Patriotism or Nationalism?

Jump to Last Post 1-6 of 6 discussions (6 posts)
  1. profile image0
    Justsilvieposted 7 years ago
    Reading a number of Hubs on politics here the word Patriotism is used heavily and this brings up the old question is it Patriotism or Nationalism? And Nationalism as defined by George Orwell?

    From Orwell's Notes on Nationalism

    By "nationalism" I mean first of all the habit of assuming that human beings can be classified like insects and that whole blocks of millions or tens of millions of people can be confidently labeled "good" or "bad." But secondly -- and this is much more important -- I mean the habit of identifying oneself with a single nation or other unit, placing it beyond good and evil and recognizing no other duty than that of advancing its interests. Nationalism is not to be confused with patriotism. Both words are normally used in so vague a way that any definition is liable to be challenged, but one must draw a distinction between them, since two different and even opposing ideas are involved. By "patriotism" I mean devotion to a particular place and a particular way of life, which one believes to be the best in the world but has no wish to force on other people. Patriotism is of its nature defensive, both militarily and culturally. Nationalism, on the other hand, is inseparable from the desire for power. The abiding purpose of every nationalist is to secure more power and more prestige, not for himself but for the nation or other unit in which he has chosen to sink his own individuality.

    Worth reading in its entirety:

    Can we please keep the dialogue respectful! Beating each other over the head just gives us both a headache.

  2. ThoughtSandwiches profile image82
    ThoughtSandwichesposted 7 years ago

    Hi Silvie...Excellent distinction between two, generally, "gauzy" type terms.  You are correct in accessing the dialogue as fairly vitriolic in the political science halls of Hubsville.

    Typically, by the time I have reviewed "Posting 93" (or whatever) I feel somewhat battered.  It's sad and I wonder if I am getting a Déjà vue thing from 1859...I hope not.

    I have this hearing issue...actually...I think everyone else as a speaking issue...but I will bow to the doc's news...its me...i digress...the condition makes it hard to differentiate individual threads against a loud background??  ( way to describe it) ...anyway...the political forums...that's much the same effect.

    I primarily decided to post this ThoughtSandwich because I'm curious to find out how many folks will be against "respectable dialogue".  OK...nice meeting you, good thoughts, good presentation.  I will now sit in the back with my notebook and watch how it goes.

    PS...the link appears broken.

  3. mortimerjackson profile image57
    mortimerjacksonposted 7 years ago

    Patriotism and nationalism are of identical sentiments. Nationalism is just a more extreme classification of patriotism.

    Consider that patriotism is defined as "love for your country." Love for your country comparative to what? Love already implies a sense of preferential treatment of a certain nation over others. It's simply a matter of extent.

    Also, in this manner, "country" is an abstract idea. People associate different places and different ideas when espousing to their "country." Everyone has their own views of what makes their "country" great. As such, it is something of a Rorschach test akin to religion.

    In my eyes, patriotism and nationalism are both divisive ideas that people of the world simply should not have. Nationalistically speaking, why should one think better of their own country than they do about, say Canada? We are all citizens of humanity. Nations should not stand in the way of our respect towards one another.

  4. gustaw1981 profile image59
    gustaw1981posted 7 years ago

    You are saying about opposing ideas. Not really true to me. Patriotism is a natural and integral part of Nationalism. One helps keeping the personal identity, the other gives strength to unite people. We always live in a mix of both of these, plus many more other ideas.

  5. ThoughtSandwiches profile image82
    ThoughtSandwichesposted 7 years ago

    Hi gustaw...i would agree to characterize patriotism as the hand inside the velvet glove of nationalism.  I think that in cases when that "hand" is an iron fist inside that begin to see the ugly side of the nationalism. 

    An interesting historical parallel for this question is Stalin's response to Hitler's Operation Barbarossa...The idea of Party/State/Nationalism being a blend with PARTY first, was a bulwark of Stalin's social framework. 

