http://www.therightscoop.com/mother-of- … ahu-akbar/
I was shocked to hear that come out of a mother's mouth. I wonder if she taught her sons to wage Islamic Jihad against Boston, and if she will ever take any responsibility herself for what her sons did.......
I believe the News said she's actually got a charge of theft against her already, from years ago.
At the very least, she should be arrested for what she said in that audio/video; it's a statement of war against the U.S.
Don't you think she's as scary as her sons' actions? Maybe even moreso.
The Holy Prophet (Sallallaho Alayhi Wasallam) said, "Eat quince, for it sweetens the heart. For Allah has sent no prophet as His messenger without feeding him on the quince of Paradise ."
I guess the Quince doesn't fall far from the tree!
The article keeps referencing the Middle East. Weren't they Chechnyan? No video came up for me, so I can't comment on her comments, if she made them.
Yes, I think they're overseas.
She said she didn't if "they" kill her son, and she shouted that she WILL say "Allah Akubar"! (Dunno if I spelled that right....)
I was initially frustrated and frightened by violence we cannot fathom, so close to home. But there is a lot of violence we don't understand going on. Violent people will use any excuse for violence. I don't know what rationale the boys used, but religion is never the start. It is the crutch to support an emotional and psychological problem. From what I've read, the mother turned deep religion after her husband left. I know several women who turned to a hard interpretation of God when they found themselves abandoned by the one who had promised to faithfully love them.
From what I understand, these people immigrated from a war torn country. What emotional scars that left on the boys, coupled with abandonment by their father, is difficult to fathom. These three were probably easy prey for shady elements.
I honestly believe we need to stop looking at violence as a horrible result of other religions and other people's philosophies. Because the violence is not limited to religion. There is no excuse for violence but, after accepting this, we have to ferret out the reason. People aren't born evil. Circumstances lead them to commit heinous acts. Life leads them to say hateful things.
We are failing in our responsibility to our neighbors, in some way. I tend to believe our way of life is to blame. We are the children of children of affluence. We have certain expectations that must be met before we can begin to care about others. Everything we think is first funneled through, 'what's in it for me?' And we export this philosophy through our media.
Terrorists surround us. Boston, Aurora, Virginia Tech, Columbine, The World Trade Center. These are symptoms to a problem. We sit in shock. Someday, we'll have to stop thinking these are isolated instances completely unrelated. History has led us to this point. We are going to have to stop grasping at straws and face this head on before it changes. But, the good people of the world have to take an active role. In their communities, in their governments and even their places of worship. We aren't doing enough to help individuals feel as if they belong. We aren't giving others the attention they deserve at crucial turning points in their lives. How hatred builds long enough to collect arsenals, build bombs, justify wanton violence against large groups; without anyone being aware that something is terribly wrong should be a wake up call to all of us.
That's what happens when hateful religious people indoctrinate their children into their beliefs.
Study it well.
Well, apparently that's what happens, or can happen, when they're indoctrinated into the wrong beliefs, yes.
Hopefully, I can assume that you studied her tirade closely yourself.....
No, actually I didn't.
All tirades from those who blindly adhere to violent religious books look the same.
I sure am glad that Christianity doesn't have any violence in it's religious books.
Good thing we picked the right religion, huh Brenda... I'd hate for any religious extremists from the Christian religion to raise their kids to be hateful and do evil things just because of their twisted view of a book... right?
Melissa, I was pretty sure that your initial post was a thinly-veiled barb at me, my Christianity.
But I gave you the benefit of the doubt and deleted my first response.
But now my fear is confirmed.
So....in the interests of not distracting from the very timely and very important topic of this thread, and in the interests of not making this personal toward me (as you are often apt to do), would you be so kind as to drop your train of insinuations? Please? I really really do not want to wade through a bunch of personal attacks just to see others' input into this topic.
Why would you ever make the conclusion that I was speaking about our religion? How could you have made that leap?
And are you saying that my statements, which are completely in agreement with your initial posts, are somehow distracting?
I agree completely that the religious apple... or Quice doesn't fall far from the tree...
