Florida pastor Terry Jones, who inflamed Muslims by once burning the Qur'an, says he has been denied permission to enter Canada to attend a Thursday evening speaking engagement in Toronto.
"I think to ban you from a country…I think there has to be more serious charges," he said. "I think you have to be a criminal or pose some type of threat to national security."
He obviously knows nothing beyond his own country. Canada has laws against hate speech. If my memory serves correctly Canada stop Ann Coulter from speaking as well.
What do you think?
canuck here...i don't have a problem with Canada not allowing someone into my country who promotes hate....the canadian border agency did not confirm his statement..and they don't have to....it's not like the guy is important as far as i'm concerned; just another nutbar that we don't need...however, the border agency does enforce legislation relevant to human rights violations.
They should keep those two idiots out of the US as well!
Thank goodness, we don't need people like him stirring up his hate.
i have no problem with him or ann coming here. speech is only words and if some people like what these people have to say, so be it. i , personally hate the thought of the muslim religion growing in Canada but i don't try to stop people from trying to make it look like a "nice, loving" religion. if we open our eyes , we will know what is true and what isn't.i don't need the goverment deciding what i hear.
My mama always said. If you don't got nothing nice to say don't say nothing at all.
Searching for the truth is impossible without free speech- a quote from someone
I think Canada doesn't want anyone to have a thought that they can't control.
Thoughts are okay. You see thoughts are inside your head. Gathering to spread hatred against another group is something different.
Oh goody, in Canada its ok to have thoughts as long as you keep them to yourself. oppressive much?
I find the claim to actually having thoughts in their head to be dubious, considering.
Considering what? That you don't agree with his way of thinking? I'll stay in the U.S. where freedom is a good thing.
You are misunderstanding what I am saying, I believe. Some on this thread are advocating censorship/abridging free speech/expression and said they are allowed to keep their thoughts in their head and I said I doubted that they did in fact have any rational thoughts in their head - because they are advocating censorship which is pure ignorance in my opinion.
But here is a good example of how important free speech is- you didn't understand what I was saying and I clarified it.
A little government regulation can sometimes be a good thing. For example the Canadian banks did not suffer at all throughout the credit crunch. The government protected us against the greed that resulted in bailouts. As a result many Canadians purchased American homes and Condo's at rock bottom prices. I personally know three people who bought a bunch of American property for next to nothing. And I thank the Canadian government from keeping this nut out.
So you are proud that you were able to purchase rock bottom American homes that more than likely were American families that lost their homes? And then talk about the greed of others?
I am starting to agree with your government that it needs to be your thought police.
Would you like a list of all the people who have been banned from entering the US? Got a few hours?
We have our own hate-mongers here already, we don't need one from the US .
I see it as no different to blocking anyone who will not be a positive contribution to the country. Enetering another country is a privilege based on being a useful or at least harmless visitor. Not a right. And you will find that Imams with similar aggressive points of view have been blocked too.
Great point. Boarder guards are constantly taking guns away from Americans crossing the boarder. There are signs everywhere are one is about to cross that no guns are allowed. When the guard asks "do you have any guns" they reply "no" and then the guards finds the guns and asks why they lied. The typical answer is "but I need it for hunting" or "if you take that gun where can I buy a new one". What they fail to understand is that it is a criminal offence and they can be charged. It's a privilege to enter another country, not a right.
Perhaps, Canada has already exceeded it's quota of nutbars.
That's actually funny, Canada has laws against hate speech, and they still support religions. Quite the hypocrisy.
I think he is being denied his civil rights. Just like he has been maligned in his own Country because of his exercising his freedom. Even by members of our Government. The man is not a criminal for burning a Koran, nor for any of his public actions to date. But indeed America has allowed radical speech, direct "hate speech", to be presented on our streets and on our television sets from people who want Israel "wiped off the map" and people who hate Christianity, etc.
