The outdated 2nd amendment.

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  1. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    The more guns, the more deaths.
    The less guns the less deaths.
    Guns certainly seem to be having their share of troubles.


    Q. What is wrong with guns today?

    Are they on pharmaceuticals?
    Are they being raised wrong?
    Are they they not getting adequate nutrition?
    Exercise?
    Love!  yikes????

    GUNS NEED LOVE TOO!

    1. Doug Cutler profile image67
      Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      This is me rifle! This is me gun! This is for shooting! This is for fun! Full Metal Jacket y-tube snip-it.
      There are comments here that infer that right-wingers and gun-nuts love there guns more than their families. Then there is the neglected. When it comes time to use it, it malfunctions due to rust, gunky oil, dirt etc. Sort of like your kids  or spouse.

      1. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
        Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Some day we will be able to tell our guns that we now live in a civilized society
        and they should rise to the occasion!

        1. Doug Cutler profile image67
          Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          lol  lol  lol  lol  again!  at least will save $$$ an Biscuits' viagra and such.

  2. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    "States with more gun regulations had lower rates of gun deaths, and states with less gun laws had higher gun death rates, both in terms of suicide and homicide."
    http://stupidpartymathvmyth.com/1/post/ … harts.html

    I would tend to believe this statement.
    You just can't allow guns to run amok!
    And left to their own devices, they commit suicide.

    GUNS NEED LOVE AND BOUNDARIES TOO!

  3. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    PS Guns prefer to be left alone. They like nothing better than to be locked up in quiet dark safes.
    They also don't appreciate being used …

    or banned and whatever that would entail, such as being thrown into massive piles or sent to Mars yikes

    Have some compassion!

    Finis lol

    1. cathylynn99 profile image77
      cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      clever

  4. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    ONE MORE THING!
    Serial killers, mass killers, and rapists / wimps / cowards who have no impulse control are the culprits. (As accurately and astutely explained by wB.)

    Guns do not appreciate being falsely accused of THEIR (serial killers', mass killers', and rapists' / wimps' / cowards') murderous acts.
    At all. sad

    1. Doug Cutler profile image67
      Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      You left out the top three.
      1. suicides: 22,000 out of the 33,000 gun deaths a year. Libs liberal use of drugs?
      2. gangs: about 50% of the the other 11,.000  These are the ones Obama could help on.
      3. arguments: with 48% linked to alcohol.  "Can't yall just get along"  Rodney King

      Butter is back in now. I like utter the best.

      1. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
        Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        List of Cowardly Miscreants directly responsible for harming human life due to HUMAN WILL as opposed to Cold Hard Guns which have NO WILL, as far as we, (well, most of us,) know.

        1. Self killers: (22,000 out of the gun 33,000 deaths a year. Libs liberal use of drugs?)
        2. Gang members: (about 50% of the the other 11,.000  These are the ones Obama could help on.)
        3. Arguers: (with 48% linked to alcohol.  "Can't yall just get along"  Rodney King)
        4. Serial killers
        5. Mass killers
        6. Rapists
        .

      2. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
        Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Butter is the best. I never did give it up.
        I hated margarine.
        Long live Butter and unadulterated foods.

  5. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    The real problem is that we do not have sufficient ESP ability to determine when the "miscreants" are going to strike.
    Justice would be to develop our ESP abilities before taking it out on the poor guns, (which are basically wearing halos compared to these "miscreants."

  6. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    And then there is the option of figuring out why such miscreants exist or how/why they are created.
    ~ and finding find ways to help ALL people become strong, brave and capable members of society.

    Meanwhile, we need to keep setting the boundaries of moral code within society and enforcing the laws of justice.

    Have some butter with your baked potato.

  7. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    Repeating:
    Guns  "… are basically wearing halos compared to these "miscreants."
      LOL?
    Yes.

  8. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    Compared to some humans, guns are angels!
    Long live tools.
    Long live morality.
    Long live rule of law.
    Long live loving home-making mothers!
    Long live loving, home-providing fathers!
    Long live Love.
    Long live Logic.
    Long live freedom of speech.
    Thank you.

  9. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    "The Knights Code of Chivalry and the vows of Knighthood
    The Knights Code of Chivalry described in the Song of Roland and an excellent representation of the Knights Codes of Chivalry are as follows:

    To fear God and maintain His Church
    To serve the liege lord in valour and faith
    To protect the weak and defenceless
    To give succour to widows and orphans
    To refrain from the wanton giving of offence
    To live by honour and for glory
    To despise pecuniary reward
    To fight for the welfare of all
    To obey those placed in authority
    To guard the honour of fellow knights
    To eschew unfairness, meanness and deceit
    To keep faith
    At all times to speak the truth
    To persevere to the end in any enterprise begun
    To respect the honour of women
    Never to refuse a challenge from an equal
    Never to turn the back upon a foe
    Of the seventeen entries in the Knights Codes of Chivalry, according to the Song of Roland, at least 12 relate to acts of chivalry as opposed to combat."
    http://www.lordsandladies.org/knights-c … ivalry.htm

    Gun and swords are friends.

    Long live the spirit of Chivalry.

  10. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    Long live HubPages forums, but I might have killed this thread. sad

  11. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

    Great posts Kathryn !  I see  The NBA is coming out  speaking openly against violent crimes  and the GUNS,  and the NRA  !
    How cleaver , domestic violence kings come out of the closet .   

    At least they're speaking TO ,   AND  perhaps being listened to by  an inner city crime  culture where  racial   and most gun violence  ORIGIONATES  and  MANIFESTS  itself!

  12. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

    HOW LONG DO YOU THINK IT WOULD TAKE FOR A BLACK MARKET GUN  MARKET   TO BE CREATED AFTER A GUN CONFISCATION IN AMERICA?

    WHAT COUNTRY IN THIS WORLD WOULDN'T WANT TO GET RICH FROM THAT MARKET ?

    Canada , Mexico ,   China ?

    Get real anti- crowd , it ain't happening !

  13. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

    I guess the reality of  these  gun control  issues ,as discussed here , will never take place anyway ,  imagine any country in the world doing such ,      talk about national security issues , and for America ?  Right ,   rattle on Anti's !

    1. Doug Cutler profile image67
      Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Mr O is lying about gun facts again. Trying to gin up fears and lead the way to further gun controls and limitations.

    2. peoplepower73 profile image85
      peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Conservative Logic 101

      Question:  Why should I be subject to gun control, I'm a law abiding citizen and have never done anything wrong?

      Answer:  For the same reason everybody is subject to TSA searches at the airport. Everybody has to be treated the same in order to ensure the safety of all the people entering the airplane,

      Answer:  But I'm not a terrorist.  If they eliminated all the terrorists, we wouldn't have to be burdened by this nonsense.

      Answer:  I know Virginia and there really is a Santa Clause!

      1. Doug Cutler profile image67
        Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        The searches at airports are political correct B.S. Terrorists are not your typical passenger.
        You know what I mean.
        Like mr O's insistence that Islam is not radical. Go do a search on what Jefferson discovered in the 1780's and has been hushed up. Then Listen to the clerics and such today. The so called peaceful can leave that radical religion if they are as peaceful as they and you and mr O regime says. Education and truth are in order hear. The Internet is the universal teach tool today. Those that are radical can leave hear and join their brethren in ISIS land or ISIL as you libs prefer.  Then they will be easer to find and destroy. Don't stop them from going as is done now.

        You are getting Virginia confused with those 72 freaky see through virgins. That is their Santa. Perhaps your's, too.

        1. peoplepower73 profile image85
          peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

          Doug:

          How do you think terrorist's bombs get on airplanes? Islam by itself is not radical.  There are radical extremists within Islam.  Islam is a theocracy, not a democracy.  It is more than a religion to Muslims.  It  is also their government.  They are governed by the Koran.  It can be interpreted for good or bad, just like the bible.  Trying to democratize them  is an exercise in futility. 

          How would you like to be told you have to convert to be Muslim?  You are the one who needs to be educated.  There is a three way civil war going on between the Shis, Sunni, and Kurds. It is much more complicated than your judgement about Obama.   Google the difference and you will understand what I'm talking about. 

          By the way, thanks for the insult about Virginia and  Santa...Have a great Holiday.

          1. Credence2 profile image82
            Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Doug is not looking for an answer, he would rather cling to biases and falsehoods than engage with factual information. That is the conservative mantra, why else do they continue to say that the moon is made of green cheese in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary?  For conservatives, actually reasoning is like expecting a bear to use the toilet....

            1. Doug Cutler profile image67
              Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              I have answers as I already stated. Is the regime that is dragging it's feet due to politically correct B.S. And liberal use of drugs as the answer to people with problems.
              Suicide is the number one area. Educate the populace on how to store guns and help those  that need it without drugs.

          2. Doug Cutler profile image67
            Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Evidently you didn't even check to see what Jefferson said and others today are finding  the same thing. Islam is about conquest, murder, rape. extortion, lie to the infidel. No interpretation needed. They come right out and say it in their books. And the clerics today tell them it is what they are to do today to be a true Muslim is all those evil things and more.

            The Israel's dont search everyone. They have other ways to tell.
            Those stuck in that rotten religion that are not into those vile things need to leave. Or just say they are Muslims for their safety. Afghanistan no longer has any Christians or Jews due to that so called religion of peace since we left.

            Islam is a sick the·oc·ra·cy
            THēˈäkrəsē/
            noun
            noun: theocracy; plural noun: theocracies
                a system of government in which priests rule in the name of God or a god.
            In their case, a god, no capital.

            I do not like to be told to convert to anything. The Christian stopped doing that years ago. So don't even go there. It is Islam that still teaches honor murders, beheadings, rapes etc.
            Just look what they are doing to Christians and Jews in Africa and the East. It is you and your ilk that sorely needs education.

            Another point is Jesus was not born in December but in Sept. The corrupt Catholic Church
            told the pagans that He was born then so they could continue to celebrate the sun starting to shine longer each day too. They where unwilling to give up that day.  Just like you are unwilling to see the truth. Only what some corrupt regime says.
            The Internet is the great equalizer.

            1. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
              wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12802434.jpg
              Your understanding is not based on true knowledge, but according to your own commentary, it is based on biased half truths, distortions, and outright lies. I suggest you review various videos of the Honorable Minister Louis Farrakhan. He is a great teacher and has been greatly mis-represented for standing against the system of white supremacy. He does not preach violence against his oppressors, but he freely shines a light upon their wickedness.

              1. Doug Cutler profile image67
                Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                What part is lies? I had to correct your A several times and showed the proof. Where is your proof? You can not deny what Islam is today that I stated. Farrafkhan has converted to Islam has he not?  Why would I believe anything from a religion that encourages its herd to lie to the infidel. You are part of that infidel group if you believe Jesus is the messiah. Perhaps you believe Mohammad is the main man. The Jews generally don't believe Jesus is the messiah and Islam is killing them too. In fact they are for, convert or die, for any religion that does not believe as they do. If a group of Muslims aren't for all that evil they are not true Muslims.

                A true Muslim is about world conquest, convert or die. It is the duty of them to do so. Says so in plain language in the Koran and other writings. The clerics say the same today. No other major religion today says or does those things today. Not a hundred years ago. Today!

                1. peoplepower73 profile image85
                  peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Doug:  You speak in generalities.  There are good and bad in every religion.  You should not lump the entire Muslim world into one category.  To you everything is either all good or all evil.  There is no middle ground.  I could care less what Jefferson said.  He lived in a different time and a different place. You have lumped all of ISIS into the Muslim world. The core of ISIS are Sunni extremists.  They have a totally different values and beliefs than other Sunnis, and Shia, and Kurds.  Look up the difference, it may surprise you.  It is far too complex for this forum, but I have done the research and analysis and written several hubs about the middle east and there conflicts. You know nothing about Obama other than what you have been spoon fed by right wing propaganda, or else you could call it a Regime.

                  1. Doug Cutler profile image67
                    Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    You didn't read what I said very well. I did say the people that are not into the vile things Islam preaches and does today needs to get out of it. Or just say they are Muslim so as not to get killed by the real Muslims. It is not so much what Jefferson said.  But what his Muslim advisor said. And Islam today is doing what it did back then.

                    Obama was a trouble maker in his younger days. Would threaten establishments into donating to his cause. Signed paper work to let babies die. Broke constitutional laws.
                    Lied excessively to the people: Benghazi, Mexico gun running etc. Ran up the dept  6.5 trillion. Let Christians and Jews get slaughtered at the hands of Islam. I know plenty about that sleaze bag.
                    Refuses to go after the gangs that are responsible for 50% of the gun homicides.
                    Constantly jumps to conclusions and is proven wrong.

