A friend of mine asked this question and I did not know the answer. He was reading a blog where the writer did not believe in heliocentrism--the widely accepted belief that the Earth orbits around the Sun instead of the other way around. He called this belief heretical. The person wrote:
"Look, people, even your Heliocentric hero Galileo recanted his idiotic notions about the Earth revolving around the Sun. If he’s your so-called reliable source on this, I think it does wonders to shatter the idea’s credibility that one of its main proponents backed away from it so abruptly."
So my question is: Is this a common Christian belief? Are there some particular Christians that believe the Sun orbits the Earth, but not most? Etcetera. Thank you for your comments.
I would be interested in knowing the answer to that as well. My mother grew up in a Southern Baptist family (her father was a preacher) and I spent my younger years going to a Southern Baptist church and this topic was never brought up. There was always plenty of controversy over evolution and things like that, but nothing regarding the planets and the sun and what revolves around what. My answer, if I needed to give one based on my personal experience, would be no. Very interesting!
I've run in a lot of Christian circles, from the very liberal to the very conservative. This is the first time I've heard of somone actually believing it. But, I wish I could say it surprised me.
When my astronomy teacher in High School explained the history of this question I asked him, "how do we know, now?" and he explained that mathematically, both views could be "proven". Then he explained Occam's Razor which said that since it was simpler to use the heliocentric computations, that would be the generally accepted method.
He then explained that in space, since everything was moving relative to everything else, anything could be considered the center. Using the sun as the center resulted in fewer calculations and easier to prove assumptions. (Thus Occam's Razor says "use the sun as the center") He then said that the "accepted science" of Galileo's day was not as far off as we normally think, but it was far more complicated than strictly necessary.
From what I understand, transcripts of records at the time show that the opposition to a heliocentic view was far more political than truly religious.
Well, you might want to do a little research. Much as I respect your opinions - you know nothing of science or history or religion, and your opinion is of no value whatsoever. Come back when you have done a little reading..........
Politics vs religion? Not the same at all........
This was what I was specificaly refering to:
http://www.galilean-library.org/manuscr … stid=43823
Specifically "Meanwhile, political events were overtaking all other aspects to the affair."
So, thank you so much for your suggestion, reading is always both fun and profitable. However, this was something I had already read.
Politics and relgion at the time were nearly insperable as each tried to use the other. So, in clarification, it was for political, more than theolgical reasons, that church officals chose to persecute Gallleo, as shown by the above reading.
You, of course, are free to argue that it is a semantic difference, as that is your normal fall back position .
No it's not a common Christian belief. But I did read a site a couple of years ago that was trying to prove this with very technical language. I tried to fumble through it but to tell you the truth I was lost about the second paragraph.
I can only speak for myself, but I believe that we (Earth) are the ones who are moving. All of the people in our homeschool group teach this. I am telling you that part because you asked about the Christian outlook. There are about 300 families in our group. Does that help any?
Are you the one who told me to watch 'Jesus Camp'?
Thanks for your response, Allshookup. I just thought that if there was a faction of Christians that believed in geocentrism (sun moves around the earth) as opposed to heliocentrism (earth moves around the sun) that some people on Hubpages would be aware of it.
As for "Jesus camp," I have mentioned it, but I can't imagine it was directed at you (since you would already be aware of such things.)
Well, there's a Flat Earth Society, so it only makes sense that there'd be a geocentric society too.
That said, like ASU, I attended a homeschool group back in the day that was 99.9% fundamentalist Christian (my family was the 0.1%) and I didn't know anybody who believed it in that group either.
Evolution is another matter, of course. We got Dinotopia through the Scholastic Book Club program the group organized (SBC is one of the things you miss most about public school once you start homeschooling), and the woman handing it out stared at my mom for a minute and said, "I don't believe in dinosaurs."
People are really masters at twisting actual reality to fit their preconceived notions of what reality should be.
Thanks, Kerry G, for that link. Very interesting. It does seem like that belief is a rarity though. Love the Dinosaur story!
Hi, Pam! How's your tucas? I hope you're feeling better!
Well it has been awhile since the church accepted that the earth moves and is not the center of the universe. The church only recently accepted evolution and it will take a time to filter down to the troops
LOL! The tucas is doing a little better each day. Thanks for asking.
Yeah, Christoph, that's because the church tortured Galileo to recant, frankly, which proves nothing except how evil and tyrannical they can be.
And yep, the Catholic church just accepted evolution a while ago. It takes time to filter down to the outliers.
I don't believe it and I am Christian sounds a little odd to me.