If Canada won't let him in, then they shouldn't let several people in, namely people who've spouted hatred like she hopes Rush Limbaugh gets kidney failure etc., and anyone who's vocal about hating Israel, and anyone who's vocal about hating Christianity, AND anyone who's vocal about killing unborn babies, etc. The list can go on and on. It can even include President Obama, since he has made several statements that incite racial tension, religious tension, etc. So go ahead, Canada, and ban Barack Obama from there too! Amen. I don't have a problem if they choose to make things fair all around. (But hey I WAS kinda hoping they'd take him off our hands, maybe give him a place outta the way somewhere where he can't instigate carp again like he did by blaming a youtube video on the deaths of our American Ambassador and others! ) Somebody needs to take the reins of power from him before he totally ruins this Nation. But instead they wanna focus on accusing U.S. citizens of "hate speech". It would be hilarious if it wasn't so wicked.
You think that Terry Jones was denied his civil rights because he wasn't allowed to enter another country? So you think an American has the right civil right to go into any other country? That's really funny.
Correct, Canada does prevent hate speech from all kinds of people. Normally they are not denied entry but in this case Terry Jones was not allowed because of previous peace bond infraction in the U.S. as well as an incident relating to a disputed honorary doctorate in Germany to keep him out.
But thanks the laugh. Denied civil rights because he can't enter Canada.
Hmm. So you deliberately left out those "little" facts and made your post sound like Canada was denying him entry because he burned Korans and spoke against a specific religion?
It is you, then, who has simply made a thread to try to bait people. Your original post doesn't match the actual facts. For shame. If you wanted to know how many people think a man should be banned from entering a Country on the grounds of "hate speech", then you could've simply asked that question. Trust me, you would've still gotten the same responses, and you could've saved face for yourself.
Get it together, please, Rad Man, before you author a thread that is apparently meant only to elicit a vehicle for your own sarcasm.
It's rather obvious that he was denied because of his planned hate speech, they even questioned him on it. The found a few excuses to deny him. Canadian's were afraid he would stay.
Civil rights, that still makes me laugh.
So, now you're saying he WAS denied because of so-called "hate speech". Make up your mind, wouldja?
He was denied because he's had some legal issues, but most likely they didn't want him in. I think I was consistent you just didn't read all the posts.
Now can you explain this civil rights issue to me. Did you say every American has the civil right to enter any country they like?
What I said in effect was that any person who is denied the rights to enter a Country because of being accused of "hate speech" for speaking against an anti-Christian religion and/or for burning a book that belongs to them personally, is being falsely accused and being denied basic civil rights, yes, that should be common in all Countries. Of course, some Countries don't have basic civil rights, I suppose. But indeed I would've thought that Canada would have. Very disappointing IF that's the reason he was denied entry. However, if there was some other legitimate reason for his barring, then okay. You made it sound like he was denied entry because he exercised his freedom of speech in America. That is not right, if that's why he was denied.
How can I be more clear than that?
And....why should I even be, since you're so unclear in your posts?
And now I'll ask you a question-------
If you agree that Canada can deny anyone the right to enter simply because they "don't want them"......do you also believe that America should be able to refuse entry into our Country if we simply don't "want them" here? I'm almost willing to bet you'll say that would be discrimination.
Of course America does employ the same tactic. Every time I enter the states I'm questioned as to what I'm doing in the states and how long I'll be and what I have with me. It's common sense that if I'll be up to no good, America has the right to deny access to me. I as a Canadian do not have a civil right to enter another Country. That's a ridiculous notion. The civil rights granted to Canadians is very similar to civil rights granted to Americans, but I can't ask the U.S. to grant me American civil rights. I can't claim it's my civil right to have guns in Canada. Don't you see how ridiculous your claim is?
Islam is not an anti-Christian religion. It's just another religion. Do you think Christianity is an anti-Islam religion? They are simply two religions.
