In his just recently published book titled "The Proof of Heaven", Dr. Eben Alexander related a detailed narrative of his NDE(Near Death Experience). Dr Alexander is a neurosurgeon, who was afflicted with a most unusual and quite severe form of E.Coli meningitis that rapidly knocked out the bio-chemical functioning of his brain, more specifically the cortical region that is responsible for conciousness. He was made rapidly comatose by the severe infection, and was mostly sustained medically by antibiotics and life support technologies that now run rampant in any ICU setting. During the 7 days that he was comatose while under the 24 hrs/day close monitoring in the ICU, he had a NDE, which he described in clear/vivid detail in his book.
In the book he clearly delineated the fact that before his NDE, he, as a neuro-scientist did not give much credence to the reality of an afterlife, the existence of heaven and spirirtual entities. After he revovered from his illness ( a recovery that was so medically unexpected considering the severity of the meningitis) he spent quite a bit of introspection on what his NDE meant in the context of his intimate knowledge of neuro-anatomy, physiology and pathology. He now concludes that there should not be any separation between science and spirituality, and that whatever artificial separation between the two that has been erected by man's ego, should be erased, if man has to move forward in his final destiny of fully understanding and trully unraveling the truth and the mysteries of existence vis a vis the universe and the divine.
Does he have a book for sale by any chance? Still - it works both ways - this woman followed his lead and nearly died trying to recreate the experience. Sadly - it was just another religious delusion.
A devout Christian woman turns atheist after spending 30 days in a coma. “I was promised butterflies and big pink fluffy clouds by my neuroscientists,” says the woman, “All the scientists and doctors I had spoken to in the past guaranteed that I would experience heaven if I went into a deep enough coma. Turns out they were lying. I may sue.”
I think you are misusing the word "reality."
Do you wear a seat belt by any chance?
Your response is typical of what I usually encounter, on a daily basis I might add, from people whose idea of a lucid, luminous, and levitating conversation, just does not measure up to the importance of the topic at hand. Which is not entirely surprising, coming as it does from someone whose sense of self-importance is matched only by his epistemological delusions.
Pretty sure that as often as you posit nonsense - you are going to find plenty of people telling you that it is nonsense. What is so important about one person's delusion exactly?
Your self righteous indignation is unwarranted - and I might add - the reason your religion causes so many conflicts.
I certainly find no distinct importance to your delusions, but when it comes to discussing issues that some people might find interesting and important, it is really a good idea to leave your delusions and reflexive knee-jerk response by the door. You might find that experience liberating and exhilirating.
Why must you attack me so? I have no delusions. I am not the one thinks there is a place with pink fluffy clouds where you go when you are dead.
The wiseguy selling the book proving heaven is real.
He says he entered a 'place of clouds - big, puffy and pink-white,' filled with butterflies and angel-like creatures that were 'simply different from anything I have known on this planet. They were more advanced. Higher forms.'
sounds like San Fran on Gay Pride weekend...
The clouds in Heaven are mostly white and lavender...
with the exception of the lowest ones, which are more rosé. due to the flames rising up from the roasting of the disbelievers and the French in Hell
it's complete and utter nonsense and i honestly think you realize this. trying to prove a myth is like trying to walk in space naked, you can only try but you will fail.
Of course his experience does not constitute proof of heaven, or even evidence of heaven (as proof is generally saved for mathematics or logic).
Evidence is when Nancy, from Nightmare on Elm Street, brings Freddy's hat from the dream world back with her. Now she has evidence that Freddy is more than a figment of her imagination and that if the hat can pass back and forth so can Freddy.
Did this neurosurgeon bring any evidence back with him? NOPE. The only thing that's changed is his mind because that's where his experience happened. Oh but he claims that it couldn't have happened in his brain, and because of his authority as a neurosurgeon we're all supposed to just accept that and move on. What's more likely, that he's mistaken and this is just another NDE, or that he really did go to Heaven and come back?
You are too wedded to the physical amd material. You might want to spend a few hours a day trying to conceptualize non-material possiblities... then maybe, you would not be too-judgemental that Dr. Alexander did not bring back from his NDE, any material proof that heaven exist.
I like his conclusion. Thanks for sharing.
I am happy for you that someone of Dr. Alexander's stature as a materialist neuro-scientist would now give credence to the existence of a big part of your HubPages monicker.
