS" to perform. Expectations of your elders really makes or breaks.

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      janesixposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Exactly.

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         Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         I think you are explaining what Maria Montessori claimed, that there is nothing more perfect than the infant at birth. She wanted parents to try and keep that perfection in bringing up the child from infancy to six, especially.
         
         I think technology should be banned for this age group. It should be illegal for children 0 to 6 to have it. They can become addicted to it.

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            wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Technology.  As in a wind up crib mobile or swing?  A bicycle or battery operated, driveable car?  Powdered formula?  Immunizations?  A talking book?  A child's computer?
            
            Or just video games?

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               Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               ...they can get addicted to ipads, and computers and even TV.
               Screen Technologies. sorry.
               (The sub conscious must be free to form itself during this period. Nature is forming the child from within through interacting with the environment via use of the senses. Early childhood is the sensitive period when the child's mind is absorbing everything in its world at a rapid-fire pace. Building, Building, Building. The environment is essential for development and in the end all that is in the child's environment is what creates every attribute the child develops. Put him in front of screen technology and he looses touch with the promptings of own vital inner life of the subconscious promptings as directed by nature. In other words, it is nature within the child which prompts the baby to interact and absorb what is around him. The child must be free to operate freely in the world. Not in front of screens which are now known to be addicting to young children o-6.
               Why are screen technologies addicting? Because at this stage, what the child absorbs is indelible. Everything becomes part of their sense of order or sense of how things are. They need to concentrate on the world and adapt to the world through concentrating upon it.  Screen technologies and too much outer-stimulation thrown at them only serve to bypass the child's connection to himself. )

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   Cgenaeaposted 11 years ago

   But I'm afraid that genetics may really not be a factor either. Most parents have varying sorts of offspring as well. Many of my entire family is obese. I'm not. I am very active and have been since childhood. My brother and father obese (now deceased because of it) were not. I tested in the 95th percentile on school standard exams. My brother was at the other end of the curve. Genetically, there is a very large number of possibilities with each fertilization. Variability there cannot pinpoint any ability either way. I am smart because my dad was smart does not fly. I cannot run because my dad couldn't run. No...

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      Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Try to look at the big picture and not just yourself. Genetics plays a role on intelligence and physical ability, but evolution has a way of creating exception that can strengthen a community. You may be that exception.

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         Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Try to look at the BIG picture... says your people are just a little dumber... you just got the good genes thanks to science.
         
         No thanks.

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            Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            I said or implied no such thing. I've been saying the opposite. If it is your intention of making me look like a racists while I have being attempting to eliminate race form the discussion all together than I'll move on.

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      Kathryn L Hillposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      warning: creative thinking!
      Perhaps, our souls incarnate into the body with tendencies from past lives, as well.

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         Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Warning, imagination at work.

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         Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Uh oh, you surpassed my level of creativity on that one lol...
         I didn't get it. I don't do past lives. I think we all get one shot. Maybe that is why I missed you. But if you think an explanation may help, please do.

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      Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Further, if genetics didn't play any role why do we look like our parents? My skin tone is in the middle of my parents.

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         Cgenaeaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Genetics plays a role phenotypically for certain, in every way. Intellectually, no. Now I may have a sub-par gene that makes me intellectually challenged, but all races have THAT gene, right???

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            Rad Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            You just finished telling me you are in the 95th percentile and that didn't surprise me at all. But this attitude does.

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               gmwilliamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Rad Man, we ALL know that genetics play a crucial role in intelligence.   Parents with 150 IQs are likely to have children of that IQ range.  There is NO denying that genetics play a role in intelligence.   That is why people who were classified in the retarded range were/are routinely sterilized in order to prevent them from having retarded children.

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            gmwilliamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Genetics DO play a role in intelligence.   It is no coincidence that highly intelligent parents produce highly intelligent children in many cases!  Conversely, it is no coincidence that low intelligence parents produce children with low intelligence quotient. 
            
            Asian children tend to score highly on all subjects for so many reasons.  Asian children grow up in an environment where success and education are highly prized.  Asian parents realize the paramount important of education in a postmodern society.   They realize that without a qualitative, advanced level of education, their children will have a scant chance of success.   Asian parents know how to prioritize, they place education first and foremost.    Amy Chua in her book, Tiger Mom, accentuated the importance of education and hard/smart work as integral ingredients to socioeconomic success.   In the Asian household, mediocrity is unacceptable and failure is definitely not an option.   It is not their race but their sociocultural environment which strongly exhort success.
            

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   Cgenaeaposted 11 years ago

   Ouch

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