Ohio police applicants graded "on a curve"--How do you feel about it?

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  1. TamCor profile image80
    TamCorposted 12 years ago

    Dayton, Ohio is taking applications for new police officers, and so far, over 3000 people have applied.

    The city, along with organizations such as the Dayton Urban League, have been aggressively recruiting minority candidates since May as dozens of the city's most decorated and experienced officers are set to retire in 2011.

    The minority recruitment is also an effort to meet terms of a lawsuit settlement the DOJ filed against the city more than two years ago, claiming discriminatory hiring practices by the city for police and fire recruits.

    Besides spending more than $25,000 on recruitment, the city tossed out its previous civil service exam, spent nearly $550,000 settling terms of the lawsuit with the DOJ and has said exams could be graded on a curve.

    The DOJ continues to monitor the hiring process and, though officials said there is no target minority number, could halt the process if the city does not get a diverse pool of candidates to pass the exam.

    Candidates could be graded on a curve?  Wouldn't we want the best possible candidates to be police officers, not just the ones who fit into a minority group, be it race, sex, or religious choice.

    And I know that if I personally were TAKING the test, I'd want to be judged on my job qualifications, not the fact that I am a female.

    I'm really curious as to how others feel about this. 

    Here is the link to the full article:

    http://www.daytondailynews.com/news/day … dlh-090910

    1. Evan G Rogers profile image61
      Evan G Rogersposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      i vote to privatize the law enforcement.

      1. TamCor profile image80
        TamCorposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        Do you care to expand on that opinion?

        Come on, I know you can do it...smile

        1. Jeff Berndt profile image75
          Jeff Berndtposted 12 years agoin reply to this

          Oh, now you've done it! smile

      2. I am DB Cooper profile image65
        I am DB Cooperposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        Would that really help with the issue at hand? I'm having trouble envisioning a society with private law enforcement enforcing public laws. I mean, look how well private prisons have worked...

  2. Jeff Berndt profile image75
    Jeff Berndtposted 12 years ago

    In other news (old news) the NewHaven, Connecticut police department made the headlines about a decade ago for not hiring someone who scored too highly on his intelligence test.

    Speaking from memory only, I seem to recall their Chief of Police saying something like this:
    "Police work tends to be really boring. Guys who are too smart get dissatisfied and quit. I don't want to waste time and money training a guy who's going to get bored and quit in a year."

    This surprised me, because I thought investigating crime called for a certain level of intelligence. And I've known a few cops in my day; they aren't stupid people.

    1. TamCor profile image80
      TamCorposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      And this man got to be Police Chief? Unbelievable.  How many unsolved crimes does he have on the books, I wonder...

      WryLilt--When it comes to the police who protect our cities, I would think everyone would want the top of the class being the ones who are hired...

      1. WryLilt profile image89
        WryLiltposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        Yes but I'm sure even you know that not all people are created equal.

        Some smart ones go really well without trying.

        Some average ones try really hard but still can't achieve what they try for.

        1. TamCor profile image80
          TamCorposted 12 years agoin reply to this

          I understand what you are saying, but I still believe that the ones who DO achieve are the ones who should get the jobs, don't you?

          I mean, I confess to not being very knowledgeable about computer technology, although I try and learn the best I can.

          I'm sure someone would rather have a computer expert who knows his stuff tutoring them, over someone like me, who's has tried hard to understand, but still doesn't...smile

          I'm not saying to punish those who don't "make the grade", so to speak, I'm just suggesting it's not a good move to hire them when someone else does better on testing.

  3. WryLilt profile image89
    WryLiltposted 12 years ago

    Schools mark on the bell curve.

    It would look bad if everyone got similar marks. It's a system that means the best gets the best mark and so on down. That means if you have ten genius' at the top of the class, if all the rest of the kids are just 'very smart', they'll have to get lower marks.

  4. Tom Cornett profile image82
    Tom Cornettposted 12 years ago

    The as usual...halfassed DOJ is wasting (some)applicants hope,time, energy and money. It is supposedly unjust to discriminate....but only against minorities.

    Sooo...if they insist on continuing this practice..they need to come up with the exact numbers instead of enforcing their vague ideas of meeting judicial guide lines.