                    You said: "You know nothing about Obama other than what you have been spoon fed by right wing propaganda, or else you could call it a Regime."  Does even make sense!
                    re·gime
                    rəˈZHēm,rāˈZHēm/
                    noun: regime; plural noun: regimes; noun: régime; plural noun: régimes
                        1.
                        a government, especially an authoritarian one.
                    They all follow the Koran. That is where they get there murderous ways. Else they are not true Muslims.

                    He is always trying to skirt around the constitution. It is his way or none.
                    It is a shame the Reps don't have the balls to stop his unconstitutional ways.

  14. cathylynn99 profile image77
    cathylynn99posted 9 years ago

    merry christmas, happy holidays, all.

  15. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

    All a bunch of opinions , and that's all ,  a gun  should be as freely acquirable  as a pen  , a  hammer . or a  baseball cap,  for that matter .The issue of  exactly why this a debate even arises at each election cycle  is a direct indication of  it's relevance  in importance ,   I think for the most part it's a  regularly timed  diversionary tactic between  the political system  and our media ,   

    For one , the politician wants us to focus on anything but their unaccountability  , their total lack of leadership  ,  the fact that they are there merely for their own financial portfolio's !

    Two , the media !   Of which none of us  are happy with in the long run .  Left or right  , who exactly thinks our media is ethically ,  morally  or  neutrally driven ?

    Is it a conspiracy ? Hell No .   The American public is to shallow to believe in conspiracies  when it comes to blind political naiveté .   We follow  the two party system like robots  , inking out our minds  and opinions like a wet paper bag full of greasy donuts .  The left ; predictably  driven by pseudo Marxist  drivel ,   the right ;  unchanging  , unshakable in it's heritage of the all  boring sameness . And here's the kicker , as long as they , the politicians  with the media in its coin filled pockets , keep us hyped up on the same  divisive topics . We never  ask them  for any positive results .

    I will keep my guns  thank you ,none of you won't see them taken  , or like  the original patriots , bury them  in oiled blankets , to dig up when the time is right for that new revolution .  And do we ever need that new revolution .

    Spoken with a totally free and  sober mind .
    http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12776878.jpg

  16. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

    Liberals , for all the "open minded enlightenments ",In reality  the greatest fascist's in the world , One who  would take it in hand, heart and mind to limit the liberties of another man .   One thing that I do know about them is that they can't begin to understand either the operation of a gun nor that of  the law !

    Al that they do understand is the motoring of the mouth .

  17. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    Instead of apologizing for evil guns, we should …

    prohibit them.

    After all, they have unrestrained impulses and uncontrolled anger.

    LOL
    big_smile

  18. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

    I believe I'm going out and buying a  heavy  machine gun !  ...........Sorry , but it's just that I've always had a great fear of zombies  , the pseudo- Marxist's  .  walking dead  of the liberal  mind , you almost can't off them !

  19. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

    2013  deaths according to the FBI 

    firearms   8,454
    of which ,
    handgun  5782
    rifle            285
    shotgun     302

    Personal weapon , hands ,feet   etc. 687

    Kind of takes the wind out of the whole assault weapon debate huh , want to register my feet next ??

    1. Doug Cutler profile image67
      Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      See, We are killing less. That goes with the sites saying we are living in the safest time in history like posted recently.  Average was 11,000 a year Then 8,500 in 2013. Can't wait to see 2015 figures. Of coarse sleaze bag Obama will take credit for it.

      But when they say peace and security.  Stay prepared and vigilant!

      Zombies will protest with a Zombie Lives Matters movement. Just like that other hateful group.

      1. profile image0
        ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        285  deaths by rifle  in 2013  !    That includes "assault weapons"  and yet probably also includes accidental hunting rifle deaths .    What a bunch of collective distortion  freaks .    I look at present day  liberal socialist activists  as I would have looked at the KKK , What difference is there between those who rhetorically incite   action for  false  reasons , actions that affect real  lives ,   and those who would kill outright .

        When a  false rhetoric  attempts to  take  real protection from the law abiding public,  by limiting such things as police protection  and  home defense . It matters !

        For instance - Black lives matter   = KKK .

        1. My Esoteric profile image85
          My Esotericposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          The reason that "Black Lives Matter" resonates as needed is because Black Lives do not Matter to Doug, an upsetting number of police, the KKK, and the rest of you who care more about whether a white lives or dies than about if a black lives or dies.

          1. profile image0
            ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            If a white man dies , and they do ,  they just die .

            But if a BLM  man dies  it has to have something to do with racism .  No matter that there is  a subculture of more violence , more death and most of which is black on black .   But to post THAT truth would be counter productive to   your causes .No?

          2. Doug Cutler profile image67
            Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            es·o·ter·ic  my esoteric
            ˌesəˈterik/
            adjective: esoteric

                intended for or likely to be understood by only a small number of people with a specialized knowledge or interest.
                "esoteric philosophical debates"
                synonyms:    abstruse, obscure, arcane, recherché, rarefied, recondite, abstract; More
                enigmatic, inscrutable, cryptic, Delphic;
                complex, complicated, incomprehensible, opaque, impenetrable, mysterious
                "in attendance were more than 50 antiques dealers brimming with esoteric knowledge"

            You are not even close. Can't see the evil in BLM! They preach that only black lives matter.
            ahorseback is correct BLM, is just like the KKK. Islam is the same way. Perhaps you are an Islamist too. That was one group that is in that web site of black mass murders.
            What gives you the right to choose which group livs or dies. By their fruits you will know them.

            You don't read very well either. I go by the individual not race as Credence2 is now threatening. I have me eye on you too and that evil BLM. Lives matter in all races. Some individual lives don't. Come off your group lib B.S.

            1. Credence2 profile image82
              Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

              I am asking you to touch upon delicate areas of reasoning and discernment. Or is that possible?

              The movement is in response to heavy handed police tactics that are statistical shown to occur more frequently to Black Americans without justification. I know that it may be a bit subtle for you to see meaning in significance beyond the idea that wanting these abuses stopped  is saying that the lives of no one else matters.  Just a Jedi mind trick, most effective on the feeble minded of the political right.

              When ever Blacks assert their rights in this society and it makes you nervous, I say BRAVO!

          3. colorfulone profile image80
            colorfuloneposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12805060.jpg

            This is the mentality of the BLM (puppets of Islam?).

            BTW, the KKK killed African American Republicans.

            1. Credence2 profile image82
              Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

              Colorfulone, that is BS and we both know it. When Paul Robertson and MLK pursued rights for African Americans, they were called Communists by the right, sound familiar. The rightwinger, like a bad penny, is eternal.

              I don't know how dumb conservative think we are?  Why do they keep bringing up the lame and tawdry discussion point?  We are not talking about a scenario a over a century ago. I am talking about right here, today, December, 2015, the 21st century, not the world of 1915, thank you

              1. colorfulone profile image80
                colorfuloneposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                MY ESOTERIC was talking about the KKK.   Go jump higher!   

                The reason that "Black Lives Matter" resonates as needed is because Black Lives do not Matter to Doug, an upsetting number of police, the KKK, and the rest of you who care more about whether a white lives or dies than about if a black lives or dies.

                I was expressing the mentality of BLM today.

                http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12805068.jpg

                ADDED: Doug is okey!

                1. Credence2 profile image82
                  Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Yes, but I may be missing your point?  Opponents of the BLM movement share a common theme with the KKK, a disregard for the rights of Blacks in confrontations with law enforcement and in life, period.  They just cant get away with the sort of outrages practices by the Klan, in this day and age. That is the only difference.

                  1. colorfulone profile image80
                    colorfuloneposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    Communists have no trust in police force no matter what color they are. 

                    I do respect your opinions.  smile

                    But this ...  is outrageous! 

                    http://usercontent2.hubimg.com/12805077.jpg

                    Double standard.

            2. Doug Cutler profile image67
              Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              That sign is a joke. If it was true then there would be a lot less blacks. The mom should have brought him up better. The dad should have stayed home. Will maybe not. They teach their young to get what they can because whity owes them. You white, you got money, you got insurance! I have heard this plenty from my days in the hood from 7-8 year olds. It the coming from the parents. Why the F should he get a free pass? Oh, whitey owes him! I see now!

              1. colorfulone profile image80
                colorfuloneposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                BLM doesn't seem to see the danger that officers are in?

              2. Credence2 profile image82
                Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                "A lot less blacks'? You would like that wouldn't you. The reality is that the population is stable and within a decade or three, there will be a relative fewer of you. So, I think that you will need to be more polite.

                More stereotypes about something you neither understand or have any knowledge of, except for a superficial standpoint clouded with a biased perspective.

                1. colorfulone profile image80
                  colorfuloneposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Are you familiar with the Jim Crow laws enforcing racial segregation in the Southern United States?   

                  "We come to celebrate and give thanks for the remarkable life of J. William Fulbright, a life that changed our country and our world forever and for the better. . . . In the work he did, the words he spoke and the life he lived, Bill Fulbright stood against the 20th century’s most destructive forces and fought to advance its brightest hopes."

                  So spoke "White Supremacist" former President William J. Clinton "Bill" in 1995 of a man who was among the 99 Democrats in Congress to sign the 1956 “Southern Manifesto”. The Southern Manifesto declared the signatories’ opposition to the Supreme Court’s decision in Brown v. Board of Education and their commitment to segregation forever. Fulbright was also among those who filibustered the Civil Rights Act of 1964. That filibuster continued for 83 days.

                  http://armored-column.com/the-democrati … gregation/

                  The Democrats may be trying to bring back Jim Crow?  Don't trust Hillary, she lies. 

                  ( "Southern Democrats" later became Republicans. Always remember that when the Republican Party was founded it was the "liberal" party.  "The establishment".)  Its always a compliment to be accused of being a "conservative" of "far-right-winger"...because that means I would be anti-establishment and a true patriot.

                  1. Credence2 profile image82
                    Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    First of all:

                    1. This is clearly one of those biased websites, the credibility of such comes into immediate question.

                    2. There were plenty of people on both sides of the isle that praised Strong Thurmond of SC and Senator Byrd of West Virginia upon their passing simply to acknowledge their years of service. And were not so petty to speak ill of them at their deaths.

                    3. I don't care what Clinton said about some old Arkansas congressmen, when his true values toward to community and the striving of the middle class was spoken in actions during his term, which I regard as successful on all the fronts that were important.

                    4. Who would be naive enough to think that I don't know about the courts and civil rights law. The Supreme Court and progressive Presidential administrations during fifties and sixties established the principle that "separate but equal has no place in American law, or American life". Thank God for the Courts and progressive leadership. The fact that the Democrats would be involved in turning this back is worthy only the National Enquirer, for Enquiring minds, of course.

                2. Doug Cutler profile image67
                  Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Of that mindset, yes. Perhaps you condone and even encourage it? I grew up poor and didn't think entitled to other peoples stuff. Got off my lazy arse and did lawn mowing snow shovlin, clean up leaves etc. In a poor neighborhood. Now, if you as a group taught a few ethics.
                  Already mention what you taught. Not in every household but a large number of them.

                  1. Credence2 profile image82
                    Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    No, Doug, I don't condone nor encourage it. Not all of us are moochers, you know, just in case that possibility has not occurred to you.

                    If I had to revisit every slight by whites during my attempt to earn my way, I would be a pretty bitter fellow today. But, I waited them out and proved smarter and more resiliant in the final analysis. So, victory smells so sweet.

                    I spite of all  advantages of my adversaries, they have weaknesses and insecurities that can be exploited as defense and compensation against their overwhelming advantage in so many areas of society. Look for the Achilles heel, I always say. Everybody and everything has one.

                    Try to avoid blanket stereotypes, it makes your arguments just that much less convincing.

            3. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
              wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              http://usercontent2.hubimg.com/12805187.png

              Against the best fiction, truth always prevails.

              1. wilderness profile image75
                wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                What truth?  The "truth" that because there was a slave on the other side of the continent long ago means I get a free ride now?  Because I have (somewhat) the same color of skin?  That "truth"?

                1. profile image0
                  ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  +++++++++++++++++++

                2. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
                  wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12805268.jpg

                  NO! You don't get a free ride. The historical record clearly shows that the white European American , as a whole, has already gotten their "free ride" for over 500 years. Free Land (stolen)  Free Labor (stolen) and Free Sex (rape).  Now the chickens are coming home to roost. Racist rhetoric and all the guns in the world can't stop the slow train that's coming.