I am hurt that you view my agreeing with you completely as some sort of attack.
Uh, with all due respect here, I took it as a jab at sarcasm toward the posting and/or the person who posted. It appeared so.
Not sarcasm. I completely agree with her premise, which appears to be that the mother influenced her children to their detriment-and the world's detriment-because of a zealous religious belief.
If there is irony in there, I cannot be held responsible. Sarcasm? Not a bit.
Sarcasm would be ME disagreeing but saying I agree. That's on me. Since I really do agree... any irony comes from another source.
It's a valid insinuation. You suggested teaching Islam made the kids violent, she implied that teaching any religion in such a way has the same effect--there are plenty of examples.
Christianity certainly doesn't all into the category of right beliefs, considering the wars it's caused in the past and the hatred and bigotry is serves up today.
Any religion is a big factor in molding the values of the youth specially idealists. Coupled with deep psychological and emotional problems it is dangerous.
I have seen several times clips of the Mother's comments. She clearly has an agenda against the United States. There is far more to this family than we have discovered at the moment. Most Americans do not know enough about the culture of people around the world to gain a solid understanding of the deep emotional hatreds they share for each other and the United States. Having worked with people of many cultural backgrounds I was shocked to discover the great prejudice many of them have for one another. I have also observed that many of the same people who appear to hate the United States jump at the opportunity to move here. I wonder why that is so? I believe they know very well that our country offers the greatest standard of living and more opportunity than any other country in the world. In spite of these advantages, there are people who live by their hatred that is ingrained by centuries of life experiences that are reinforced to their children and passed on. I also believe that we should recognize that Islam is a religion that seeks to cover the world. Just as a mandate of Christianity is "Go ye into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature." Islam has identical goals but certain elements of the Islamic religion are radical and will do anything to accomplish their goals. As Americans, we are living in a bit of culture shock because none of us have lived in a country (America) that has been invaded by a Foreign enemy. By this I mean an enemy that controlled the entire country. Until we wake up and notice that our liberties are being lost, our principles are fading and our eyes no longer see the imminent danger to our way of life, we will continue to argue about left and right wing philosophy. The Roman Empire did not fall in one day. It was destroyed from the inside by decadence, moral failure and political infighting. May God help us all.
Yes, God help us all.
We can't say we weren't warned either. I recall several years ago that the News told of how a German commentator even could see that America was headed for decline because of the immoral laws it was enacting. If foreigners can see it, we should be even moreso able to see it. Not to mention how the Bible warns us, and the Christian community in general has been warning America as a whole for a long time...............
what do you expect they are muslimes. there are no muslimes that are peaceful . They may appear and act peaceful but when the call goes out they will answer , they will do what they are told or they will be killed too.
Any different from the slimy anti-United Nations useless right wing southern fundamentalist Christians?
Aside from a couple different names in their holy books, there's not one iota of difference.
Disappearinghead that sounds bitter. Are you acquainted with many right wing southern fundamentalist Christians; or are you basing your comment on news reports?
Yes, the people you describe are not setting off bombs all over the world.
Wow, I think I'll avoid your church...
I'm assuming that comment is based on what your profile states...
"I am not here to promote myself but to stand as a beacon of scriptural truth"
This has to be one of the most hypocritical threads to date.
Some specific posts may be hypocritical, but the thread isn't hypocritical.
There are people still in hospitals with missing limbs, some dead people including an 8-year-old boy, and a suspect and his mother who've shown absolutely no remorse to date for the terror and pain the victims are going through.
Very relevant topic and questions about a current event of major proportions.
Why would the mother show remorse?
She didn't plant the bombs.
All she did was raise them in her faith... and you have stated many times that that is what parents are required by God to do.
That's not the point at all, it is hypocritical for believers of one religion to criticize the believers of another religion, when both religions are guilty of atrocities and violent acts.
I have 4 really wonderful kids. I have taught them all about Jesus, about forgiveness, love and that God is in control. They have learned that things like the crusades were evil... ppl using God's name to do their own will. They have learned that terms like "republican" and "conservative" is a term that doesn't necessarily have anything to do with God, though some ppl like to hang that sign around their necks, increasing their chance to win elections. They have learned that "man of God" can be a meaningless term if the man in question isn't seeking after God.