    Such as: 100 jobs are available.
    You must hire:

    30 African Americans 1/2 must be female.
    30 Latin Americans   1/2 must be female
    10 Middle Eastern Americans 1/2 must be female
    10 Asian Americans  1/2 must be female
    10 Native Americans  1/2 must be female
    10 Caucasian Americans 1/2 must be female

    Then....at least...people would have an idea about their chances of being hired.  As the jobs are filled...it should be published on line.

    1. TamCor profile image80
      TamCorposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Good idea, Tom--think they'd do it?

      1. Tom Cornett profile image82
        Tom Cornettposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        Probably not...the Department of Justice...I doubt has the capability of making competent legal decisions...most of them probably got their jobs through political favor.

    2. Jeff Berndt profile image75
      Jeff Berndtposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      "It is supposedly unjust to discriminate....but only against minorities."

      Smart people are a minority. Haven't you noticed?

      1. TamCor profile image80
        TamCorposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        When it comes to things like this, I have to agree with you, Jeff! smile

      2. Tom Cornett profile image82
        Tom Cornettposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        I have noticed that.  smile

  5. profile image0
    sandra rinckposted 12 years ago

    So if they are all under average, and they were graded on a curve, then... bad idea, bad!

  6. habee profile image94
    habeeposted 12 years ago

    I think the practice is unfair. I'll give you another example. Several years ago, I taught a high school senior named Lynn. She was black and was super smart. She wanted to get into journalism. She went to college for a while and then decided to apply for the college's journalism school. One weekend, she drove home and came up to the high school to see me. Man, was she mad! She found out that she'd get extra points on the entrance exam just because she was black! No other minorities got this help - just African Americans. She said it was a slap in the face to her - like she needed extra points to do as well on the exam as whites, Hispanics, Asians, etc. "I don't WANT their help, nor do I NEED it!"

    And I'm sure she didn't. As I said, she was very intelligent and was a great writer.

    I've been the victim of reverse discrimination. I taught at a preschool for underprivileged students. The director, an African American female, got fired. They asked me to fill in as director until a new one could be found. I did a great job for two months, until they hired another AA female. At the time, I had two years of college in education, had worked as a para pro with an elementary teacher, and had preschool children of my own. The woman they hired had never attended college, had no kids of her own, and had never had a job working with children. They begged me to stay on as an instructor, but I didn't. The new director lasted only a few weeks. Then they wanted to hire me to fill the job, but I had already started back to college to finish my teaching degree.

    I know minorities have suffered a lot of discrimination, but I think there should be some way to screen applicants for jobs in a way that the employer can't tell if you're black, white, young, old, fat, thin, attractive, ugly, Christian, Muslim, atheist, etc. Why couldn't a job interview be done via computer?

    Sorry I got carried away! lol

    1. profile image0
      EmpressFelicityposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I totally agree with you, Habee.  When you think about it, reverse discrimination of any sort is extremely patronising to the minority being "helped".  Effectively it's saying "you're not talented/bright enough to get this job solely on your own merits, so here is a boost up the ladder.  Oh, and when you get the job, everyone will say behind your back, 'She only got that job because she's black', regardless of how well you acquit yourself once you're actually in post."

      Reverse discrimination is the invention of guilt-obsessed middle class left wing luvvies who don't understand the concept of "unintended consequences".

      1. TamCor profile image80
        TamCorposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        I couldn't agree with you more, Empress... smile

    2. TamCor profile image80
      TamCorposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks, Habee--Your story is exactly what I was talking about at one point.  I would feel the same way as Lynn, if I'd been in that situation--it'd be like a slap in the face.

      It's ironic, what you said about job interviews being done via computer--Tom got his new job that way.  We saw the job online, applied online, he got interviewed over the phone, then the next thing he knew, he was hired. 

      He didn't meet anyone until he went in his first day for an orientation-type meeting.

      I'm so sorry about what happened to you, that's so unfair, too... sad

      1. habee profile image94
        habeeposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        My situation turned out for the best! It prompted me to finish my English ed/teaching degree.

        1. TamCor profile image80
          TamCorposted 12 years agoin reply to this

          Well, I'm really glad to hear that! smile

          Isn't it odd, though--it seems most people are against this kind of action, but it's keeps being done?

          I am really surprised that someone didn't come on here defending it, but I'm glad to see so many that didn't!


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