    Under the pressure of the German Invasion...he didn't appeal to Party/State/Nationalism...he appealed to Russian Patriots to fight for "Mother Russia".  And yes...I realize "fight for the communist party" would have been a hard sell to a nation that had been brutalized by his (Stalin) every whim throughout the 1930s..

  6. profile image0
    Justsilvieposted 7 years ago

    I think for me what was an excellent example of the divide would be the Former Yugoslavia, Tito's enforced Nationalism kept the countries together. He MADE the people act as one folk and impressed on them they were better than anyone else in Eastern Block and people know you did it his way or else. (some really believed it and still do)

    I would say the mindset was in no way shape or form related to Patriotism at all and we know the outcome once his influence was gone.

    Some of the Hubs I have read show opinions that are running in the same direction.


This website uses cookies

As a user in the EEA, your approval is needed on a few things. To provide a better website experience, uses cookies (and other similar technologies) and may collect, process, and share personal data. Please choose which areas of our service you consent to our doing so.

For more information on managing or withdrawing consents and how we handle data, visit our Privacy Policy at:

Show Details
HubPages Device IDThis is used to identify particular browsers or devices when the access the service, and is used for security reasons.
LoginThis is necessary to sign in to the HubPages Service.
Google RecaptchaThis is used to prevent bots and spam. (Privacy Policy)
AkismetThis is used to detect comment spam. (Privacy Policy)
HubPages Google AnalyticsThis is used to provide data on traffic to our website, all personally identifyable data is anonymized. (Privacy Policy)
HubPages Traffic PixelThis is used to collect data on traffic to articles and other pages on our site. Unless you are signed in to a HubPages account, all personally identifiable information is anonymized.
Amazon Web ServicesThis is a cloud services platform that we used to host our service. (Privacy Policy)
CloudflareThis is a cloud CDN service that we use to efficiently deliver files required for our service to operate such as javascript, cascading style sheets, images, and videos. (Privacy Policy)
Google Hosted LibrariesJavascript software libraries such as jQuery are loaded at endpoints on the or domains, for performance and efficiency reasons. (Privacy Policy)
Google Custom SearchThis is feature allows you to search the site. (Privacy Policy)
Google MapsSome articles have Google Maps embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
Google ChartsThis is used to display charts and graphs on articles and the author center. (Privacy Policy)
Google AdSense Host APIThis service allows you to sign up for or associate a Google AdSense account with HubPages, so that you can earn money from ads on your articles. No data is shared unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Google YouTubeSome articles have YouTube videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
VimeoSome articles have Vimeo videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
PaypalThis is used for a registered author who enrolls in the HubPages Earnings program and requests to be paid via PayPal. No data is shared with Paypal unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook LoginYou can use this to streamline signing up for, or signing in to your Hubpages account. No data is shared with Facebook unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
MavenThis supports the Maven widget and search functionality. (Privacy Policy)
Google AdSenseThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Google DoubleClickGoogle provides ad serving technology and runs an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Index ExchangeThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
SovrnThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook AdsThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Unified Ad MarketplaceThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
AppNexusThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
OpenxThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Rubicon ProjectThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
TripleLiftThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Say MediaWe partner with Say Media to deliver ad campaigns on our sites. (Privacy Policy)
Remarketing PixelsWe may use remarketing pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to advertise the HubPages Service to people that have visited our sites.
Conversion Tracking PixelsWe may use conversion tracking pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to identify when an advertisement has successfully resulted in the desired action, such as signing up for the HubPages Service or publishing an article on the HubPages Service.
Author Google AnalyticsThis is used to provide traffic data and reports to the authors of articles on the HubPages Service. (Privacy Policy)
ComscoreComScore is a media measurement and analytics company providing marketing data and analytics to enterprises, media and advertising agencies, and publishers. Non-consent will result in ComScore only processing obfuscated personal data. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Tracking PixelSome articles display amazon products as part of the Amazon Affiliate program, this pixel provides traffic statistics for those products (Privacy Policy)