*None of my children own guns, and if they want to banish them or own one, that will be up to them.
*They would never abort a child of their own, but they would love and care for a woman who had aborted her child b/c they have learned empathy.
*They drink at times, and have smoked, but didn't continue to smoke b/c they are intelligent.
*They know a great deal about other religions or lack there of and know that you cannot force your belief system on someone else.
*They have homosexual friends and family, some that they are close to and know God created and loves each and every one of us.
*They know we are all sinners and fall short of the glory of God, and that they as individuals are the chief amongst sinners.
*They know that children are a gift from God, as is family, as is a job, and a home... and all things good come from the Father of Light.
*They know that black, white, male, female, Jew, Gentile, rich, poor, we are all of equal value in God's eyes, and we were all found worth dying for.
I know there are all kinds of Christians in the world, b/c there are all kinds of ppl in the world. Speaking for my oldest two, they wouldn't hurt a soul if their lives depended on it, although if a child or someone weaker were in trouble, I think they would summon the strength to defend. I'm very proud of my sweet kids and I thought you should meet some actual Christians for yourselves. We aren't all sitting home watching Fox news, voting for Sara Palin and laughing at Rush Limbaugh jokes. Some of us come with flaws, and hurts and dreams and we aspire to be better than we were the day before. We're human, we have found that we fell short and that we were in need of a Savior. We are Christians not b/c of our superiority, but b/c of our lack. Jesus covered the gap between us and God. And that's what I am teaching my kids.
I watched the mother on the News again. Now she fluctuates between sorrowing for her sons to saying she believes it's all a hoax and her oldest is still alive, to accusing America of taking her sons from her!
Maybe I missed a part, but I also haven't seen her have any sympathy at all for other people's children like the victims of the bombings.
The first stage of grief according to Kubler Ross is denial. Stages are : denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance.
Yes, I guess that's right.
But there's something different about that mother's reactions, it seems to me.
And I thought that Muslim women weren't supposed to be so outspoken and the subject of public attention like she's allowed to do. Her husband (I assume it's her husband?)....just sits there while she talks on the phone to reporters and in interviews that are shown publicly...........
Why on earth did you think there were no outspoken Muslim women? That's like saying that traditional Christian women can not be outspoken.
She was added to the counterterror list according to CNN together with her son. CNN said that "U.S. authorities added both the mother and son to the Terrorist Identities Datamart Environment, or TIDE, database -- a collection of more than a half million names maintained by the National Counterterrorism Center -- an intelligence official said."
There is nothing wrong with being outspoken BTW.
Well, there ya go.
It's sad and horrifying (for everyone involved and for humanity as a whole) to know that they both slipped through those lines of defense.
No, there's nothing wrong with being outspoken.
There is, though, something wrong with such a high-profile and openly anti-America person who's a criminal suspect herself giving anti-American rants on American tv to the extent that the woman has been doing.
Then your problem is with the press. Pity about that whole freedom of speech thing, eh?
No, not unless the press's intent is to gain sympathy for an anti-American anti-Christian person. My problem is with her behavior. An attached problem is the pansy-wristed actions and words of the POTUS whose agenda has led the liberal charge to holler for tolerance and sympathy for terrorists.
I have nothing against freedom of speech for normal purposes. I have a lot against freedom for radical anti-American sentiment including Islamic propaganda.
The 1st Amendment states that government shall not sponsor any religion nor pass laws favoring one over another.
Doesn't say jack squat about protecting your poor hurt little feelings.
The First Amendment was made so that no particular Christian denomination or Christian group could take over. It wasn't about freedom for atheism, nor was it about free speech for anti-American nor anti-Christian religions.
I thought it was about free speech for everybody. I looked, it doesn't say free speech for Christians. That would be really weird since all of the signers weren't Christian.
