Insurrectionists
These are some of the faces of the insurrectionists that attacked the Capitol.
Ex-Chester Firefighter
A former Midland mayoral candidate and business owner
"Everybody in there is a treasonous traitor. Death is the only remedy for what’s in that building.”These authoritarian shitlibs doxxing their political opponents are no better than the neo-fascists they pretend to oppose
I think you confused the term political opponents for criminals.
School therapist
Rocky Mount, Virginia cops
Olympic Gold MedalistInsurrectionists? The left needs to get a grip.
It was a protest. The fact that it happened at the capitol, does not make it worse than the protests we have seen in America for months now.
It was no more violent than other protests we've seen. Was it an embarrassment? Of course. Was it ill conceived. You betcha. But an insurrection? The left needs to grow up. No one on the left condemned any protest up until this one.
Certainly post pictures to embarrass the participants in the tom foolery. But we've had enough words stretched beyond recognition for at least a decade. Let's not stretch another one.Insurrection
noun
- A violent uprising against an authority or government.
I think Congress on the day they are certifying the 2020 electoral votes would qualify as an authority or government. And first time I've heard the murder of a policeman called tom foolery.Murder. Another stretch. And aren't you left? Since when do you give a rat's behind for the safety and security of a police officer?
Selective and hypocritical outrage. It's a trademark of those supporting the agenda of the left.
I can guarantee you our lawmakers were in less danger and the capitol building sustained less damage than did average Americans and their businesses were during other protests we've witnessed.
Until you, and others, are reasonable and rational in your assessment of our current politically charged environment you are directly contributing to the unrest.
And, to be honest, for a political party that has supported and encourages demonstrations to defund the police it is fascinating, to me, that they now feel they need a police presence. The left cares for their politicians and leaves their neighbor to fend for themselves without protection. Talk about warped values.You are directly contributing to the unrest.
Yeh. Classifying all riots as wrong is terribly insane of me. And recognizing hypocrisy is so, so contributory.
Sue me.
So you support the neo-Nazis? That speaks volumes. So does supporting people who break out our Capitol's windows and steal furniture and government documents. How can you compare that with these street rioters who harm the private sector? That is bad enough, but these people actually tried to take over our government!
If Facebook hadn't taken down the video, I would post a person breaking into the building saying "it's a revolution!"You know, I've been thinking about those types of accusations. It's so weird. The left defends protesters, demanding we remember riots are 'mostly peaceful', had 'a few bad actors', aren't all anarchist, socialists or communists, etc. And I respect that, to an extent.
But why would a protest by the right get everyone involved labeled ' neo nazi's'? It, too, was mostly peaceful. I saw some pictures of bad actors but I didn't see a neo Nazi. Which doesn't mean there wasn't someone there who was one, I just couldn't readily identify one from the footage I saw.
Why the double standard?Hypocrisy is a huge part of those on the left. It always has been and always will be, it is who the left is.
The new left. The left that desires a one party State. The new oppressive, cultish left.
Someday, we'll realize independents, classic liberals and compassionate conservatives have more in common than not, we'll band together and change this toxic madness.
I'm still flabbergasted by people who still defend this coup. And call it a protest, and compare it with other protests. But this was not a save the blue whales protest. This was basically trying to overthrow the government. Threaten the politicians to stop the count of the Electoral College votes and certify Joe Biden's victory. That's not just an demonstration.
And so the demonstrators can be called terrorists. (terrorist - a person who uses unlawful violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims.).I still get a kick when I hear someone claiming it was an attempt to overthrow the government. Think about what weapons were confiscated. Think, honestly, (if possible) what the outcome would have been had they (and I don't concede this was their intent) occupied the capitol.
Do you envision something like Chaz? Think the mayor would have said 'oh, it's just a winter of love and let them set up an autonomous zone?
Sorry. The only logical reading of the event was it was a protest, people wanted their voices heard in the halls of congress and it got out of hand.
Calling it anything else, considering the information we have at hand, is disingenuous.Yeah, when law enforcement tells you that there was an intent to take members of Congress hostage as they were certifying an election and then to assassinate them, I guess you Trumpers can discount that as disingenuous.
Just because they didn't use guns does not excuse them beating a cop to death. And they did occupy the Capitol.Indeed, it appears the federal official walked back his statement.
And yet you chose to continue to peddle a lie.
About Chansley. Not this one. https://hubpages.com/politics/forum/350 … ost4170848
First you have an election. Biden won this Election. Trump is telling for months that the elections are a fraud. Without any evidence. He is telling by all means that he won the election. He hasn't won a single court case. His claims are simply wrong.
But his supporters believe him, although there is no evidence.
This spreading of false information is the start of a coup. He wants to overthrow the legally chosen government.
On the moment that Biden is voted officially as the next president. President Trump urges his supporters to go to the Capitol and to fight like hell.
He is asking his supporters to take the law in their own hand. To dismiss the elections and to go to the Capitol and set things right.
That is what I call, trying to overthrow a rightful chosen President. In other words a coup, or more correctly an autocoup.First, four years ago, we had an election. Hillary claimed it was stolen. We had 4 years of democrats lying, squealing, claiming foul and generally refusing to accept a duly elected president.
Did you expect the right to accept the results? Jeez. Even if there hadn't been so many questionable developments I think the right would have still acted like the left did 4 years ago.
Both sides need to stop calling names (the left started it), stop being sore losers (the left did that first), don't be sore winners (again, the left) and respect that people can have different opinions without demonizing those who do. (The left,)
All you have to do is be civil, respectful of opposing opinions and not cheer one riot and condemn another.The lying started with Trump on day one of his presidency. Many might have supported him had he not lied right to our faces about something so stupid as crowd sizes just to appease his fragile ego.
Hillary literally conceded the day after the election. The foul was Russia attacking our election - checking to see if Trump was complicit was a matter of national security. Debate me otherwise.
And this not accepting the duly elected President started with McConnell who declared he would do everything he could to obstruct Obama. Check your history book. Name calling - been going on long before Trump with people mocking Bush Jr. and calling Obama a Muslim. Sore winners - from the F**k Your Feelings crowd - sure.
Having a different opinion is fine - living in a completely different reality that leads to a violent coup attempt of Congress doesn't deserve civility or respect.Pointing fingers doesn't clear a crime. Pointing the finger is like a red herring. Trying to drift away from the real discussion topic.
That people voted for Trump 4 years ago, I can understand. It's not my choice but I can understand that people didn't like Hillary and wanted something else. An outsider. But after 4 years, I can not understand why people are still defending Trump. That's beyond me.
If you have a simple look at the way how he communicates through Twitter (so you can't blame the media.) Isn't it obvious that he is only doing things that suits him and his family. Like a mafia boss.
Can't you be party critical? You can still say, I'm a proud Republican and love my country, but what Trump has done is simply against what I feel is right. Inciting people to take the law in their own hands.
The besieging of the Capitol was just plain wrong. Can't you admit that?The left has pointed fingers and changed the subject repeatedly, for 4 years. Don't pretend it hasn't. What we are witnessing is a continuation of hostilities started by the left. There is no changing the subject. Only now, when there are bad actors on the right, is it willing to engage. But, you can't ignore factors that brought us here.
Maybe it's time for a four party system. The Trump Party, The Republicans, The Democrats and the AOC Party.
More choice, more democracy, less blaming the other side.70 million voted for Trump, it is not unrealistic to think he won't start a party that could certainly put a quick end to the Republican party. Many people here in America are very unhappy with our Government, proof --- in 2016 Trump won over a shoo-in, Hillary Clinton.
I would almost bet Trump will start a brand new party. He has the numbers, and the more left the Dems go, the more will drift over to something new.
Crazier things have happened. A man descended down a golden escalator, and a guy that did not campaign a whole lot and did not share his policies, and told us --- I will tell you after I win... What next? Should be interesting at best.That will hack up in two the GOP. We on the left have to see such an outcome as fortuitous as it will be divide and conquer.
History has shown that "Third Parties" in the American political experience have been a mere flash in the pan and unsuccessful.
The Trump 2016 victory was not exactly a "shoe in" as Trump did lose the popular vote.History has shown us the futility of 3rd, (or 4th), party efforts, but think about it for a minute. Wouldn't we citizens benefit by having more choices? I can't support all Republican or Democrat policies. I would love to have a middle-ground choice.
Is our history of 3rd party efforts telling us we are forever doomed to a 'least bad' choice?
What if we had a proportional voting system and candidates had to compete knowing their fate wasn't determined by an all-or-nothing vote? That, for me, is a pleasing thought.
GAI think there has never been a more opportune time for a brand new party. There is such discontent. And one can call Trump lots of names, but flash in the pan may not be one of them. Time will tell.
I think at this point Joe has a lot of weight on his shoulders. It will be interesting to see what occurs over the next four years.
I hope his term will be as smooth as silk.In an honest democracy Hillary Clinton should have been the president. Simply as she had won the popular vote.
Trump is right when he says that the system is rigged. But in a different way then he sees it I think...You are wrong. Our system is that of a Republic, it is not a system of pure democracy/ The system is not rigged.
GAWe do not have just a republic.
The classically educated Founding Fathers were very clear about using a combination of republic principles from Roman history and democracy principles from Greek and English history.
We do not have a pure republic or pure democracy. We have a hybrid of the two.
The fact that they used the word "Republic" in some of their writings only means they were trying to keep things simple.Hmm . . . We are a Republic nation of States. We have a Democratic Republic for of government. Or is that wrong? Is that different from what I said?
[EDIT] Oops, Got rid of the "Public" nation. (see Sharlee, I told you everybody does it. ;-)
GA
It may not be anymore, but in 2016 and some previous elections, some rogue electors voted their "conscience", not their state's popular vote. In 2020, in a 9-0 decision, the Supreme Court ruling bound the electors to support their state's popular vote in the electoral college.
Okay, but, I think I am missing your point. Doesn't that SCOTUS ruling just affirm a state's power of law? All states aren't winner-take-all, so the applicable "popular vote" in some states, (relative to EC electors), is district votes instead of state votes. I think.
GA
Rigged was maybe the wrong word. Just wondering if it is a good idea that you can have a president with a minority vote.
You have to adjust your perspective to consider what type of government structure we have. Truthfully speaking, it is our states that elect our nation's leader—not the citizens. The confusion that arises for folks in a different governmental system is that our system is not a pure democracy, it is a representative democracy.