                  Your failure to understand the complexities of race relations,  is directly related to your inability to grasp the connection between the manufacture and sale of guns, and gun violence. Such a mindset can only lead to the utter annihilation of the American people, and perhaps all of mankind.

                  1. Doug Cutler profile image67
                    Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    No! it is your failure to see what a free country we have/had until now. And how the free enterprise system has benefited all. Why do you think the world wants to come here?
                    Not the few nut jobs that want to do harm. Even the crooks are on the borders to get their part of the American dream.

                  2. wilderness profile image75
                    wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    Well, why can't I get the same free ride others have?  While it's true that I don't have quite as much melanin in my skin as they do, it is almost a certainty that somewhere in my ancestory was a slave.  Probably not on this continent, but somewhere.  And most likely with a slavemaster with more melanin that I have, to boot - should not the black race then offer me a free ride?

                    What you never seem to realize is that I am not the racist.  I have done nothing to cause racial tensions (except insist that race doesn't matter - that got me some grief in one job until employees figured out I meant it).  Yet you hold me, along with all other Caucasians, liable - how does that work again?

        2. Credence2 profile image82
          Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

          You are incoherent as usual, ahoreback. What are you talking about?

          What do 'Black Lives Matter' have in common with the KKK. KKK had a body count, when has the BLM taken any lives?

          Besides people complaining that protests interfere with their shopping habits at malls, what about the white supremacist men that shot into a BLM rally, who, when I last checked, were still at large?

          If this movement makes you and people like you uncomfortable, I say GOOD. Get ready for more discomfort because we are going full throttle in 2016

          1. profile image0
            ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            My point is in that one is as relevant to truth and reality , as the other .

    2. My Esoteric profile image85
      My Esotericposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Now limit your stats to MASS killings and what do you get?  Oh yeah, I forgot, those dead people don't count as dead to you and are not important.

      1. wilderness profile image75
        wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        it then your stance that the most intelligent attack on murder rates will be to isolate the smallest, but most emotionally laden, segment and try to force the insane to change their tool of choice by throwing roadblocks in the path of innocent people that will not use the tool in that manner?

        Makes perfect sense...if the primary goal is simply to remove guns from everyone.  Other than that, it seems more than a little futile and quite dishonest to boot.

        1. Doug Cutler profile image67
          Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          That appears to be their plane. The regime jins up hot heads with exaggerations.
          One apparently on this thread wants just whites to give up guns while they keep theirs'.
          I have been banned by calling him out and using the big bad H word. Wouldn't surprise me if he was the one to B and get me banned.

    3. My Esoteric profile image85
      My Esotericposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Also, your tally is off by about another 16,000 dead people killed by firearms (granted not by assault weapons).

      1. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
        Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Those bad firearms!

        ~ OFF with their arms ! ! ! mad

        1. wilderness profile image75
          wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          No need.  Just take their hands, or even fingers - without fingers they can't pull their own trigger any more.  Problem solved!

          On second thought - just amputate those evil index fingers.  Not being noted for high intelligence, guns would never figure out that they could use a different finger!

          1. mike102771 profile image68
            mike102771posted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Isn’t that what they do with thieves in the middle east?

            1. Doug Cutler profile image67
              Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              Good point. Perhaps that guy holding that sign should have some missing too if he is a thief.
              That would be an education. Same goes for all colors.  BLM, CAIR sharia Islam Don't you know what you are asking for?

              1. mike102771 profile image68
                mike102771posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                A world free of high-fives, waving, finger pointing, peace signs, and of course the one finger salute. roll

          2. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
            Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Its the wrist that counts, no matter what finger is used.

  20. colorfulone profile image80
    colorfuloneposted 9 years ago

    CS Lewis wrote, "In a sort of ghastly simplicity we remove the organ and demand the function. We make men without chests and expect of them virtue and enterprise. We laugh at honour and are shocked to find traitors in our midst. We castrate and bid the geldings be fruitful."  1947, in "The Abolition of Man". 

    Scewtape!

    1. colorfulone profile image80
      colorfuloneposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12805132.jpg

      Look it up Cred...you can do it, I have faith in you.  wink

  21. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    Someone needs to tell firearms that people are NOT for killing!!!

    ... well, someone needs to tell that to ALL the people too.

    and ALL the people need to listen to that someone.

    But do they?

    No.

    ~ and that is what riles up the firearms!

    So, we need to stop riling up the firearms!

    1. colorfulone profile image80
      colorfuloneposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      http://usercontent2.hubimg.com/12805115.jpg

      The Matrix is a Warner Bros. place to be. 

      Next people are going to be arrested for carrying a gun with a legal license?

  22. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    what is a firearm with out its arms?
    Fire

    The origin of gunpowder is unknown, and may have occurred in China, Turkey, or Europe. The first record describing the combination of charcoal, sulphur, and saltpeter, to produce a rapidly burning or exploding powder is a coded writing by Franciscan monk Roger Bacon shortly before 1250 A.D.

    http://www.nramuseum.com/gun-info-resea … earms.aspx

  23. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    We need to outlaw fire.
    No more fire
    No more combustion of any sort.
    No more sun, "blot it out from the sky:"
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4irXQhgMqg

  24. colorfulone profile image80
    colorfuloneposted 9 years ago

    Parents of wanna be rapper "donkey cartel" who was killed in the northlake mall, of course say he was a good boy who wouldn't hurt anyone. Nevermind the fact that he pulled out a gun and started shooting in a crowded mall and his mother openly admits he always had a gun. Donkey was also a BLM supporter who tweeted "I am racist, I don't like white people".

    But he was a good boy and its the cops fault. Mean old racist cop.
    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nationa … -1.2477589

    http://usercontent2.hubimg.com/12805185.jpg

    BLM going to protest Donky's death next?   We'll see. 
    I agree with blaming the parents for not teaching right from wrong...and the Truth of Love! 

    Enabling parents see the fruits of their inaction and don't accept any responsibility.

    PS, did I miss it or have they failed to lament the death of their other son who was shot in the head by a fellow gang-banger?

    1. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
      Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      +1

    2. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
      wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12805278.jpg

      It's interesting to note that I can't recall any comments on this thread about white mass shooters. I have hardly seen anything posted about Dylan Roof, or Adam Lanza,  but you post a pic of the Donkey Man to prove what?  He didn't kill 20 little kids at Sandy Hook Elementary, and he didn't kill 9 people who were attending church, but he did fire a gun in a shopping mall. Apparently, especially since he was black,  that makes him more newsworthy than a mass killer who happens to be white. Yes, that's how I spell racism.

      1. Doug Cutler profile image67
        Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Where were you a couple days ago? That was all that was on here. You even took a couple shots at me. Go back and catch up on some reading. Remember the racist stuff you posted?
        Remember the post about showing the black mass murders and serial killers? Do you know how to count? In a country that has 5 times as many whites it only stands to reason there would be five times as many white murderers. Then there is the Islamics. What, maybe 2% and 1 in three of the mass murderers are them! Try the stats on Indians. I looked and there is nothing to be proud of there. Go back to sleep!

        Daylon Roof was covered by yours truly.  Also the good people that forgave him. Don't know if I could. You apparently certainly can't

      2. colorfulone profile image80
        colorfuloneposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        I would give you the metaphysical definition but I will keep it to the simplest way I can say it. That, mankind has opened a big can of whoop-ass and its gonna get real expensive!  Our technology has created a slave race of beings that have lost their heart, compassion and moral compass and it's all by design by the psychopathic non souled beings that have created an environment where only the heartless, careless and greedy people get all they desire at our expense!

        I don't believe that we need more gun restrictions.

  25. mike102771 profile image68
    mike102771posted 9 years ago

    All of the bill of rights was written in another time and place. If we used your logic is freedom of the press or speech also outdated? Our four fathers (the Federalists) knew that if rights are not written down then they cannot be defended. I do believe that if we had cars in that time then we would have a right to dive instead of a privilege to as the government sees fit.

    The second amendment does not drive people mentally ill nor does it drive the mentally ill to kill. You could make the argument that it does make it easier for the mentally ill to buy a gun. Then someone will say that many states already have ways to prevent the legal sale of guns to people who have issues and that we need to inforce laws already on the books rather than eliminate rights for everyone. It would be like outlawing cars because of all the deaths to drunk driving. We need to address the way we deal with mental health in this country. It’s like the drug issue where we spend billions on a failed drug war rather than dealing with the issue of addiction (including mental health). Maybe if we were to outlaw narcotics like cocaine, meth, heroine and other drugs then the drug epidemic would end? hmm

    The gunfight at the O.K. corral (which actually happened in an alley near the corral) was a group of public officials (sheriff and his deputies) out to disarm a group for which they have an establish vendetta with. Using this as an argument for disarming than we would need to disarm the police and criminals not the general public.

  26. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

    Since when did the color of a mans skin today  become a badge !

    1. My Esoteric profile image85
      My Esotericposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      No, the question is when will the color of a person's skin stop becoming a target.  The only people who were their skin color has a badge are White Supremacists, Nazi's, the far, far Right and Black Panthers.

      1. profile image0
        ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Why does the left continue to deny  that there is a problem of crime in colored  inner city neighborhoods, THAT is where almost all [ 3 out of 4] gun murder numbers come from ,   Lets answer that first ?

        1. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
          Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          cuz thats where guns like to live.
          ~ why, I do not know.
          we need to ask them ...

          and ask them to move.
          ~  like to the hills of Wyoming or somewhere.

  27. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    Prohibit combustion!

    1. My Esoteric profile image85
      My Esotericposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      walk

      1. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
        Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        what?!

  28. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    No more  F I R I N G  of arms!


    Send all gunpowder out of the solar system!

  29. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    PEOPLE ARE NOT FOR KILLING, YOU BAD FIREARMS!
    There.


    Let's see if they listen.
    I'm sure they will listen and comply if ...

    we ask nicely. smile

  30. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    I was watching a three year old while she played on play equipment designated for very young children the other day.  A group of moms were talking amongst themselves on a picnic table while their great big teenage boys were galloping around the play areas shooting great big 'ol toy guns at each other. The plastic guns launched light weight apparently harmless projectiles about three inches long with loud clicks.

    For some reason the boys decided the play equipment for the very young was a great place to shoot their guns at each other. They were "firing" and shooting, shooting and "firing" and it was very disconcerting to me as these projectiles whizzed over the child's head. I wanted to tell the boys to please leave the small child play area and have some respect for me and the child.

    I decided to stand there and observe them, instead. I clearly comprehended they had no regard for me or the child whatsoever. They cocked their big plastic toy guns and shot all around us. I could barely stand it, but I held my tongue. Finally, they sensed my growing intolerance and finally scampered off.
    The mothers were absolutely oblivious to their son's behavior and the disturbance they were causing.
    Humph.

    1. profile image0
      ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Kathryn , As a child we had sticks for guns ,a piece of   bark for knives  ,   we even threw  rocks occasionally .making our own bows and arrows ,     But we never even dreamed of really hurting someone .        What IS missing is a common thread of understanding between parents  . A common decency in behavior ,  Common sense  - you know that thing that people  believe no longer exists ? Sorry about that experience  ,   You should have their parents offed !

      1. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
        Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        That scene is indicative of what is wrong with society.
          Moms WATCHING their big teenage boys. 14 -16
           In the PARK
           around PLAY EQUIPMENT
           with bright plastic TOY guns!

          I mean does anyone see the bigger picture here?
        I might have gone up to these moms to see what was up.

        but ... I didn't want to know.

  31. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    <"Racist rhetoric and all the guns in the world can't stop the slow train that's coming.">

    What is it?

  32. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    Hint: Brains / Minds are terrible things to waste
    and they need to be guided toward positive, constructive directions.
    Why, oh why are these directions so hard to FIND, let alone follow ????
    negative directions need to be banned.
    not guns.
    … well until the world is 100% full of people who are positively wound up.

    TWISI

  33. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    < "they (adversaries / whites) have weaknesses and insecurities that can be exploited as defense and compensation against their overwhelming advantage in so many areas of society."> Credence

      This is a peculiar pont of view, IMO.


    What are their weaknesses?
    What are their "advantages." 
    Where did those weaknesses / advantages come from?

    1. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
      wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12805756.jpg
      The fundamental  weakness that I have seen is arrogance, and a false sense of superiority.  But I am not the first to recognize this ands use it as a weapon. During the antebellum many black slaves pretended to be illiterate and simple minded, and used this technique as a subterfuge. Of course, the slave owners readily accepted this false image as fact, simply because it fit with their illusion of superiority over what they perceived to be an inferior race.