People seem to do a double-take when they read this:
"I have found Christian dogma unintelligible. Early in life I absented myself from Christian assemblies." - Benjamin Franklin
"When I see throughout this book, called the Bible, a history of the grossest vices and a collection of the most paltry and contemptible tales and stories, I could not so dishonor my Creator by calling it by His name." - Thomas Paine
"I have never united myself to any church because I could not give assent to the long complicated statements of Christian doctrine and dogma which characterize their articles of belief and confession of faith. When any church will require only the Great Commandment (the Jewish Shema) for belief, then I will join that church." - Abraham Lincoln
"The Christian god can easily be pictured as virtually the same god as the many ancient gods of past civilizations. The Christian god is a three headed monster; cruel, vengeful and capricious. If one wishes to know more of this raging, three headed beast-like god, one only needs to look at the caliber of people who say they serve him. They are always of two classes: fools and hypocrites." - Thomas Jefferson
"Christianity is the most perverted system that ever shone on man." - also Thomas Jefferson
I could give you just as many quotes, or more, that show the exact opposite beliefs the Founding Fathers had. What you've posted is things that liberals must've searched tirelessly to find just so they could take them out of context and out of time.
Same as there've been so many textbooks and school curriculums that've been changed to give a liberal anti-Christian slant. Has no effect on my beliefs nor on my common sense. But might on more impressionable people, like, say............immature people and kids. No wonder that's the target of the anti-Christian activists; easy marks are kids especially.
how exactly do you reconcile saying: "What you've posted is things that liberals must've searched tirelessly to find just so they could take them out of context and out of time."
without managing to realize that it works the other way around - and all of us are equally right to say "what you could post are things that christian fundamentalists must've searched tirelessly to find just so they could take them out of context and out of time"? Just because any quotes you could find would agree with your assertions, so therefore they must be right?
Tell me, then, what CONTEXT this would have to be in for it to NOT say what it actually says: "The Christian god can easily be pictured as virtually the same god as the many ancient gods of past civilizations. The Christian god is a three headed monster; cruel, vengeful and capricious. If one wishes to know more of this raging, three headed beast-like god, one only needs to look at the caliber of people who say they serve him. They are always of two classes: fools and hypocrites." - Thomas Jefferson
How would ANYTHING make that positive for the beliefs of christianity?
Pffffft, who's Thomas Jefferson, anyway? I mean, it's not like he's the guy who wrote the Declaration of Independence or anything--oh wait...
Theistic rationalism and anti-clerical Christianity.
Both were wonderful theological philosophies that were quite popular at the time.
Show me proof that Jefferson even said that.
And even if Jefferson said it, it doesn't make Christianity look bad; it only makes Jefferson look bad.
And if you'd like to provide the reference to which writings of Jefferson's said that, and allow me to read those passages along with the context of the rest of the writing, I might be able to make a judgement about those lines. But as it stands, there's no reason to think Jefferson even said that!
Can you provide me with the entire body of the letter or written pages where you believe the quote came from?
And even if you do, there are other points of evidence that Jefferson actually did believe in Jesus and Christianity. Maybe he was of a specific doctrine that's in error about true Christianity? Who knows? Wikipedia says he had a problem with the particular Catholic Church at the time. That's not the only denomination that caters to wrong interpretations either. Several Christian denominations are in error on several things. And yep, some of them aren't really Christian; they just ride the coattails of true Christian denominations.
And indeed there are differing behaviors in people sometimes. I'm recalling how Bill Clinton upheld some laws that he didn't even agree with, but that he knew were right! It was only later when liberalism became popular in politics that he showed his true colors personally. His moral code had been hijacked and practically done away with, so he felt he no longer had to uphold to it.
So...........even if Jefferson said the things you say he did, that doesn't make the fact that the Founding Fathers over all based their writings and the Constitution on the belief in God, invalid. Humans usually make laws the right way, knowing it's needful, even if they personally struggle with adhering to those laws. Matter of fact, we all KNOW we're gonna struggle with keeping some laws. And that's precisely why we do make those laws; they're the guide by which we must keep even our own human temptations in check.
It's actually a little more ironic with Brenda.
I'm not a Christian, according to her.
All of the founders of the Constitution were Christian. According to her.