Anyway, do you really believe that afterlife, or something like that, exists? Do you have any explanation how this interacts with the physical world?
Belief in the afterlife is either conceptual and experiential....conceptual to those who believe in the existence of the human soul.....experiential to those who, like Dr Eben Alexander, went thru a NDE.
My personal interpretation of the events narrated by Dr. Alexander during his NDE, is that since his brain function was totally wiped out during those 7 days or so that he was comatose, his brain couild not have been the source of the consciousness that made him so vividly experience the events that he narrated in his book. It could only mean that another source of consciousness was operating at that time... a source that was not
in any way dependent on the functioning of the part of his cerebral cortex responsible for human consciousness.
I can only conjecture as to how that other consciousness may or could interact with the physical world. Dr. Alexander I'm sure have thought a lot about it, and even he has not quite gotten to a fuller explanation.
Quick correction - this man is a neuro surgeon - not a neuro scientist. He cuts bits out of people and has no skills as a scientist - neuro or otherwise.
Hilarious. A coma is described as an injury to either the cerebral cortex or the brainstem. If the cerebral cortex is injured, this will affect ones perception and the relay of sensory input and indirectly, all the neurological functions.
You might want to read his book before you dismiss it as just another "your run-of-the-mill" NDE. Since, it seems from your response, you know so much about brain function, you might want to have the debate with Dr. Eben Alexander. I'm sure he's going to give you quite a rumbunctious debate on that specific topic.
LOL. Understanding what constitutes a coma is minor. Accepting the perceptions of one who had a "severe form of E.Coli meningitis that rapidly knocked out the bio-chemical functioning of his brain" is ridiculous considering the patients brain has been injured, causing hallucinations.
it pains me no end to watch someone whose empirical knowledge of brain anatomy and physiology, is as negligible as his knowledge of the various ramifications of its pathology.
It's laughable to watch those who desperately believe anything that will support their faith.
What is not laughable is the verity and gravity of the issues raised by Dr. Alexander's book. What is inexplicable and unconscionable is the reflexive knee-jerk response of those whose belief system is so totally tethered to the purely physical and material that they may have sight but are blind, may have hearing but are deaf, may be touched but are numb to the endless possibilities of the non-physical, non-material realities.
Verity? Gravity? Knee Jerk? We just find it so very funny when people who claim that faith is all they need clutch at these straws. Especially when this one had been done to death already.
The above poster show succinctly the fatuousness of atheism... a non-belief system that emanated from nothing, and is going fast to nothingness....and just like T.Rex to extinction as well.
Since nothing sustains you except the supreme and inexhaustible belief in yourself, then I suppose you and the other folks who adores in the altar of narcissus could go on dancing in that delusional millieu.
Little wonder your religion causes so many wars.
How proud you are.
Mark, you really are a one trick pony. You beat this line to death even when it makes no sense whatsoever. I see you use it all the time. Someone disagrees with you or expresses a point that makes you look bad and your response is to pretend to know what their exact religious beliefs are, and blame wars on it. I can only conclude that being the troll you are, you hope insulting and blaming bad things on good people you will offend them enough to get a rise out of them which perhaps you can exploit to perpetuate your delusion. But of course, I am sure to you, my comment is just a further proof of why my "religion causes so many wars."
Yup - dragging up a dead thread to berate me because you are too lazy to read the masses of other information I have provided is a good example of why your religion causes so much ill will.
Thanks for validating my opinion.
"...masses of other information I have provided..." is a factoid if stated by someone else, but coming from you... is total fiction. Reading your so-called masses of information is like going thru a grocery list, full of snippy-snappy items that does nothing to add girth to the discussion. Sorry MK, I think your narcissism has gotten the better of you... again, and again, and again, and again.
Which leads me to the question: When is it ever going to end?
It will never end. All you time you guys spout the self righteous nonsense - I will call you on it.
In the mean while - here is some reading for ya if you don't think I have had anything to say other than point out how much conflict your religion causes:
http://mark-knowles.hubpages.com/hub/cr … -evolution
http://thaumaturgical.com/a-big-list-of … charities/
Oh I've read your threads on HubPages, but am I so throughly impressed that I should now call you the grand wizard of Atheism and other such non-sensical non-belief systems?. Nah...As my 3 year old grandaughter would say:...'in your dreams."
