Explain Why Religion Exists?

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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Hello Hubbers,

I found myself wondering the questions below......
Now, you don't need to give any response, if you
don't choose to, but....these questions were some
of the questions I had as a kid and for some of my
adult life. However, since I have my answers....I
want to hear what others have to say on the subject
at hand.

What purpose does religion serve?

How did religion first come about?

Where did the religion concept come from?

When did the religion concept begin?

And, How come people are willing to sacrifice
their own existence for something unknown?

Everyone is welcome to post.

All religious faiths can feel free to express
themselves without recourse from myself. I
have no intention in engaging in arguments of
any nature.

You have your belief and I reject all religions.

If you cannot answer any or all of the questions
asked, without using conjecture or scripture from
any form of Bible, then don't waste your own time.

And, please do not ask for my answers to these,
for which, you will not get an answer, because of
the understanding that I have - You will not be
willing to accept the answers. So, don't ask.

You can deal amongst yourself on this subject and
we'll see where it goes from here.

Thank you for your time and Have a Great Day!!!!!

Raymond Choiniere II - Cagsil - CAGSIL
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  pylos26posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I wonder … should we all have our personal “understandings”… who would comment?
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The purpose is to guide man in living properly and merging with the cosmic force.
  Religions are group of people who follow a particular philosophy ,of someone who has gone beyond, merged with the light.
  When did it begin god knows.
  Its not sacrificing in a negative way but a positive way.
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  jparedesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The purpose of any type of belief system is to explain the unexplainable. Any type of ritual done within a particular religious/cultural group has cohesive and supportive functions. As a whole, it can define a particular group of people because
  it gives them a sense of belonging. And individuals within that particular group are able to move on in their lives knowing that he or she is connected to others by a specific belief and are able find comfort and understanding within that group.
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  (Q)posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  My understanding is that "religious beliefs" of sorts can be traced back to the early 'shamans' when Neanderthals and early man were cohabitating and joining together for large hunting parties. Prior to the hunt, there would be moaning and arm waving in front of cave drawings.
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  aguasilverposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  What purpose does religion serve?
  
  Cohesion in society or tribal group
  
  How did religion first come about?
  
  Awareness of things that could not be explained by senses
  
  Where did the religion concept come from?
  
  One person was more aware, others looked to that person as a leader, what they believed became 'law'
  
  When did the religion concept begin?
  
  As soon as Satan was stranded here and worked on the minds of the humanoids he found.
  
  And, How come people are willing to sacrifice
  their own existence for something unknown?
  
  Because it's not an unknown for those who believe in eternity, besides I would sacrifice my life for my family, friends, possibly even strangers, why be hung up on life? - assuming eternity, I'm well prepared, if there's not, I'm never going to know about it.
  
  Faith sustains me in this world and makes a reason to believe in the next.
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AdsenseStrategiesposted 14 years ago
Evolution caused religion
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Thank you Adsense.
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marinealways24posted 14 years ago
What purpose does religion serve?

To control and govern people through belief.

How did religion first come about?

Elitist that wanted to govern people.

Where did the religion concept come from?

The free thinkers that realized that absolute belief was absolute control.

When did the religion concept begin?

When individuals consciously realized others could be controlled through a belief.

And, How come people are willing to sacrifice
their own existence for something unknown?

Religion teaches death in protection of the belief is the greatest sacrifice possible.
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  sandra rinckposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Great, now that you have Rome and Egypt down, now explain why Christianity emerged.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hey Sandra, are you planning answering the questions or did you come here to pick an argument with someone else? just curious.
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  sandra rinckposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I am going to make a point. If you want to answer the question go right ahead. Tell me why Christianity emerged?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That wasn't my point. My point was - wondering if you planned on answering the forum questions or did you come in here for another motive?
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  sandra rinckposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry, my bad Ray. Didn't mean to hijack the thread.
  
  I don't know how religion came about other then sentience. Self awareness and a need to understand the natural word.
  
  Judaism came out of oppression. Moses told the Pharaoh, "let my people go!" He gave them the 10 commandments and from there they were a free people, their only obligation was to God and being obedient to God's law.
  
  This was promising at the time because they could either a) wonder the dessert in search of freedom and a new land (the promised land) or b) continue to be slaves to Pharaoh.
  
  So they wondered the desert for a while and 'miracles happened' which can now be explained as natural occurrences however the 'timing' is a mystery and worthy of the assumption that God gave them grace by faith.
  
  Later on down the road, again the Jews were being oppressed by Rome and Jesus came along to set them free but instead of taking them to a new land, he gave them the confidence to stand up to the oppressors and gave them their rights as humans under God's Law... again and he died to prove to them that they are not subject to Roman Law but are subject to God's Law.
  
  While after Christ's death, his followers were not aggressive but their meek nature was taking root in the Roman society and the Romans felt threatened by them because more people were believing the do have rights given to them by God to be a free people.
  