We do use a system of pure democracy for everyone from local city councils to state leaders—the citizen vote is the final word, but in our national election the citizen vote is the final word only in telling the state how to vote, and it is the states that do the actual electing.
Personally, I think it is a good idea. Pure democracy is nothing more than mob rule. I bet you don't think "mob rule" is a good thing?
GAThanks for the explanation GA. I guess my frustration comes from the long line of the USA bringing democracy to other countries (Like Iraq, Vietnam etc.) without having a proper democratic system themselves.
By the way, I guess the best thing Trump did, was not starting a war.
I'm aware that I have only superficial knowledge of the American voting system. So yes, I'm open for adjusting my perspective on this point. But it's bloody complicated. it seems that almost every state has different rules regarding elections. History of the country I guess.
No I don't trust the opinion of the mob. And I'm not to fond of referendums either. The Brexit referendum is a classic example. Most people had no idea where they were voting for or against. And to decide on a 4% difference for such a huge political decision is madness.We think alike relative to referendums. They are a good example of pure democracy; aka the will of the people aka majority rule, aka mob rule . . . as in the majority wins. regardless of any consequences for the minority, or even any consideration of practicality.
Your Brexit example may be a good one, and I think California mighty have a couple of similar examples.
GA
A coalition government, now there is a thought. I should brush-up on Israel's political history to see if I want to hold on to that thought. What little I think I know of the British experience with coalition governments isn't enough for me to know what to think.
I will offer you another nugget to chew on; proportional voting. as in 1st choice, 2nd choice, etc. However, I must admit I strongly support the concept of our current system; a Senate, the 'Upper House of Wisdom', and the House of Representatives. the House of the people's voice.
GAAs you maybe know GA, I come from the Netherlands, and we have a coalition government for over a 100 years. If works perfectly well.
We also have a Senate and a House of Representatives.
Spain, where I live, recently has 5 parties of influence. And so they have to make coalitions too. It used to be more or less a two party system.
I think with a coalition, you always have to negotiate, and thus never go to extremes.
Politics is a riot, and too intoxicated.
Probably because I understand what a coup is. I don't use the word for political gain. I know the left thinks all words are available for redefinition as it suits their fancy. I just don't agree with that.
Coup
noun
A sudden, violent, and illegal seizure of power from a government.
Sudden - yup.
Violent - yup.
Illegally seized the Capitol - yup.
You sure you understand what a coup is?"...illegal seizure of power from a government."
They seized a lot of power, all right, as the nationwide manhunt continues for them. You would have thought they would have used that sudden power to give themselves awards rather than prison sentences.I don't get why Trump's group wants to hang Pence. They just want to raise hell for nonsense.
It was an attempt that failed. It is being reported that insurrectionists were less than 60 seconds and less than 100 feet from getting Vice President Pence. What if they had managed to capture him? They have stated they were ready to hang him. It was an attempted coup directly fueled by Trump.
Remember, Trump turned his followers on Pence in just a matter of days, when he realized Pence was going to follow the Constitution and certify the elecrion. In just a few days Pence went from loyal Trumper and potential savior of the election to traitor, in the minds of these Trumpers. It really is quite scary how easily they were led around by the nose by a lying demagogue. Very scary.
I cannot believe anyone would attempt to minimize what happened. Oh, wait, I can. It is simply a continuation of a sad pattern that has been followed since Trump came on the scene.You know, I can relate. I cannot believe anyone would attempt to minimize what happened in cities like Portland, Minneapolis, Seattle and others. It killed dozens of people and caused billions of dollars in damage. It ruined many people lives. Yet, the left always seems to play it off with a shrug of the shoulder.
I wonder why?
Seriously. But, the left is having so much fun imagining otherwise its hard to convince some.
“Patriots on the Capitol. Patriots storming. Men with guns need to shoot their way in.”
A retired Air Force officer who was part of the mob that stormed the U.S. Capitol last week carried plastic zip-tie handcuffs because he intended “to take hostages,” a prosecutor said in a Texas court on Thursday.
“He means to take hostages. He means to kidnap, restrain, perhaps try, perhaps execute members of the U.S. government,” Assistant U.S. Attorney Jay Weimer said.
So . . . without their involvement in the Capitol Hill assault most of those pictured would be viewed as 'Salt-of-the-earth Americans:' Combat veterans, law enforcement officers, nurses, etc. But because they don't believe what you believe they are insurrectionists.
Well, in many instances, such as the Confederate flag guy, et al. I agree, but in instances such as the nurse that I think participated because she was carried away by the moment, I disagree.
My perception is that a lot of those that invaded Capitol Hill do fit the description of insurrectionists, but a lot more, like the nurse, or the guy with Nancy's podium, fit the description of folks carried away by the moment. I would bet that many of that latter category regret their participation—after the fact.
When speaking of such mob incidents IslandMom, everything isn't always black and white. Can you say you have never been carried away by emotion and done something you later regret?
GAIt's not that they don't believe what we believe - they were convinced into thinking that Congress was their enemy on that day. And if those salt-of-the-earth people hadn't been part of the mob, perhaps the Capitol Hill Police force defenses might have held. Maybe one policeman wouldn't have been killed at all.
Maybe.
My intention wasn't to absolve them but to try to understand them. I am still struggling to accept their involvement. For the most blatant of the invaders, it is easy—they are idiots. But for folks like the nurse or the teacher . . . that's tougher to understand. The worst I can come up with is that they were carried away by the moment. That may be too charitable, but it is where I am.
GAQAnnon membership is full of those salt of the earth patriots.
I wouldn't know. I am topically aware of QAnon, but no more than that.
GAThought of you when I read this.
NY Times, QAnon's A Meme Queen
It was an informative read. Thanks.
I can see why I hadn't looked deeper into Qanon
GA
You're going to hate this, but "good" people followed Hitler, too. Lying demagogues have a way of convincing otherwise "good" people to abandon their values to follow them.
Some people never learn from history, or even from their own ideological missteps.
I bet every one of them still thinks the election was stolen. Imagine if Hitler had not been defeated. His followers would have stayed strong and "good" people would still believe his ideology.Surprise! I don't "hate" your comment. I can't argue with it. "Hitler" is just one of many historical examples you could have used for your point.
GA
The police officer died of a medical condition.
"According to sources familiar with the matter, authorities believe Sicknick's death was driven by a medical condition. They're also investigating reports that he was attacked with a fire extinguisher or another item at the Capitol, sources said. So far, reports of an attack haven't been confirmed and authorities are hoping to locate video or other imagery from the scene."
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/capitol … d=75124131According to your linked article, dozens of "authorities" appear to think the "medical condition" was a cracked skull.
Yes. It caused a blood cloth. He died of a stroke.
But because they don't believe what you believe they are insurrectionists.
I wont bother to answer that stupid conclusion.
Can you say you have never been carried away by emotion and done something you later regret?
Attack the Capitol? No, I haven't.
Btw, I know is hard for you, and you need an excuse for them (and for you).
The nurse: “This country was founded on revolution...I’d rather die as a 57-year-old woman than live under oppression. I’d rather die and would rather fight.”
Her son: “We wanted to show that we’re willing to rise up, band together and fight if necessary. Same as our forefathers, who established this country in 1776. It was a kind of flexing of muscles.”
They did what they did.It may have been a "stupid" conclusion, but it was the one I came to.
As for instances of "being carried away," invading the Capitol wasn't an example of what I meant. You have lived a more abiding life than I have if such a thing, (getting emotionally carried away), has never happened to you. Good for you.
But you are right on one point, I am looking for excuses for them. My disappointment is palatable. I don't want to be so wrong about so many people that I have previously defended.
Now, to the nurse . . . It appears I was wrong to attribute anything to her vocation. If that is her statement, then there is no "being carried away by the moment" in her motivations. My bad.
GA.Thank you, IslandBites. Your reasoning makes more sense. If they'd stayed at home and daydreamed the incident, like some may have, then we could still call them "salt of the earth Americans."
These people need to spend a couple of weeks as tourists in Russia. They would change their tune in a heartbeat after experiencing REAL oppression.
Woman, you take yourself too seriously. LOL
Btw, not a mistake, just laziness.
But Im sure there are many.I can't stand snarky. I always point it out, always will.
You may not be aware of the coined label "snowflakes" is as a rule directed at liberals by right-wingers? I would rather be called just about anything else you can come up with.
"But as 2016 dawned, snowflake made its way to the mainstream and, in the process, evolved into something more vicious. The insult expanded to encompass not just the young but liberals of all ages; it became the epithet of choice for right-wingers to fling at anyone who could be accused of being too easily offended, too in need of “safe spaces,” too fragile overly sensitive, incapable of dealing with any opinions that differ from their own.
https://archive.thinkprogress.org/all-t … 1a922f37b/
Just curious, but how many decades ago was it that you visited Russia?
From my experiences, I have learned that things can change extremely quickly in a nation. Amazingly quickly.
They can go from backwater nation to leading industrial nation in a few short years (South Korea - mid 1990s to early 2000s did this).
And you can also see well functioning nations implode in a few short years (Venezuela did this in spades).
The fate of nations can change in a hurry, America is not infallible, it too can change quickly with the right set of circumstances.
The pandemic and more importantly how many State governments and Federal Reserve have handled it, may well be the precursor to such change.America already has the “right set of circumstances”, I am sad and sorry to say.
Teachers, Firefighters, Police, Nurses, Military...
Some would call those the pillars that keep our society/civilization functioning. Without which, cities would burn, lawlessness would become normalized and safety would be dependent on one's ability to protect oneself.
When those are the people rioting against their government... one has to wonder how much longer said government is going to remain functional and supported by the pillars which hold it up.Yeah, when they can be convinced that the decisions made by the courts, elections officials, FBI, and DOJ do not matter - but the claims of a man found guilty of fraud should take precedence - one has to wonder how much they belong as part of the pillars of a functional society.
I think what you maybe missing is the why. That why is incredibly important. Why was the political climate such that Trump could have gotten elected? My vote for Trump was a vote of disgust at what politicians wanted us to vote for. A vote of disgust at a political climate so partisan, the business of the American people had to take a back seat.
What was the outcome? The democrats doubling down. Denying a duly elected president was legitimate. Twisting words to attempt to lay crimes at his feet he had not committed. Playing political games during the pandemic. Games which hurt every day Americans.
