I personally believe and follow God. I do not follow a particular religion, as religions are man made, and most have man made rules that have nothing to do with the belief in God. I simply believe. What are your thoughts on this subject?(:
How can you not follow a religion and follow a god? How does that work?
If you don't know by now you will never never know.
Then, with your vast intellectual prowess, explain it.
OK, I'll take that as a challenge.
Let me put this simple enough that you will understand.
Just because you wright the name of my favorite singer on the side of your band wagon, don't mean that I'm going to jump on that wagon or follow behind it.
That explains nothing. So, thanks for nothing.
OK ! let me get a little more simplistic,
Just cause you wright Potato chips on the side of a bag of rocks and just cause I don't buy it, don't mean that I hate potato chips.
Got it ??
In other words, you are entirely unable to explain it but you've got a marble bag full of hillbilly hubris to share instead.
Thanks for nothing, again.
OK ... I got it ! I understand now. I had my suspisions before but now I got it.
Jerami love metaphor. With respect - unfortunately they don't apply effectively to religion.
Jerami - You don't adhere to any organized religion. Ok. So how do you follow God? How do you know what to follow?
Couture. They made a book on this. It is called the Bible. The Bible did not come from organized religion. Organized religion was formed by man, for power, separation and greed. You do not need organized religion to teach you how to read a Bible.
When do read the Bible, it says man is not good, God alone is good.
How dose that make feel?
You don't have to be a Catholic, Jew, Protestant or affiliate of a man made religion just because you believe in God.
Another way using Jerami's wording...Just because you shop at Wal-Mart, doesn't mean you work at wal-mart (:
That still doesn't explain how you can follow a god without following a religion. Is this a new god you made up or is it one that already has been mentioned?
That's fine, but you are talking about various DENOMINATIONS, not religions with the exception of Jew. Words mean things. Properly worded, you might have had a nice discussion here.
I personally believe and follow God also.
Could you define this God that you worship? And how did you find out about this God if not for the influence of others?
Read a book they like to call the Bible perhaps? It's not a requirement to "sign up" for some religion just to read a Bible.
The bible?! That's absurd. You're just fooling yourself.
There are over 30,000 different denominations of Christianity, and they all read the same bible. It appears that you are not very different from any of them. You are just non-denominational.
There is a difference. The denominations make up rules you have to follow to "be one of them." If you don't follow their rules, then according to them, you are going "against the will of God" and they shun you for it. I do not agree with those ways. I would rather interpret the Bible the way it seems fit to me, not the way some one tells me it has to be seen.
Why not just stop half-stepping and throw the whole bible out? You are still allowing them to control you, and you are rationalizing it.
So, if he doesn't follow an' organized' religion he should forget God? What kind of reasoning is that? Are you a sheep that has to be in a herd? He has a better chance of finding Truth by reading the scriptures than following some minister with his own agenda.
Reading the Bible does not mean I am being controlled by some organization. I'm not being controlled or brain washed or any of that. I read out of my own choice, my own free will. I decide what the things I read mean. I do not let other people tell me "this is what it's supposed to me." I don't agree with that. I believe we are meant to interpret the Bible the way we see fit. Not the way some one else does.
But I can't help but think that after reading the bible, that you somehow think it is true. This shows that you are still being controlled. Who told you that the bible was the inspired word of God? That is who you are being controlled by.
You are reading the bible with a presupposition, that the bible is the inspired word of God, when, in fact, you should suspend that belief, THEN, read the bible. But I don't believe you can do that---because irrational fear of authority causes one to be terrified.
Because I choose to believe it, I am being controlled? So then, saying you choose not to believe it would mean you are being controlled by an out source that says it is not true. We have the ability to decide on our own with out being controlled in any form. Whether you accept that or not is your decision.
You seriously expect reasonable people to believe that? After reading the bible objectively, you have decided--on your own--that it is, indeed, the inspired word of God?
I don't understand how you can excuse an ill-tempered, jealous, unfair, murdering God, unless you have bought into your earlier indoctrination. Still, somehow, you find a way to twist words to justify this psychosis.
By the way. No outside source told me to NOT believe, it was actually the other way--everyone I knew argued with me incessantly. I simply have confidence in my own mind.
You, on the other hand, will impose willful ignorance upon yourself, because of a neurotic fear of authority.
It's not a fear of authority. It is MY choice to believe. Just as it is your choice NOT to believe. I'm not here to change people's minds. Just state my opinions, my beliefs, what I choose, not what people tell me to choose. I have my reasons for believing, just as you may have your reasons not to believe. You seem rather angry about me choosing to believe. I'm sorry if that bothers you, but you see, I CHOOSE to believe, because I WANT to. It doesn't hurt to have something to believe in.