      The black slaves were able to gain a great advantage through this technique, especially during the Civil War. They were able to gather various intelligence and pass it on to the Union forces simply by pretending to be docile and stupid. The racist, like most people, loves to be flattered, and so you can move mountains simply by appealing to their false sense of entitlement and superiority. Buying them a gift for Christmas, such as a velvet Elvis poster, or a new gun rack for their truck , doesn't hurt either.

    2. Credence2 profile image82
      Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      That is ok, Kathryn, you can be a ‘big girl’ and ask me that question directly. It is a good question, the answer of which you can consider a part of your continuing education.

      Yes, it is my point of view and the reality of most black folks, at least of my generation, anyway.

      Doug says that at 5-7 years young black kids in ‘the hood’ are saying that they are owed by ‘whitey’.

      What are white advantages? Look around you, from Miss Clairol hair color, cultural, political and economic dominance. Growing up and turning on the tele, all I ever saw were your faces. Your culture norms determined the standards of beauty and the standard of success. How were we to compete with that? Even when racism was not involved, we were always on the outside looking in. White individuals have a natural advantage in such a system that was built by people like them and for them. Where did that leave ‘the others’? We always had to have a sponsor for access to opportunity, and there were not always many. Otherwise, our fate was either being consigned to a life of economic marginalism, prison or death.

      Your disadvantage is overconfidence, and underestimating the people the system has consigned to oblivion. My generation was raised with a sense of ‘healthy paranoia’, realizing the color blind, equal opportunity stuff was more talk than reality in most cases. Whites did not need to know any thing about us outside of the stereotypes of love for chicken, watermelon and such. Your culture was in dominance, you did not need to care. Understanding and negotiating through the white culture was necessary for our survival, so I had to become much more expert on your habits as a group and how that translates into action on the individual level. My studies and understanding of your culture, naturally, had to be more complete and taken far more seriously. I learned to identify allies, learning which buttons to push and which ones not to push, manipulating racists, who, as WB says, are basically fragile and insecure people. (Colonel Klink style) I allow people to believe and think whatever they felt comfortable with as long as my agenda was not impeded. I was concerned about making an impression only on the people that I needed for something, otherwise, I was wasting my time and energy.

      What the young scrubs may be losing is this ‘sixth sense’. That many more basic and subtle techniques to get at social problems are more effective than rioting and screaming demands. It is so much like the martial arts, as an opponent's superior weight and momentum can be used against him by a skilled practitioner.

      I close now with a reference from one of my favorite movies, the 1953 science fiction classic, “War of the Worlds’. Dr. Forrester said before a gathering of scientists and military people after a recent defeat, ‘ we now know that we can’t beat their machines, we have to beat them’.

  34. cheaptrick profile image74
    cheaptrickposted 9 years ago

    What a beautifully written piece from a difficult position to say the least.
    If we look back through history however,We find that Every race has held the position of 'King Of The Hill' at one time or another.
    Each race touts the accomplishments and contributions it made while 'At The Top',all the while proclaiming its superiority to all other races.
    The Pyramids of Egypt,the Massive ancient cities being uncovered in the deserts of Africa,and the veritable age of the black race clearly shows their 'Day In The Sun' existed(and in all probability will come again) for quite some time.
    Through all the racial wars,persecutions,and genocides no one seems to have noticed that EVERY race has made great contributions to civilization and EVERY race has a dark side as well.
    We need to examine the concept of intellectual contribution while maintaining cultural heritage;the first because it improves life in general,and the second because the world would be a very boring place if we were all the same.
    So we have the contentious "we have to beat them" ideology...which is wrong...And we have the "melting pot" also known as "multiculturalism" ideology which is equally wrong...because(as I'm sure we all know)what lives inside a person rarely matches what we think we see.How do we achieve intellectual equality while maintaining cultural heritage?
    I'm afraid my brain is not big enough to answer that question...but there are much bigger brains out there who(I'm betting) can...
    Thousands of years ago a pretty smart Chinese guy named Confucius was asked what the answer to all the worlds problems was;He said one word "Education".
    Isn't it about time we got started learning how to think?I'll end this piece (in the spirit of science fiction) with a question to get us all thinking:Why,in the Star trek series,do they have to walk to the transporter room?

    1. Credence2 profile image82
      Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      hello, Cheaptrick, thanks for your most gracious compliment.

      I dunno, if every racial group has had it day in the sun, the Anglo should have a coveted tan by now!

      This preference for 'white' is pervasive and probably started as part o the 15th and 16th ocean voyages as a tool to be used by the mariners and settlers to control to native populations they came upon. Shackles on your mind and your self image were, in the long run, more effective than any physical restraint.
      In Mexico' the preferred are those that could trace their lineage back to Spain, and oddly enough they would have the most 'White' appearance. The ladder steps down from there

      Living in Panama and Costa Rica for 5 months, it was evident that people of darker hue than me were calling me "Black" in derision. How does one make sense of it. What ever the potion was, it was powerful stuff. Whatever the standard, when you do not adjust for other factors, White was always on the top and Black on the bottom. I stumbled through some of the 'novellas' on TV as my Spanish was fledgling at best and these people were still using analog broadcasting techniques. What was clear was the preference for white or white looking characters in a world where brown and black was all around me. This was obvious. I saw it in the Caribbean at St. Martin.

      While spending a month in Europe during the 1970's as a young man,  it was remarkable that while racism  was there, I never really sensed it as the expectation of being treated in an adverse way never came. It was held never against you like it was in 'the States'. The French were more concerned  'with being French" regardless of your color. The Germans were after the Turks and I was not a target. The Europeans were generally nice people, but with the current demographic and political reality today, I would be naive to say that they have not changed.

      As a fellow trekkie, you can realize that with the endless squabbles over relatively insignificant things, humanity remains in its infancy with its future in doubt. The ideal world which, I think that Europeans were ahead on is the world Star Trek. A world that did not worship amalgamation, but celebrated the uniqueness and diversity of all the sentient beings inhabiting the galaxy. Humanity as a species had to grow up and embrace this new reality. In the face of the possibility of such a world, I was born 200 years too soon. Star Trek has got it right, as there need not be a conflict in how we should relate to one another.

      Speaking of Star Trek, there is a new offering, Star Trek, Renegades.

      Again, thanks for your thoughtful reply and I say to you that we must chat again, soon....

      1. Doug Cutler profile image67
        Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Neither Columbus nor the earlier Norseman were out to conquer and control as you suggest.
        You must be listening to Biscuits' drivel too much.

        http://www.heritage.nf.ca/articles/expl … lantic.php

        Columbus' "sole reason", as Biscuits would say. Was to find a trade route to India. Why do you think they called them Indians? Columbus made 4 tours. He thought India was just a little further beyond.  He worked for the Spanish royalty and the Spaniards came a little later with the conquistadors.

        1. Credence2 profile image82
          Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

          I am not talking about the initial reason for exploration and conquest, I am talking about the tools used to keep native people in subjection to the conqueror and colonizer.

          Is the concept getting a bit over your head, Doug?

          1. Doug Cutler profile image67
            Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            There was some that. You make it sound as if that was the primary reason, As one of Biscuits, favorites  "sole reason" for this and that. Ignoring the major reasons.
            It was the local Africans and Islam that supplied the slaves to the few that had slaves.
            I don't like you libs' group mentality. Most people came here as families to have a better life.
            Some where foisted upon us by the Brits. Like Castro did in the 80's to clear out his criminals and misfits. Others came as individuals to work, farm, hunt and trap etc.  Not to conquer!
            Most did not have slaves or go on the warpath to kill Indians contrary to what some on this hub say.  What do you think the underground railway was? Run by blacks.? No!
            What do you think most white people do? Sit around and see how and what to to do to blacks? So, come off your biased one reason only crap.

            1. Credence2 profile image82
              Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

              Ok, Doug

              Yes, you create a sense of inferiority among natives relative to the conquerors, you have a better chance of controlling people short of the lash or extinguishing entire populations. 

              I don't excuse African and Islam for being involved in the slave trade, but they were not the ones touting 'liberty and justice for all'. I expect more from a society that boasts of the rule of law over the rule of men. I have a right to, as well.
              As for people coming here for a better life, talk to the millions of slaves and native Americans for whom the settlers manage to overstay their welcome.

              You are talking about relatively contemporary times and I am going back much further. How do you get more land to farm, hunt and trap without displacing others? But the 'system' that you seem to want to defend needed to enslave, expropriate and annihilate so that all the 'peaceful' white farmers could have access to land, unfettered.

              The underground railroad was run by determined abolitionists in the North and most were white, I acknowledge. But these were different kinds of people than what you seem to be.

              The inequities and disparities between racial and ethnic groups just did not appear from thin air, many of you hide behind ' the machine', never acknowledging that there are individuals that run it giving you and people like you an advantage that you did not earn.

              1. Doug Cutler profile image67
                Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                You are so wrong. I am a product of karmic debt and what I earned in previous incarnations. As we all have. Even Biscuits knows this.
                So, if you are so abused it is what karma has dealt you. Do better this time and maybe you will have a better life next time around. Teach this to those that think I or others owe them!

                While you brought up inferiors. I have a little rude awakening of what Islam thinks of you.
                http://conservative-headlines.com/2015/ … ck-people/

                You have been scammed into thinking Islam is the religion of the blacks. They forced it upon you while selling you and using you as sex slaves. What is your peoples' original religion?
                When you find out maybe you can educate me some.

                1. Credence2 profile image82
                  Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Sorry, I don't go for all this Karma stuff. There is just cause and effect. The rest is just an convenient excuse or a high class level of BS.

                  I don't care what Islam thinks of me as I don't live with them. As long as they don't bother me, I don't care what their attitudes are. Our adversaries in the struggle for equal rights and such are much closer.

                  I never said that Islam is the religion of the Blacks, in America a large portion of us are Southern Baptists, clearly adhering to Christianity.

                  Who sold who, and what is this drivel about sex slaves?
                  You got it all ass backwards, Doug.

            2. peoplepower73 profile image85
              peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

              History has always been written by the victors and always will be.  When a culture or a group of people devalued another group of people, it was easy for them  to justify the killings and mistreatment of others. The American Indians, being put on reservations, as a result of Manifest Destiny. Slavery in the new world as means of cheap labor; Hitler establishing a new world order; Jews mistreatment of Palestinians; African Nations enslaving their own people, are all examples of groups devaluing the life of others for their own needs.  I'm sure you can come up with your own list.

              The Africans were literally ripped from their own culture and own lands and brought to the new world as slaves.  They lost everything that had belonged to them including the ties to their families.  After Lincoln freed the slaves, they were given some of the same rights and opportunities as the white man, but most were uneducated and did not know how to act in a free white man's world. In addition, prejudice and hatred ran rampant.  Today, we still have the effects of those years of slavery. Albeit, there are more interracial marriages and more acceptance of people's difference.  That is in large part due to the media and the entertainment world. But there is still racism and hatred that keeps bubbling to the surface.

              In today's world, if a black person does not comply with what a police officer wants, the police officer starts the use of force triangle.  Each time the person is asked to comply and does not, the use of force triangle is escalated to the next level, until there is compliance or there is death.

              What is missing in this world today, is empathy.  Empathy is the ability to place oneself in the shoes of the other person and feel what they are feeling.  That's what this forum is about, people trying to make their points as to why they feel the way they do about guns and the 2nd amendment. 

              Patriotism in WWII played a large part because people felt a direct threat to their existence,  but today, there is not that type of patriotism, the country is divided politically. If there was an attack from outer space that affected all of mankind we would all come together as one giant world force against that threat, but that isn't going to happen, so we have to live with our differences.

              1. Doug Cutler profile image67
                Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                Manifest Destiny was started against the Spanish involving Texas. It may have extended some to the Indians.
                The Jews have a right to protect themselves from the the hoards surrounding them.
                The Islamist even commented how the hand of God must be directing those thousands of
                missiles away from there targets.

                It was the Islamics and fellow countrymen from rival tribes that rounded up most of the people for slave trades or to abuse themselves.  Not just some of the whites.

                It is really stupid of him/her not to complying with the law. His mom should have taught him
                or her better. I didn't say dad because he's out getting nookie from same other mother.
                See how I can paint a picture using you group mentality.  Don't cherry pick a case here or there. I can do that to and may if you do.

                Patriotism may be coming back for the majority if things get much worse.