  In fear of losing control, he started to have them killed. The early Christians held fast to what Jesus had told them and they were all being killed... the gentiles and the Jews.
  
  Eventually an army of God formed in opposition to oppression to defeat the Roman Empire. Constantine said he was given a vision from God to build the church which we know as the Roman Catholic Church and many people died to be free from oppression.
  
  Then came Islam but I wont talk about it because its a sore subject for people to discus without getting angry... however it turns out that Islam arrived from a disagreement with the Roman Catholic Church concerning the trinity. And that is the literal reason. Sad I know.
  
  Some small bickering went on and eventually Islam grew in opposition to the Roman Catholic church and indeed, they tried to take over and make everyone submit to Allah. The Muslim Empire was taking over lands and people and again forcing their will on others.
  
  One could say that the Roman Catholic Church was inspired by God to keep the God's people free from oppression. What happened during the first crusade was to keep their people (the christians and jews) free from the Muslim Empire.
  
  Eventually, they won (though many people dead) to preserve peoples "God Given Freedoms" by choice NOT SUBMISSION. In which case, Islam literally means; submission to God. It does not mean peace.
  
  Today, Christianity is branded a religion of hate by all the oppressors against a people who know they have God given rights.
  
  And there will always be people (christians) who will fight for the freedoms that God had given to all men. What seems crazy is that today, our rights are dictated by men and anyone who says screw man laws I have Gods Law are also branded as haters because I and they will not give up my God given rights to please anyones god or empire or investments etc...
  
  While I know that the Catholic church also holds a lot of wealth I am not going to judge them and say they are greedy bastards for doing so but because we should all know by now how money works... keeping it out of circulation is and probably always will be the only way to keep "satan" locked up.
  
  Yet, since someone, not naming names... decided to print more money, you can now feel the disastrous effects in an interconnected world along with the re-energized call for Christians to stand their grounds against societies that wish to take our God given rights away.
  
  Religion is incredibly important. I can only imagine that if those writings were not preserved, life would be a lot worse then it is today.
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  AdsenseStrategiesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hi Sandra. I didn't read your whole post (a bit long for me ) but I did notice one thing I wanted to comment on.
  
  I don't think Jesus gave the Jews the confidence to stand up against the Romans. As you know from the Bible (which, while I do not believe it is divinely inspired, I do think it is roughly correct on some historical points), the Jews did not, on the whole accept Jesus. And, the Romans destroyed Jerusalem in the year 70, and carted off lots of people into slavery.
  
  However, I have said earlier on this thread, I do think he was preaching something of worth. I just don't believe the Jews accepted him, on the whole (and the Bible backs me up).
  Best wishes!
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  sandra rinckposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Those who did were referred to as gentiles. It still remains, that Christianity was against oppression and freedom from slavery.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I believe that Jesus did not give the Jews confidence to stand up against the Romans because Prophesy as it had been written had to be fulfilled. Rome was the Fourth beast (Kingdom) as described in the book of Daniel which was described to have 14 Kings and I think that it was the 4th or 5th that was reigning at the time.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  It's not a problem, I was just wondering if you had an interest in answering the other question. You could have said no. You really didn't need to explain.
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  AdsenseStrategiesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Is there a difference between the question of how Christianity came to dominate the parts of the world it did (Europe in particular), and the question of how and why Christianity in its first century "original" (so to speak) version arose?
  
  I think there is.
  
  As far as I know, a large part of the reason Christianity spread was, of course, the conversion of the emperor Constantine.
  
  But this is not my main point (and it might not even be right, at least not completely. For example, the Council of Nicea took place way before Christianity was spread by imperial decree, I think, and this was a long way from Palestine... I think Nicea was in France. Be that as it may...)
  