Games which forced businesses into bankruptcy. Games that caused businesses to burn. Games that encouraged cancel culture. Games designed to divide is.
The left embarked on a 4 year long effort to insult and marginalize any who didn't fall in line.
The left has divided this nation. They have done everything possible to ensure intelligent and reasonable people are leery of their lies.
Who is responsible for the current climate? Who drove these,otherwise, backbones of our society to question? Look to the left.Who was found guilty of fraud? If you are referring to the bogus impeachment, the trial takes place in the Senate. No trial has taken place. President Donald Trump was not been charged with fraud.
Actually, I was referring to the Trump University settlement and the Trump Foundation payment he had to pay for illegally using those funds for personal business.
And there will be the Mary Trump case and the Trump Organization case where he reimbursed Michael Cohen for paying off Stormy Daniels and claiming those expenses as business expenses.
Yes, it should get some thinking. When citizens travel to Washington to be heard and are actually not heard. But, the spin points all to have a look only at protecting those the people the citizens are so pissed at. And call them a terrorist without any cause. These citizens are mad, they have never taken it upon themselves to protest in this manner. I guess it is expected these citizens will just throw in the towel, without being heard. I don't think so. Is our Government really for the people, all the people anymore?
This entire thing is so dumb. The rightwing mind must be fundamentally different from my own. The very thought of doing what those insurrectionists did and to excuse their behavior is beyond me. I want "the book" thrown at them all and that includes "Ma Barker" and her felonious son.
Leave it to conservatives and Rightwingers to go effusive with excuses for criminal behavior. Trump was right about one thing, his mob supporters are low class
Did you the hear about how Trump decided to "stiff" Rudy, not pay the money he agreed to?"The very thought of doing what those insurrectionists did and to excuse their behavior is beyond me."
Are you okay with the cities like Portland, Minneapolis, Seattle that were burned and looted causing billions of dollars in damage? Are you upset by the over 50 federal building that were set on fire? Does it bother you those protester tried to set fire to a federal building with people in it?
Just asking.This is so tiresome. I have stated this many times. I do not approve of or support violence or looting, but I do support anyone's right to protest.
Now, do you comprehend this?I did not support violent protest, I am against the Right's tendency to consider any kind of protest a riot. There can be no question as to what occurred last January 6th.
These faces, the videos, the images captured don't lie right? We know the whole story from these few pictures shared...or do we?
Where are the pictures and video of John Sullivan and his colleagues, BLM activists?
He was an instigator, there from the get-go, there later on, when the veteran was shot (in fact, he was right next to her) seen breaking glass, egging it on (He is too potty-mouthed, otherwise I would have shared the video)
Agreed, some took things way too far, I understand frustration, but they needed to check that frustration at the steps of the Capitol Building. They will be dealt with case by case.
BUT... BLM doesn't get a pass, Antifa doesn't get a pass.
They were there, not because they love this Country or because they feel disenfranchised and beyond frustrated.
They were there for one reason and one reason only...to create this chaos and to document it for nefarious reasons.
They were there in their Marxist capacity to wreak havoc.
While pointing out the faces of police officers and teachers, don't forget to point out the antagonists that live for this type of day!
God Bless and Keep the United States of America!
Federal prosecutors in a document filed Thursday said that they believe the pro-Trump mob that stormed the U.S. Capitol aimed to "capture and assassinate" elected officials and argued that the man who was seen wearing a horned headdress and face paint should be denied bail.
The man, a believer in the QAnon conspiracy theory and a Trump supporter, was charged with knowingly breaking into the Capitol building and its grounds, along with violent entry and disorderly conduct.
"The crimes charged in the indictment involve active participation in an INSURRECTION attempting to violently overthrow the United States Government. By the man's own admissions to the FBI and news media, the insurrection is still in progress and he intends to continue participating," the filing reads.
The man stated that he drove to Washington, D.C. as a part of a group effort, with other 'patriots' from Arizona, at the request of the President that all 'patriots' come to D.C. on January 6, 2021."
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/prosec … -officialsWhomever saw it fit to pick up a fire extinguisher and hit another living, breathing, human being in the head with it, should be in jail, waiting for their day in court.
"Can you say you have never been carried away by emotion and done something you later regret?" It never involved breaking the law, destruction of property, making people fear for their lives, or actually costing 5 (possibly 6 if you count suicide) their lives. Can you comprehend the difference?
Do you think I can comprehend the difference? Do you think my question was making such a comparison?
GA
Gawd, they look so pleased with their stupid selves.
Damn, I just can't stop digging this hole I am in. I should be nearing China soon.
Everything I am thinking, prompted by this image, is screaming at me to remember that you can't judge a book by its cover. But still, it is appearances that are driving my thoughts.
My first assumption is that this was posted because there is information that they are Trump supporters heading for the Jan. 6 rally.
My next assumption is that they appear to be in a private plane and that and their clothing, (not sure what to think of the window image, could it be a home?), mean they don't appear to have money worries or be obvious idiots like the Confederate flag guy. So my last assumption is that they are the other end of the Trump supporter spectrum: no worries about money or jobs, no reason to be angry at their life circumstances caused by the elitist liberals, and they don't look like the type that would be easily mesmerized by a demagogue.
Yes, I know, that is all based on my perception of appearance with no other support at all. But at this point, what else is there to know? Maybe IslandMom posted this because she has more information?
So, if they are intelligent enough to be apparently successful in life, and, they support Trump, then why? Could it be because they think he believes what they believe, rather than because they believe what Trump has told them? Take a minute with that, I don't mean it to be a mishmash of who believes what, but that there is a possible scenario where they may not be Koolaid drinkers, but just believers in what they see in Trump.
It is obvious that if all Trump supporters are lumped into one basket of deplorables it is easy to think of all of them as stupid people.
But what if all 75 million aren't deplorables, or horned-hat wearers, or confederate flag-wavers, or zip-tie guys . . I don't think all 75 million are, but apparently, every anti-Trumper does.
I feel like a damned ping-pong ball trying to get a grip on this one; back and forth, yes they are, no they aren't. At this point, I am sticking to where I was in the first foot or two of this hole—the folks that assaulted Capitol Hill don't represent all Trump supporters. They may not even represent all of the hardcore Trump supporter base that we have all differentiated from the beginning. *shrug*
GAShe was arrested. She is a realtor and yes, she arrived by private plane from to Washington D.C.
"We're gonna go down and storm the Capitol. They’re down there right now and that's why we came and so that's what we are going to do. So wish me luck."
She subsequently tweeted a photo of herself in front of a broken window at the Capitol building, writing "Window at The capital [sic]. And if the news doesn’t stop lying about us we’re going to come after their studios next…"
“We are going to f---ing go in here. Life or death, it doesn’t matter. Here we go,” she said in it, turning the camera toward her face, the feds said.
She then took a moment to tout her own work as a real estate agent.
“Y’all know who to hire for your realtor. The woman for your realtor,” she said.
"I do not feel that I did anything wrong, in fact, I felt that I did something noble and I’m proud of being there," she said in a Wednesday interview.Oh Buggers IslandMom. You are not helping. I am trying to find non-idiots amongst the invaders.
GA
But what if all 75 million aren't deplorables, or horned-hat wearers, or confederate flag-wavers, or zip-tie guys . . I don't think all 75 million are, but apparently, every anti-Trumper does.
And you're wrong about that too.Yes, I know. I was carried away by the moment. My bad.
GA
Your first mistake is thinking it through GA, correction: skip the, "it through" part.
Don't think, just look at the images, create the worst possible scenario in your mind; stew in it for awhile, get mad, get angry, explode....there may be time/room for the truth to enter in at some later point.Speaking of truth...
https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/20 … daTCsFteBg
American Thinker and contributors Andrea Widburg, R.D. Wedge, Brian Tomlinson, and Peggy Ryan have published pieces on www.AmericanThinker.com that falsely accuse US Dominion Inc., Dominion Voting Systems, Inc., and Dominion Voting Systems Corporation (collectively “Dominion”) of conspiring to steal the November 2020 election from Donald Trump. These pieces rely on discredited sources who have peddled debunked theories about Dominion’s supposed ties to Venezuela, fraud on Dominion’s machines that resulted in massive vote switching or weighted votes, and other claims falsely stating that there is credible evidence that Dominion acted fraudulently.
These statements are completely false and have no basis in fact. Industry experts and public officials alike have confirmed that Dominion conducted itself appropriately and that there is simply no evidence to support these claims.Oh we are changing the subject now. Alrighty then.
I agree, Dominion didn't steal it all on their own, it took a whole lot more than Dominion Voting to steal the election from a man with all the momentum.
I really don't know how some people sleep at night. It will catch up with them.....eventually.
Who's truth? Stewing on images of citizens I defended, doing what they did in the Capitol building, isn't going to offer an epiphany that what I assume to be your truth is the truth.
Stewing on the images of the idiots with the Confederate flag, zip-tie handcuffs, breaking down doors isn't going to help either.
But, putting those idiot examples out of my mind and stewing on the why of the non-idiot participants might help. As of now, it is a work in progress. I think the "why" matters.
GASome misconceptions I see here...
First is considering your perception of those who participated "idiots".
Again, as I mentioned in my previous comment to you in this thread... they make up the pillars of our society,
Nurses, Firefighters, Teachers, Military... even those who can charter their own flights to get there.
Not saying amongst them weren't some idiots... but the bulk of those hundred thousand or so people who went there are anything but what you are referring to.
I have the advantage of course of not watching ANY MSM coverage of this, so my perceptions are not skewed by the biased reporting.
What I see (in addition to average Americans showing up for that "insurrection") is that the MSM has tried to create the narrative that Trump turned these Americans against Congress and the Constitution, etc. etc.
Funny, Congress has had single digit approval ratings for well over a decade now... America is fed up with their corrupt government and that is how we got Trump in the first place.
But that is not the narrative the MSM is pushing, that is certainly not the "facts" being espoused by our DC politicians who are blaming it all on Trump.
Which is fine, the MSM and the politicians can continue to live in their version of reality, it won't divert what is to come...
History repeats, Empires rise and fall, governments collapse and are remade, it happens to every nation eventually, usually due to economic factors forcing the masses into action.
For those paying attention, we are at that precipice in America's history, homeless are overrunning states like California, millions more are surviving on government unemployment and stimulus alone, delaying the inevitable bankrupt economic reality, and the "pillars" of our society are in revolt (insurrection) against their government.