Yes, I do think Islam is an anti-Christian religion. Christianity is not just a religion, because it is about Christ, who was God in the flesh and who is inseparable from the Father. Christianity is not necessarily anti-Islam because it is not meant to be on the offense; it simply is about Christ and has the right to that claim; whereas Islam itself makes false claims about Christ, thereby attempting to put Christians on the defensive; it makes a point of trying to demote Christ to the level of "just a prophet" of the stature of Muhammad. We Christians know that Christ is not "just a prophet". He was God in the flesh, is the Creator (read the book of John, and I can provide other Scriptural references); He is inseparable from the Father. The Trinity is comprised of Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, three manifestations in one Being, all inseparable from each other, only with distinct manifestations.
It is indeed tiresome and offensive to have to listen to Islamists say that Jesus was simply a man, with no more power than Muhammad. Yet I wouldn't try to take away your rights to say that, since that is what you (I assume?) believe. However, to say that Islam isn't anti-Christian would, I believe, be false.
Because Islam is about Muhammad, is it not? Therefore, it is NOT about Jesus.
We Christians do not try to place Muhammad in some category that he doesn't belong in.
Islam, however, does try to place Jesus in a category that He doesn't belong in, a category that denies His divinity and His sacrifice. So yes, we have every reason to view Islam as an anti-Christian religion.
Especially when people decide to pose insinuations like Islam is probably gonna overtake Christianity and therefore Christ will be part of Islam, etc.
If Ishmael's descendants wanted to be Christians and claim Christ in any capacity, they would've taken hold of the writings that Christ inspired (the Torah, and the New Testament), not a totally separate writing like the Koran.
You know nothing of what I believe. I can tell you this, from an Islam standpoint (and I'm not a Muslim so if I'm wrong a Muslim can clarify) Christians deny Mohammad as a prophet. Christians have to deny Mohammad as a prophet because if they admitted Mohammad is a prophet they would have to except his claim the Jesus was only a prophet. So the two Religions equally oppose each other. Then we bring in the jews who say Jesus was just a man. Are they anti-Christian as well? If you think all other religions are supposed to agree with you about Jesus or they are anti-Christians then the other religions can claim the same because you are denying there faith.
I won't deny that Christianity and Islam are opposed to each other. However, like I said, it is Islam that comes out on the offensive.
As far as Judaism, that has something that Islam doesn't have----belief in the Old Testament. Among other points, I think. And God named them (the Jews of those times) His people and promised to always draw them back toward Him. But indeed the Bible also says that not all who are of Israel are Israel, so today (and perhaps even then) being "Jewish" doesn't guarantee a person a place in Heaven. Because the New Testament tells us and them that we must accept Christ as our Savior in order to go to Heaven; and it also tells us that the old rituals and animal sacrifices aren't what saves us. Only faith in Christ saves anyone.
Islam, as far as I know, does not believe the Old Testament. Now, exactly when where and how that religion originated I'm not sure; but I've heard that it's based on the story of Ishmael in the Bible. Perhaps you could confirm that for me, I dunno.
Judaism, like Christianity, maintains that God chose Isaac and descendants, not Ishmael, to be His heir.
But if it was based on that originally, then it would be informative to find out exactly when and where it veered off onto a totally different tangent. Ishmael and his mother did indeed hear from God. But that side of the bloodline was never chosen by God to become the ancestors of Jesus; Isaac's side was. I can only figure that jealousy caused them to veer off onto a mission of looking for other prophets besides the Old Testament prophets that God had chosen. Ergo, they latched onto Muhammad.
Yes, we Christians don't necessarily deny that Muhammad was a prophet; we just know that he was a false prophet because he didn't claim to hear from the God of the Old Testament; instead, they call God "Allah", which, even if it were to be a valid variation of the word "God", it doesn't fit the Old Testament where God revealed so much about Himself. Instead, they instituted the Koran, an entirely different writing than the Old Testament and a more modern book, even, than the Old Testament, by some person who declared himself a prophet without even following the Old Testament prophets, entirely separate from the Judeo-Christian belief in the Holy Bible.
Hey, I could be totally wrong about it originating from some sort of following of Ishmael!