                1. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
                  wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12806620.jpg

                  Doug, whenever you have the time,  it would be a good idea to study a little American History. Here is a good place to start: Howard Zinn's "A People's History of the United States". The whole book can be accessed for free online: http://www.historyisaweapon.com/zinnape … story.html

                2. Credence2 profile image82
                  Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Please define "Patriotism may be coming back for the majority if things get worse" ? What does this mean?

                  1. Doug Cutler profile image67
                    Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    When the scourge is let loose and the duped useful idiots like BLM and the like join them. Oh! wait. CAIR has joined in. It will be up to the Patriots to clean up the mess. Like in the 1780's. The Patriots only comprised of about 20% of the population. So crank out those baby soldiers.  Of coarse if the libs control their love of aborting millions. Sounds contra productive to me. Maybe the gangs will increase to a point to compensate. The regime sure isn't doing anything about them. Perhaps Mr O's private army bigger than the present military that he proposed?

  35. colorfulone profile image80
    colorfuloneposted 9 years ago

    http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12806288.jpg

    I've never read this bottom portion before.  My question is, are these old court decisions that have been overturned? 

    It is definitely our right but the govt will foul that up and make it their business anytime they can.

    ADDED: question.  Is anyone here covered by LegalShield?

    1. Credence2 profile image82
      Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      No, I not am not familiar with LegalSheild, but I once was involved in a 'Prepaid Legal' program, maybe that is what they have changed to?

      None of the Bill of Rights are absolute, so do you want a 15 year old to go the market and purchase a handgun?

  36. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

    Political Correctness ,     The one absolute of Fascism !

    When a group of leaders can convince a people of the necessity of political correctness  so easily,  as has been done in America to those on the  left ,    a nation of people are ALL then in jeopardy  of  national demise .  Of course , that's exactly what the new world ordered -  left wants .    They have decided, collectively that , what was once the great nation of America  isn't good enough to preserve as is .    Lock stepping leftists would have all their own underlings believe that it's all for their own good .   Before you know it   that good old " Progressive Liberal " very quickly becomes the brown shirted Nazi's .   

    And all  of it for political correctness , so the next time you as a liberal  have a second thought along the lines of   "  Gee , Why does that sound  like it wouldn't work ?"...........Remember , it all began with innocent P.C.!

    1. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
      wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Could you please tell us exactly during what time period the United States was a great nation? No one has ever been able to explain exactly when that was.

      1. profile image0
        ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Wrenchbisket , sorry ,  but its too late to save you .

      2. Doug Cutler profile image67
        Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Tesla: One of the smartest and uncorrupted spiritual individuals in 1880's came to work for that A hole Edison. He loved his homeland and apparently loved the U.S. more. Became a citizen he did. Why do you think so many are coming across the boarder? Just to do us in?

    2. peoplepower73 profile image85
      peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      ahorseback:  You love to state your opinion as fact, when in fact, it is nothing more than your opinion.  You should look in your own backyard as far as PC goes.  You don't like the terms Assault Rifle, although that's what the AR stands for in AR15.  You don't like gun control.  To you that implies confiscating everybody's guns.  You and Wilderness don't even use the word gun.  You call it a tool,

      You and your kind also suffer from the what if syndrome and the slippery slope. 

      "It's just a matter of time if the left keeps using PC, this country will become fascist and they will take away all our guns.  That's what happened in Germany.  What if that happens here. 

      So the left are "lock stepping."  What do you call right wing propaganda?  How about the right changing their name from the Tea Party and now calling it The Freedom Caucus?  Isn't that PC?

      The more I hear from you, the more I believe you are an existentialist.

      Existentialism Definition:

      A movement in twentieth-century literature and philosophy, with some forerunners in earlier centuries. Existentialism stresses that people are entirely free and therefore responsible for what they make of themselves. With this responsibility comes a profound anguish or dread. Søren Kierkegaard and Feodor Dostoevsky in the nineteenth century, and Jean-Paul Sartre, Martin Heidegger, and Albert Camus in the twentieth century, were existentialist writers.

      1. colorfulone profile image80
        colorfuloneposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12808038.jpg

        ?

      2. profile image0
        ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        For one Peoplepower ,  the right  in America  is all about  . Leave well enough alone ! Nothing more .

        Throughout  our history in America  there are  those who believe that the constitution , the "peoples"  government and  the  unmitigated amount of moron-ity in  adding laws ,upon  laws , upon laws to a system that  already works well enough  ,one that  already  is enough ,  just plain enough !   

        For instance  ,  how many laws do we need  for  jay walking , for  parking fines , or for driving too fast . How about gun crime laws ?  A hundred  , two , three ?     

        But the left ,  the left is all about  adding  yet , another law to any  uncomfortable situation . Any situation !  Got a problem with  local leaders   , write a new law ,  a problem with a distant central government , write a new law .   Change something , anything .  just don't leave anything legislatively unturned .   Got a collective guilt problem  , write a new law .   And by the time you are done  , you have surrounded yourself with a  chokehold by our government , for everyone !

        As to stating my opinion ;    All I'm doing is stating a general common sense .   That is what most people are thinking , my friend !   Existentialist ?     Painting  me with a  pretty broad stroke aren't you  ?

        1. cathylynn99 profile image77
          cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

          what about all the new restrictions on abortion? you can't say the right is about liberty with that going on.

          1. profile image0
            ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            What exactly are the NEW restrictions on abortions ?

            1. cathylynn99 profile image77
              cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

              doctors must have admitting privileges at a local hospital and abortion clinics must be outfitted like surgical hospitals. both totally unnecessary (i have an MD) for patient safety but masquerading as such, really just attacks on reproductive rights. texas has so few abortion clinics left that women have to travel hundreds of miles to get an abortion. and now ohio is trying to pass a law that requires aborted fetuses to be buried or cremated, an unnecessary expense for patients. poor people already can't afford abortions.

              1. Credence2 profile image82
                Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                We all know that in all things that are progressive objectives, Texas sucks! I would find the moon less uninhabitable.

              2. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
                Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                Yay, Ohio!

                (<"Abortions claim 30 times the lives as the estimated total gun deaths.">DC 
                what ... are these not deaths?   NO?)

                1. cathylynn99 profile image77
                  cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  they are not deaths of legal persons, either according to USA or the bible. in the books of moses, if a man hit a pregnant woman and she lost her fetus, he was fined. if she died, he died. so god evidently sees a difference.

                  1. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
                    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    And the soul of the little person in the making does not suffer? Does not feel his limbs being torn off his body, his head severed from his neck? Until a pain-free demise of each and every pre-child, (who is violently prepped for being vacuumed out of his mother's womb,) can be guaranteed, I consider abortion to be a tragic event absolutely equivalent to DEATH on any level.

          2. My Esoteric profile image85
            My Esotericposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            If America had followed ahorsebacks advice that "the right  in America  is all about  . Leave well enough alone ! Nothing more .", blacks would still be enslaved, women couldn't vote (in fact only white property owners could vote) , child labor would be legal, presidents would still be appointed, senators would still be appointed, work weeks would still be 60-80 hours, and so on and so on. 

            That is ahorseback's worldview.

            I am glad I am a pragmatic moderate who believes the gov't has among others, the responsibility to help society 1) move from less liberty (black are slaves) to more liberty (blacks are not slaves and 2) removing barriers placed in front of people trying to reach the American Dream by people and organizations who want to stop them from reaching it.

            1. profile image0
              ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              And is it progressively pragmatic to add law on top of law on top of law to  restrict something that your system can't control or otherwise deal with in it's arrests , prosecution  or incarceration ,to begin with ?
              That's utter stupidity , it's redundancy ,  its a waste of  time money and manpower .. To say nothing about the costs of over -legislating redundancy !

              No ? , I will remain conservative then . That is what a conservative is about , the lack of waste and bigger ,  more intrusive ,   more expensive government . This is the part of liberal systems I will never understand ,   You want more , bigger , increased  government  and at the same time , less accountability in crime and punishment . ........Insanity ?

        2. peoplepower73 profile image85
          peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

          ahorseback:  I beg to differ  with you my friend.  The right at the lower level of the pecking order may be about leaving well enough alone.  But at the upper levels, it is about removing laws under the guise of too many laws and too much big government. 

          I especially hate the removal of the law that was in place since 1933,  The removal of that law caused the financial meltdown, that we as a nation and the rest of the world economies are still suffering and will for years to come.  That law was called the Glass Stegal Act.  It allowed commercial banks and investment companies to merge their assets. It opened the door for all kinds of exotic, toxic investments that the banks and big moneyed interest prospered while people had to leave their homes and caused business to go down the tubes.

          Another law that upper right had removed, as a supreme court ruling, was corporations were not people. It was replaced with the Citizens United ruling that gives person hood to corporations.  This ruling allows corporations to donate unlimited amounts of money to Super PACs which are used to fund election campaigns. This is done without any disclosure.  The money can come from any place in the world to fund our elections.

          Your writing is taking on a form of hyperbole.  You use exaggeration to make your points, but nothing of substance to back up your points...and I quote.

          "For instance  ,  how many laws do we need  for  jay walking , for  parking fines , or for driving too fast . How about gun crime laws ?  A hundred  , two , three ?"     

          "But the left ,  the left is all about  adding  yet , another law to any  uncomfortable situation . Any situation !  Got a problem with  local leaders   , write a new law ,  a problem with a distant central government , write a new law .   Change something , anything .  just don't leave anything legislatively unturned .   Got a collective guilt problem  , write a new law .   And by the time you are done  , you have surrounded yourself with a  chokehold by our government , for everyone !"

          Ronald Reagan influenced the right beyond his wildest dreams by making this  statement: "government is not the solution to our problem government is the problem." 

          The solution is a balance between government and free enterprise.  Too much government is bad and free enterprise with out laws to govern greed and corruption is also bad. Greed and corruption are all part of human nature and need to be controlled...uh oh, there is that bad word again!

          1. wilderness profile image75
            wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            And yet...that delicate balance is forever shifting towards the side of increasing government control.  Our rights and freedoms are continually being chipped away for no more reason than a sick desire for control of others.

            I saw a statement by a cop recently, to the effect that no one could possibly drive even a few blocks without committing some crime giving him a reason to stop and ticket them.  Forget a turn signal, cracked taillight, dirty license, cut a corner; there will always be a reason to be stopped.

            So it is with guns; the ever increasing load of laws prohibiting this, limiting that can only be designed to eventually remove guns for we already have all the laws we need (absent new technology such as "printed" guns or drones).  It is illegal to use a gun to shoot someone or in the commission of a crime.  It is even often illegal to even own a gun - there just isn't a need for any more laws on the matter.  Just enforce the ones we have.

      3. Superkev profile image59
        Superkevposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        There is never anyone more misinformed than a liberal when it comes to all things firearm.

        "AR" stands for Armalite Rifle.

        And you have the stones to claim someone else needs to check their facts???

        Assault Rifle is a term made up by anti-second amendment dweebs because it sounded scary to the masses.

        1. My Esoteric profile image85
          My Esotericposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          Superkev, you need to get your facts right as well; your hatred of anything liberal (and, by proxy, individual liberty by proxy) makes you say the craziest things.

          Assault Rifles ARE NOT a liberal coined term, see - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_rifle

          1. wilderness profile image75
            wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            From your link:
            "An assault rifle is a fully automatic selective-fire rifle..."

            Are you now trying to claim that this is what liberals mean when they use the term "assault rifle"?  While they didn't invent the term, they certainly invented the modern usage of anything black and scary looking!

            I do like the article, though - we finally get a real definition of what an "assault rifle" really is.  Now if we could only get the liberals seeking to ban guns to understand that definition and quit making it a siren call to get rid of guns in general...

            1. peoplepower73 profile image85
              peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

              Wilderness:  You are right, it is black and scary, just ask all the dead people that have been assaulted in all the mass killings by all those black and scary things.

              1. wilderness profile image75
                wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                Never seen or heard of a killing by a gun, or even an assault by one.  Have you?  Or just heard of them by people, bears, crocodiles or other animate things?

                But you didn't answer the question; with a firm definition from Wiki, why do liberals try to change it?  Just for debate points?  To increase the fear factor?  For another reason to take guns?  Why have they made up a new definition for an old word (coined a term, if you will)?

                Is it kind of like the claim that guns assault and kill people - just another scare tactic to get guns away from people?

                1. peoplepower73 profile image85
                  peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Wilderness:  You are throwing sand into the wind and insulting everybody's intelligence.  We all know guns don't kill people, but people with guns kill people, until we are blue in the face. And yes, you can use other means for killing people but not as  efficiently as that scary black thing. And yes, the total number of killings by guns is insignificant when compared to the total number of  homicides.

