Belief of the intelligent design

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Mark Johannposted 11 years ago
I just saw some documentaries about scientists admitting that there is an intelligent design made by the Designer...The Creator.

I would like to recommend this youtube video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl … S1x-6al2pE

Thanks for participating my forum.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  No, scientists do not say such ridiculous things.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  THAT is a lie. THAT is ridiculous. There are many scientists who do believe in a Creator. For Heaven's sake. At least admit to things that can be proven.
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  Zelkiiroposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  1 out of every 1000 is not "many."
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  wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Beth, you are both right and wrong. Yes, there are scientists that believe in a Creator. There just weren't any (good) ones in that video. There are far too many logical fallacies, too many unsupported claims and too much arguing from a semantical base to be considered a scientist.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  The key word here is 'scientists' which immediately implies that they are speaking on behalf of science when they make those claims. Those folks could be bowlers, for all we know, but no one here is saying that many bowlers believe in a Creator.
  
  And no, real scientists who speak on behalf of science do not say those ridiculous things.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Your assumptions are incorrect.
  Or maybe you don't consider Isaac Newton or Pythagoras contributing scientists?
  Here's a small list of names to peruse.
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  Zelkiiroposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Isaac Newton and (especially) Pythagoras weren't around when modern science became a thing and handily brushed off mindless superstitions like deities, the afterlife, and the supernatural. Hell, neither of them were even around when we discovered bacteria. Or atoms. Or neutrinos. Or dark matter.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah... lets not count them... or the list I posted.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Oh, I see, you believe that centuries ago, your religion didn't torture or kill people for not believing.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Wow. Holy off-topic Batman.
  I do not discount reported history. Where did I say that? Yes, I have indeed heard of the crusades... where a group of ppl went on a killing spree and all in God's name. I could go on a killing spree in your name as well, would that make you in any way responsible?
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  wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Good point. So why do people find it necessary to be a part of the religion that caused the crusades rather than simply be a part of God?
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  You will have to ask them. I follow God and the Bible, not a religion.
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  wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Good for you, but I'm sure you recognize that most people don't. You won't find many true believers that don't consistently inhabit the inside of a church somewhere.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  I can tell you I have many issues where I fall woefully short of the mark, which is to be like Jesus. I have a sarcastic sense of humor... so many times I find it hard to pass up what I think to be a funny joke when it would be best to shut my mouth. I also struggle with lust b/c of a situation I was in for too long, but God isn't finished with me yet. God willing, I am improving every day.
  There are no Christians without sin. You will never meet one. No one is perfect, save one.
  That being said... yes, I believe you are correct. The one thing that will show the world that we are Christians, that we love God and want to follow Him, is *love*.
  Too many times it is the church crowd that don't tip or treats the ppl who serve them rudely. It is my thought that they went to church and they sat in the pew, but they got little out of the sermon. There are some, like the crusaders of old, who claim the name Christian b/c it is traditional for their family. God willing, there are still some who would be willing to give their all out of love for a neighbor or even a stranger. "Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one's life for one's friends." Jn 15:13. I want to be that person... and if I am not that person now, I pray I will be that person before I die.
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  wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Maybe I'm just being mean, but I think 95% of those in the pews are there for social interaction, not to commune with or learn about God. It's an "experience", just like going to a football game, and a better one than watching the game on TV or studying the bible even though the "view" is better at home.
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  bBereanposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Unfortunately, there is a lot of truth in what you say. It was foretold in the bible, even by Jesus Himself, and is very true of our time. All sorts of watered down, feel good doctrines to keep the pews full and the good times rolling. Remove the unpleasantness of accountability and you can get the world to join your club. Sad but true.
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  wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Well, either that or stick in a basketball court, evening Bingo and a potluck dinner.
  
  Lots of ways to get people into church, and they work quite well to gather the social club.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Following gods and holy books are the definition of religion.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  No, it would make you responsible.
  
  Of course, I don't act like a selfish, psychotic despot, demanding love and worship from my followers.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Im glad.
  I don't know anyone like that either.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Except the God of the Bible.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  So then, you believe He's real, but you don't like the personality you've attributed to Him?
  Or you don't believe He's real and you spend your days and presumably even your nights concerned with an imaginary being?
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Yet again, you are not reading others posts or have a very serious reading comprehension problem, I have explained this many times, not long ago to you, in fact.
  