Which, in that case, Islam was apparently invented by some guy named Muhammad and/or his followers, and just came into being from that source, having nothing to do with any Biblical reference at all. Either way, it does not adhere to the God of the Bible, and therefore is totally opposed to Christianity and Judaism both.
Jews have the chance to accept Christ.
But so do Islamists.
Just as everyone does.
But no one can do that until and unless they entertain the notion (the fact) that Jesus Christ was God in the flesh and died for their sins, rose again, and is still the only way to Heaven.
People have the right to deny my Christian Faith if they wish.
And I have the right to deny their faith in..........whoever or whatever their faith might be in.
You mean denying his right to deny others their civil rights?
You mean his freedom to tell others what to believe, or else?
What if he burned a bible, instead?
He can burn as man Bibles as he wants as long as they belong to him. Heck, I don't care how many men burn their books as long as they belong to them and not to someone else! I bet there are a lot of Hustlers and Playboys and witchcraft books that could use a match set to them! ha. But indeed that would be the personal choice of those individuals.
Now, what I DO take exception to is incidents like when our American soldiers were commanded by their leaders to burn Bibles. That wasn't right at all.
I guess you missed why he was banned when I posted it earlier
"It was confirmed Thursday afternoon that the Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) barred Jones from entering Canada. One of the reasons was Jones was fined in Germany for using his doctorate in theology to identify himself as “Dr.” Pastor Terry Jones. The other reason was he broke a peace bond in Dearborn, Michigan in 2010."
The protest went on without him.
That is pure evil. What a sick and sad world we live in. I am sure, they don't prevent many muslims from coming in, that have done much worse, or do they deny the guy that put a Jesus on a crucifix in urine, from coming in?
Be careful people, that you don't unknowingly support true evil, at its core. Free speech IS a human right. Who determines what is hateful, and what is not? Does no one care anymore, that they refute their own points, when they are inconsistent, and illogical, or turning a blind eye to even "bigger" and truer hate that takes lives? This kind of thing is incredibly alarming to me.
Ann Coulter and people like her, may not be liked, but is she wrong? Or is SHE so hated, and "dangerous" because she IS so often right?
My number one concern for America and the world currently, is that people are struggling with the reality of situations. They don't seem to care about truth, and reality. In the mean time, we continue to lose freedoms, and in like this example, in an effort to stop hate, we are embracing actual hate even more. Think about that, oh...the irony.
Muslim hate speech has been prevented in Canada as well, so has the KKK. Yes, Ann Coulter is wrong. Losing freedom? Really? What about the freedom to not be bullied? Yes we can prevent an American coming in and spreading hatred, that is our freedom. Canada has the right to say who enters Canada, just as America does when Canadians enter America. America decides who enters just as Canada decides who enters Canada.
Ann Coulter had one speech cancelled by a university. She was allowed in the country. I believe Terry Jones has been charged with a crime has he not?
I had to laugh when environmentalist David Suzuki was refused entry into the US to speak a few years ago.
Yes they cowardly hide behind terms like "hate speech" when in fact they hate free speech.
You're free to speak as long as you are not spreading hatred against a particular person or group. CBSA cited a previous peace bond infraction in the U.S. as well as an incident relating to a disputed honorary doctorate in Germany to keep him out. If Canada had let this nut in he would have proceeded directly to event to speak to the "Canadians united against terror" event at the lawn of the Ontario legislature. He wasn't stopped because of his speech, but because of he peace bond infraction in the U.S.
What if any good would have come from his speech?
I have a good idea at one end of the field well have this guy spouting of about muslims being terrorists and at the other end well have muslims spouting off about the burning the Quran.
Um, what has blocking someone because of their faith got to do with blocking this guy because of his *behavior*. Completely false parallel. Christians can come and go as they like, idiots can't.
In short, any nation has the right to deny access to whomever they choose, whether it's Canada or the U.S. Strangely enough, though, Canada and the U.S. are the only ones who ever have to defend themselves when they choose not to allow someone into the country because the person is a hate monger or has a fairly serious criminal past or is trying to sell out national security secrets. Why is that?