                  In San Bernardino, a group of people were having a Christmas party, when two terrorists came in with AR15s blazing and took out 14 people and injured 21 in the blink of an eye.  They then held off a swat team for more than an hour firing 75 rounds into the team...Yes just another scare tactic.

                  I don't care what you call it a tool, an inanimate object, or a scary looking black thing.  When it is used by humans for it's primary, intended purpose, it is an efficient and effective killing machine, end of story.

                  I am so tired of hearing how all citizens' guns are going to be confiscated and that our tyrannical government led by Obama is going to take away all of your freedoms and we are going to become like NAZI Germany with our socialist Communist leaders.

                  And that's why you need the scary black thing is to protect yourself from this imagined paranoia.  I don't see how you people sleep at night. Oh that's right, you have your inanimate objects beside you.

        2. Doug Cutler profile image67
          Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_rifle   early 1940's WWII
          The term assault rifle is generally attributed to Adolf Hitler, who for propaganda purposes used the German word "Sturmgewehr" (which translates to "assault rifle"), as the new name for the MP43, subsequently known as the Sturmgewehr 44 or StG 44.[8][12][13][14][15][16] Other sources dispute that Hitler had much to do with coining the new name besides signing the production order.[17] The StG 44 is generally considered the first selective fire military rifle to popularize the assault rifle concept. Today, the term assault rifle is used to define firearms sharing the same basic characteristics as the StG   (name used by normal people, but not the libs)

          The AR-15 is not an assault rifle! The libs are wrong. In more ways than one.
          Abortions claim 30 times the lives as the estimated total gun deaths.
          http://www.abort73.com/abortion_facts/u … tatistics/

          1. cathylynn99 profile image77
            cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

            except fetuses aren't legal persons, not even according to the bible. in the books of the law, the rule was that if you hit a pregnant woman and her fetus died, you'd get a fine. if the woman died, so would you. so woman = life. fetus = not so much.

            1. Doug Cutler profile image67
              Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              Times change. Slavery was not condemned either. Your were told to obey your master and do what they told you. The master was told to treat their slaves well. Many verses in the new testament. Using to your reasoning we should be able to own slaves and kill any child 5 and under and only be fined. Cherry pick! Cherry pick! Cherry pick!

              Every one is born as their karma dictates. Do better in this life and you may be blessed the next time around.

              So, abort away and only get fines if child is 5 and under. How many of your are atheist libs ?
              Bring up verses that suit your agenda and ignore the rest.

              So come off your rant about those evil founders that had slaves for a while. The topic should be how they treated them. The constitution had corrections in the works. Karma had to be paid first.

              1. cathylynn99 profile image77
                cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                i wish i could see a thread of logic anywhere in that post.

                1. Doug Cutler profile image67
                  Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  The logic is the illogical notion that our fonding fathers were so evil according to some here  and that we should not follow the constitution because some owned slaves and another had a fling with a 16 year old girl before there was even laws stating an age of consent..

                  How about  Kennedy planking a 16 year old himself in the White House when there was laws?
                  Let's rescind every thing he did too?

                  That comment about sister chichester makes no sense! Who ever she is! Obama says trash too. I don't believe in much of what he says either.

                  "restrictions just means more women die in illegal, unsafe abortions. what about their lives?"
                  Where is their F'n accountability? pun intended. There are exceptions in place. If the life of the women is in danger. Other reasons are unacceptable. Another big lib caused problem.

                  1. cathylynn99 profile image77
                    cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    sister chichester is a respected catholic nun.

                  2. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
                    wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    http://usercontent2.hubimg.com/12810483_f1024.jpg

                    Yes Doug, they were the true definition of evil. But you and some of the others here have the false notion that everybody wants to throw the baby out with the cat litter. A Scot, Alexander Fleming, discovered penicillin in 1928. I don't know much about his personal life, but if it were ever discovered that he had been a serial killer, I would still advocate the use of penicillin . However, the difference here is that I would not glorify the man. Nor would I build a statue in honor of a serial killer, regardless of his positive contributions to society. And if any statues had already been erected  prior to discovery, I would insist that they be torn down. Such a  heinous act would forfeit any honors that might otherwise be bestowed upon him.

                    It is the same with your so-called founding fathers. It is not necessary to glorify evil men in order to reap the benefits of their legacy. It's called separating the wheat from the chaff. Men like Columbus,Washington, Jefferson, and Andrew Jackson are deserving of no honor or fond  remembrance.  By honoring such men, we are in effect saying that the lives of all of those who suffered at their hands did not matter. But I am here to tell you that all of the the black lives mattered, and that all of the Indigenous lives mattered as well.  I am not only talking about the thousands of people these men personally  brutalized during their lifetimes, but I am also talking about the millions who have suffered over the last 200 years from the legacy of their crimes. The NRA has dishonored the Constitution more than I have in my  condemnation of  the corrupt hands that forged it. The NRA has exploited, and perverted the meaning of the Second Amendment simply for the sake of profit.

              2. cathylynn99 profile image77
                cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                how 'bout this. nowhere in the bible, not jesus, not paul, is abortion condemned. it's a totally made-up issue.

                1. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
                  Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Murder is murder.
                  It seems, If one believes in restricting/discouraging gun access one would also want to restrict/ discourage abortion access.

                  1. cathylynn99 profile image77
                    cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    fetuses are not people.

                  2. cathylynn99 profile image77
                    cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    i have friends who want to do both.

                  3. cathylynn99 profile image77
                    cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    just because you call it murder, doesn't make it murder. if you call me a chair, i'm still a person..

        3. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
          wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          http://usercontent2.hubimg.com/12809803.jpg

          Here I will reveal one of my famous techniques for revealing the fundamental of a particular explanation, or definition. In order to understand the deeper meaning we must often "drill down" to reach the motherlode. Look at the process as applied to the following explanation, or definition:

          "The AR (Ar-17) stands for ArmaLite, the company that in the 1950s developed this style of rifle, which eventually became both the military's M16 rifle and the civilian semi-automatic sporting rifle known as the AR-15, or modern sporting rifle."

          Layer 1. "...which eventually became both the military's M16 rifle and the civilian semi-automatic sporting rifle known as the AR-15..."

          Layer 2. "...the military's M16 rifle..."


          Here we see the fundamental of this explanation is "...the military's M16 rifle...". It is designated the fundamental simply because it is the most powerful phrase to be found in this explanation. Now that we have learned how to identify the fundamental, we need to create an appropriate acronym.

          When searching for an acronym, a creative marketer tries to find one that not only is associated with the name of a particular entity, or company, but whenever possible,  one that also lends itself to a wider interpretation, and related associations.

          For instance

          U.S.A. Patriot Act = "Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism"

          This is a brilliant acronym, as it uses two terms that are considered "positive" by a majority of Americans: "U.S.A" and "Patriot". The purpose of course is to sugarcoat an insidious, evil, and highly intrusive law with terms that appeal to patriotism and national pride. By doing so it makes the evil law more "bullet proof" and "water resistant", and forces opponents to indirectly denigrate revered terms; immediately placing them at a disadvantage.

          Although the "AR" in AR-17  may stand for Armalite, as we have seen, many people have mistakenly associated the acronym with "Assault Rifle". It should be no surprise that the company might have anticipated such a reaction. But even if they didn't, it would be foolish to think that company executives would not be thrilled with such a "happy accident". It is also very likely that such an association has helped to make the weapon more appealing, and has increased sales. That's what creative marketing is all about. And that's why the top marketers are worth their weight in gold.

          The term "Assault Rifle" is especially appealing to white males who are feeling threatened by the "browning" of America, and women who are increasingly challenging the dominance of white males in the workplace, business, politics, and at home. The assault rifle is a phallic representation of power and dominance. Even if the AR-17 itself is not truly an assault rifle, the association through the acronym  aligns it with such weapons in the mind of the consumer; especially the potential mass killer from Idaho, South Carolina, Australia, Arizona, or the killing state of Texas. The idea of an assault weapon helps to level the playing field for those of lesser endowments whose sex lives consist primarily of sexual fantasies; daily rituals that are  played out on the right hand, or on the left.

          Yes, the human being is most definitely a simian, and we can see that much of the controversy surrounding  gun violence is simply a matter of "Too Much Monkey Business".
          .

          1. Doug Cutler profile image67
            Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            You should be ashamed or yoself for that racist slur code word "monkey bizz." Inferring that is where 54% of all homicides is from. Yet you continue to rant on and show a small cherry picked portion of the homicide problem caused by you libs in the first place.

            You really don't know what you are talking about. Neither do the libs.
            The AR-15 is a whossed down version of the M-14 which itself was a less powerful select fire rifle patterned after one of the best rifles of all time, the M1 Garand. .The Germans in WWII developed the first assault weapons. It had smaller cartridges for close in combat. Was more controllable because of less power. The AR-15 isn't even an assault weapon. Peruse the posts and learn.The libs don't know their A from a H in the ground as the saying goes. You should distance yourself from them, then you may be taken more seriously. Then again??

            Now, if I wanted  to elate a weapon with a manhood part,  you seem to desire, I would go back to the Garand or perhaps one of the anti-tank rifles of the same period.
            I am all for Browning the field!  Also called a BAR. Look it up.

            I can't see for the life of me why the stupid libs would consider a heat shield on a rifle as something that makes it more dangerous? ("sole purpose" if you prefer) Yet, they insist the same thing be on lawn mowers and other small engines. Purpose: To protect your whossie hands, manly or other parts from being burned.

            1. peoplepower73 profile image85
              peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

              Doug:  Or use the AR15 as Ted Cruz did to cook bacon.

              http://freebeacon.com/politics/ted-cruz … -an-ar-15/

              1. Doug Cutler profile image67
                Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                Nice vid! See, there is other uses for guns! Was that a lib on that target? Multitasking.
                He called it "machine gun bacon. I think he's poking fun at the libs who don't know the diff between a flintlock and a fully auto.
                     Earlier post: multitasking again
                Well, wise one. I don't even own. And sleep very well, except when wife flounces about.
                If I decide to own I would even sleep better. Started sleeping better when I moved near a small town and out of a crime riddled lib city.

                The AR comes in p___y  pink too. Would that make it more appealing? If it had a big fat anti-burn shield, Biscuits would like it better too!

          2. wilderness profile image75
            wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Now this is absolutely brilliant - something only a massive intelligence could figure out! 

            And the next step - apparent even to my own feeble intellect after the primary discovery is unveiled - is to stamp KM on all the nerf guns at WalMart.  The idiots in inner city gangs, whether white, black, hispanic or Indian, will quickly determine that this stands for Killing Machine and promptly throw away their fake "assault rifles" in favor of the Killing Machine!  After all, they want to kill, not simply assault someone!  Besides, nerf guns have those nifty little phallic symbols that they shoot!  And some of them make a neat little "thonk!" sound when fired - sexually repressed musicians are bound to snap them up, even to the point they may quit wasting server space on HP with their ridiculous fantasies!

            1. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
              wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              http://usercontent2.hubimg.com/12809979.jpg
              It is not surprising that you would resort to your usual schoolyard vitriol when confronted with the superior intellect. Your mockery is completely unfounded, as your own words reveal. You, Archie, and Jughead have already admonished us on several occasions for the improper use of the term "Assault Weapon". Such improper usage, which is very common, only further verifies my assertion. I often feel guilty when I reflect upon how much I have been given, and how very little others have received. But it was never my desire to be a leader. It is simply a responsibility that has been thrust upon me.

              "From each according to his ability. To each according to his need." Rest assured, God has not forsaken you.

              1. Doug Cutler profile image67
                Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                Wilderness has a much "bigger" score than you. How can you say you are more intelligent?
                It is you that is constantly trying to make up for some "shortage".

                My score is smaller because I am more mechanically inclined. Don't you know it is more important in how you use your tools than the size? Surveys about women"s preferences bare this out. Don't cherry pick a few to say otherwise.

                What is that about the bigger you "think" you are the harder or faster you fall?

                1. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
                  wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  http://usercontent2.hubimg.com/12810043.jpg
                  Let's keep it real Doug! We all know that checkers sells more than chess. Is he not the Checker King? We also know that we can get to where we are going in an old VW Bug, but a Lincoln Continental is so much nicer, and much more comfortable. Size matters in almost every aspect of life. The big Johnson, the big bank account, the big car, the big IQ, and the big body that stands at least 5ft. 7 inches.