One of the founders of the constitution helped start the first church of my religion in the United States.
So, logically, either he wasn't a Christian or I am.
She hasn't ever quite gotten over that cognitive dissonance.
You're not "sayin' squat" about the feelings of the victims of the bombings. So your mockery of me is invalid and personally directed when it shouldn't be.
You should stick to the subject instead of trying to distract from the issue of relations between America and Muslim countries.
Zelkiiroposted 39 minutes ago in reply to this
The 1st Amendment states that government shall not sponsor any religion nor pass laws favoring one over another.
Below is what the First Amendment actually states.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
Congress shouldn't officially establish any religion, as in making it mandated that people join that religion, nor that anybody has to follow any particular church's doctrine.
Ah, but would you like Congress to mandate that everyone follow the doctrine of your Church...the true Christians' Church, God's favourites?
Surely she has the right to feel and say anything she likes? Right?
But she didn't blow up anybody. She's someone who hates Americans... Lots of people hate Americans. Just like lots of Christians hate Muslims.
Understanding reasons doesn't indicate sympathy, it indicates empathy. You can understand why someone does/did something without approving of their actions. Not tolerance for terrorists... I don't have that. He should be punished for his crimes.
She is a grieving mom Brenda.
She has also the right to say whatever she wants.
I disagree in this case.
She needs grief counseling. From a legitimate source; not from some radical religion.
And she needs to be in a private setting where she can get that instead of being allowed to rant anti-American stuff on international tv.
And if she comes to America, she needs to be detained in accordance with law, but with of course some acommodation for her grief and her worry about her younger son. I am not unfeeling, as I've said; but this is no ordinary situation.
What crime has she committed that if she came to America she should be detained in accordance with the law?
Last time I looked America was not some Orwellian state where hatred of America was illegal.
She does actually have a shoplifting charge against her. But I don't think Brenda was referring to that.
I don't see too much sympathy for a woman who, essentially, has had both of her sons killed either.
I don't know about what other people would do, but I know I clung like hell to my religion when my son died.
As it is all she has left, can't say I blame her.
It is also unreasonable to expect someone who has just lost a son to have the ability to grieve for a group of people who she has never met. But hey, she's a Muslim so she's not human.
Look, Melissa, I really wish you'd try to respond without being so aggressive and personally offensive all the time.
I never said, nor even hinted that I think, Muslims aren't human; you, however, did; and it would be good if you'd stop.
I'm saying this situation, and that mother, seem really odd in behavior. She doesn't seem to be the typical grieving mother at all.
She's openly anti-America, for one, and is a criminal suspect herself from having been charged with theft previously. I certainly understand ANY mother's grief, but she's very audacious and very rebellious about the whole thing. That's worth noting in light of the plight of the Boston Marathon bombing victims AND in light of its effect on, and her effect, on America's National security.
And, no she doesn't seem to fit the typical picture that's been given us of a Muslim woman in a Country and a religion that supposedly mistreats and persecutes women and otherwise denies them their civil rights.
If you find it offensive, that's on you. I wasn't attacking you personally, if you find opposing opinions offensive then I'm not sure what to tell you. My response to the inhuman was to the "slimy muslime" comment above.
Of course she's anti-American, American police killed her son (from her pov). That's not hard to understand.
If you understood any mother's grief, you would understand the possibility of being angry at the people who cause her son's death. I am still, to this day, irrationally angry at my ex-husband for causing my son's death. It doesn't matter that it was an accident.
I was charged with speeding once. That has no bearing on whether I should grieve for my son. If I was charged with murder... still no bearing.
Muslim women are expected to be subservient to their husbands and modest in dress. That's it. Those are exactly the same requirements of traditional Christianity. That doesn't mean there are no outspoken traditionally Christian women. I personally, subscribe to the same rules in my marriage. That doesn't mean I don't get to give my opinion.
Your image of Muslim women comes from where? They do not violate a women's civil rights over there... or at least not in the way you are describing. They have a different version of what a woman's civil rights are and I suppose they adhere to those rights as well as American's adhere to ours.