  My main point is that I think Jesus was truly innovative, and injected into Palestinian, and later Greco-Roman society a way of "experiencing God" (so to speak) that was possibly novel, and perhaps even revolutionary. That is explanation enough, in some sense.
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I think it started just like the other religions. Maybe it was taught at the beginnings of Christianity that they were separating from other religions making Christians think they were higher than other religion for worshiping Jesus/God instead of worshiping the religion itself. This doesn't mean Christianity was separate from other religions just because they believed they were separate.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Thank you Marine.
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  lol What? No disagreement?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I stated in the beginning I wasn't going to get involved.
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  lol The disclaimer that no one will be able to accept your answers? To accept them as theory or as absolute?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I am not even going to go that far. But, Thank you.
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  lol You are no fun tonight. No offense.
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  earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Not from me either.
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  qwarkposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hi Marine:
  I disagree with every point you made..:-)
  I'm not inclined to spend an hour or 2 explaining why.
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  lol What are you talking about. You seem not to have any trouble writing your disagreements to others.
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  qwarkposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Marine:
  I've already typed my reasons in "Hubs" and other forum topics...gettin' "carpal tunnel syndrome"...lol..besides I hate redundancy...but thanks for asking...
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  lol you make a silly comment and then run away telling me to read your hubs and search through the forums. Very smooth.
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  qwarkposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Marine:
  Hell, I don't care one way or the other if you read my hubs..:-)
  All I did was mention the fact that in my "dribbles and drabs" in the forums and in my hubs, I have mentioned my understanding of why man has a religious "bent."
  To go back over them and repeat would be boring to all including me.
  I'm just saying to you that I "respectfully" disagree with every point you tried to make in ref to this forum subject and that I don't feel like going into why.
  Maybe I shouldn't have responded knowing full well I wouldn't follow thru when the question was asked: why.
  If that's so, "my bad."
  My fingers are stilled..:-)
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  lol Alright, I have no problem with someone disagreeing with me. It is a little silly when they disagree with no specific disagreement, so you say you disagree with everything. You are right, maybe you should have thought before you wrote since you don't want to put in effort to point out how and what I am wrong on. I didn't ask for you to write a hub, I just asked for a single point. If you say everything I wrote, it should be easy for you to find at least 1 specific point.
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  qwarkposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Marine"
  Sure! Fair enuf.
  1.A, probable, genetic propensity.
  There ya go..:-)
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I'm not impressed. How is this disagreeing with anything I wrote?
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  qwarkposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Marine:
  Who's trying to impress? My goodness!
  You asked for 1 reason,I provided.
  Nuff said..:-)
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  lol You provided nothing.
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Jeramiposted 14 years ago
As long as we recognize the diffrence between religion and Faith in the creator that religion says that it is about.
Marine layed it out verry well.
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks to you and Earnest. I agree that faith in creation can be separated from a taught religion if found through individual belief.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I hope that is a good thing, if so thank you.
  I think I was born with some belief in a creator.
  I dabbled in religion for a while (age around 40)and was confortable there... for a little while until the pastor wanted a bigger building and started reminding me of Jim Jones.
  That didn''t kill my faith though.
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Not to be offensive, but don't you draw your belief of creation from the bible which was put together by religion?
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The seed of thought might have sprouted there... I believe that the big band theory seems logical. I'm not ruling out the fact that something caused the bang. What ever caused the band can be said to be the creator. Evolution could be thought of in a consistent manner with the Genesis account. the spirit (or energy) of God moved across the surface of the waters and life abounded (and evolved).
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kessposted 14 years ago
C, What purpose does religion serve?

Kess, Religion should be the kingdom that should guide others to the way of and purpose of life.

But now is the kingdoms set up by darkness and death (non existence) to rule over light and life (existence).
And by the deceit of lies woo those who are inclined to following the purpose and way to life.

C, How did religion first come about?

Kess, Whenever a person come to realization of the purpose of their own existence, they will be inclined to organise and teach others that right way.

But darkness uses those with big egos, who have no interest in walking that true path instead loving the glory of leading and/or manipulating others. Makes a religion of the true teachings modifying it for his benefits.

C, Where did the religion concept come from?

Kess, The true origin is the wisdom of men to do good.
And with a little manipulation transform it for selfish benefits (evil).

C,When did the religion concept begin?

Kess, From since the begining of consciousness of an individual.

C, How come people are willing to sacrifice their own existence for something unknown?

Kess, Once one begins to question the realisation of his existence, he would conclude that only the selfless good is lasting and eternal.
And if all were to focus to that end, then all would profit indefinitely.

This is the purpose and way of perpetual existence and life. This is the concept and reality of God.

One can be a part of this, which means having the knowledge of the one true God or life.

Or one may ignore this and be part of non existence or death.

There are two great opposite.
One is positive and is the Good, life, existence, light, truth.
All these combine to form +One, the kingdom of God.

The other is the negative, the evil. Death, nonexistence, darkness, lies. And all these combine to form the -One, the kingdom of darkness.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you Kess.
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nbd09posted 14 years ago
Very nice post Kess. Im sure that cleared up alot for somebody. =]
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prettydarkhorseposted 14 years ago
utilitarian -- it is needed by society
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  nbd09posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Why do you think so?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You tried to answer the topic question, but leave the rest alone. Hmmm....that's odd. But, as you wish.
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sneakorocksolidposted 14 years ago
All us comando religionists are using religion as our call to action! We work to spread irrational fear of world events to increase membership by spreading fear of an impending doom. Thats how we finance our tax-exempt acticities and to promote world conflict. More conflict, more fear, more money!
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you Sneako.
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  sneakorocksolidposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Right on!
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Too bad, you didn't answer all the question either, but then again, you rarely answer any question, with any form of sanity. But, your input is welcomed.
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AdsenseStrategiesposted 14 years ago
I don't think it is necessarily needed by society (though perhaps it is, not sure) but I am assuming that our earliest ancestors (not apes, humans, trying not to step on that booby trap) *did* find it utilitarian... not that they deliberately designed religion consciously, necessarily, but just that all those mental resources going into an institution like that must have helped them survive in their habitat somehow...