Stated simply, the ripping of the veil outside of the Holy of Holies symbolized that the veil had been removed from over our understanding of God. Reading the scriptures and discerning for yourself is not beyond the grasp of anyone. And much better than taking someone else's word for it. Organized religion boils down to power over people. That has nothing to do with understanding God, and many times hinders your search.
First of all, Why did you respond to my comment with this statement? You created a strawman, then proceeded to answer the strawman's question, not mine.
I'd like you to go back and read my post, and confirm that I said anything close to that.
Another question to your strawman, nothing to do with me.
Not really. If he reads the bible with the assumption(already) that it is the word of God, then he is not much better off.
You must define this "god" thing you believe in before anyone can reply with a "credible" response.
Tell me what "it" is you believe in and I'll try to answer your question.
TY
Qwark
I'm sure you'll have to put him on the pile with the rest, qwark.
Getit:
lol...many of the "select" have been "chosen!" He may be on his way...:
Qwark
Isn't it amazing how these people, boldly, make these assertions, then when asked for some validation, they immediately start feverishly back paddling, while throwing angry childish nonsensical irrelevant comments.
This shows a complete lack of credibility, and an unwillingness to man up when ones premise is proven to be a farce.
Getit:
Yep!
That's why I find 'em so entertaining. They do exactly what I expect.
I'm always chuckling under-my-breath as I respond to 'em.
I haven't found one of 'em that "tapdances" well yet. :
I never try to "prove" them to be farcical. I just offer them logic and reason and watch as they do a "marvelous" backstroke.:
Qwark
This is just a simple question. No need to define anything, I'm asking of every one else's beliefs, not my own.
Yes, it is a "simple" question.
Since the word "god" can only be defined in terms of opinion.
I can only consider it as such: an opinion.
I don't waste any time considering opinions in ref. to "it."
If I did, I would consider it to be an absurd waste of my time.
Thanks for the response...:
Qwark
Well, if it is a waste of time, why bother wasting your time on such forums? (:
Yes, I do believe in the Creator-God whom Jesus used to call God-the-Father; Jesus was neither a god nor a son of god.
And people wonder why the world is going to hell in a hand-basket. Too many selfish people in the world.
Jerami love metaphor. With respect - unfortunately they don't apply effectively to religion.
= = = = = =
Why do they not ?
- = - = - = ===============================
Jerami - You don't adhere to any organized religion. Ok. So how do you follow God? How do you know what to follow?
- - - - - -
I don't know; ? maybe God wrote his laws within my conciousness. I didn't know how to read them as well when my harmones were rageing like a bull,
My eyes are failing me now, I wear glasses, but I think that I am reading the handwritting on the wall much better now than before.
I can only figure out, to the best of my ability, that which I think is the right thing to do. Then do the best that I can do to follow that reasoning.
That's why I mentioned before, Jerami, that you somehow knew everything there was to know about Jesus and that knowledge was confirmed by the bible.
Of course, you most likely got all your beliefs from your childhood indoctrination, from the bible, from a religion.
The Bible is not a religion. You do not need a religion to read the Bible.
Ah, there you are. I had responded to one of your posts asking you to substantiate your extraordinary claims, but you seemed to have disappeared and have now resurfaced here. Strange that.
I would agree you don't need to have a religion to read the bible, or the quran, or any other holy book.
But, if you follow the bible, what god are you promoting? If you follow the quran, what god are you promoting?
Religion is the belief in the supernatural, a category into which gods fall. If you follow a particular holy book thus following that particular god, you got a religion, baby.
Well, the way you explain it makes sense I would say. But I believe the definitions we are going off of are different. The thing I'm talking about is organized religion, man made religion. That I do not agree with. I do not follow it. I follow my heart, my own beliefs. If you want to go by man's definition of religion, then yeah, sure I have a religion. But otherwise, I do not say I belong to any religion.
That's why I mentioned before, Jerami, that you somehow knew everything there was to know about Jesus and that knowledge was confirmed by the bible.
= - = - = ??- = - = !!
No one knows everything.
Some of what I do know was confirmed by the bible, that much is correct.
===========================================
Of course, you most likely got all your beliefs from your childhood indoctrination, from the bible, from a religion.
- - - - = = = = =
NO! I wouldn't agree with that supposition either.
I would say that from reading scriptures, believing to know those things that I already knew; I "MAY" have developed a different perception than many people that I have met.
In fact I have received very little formal teachings from churches.
I was totally surprised when I found out what was being taught; supposedly from the scriptures.
I have a puppy running around in my back yard. It just runs around looking for anything standing to chew it down or pee on it. Then it digs a hole.
Next time it climbs the fence to get out, IF the dog catcher catches it, he can keep it.
I hope I never irritate God like that. If I do, who's fault is it if he lets me stay in the hole that I have dug for myself.
