Does Obama Want To Destroy America?

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   mikelongposted 13 years ago

   I provided you with many sources Lady...including one from Fox News....
   
   You are becoming more ridiculous by the second...

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   mikelongposted 13 years ago

   No other responses Lady?
   
   Did you read the Fox News article I mentioned?
   
   Any real thoughts?

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   Jim Hunterposted 13 years ago

   "Does Obama Want To Destroy America?"
   
   Maybe.

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   Mighty Momposted 13 years ago

   Finally. A fully defensible argument!

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   mikelongposted 13 years ago

   Well said...
   
   Lady has a pattern of making empty claims...... 
   
   Have you read the articles I posted in this thread yet Lady?

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      Jillian Barclayposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks, Mike!
      
      But I am waiting to get blasted! Just get so tired of the empty rhetoric...

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   mikelongposted 13 years ago

   And I'd be lying if I said you were an informed and logical person...  As for your caring...I care not..
   
   
   Lady....I am still waiting for the response to the links I left you...
   
   
   Are we ever going to get a real statement from you about anything of substance? 
   
   Is this not productive enough for you? 
   
   "Obama education?"<----  Nonsense...
   
   Keep living in your Platonian Cave of Shadows....  Lady and Billy are too busy staring at a blank wall in darkness to come out into the light and view reality...
   
   Too bad for them...

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      BillyDRitchieposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      That's right I forgot, only the liberal mind is the enlightened mind.....silly me....

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         John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         t's certainly beginning to look like that if you and LaLo are anything to judge by!

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   mikelongposted 13 years ago

   Keep living in the world of glittering generalities.....
   
   What folly it is to follow down your path...

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      BillyDRitchieposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Keep living in the world of personal attacks....it proves beyond all doubt that you in fact, have very little in the way of argument.....

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         John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         What's the matter? Are we impinging on your personal space?
         I see no shortage of personal attacks from you and your alter-ego, Lady Love, in fact that's one whose whole purpose is to make personal attacks.

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            BillyDRitchieposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Perhaps you'd be so kind as to point me to one of these personal attacks I'm apparently so famous for?

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               John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Remind me, who said
               
               "That's right I forgot, only the liberal mind is the enlightened mind.....silly me...."

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                  BillyDRitchieposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  You're upset because I called a liberal a liberal?  Alrighty, then.....

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                     John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     You can't deny it's a personal attack! Oh I suppose you can.

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                        BillyDRitchieposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        Um, yes, I can.  If that is your idea of a personal affront, you're gonna get your feelings hurt quite often.....

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                     lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     Lol! Awww don't pick on Johnny...he's a sensitive boy!

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                        John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        Hey Lady, it's not me constantly accusing me of making personal attacks!

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                           BillyDRitchieposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                           Constantly?   I wasn't aware one time constituted constantly...
                           
                           And why do liberals always run from the word "liberal".  You guys keep saying it's a dirty word....we never said that....it's merely a word that identifies an ideology.
                           
                           Or does that make too much sense?

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                              John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                              Well, as I've said to Lady Love countless times I aint a liberal, I'm a socialist. I may have some liberal tendencies but no liberal ideology.
                              For you and Lady Love to keep referring to me as a liberal in spite of this is akin to accusing Obama of being a Muslim and trying to destroy America.
                              I'm not offended by being called a liberal but I find it typical of a certain element of the right who insist on mislabelling and demonising.

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                              John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                              Er, my post was addressed to Lady Love and she does constantly resort to personal attacks and name calling.

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            lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

            What personal attack??? You can't be upset wig me bc I called you a liberal?? Why is it that liberals never like to admit it... why do they consider the lable to be an insult? Can it be sub consciousnessly they know liberalism is evil?

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               John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               There you go! Thanks for helping me make my point.

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   mikelongposted 13 years ago

   "That's right I forgot, only the liberal mind is the enlightened mind.....silly me...."
   
   
   Here is just one of the types of personal attack that the likes of LL and Billy use...
   
   First, the use of the word "liberal" as a slur...like "wetback" or "fool"... 
   
   The connotation of "liberal" being un-American or anti-American or "threat to America" is synonymous with "wetback"...another term to stereotype a population as not being American...and as a foreign threat..
   