...you could still argue that "God inscribed it on their hearts" if you like, but that, for me, would just be another way of saying that, however it developed, it "nourished" the human population of the day in some way.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you again Adsense.
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SirDentposted 14 years ago
What purpose does religion serve?

This is a hard question to answer. Religion in itself is only a following of set rules and regulations. (This is not set in concrete) It is man's attempt to reach God. Even following the laws of the government could be considered religion.

How did religion first come about?

Religion actually first started in the Garden of Eden when Eve and then Adam at the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Where did the religion concept come from?

See above.

When did the religion concept begin?

See above

And, How come people are willing to sacrifice
their own existence for something unknown?

I can only give an answer from the Christian perspective.

Christians do not give up their existance for something unknown. They actually come to the realization that God is real and that there is only one way to Him. That is through the blood of Jesus Christ.
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  AdsenseStrategiesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I don't agree with much of this, of course, but I do agree with the last point... people who sacrifice for their beliefs do not consider their "truths" to be unknown... they "know" them to be "true."
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Thank you SirDent.
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  SirDentposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry i didn't see this earlier. You are welcome.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  No problem.
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PrettyPantherposted 14 years ago
"If you cannot answer any or all of the questions
asked, without using conjecture or scripture from
any form of Bible, then don't waste your own time."

It is not possible to answer all of your questions without using conjecture. Possibly the first four, but certainly not the last one.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you PrettyPanther.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Anyone else care to answer?
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earnestshubposted 14 years ago
Perhaps religion exists because of the operation of the fight or flight mechanism in our old or lizard brain. It has no capacity to think, it just makes junk up so it is less scared.

It's concerned with fundamental needs such as survival, physical maintenance, hoarding, dominance, preening and mating. It is also found in lower life forms such as lizards, crocodiles and birds. It is at the base of your skull emerging from your spinal column.
So maybe religion is fired from here.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That is one might interesting post Earnest.
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PeppermintPaddyposted 14 years ago
What type of religion?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Mystical faith based religions.
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  PeppermintPaddyposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Oh, this isn't a sex thread
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  And, you entered a RELIGIOUS FORUM to ask that sad question?
  
  Sex isn't a religion, just in case, you didn't know.
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  PeppermintPaddyposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  But isn't religion about having a spiritual experience? lol I'm just a kid so you know I'm kidding.
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AdsenseStrategiesposted 14 years ago
I think there is also a distinction to be made between "established" religion and folk or popular religion. Established religion, I suspect, tends to be wrapped up in power and politics, and often also domination of the masses in some way.

Folk or popular religion has a life of its own, quite apart from officialdom.

As far as I can see, a massive chunk of the Old Testament represents the conflict between the centralizing forces based around the Jerusalem temple, that sought to impose monotheism as state religion, and the religion of Yahweh as practiced by most people at the time, which included often also worship of Baal and El (so it was polythestic).

Similarly, the New Testament is Jesus' attempt (or, at least, the attempt of SOMEOONE) to break away from the constraining forces of official Judaism of the time.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hey Adsense, let me ask you question. Was Jesus religious himself?
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  AdsenseStrategiesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Mmmm. Well, first we have to assume that at least Matt., Mark and Luke are reasonably reliable sources. (So let's do that, for a start).
  
  It's tricky. He didn't bow to authority, in fact in a way he was far, far more critical of religious authorities than he was of the Romans (or Herod). Maybe this is exactly what I mean. Judaic authority was (I presume) pretty hierarchical, and liked to put people in straitjackets. They hated Jesus because he seemed to be saying (if we believe the Gospels) that you didn't need to go through these folks to have an experience of God.
  
  I'm inclined (perhaps at the risk of sounding like a Marxist!) to say that this is the tension I meant... people can have "religious" experiences on their own, thank you very much, but authorities try to monopolize dogma, and behaviour... one more lever of control
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Was Jesus religious himself?
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  AdsenseStrategiesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  It depends how you define religious. I mean, I think he was religious in the "conventional" sense because he obviously went to Temple, and also commemorated Passover. So, yes, I think he believed in YHWH (I don't know what Jews called God in those days, but you get the drift) and would have said "I am a Jew".
  
  But he certainly did not "tow the line." He was offering the possibility of an alternative way to be "religious." An alternative definition of the word, that did not require (ironically) buildings, a hierarchical clergy, rigid adherence to rules, judging of others and poking your nose into their business, etc.
  
  (Perhaps the most fascinating part of this is that I believe everything I just wrote, but still do not believe in God, or Jesus in the sense of him being divine)
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I can understand that.
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  SirDentposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I am going to attempt an answer here if you don't mind.
  
  Jesus stated, "What the Father comamnded me to do, I do." That is paraphrased. He only spoke what he heard and did what the Spirit had Him to do. This makes Him religious in a way.
  