The debate going on in this thread, of rightness or wrongness of their actions, or who stirred them into action, misses the bigger picture entirely.
Which is... the S__T has begun to hit the fan.
It would take a complete reversal of all lock downs and an economic explosion that the country hasn't seen since right after WWII to negate this downward spiral the country is now in. In other words, it would take an economic miracle which is impossible to achieve under our current circumstances.
They can't "print" their way out of this dire situation, we have yet to face the worst economic turmoil from this pandemic, we haven't even begun to feel the economic pain, it was deferred, covered up by pushing trillions of dollars into the system and giving everyone who lost a job unemployment and stimulus money.
And now, the Pied Piper is coming round the corner expecting to get paid.The first point to clear up is that in all of my comments my intention, (and I thought it was clearly stated), was to address the Capitol Hill invaders, not all Rally goers. Just a guess, (and previously stated) is the invaders were less than 10% of Rally goers, and I have heard descriptions that the Rally population was tens of thousands. So my "idiot" comments are to those 1000 or less that actually entered the Capitol Hill grounds and buildings.
Then there is this:
"Again, as I mentioned in my previous comment to you in this thread... they make up the pillars of our society,
Nurses, Firefighters, Teachers, Military... even those who can charter their own flights to get there."
I agree, I used the term salt-of-the-earth; same-same.
It was those folks that I have been trying to find excuses for their actions in the Capital building, not the ones in the Rally that didn't invade the capital. And yes, you appear to be right, there are some idiots among the pillars too.
As for being influenced by biased MSM presentations, I haven't relied on them. I am forming my opinion based on what my lying eyes saw live, and the videos provided by both Left and Right sources. I don't need their explanation, (or spin), of and on what I am seeing. I can still see for myself.
I think from that point in your comment we are in agreement. You speak of the "big picture" being the most important thing to understand, and I noted I think it is the "why" that is most important to understand. I think both are saying the same thing. If a "pillar" of our society suddenly becomes an idiot, by actions, I think it is more important to search for the why than to just dismiss them as Trump idiots.
GAI agree that the "why" is the much bigger topic of concern here.
So long as they can keep those who would act fighting amongst themselves and blaming one another, DC/Congress may be safe.
If however, these various factions stop fighting one another (Proud Boys, Antifa, BLM, etc.) and determine the enemy is their own government, then what occurred in this instance will seem trivial in comparison.
As the Lock Downs continue, as millions run out of options (and unemployment and stimulus) and the ability to house and feed oneself becomes beyond their ability, it is possible this triggers such things to occur, and the various "protesting" groups out there focus their attention not on one another... but DC.
I realize that the conservative voice is being silenced from sea to shining sea, but I don’t go quietly, I don’t get canceled so easily.
The left doesn’t think it through or wait for the rest of the story, they react, it’s what they do!
I stand by my previous comment:
“Your first mistake is thinking it through GA, correction: skip the, "it through" part.
Don't think, just look at the images, create the worst possible scenario in your mind; stew in it for awhile, get mad, get angry, explode....there may be time/room for the truth to enter in at some later point.”
Speaking of the left, Valeant and Scott B. led me to believe that within 5 days, Antifa was ruled out as to having any part in the Capitol building intrusion, but they were obviously jumping to conclusions.
Also, I think an earlier comment of mine was overlooked, so I’ll repeat:
“These faces, the videos, the images captured don't lie right?
We know the whole story from these few pictures shared...or do we?
Where are the pictures and video of John Sullivan and his colleagues, BLM/ANTIFA activists?
He was an instigator, there from the get-go, there later on, when the veteran was shot (in fact, he was right next to her) seen breaking glass, egging it on (He is too potty-mouthed, otherwise I would have shared the video)
Agreed, some took things way too far, I understand frustration, but they needed to check that frustration at the steps of the Capitol Building. They will be dealt with case by case.
BUT... BLM doesn't get a pass, Antifa doesn't get a pass.
They were there, not because they love this Country or because they feel disenfranchised and beyond frustrated.
They were there for one reason and one reason only...to create this chaos and to document it for nefarious reasons.
They were there in their Marxist capacity to wreak havoc.
While pointing out the faces of police officers and teachers, don't forget to point out the antagonists that live for this type of day!
God Bless and Keep the United States of America!”
I’m wondering....I probably just missed the volumes of pictures from throughout the summer, when I B shared them here.
We certainly didn’t have to jump to any conclusions with those; the flames and broken glass and stolen merchandise being stuffed into trunks of cars, was right there, being documented.
I made several attempts in several articles to share some of the images, but they were considered “spammy element”.
I am sure someone was able to share them though. I will go back and look.
"The man was inside the Capitol, he was one of the first… my husband is a Patriot soldier.”If by all the momentum, she meant the rising death toll from failing to take even the most basic precautions to stop Covid-19, then yeah, there was momentum.
Or that momentum in Georgia, where Trump only won by 200,000 votes in 2016, and then Stacey Abrams registered over 1 million new voters in the past four years. Now that's some momentum that should help easily explain why Trump lost Georgia.
Perhaps it was the momentum where Trump asks people to 'Liberate Michigan' and then those that vote for him plot to kidnap the Governor of that state. Is that the kind of dangerous momentum we're talking about?I grow weary of reading these statements that are so out of touch with reality.
Agreed. There are three new threads each day aiming to display how victimized the poor GOP is in this country.
And don't even get me started about the hubs that that dude Jason B. Truth keeps publishing. His theory today is that when Marjorie Taylor Greene files her articles of impeachment for Biden on January 21st, the Democrats in the House will rally behind Senator Harris and push them through.
I may just bet him that Greene gets expelled by a 2/3rds vote before Biden gets impeached.
I have not been able to locate the Trump liberate tweet in full. As a rule, his tweets are online. I would like to see the full tweet, not just two words. How can I add context to his words with only two words? It appears this particular tweet has been canned.
I am not arguing the fact that a group planned to attack My Capitol. or that they were after Whitmer. Just would like to look at the tweet.
Many groups here in Michigan dislike Whitmer, one such group fought in court and had her powers to dictate mitigation in regard to COVID removed. And she has several pending lawsuits and petitions to remove her from office. And yes, it was clear the bunch that hatched that plan is very dangerous.
Thought of the Day:
Kind of interesting when you realize that the people who stormed the Capitol will now likely have felony records and lose their gun rights.Ted Bundy - Assistant Director of the Seattle Crime Prevention Advisory Commission
Ted Kaczynski - Math Professor
John Wayne Gacy - Vice President of Jaycees, then Manager of three KFC restaurants
Timothy McVeigh - Iraq war veteran, honorably discharged
Joseph Dewey Akin - Nurse
Steven Pennell - Electrician
Dennis Rader - Worked for ADT installing security systems for 14 years
Not sure pillar of the community can exclude someone from being an evil SOB.
But from what I've been hearing, I concur that the economy is in for a regression. The Fed has pumped over 7 trillion in free money into the economy. Ken is right, get ready for a market adjustment. Some calling for a 40% stock market correction.Well, it is substantially and systemically more problematic than that.
Of those 7 trillion created, lets say 5 trillion went to the "banks"... they in turn invested it into assets, which drove up the price of the stock shares you have mentioned.
But what has really occurred is the dollar has been devalued, by some 33% in 2020. Of all the "dollars" created/put into existence, 33% were created just last year.
When the system "corrects" itself, your Milk, your Bread, your Cars, your Houses will cost 33% more.
The buying power of the dollar will be significantly decreased in 2021.
Republican lawmaker has some questions about the National Guard:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/republican-l … 31089.htmlDearest GA, Live to learn, Ken Burgess and Readmike.......oh whatever.
The laundry list of defenders of the indefensible is just to long to deal with with so let's get down to it and let me get this straight!
Are you kidding me or just pulling my lariat?
A rampaging crowd, at the behest of a carnival barker is instructed quote " we’re going to walk down, and I’ll be there with you, we’re going to walk down, we’re going to walk down." I don't need to go on with this complete and utter travesty of a so called speech that was nothing more than marching orders for a bunch of low brow MagaMorons.
And of course, once his secret service praetorian guards informed him they couldn't guarantee his safety, the draft dodger in chief high-tailed it back to the chicken coop (otherwise known as the Trump Whitehouse) where he watched his favorite medium of television which is closely followed by his second favorite medium which is Playboy magazine because, you know, he looks at it for the articles and it comes in real handy for "executive time". But let's not stop the fantasyland story here.
Oh no!
Meanwhile, back at the ranch, the rabid crowd of rabble-rousers breaks through a line of Keystone Kops for some reason, so thin, that it folds like a bed sheet while a mere 340 National guardsmen were "watching traffic". Shortly thereafter the MagaManiacs violently overrun the overwhelmed Capitol Police and break into the halls of a building so sacred to Democracy that Real Great Men such as Abraham Lincoln, Franklin D. Roosevelt, Dwight Eisenhauer and John F. Kennedy once trod and proceed to terrorize government officials who are forced to barricade themselves in offices and safety bunkers.
But that's not all folks.
This ragtag bunch of domestic terrorists' proceeds to run amok around the capitol yelling like a bunch of MagaMethHeads, Bikers on Booze and Cocaine Cowboys while stealing and destroying government property and defacing artworks while dressed like a Halloween party that's a cross between Mardi Gras and Game of Thrones.
Are you still with me? Because here comes the best part.
During the one time in a deadly pandemic, in a Federal building where masks are legally required due to Covid 19, these numbskulls decided to go mask less while destroying Federal property? I mean, think about it. One year ago you couldn't wear a hoodie in a convenience store and now is about the best time to shoplift a 7/11 and these patriots chose to bring zip ties instead of a ladder and some spray paint so they could block the Capitol security cameras?
Oh no! Instead they chose to take selfies and videos of themselves committing a federal offense! And now the FBI is sweeping them up like a Hoover vacuum cleaner all across the country.
Bwahhhhahahah!
Is this the best you've got far right wingers? Are the democrat lib snowflakes supposed to cower in fear when faced by a paramilitary group that resembles a Monsters Inc cartoon? If so, please don't send them to my house. I'll be so doubled over with laughter that I wont be able to chase them off my lawn.
Sincerely,
The Maskless Marauder.Such an extraordinary creative effort deserves an equally creative reply; it's maskless, not "mask less."