  It's like talking to little children about Santa Claus and why there are presents under the tree, the adult no longer believers in Santa Claus but talks to the little child as if he did exist. Understand, now?
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  So in this scenario... are you Santa, the child or the adult?
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  You are obviously the small child who believes in Santa, or in this case, God.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Right, right. I forgot. So you are Santa and I shall sit on your knee? This story seems a bit awkward to me. Who is the adult? If it's Radman, I don't know if I want to be in this story anymore. I think I would like Emile there to supervise.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  No, what we are concerned with is the state of the world and how the religious mindset has done nothing but wage wars these past many centuries, how the religious mindset has shaped and formed our societies to their ultimate and obvious failures.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  "we"... there it is again. I am quite convinced you are most probably not alone in there.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  "We" describes those folks here who think rather than believe. Understand, yet?
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  I believe I do.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  We'll see, time will tell.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  So I am Santa... you are the child and Radman and Emile are our mommy and daddy. Got it!
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  I didn't think you'd get it. It was unlikely the thinking process that lay so dormant all these years suddenly awakens.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  I like puppies.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Trolling now?
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  No thank you. You go ahead.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Not interested, thanks. It is your forte, not mine.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Ouchie. Why must you always poke? Now I have to go off to work remembering the porcupine I had a conversation with. Try this: "Have a good day, Beth." Then I will say it back to you. It will be fun.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  You are the one who started trolling. Now you play the victim card?
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Yes. Have a good day ATM!
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Zelkiiroposted 11 years ago
I see your YouTube video and raise you another:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RnygS7opCA
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  And I, you.
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c63awtAyHdU
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  Zelkiiroposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Ben Stein? Glad you brought him up! He makes an appearance!
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xO7IT81h200
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  I love this movie. (Expelled.) Did you watch it?
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Rayne123posted 11 years ago
this is going to sound strange but I on the other hand have no idea what you are talking about lol
sorry
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Beth37posted 11 years ago
Y'all may spin it as you please. It doesn't bother me at all. What bothers me is to call something an absolute that isn't one.
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scottcgruberposted 11 years ago
The burden of proof is on the creationists to prove that there is design in nature. They have not done so.

They have only made arguments from ignorance: we don't know how x evolved, therefore God Did It.
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  renegadetoryposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  That's an interesting position, but science has not proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that life began without a creator, so there is an equal burden of proof on them to prove there is no God.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  No, the burden of proof for God is entirely on the shoulders of believers like yourself.
  
  Science has shown life began entirely on it's own, no gods, leprechauns or giant lizards were required in the creation of life.
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  renegadetoryposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Has it? I would be interested in knowing your source, if you don't mind.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Try this for starters...
  
  http://exploringorigins.org/rna.html
  
  then you can peruse more advanced papers here...
  
  http://rnajournal.cshlp.org/
  
  Here's a helpful guide...
  
  http://ghr.nlm.nih.gov/glossary=rna
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  renegadetoryposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  From the links that you have posted, I gather you are guiding me towards the "RNA world' hypothesis? Please correct me if I am wrong.
  
  If this is in fact the case, has any scientist been able to demonstrate how RNA could have formed before living cells were around to make it or how it could have survived under the conditions of the early earth? If you are able, please throw a link or two in my direction or list a book that I might be able to look it up.
  
  With regard to the second link you posted, are there any particular issues or specific articles that I should be looking for?
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, this guy created under laboratory conditions, an RNA molecule, modeled after the conditions of the early earth.
  
  https://mcdb.colorado.edu/directory/yarus_m.html
  
  http://artsandsciences.colorado.edu/mag … n-of-life/
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  renegadetoryposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  I was not aware of this, how very interesting.
  
  To be fair, I will share with you where I get much of my skepticism of the RNA world theory:
  
  http://www.its.caltech.edu/~bch176/Joyce1989.pdf
  
  I realize that this is a somewhat dated article (1989) but he makes a good argument regarding the difficulty to synthesize RNA in the prebiotic environment.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  But, he also states it's time to start looking at RNA seriously and figure out how to make it, which was accomplished since then. No problem.
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  wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Me, too. Proof that God didn't reach down and...push...those early atoms and molecules together in the primordial soup would be most interesting.
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Mark Johannposted 11 years ago
If you have emotions then there has to be Someone who made that thing. Just my thought.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  That makes no sense whatsoever. Why did there have to be "Someone" who made emotions?
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Beth37posted 11 years ago
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  No, that is not atheism, that is nonsense. Whoever wrote that deserves to be mocked.
  