   Flightkeeper put forward an interesting thread in the political forums directly relating "liberals" to idiocy....  This same idea is shown in Billy's above quoted line, in numerous other remarks of his, as well as throughout every aspect of what Lady Love has communiciated in this and other threads...
   
   It is beyond just the word itself....but how the user is construing it...
   
   Didn't we take communication courses in school?
   
   Again...Billy and Lady Love are two peas in a pod of hate and hypocrisy...
   
   I respond in kind to what I receive...
   
   Lady, your personal attack against me that I am somehow forwarding deluded "liberal" ideas has been met, and I am still awaiting your response to the links I left behind for you...
   
   Your ongoing inability to answer to my comments display far more than your words..
   
   Keep hiding from reality...

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      John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Quite Mike. I couldn't be bothered, they don't listen.

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      lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Why is it only liberals can claim that word is a slur? It is nothing but a description for those that follow a certain political ideology. Any claim that is tan insult is manufacturered in the mind of an individual outside of reality. The term "wetback" comes from a term used to describe illegal immigrants from Mexico that crossed into the USA via the Rio Grand,  it also is the name of an operation by the government to roundr up and deport them. It can't even be compared to liberal.

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         John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         So evil liberal as an insult is just a figment of peoples imagination and your insistence on calling everybody who disagrees a liberal is meaningless!

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            lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

            I never called you evil! Liberals individually are harmless... its collectively that liberals become a force for evil.

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               John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Oh dear!About seven hours ago you wrote-
               
               " I don't know if I will ever change anyone's mind but I will continue to speak mine and to share the truth that liberalism is morally wrong, destructive and evil, and must be stopped!"

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                  Jillian Barclayposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  John,
                  Save your breath! LL is not interested in what you say, she is only interested in her own responses, and Mike, same thing applies. Save your knowledge for people that are actually interested in learning. LL is not!
                  
                  And LL,
                  In your reply to someone suggesting that you should move to Somalia after you suggested that he move to Cuba, you stated, "I may do that if I can't purge the liberals from our country!" See page 2 of the previous forum titled "Will the new healthcare policy personally help you?"
                  
                  Also from page 2 of the same forum, you stated, "We have to do something to get the cancer of oppression out of America... of course i'm hoping it can be done through education and the ballot box, but you can't rule anything out!"
                  
                  You have already stated that you want all liberals purged from this country. Is that part of the Constitution that you say you hold so dear? If it isn't, maybe you should work on having an amendment passed that would purge all the liberals?
                  
                  The cancer of oppression that you need to also remove from America could be covered in an additional amendment.
                  
                  You will never 'educate' anyone because that is not your motive. Everytime that you speak, I am firmly convinced it is because you think you are clever, witty and far more intelligent than anyone who argues with you or disagrees with your opinions. You do call people names and you are intolerant.
                  
                  I am a liberal and proud of the label! I do not care if you disagree with my opinions and it is not my mission in life to shut you up, educate you or even purge you from this country, which, by the way, is my country, also. I suggest you learn to live with it.
                  
                  I would also suggest that the best response to you and your clever statements would be to ignore you and the outlandish things you say. I will be doing that from now on because that will be the most effective method of dealing with your constant need for attention.

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                     lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     Sorry but in your examples I didn't call anyone names. I am a proud conservative and yes I believe this country would be better off without liberals yes I think liberals are the enemy... they hate freedom and are hypocritical... we see this everyday like today in WI. Its nothing personal individually liberals are fine the problems arise when they impose their beliefs on free people through force of government.

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      BillyDRitchieposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Dude, you're actually offended by being referred to as a liberal?  That is your idea of a personal attack?  Really?

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9. 62

   mikelongposted 13 years ago

   John, that is the unfortunate reality...
   
   It is easy for some, perhaps, to take them seriously within internet forums....
   
   I just wish we could have these conversations in person...  Once confronted with facts, LL and her ilk would just fall apart in front of everyone's eyes...
   
   The lack of anonymity, and the fact that they would have to respond immediately with off-the-cuff knowledge would easily move them to the fringe, where they belong..