"Bwahhhhahahah!" (I have never used that before, it felt good)
GAAs always, true to form. Good to see you again, Masked Man...
I don't know MM, now that Trump has brought in top military adviser, the My Pillow Guy, to talk about instituting martial law, you should be shaking in your furry slippers.
https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/tru … 57011.html
After entering the building, the man was allegedly captured on footage smoking a cigar inside, the release states, and “saying words to the effect of, ‘Victory smoke in the Capitol, boys. This is f---ing awesome. I knew we could take this mother----er over [if we] just tried hard enough."
He allegedly bragged about the criminal activities afterward and stated along with others that he “would have killed anyone they got their hands on, including Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi and Vice President Michael Pence,” the release states, citing the allegations in the affidavit.You brought up a poignant subject. Some clearly appear to find the protest/riot of the Capitol different from the months of protests on behalf of BLM. It would appear both had people that were out of control, came to fight, while the majority did not come to cause riots. Both let's call them groups seem to have planned that they would become violent. In the summer riots, there are videos where vans pulled up with bricks, bottles, and who knows what else. It is said that on Jan 6th lots of what could be called weaponry was also found. Now, we know on several occasions people were killed due to the months of riots, and we had deaths occur at our Capitol riot. At both riots, we had the threat of killing. On several occasions, rioters tried to burn Law enforcement alive. And yes we had one law enforcement officer killed, and a protester also killed. And three other deaths that have been reported. So, we have a full circle in regards to these two groups. So, it would seem both groups had some form of cause they were promoting. Both groups turned to violence to get their point across. So are Congressmen and women more valuable than law officers' lives?
The next variable might be it is thought that the President inspired the riot with his opinion that he was cheated out of the election due to fraud. There is no doubt he did speak frequently and loudly about his opinion. The inspiration that spurred the summer riots was the killing of Mr. Floyd by a policeman that leaned on his neck. The riots started immediately, and the media covered them very differently. Some called the riots mostly peaceful, and purposeful. We even saw our politicians bailing out those that found themselves arrested. Fox reported the riots as violent, covering the nightly looting, burning, and deaths. So, did nightly rhetoric spur on rioters? Food for thought.
Reading some comments here leaves me with the opinion that some don't care to distinguish who's lives matter? Or perhaps have just not considered that the summer rioters and those voters that attacked the capitol are much the same. Whether one wants to realize it or not both groups had a cause. One may not agree with either cause but both groups felt strongly enough to commit acts of violence. Myself, I don't like any form of violence. I can't make an excuse for breaking the law for a cause --- period.
Not even sure I would label this hypocrisy at this point. I know some will get all patriotic on me at this point. However, I don't in any respect feel one life is more important than another. Not one bit different.
https://komonews.com/news/local/police- … e-officers
https://www.king5.com/article/news/loca … b70b48d96f
https://nypost.com/2020/06/18/portland- … -precinct/Would you please provide a link to me or anyone else in these forums saying it was alright to take a life?
I prefaced my comment " leaves me with the opinion". I am not at all willing to point out anyone's post or person due to it being an objective opinion. Just pointing out what I came away with. Not about to read someone wrong. Hey, I may have done just that with you the other day. As I said I learned something due to our previous comment.
That's an awfully damning opinion to have without presenting any evidence. Opinions, to be respected, must have at least a little basis in reality, in my opinion.
Would it serve any purpose to point out a couple of statements that made me add that one statement? I was also trying to point out there were lots of very upset over something that pretty much has mirrored what we had during the summer riots. I thought IB made a point by just posting photos and offering what some of these people did for a living. It gave a real human side to all of this. Not sure if it was what she hoped to do? But It made me think, lots of people from different walks of life, vet, Olympic participants, nurses you name it.
My comment was mostly to make people stop and think about the fact violence is violence no matter what cause one ascribes to it. l. No matter if incited or promoted. due to what one might think a worthy cause. People get hurt, and as a rule, nothing is accomplished, but more turmoil.
Valeant. I'm curious as to how you knew I have "furry slippers"? I feel a V anon conspiracy theory coming on. That's way too close to home. I'm now in the process of putting tape over my computer cameras and disconnecting my Alexa. LOL.
“Feelin cute...might start a revolution later, IDK – in Capitol Hill,” he wrote on Facebook.
A Virginia man who showed police an unauthorized inauguration credential at a checkpoint along the perimeter securing downtown Washington, D.C., ahead of Inauguration Day was arrested after a gun and hundreds of rounds of ammunition were found in his vehicle, police said.
A gun with a high-capacity magazine inserted and ammunition were found in the vehicle, police said. The gun was not registered in Washington, D.C., police said.
Police say they also found "509 9MM rounds of hollow point & ball ammunition" and 21 12-guage shotgun shellsI think there are already three parties as about 10% of Republicans want nothing to do with Trumpism. Those are the Lincoln Party Republicans.
The Democrats have two factions as well, a little more evenly distributed with the moderates and the Democratic Socialists.
It took a fascist like Trump to unite both Democratic factions, something Hillary could not do with the treatment Bernie received in 2016 from the DNC.So who knows. Perhaps Trumps stirring in the democratic process becomes something positive after all. That would be the day, two right wing and two left wing parties.!!!
Another must watch!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=270F8s5TEKY
Crazy sh!t.
Must watch - horrible!
https://www.dailywire.com/news/retired- … mpaign=mjkGuy in the ski goggles should have used the skiing concussion excuse.
https://www.timesunion.com/news/article … 181535.php
I'm wondering what is more dangerous to our way of life. A few bad actors in a mostly peaceful protest, or the use of it to springboard into a concerted and coordinated censorship of all alternative views. Views that either criticize the democrats or disagree with the official narrative.
I just listened to an interview with Brandon Straka, the #walkway founder. The official account on Facebook was banned. He, his employees, any peripheral contractors and contributors had their personal Facebook accounts closed. They were all purged from their email platforms.
We are witnessing an ideological pogrom by big tech and the media, in lock step with the octogenarians who control the democratic party. Will the left fight to protect the civil liberties of Americans?
Probably not.With the internet, you can read whatever you want. From UFO kidnapings organized by the CIA to a sighting of Elvis.
You can read right-wing propaganda and you can read left-wing propaganda. So please don't come with the word Censorship of the news..
You're not living in China.
If you don't like Facebook, go somewhere else for your news. It's not that difficult.
But yes, to be fair, the big newspapers do print in their line of interests and what sells, but that is called capitalism for you!A few bad actors? Some 70% of Republicans believe the lie that 81 million people did not elect Joe Biden. In my view, they've chosen to leave reality behind and that makes them dangerous. They're willing to believe a man with a history of lying and fraud, and his dangerous rhetoric. There have been multiple instances of people violently acting using that rhetoric - including many in the Capitol quoting him directly.
At this point, Big Tech is acting in a national security role. If you're going to spread the lies that have led to an attack against our government, I have no problem with them banning people.In my mind, they have chosen to question the election outcome, plain and simple. Too much has gone down the last four years, many citizens question the goings-on in Washington.
Big tech has no right to act in a national security role. They are more or less a media for social views. Do you really think it appropriate for social media companies to police any accuracy of our society? Hopefully, I misunderstood your words.t appears you are somewhat on board with censorship.
"Big Tech is acting in a national security role. If you're going to spread the lies that have led to an attack against our government, I HAVE NO PROBLEM with them banning people."Big tech has every right to act in a national security role. They are private companies and can choose to set the rules for their users. And yes, when people are using their platforms to spread lies that lead to violent insurrection, I definitely think they should ban those users.
Ever had a gander at some of the violent rhetoric BLM posts on Facebook and Twitter. Get real. Or maybe you do not use Facebook or Twitter? I will agree to disagree about social media picking and choosing what I see. You may like that kind of control... There is a large ilk out there that love it.
BLM used social media to plan each and every one of their protests/riots, and they did it unfettered.Yes, they planned the protests. No, they did not plan riots.
Why yes, I have seen Black Lives Matter posts, can you point out the violent ones: https://www.facebook.com/BlackLivesMatter/photos
If someone promotes violence or rioting, I agree they should be banned, regardless of where it's insurrectionists or social justice warriors.OMG, they post radical crap all over Facebook as well as Twitter. Do you own research?
Facebook did threaten many times to banned BLM all summer. Twitter just let them say anything they felt they wanted to.Do I own research? Do you own English?
I literally posted the link to the BLM site and asked you to pick out the violent posts. And you come back with....nothing.Do I own research ---- I said --- Do you own research? I left off an r. Have you ever made a TYPO?
A random typo, sure. Misspelling a word and using a question mark when a period was warranted is not a typo, it's a butchering.
And noticed you couldn't go to their site and pick out the violent posts, even when provided the link. Then AB joins in and quotes things from 5-6 years ago.
If you're going to make a claim, at least have some evidence of that claim.It is very apparent you do not follow Twitter BLM garbage or what they got away with all last summer. Check the archives. I am not taking the time to quote their rhetoric.
Butchered a bit.. some of my short remarks are done on my phone. Glad you took note.
Ummmm, "pigs in a blanket, fry em like bacon", OR "what do we want, dead cops, when do we want it, NOW."
No, we aren't going to do this, we aren't going to pretend, they are a poor misunderstood, harmless little movement. They have worked, along with Antifa, to divide us, hoping to destroy all we have accomplished and all we have overcome.Those chants were from 2014 and 2015. Got anything that represents the BLM movement of today?
So what you have just said with that statement is that we are to ignore hate speech....if its old?
Yes there's some more modern day chants coming out of them as well....same tune, different day, "eff the police", all day long, day in, day out.
Also, the white members of BLM are the worst of all, they make fun of the personal appearance of police officers of color.
It's disgusting and you refuse to condemn it....apparently!
These chants, threats, were/are disconcerting to all of us with family or friends in law enforcement. The actual targeting and killing of police officers, as a result of these hateful chants, doesn't get a pass, doesn't get swept under the rug and forgotten, so that we can PRETEND that only conservatives are responsible for bad things that happen.Why do you right-wingers always put words into people's mouths? The discussion you came into was discussing Black Lives Matter's social media posts from this summer, and you go back 5-6 years for things done in the past. And you bring in chants and not even posts. Your whataboutism isn't really related to our discussion on whether BLM should be banned from social media platforms - and why I provide the link to their online page to ask which posts were inciting violence. Shar can't provide a single post from the group - just claiming that they surely exist because she is clearly such an avid follower of them - being old, white and from rural Michigan.