The Catholic Church is synonymous with political persecution throughout a long history. Birth control, ie, has only been recently accepted because of their beliefs, basically, concerning women.
Cannot separate the political from the organizational--leading to the personal for some, even to this day.
Having sat on the State Board for a major US demoniation, I have to agree 100%
It does appear that it might be the fundie Catholics rather than the fundie Protestants who are more inclined to this particular delusion: http://catholicintl.com/products/books/gwwprint.htm
I wonder if Mel Gibson thinks the Earth is the center of the universe?
Ooof! I'm so ashamed... I prefer to think of Catholicism (having grown up Catholic) as something of a cultural affiliation, lol, as many Jews view their Jewishness--since we've all been through certain trials & traditions (haha) and things, etc.--rather than any belief system.
Who the heck knows WHAT Mel Gibson thinks? Star train wreck, lol!
Technically, using Relativity, it is perfectly acceptable to assume that the Earth stands still and that the Universe revolves around it. It looks like the Catholic Church discovered relativity hundreds of years before Einstein.
Even more chillingly, according to Relativity, the entire cosmos revolves around my house. What are the chances of that? Maybe that will push the value up a little and we can have a little blue plaque proclaiming that my house is at the centre of the Universe.
I strongly suspect that they give out Ph.D's as a free gift in the bottom of cereal packets nowadays.
PS ASU - Hope it is nothing majorly serious
Back from the doctors.
Just so you know, we do believe in dinosaurs. Also, since we are not Catholic, we will not be accepting evolution. We believe in creationism, that wont change. Which, I'm sure you knew. Last night I saw that the movie was coming on and I thought "That's the one Christoph talked about", so I watched it. I had never seen it. I don't think you told your take on the movie. My take is that, unlike many believe, we don't believe that women are called to be pastors, preachers, etc. That men are the only ones called. We get that from the verse that tells that one of the requirements is that the man is to be the husband of one wife. A female can't be that. I know people who believe that women are called and I don't have a problem with them believing that. I lose no respect for them believing that. In fact, one of my best friends believes that women are called into the ministry. It's all good. It's not something that is a big deal to fuss about to me. Also, I didn't think that the radio dj was very smart. He didn't seem to understand the meaning of the seperation of church and state. He felt it was that it meant that the church is supposed to stay out of politics, which is wrong. It says that the government is not to tell us how we can worship. Besides that, nothing really stood out to me. I thought it was a good thing that parents took the time to teach their children about God, abortion, satan, hell, etc. I feel if more parents took more responsiblity in their children's lives, it would help this old world so much. I also believe we would not have crowded prisons. Thanks for the heads up about wathcing it. I'm glad I did.
What sort of creationism do you believe in exactly?
An old earth creationism that involved dinosaurs? Or were they wiped out in the flood?
"He felt it was that it meant that the church is supposed to stay out of politics, which is wrong. It says that the government is not to tell us how we can worship." Hope all ok at the Doc. The church is supposed to stay out of politics. For instance the Pope tried to and maybe did help decide who should be the US president. Catholics are not suppose to vote for anyone 'woman's right to choose'. And for this they don't have to pay taxes to the government like everyone else. Haven't heard of the government telling people how to worship. Maybe I missed something.
Thanks for asking about my dr apt. My blood work came back bad, but at least that explains why I am hurting so much. I don't like that people tell their congregation who to vote for or not to vote for. It's not for them do to that. To preach Biblical values, yes. To tell them what to do once in a voting booth, no. Our pastors don't tell us who to vote for. I feel like the reason you haven't heard the government telling people how they can worship is because of the law that tells them not to. I hope it stays that way.
"PS ASU - Hope it is nothing majorly serious"
I once thought I was the center of the universe. Major fun really, at least for me.
Thank you for asking. Very sweet of you. I have a 2 foot blood clot in my stomach and left leg. I have 2 stints inside the clot. My blood gets too thick sometimes, despite me being on a large dose of Coumadin. Last summer, it got thick and that made the stints clot off. My blood was thick today. When it's too thick, my leg, stomach, and side hurts where the stints and clot are. It also causes my heart to beat very hard to pump when it's thick like this. I sorta knew something was wrong by the way I felt before I went. I got a shot of blood thinner into my stomach and he increased my Coumadin dosage. I'll feel better within the next 72 hours. I really appreciate you caring. Thanks!
Hopefully the medicine will work!
Thank you. It will. It usually takes about 3 days to get me back where I should be. The thinness of my blood, that is. Thanks so much again
Heard about a guy that had thick blood all his life. He gave blood as a blood donor once a month to thin it down. Probably not a good idea. Have you tried to find a forum on the net of people with a same problem. People with experience can often be helpful.