                  How many midgets have you seen on the cover of Cosmopolitan or Hustler? How many short female chorus girls have you seen? What about pole dancers and strippers? The tall babes with the long legs always get center stage. And you won't see Rush Limbaugh  getting invited to a Mandingo Party either. Not only is he the wrong color, just look at the guys hands. Tesla and Einstein; they had the big brains. They are the ones who mattered. FDR and Truman were simply functional lackeys for the ruling elite. Nothing big there. Not unless you want to count the big bombs that the war criminal Truman dropped on Nagasaki and Hiroshima.

                  Now, here is a good rule of thumb:  Anyone who has a high score and lots of followers is someone who is appealing to a majority. But I'm not going to just pick on the Americans here, as I am including the entire world: As a whole, the human race consists of a majority of stupid people; dumb brutes who are primarily concerned with carnal pleasure. If they aren't rutting like stags, they are filling their fat faces with food, watching TV, or spending their weekends at the shopping mall.  But just because they are stupid, it doesn't give greedy capitalists the right to sell them weapons of  mass destruction: guns, automobiles, tobacco, GMO's etc.. On Hubpages, I will never have a higher score than wilderness. If I did, I would be sorely disappointed. And  I will leave you with these words of wisdom: "A bigger ---  is always going to attract more flies".

                  1. Doug Cutler profile image67
                    Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                    I am for moderation, in most thongs. That girl is too big. Those will probably sag to her belly button if let loose. Look at those older African ladies in those tribe photos.

                    Had 4 VW',s in me younger years. All were basically junk and extremely over-hyped.

                    The last time I was at the polls was 1971 when my laid off brother allowed his 5'-2'" hot wife to get a job doing the polls to make ends meet. Didn't end well for him.

                    He was all wrapped up, literally, got called back to his high paying greedy lib union job and had to get the biggest fasted bike of the day. One bright sunny morning in 76 wrapped it up against a guard rail getting on the e-way from his newly built status symbol land home in the burbs. Night of the funeral hot wife got laid by one or the poll bearers.

                    GMO's, now there is a sad topic. You have to have large dumps to get enough nutrients.
                    I bet if someone ate good and had smaller, that would bring more flies.
                    Bottom line: Bigger is not always better.

              2. wilderness profile image75
                wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                Mockery.  You mean such silly, ridiculous lines as: "The term "Assault Rifle" is especially appealing to white males who are feeling threatened by the "browning" of America", or "and women who are increasingly challenging the dominance of white males in the workplace"?

                Such stupid and foolish remarks as "The assault rifle is a phallic representation of power and dominance" and "The idea of an assault weapon helps to level the playing field for those of lesser endowments whose sex lives consist primarily of sexual fantasies"?  You mean those kind of mocking statements? 

                If so, I agree with you.  I mocked your childish, ridiculous and offensive statements with more of the same.  You can dish it out, but can't take it, is that the problem?

  37. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    <"… in order to reconcile the future we must first reconcile the past.

    This _________ is the disconnect that is causing all of the confusion in the world today. The racial tension and the gun violence are all related to a past____________________________________ that must be reconciled and balanced before we can move forward. 

    Otherwise, things will only get worse, as with each generation the interest is compounded. By forgetting about the past we are abandoning the future_____________________________."> wB

    Perhaps, if you fill in the blanks you could prove what you have attempted to put forth.

    To date, I do not believe in the necessity of reconciling the past. Nor do I see how it could be done.

    What?
    You want ghosts appear in the sky to apologize for their unjust actions committed in history?
    Not happening.
    You want their descendants to apologize for the actions of the past?
    Not happening.



    Basically, you are asking for the impossible.

    Again, thanks for nothin ...

  38. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
    Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

    If Jesus could forgive us for putting such a light as His out, we can forgive those who unjustly tore down civilizations, empires, dynasties, towns, forts, nations, countries and peoples. Its the only way to move into the future.
    The past is the past.

    Let it go.

    1. Doug Cutler profile image67
      Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      The left likes to cherry pick and even fabricate. Biscuits is a pro at it.
      He likes to talk about the arrogance of the Americans while Holding himself
      above them. Time to bring out the H word. The high fall the hardest.
      Jefferson had sex with a 16 year old back when there probably was no law against it.
      Did she give consent? How old was he?
      Those with sin cast the first___________________________.(fill in the blank)
      I don't know what he has on Washington. Probably because he was the first president.
      Just like he blames everything on Columbus just because he is who he thinks was the first.

    2. profile image0
      ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

      Listening  especially ,to  these posts about the indigenous  peoples  , I am reminded of Ward Churchill  , the great spokesman for the native American tribes .  The all great 'phony feather wearer'  ,  someone who called  the victims of 9/ 11 ,"Little Eichmann's "  because they are somehow responsible for what  actually happened to them .    This man has  be-littled , insulted , and generally  vomited  defamatory remarks at the American public for decades ,.   

      Turns out though , that he is a phony , a  " fake Indian"  ,   claiming  Cherokee  or any native blood for the benefit of his own  good , all the while  enjoying the  aura of national  attention .    In truth ,most of us  people  are ' part  native '  like we are all "part" African  or" part"  European or "part "Celtic ,   Anyone ever heard of the melting pot ,   THAT IS WHAT AMERICA IS ,   a melting pot  and each of us is nothing more than a  hybrid  of race .   Until we chose to leave or die  ,we are all American  , nothing more , nothing less .

      Those of you who  elevate your own ego's  for the benefit of  the depreciation of  our nationality  ?  Are nothing more  and nothing less than attention seeking entertainers  for egocentric  self infatuation  ! Whether it's done for the identification to a group or a tribe , or simply to  degrade another forum member  for political purposes !

      God Bless  America !
      http://usercontent2.hubimg.com/12807523.jpg

      1. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
        wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12807844.jpg

        Your appeal to Political Correctness is quite predictable. How American of you! Free speech as long as it fits with your way of thinking: Right onhorseback? The issue of blood quantam is a desperate attempt to destroy the reputation of a great leader, and voice of the people; not unlike the attempts to denigrate Martin Luther King, Mandela, Malcolm X, and many others who have spoken out against evil. A man's racial identity doesn't really matter. It only matters whether he stands for the people and what is righteous, or for the Dogs of War and corporate greed. Supporters of the NRA and the gun lobby are as responsible for the deaths of the school children at Sandy Hook as the deranged shooter himself. I would not feel sympathy for any number of these who might realize a similar fate. But only a human being would understand such sentiment.

        From the book: "An Anarchist Pschotherapy: Ecopsychology and Pedagogy of Life"
        by Daniel Rhodes Ph.D.

        "...In is essay in response to the 9/11 attacks Churchill called some of the individuals killed in the World Trade Center "Little Eichmanns"; a cadre of faceless bureaucrats and technical experts who had willingly and profitably harnessed themselves to the task of making America's genocidal world order hum with maximal efficiency. ... the willingness by corporations to attempt to avoid or ignore the damage that their economic policies cause is not an excuse to say that 9/11 was an unprovoked terrorist attack either..."

        This assessment is accurate to a point, but does not go far enough. My research shows: the fact that technocrats operating on behalf of the Imperialst arm of the government were among those killed in 9/11 may add credence to the myth that the event was staged and executed by Muslim extremists. But the deeper meaning  is that 9/11 clearly illustrates how the U.S. government will stop at nothing to further its Imperialist ambitions in the Middle East, even at the expense of those functionaries directly involved in the genocidal policies of the government.

        1. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
          Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          Nothing wrong with, (most of,) what you have posted.
          HOWEVER, one should NOT blame a system for the evil of MEN/WOMEN who misuse it.

          < "Supporters of the NRA and the gun lobby are as responsible for the deaths of the school children at Sandy Hook
          as the deranged shooter himself."> yikes!

          This statement is quite debatable, however.

    3. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
      Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

      <"whatever causes humans to become deranged … ">

      This is where the focus should be.

      Is it?


      NOOoooOOO!!!!

      Why I wonder?
      Because it is easier to remove and restrict gun use than herd cats? 


      Both are pretty much impossible.

    4. Sgt Prepper profile image60
      Sgt Prepperposted 9 years ago

      To "Keep & Bear" plainly means own and CARRY.  Hello?  Civilians are and always will be able to lawfully maintain sidearms similar to those issued to Infantrymen and law enforcement as those are the ones we will defend ourselves from when martial-law is declared.

      1. Doug Cutler profile image67
        Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Some predict that will be just before the 2016 elections. Then the elections are called off and Mr. O goes from commander in chief to to dictator like Hitler did.  He is just a puppet for the New World Order anyway.

        1. Sgt Prepper profile image60
          Sgt Prepperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          I'm very happy to hear from another American patriot who can see how it is all falling in place just like the Bible predicts
          FYI Abortion is the taking of innocent human-life for selfish reasons.

          1. Doug Cutler profile image67
            Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Well, you may have read on this hub where they are using bible verses to cherry pick to their agenda and then say the bible is wrong when it condemns gayness, or some other thing they advocate.  Thanks for your support.

      2. cathylynn99 profile image77
        cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

        i bet you, no liberal will declare martial law in our lifetime. trump might.

      3. peoplepower73 profile image85
        peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

        sgt. pepper: "will be able to lawfully maintain sidearms similar to those issued to Infantrymen and law enforcement as those are the ones we will defend ourselves from when martial-law is declared."

        In other words, you are going to use assault weapons to defend yourself when martial law is declared to assault the enemy...give me a break!

    5. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
      Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

      Re: The Topic of Bigness:
      The photo of this girl shows there is such a thing as too big.
      How many flies does one really want to attract?
      And why did Credence call me a "Big Girl" a while back?
      5'7'' is way short.
      FDR had a big following and still influences the small.
      Long does not equate to big.
      Big capitalists can sell anything they want to small brutes.
      Why not?

      1. Credence2 profile image82
        Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

        The reference for "big girl" is positive translates as grown up/adult.

    6. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
      Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

      <" I cannot snap my fingers and make dreams come true.">

         Good to know! 

      lol

    7. profile image0
      ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

      Just plain dumb, is all we can use to describe the mentality that , Just because gun owners won't "Change our minds " , run to the local sheriff and turn in our guns and  that that somehow makes us  slave holders ,   racists ,  colonial primitives ,   Neanderthals all of us !      Oh my God , I'm so ashamed .   
      Right .

      I believe that liberals  should turn in their diploma's ,    there is one dangerous new weapon if you ask me .    All that education and still   pounding your heads against the wall ?  How insane is that .

      1. My Esoteric profile image85
        My Esotericposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        In that analogy, ahorseback, then the educated American revolutionaries should have stopped the insanity of "pounding their heads against the wall" and instead, submitted to the English Parliament.

        Do I have that right?

        If not, then how is educated moderates and liberals insanely "pounding their heads against the wall" in order to save lives from needless gun deaths by enacting sensible gun safety laws different?

        1. wrenchBiscuit profile image71
          wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          That's a fair question but a person would necessarily need to be educated in order to answer it.

        2. wilderness profile image75
          wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          Doesn't work that way.  PeoplePower, for instance, has made it clear that the goal is not to save lives through gun control; it is to prevent the dead from dying from gunshot wounds.  How many die is irrelevant as long as they aren't shot.

          And now that you've gotten pretty good at the consistent reference to "gun deaths", we can only assume that you've taken the same path.  Let them die, just not by gunshot, because we don't want to actually address the problem of American violence.  We just want guns gone and will continue to work towards that goal.

          1. peoplepower73 profile image85
            peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Wilderness:  If you want to go off topic, that's your prerogative. However this forum is about gun control and the 2nd amendment. What you are doing with total homicides is going off on a tangent. Everybody and his brother knows that gun deaths are a subset of total homicides. You are using the NRA ploy of Is it gang problem or a gun problem.

            Please read this; http://www.huffingtonpost.com/evan-defi … 71639.html

            1. profile image0
              ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              Huffington Post ?. There's your first problem Peoplepower , Wilderness is trying to show ALL fact not just your cherry picking  ones .

            2. wilderness profile image75
              wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              No, it's not a tangent, PP.  It is a major part (if not the ONLY part) of the "why" section of gun control.  Why have gun control at all if the goal and expectation is not to save lives? 

              I fully recognize that you don't want to answer that question, and I fully understand why.  Nevertheless, it IS a big, big part of gun control and until it is answered (along with the closely related question of reasonably expected results of gun control) you have accomplished almost nothing in any discussion of controlling guns.

              So climb off your high horse and let's talk about the most important part of gun control; what we expect to accomplish and why.  THEN we can begin looking into specific laws/actions to accomplish those goals.