And white people making fun of the appearance of black officers? Not even sure where that came from. And since I've never heard of those examples, it would be pretty hard to condemn them...so save your accusations of what others think about something. That'd be like me saying that since you didn't come on here and condemn the El Paso shooter, you must support shooting immigrants. If you want to go around guessing about what people support, we can play that game all day and we'll both get banned pretty quickly.
And let's not go speaking for those of us with family in law enforcement. My father was a 22-year member of our state police. Targeting of police was happening by those in the social justice movement and those on the right and should be met with the greatest amount of legal repercussions available. But at the same time, there needs to be reforms for when police and others use excessive and lethal force against unarmed black people as we saw so many times this year.So long story short, yes, you choose to ignore it?
In the same way you ignore calling out the shooting of immigrants.
Not sure what you are talking about and what does that have to do with the hate speech of BLM? Besides the targets which it places on Police Officers of course!
Just assuming a position for you in the same manner you do for me. I guess you missed that in my long story post.
And you still want to cling to your whataboutism because, like Shar, you cannot point to a reason why BLM should be banned from social media sites. I've looked up the chants used this summer during the protests - not sure I'd call them hate speech as you claim.Here is one of the posts ---
The Movement for Black Lives
mtSplMeeaoyiScnnso 3u1,alar 2020red ·
The Movement For Black Lives, and organizers mobilizing across the country, invite you to rise up with us and say no more! We are calling for a week of action June 1st to 5th In Defense of Black Lives. This is an opportunity to uplift and FIGHT alongside those turning up in the streets and on the airwaves.
Today we prepare for the week ahead by intentionally grounding ourselves and fortifying our spirits for the protracted struggle. Today we make space for collective mourning and resilience as we get in touch with what is required of us in this moment. Mobilize in solidarity with activists and organizers across the country and world saying enough is enough. Change your social media profile pictures to the image below this week to show that you are committed to being in defense of Black lives. #DefundPolice #DefendBlackLife.
You only need to view BLM Facebook. Much of the rhetoric is removed as necessary.
Posts such as this one were used to plan protests, protests that ultimately turned into riots.By your argument then, you seem to be making the equal case that Trump using the word FIGHT, as you so eloquently capitalized, is a call to violence at his January 6th rally.
And you chose information from a smaller subset of Black Lives Matter called The Movement For Black Lives. BLM has 700,000 followers online at Facebook, while the Movement For Black Lives only has about 90,000. Slightly different organizations. And considering I never heard of the latter until you posted something that they said, that difference could be enough of a difference to matter.
There's a 'well, all their websites look alike to me' joke in there somewhere.I am pleased to see you caught my anology. However, you headed down the wrong path --- I was pointing out the word fight can be used in a sentence to promote a different context than physical fighting.
I have tried unsuccessfully on many occasions to point out context matters. If one listens to Trump's rally speech as he leads up to using the words fight on two occasions strung together, one might come away with he meant much what BLM message denoted.
Come together and campaign determinedly for or against something, especially to put right what one considers unfair or unjust.
Do you see where I am going in regards to just one word, and how if one tries even one word can be misconstrued and spun out of context?If you only count the one word and not take in the entirety of the rally that was organized by the Trump campaign. Trial by combat, fight, show strength - all pandering to armed militias in that crowd.
Like she's always saying, context matters. In the context of a months-long propaganda campaign to convince his supporters that the election was stolen and they must rise up to take it back, it was clearly an incitement to insurrection.
Good point ---
In regards to the Jan 6th Capitol riot, it is apparent only a segment (a minority) of the people that were at the rally started a physical battle, the majority just marched for a cause.
Context does matter-- Trump clearly did incite some to become physical, but the majority, no they were peaceful. They traveled to Washington to protest the election results, they did it peacefully. In my view, these are the folk that the other side should be worried about. They don't seem to be settling for the path "they feel" the country is heading.
I predict they will continue to push back without any bit of violence. The word fight is a strong word, to me, it denotes physical altercation, as well as standing up for a cause.And yet those same people are able to ignore the will of the 81 million that stood up for the cause of democracy, the ruling of the courts, election officials, the FBI, and the DOJ stating that no systemic fraud existed. Those still unable to accept the result are not standing up for a cause but living in a fantasy world.
They do not only live in a fantasy world but undermine a democracy. It's putting a foundation full of lies for another Trump. Somebody will pick up where Trump has left. Probably a bit more intelligent and using the election lies of today.
It would not surprise me if in 4 years' time Pompeo wants to be the president. Going for the same aggressive right-wing politics as Trump, but a bit smarter.We vote every four years for a president. Yes, Joe won, and he will have a go at being President. The people have spoken. There are many as there were in 2016 that are unhappy with the results.
When I really think about why so many are up in arms about the election results it leaves me feeling it is a lot more than them feeling the election was rigged. I canvased for Trump, and I got to really hear a lot of the same complaints. Mostly about the Democratic party, Joe was secondary to their complaints. So not so sure so many are mad about a rigged election, but an agenda they feel is not right for the country. Many Trump supporters liked his policies, and yes his communicating with the people.
So, even with all you mentioned, when Trump lost it must have devasted too many to feel they would return to the same old same old. And the thought of losing possibly due to fraud made a lot of people
even madder.Well stated Sharlee. Most people just want to know that all is fair and that all things are equal in elections and in life.
I hope you have followed my thoughts on other threads here in regard to voter fraud. I have covered the arguments in regards to the many court cases, as well as the need for an investigation. I have been for an investigation due to all the whistleblower's allegations. I do think many of us that voted for Trump have multiple reasons that we are up in arms...
Voter fraud was more or less the last straw. People feel cheated for so many reasons. I am sure you know that.
I am still promoting an investigation, we know there was voter fraud. We need to know to what extent or it will be worse next time around.Definitely, agreed.
I don't know if there can ever be fair elections again though. If elections are opened up to internet registration, acceptance of mail in ballots and drop box ballots, acceptance of post deadline ballots coming in from all directions, haphazardly handled by multiple hands...
It is a privilege and an honor to vote, it should be protected as such... Publishers Clearing House sweepstakes has stricter rules.Once they did away with the "paper trail" there was no way of verifying the legitimacy of ANY election.
Computers are programmed, mail in ballots are forged, etc.
It's not the people who vote that decide the election, it's the people who count the votes.
They have a right to peacefully push back and I hope they do. We need to clearly see who fell for the con so we can keep them out of elected office, from top to bottom.
After all, it one cannot discern truth from propaganda, one should probably not be in office or any position of real responsibility..
I don't read into what another might be thinking. You could be very correct, but what if you are wrong? I guess I just look at things differently than you in regards to how I come about a thought. Everyone is different. As you well pointed out I am an older woman. I must correct you in regards to where I live in Michigan, and actually where I have lived my entire life. I live in a large county right outside Detroit. I grew up five miles outside the city. Pretty much city person all my life.
The word fight is a strong word, to me, it denotes physical altercation, as well as standing up for a cause. It's not easy to distingue between the two. Maybe a word that should be used with caution.
I feel you and this is exactly why I periodically just stop engaging with them on anything but the most surface level. Up is down, day is night, Trump didn't say that, and what about all those cities that burned to t he ground this summer.
I'm at the eye rolling phase at this point.
He’s part of a Texas militia group called Texas Freedom Force
Threatened his children: “If you turn me in, you’re a traitor & you know what happens to traitors. Traitors get shot.” He further told Son that if Son crossed the line and reported him to the police, putting the family in jeopardy, he would have no option but to do his duty for his country, and “do what he had to do.” Shortly after the above threat, Daughter was using her cellular phone to talk with friends. He stated to Daughter that if Daughter were recording him or put this (meaning his comments) anywhere on social media, then Daughter will have crossed the line, betrayed the family, and he was going to “put a bullet through” Daughter’s phone.
MAGAFBI investigating whether woman stole laptop from Pelosi's office to sell it to Russia
"It appears that the woman has fled," according to the affidavit, which was signed Sunday and posted publicly after 9 p.m.. "According to local law enforcement officers in Harrisburg, her mother stated that her daughter packed a bag and left her home and told her mother she would be gone for a couple of weeks. She did not provide her mother any information about her intended destination."
While it is certainly possible (selling the laptop to Russia, China, Iraq, N Korea or any other country), my guess is that she is simply trying to lay low and avoid being arrested while she looks for dirt on it.
I know that I wouldn't have the foggiest notion of how to go about finding a foreign nation to buy a stolen laptop. Call their embassy, perhaps? Wear a long black coat with the word "spy" printed on it while applying for a VISA?
These chants, threats, were/are disconcerting to all of us with family or friends in law enforcement. The actual targeting and killing of police officers, as a result of these hateful chants, doesn't get a pass, doesn't get swept under the rug and forgotten, so that we can PRETEND that only conservatives are responsible for bad things that happen.
U.S. files conspiracy charge against Oath Keeper leader in alleged plot against the Capitol
The man was arrested in Virginia on several federal charges, including conspiracy to commit an offense against the United States.
FBI agents describe The Oath Keepers as a “large but loosely organized collection of the militia * who believe the federal government has been corrupted by a shadowy conspiracy that is trying to strip American citizens of their rights.”
“We need to do this at the local level. Lets [sic] storm the capitol in Ohio. Tell me when!”
* That sounds familiar.“Self-styled militia members from Virginia, Ohio and other states made plans to storm the U.S. Capitol days in advance of the Jan. 6 attack, communicating in real time as they breached the building on opposite sides and led dozens in a hunt for lawmakers to make “citizen’s arrests,” according to new court documents filed Tuesday...”
The conspiracy theories sure are vast among many at this site. If you're so unsure of the election process, instead of writing falsities here, go volunteer and be part of the process so you can have first-hand knowledge instead of taking your cues from a functional illiterate like Trump.
Thumbs up to this! I've been a poll watcher when I was in better health and could work. Believe me, the Poll Sheriff and her/his paid assistants don't fool around. There is no room for the tomfoolery that they've been accused of in this election.
If you don't agree that there's plenty of room for error, that's your prerogative, however, it doesn't cancel out the observations of others and it certainly doesn't make you the authority.