The Bible says something to the effect that God put a knowledge of Himself in all men. I'm religious, i see the logic in Christianity, but I don't follow the organized Church. I try to follow the teachings of the Bible.
And you both fail to realize you've been duped. How ironic?
Not at all cagsil. Had we chosen to believe what PEOPLE tell us, then yeah, I'd agree with you. If you interpret it your own way, then how is it you are? Other than possibly fooling yourself...which I'd much rather fool myself, than believe what others have to tell me.
You've failed yourself then. Apparently you've not paid close enough attention to yourself, much less other people. It is abundantly clear you've been duped to believe in a god.
Yet, fail to realize that Jesus from your own bible despised religion. Religion is the god concept and Jesus wanted nothing to do with it. YOU guiding yourself, through honest thoughts and actions, having love and compassion, for those who do not know how to do it.
It's pathetic that so many people continue to assign a real identity, to something that is clearly not real.
Jesus spoke about 'god' within people. The only thing IN you, is YOU.
No I did not fail to realize that. I can see that what I'm trying to explain does not make sense. If I could explain it better I would. However, I will admit, I'm young and still learning myself. But what you point out about Jesus, I mentioned, not directly of course. I believe my words were "God did not create religion, man did." I understand that is not directly what you say, but it is addressing the issue. This is why I do not follow any religion. I follow what I myself have learned, discovered, experienced, and believe.
You follow your heart. Can't go wrong with that.
No religion made up the "god" concept. Why did the god concept come into being? Because, it was noticed that humanity, the species, needed to be controlled and made to answer a higher authority, otherwise there would be chaos.
Since people easily believed in a higher power and most commonly failed to understand their own life, making them completely unpredictable, they are more easily handled.
Religion is nothing but a hoax. The hoax is the god concept, for which, Jesus recognized during his time. Rulers then, found him a threat, because he denounced religion and it's god concept.
His message is as I said. Self mastery- control your thoughts, control your actions- love yourself first and foremost, then have compassion for those who don't know any better. That is Jesus' "god" concept. Not some imagined entity/spirit.
Although I admire your thoughts on self awareness I would disagree with your conclusions on God and Jesus. Failure to have experienced anything in your own life to assure you of their presence does not negate the experiences of other individuals. An open mind guides one who is truly aware.
I believe in God, but I'm not a big fan of organized religion. My feelings on the subject are similar to Blake's. And Emily Dickinson's.
There are literally thousands of gods to choose from! Have you heard about Stoogism? There is a book about this too!
I didn't know you were such a fan of "fudge"! lol
Wish I'd known that at Christmas, Ray! We overrunneth with fudge then! lol
Hey everybody. Beware the false Stooge gods and their crazy prophet.
I am inspired by the word of Moe! Woop, woop, woop, brothers and sisters!
By the way, just-curious, this was my original post:
"Why not just stop half-stepping and throw the whole bible out? You are still allowing them to control you, and you are rationalizing it."
Not to belabor a point, but wouldn't that be like throwing the baby out with the bath water? I say Church is suspect. God is good.
But by using the bible, you are asserting that your deity is the only source to look for God. I would think that an omniscient, all powerful creator would not confine himself to the pages of a book. That kind of thinking is due to indoctrination.
To look for the truth, I think that by using the same source of the people that you disagree with--to find the truth--is absurd.
It's like a child getting angry with his parent, and threatening to move out, then camping out on the porch.
I would disagree with that. I agree with what I think you are saying, that there are many ways to find God (for those of us who believe). And there is the danger of falling into the trap of religious dogma if you limit yourself to one way. I don't fear that and I do think it is entirely possible to find out what you need to understand God's desire to have a relationship with man from what I believe to be the Holy Scriptures, without joining the cult of organized religion. Just as I believe there are other ways to find Him.
Which God?
This is what I'm talking about. Here, you are stating something that you have merely taken from the imagination of others. Please prove first that there is a God, then, prove that He is a He, then prove that He desires to have a personal relation with us. And can you do it without using the same book that "religious" people use too control others?
And you beleive this based upon what proof?
Getitrite, I understand where you are coming from, but it would be impossible to converse on this because ee have to start from a common ground. You state there is no God I state there is.if we can't agree on the first premise, then whatever argument I presented would be bogus in your eyes. And I was just starting to enjoy taking to you. Oh well, it was fun while it lasted. And just so you know, had no one told me of God, and if there were no scriptures to study I know, in my heart, that He would still have made his presence known to me. I's the open mind thing I guess.
The most logical thing you have said all day, but I really doubt that you have an open mind. But keep believing what you want. It's your right, whether delusional or not.
Funny getitrite
Hey curious, you agreed with me on my middle grounds approach in life and it was some what how you fell about things.