Of course, I suspect this all falls on deaf ears...
Edit: What does a typical grieving mother look like anyway?
If you wanted to respond to the "slimy Muslim" comment, then you should've responded to the poster who made that comment, not to me.
And there's one thing I see now. You said "irrational". And if you realize that something's irrational, you do have the ability to change your thoughts about that and stop placing blame on someone.
That mother is acting irrational, yes, and you think that her grief makes that "normal".............I don't think it does in this case. Unless extreme selfishness is normal under the circumstances of such an involved case where other people were killed so heinously. Again, I understand a mother's grief; but I believe that even a mother who's grieving will also be grieving for OTHER mothers who've suffered huge loss in the same situation, especially since her sons are pretty obviously responsible for that suffering. And her behavior and words goes against everything that we're told about the Muslim religion------that she would "normally" be happy that her oldest son earned his right to be considered a hero of sorts, and her other son!
I'm thinking her being given the freedom to say the crappy things she's saying without being taken from public view and influence is somehow a political ploy, or at least will be used for the anti-Christian-pro-Islam agenda activists. And especially I'm wondering how the families of the bombing victims, and the victims, are able to contain their own anger and shock at seeing the bombers' mother on tv ranting about America and ignoring their sorrow and rightful anger.
If you have the kind of composure required to act rational when your child is killed, congratulations. Not many mothers do. But since that doesn't fit into your view of how it should be, we'll disregard the fact that some mothers are actually driven to insanity by the death of their child. (Shock actually drove me to semi-catatonia, the only thing I remember about the funeral was carrying the coffin) You can't stop being irrational just by knowing you are being irrational.
In addition, sorry I simply didn't give a crap about the grief of those around me. That's also within the realm of "normal" human response. I certainly wouldn't have had the ability to give a crap about the people who I didn't know. Yep, selfish... I know. I should certainly have had the strength to care about strangers when suffering womb-tearing grief.
Who the hell are you getting your information on Muslim religion from? Have you actually ever spoken to a Muslim? Seriously, I'd like an answer to this one. Where is this information coming from?
She is given the freedom to say what she wants because the press is recording it. If they want to broadcast it, then blame them. The "political agenda" can't stop the press from doing anything...
I feel horrible for the victims of the Boston bombing and their families. Understanding the grief of a mother that lost her child in no way takes away from that. No the people of Boston shouldn't have to understand her grief in the middle of their grief. Just as she doesn't have to understand their's in her's.
I didn't know you'd lost a child Melissa. Im so very sorry. My heart goes out to you and your family.
My third child, about five years ago. He was a couple weeks shy of his fourth birthday. Thank you Beth for your condolences.
Oh Melissa. There are just no words. You poor thing. Im so sorry.
Thank you again Beth. To be quite honest, I'm never sure what to do with myself during condolences, but I really do appreciate it. He touched a lot of lives and he helped a lot of other children. In his short life, he did more to change the world than most of us ever will, and if there is a heaven he is most assuredly in it. I am crushed that he is gone and I miss him everyday, but I am more blessed that he was given to me even for that short time.
Err... is there anyway we can change the subject? Like I said, I get kind of awkward.
Out of one side of her mouth she says her sons were framed.
Then she questions whether the bombing even happened -- that it was red paint, not blood.
But if she doesn't care that her sons die or that she dies, would that not
imply that she not only knows her sons did this, but condones it?
I wonder if she will ever be honest? Although honesty does not seem to be a value of hers (hence the shoplifting and destruction of property charges)...
I cannot speak to being a mother with a radical anti-American agenda.
I can only speak to being a mother who believes in God.
If my son killed people and maimed people with
bombs, I would be remorseful beyond words.
I'm not sure you would feel the same if one son just died, another was most assuredly going to, and everyone in the world hated you in the middle of your grief.
This is an interesting read that partially addresses... it's an interview with Susan Klebold (mother of one the Columbine shooters) where she, in part, goes into her feelings of denial about her son's involvement.
http://www.oprah.com/world/Susan-Klebol … Know-Why/1
It might help with a bit of insight, although every grieving parent is different.
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