  Jesus wasn't so much against authority. He was against unfair authority in the church.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That is an interesting take on my question. Thank you.
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  AdsenseStrategiesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  He was against the earthly "religious" authorities in Jerusalem though. Though maybe you are right; if there were religious leaders in the Sanhedrin, (or whatever, in Judaism in Palestine at the time), maybe he just didn't speak out against them, because he accepted them. He still seemed pretty pissed in general at the "church" (wrong word! ) of the day however, if you ask me
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I don't want to step on any toes, but I asked this same question in the other Christianity forum, but I'll ask you here.
  
  Wouldn't it be really nice, IF we knew where mankind had evolved to, during the time of Jesus, so we could better understand his teachings?
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  SirDentposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I saw this question in the other thread. Not sure how to answer it. Maybe where you used the word "evolved."
  
  The Bible itself has a lot of history to it that leads up to Jesus. I will have to sleep on this before I can give an intelligent answer and then I may not be able to.
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  AdsenseStrategiesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  No toes stepped on, but I am not sure what you mean exactly to be honest
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Good night SirDent.
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  SirDentposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You have to understand what the pharisees did and believed. Jesus said, "Except your righteoussness exceed that of the pharisees, you will not see the kingdom of heaven." The pharisees were very strict in their practices. They followed the law to a T. They did no work at all on the sabbath.
  
  They paid tithes, gave offerings and fasted twice a week. In all this, it was not enough. Their hearts were hard. They would pray bragging about how good they were while putting others down. In other words, they were great in their own eyes.
  
  Not all of them were bad though.
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tal g melposted 14 years ago
Thank you!
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earnestshubposted 14 years ago
There are many things unknown in science and even the human mind.

That is no reason to replace the little good understanding that we have with some invisible more than improbable entity.
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Danny Decayposted 14 years ago
Religion is like a psychological disorder based on ignorance.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Anyone else want try?
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Will Apseposted 14 years ago
Human being are prey to so many existential anxieties. Religion helps a lot.

I like Buddhist straightforwardness and honesty. The Buddha made clear that his philosophy was designed to deal with the fears of sickness, old age and death. In many parts of the world that philosophy has been transformed into a religion and does a pretty good job.

Also religion has valuable social elements giving people an avenue to take part in communal events and giving shape and meaning to lives. It is also a vehicle for those who think deeply about human needs and society to influence others.

Religions also mirror psychological realities in a way that no secular practice- not even art- does.

I'm not a believer but I use the full repertoire of understandings, reactions and metaphors that have evolved in Christianity every day of my life. I only noticed this a few years ago. Before then, I was as blind to my cultural history as earnesthub, Mark Knowles etc.
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  AdsenseStrategiesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I'd be a Buddhist if I had to be "anything." I attend a (very informal) weekly Buddhist meditation group. I don't think many of the people there believe much of (or even know much of) Buddhist doctrine, but there are some great insights in the religion...
  
  I'd say it could be pared away from the business about Nirvana, reincarnation, and Karma, (which I see no reason why I have to make a decision about one way or another) and preserved as a practice of calming the mind and soul, coupled with some wise insights about life.
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SirDentposted 14 years ago
Good night friends, and you too Earnest.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
The doctrines for religions, all start with the same first three.

(1) selfless (2) give up desire (3) belief in god.

All three are core to all religions of the World today.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Okay, maybe I should clear something up.

When I say I am of the "understanding", I am talking about Wisdom gained by Knowledge learned.

What is means to other people? Who knows.
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  pylos26posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry…cagsil…its just that when one seems to pound his/her advanced virtues down in ink…some may naturally feel a bit of condescension easing overhead.
  
  I absolutely mean no offence…and I certainly get pleasure from your writings…thanks.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Are you under the impression I was mad at you? Not even close, I just wanted to make myself clear, for the rest of the forum. Your posted fitted with my scope, so I used it.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Thank you Mohitmisra.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Welcome Cagsil
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Just to let you know, you didn't answer all the questions.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I found the answers similar for some questions.Dont know who the first enlightened one on this planet was and who followed his philosophy.
  Hindu philosophy attributes this to Shiva.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  What couldn't you answer? And, What did you find similar? Each question has a different answer.
  
  SirDent, also gave an answer, saying see above, in his answers, so I can only assume he had the same problem you had.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The how,where and when, connected.
  
  Dont know who the first enlightened one on this planet was and who followed his philosophy.
  Hindu philosophy attributes this to Shiva. :)He passed this knowledge to the Sapta Rishis or seven saints who passed it on to the rest of the world.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Okay. Thank you.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
And, Pylos?

I am glad you like my writing. It's a pleasure.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Anybody else want to try?
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Did you get a satisfactory answer ?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Some people have interesting thoughts/interpretations of history and religion. However, if you're asking me if I found the answers satisfactory, then I would say no.
  
  No, because as I stated, I knew the answers to the questions beforehand, and wasn't asking to find an answer. I wanted people to voice their thoughts and if they wanted to engage me, then they would have to initiate contact.
  