Allah wants all of you and Yahweh is the be all and end all
Are middle grounds for a Christian, like being in the middle of the road where you can get run over?
Maybe, but I think the Christians like me stay alive because we stay out of church, so the organized religions just figure we're atheists too. I can't get run over though. I dodge traffic pretty well.
As soon as I say, everyone is God, many atheists tell me I'm religious.
When I say to an atheist, I do not believe in a personal God or supernatural God, atheists they tell I'm an atheist.
Most Christian ignore me moreso because I do not think jesus is the only way to God, even when I say, I fell mystic about Jesus, you seem to be open enough to the idea.
Um, what most people do not understand is that god is in us, and all around us. We chose to worship the messenger. And why does "god" have to be located anywhere? like, he doesnt have to be a man in the sky. He can be all twisted up in who we are, and what we are capapble of. I just....dont get the old school die hard beliefs...i just dont.
It Kind of makes us and mixes us up into an over ego world. With good sense this world will move slowly towards a spiritual age, it's what I sense anyways, how about you pink?
That spiritual age is what this generation is already considered. According to the "experts" or in other words the scientists.
Which experts or scientists say this ? I don't think 'they' think this at all,
most 'experts' see this period following postmodernism is a degeneration of spritualism along with renewed interrest in humanism.
Reading a lot of the news lately there seems to have been a lot of them mentioning so. Namely a few months ago when it sparked the most, before the end of the year. Unless their opinions have suddenly changed already I would be under the assumption that they still say this is the "spiritual generation."
Maybe you are mistaking what the media say for what 'experts' say ?
There is an attempt by the creationist fundamental school of anti-thinking to promote their unfounded and childish beliefs as though they were in some way comparable to actual thinking and any form or concept of reality - but no actual 'expert' would think that this has anything to do with spirituality.
Maybe.
It also depends on their definition of spirituality. From what I've heard lately, they're defining it as some thing dealing with yoga/tai chi/meditation related things, which I don't quite understand why. I dunno, strange world I suppose.
In China - the new art is moving toward an interest in spiritual values to counterbalance the ascendency of commercial values with the economic renaissance. This renewed interest is about spiritual values rather than a move toward religion and is invariably linked with a heightened focus on humanistic values in society.
Well that's interesting.the communists jail, or kill people of faith for decades, then notice that people do indeed need faith, so they figure out a tidy way to wrap it up. Let's keep the masses in line while we move into the world economy. Won't work china man. If one believes in a Higher Power one will ultimately be responsible first to that higher power. Atheism works best for communists. It's a historical fact. Way to think on your own though. I guess the slogan will be ' If 1.3 billion think it, it can't be wrong'
What makes you think they are atheists. Most beleive in a spiritual position, many are Buddhist, some Taoist, a few christian, and loads of nothing much but they still observe some kind of ritual acknowledgement of the unknown, and they all go and chat with their dead ancestors on a specific day accompanied by lots of spiritual based activities.
I don't blame you for not knowing this, not many western are aware of anything much outside what they are fed by the media.
Interesting comment that Chinese kill people of faith - got a source for that ? or do you mean during the purges of the 50's while America was witch-hunting commies and secretly getting into bombing commies in Vietnam and Cambodia ?
Sorry, your opinions are now suspect. How do I know you're not a chinese government plant on this website? I'm here curiously seeking individual opinions. I don't trust governments to be honest.
Why would that matter? If he exposes ones ignorance with logic, reason and data, it would be that one who should be suspect of honesty or trust.
Hey Beelzedad. If being the definitive word in that sentence. You trust who you want and I'll trust who I want. it's a free country, at least it is in the one I'm posting from. And google the persecution of believers in China. It is ongoing. Play the devil's advocate if you want. Anyone that turns a blind eye to the persecution of anyone, for any reason, is not someone I trust.
In Toronto and Vancouver the largest ethnic group is now Chinese. After being in China a few times I find a lot of people there are spiritually non religionious. I belong to no group yet do tend to more to eastern
spirituality way of thinking. This Royal imperialist rule of law has suppress the people for thousands of years, now the people have rapidly found new ways to be more Global thinking
Beelzedad, you are being nonsensical,as I'm sure you know. There are some truths worthy of giving no quarter on. Persecution of others is dispicable, turning a blind eye to it is dispicable, and trying to use the fact that someone considers it dispicable as a reason for any argument whatsoever is sad. Get rid of the picture of Einstein and replace it with Hitler, Stalin or Mao and then, perhaps, one could consider you serious with that point of view.
I would worship a half naked woman never a Hitler, too religious
Half naked at home that is.
Starting to fell that rearing ugly head
I doesn't believe in god, Because god doesn't do good for me any time in my life.
http://hcgactivator.org
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