I've about had my fill of the elitist attitudes which reside here, so I guess that makes us about even.So, you are also on record as not believing state officials (including Republican ones), judges (including Republican appointees), Trump's FBI, and Trump's DOJ, when they say the allegations were investigated and no massive election fraud was found?
So agree, it is thick here, and so uncalled for. I mean come on...
Right, the thickness is stifling. I am about ready to take another break from the forums and just concentrate on my articles.
You're right, that's why I rely on recounts, election officials, the courts, the DOJ, the FBI and even Mitch McConnell who assured us that there was no systemic fraud. Who do you have again - the guy who was alleging fraud even before the election took place? The same guy who alleged massive fraud in the 2016 election and then could prove none of it?
I've had my fill of accusations that have been debunked by court rulings and election officials that has now led to an attempted violent overthrow of our government.
Yes, there's too much room for error. I prefer a paper trail, always have. I still request my bank statements be delivered snail mail and I still write checks. How's that for old school.
I agree with you on the need for a paper trail. In which states where fraud was alleged was there no paper trail?
Can there even be a trail when there are no clear paths, doesn't it then become a maze?
I have no idea what you mean. Can you clarify?
As far as I am aware, every state where fraud was alleged had a paper trail that was checked to verify the challenged votes. I could b e wrong, though. That is why I asked.
Like I said, though, I do not understand your response.I was wondering that too, as I wasn't sure which states it affected. In 2020, counties in Texas, Tennessee, Louisiana, Mississippi, Indiana, Kansas, Kentucky, and New Jersey are still exclusively using paperless machines, also called direct recording electronic systems (DREs).
So that means that every state where fraud was alleged to have occurred had a paper trail.That is good to know and just more evidence that the election was not fraudulent.
In PA this was easily overcome by the additional time allowed for "Mail In Ballots" to come in well after election day. Not surprisingly the entire nation was forced to patiently wait on slow results from Pennsylvania as it sifted through millions of mail-in ballots.
Trump held Florida and Ohio, which quickly reported their mail-in results on election night. For four arduous days, the outcome of the 2020 election lingered in purgatory.
As the days crept by, Trump's massive election night lead of 700,000 votes slowly disappeared as Pennsylvania's 67 counties churned through their mail-in ballots, accepting newly received ones well after election day, revealing a narrow win for Biden.
In GA they have a new hybrid electronic voting system that combines familiar touchscreen machines with paper ballots but critics said the system was still vulnerable to hacking, and of course, fraud.
So... when stating that there is no "paper trail" that is an oversimplification for systems that are ripe for fraud and corruption to change the outcome. But yes, it technically is an error to say they are without a "paper trail".And those mail-in ballots could be counted and audited because they exist, on paper. And which party refused to change their law to count those ballots early? That would be the GOP reps in PA, Mich., and Wisconsin. And all the research contradicts your point about mail-in ballots being ripe for fraud as many states have used them for decades with very little fraud present.
Just that it has become too complicated with too many avenues; there are too many opportunities for human error or for cheating to take place (along the maze, beginning with online voter registration). Unless, the person wishing to vote is military and stationed overseas or under the sea, unless the person wishing to vote is in the hospital or bedridden, I don't see any reason for not getting out on Election Day and voting in person. Like I said I admit, I am old school. Not a fan of long lines, but when I see a long line of people doing their civic duty on Election Day, I will wait, without complaint, in fact, it does my heart good.
Well, it's one thing to believe there is a possibility of fraud. To me, this is an obvious thought, like saying "there is a possibility of bank robbery." Yes, a possibility for illegalities exists. The question then becomes, have we included enough safeguards tnat fraud will be extremely rare, and if it does occur, will it likely be discovered?
Based on everything I have read on the matter, I am comfortable that our elections are secure. This has been borne out by this election, where a substantial effort was made to prove fraud and that effort failed on every level.
I honestly do not see how a rational person can continue to claim massive fraud occurred in this election. Every opportunity was given for it to be proven, and it wasn't.
I hope that Dominion does follow through with their threats of suing people, including Mike Lindell, that will finally be their "opportunity" to make their case.
Do you think Dominion will follow through?
What case does Dominion need to make? If they are accused of sometging, it is the accuser's responsibility to make a case.
And what opportunity was not given to prove election fraud? They pursued every legal avenue, didn't they?
Who among those calling attention to fraud had a day in court?
All of them went through the legal orocess and if they didn't that is on them. Are you imolying that every single court decision was wrong?
I am saying that as a citizen of the United States of America, I have more questions than answers about the last election. I'm not one to just, let it go...
I am not arguing for the sake of arguing, I have legitimate concerns.Yeah, yeah, I get that. But what, exactly, would have to happen for you to be satisfied that massive voter fraud did or did not occur?
I, for example, am satisfied it did not occur based on all the investigators and findings that have already occurred.
What more do you want to happen?
As for Dominion, they've threatened to sue their accusers...I am asking you if you think they will follow through and sue or are they just making noise?
Not sure why I am so difficult to understand, I don't speak or write Greek, I did learn Spanish, but have used it so infrequently that most words escape me, when needed.
Dominion sued Sydney Powell for defamation for 1.3 billion.
Here is the AP announcement link https://apnews.com/article/dominion-law … 61e20ede69Good. Hopefully, as a result of this; the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, will come out, once and for all.
And I answered that I have no idea. Do you have some inside knowledge? However, if a large news conglomerate like Fox News is willing to retract their story because of threat of being sued, I tend to think the story was wrong. Fox, a news organization, certainly has deep enough pockets to defend themselves if they were accurately reporting on Dominion. The fact that they quickly backed down indicates to me that they knew they couldn't win. Remember, if they did win, not only would they enhance their reputation for quality reporting,but Dominion would have to pay Fox's legal fees. Win-win for Fox. The fact that they immediately capitulated is an excellent indicator that their story on Dominion was false.
"Court-ordered audit concludes Dominion voting machines were intentionally designed to ‘create systemic fraud’ in Michigan
The court-ordered forensic audit, carried out by Allied Security Operations Group (ASOG), found that Dominion systems in Antrim County, Michigan recorded a shocking 68 percent error rate while tabulating votes. The report noted that the faulty software far exceeds the “allowable election error rate” of 0.0008 percent set by the Federal Election Commission.
Shockingly, the auditors claimed that the widespread errors were a feature, not a bug, stating that the voting system “intentionally” generates a high number of ballot errors which can then be used to manipulate the vote tally. "
https://www.rt.com/usa/509674-michigan- … ors-fraud/That's what I want, I want the truth to come out.
I want a whistle blower to come clean about the volumes of mystery ballots, which seemed to come out of the woodwork, ALL with only one mark (for Joe Biden alone!!) It is far from believable, but how do you prove it? It has to be someone wishing to clear their conscience.
I want Mike Lindell and Sydney Powell and all others that Dominion plans to sue to say "bring it" and I want it all; evidence, witnesses, everything to be on the table, front and center and for it to be shown in prime time.
That's what I want, don't expect to get it. Too much to ask for?Why do you think these things are not happening the way you describe?
And when the result doesn't end up being what you want, you'll claim it was done by some RINO's in Congress, or that the courts didn't adjudicate things properly. We've already seen Republican judges, Republican election officials, a die-hard Republican Attorney General, a Republican-appointed FBI Director and even the word of the GOP Majority leader, Mitch McConnell discounted. Unless it comes from Trump directly, his cult won't believe a result from any other source.
That's what's been actually proven during the last two months.The truth will set us all free V and while I have your attention, I am a Christian, I read the bible, I believe that Jesus is the Christ, the son of a living God.
When I hear the word "cult", I think satanic and that is something that I, personally, could never be a part of.
Maybe for you, a cult is something else, but don't lump me in with it, ever again.
I am out of here.Then you need to read a dictionary and look up the word cult.
Cult
Noun
-a misplaced or excessive admiration for a particular person or thing.Yea, usually reserved for Satan! I don't want any part of or in a cult.
I hope you will continue our dialogue and answer my last question. I believe we are very close to the end of road.
I don't know about that, what was your last question?
The REAL reason the Right has been so stubborn about the electoral processes when their charges of fraud have been debunked at every point.
https://news.yahoo.com/armed-groups-cap … 57163.html
---------
A complex relationship with authority
These groups, which traditionally have been described as “anti-government,” in fact have a much more complicated relationship with government and other authority.
Most see constitutional leaders as legitimate and worthy of protection but believe it is their sole prerogative to determine who lives up to that standard. They also believe that liberals and others who disagree with them should not have an equal say in the direction of the country or in which leaders should represent the people’s collective interests.
To cover the arrogance and insolence of that attitude, they call it "vote fraud".Unfortunately, "patriot" has been code word for something else entirely for quite some time now.
See, PP, it never ends.
I have work to do.
Oh gawddd . . . More "code word" stuff? What's wrong with taking a word for what it means, instead of attributing semi-secret codes and dog whistles to it?
Is it inconceivable to think that patriot means the same thing to you as it does to a Trump supporter? *as he stands back aghast at such a suggestion. . .
GAOkay, I'll give you an exanole. These words are verbatim from a social media post floating around the citizens of our little town this summer:
CALLING ALL PATRIOTS!
We are meeting at Johnnu's Drive In at 7 pm to plan a trip to Portland to programmers BLM's occupation of Portland. Johnny's is open carry friendly.
Who do you think they were talking to when they said "calling all patriots"?
But, yes, ideally "patriot" would simply mean "patriot." I just don't think it's always used that way any more.
Well, I disagree with your thought, but, allow me to grab your comment to launch a thought I am struggling with—that of arrogance, insolence, and, as previously described, a lack of critical thinking.
This is a personal anecdote and one that I have been pondering for a while. So bear with me, my point will be that I think the most gross thoughts about Trump supporters are self-serving and misguided.
Just today I had a conversation with my nephew-in-law. He is a Trump supporter, and he is not dumb. Yet he firmly believes the election was stolen.
Allow me to describe this guy. He is a firmly middle-class American. (yes, he has an American Flag pole in his front yard, but he would never fly a flag from the bed of his F150). A great dad of two boys, and a correctional officer that must deal with the dredges of our society daily. He has maintained an excellent credit rating, (800+), since he was a teenager because he realized the importance of good credit. He is a pro-gun advocate and owns multiple guns. Because of his profession, he is always armed, all of the time—even when off-duty.