  I was simply being polite by saying "Thank You" to each person who posted.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I would love a healthy debate.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Debate about what?
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  This topic the questions you have asked. :)Which answers satisfied you and which didnt?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  What purpose does religion serve? (control)
  
  How did religion first come about? (by accident)
  
  Where did the religion concept come from? (man)
  
  When did the religion concept begin? (est. 10,000 years ago)
  
  And, How come people are willing to sacrifice
  their own existence for something unknown? (because they don't know any different.)
  
  Explain Why Religion Exists? (power, greed, deception + control)
  
  These are the questions I asked. My answers are in ( ).
  
  You may not like the answers, but my learned research says that my answers are correct.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  There is both good and bad , you look only at the bad.Man using religions as an excuse for his wrong deeds is what corrupts the name of a religion.
  
  The good teachings are of not harming anyone,doing good, meditation, peace, oneness with all, with god.
  Aiming for the ultimate ecstasy, we are all seeking happiness.
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prettylauraposted 14 years ago
For me the purpose of religion is to unite people. But maybe depends on what kind of religion we have. If we only have one religion every people would have that more understanding and strong bond
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Great paths have been created due to great masters now they will merge as they speak the same truth.
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earnestshubposted 14 years ago
Pretty spot on I would say.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I thought so too.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Hmmm.......? How to take what you've said, is of particular interest, but only to the extent that you seem to think that I am corrupted?

However, I am one with myself, for the first time in my life and have been so, for a number of years(going on 12 years now), ever since my research/study of religion ended, with my test of the religious doctrines (1) selfless, (2) give up desires and (3) belief in God.

I have tested each of these doctrines and found them to be unattainable for any human being, regardless of what people claim they belief.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Difficult but its possible .
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Anything is possible except for the impossible.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Now thats where god does come in.Whats impossible for us humans is not for him Man with god the impossible becomes possible
  
  Then you need to burn out your desires as well.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Sure look at me a perfect example. Was an atheist , god came into my life made me a poet and now ranked 2 on one library in spiritual and religious books.
  Everyone called me mad saying this is not the age to blah ,blah blah, didn't stop me, knew what they didnt ,all thanks to god.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
That's nice. I was once deeply religious and nothing ever could shake my faith, then I studied religion thoroughly, only to find it a hoax.

Therefore, any "GOD" of any kind, attached via Religion, because that's how it started, is false.

Hence, you mystical faith is guided only by you and nothing else. Therefore, makes your individual belief in "GOD" meaningless, because "GOD" didn't do anything. You did.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Yes I did but I work for god and understand god is this light pure love permeating everything,including me.No atheist work is ever going to get ranked next to the Bible.
  
  What you are going through is very normal,many have such fluctuations.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
An atheist doesn't need to try.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Aw common Cagsil many have written and currently write books.
  This can happen only if god is with you.I have always attributed my work to god.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Based on religions and god. Poetry is considered as the highest and most condensed from of philosophy, the medium used by the enlightened ones to spread god knowldge.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You know, poetry is nothing more than systematic method of writing. There is no "GOD" in any of it, even if written by you.
  
  As I have already stated. Your individual problem is the same as every other religious zealot in the world. You don't listen, when people talk. And, there are times, when you twist other people's words, so you can make yourself sound profound.
  
  My answers to the question I posed in this thread, like I said. I have the answers to and I have graciously shared those with you. However, what you don't see, because you're blinded by faith in "GOD" is that you are one of those people who don't know any better.
  
  I'm not interested in what "Literature" says. They are no better than you.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Common lets just debate without the rude remarks.
  What about philosophy do you believe in that?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Well, thanks to religious/spiritual leaders, much of philosophy and other sciences were discredited in their initial inception, but yes I do.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I value their words.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Then again, an atheist wouldn't even try.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
You keep believing that. You'll only continue to inflate your own ego.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Its what literature says.
  Literary pundits say it can only be carried out by th enlightened ones as an ordinary human does not posses the intelligence or energy to carry out such a task.
  English professors have said this is impossible no one can write like this.
  I attribute this to god.
  
  Holy Vedas most ancient spiritual text is poetry,, so is the Ramayana, Bhagwat Gita , Mahabharata, part of the Bible, Quran, the Guru Granth Sahib a collection of spiritual poets etc etc.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
You bring up philosophy, then you've got nothing to say? Why am I not surprised.

On that note, I'm off to bed. I'll check on this thread tomorrow.

Good bye.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  
  In answer to your original question:
  
  Religion exists to answer all the un-answerable questions that arise from the irrational assumption that "there must be a creator."
  
  Many people must have an answer to these, and religion supplies it. Many people need to look outside of themselves rather than face the really difficult-to-deal with aspects of themselves. Things like
  
  "What happens after I die?"
  "Will I really cease to exist?"
  "Why am I here?"
  