  Atheism is merely a lack of belief in gods.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  oic
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  autumn18posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Not all atheists mock your beliefs so that image is just promoting conflict.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Im just curious... do you come to the defense of a person of faith's belief's when an Atheist rips apart every attempt the believer makes to answer the question they were asked by the Atheist? Cause I don't remember seeing you before.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry, sometimes words are hard.
  
  I wanted to know if she also came to the defense of (let's say) a Christian...
  when the Christian's belief's were mocked by an Atheist (let's say you.)
  Because I didn't remember seeing her here on this thread asking you to stop mocking the Christians, for simply trying to answer the questions they had been asked by the Atheists.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, thank you, that makes more sense. Carry on.
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  autumn18posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  No I didn't specifically go to the defense of a Christian in this thread. If I see someone mocking a person with incorrect skewed information or assumptions then I would. The silly image did that. It jumps out at me more because I hear so many Christians claim to want peace and understanding with all people regardless of belief system and the image goes against that. You can believe anything you want, it only matters to me when people's beliefs (on any side) cause conflict.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Exactly, and it was posted here with the sole purpose of promoting conflict.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  lol. Does your mother know you do this?
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  She's currently standing behind me laughing her head off at your posts.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  I find that shocking.
  
  I guess she doesn't subscribe to your strong conviction to mock the faith and not the person.
  
  (I have to go to work now, that doesn't mean I don't care.)
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Why would you find it shocking that people laugh at your beliefs, it happens all the time.
  
  Yes, she does, that's why she is laughing hysterically at your beliefs. Of course,they aren't really yours to begin with anyways, they are someone else beliefs which you have accepted.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  I was just kidding with the shocked thing. Im sorry, I thought that came across.
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  wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  ATHEISM
  The belief there was once something we've named a "singularity". The singularity exploded (for no known reason), creating everything and everywhere. The a bunch of the exploded everything (called mass, atoms or molecules) rearranged itself (according to the laws of physics and chemistry) into self replicating bits which additional bits of energy or mass eventually turned into dinosaurs.
  AND THEY MOCK YOUR BELIEFS
  
  A little more truthful, a little less disparaging, but basically true. But, reworded for truth, it certainly takes away the ridicule, doesn't it?
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  I can tell you the constant ridicule of your belief begins to wear on you after a while. I hope this is something you can identify with and maybe begin to understand.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  I'm not at all surprised, when one believes in ridiculous invisible magical super beings and expect to be treated like adults will be constantly ridiculed, until they grow up.
  
  It is completely understandable.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Oh good, problem solved.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Actually, the problem is not solved. Can you not see the problem of posting that conflict?
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  wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Yes. Yes it does wear. As does any ridicule where facts are changed to become lies, baseless insinuations and innuendos are made or truth is twisted unrecognizably. Whether it is for atheism or theism, whether for democrat or republican, or to promote choice or life, it's increasingly irritating.
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Mark Johannposted 11 years ago
Our minds cannot fathom the mind of God. I just want to express my beliefs and hopefully let some people there believe and accept that there is a Creator, a Higher Being, who made us and loves us always.

I am thinking of unification of mankind through Jesus Christ's example. I am just thinking that why are some people don't wonder why adult or old people really really believe and serve God. This is not a childish way. They are adults, philosophers, good thinkers, not foolish.

Why not research and think of the possibility or even believe that there is life after death and there is God, instead of insisting and mocking that we believers are foolish of believing God. I am just confused of the how those people live their lives by believing just by themselves.

I am praying for those people that someday, they may be as higher believers as my level of belief today.

Those who oppose against the belief in God are stronger preachers on the side of God soon. I hope and pray.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Well said.
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  Mark Johannposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks Beth37. Bless you!
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  Mark Johannposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  I am sorry for excess words written. I did not review it.
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  Beth37posted 11 years agoin reply to this
  It was from the heart. It was perfect as is.
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  Mark Johannposted 11 years agoin reply to this
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  Mark Johannposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, from the heart, indeed.
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  A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this
  You will not succeed because those beliefs are childish myths.
  
  Christianity has always divided mankind and will always continue to do so as long as people believe and follow it. Yes, it is very childish and foolish.
  
  It is actually research and thinking that leads people to understand gods, the afterlife, etc. are merely childish myths. Those who defend those myths deserve to be mocked.
  
  Praying is useless, it accomplishes nothing. You will fail to do anything when you pray. That is why people actually do things rather than pray.
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