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      John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Unfortunately she would behave in exactly the same way face to face, constantly denying that she'd said something or else just ignoring what she'd said and ignoring any challenge to it.

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         lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

         What nonsense! You constantly put words in my mouth and just make stuff up! Maybe its my NY accent? Lol

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            John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            One occasion when I've put words into your mouth please.
            
            Does your private health insurance cover you  for dementia?

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      lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

      You are the one on the fringe compared to the rest of America your kind amounts to about 25% of the electorate. Your sources too are mainly far left radical publications and hardly representative of any facts.

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         John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         So that's why you have a democratic president is it?
         Lots of hanging chads on his papers were there?

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    Your refusal to answer to a single point I made....which I referenced for you specifically Lady....that is yet another form of insult...
    
    To try to pass yourself off as at all credible or based off "facts" is a slur to those who actually do pass on real information...
    
    
    Why do "liberals" see this word used sometimes as a slur? 
    
    Because people like you turn it into one..
    
    I understand this delusion perfectly, for I also used to use this word in such a way... 
    
    I compare it to the use of the word Muslim...or even Mexican...  While a Muslim or Mexican would identify themselves as such, with no negative connotation...when someone demonizing either speak of them..."Barack Obama is a Muslim"....how does this characterization of Muslim differ from one held by a Muslim him or herself....
    
    The same goes for those who like to use "Mexican" to mean "less than American", or as a typification of backwardness or ignorance...
    
    If are incapable of understanding what I just explained Lady, that is one thing...  But if you can comprehend my statment here, and if you then choose to rebuff it, this then points to a far deeper problem within the construct of your personal character..
    
    I don't expect an actual response to this, just as my ongoing serious comments to you have gone obviously unheard...
    
    Again...did you read at least the link I shared from Fox News?
    
    Or will you keep ducking and dodging.... If so, the only person you're fooling is yourself...

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       lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

       You know what you have destroyed this thread... I don't agree with a single word you said and that has nothing to do with my character construction... you and john have turned what I hoped would be a serious debate into a childish contest of he said she said... repost your link or email it to me along with a cogent point and I'll respond but im done here now.

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          John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          You wanted a serious debate on Obama wanting to destroy America!
          Must be a first! Hint, if you want something to be taken seriously, treat it seriously and don't, while your at it, litter the forums with spurious accusations.

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    TheSeniorposted 13 years ago

    I really don't think the Pres wants to destroy America, however because he is a liberal his vision is way different from Mainstream America and the Founding Fathers.
    
    I don't feel that the Pres is a socialist per say, however I feel that he is enambored with society being equal and nobody going without.  In fact one of his speeches he said 'arn't you making enough money' then said this is America where you can make all you want.  This is a very telling fact from where he is thinking.
    
    He looks at Europe and wants that for America - this type of socialism - where supposedly no one wants, the truth of this is that in England the rules are soo lose that England is basically forced to do what they do And at a very high cost to the taxpayer, not only that but when the conservatives took over the debt from socialized guarantees for everyone was 19Billion in debt.
    
    Fortunitely since the Republicans took over the house his efforts have been 'halted' - the one thing about the Pres is that he sometimes has a good way with masking words and ya gotta listen carefully.
    
    I feel that the Pres has awakened us'ns to return this great nation to where it once stood - Europe has been weakened by what he proposed - It must not happen here.

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       DTR0005posted 13 years agoin reply to this

       The Senior,
       Respectfull, do you really believe we live in the same world as our Founding Fathers lived in? Can you see anything in 21 St Century America that remotely resembles the 18th Century? I know people like to talk a great deal about the intentions of the Founding Fathers, and that is fine - it's a great philosophical debate, but it holds limited relevancy in our lives today - they didn't live in the 21st Century and conversely we don't live in the 18th Century.  I am not saying we should toss the Constitution out the door, but it was not a document written by God. It was a document written by, well, radicals - people that thought outside-the-box for their time. These "radicals" weren't trying to take America back 200 years, they were trying to send it into an enlightened future.  And indeed people who today would be considered "progressive thinkers." The definition of conservatism is an adherence to traditional values, the status-quo. Change has traditionally been a four-letter word to conservatives. These people were about change for the good of the people - they were not men who drew comfort from the "status quo."
       But you see those who throw around the Constitution in every other sentence would likely have nothing but disgust for the radicalism of the Founding Fathers if they met them at a dinner party....
       And one more comment: because the president, as you stated, sees everyone as equal and believes no one should do without are we to assume that is "bad" thing?