  Many people have said to me that "life would not be worth living without a belief in god."
  
  Which I find incredibly sad. As sad as people who are so uncomfortable with themselves they jump from relationship to relationship without ever thinking.
  
  For me - the trick has been to become comfortable with myself and make peace with the un-answerables. This I find preferable to accepting obviously false answers that religion provides.
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  aka-djposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  GOOD answer!
  Sad that you have made peace with all that, yet you have trouble making peace with any/all believers. (Oh, sorry, I mean Religionists, as you call them).
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Oh - you mean not having a contrary opinion?
  
  You stop telling me you know what god thinks - I will stop laughing at you. Deal?
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Sa Toyaposted 14 years ago
TO ME it's the opium of the masses.

It'a a form of control as well as a means of comfort or rather it's comforting attributes are used to control.

I agree with Marinealways . Answer there was spot on for me!
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aka-djposted 14 years ago
Religion started at the fall of man. (You know, the Adam & Eve story). That (original) sin severed the relationship between man and God.
Jesus Christ's sacrificial death paid the price to re-connect man with God. So, those who do not align (for want of a better word) with Christ,(or reject Him), develop all sorts of "ways" to try and do it on their own. It was first organised into a formal "religion" by Nimrod, at th tower of Babel.
All the myriad of faiths and religions etc. of today are followons from there.
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  poetlorraineposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  WELL SAID. we are born into a religion, and most in that religion tend to believe mostly the same thing, safety in numbers. Security too, wish we all believed in the same thing, and we all could love each other, and stop arguing
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Nonsense.
  
  Religion started when we first became self aware and had time to ask the question . "Why?" And some one attempted to answer - and then discovered a wonderful way of controlling people.
  
  You ridiculous notions are of no value to me dj. The sooner you understand that you need to look inside and become jesus yourself instead of looking to some one else for "salvation," (i.e. dump this ridiculous notion that you have a "personal relationship" with some one that does not exist) - the sooner we can move on and drop your religion.
  
  So - no deal then?
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  aka-djposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Why is my "opinion", nonsense?
  
  What makes you an authority to state this? Were you there when the first "why" was asked?
  If not, then I say
  "nonsense"
  Why is it always about YOU?
  I don't write my posts to you personally, all the time. There are others around. Do you think? Maybe? Just one or two?
  Dunno?
  What else are you offering. Laughing (or not) at me is a very weak bargaining chip.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Your ridiculous notions are of no value to anyone. They have been regurgitated so many times and have been proven worthless by history that anyone clinging to this religion you claim to not be advocating must be wearing blinkers. That better?
  
  And as usual - you have chosen the deliberately obtuse road.
  
  Jesus would be proud.
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  aka-djposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Now you make me laugh.
  
  This ridiculous, worthless notion, regurgitated for thousands of years has changed thousands...no millions of lives. You may want to read some peoples testimonies of what Jesus has done for and in them.
  Trouble is, you pre-judge them as liars, (and the like), and miss the message.
  
  As for obtuse? You have done a better job than me on many occasions.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you for posting some form of answer, but you also failed to answer all of the questions.
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aka-djposted 14 years ago
@ Mark.
Deal? Was I asking to make a deal?

I didn't know you were laughing at me.

Shock! Horror! Devastation! I am undone!

Now you can laugh!
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Will Apseposted 14 years ago
It's worth remembering that Christianity is one of the first international religions. Paul designed it to be that way. Before Christianity, religions were essentially tribal. You practiced a religion to belong to one tribe or another.

Without Christianity, Islam and Buddhism there would be precious little nation speaking unto nation. They offered something from outside the narrowness of ethnic identity and gave new avenues for identity and belonging.

This nonsense of Christianity causing wars needs to be put to bed. Christianity allowed for a more less coherent culture in Europe for the first time. When Christianity added Greek thought to Judaic beliefs that led us into the modern world.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Good Morning or Good Afternoon, depending on where you live.

Anybody want to try to explain?
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The Paulposted 14 years ago
Even though he was sort of doing that Dawkins thing, where he wanders off into rampant speculation... it's speculation consistent with itself and what we know of the world. I think it likely the reason religion exists is very close to Dawkins' musing on the matter.

You're probably familiar with his take on it, but if you're not and you're interested, I'm not going to word it better than he did.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
If you don't plan on answering the questions, then why did you come into this forum?
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lyricsingrayposted 14 years ago
to make money and give people a reason to help their fears also to attempt to form communities. Or maybe it doesn't at all.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Interesting answer Lyrics. Btw- you didn't answer all the questions either. But, it's okay, most people are not answer them.
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lyricsingrayposted 14 years ago
oops :
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  No problem.
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  lyricsingrayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I can't hear you with this thing on my head sorry.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  
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  lyricsingrayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
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sneakorocksolidposted 14 years ago
The orgins of religion go back before recorded history. Initially it was based on superstitions some of it to hopefully promote good for the group and to prepare memebers for the afterlife. It also help solidify groups with common beliefs. It exists now in it's current form because it has been revealed to us thru prophets and God himself that he is there for us and he loves us. This helps comfort those in need and offers hope for a better day.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Interesting thoughts. Thank you for clarifying.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
Any other takers, think they can explain?
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kessposted 14 years ago
Casgil you said you searched for god and found him not, did you look within yourself?