By almost all standards he fits the description of a Trump supporter, (and he is), but he is also a very law-abiding citizen This guy wouldn't even Jay Walk, and if he found a dollar in a parking lot he would look for a customer service desk to turn it into. So there you have it, an honest description of a salt-of the-earth American.
So how can it be explained that he believes the election was stolen?
Because .. . . he is not like us forum dwellers, researching and dissecting everything we hear. He works eight and sixteen-hour days. His off-time is devoted to his homelife and family, (he strives to win HOA holiday decorations awards every year). In all things, his boys and wife come first. He is not a Proud Boy' or a militia guy', or a Confederate flag redneck. Yet, he is a Trump supporter that believes the election was stolen.
In these forums, we have described such folks as idiots and non-critical thinkers, but given those truthful credentials and characteristics I have described, can we, (us forum dwellers), really be so confident in our characterization declarations?
Now here is the problem,. He mostly gets his news from Facebook feeds. And obviously, those would be Right-wing conservative feeds. He probably never watches evening news programs, (too busy working and interacting with his wife and kids), and almost certainly never factchecks the items in his feed.
How many other "salt-of-the-earth" Middle Americans do you think he is representative of? Would 70 million, (okay, 75% of that, 50 million), be a fair guesstimate?
To be all elitist and judgemental it is easy to say, "Well, of course, he is suffering from confirmation bias and the absence of any critical thinking efforts." Ha! aren't we so smug in our lives that we can criticize such an upright citizen as this guy—just because he doesn't spend every minute analizing' the politics he believes.
He believes what he believes and he believes what he hears that agrees with what he believes. By our standards, (us forum dwellers), he is an idiot for not researching the truth of what he believes. Damn, the air can get thin up here, can't it?"
The point behind that whole explanation . . . is that he is the Trump supporter that I have so frequently addressed and defended—not the zip -tie or Confederate flag yahoos.
And . . .we, (again, us forum dwellers), would be a lot more credible in our thoughts if we didn't declare such broad characterizations as " arrogance and insolence "
I will continue to stand with my thought that the Capital Hill invaders are not representative of the majority of Trump supporters. And I will continue to stand with the thought that, with the exception of acknowledging that they can be ill-informed, these folks are the salt-of-the-earth that benefit our society every day in almost every way.
I will close with a mea culpa. I can't talk politics with him. I don't want to crush his spirit. He, (oddly), respects my opinions and I hate peeing in his Cheerios on every topic he brings up. ;-)
GAThanks for bringing your comment back to life.
It was poignant and I was anxious to provide a reply.
No, I don't condemn your nephew in law, there are a lot of people like him, apolitical. We have them on "our side" as well.
My Dearest Mum in her late 80s was and is like that. She admonished me prior to my going to the University as a freshman "You had better stay away from all that "LDS", and I know that she was not talking Latter Day Saints. She has been a regular churchgoer and carries a bible with her, but I wouldn't trouble her by asking her what actually was in it.
From over a half century of experience, she just knows that Republicans are no damned good. Yet, she is right as most of us believe that the Republican Party has not really give us a reason to view them any other way. So, it is like the proverbial mallet striking the patella, just reflex.
She has, as well as my relations, been law abiding and lives a productive life like your nephew, yet see the world differently. Most of us are not in Portland and Seattle throwing Molotov cocktails, and would perish the thought of such behavior.
"Salt of the Earth" can be found in a variety of venue.
So, was the election stolen, the preponderance of evidence says it was not. We look at the policies of the GOP to guide us as to their concern and interests regarding our issues. That is how we come to our conclusions regarding them.
What evidence does your nephew rely on really to support the idea of the election having been stolen by Democrats besides bias media sources?Unfortunately, I don't think he has any "evidence" beyond his social circle and conservative values.
*sigh. . . We have to keep reminding ourselves Cred that "normal" folks have lives beyond Google search and political discussion forums. We are the anomaly bud. While we search for facts and positions, most normal folks are searching for the latest viral cat or public news incident videos.
GA
It it interesting, isn't it?
We lived through four years of "the Left" telling us the election was stolen by the Russians, or whatever, and that Trump was not a legitimate President.
And now, the shoe is on the other foot, so to speak, and those people feel just as strongly that the election was stolen, as those four years ago felt.
The big difference being, we had endless investigations into how 2016 happened, what went wrong, who was responsible, who was in collusion with who. And now we don't, and won't.
The excuses for the changes rapidly to come have been set, and in the coming months we will see many of them enacted.
We can never have another election where "outside influences" sway voters, we can never have dangerous rhetoric allowed on Social Media or else we could have an "insurrection" or worse a "revolution".But no one sacked the Capital building in 2016.
I thought that Gore got screwed in 2000 over 530 some votes, did the left physically threaten the Government in response?
We are free to disagree but not to get physical and violent. Every bit of evidence points to fact that Trump lost, and I still believe that for the Right the controversy provides an excuse to threaten the democratic process, itself.Yes, fair point.
That gets me back to thinking who those were who did that... the "pillar of the community types" the nurses, police, teachers, firemen.
And it also gets me thinking, that without such an 'insurrection event', they would have been hard pressed to justify some of the changes that are going to be implemented... ... but now, whatever it takes to keep our government safe, right?The pillar of the community types that opposed Trump did not attack the Capitol in an insurrectionist fervor in 2016. There were plenty of protests against Trump starting with the Women's March in January, 2017, but no one was talking about insurrection or sedition.
The D.C. Crowd was no less than a mob, Ken. We all know that such behavior is unacceptable whether it comes from antifa in Oregon or the Rightwinger in DC. There is absolutely nothing to redeem them.
Since when do these Right winged "pillars of the community" get to have their wishes placed ahead of the majority of the electorate?
That, as I have always said, is the arrogance behind fundamental conservative philosophy.Credence,
I have grown very distant from either Party or any "side"... I am not supportive of Trump, I am not in favor of Democrats over Republicans.
Its impossible for me at this stage, when I see the bigger picture(s).
Democrats... Republicans... they are two wings of the same bird.
Democrats... Republicans... Congress and the DC Establishment serve the interests of the same "institutions" no matter which side is in control.
The exception to this in the last 30 years was Trump,,, he was an outsider, he was an antagonist, he was a populist, he was a lot of things, he just wasn't a DC sycophant and he wasn't willing to play nice.
But again, this isn't about Trump for me, this is about the bigger picture, about where the economy is headed, the changes to be implemented on our society and in our lives, the direction things are moving globally and in conjunction with things I have discussed and written about.
This is about tens of millions of people rising up... right now you see Trumpsters invading the Capitol and someone else on here complains about Antifa or BLM rioting in Portland or occupying Seattle...
These groups are soon going to put their differences aside I believe and focus their frustrations on the ultimate source of their problems... a failed system and the powers that are keeping it in place/control.Ken, while you may see both sides as problematic, I see one as more problematic than the other.
Yes, there is an "establishment" that is maintained by both sides, but one side is clearly more autocratic, plutocratic, tyrannical than the other. Things are not the way I would prefer, but as I always said, I am going with those that attempt to see the world as I do to the greatest extent possible. That is NOT Donald Trump, his incitement toward insurrection unknown by any holding the office of the President through out history. Trump is just another greedy little capitalist, unfortunately placed in a critical position within our government and I am most relieved that he has been removed. He is not a solution more than an exacerbation of the underlying problems within this society.
so, lets look toward the future and see, I see the differences between the MAGA people and the Left as fundamental as to the direction in which we want to move.We agree that Trump was not the solution... he certainly made for a great "hand grenade" to be thrown into the snake nest of DC, but he is not the person to lead America to a better future.
As GA said a while back, and I am paraphrasing here, what we have done is gone back to what was... that is all that Biden is... the corrupt establishment at its worst back in control.
There was a shred of hope for something much more, just a glimmer, that we could get a Tulsi Gabbard or some other person made of stout moral fiber and beliefs forged from being in the real world we live in.
Tulsi being a combat vet and having seen the real world up close in all its ugliness was an excellent choice to lead the country, last thing she would have done is deployed our forces to some foreign country so some rich corporations could get richer.
You are still focused on Trump, but he is gone, and ahead is a Tsunami getting ready to pound our political shores that will make the rumblings in the ground Trump made seem like a walk in the park, just give it a couple of years, you'll see.
Only so many millions can lose their jobs, their homes, their hopes, before there is a reaction of epic proportions... and that time is near.I know. People, I have observed, are really agitated with one other. I fear the idealistic, *philanthropic democrat-liberal types have become exceedingly intolerant of *self-sufficient and confident conservative-republican types. People from both parties have become bitter and resentful, each blaming the other for taking away everything which makes them happy.
I don't know how we are going to rise above this widening psyche-divide.
The rumblings will get loud and earthquakes will transpire for sure!
Unless some miracle happens.
*phil·an·throp·ic
adjective: philanthropic
(of a person or organization) seeking to promote the welfare of others, especially by donating money to good causes; generous and benevolent.
"they receive financial support from philanthropic bodies"
VS
self-suf·fi·cient
adjective: self-sufficient
needing no outside help in satisfying one's basic needs, especially with regard to the production of food.
"I don't think Botswana, due to the climate, could ever be self-sufficient in food"
emotionally and intellectually independent.
"their son was a little bit of a loner and very self-sufficient"
I wonder what that miracle would/could be?
maybe if we could realize both parties are right! both causes are worthwhile/vital!
... and what part are outside forces playing in pitting us against each other?
Can we resist the Globalists / Deep States, (right and left) and China ...
and acknowledge our common enemies?
Ha! I would have written the same thought Ken. ^5
GA
- PrettyPantherposted 12 months ago
0Geez, there's an awful lot of snowflakey-ness going on around here.
I wasn't even talking to you.On a separate subject..."snowflakey-ness" is a pretty cool word. I like it. Now...we can go back to disagreeing.
You missed my point.
We never seem to manage to get to the end of the road or wrap it up, because there's always one more insult, one more jab, one more can of worms to open, that inevitably gets opened (both sides and the fence riders all do it)
Not sure where snowflakey-ness is coming from.I did not jab you. I was responding to an article shared by credence. Some people are more easily offended than others, it seems. Hence the "snowflakey-ness" remark which was meant to be a humorous jab. But, yes, a lot of jabs do get thrown in the forums.
PrettyPanther,
LMAO. The perfect comment like the perfect wine, sweet but with just enough acidity to bite the tongue.