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    Childish...
    
    You ask for proof regarding a serious claim that I made....and then your only responses are about "liberals" and ridiculous they are...
    
    Your entire post (at least your writings) have reflected childishness and an inability to debate at all...
    
    This thread was ruined the minute you started it...
    
    If you don't like my views, that is fine....  I have proofs that I have posted...
    
    If you choose to either ignore them that is your own problem.
    
    But when you then try to argue more you demonstrate that it is your own competitive streak (not trying to learn, just trying to play silly rhetorical games) that is showing itself..
    
    The hypocrisy continues...

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=77754
    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,134836,00.html
    
    Here's a chance to redeem yourself Lady, and show yourself to be "oh so serious".
    
    I will redirect our discussion to something productive...as you like it...
    
    You tried to make the claims that 1) the health care law is unconstitutional...which has not been determined by a longshot..
    
    You then made statement 2) that Obama should be legally prosecuted for the "crime" of signing an "unconstitutional" law into action...
    
    You ignored my serious and factual response that Federal courts have also found the law constitutional, and you were oblivious to the fact that 12 Federal courts refused to even hear the case based off a lack of substance....
    
    I then pointed out that, if one is really serious about legally prosecuting a president, President Bush is due for a subpoena and court date, along with Cheney, for their own very serious and real potential crimes against the nation, and humanity overall...
    
    You claimed my "liberal" mind was fabricating this information....and I started posting links....
    
    Will you read?  Will you seriously respond?
    
    Or will you do the typical thing....disappear...wait for my post to get buried, and then reappear as if you actually had something meaningful to say?
    
    Let us see who the real Lady Love is....

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       lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Mike, how am I supposed to respond? The links you posted have to do with Haliburton doing business with Iran in the 90s one source was a blog the sources indicated weren't confirmed and only concerned allegations. The Fox source was about a similar subject being raised in the debates by Edwards of all people!
       In your text you talked about health care... what does one have to do with the other??? Mike your thoughts are all over the place!

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    Where'd ya go Lady?

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    That may be, Billy...  But that is irrelevant..
    
    Lady likes to refer to some hubbers as "boys"... For some, being called a "boy" is a challenge to physically fight..
    
    If you are a person who makes personal attacks, you have no right to criticize others for the same thing..
    
    The fact that Lady and others complain about personal attacks shows their own sensitivity...

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       BillyDRitchieposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Again, perhaps you can point me to a personal attack that I have made.  Sorry, but referring to our liberal friends as liberal doesn't cut the mustard....

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          John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          Another tactic of the right is to constantly derail threads by banging on about irrelevances.

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             Evan G Rogersposted 13 years agoin reply to this

             perhaps it's just them defending their reputation against pointless insults?

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                BillyDRitchieposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                John, you made the accusation, pal.  Either back it up or back off.

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    mortimerjacksonposted 13 years ago

    Liberals don't seem to care much about facts. Countless research has shown that Obama really does want to destroy America. Why do you think defense spending has gone up so much recently? Obama is OBVIOUSLY building an army of mechanical spiders operated exclusively by Hitler, who he will raise from the dead via the Book of Necronomicon.
    
    Gosh you liberals are so egnoriant.

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    No...they don't...
    
    You have failed to read them..
    
    That is yet another type of insult that you use....insulting my intelligence...
    
    Read before you write....then perhaps we can talk substance...
    
    That was a ridiculous response..

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       lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Yours is a troubled mind.

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    "According to journalist Jason Leopold, sources at former Cheney company Halliburton allege that, as recently as January of 2005, Halliburton sold key components for a nuclear reactor to an Iranian oil development company. Leopold says his Halliburton sources have intimate knowledge of the business dealings of both Halliburton and Oriental Oil Kish, one of Iran’s largest private oil companies."
    
    From the article I posted:
    
    http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=77754
    
    It frightens me to think how well you read the voting books before you cast your ballot...