I am assuming the affirmative, tell me what was your realisation.

And if not why not?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  When you search inside yourself looking for "GOD", then you should be able to come to the self-realization that "GOD" doesn't exist, because your individual consciousness, sub-consciousness and conscience, learns the truth about life, thru introspection.
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  kessposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You should then know the origin of your individual selfconsciousness.
  
  Can you then explain to me how you became not the physical for that came from your parents?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Do you mean, my individual consciousness?
  
  This question makes no sense. Please clarify?
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I think he means "self aware."
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Kess, last time I checked was female? But, I could be wrong.
  
  And, Mark, I only asked for clarification, because it was the only way to get Kess to introspect.
  
  I didn't need the clarity, because my individual awareness has been with me my whole life. It wasn't until I learned the knowledge, for which, defines conscious life, that I became full aware of my life. I used to worry about "GOD" and what was going to happen to me, should I not believe.
  
  When I did the introspective research inside myself, my level of awareness grew.
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  kessposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Do you mean you are the author of your selfconsciousness?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You continue to use the word "selfconsciousness", in the wrong form.
  
  Consciousness is oneself's awareness. My consciousness was created by the reproductivity of the human race and all it's glory. When my father and mother had sexual intercourse, and my life began, my consciousness began, even if it wasn't realized by myself at the time.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Naturally occurring after millions of years of evolution. It is only a matter of time before (if they have not already) other species become self aware. In fact - there is a suggestion that gorillas and dolphins are close already. They just need time.
  
  There is also a possible danger of the internet becoming self aware. Unfortunately - we do not really know enough about that to determine how great a threat that might be.
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  kessposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Mark we are not talking about things that are the ideas of others verified through a mountain of conflicting research and difficult to understand and justify scientific methodologies, equipment etc..
  
  The things that are learned through self realization, which any and all can verify through themselves only with the logics of common sense in the pattern of things that all can easily perceive.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry you are unable to understand science. Never mind. And I guarantee you that the stuff you write in your hubs did not come about by introspection. Oddly - it is all other people's unverifiable ideas.
  
  Logic? Common sense? Deary oh deary me.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Search harder don't give up so easily.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I don't need to search harder. And, I didn't give up easily. My self-realization can from finding my true self and the true wisdom I've learned. My search is over, because my introspection revealed Life's truest meaning.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Your true self is the light or spirit or god.What heave you learned? That there is no intelligent spirit?
  Do you know what death or god is? You have learned nothing and yet claim to know everything.Lifes truest meaning?
  What are you talking about? You dont know your source or where you go when you die and what is the basic fabric of this universe or you.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Again, don't try to categorize me in the same sentence as "GOD", I am real - it isn't.
  
  I've learned that with knowledge and wisdom, I am in control of my life. I direct my life and where I am going. I do so, without assistance.
  
  Intelligent spirit? You are kidding right.
  
  You can sit there and say anything you like. I understand more than you could possibly imagine, but since you believe in "GOD", there isn't any reason for me to continue with you.
  
  Do I know what death is? Yes, it's the end of my life. It is the end of my existence. And, if you plan on saying any different, then you save your breath.
  
  Do I know what "GOD" is? Yes, a non-existent entity for which is passed thru generation, after generation, for no benefit of the human race. It would be better off it the subject itself was eliminate from all vocabulary and every single person on the planet was 100% completely self-responsible for their actions, without needing external guidance for another.
  Says you, who is nobody to me. And, you are sadly mistaken....NOT ONCE have I claimed to know everything. So, you can stop putting words into my mouth, so as to make me look like I don't know what I am talking about.
  
  I have my answers for my life and I don't need a nobody(regardless where you are ranked on this planet), to try and tell me different.
  
  You claim to be GOD, yet you can't even get your understanding straight. You claim GOD is everything and nothing. And, you and all your sadly mistaken followers(all religious people), don't have the right to tell me I am wrong. Especially, when I am clear in mind, clear in heart and clear in conscience.
  
  So, I bid you farewell. Have a great life. There is no debate, because you refuse to see the other side. You wanted me to debate with you about what I've learned, yet you dismiss it all.
  
  So, where is the debate. You only try to make yourself seem profound, when you offer NOTHING of any value to the conversation.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  This is your self realization ? It is totally opposite of the mystics and saints.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Of course it is. Most of the ancient mystics are right-brain guided and I am not.
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  mohitmisraposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You claim that there is no god or intelligent spirit, that's your self realization.
  
  What happens when you die? do you have the answer as you claim to ."I have my answer" please share them.
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