I am a member of several boards and groups. I am the youngest one on all of them. I have had this problem since Sept 7, 1999. I was 29 years old when it happened. I worte about it in a hub concerning Vitamin K, hoping that my story might be of some help to someone. I am also a councelor for one of my doctors to help people who is starting out on it. I try to help with diet, meds, when to have their blood checked, etc. The giving of blood doesn't help me. That is something they have tried with me. I have been sent to several states and many doctors over the past 9 years. They all say the same thing. I will have a shortened life due to this. When my blood is thick like it is now, the clot grows. It's getting close to some of my vital organs now. It's up to my bellybutton in my vena cava. There's no way to do surgery do to what all has gone on inside my body. Since I haven't gone through menopause yet, my blood is very fickle. I have to have it checked every 48 hours. Most people have it checked once or twice a month. Mine changes on me very fast. I have a machine now to where I can check it here at home. I was fortunate enough to be one of the first people in the US to have this machine. But, since my stints are not close enough to my heart as my insurance says they should be, they don't pay for the medical supplies for me to do it. We try to keep them here, but lately, it's not been possible. It costs me $12, out of our pocket, every time I check it here at home. So, I have to go to town to the doctor to have it done right now since I don't have the money to buy more supplies. But, it's only a 20 minute drive to town. So, it's all good. It really does help to have people to talk to about things like this that are serious that you are going through. And, if I can help someone, that makes me feel good, too. My uncle had a heart attack and is now on Coumadin. So, I was able to help him a lot. He's a sweetheart. It has disbaled me. I guess that goes without saying. I can't stay on my feet long at all without a lot of swelling and pain. A few Novembers ago, the clot grew really fast while my blood was thick. I ended up in a hospital. They planned to take my leg off at my hip because my leg was dying. Thankfully, they put in experimental stints and it opened the clot up enough that they didn't have to. It was a VERY scary time for us. I know that that may be something I may have to go though at some point in my life. But, I'm able to be up now, and I can drive now. I went 6 years without being able to drive. So, right now, I feel blessed to be able to do what I can do. That's why I am able to be on here so much. I can't work any longer. But, I get to spend more time with my family and help with my grandmother, etc. I really do appreciate your advice. It's excellent advice. Like I said, if anyone would like to read about all of this, it's in a hub about Vitamin K. It's listed on my profile page. Thanks for caring.
Sounds like you are very knowledgeable about your problem. But since I must continue to try to be helpful, the only thing I could suggest then, is some kind of Chinese medicine herbs, which has been around for thousands of years. Maybe there is something there somewhere.
Countrywomen just emailed me a link to a site like that and I'm looking at it right now. I have 2 doctors appointments in Memphis next Monday. I hope to learn some things about that type of medicine and herbs so I can present them with that info or at least the site address so they can look at it. They are very open to options for me since they don't feel they can do anyting. I go to a chiropractor. It's helps with my headaches. The Coumadin is somehow not allowing my spinal fluid to drain properly and that puts pressure on my brain and my eyes, causing headaches. Getting adjusted helps. He also does accupressure on me, and that's great! I was shocked that a medical doctor would suggest other kinds of healing. I'm thankful I have open-minded doctors. I would love to be off of so many meds. I have a galllon-size zip lock bag full of meds I take daily. I am willing to try anything to help my condition. My goal is to live to be a grandmother one day. Again, great advice, thank you!!!!
Dear, I have been on Warfarin since Christmas 2000. I have a Coumadin Clinic that monitors my blood. A Coumadin Nurse/Specialist knows more about this than the Doctors. You must stay away from herbs, certain foods like green leafy vegetables and certain other things that affect your own systems ability to control the affects of Coumidan.
Please listen to your physician not holistic healing, that can be quite dangerous to us. Don't even drink green tea!
May God bless you with healing powers and Godspeed for recovery. Of course He did give us Physicians to help us. He Himself was given medicine while on the cross, but refused it.
I also have plenty of medicine to take daily and these can affect the Coumadin results.
Best of luck
Where do you guys think up this stuff?
Don't trust holistic medicine. Don't trust doctors because a nurse knows better, but God gave you doctors. God himself refused medicine. God bless you with healing powers. Yet you are taking rat poison for your god-given affliction. LOL
It is no wonder you are all sick all the time. I think I would be sick if I had that much rubbish floating around in my head.
Welcome to hubpages. I only say these things because I love you
Nice to meet ya Mark. I take no offense at your words. I am thick skinned. You know how to make a person dig down deep and really think. I like that.