I have no problem with this man being denied entry into Canada. I also have no problem with anyone who entered my country illegally (for reasons other than political asylum) being asked to leave.
North America is home to millions. We ALL have a right to decide who may and may not enter our homes, regardless of the reasons.
Your home?? When did it become your home? You robbed North America from the Natives! Value truth. You can't judge who should stay or enter, other than using force. The land doesn't really belong to you. In the real sense, you are immigrants there.
It became my home right after we robbed it...any other questions?
Interesting perspective... Just pray that we remain the last gang of robbers over here.
There is always somebody bigger and stronger, maybe Britain will give it another shot?
Those Brits have become all-feminine in their character. Look for the Chinese and Indians. If they shake hands with Russia, then good luck for the Godfathers!
I don't know anyone who robbed any land from anyone. You can't blame todays European Canadian for something that happened hundreds of years ago. As far as I can tell the land is shared.
Yes, sharing is finally becoming a reality with FN's and gov't, somewhat least it's improved and hopefully improve more once current leadership is gone. OT, I don't see anything wrong with Canada upholding 'standards' to protect their citizens which yes, includes Muslims. US also has the same rights of refusing entry to Canadians. Hate speech is a crime and enforced when necessary. I had to laugh but was delighted to see Canadians stand up and face off with a attempted parade of KKK who literally got chased away, we like our US neighbors and especially those with great conduct.
Good for Canada!
With all this push for greater states' rights, maybe we'll see a day when he'll be stuck in Florida unable to leave because no other state in the union will grant him access either.
Serves him right.
Hmm. I've heard a few Canadians say some hateful things about Americans in general. We haven't sent them home. Sounds as if Canada doesn't really understand the concept of free speech. That's OK, there appears to be a lot of that going around.
We understand free speech very well thank you. It's different when you are already here.
Unlike you, I have a life
Here is a quick one:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_pe … ted_States
Different when you are there? Is free speech different for Canadians? Only Canadians get to voice opinions that come off as irritating to certain groups? That explains a lot, actually.
That's right only Americans understand free speech are are allowed to deny entry into their country.
It was confirmed Thursday afternoon that the Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) barred Jones from entering Canada. One of the reasons was Jones was fined in Germany for using his doctorate in theology to identify himself as “Dr.” Pastor Terry Jones. The other reason was he broke a peace bond in Dearborn, Michigan in 2010.
Read more: http://digitaljournal.com/article/334699#ixzz296LLXuqP
I don't know how this guy became a Pastor and those who follow him are lunatics like him. He shouldn't be allowed in any country. No religion is bad, religion brings peace to society we live in and all religions should be respected.
by Holle Abee 8 years ago
Is burning the Qur'an even legal, according to the Constitution? Is it covered under the 1st Amendment?The SCOTUS ruled 5-4 that burning a cross is not covered by the 1st Amendment. Sandra Day O'Connor wrote the majority opinion.Isn't burning the Qur'an a similar action?
by The Frog Prince 6 years ago
Does the burning of a Koran deserve and apology while the burning of the Bible deserves none?There are people getting killed over that very question. Which deserves an apology?
by paarsurrey 8 years ago
Hi friendsThe Florida Church should not burn Quran; it is no service to humanityhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiMFHVqG-eYQuran/Islam/Muhammad are pro-life and do not support the fanatics and Terrorists; they serve humanity and are peaceful.ThanksI am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
by S.P. Kelly 3 years ago
Does the Qur'an, openly or 'between the lines', incite violence from it's followers?If interpretation is going to be your answer, then I ask how do groups with no connections to each other, on different continents, receive the same message of violence?
by Dave 6 years ago
Is burning the Koran any more insulting or offensive as certain other countries burning the Stars and Stripes or the Union jack and effigies of our democratically elected leaders?
by andrew savage 5 years ago
Can someone who has studied Islamic literature/scripture explain that killing people for having different religious view is not okay in the Quran?
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