What you are MK is a huge echochamber of the truly gifted purveyors of atheism...Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins. And I say that with not a hint of trepidation.
Interesting comment considering the time stamps show my post was made right away in the active thread, responding to one of yours. No further comments until 11 days later when you revived it to say I drug up a dead thread to berate you. You are confused as usual Mark. It's no wonder your religion causes so much conflict.
Interesting that you did not bother reading the articles I posted. Little wonder you hide behind yet another avatar and persona. Did all the others get banned already?
You sure do a lot of assuming. Different personas? No, this is the only "persona" I have had with hub pages. Lots of folks feel the same way about how you interact in the forums, it's not the same person coming back under different personas just to antagonize you. I have heard you level this charge against several folks. I am sure they care as much as I do about the accusation. Whatever, Mark.
You also assume I haven't read your material. I have. Lots of good hubs on several topics. Might even try some of those recipes. Regarding this topic though, you are lock step with Dawkins, same old stuff. As for the article bashing creationists and promoting your religion, nothing compelling. Heard it all before. I reread it just now before posting, in case I missed something of substance, but I didn't. In fact you seemed proud of the fact that you weren't going to take the time to make the case for evolution beyond parroting the lines most evolutionists use, stating it is so obviously true and it has been "proven" so many times it doesn't need defending. Of course that is a paraphrase, but it is what a reader walks away from the article with. Confident arrogance and the party line, that's all.
Please don't misunderstand, I have no problem with you being zealous in your religious view, faithful to your doctrine, or even proudly promoting your preacher. What gets you all the negative comments from folks is that you come across arrogant, condescending and dismissive most of the time. You treat people like they are stupid and then take some parting shot about their religion being the cause of conflict, even when you really don't know that much about them or what they believe. So have I done the same with you sometimes? Sure I have. Hard not to when it seems to be what you relate to. Fire with fire and all that. Meeting people on their level, that sort of thing. I'm not proud of it and will try to do better, but if you continue to treat folks the way you do, you can expect more of it back from them. Probably from me too.
If I ever get around to trying any of those great looking recipes, however, I will be sure to leave positive feedback about them.
Ah - didn't bother reading the links I gave you huh? Not surprised - a lot of big words n stuff. Learning is hard - don't worry - lots of people take the easy option as you do. Goddunit and the pastor sed everlushun is a lie.
See Mr. Knowles, that is what I am talking about. That is exactly the reason your religion causes so many conflicts. lol
I would agree that I've not experienced the hallucinations induced by a coma.
There was this one time with tequila, however...
There is nothing desperate about being sustained by ones faith i.e the belief that there is more to life and existence than the purely physical and material.
I suppose if someone does not subscribe to the concept that the spiritual realm do touch us in some ways at some point of our material existence, then there is really no other course for that person than to be sustained by tequilla induced hallucinations and delusions.
Would think the hallucinations would be as different as people, but they tend to be quite in common.
"The Reality of Heaven"
Paradigmsearch discovers this thread...
"You never get sick. You never get old. You never die."
"You are never hungry. You always have shelter."
"No one tries to cheat you or hurt you."
"All is as it should be."
"Freedom to explore knowledge. Freedom to explore mind. Freedom to be as you wish to be."
"So why would anyone ever leave Heaven...?"
Is there anything irrationally wrong about humans, after spending their earthly existence and all that it entails, to aim for and dream about an existence that you just described?
My my, well I do know of an incident of a well known evangelist and his trip to heaven. You see, he could not speak about it to me for weeks without getting over emotional. fact is that he died and his body was in contractions as two of his state trooper sons were working at holding him in the bed. when he could talk about it he explained that he knew nothing of being in the bed and that his body was dying but he was on a craft of some knid with friends he knew from another state. They got to go in to heaven but he had to come back. well, he could not endure life here when he came back and prayed night and day for nearly a month till he was found dead. now here is the clich, when he did come back there were messages on his answering machine that was informing him that his friends in the other state had died when he did? All I can say is soon us so called religious fanatics or bad apples will be taken from this earth and then this planet will be filled with those living off their ideas and yes there will probably be people still going to so called churches looking for answers. I for one believe in the ressurection and the power of the Living Christ and will be in that number when the saints go marching in.
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