Holistic medicine is great. It's not for any person who is on a blood thinner, at least the menu part.
A Nurse in a Coumadin Clinic is a specialist, we have them in the Cleveland Clinic if you know who they are? Dr'. refer patients to them because it is a very tough problem getting the doses right with each patient, and the Nurses are trained in that field. I have learned a lot more from my Nurse than my Cardiologist on the subject.Yes it is a "rat poison" as you say, but it has saved many lives. Now ain't that an oxymoron? I know it's history.
My health problems have nothing to do with a blood thinner, I am not sick all the time. I only hope you never have to use it.
Did I say God afflicted me? I don't blame anyone for my afflictions, it just happened. I guess I'm a weak link in the 'evolutional' chain? I will soon be extinct.;-)
I am just winding you up. I know you Scotch Irish drinkers enjoy that
Although, I understood you guys believe everything is given from god. No?
The real question is whether you have bred or not before you go extinct.......
I get thick blood in the heat of summer - the doctor prescribed two shots of whisky every day. That is the best prescription ever
Not anywhere as serious as your problem, so I hope that your research finds something. The Chinese know many things, so maybe Knol is onto something. Good luck with the search for relieving the problem. Will read the Vitamin K Hub.
That's so sweet. Thank you. Yes, I like herbs. I'd love to find one to help me out. I'm reading now. I put it in my favs. I never have heard of the whisky thing, I will ask them about it Monday. I'm really curious to find that out. I knew that alcohol thins blood, but I don't know how they measure it. I have to keep my INR between 3.0 and 4.0 to keep the clot from growing. Like I said, I will try anything that might help me. Herbs are good for so many things. I'm anxious to see what I can find out about them. Thanks again for the good wishes!
Don't know what I am looking for here but just thought I would see if there was anything out there on google:
https://www.tcmassistant.com/symptoms/m … blood.html
I will check out all of those sites. Thank you so much!!! I really appreciate you taking the time to look those up!!!
Nothing to it. The trick is to find the right key words, and the order to put them in.
These sites are great!! I am definately showing my doctor the second site since I still have endo. I went in for surgery to get it burned out, but then the doctor cut my vena cava and I bled to death and was dead for 8 mintues. So, getting me back was the priority, not the endo. So, I still have it. That site may be of great help to me. Also, on the 3rd site, there's a herb on there for blood clots. I wonder how it works and if I were to take it, would it cause part of the clot to break off and go to one of my organs or it if makes them just dissolve. I'm gonna research this and get her to see what my doctor can find out about it too. In Memphis, I'm sure there are places up there where I could get my hands on herbs like this. Down here, we don't have that type of store. Good stuff. Thanks!
chinese medine+thick blood
chinese herbs+thick blood
thick blood+herbs ..... or chinese herbs
chinese herbs+name of disease.... and other way round
chinese medicine+name of disease.... and other way round
blood clots+herbs+chinese medicine
etc. everything you can think of..
See, I'd put something like.....what chinese herbs help with blood
For some reason, I usually type in a whole question. Thanks for the tips!
Almost forgot that I wrote this request hub
http://hubpages.com/hub/Which-food-help … c-patients
There my be some info in there for you - I hear that they do some good olive oil in California. You want the extra virgin green stuff with bits floating in it.
There is also the world famous Taygetos Mountain Tea:
http://www.davidstea.com/herbal-tea/her … n-tea.html
Now is not the best time of year, but if you remind me in the spring, I will pick you some and send it across!
Anyway, very late here, so off to bed.
I'll go check out those sites right now. Thank you so much!
Just picked an herb at random here, for more examples when you find a medicine to check out.
Qin Lian Si Wu Tang
Qin Lian Si Wu Tang+uses
Qin Lian Si Wu Tang+side affects
Qin Lian Si Wu Tang+blood treatment
Qin Lian Si Wu Tang+results
Qin Lian Si Wu Tang+the disease name
the disease name+Qin Lian Si Wu Tang
I'll do it! Thanks so much!!!
Thank you for the concern. We don't have any Coumadin nurses here. The doctor that is my 'Coumadin doctor' is an Oncologist. She's great though. She's the one who helped me be eligable to have the machine at my house. I know that everything I eat or drink effects my blood. Something I quickly learned after getting the clot. I really appreciate the post to me and all of the things you told me. I haven't been a fan of green tea. Please know that I understand what you are saying about God and what He can do. I have faith in Him. If not for Him, I would have stayed dead 9 years ago. He's Who is keeping me alive right now!
Vey true its God who decides when we die. In India its called prana or cosmic force which is what keeps us alive.
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