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       lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

       That's not an "article" its a blog produced by a professor with student helpers! The source is a journalist with " intimate knowledge" of dealings with an oil company that operates in Iran!  My God Mike!! On top if that it was written when 2004??  Obama said he doesn't want to re fight the battles of the last 2 years... well I don't want to revisit the BS of the last 15! I'm done! Get some help,  seriously!

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          John Holdenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          But it's ok for you to cite blogs as evidence! ROFLMAO

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    Lady,
    
    Your inability to read a news article written in plain English leads me to doubt your ability to read and understand a piece of legislation, like the healthcare law, let alone interpret the Commerce Clause of the Constitution...

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    I think the pot is trying to call the kettle black... Don't project your issues onto me...
    
    At least I can read an article...and I don't have to lie to cover my ignorance...
    
    And I love the personal attack, that you claim you don't make..
    
    Troubling indeed...
    
    I take it that this is the only way you can respond to the articles I posted?
    
    Is that all Lady?
    
    Is this how shallow you actually are?

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    Good.
    
    We are getting somewhere...
    
    Now, simply google Mr. Leopold, and read his article...not a blog...
    
    Then, google search the indictment brought forward in the U.S. Senate charging Dick Cheney with violating U.S. Sanction laws..I can't link it here because this computer I am using can't open a pdf file...
    
    However, I will link you to the google search page that has the link...
    
    http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy& … 2ef0af3d83
    
    Leopold is an experienced reporter, and he has his own publication. 
    
    Here are several links of diverse types that discuss what Leopold is mentioning:
    
    http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy& … 2ef0af3d83
    
    I listed more sources than just those two I posted a few minutes ago.. They are still here in this thread...page 7, I believe..
    
    Do you decide to read further, and explore other sources?
    
    Or do you quickly come to your own conclusion and then build walls around yourself?
    
    We shall see...
    
    By the way....we all write blogs here.... Speaking for myself, I do my research and post responsible and very informative articles...
    
    "Blog" does not take away from "factual" or "useful"...
    
    But, when you live in the world of epithets, "blog", "liberal", and other words become corrupted...

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    "well I don't want to revisit the BS of the last 15! I'm done! Get some help!"<----Lady Love
    
    What we are witnessing here is cognative dissonance...
    
    She is showing us that "learning" is not something that she corresponds to "knowing."
    
    When confronted with challenging views, if she cannot berate them into silence she decides to bury her head in the sand...
    
    Very good traits and characteristics needed in a democracy...
    
    Again, I will reiterate the original claim I made to you Lady...  We live in a nation of laws, where precedent plays a huge role concerning how the society runs...
    
    If we are unwilling to set a real precedent, especially faced with the gross amount of potential illegality and conflict of interest exercised by the Bush administration, how do you (Lady) ever expect to hold a future president responsible for his/her wrongs?
    
    You are willing to press for indictment of Obama, who hasn't done anything as of yet, but will let the "water flow under the bridge" for Bush/Cheney...
    
    Again, your hypocrisy knows no bounds...this is what is destroying America...

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    Mighty Momposted 13 years ago

    Thank you, DTR0005, for reminding us of the historical context of the Founding Fathers and Constitution. You said exactly what I've been thinking.
    In their wildest radical idealist dreams, the FFs could NEVER have envisioned the world we live in today. Not even remotely close.
    We can't turn the calendar back to 1776. I don't really get this movement of people who think we can.
    
    As for Obama, yes, he does see all Americans as equal. He does believe that no one should go without the basics that are guaranteed under the Constitution.
    Does he believe everyone should make the same amount of money?
    NO! He does believe in, and supports business, too.
    Just to be clear....

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       lady_love158posted 13 years agoin reply to this

       What basics are guaranteed under the constitution and where in the constitution does it assigh the federal government to provide anything to the people other than what's listed in article 1 section 8?

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    mikelongposted 13 years ago

    Billie...."negro" is just a word...and its meaning is based on how it is used.. The word "bitch" does not always infer insult.  I can think of many other less controversial words that share this characteristic, and I am sure you have the skills to see all of this..
    
    The context clues behind the use of the word "liberal" is what is insulting..
    
    Keep playing semantics games...

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