      2. peoplepower73 profile image85
        peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

        ahorseback:  One of the definitions of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.  Your fellow right wing congressman, tried to repeal Obama Care over 50 times and failed and Hillary's Benghazi investigation was done seven times.  The last one was over 11 hours long and they found nothing incriminating...and even at that, they want more investigations.

        They did those things because it is good propaganda to let you people on the right to never forget these words:  "Obama Care is a train wreck and Hillary caused four Americans to die and she is a liar."   You have been brainwashed into thinking everything is the liberals fault, there are too many laws, and government in any way shape or form is bad, and tyranny is imminent.

        Maybe, you should get a diploma, if education is that much of a threat to you.  Whether you realize it or not education is the solution to most of the gun violence problems. One way to reduce inner city violence is by educating those that flocked to gangs, so they can move up the ladder, instead of resorting to a life of crime. 

        You don't like laws, but you want more laws to stop the violence in the inner cities.  On the one hand you blame the liberals for having too many laws, but on the other hand, you also blame the liberals for not having enough laws to prevent inner city crimes...You can't have it both ways my friend.  I guess you can, if you blame liberals for everything...very clever indeed!

        1. Credence2 profile image82
          Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

          uh, oh, yeah.............

        2. profile image0
          ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          Peoplepower ,Merry Christmas and happy new year ! 

          We have millions , ........okay thousands of laws  over a couple of hundred years to control  the outlaws , My question to you ............. How is that 'working" , how has it "worked "out   for these  couple of past decades    ?    There was actually more adherence to the laws of society  before the  sixties revolution ,  before  capital punishment became a shell game  ! Before the entire Justice dept . turn into a psych ward  for intellectual midgets .

          Talk about my insanity - A lot of people in your frame of mind have no business  in forums , Why , Not because  you don't deserve to have your "say " . But because  with all of the education you may have , all of these years you have lived , all of the  military experience that you claim to have , you cannot even grasp the  fact that you suffer from  the latest manifested  plague of political correctness !    Now , somewhere  in your many years of living experiences , you voluntarily gave up on being able to wade through the  sea of misinformation on the net , in the news media , and even from your elected leadership.

          But even worse than that  ,  you are unable to decipher truth from fiction .   The reality of even your own government FBI  statistics tell a story that liberals DON"T want to accept , it blows your touchy ,feely perception  of utopia out of the water , BUT the facts don't lie ,    Gun Violence LIVES in the inner cities of America's most violent cities .,  with organized  drug fed , infested and  economizing gangs ,     And yes , with minority men  killing other minority men .   Sad part is Peoplepower , together  and  with REAL solutions and not the mirage of  leftist  horseshit ,  we could solve these problems together .   Yet ,  you and your  Pseudo  leftist socialites    continue on this path of frivolous  , half baked  idea's .

          I want to do you a favor Peoplepower ,  look at FBI studies of the ten or fifteen  most violent  cities in America , look at  the racial make -up , Now don't be afraid  Peoplepower !  Other liberals aren't watching you !  While you're there ,  check out who's really killing who and how much  .    Again,   don't worry , no  other liberals  will be  watching  or judging you ! I know , that peer pressure's a real bi##ch .

          1. peoplepower73 profile image85
            peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this
            1. Credence2 profile image82
              Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

              Getting ahorseback to eat that crow might be a little tough without a little salt to help it go down easier.

          2. Credence2 profile image82
            Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Yes, I guess things were better before the sixties revolution, if you were Ozzie and Harriet...

            Yes, there is a lot of violent crime in innercities, what else is new? Whether we want to admit it or not, there is a correlation between poverty and tendency toward crime. So, what is your point?

            1. profile image0
              ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              Happy Holidays Credence ,  There may be a correlation between poverty crimes in the city and  poverty elsewhere , but  more a problem  between some poor and other poor , shame on you for dissing the poor though  , I grew up in the "poorhouse" , funny thing  though   .  Gun violence never crossed me or my poor friends and families minds !

              1. Credence2 profile image82
                Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

                Happy New Year to you as well. While poor were you raised in a environment of systemic poverty the structure of such is all around you?

                I can't explain why gang bangers do the things that they do, it comes from a sense of hopelessness and frustration associated with a system that is near to impossible to be successful in with the resources available to them.

          3. peoplepower73 profile image85
            peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

            ahorseback:  In your first paragraph, you make it sound like in the past decades liberal democrats are the only ones to hold office and the conservative republicans have never held office.  Therefore liberals get blamed for all you ills.  I'm telling you, you missed your calling.  You should have been a propaganda writer.

            In your second paragraph, you are the one who brought up the accusation of insanity.  I was just further defining it to show you that it applies to both sides.  Here is what you said: "I believe that liberals  should turn in their diploma's ,    there is one dangerous new weapon if you ask me .    All that education and still   pounding your heads against the wall ?  How insane is that."

            You insult people and don't expect a retort? As far as my education:  I have some college, but I consider myself more of a self-educated person.  I learned electronics and computers while in the Air Force.  It has served me well through my entire career.

            My military experience includes four years in the Air Force from 1956 to 1960 and two years in the reserves.  I was in the cold war and worked in radar maintenance  on remote radar sites to protect your butt from invasion by Soviet  bombers carrying A bombs...three years in the U.S. and one year in Japan.  What is your military experience?

            Your third paragraph:  More insults and what is your solution...more laws to curtail the inner city violence?  But you are waiting for the liberals to enact those laws...right?

            In your fourth paragraph, you are telling me you are a racists without saying it. Because there are more blacks that are involved in inner city gun violence than whites...right?

    8. Kathryn L Hill profile image84
      Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

      * Here is the bottom line, if you ask me:


        <… if you don't like guns, then don't carry one,

                           but don't hide behind me when someone starts shooting,

      asking me to protect you from them,


                                 after you asked to have my guns removed …>M65gt

      1. cathylynn99 profile image77
        cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

        actually, you are safer without a gun in your home.

        http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NE … 0073291506

        1. Credence2 profile image82
          Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

          Need to get a hand phaser, that I can set on 'stun'!

          1. cathylynn99 profile image77
            cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

            that would be way cool.

            1. Doug Cutler profile image67
              Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              Yes! you can use that to stun babies before they completely came out. Then use those scissors to finish the deed before the baby takes a breath. Because to a lib it is just a fetus before it breathes on its own. How many have you had the honor of doing in.?

              Should they breath first then put them in a room without care till they die. Obama signed this process when a senator. Why this isn't considered accomplice to murder or child endangerment??? A lib thing! Biscuits has the audacity to call the founders murders.

              Something a like a phaser or taser will be next on the libs forbidden fruity list.

    9. profile image0
      ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

      The gun violence that's been a plague in America  of late is  no longer even about guns !   Is the NRA responsible then for Michael  Brown ?     What about Dylan Roof ?     Does the NRA hand out handguns to city slicker gang members who then blow away six year old kids ? 

      What's happening in America  is the disconnect of morality  , in families , in communities , in cities .  In the leadership of  cities too.     The ten most violent cities in America , mostly liberal , entitling   democratic" leadership ".

      But the left will argue this !

    10. profile image0
      ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

      Even with all the hoopla about recent gun deaths ,  Most Americans oppose  more gun legislation now than ever .  Polls show about 52 % oppose more law ,  Six percent higher than  those wanting more legislation ,    Good luck pulling the wool over America's eyes !

      1. My Esoteric profile image85
        My Esotericposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        That 52% (supported by another poll I looked at) is the very broad view, just like 55% of people oppose "Obamacare" but not "ACA".  Further, there is great approval for each individual piece of Obamacare legislation (minus a tax or two); go figure.

        Same, same for your 52% result.  When you dig down you find that:

        1. 89% Favor expanded background checks for all on-line and gun shows (the survey didn't ask about universal background checks).
        2. 58% Favor a total ban on assault weapons
        3. 55% think it is TOO easy to buy a gun today (4% think it is too difficult)
        4. More/Less Safe with if more people carried guns:
        --- Overall: 44/47
        --- Rs: 75/15
        --- Ds: 12/83
        --- Is: 44/43
        5.  Does someone in household have a gun
        --- Overall: 50% have none
        --- Rs: 29% have none
        --- Ds: 74% have none
        --- Is: 46% have none
        6.  83% Favor banning people on terror watch lists from owning guns
        7.  51% Favor stricter gun laws and 10% Favor less strict gun laws

        So, how do you think Americans really feel?  My takeaway is that Americans want more reasonable gun laws

        1. profile image0
          ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          Problem is , "reasonable gun controls " to liberals means reasonably non-existent !     Get over yourself , actually , you should try target shooting ,the accuracy of anti-gun folks is  way off !

    11. profile image0
      ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

      http://usercontent1.hubimg.com/12811818.png

      1. Doug Cutler profile image67
        Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Yes! an assault weapon. Even an automatic! One pull of the trigger empties the weapon.
        Low enough in power as not to adversely affect accuracy. For close in combat.
        Even if it doesn't have one of the following: pistol grip, folding stock. barrel shield, screw thread at end of barrel etc.

        Watch the libs include this in the list of forbidden fruits!

    12. profile image0
      ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

      Suggesting that the NRA is responsible for murder is like saying that Bayer is responsible for drug abuse !

      Great try though .

      1. Doug Cutler profile image67
        Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Yes! Pure lib logic. Most are suicides and don't even know what the NRA is. Most gun owners I bet don't either. That same lib logic says our founders where murderers too!

        However, there is a direct link to lib cannabis use and many problems. Case in point: Whacked mom drives repeatably on and off sidewalk killing and maiming.

        1. cathylynn99 profile image77
          cathylynn99posted 9 years agoin reply to this

          how, exactly, are liberals responsible for drug abuse?

          1. Doug Cutler profile image67
            Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            54% of liberals are for legitimization of marijuana. 22% for conservatives.
            Marijuana leads to other drugs. Of course libs refute this.
            New studies have shown marijuana is more dangerous than thought before.

            1. Credence2 profile image82
              Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

              But alcohol is a drug, would you care to provide documentation as to who is abusing this? Alcohol abuse has the body count, I don't see that with MJ to anywhere near the same extent.

        2. Sgt Prepper profile image60
          Sgt Prepperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          Every year more people visit the Emergency Room from pillow-fights than gun-injuries.  I suggest registration of all pillows and then confiscation.  Even if only one life is saved it will be worth it.  However the pillow manufacturers will hire lobbyists to prevent this.  Those pillow-makers should be sued out of business.  BHO could quickly deem pillows lethal weapons and outlaw them period.  Of course then birther-Trump would be a shoe-in.

          1. peoplepower73 profile image85
            peoplepower73posted 9 years agoin reply to this

            This is the problem with forum posts, replies get buried.  Please read this.

            http://www.vox.com/2015/10/3/9444417/gu … es-america

    13. wesleycox profile image81
      wesleycoxposted 9 years ago

      It would seem the OP is a basic retard with retarded logic.  The 2nd amendment was written in a different time in order to transcend time and advances in weaponry.  The founding fathers were not so naive to believe guns would not advance past the technology of the 1790's hence the real purpose of the 2nd amendment was to keep the people of this country secure in their liberties from many things like an invading Army or a government promising security if you'd just give up your liberties.  In today's world it is needed most when every one crying for gun bans is so quick to blame an inanimate object for the crimes of people.  People are killing people not guns.  Guns are simply the tools people use and in no way does the 2nd amendment cause mentally ill people to commit mass killings, I would have to argue that their mental illness is what causes them to do crazy stuff like commit mass killings.  The only thing evil needs to succeed is for good people to do nothing.  More guns is the answer for good citizens that have been trained.  The thing about the O.K Corral is the Earp brothers were there to disarm the Clampetts and history tells us what happens in the end.  That is the only way I'll be disarmed.

      1. Doug Cutler profile image67
        Doug Cutlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        OP? Am I the only one that doesn't know what that means? Looked it up. Means Original Poster.

        Yes! he does spread some biased misinformation. Unless you consider the gang bangers,  those that argue and suicide cases as mental illness. There probably is some mentally ill  in these groups

        Those that are mentally ill along with mass murders are a very small part of the over all homicides.

        There are a couple nut jobs here that put way, way too much emphasis on their pet areas.
        Mass murderers, NRA, founding fathers and the right to keep and bear is just for those in militias.

        The top gun deaths is suicides 22,000, 11,000 homicides with 54% 0f those by gangs. the next area is arguments with about 48% of those linked to alcohol.

        The first few seconds of an attack are the most critical. So relying on law enforcement is a joke in most cases. The only reason they got to San B. so quick is because they where training near by.

        I feel the number one reason to keep and bear is equally shared between protecting oneself from other people and a rouge gov. or foreign force.

     
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