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The right way is subjective

  1. mischeviousme profile image60
    mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago

    I could choose any number religions and I'm pretty sure that it would be the right choice, depending on my base belief system and whether or not I'd buy into it. Many men have claimed to know the way and the result was only more confusion. I would say, just choose to believe whatever and then no one can argue, especially if it is personal from the get go. People #1 like to argue this because one does not know, religion is based on belief and no sollid answers can be given from faith.

       If I could choose the right path, it would have nothing to do with religion, it would be the path that I set out for myself. My opinion is that no answer can be given and that the seeker finds what the seeker wants to find. This is good for the self and just the same, the seeker can never impart whatever knowledge he/she has gleemed for, as I've said a 1,000 times before, there is no language spoken or written that can convince me that anyone has the right answer.

    1. autumn18 profile image67
      autumn18posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      That's why I choose no religion.

      1. mischeviousme profile image60
        mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        I too share your view. Religion is nothing more than a trap for the mind. I say learn as much as one can, then move on.

    2. kess profile image60
      kessposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Without deviation from your logic, nor to discredit your conclusion...

      I go further to conclude that everything that you just stated is also just "not the right answer".

      To disagree is to allow your confusion to remain and take deeper roots.

      1. mischeviousme profile image60
        mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        And I said that as well. There is no right answer, especially one that everyone can agree with.

        1. kess profile image60
          kessposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Well its not good for you to be both right and wrong about the one issue....


          That is confusion...

          You are either right or you're not....


          For right can only be right...anything else is wrong....completely.


          To agree with me would mean retracting you position...

          Even if/when you include yourself it still confusion....and you're it.

          1. mischeviousme profile image60
            mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            If I claimed to have the answer, the truth is, none but a few would agree. I have my own answers and I am not confused by them. This is the point I'm trying to make. The answer is not in a book or in the words of men, but right in front of you. You must choose to learn and move on and learn some more. One must never stop learning and must never forget that all paths lead in the same direction.

                Very simply put, there is no need to disagree with anyone for their choice of beliefs. If you find what you're looking for, then that was the answer for you. This is why it is a subjective venture.

    3. Jane Bovary profile image83
      Jane Bovaryposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      The trouble with religious belief is the 'right way' can't be properly discussed - not rationally anyway because there's already an assumption of immutable truth.
      At least with people basing their beliefs on their own reasoning, there's more room for debate and the changing of minds. when something seems truer or 'righter'. After all, most of the great moral leaps forward in the last few hundred years have come from secular thought, not from religious instruction.


      It is true though, that in these days of Western *salad bar* religion, many people just superimpose their own beliefs on their religion anyway...ignoring or making excuses for those bits that don't fit their own moral compass and accepting those that do. This may be a bit feeble (how can a holy book be only true and divine in parts?) but at least it dodges some of the dire consequences of fundamentalism.

      1. mischeviousme profile image60
        mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        People get trapped in their minds by not moving forward. It is better to learn and retain than it is not to move on with the teaching. With free will there is no room for growing stagnant, yet people stay where it is comfortable and forget that the world and people change. They hang their very lives on the words of pious men that love hookers. The point is, that to hang one's life on the words of men, only leads to violence and ego.

            Again this is what the observer in myself see's and it is not based on fact or on any moral high ground. It is just how I view the world and is a part of my own philosophy. People can take it as it is, perhaps learn from it or discuss it like an adult. I cannot be wrong, maybe misguided, but not wrong.

        1. Jane Bovary profile image83
          Jane Bovaryposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          What's the difference between between being misguided and wrong? 'Misguided' suggests there's a correct position to be steered away from.

          1. mischeviousme profile image60
            mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            I was trying to throw jabs at myself with an air of humor. I believe self deprication and humillity should be a staple of human endevour.

    4. A Troubled Man profile image59
      A Troubled Manposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      For the most part, people actually never choose their religion.

    5. Jean Bakula profile image92
      Jean Bakulaposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I think there is a divine energy, but that we are all a spark of it. I have no use for organized religions, they do not answer my questions. I am interested in all religions though, and take what I will from each. I dislike any based on fear or going to hell, I don't believe in heaven or hell, and do believe in reincarnation. I wish all religions would accept the areas where they agree, and stop fighting about who is wrong and who is right. It's like a childish, "My religion is better than yours." We need to decide our own truth. Spirituality is between you and what you believe, and how you choose to live your life. That should be your only concern, except for treating others well.

  2. Cagsil profile image60
    Cagsilposted 5 years ago

    Interesting thread.

    There's always a "right" way and a "wrong" way. And, every individual is able to discern which is which. Whether or not they accept truth when revealed is the difference between being honest and dishonest.

    I wasn't going to bother with this thread, because it's suggestive statement about religion, but it's complete ignorance to think that there's no right answer with regards to a question about life itself.

    I'm of the understanding that those who choose to distort and pass along misinformation, such as "life is too complex to be understood, therefore no one individual could possibly comprehend it", is just that- distortion and misinformation.

    The foundation of being human begins with choice, that choice is simple to make, you either choose to understand your own life or you choose not to do so.

    To understand your own life is the first step before you can even attempt to explain the world around you and your perception of said world. Anyone attempting to explain the world around them through their own perceptions without first knowing themselves, is plain foolishness and blatant ignorance.

    Therefore, you must decide to learn and know about your self before anything else. Any level of ignorance with regards to knowing yourself will only lead to confusion and a skewed perception of living life.

    Since I know myself, I know that the only path for life(anyone's life) is through being honest with one's self, before attempting any action with regards to the rest of the world. This requires a high level of self awareness and a complete understanding of the "word" integrity. Having a high level of self awareness and understanding "integrity", brings about a love for one's self because they will understand the consequences of their actions, on both sides of the equation- (a) self and (b) others. A person cannot love others or claim love for others without first truly understanding themselves, because you need to understanding yourself before love can be achieved within one's self. To make a claim of loving others without loving one's self first and foremost, is just dishonest.

    I completely disagree with anyone who is going to spout off about there being no language or words, which can explain life itself. That's just pure unadulterated nonsense.

    1. mischeviousme profile image60
      mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Again, if the answer is right to you, then it becomes subjective. By subjective I mean you have made it the subject of your life. Then it becomes the right answer for you. But to me, there is no right answer because all the questions point in the same direction. This is my subjective view and while it is not unique in any way, I can only state it in so many words.

           It is very simple to understand what I am saying. I am saying, that there should be no prejudice between religious belief, for the subject matter is all the same, no matter what discipline one should choose to follow. This view does not make me wrong, it makes people argumentative because they know it is right. It may not be right for them, but people don't like it when individuals want to walk outside of the fold so to speak.

           Plain and short. I am a very simple person, with a very simple mind and I don't care who's right or wrong. I just see the simple truth and it's been corrupted by religious piety and the suckers that fight for the wrong reason. I am going to think this way and I am not wrong for it.

      1. Cagsil profile image60
        Cagsilposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        BS. Truth isn't subjective. It's objective and everything I said is TRUTH that isn't up for you to dispute.

        The path laid out as stated cannot be argued with. Therefore, you've no ground to stand on.

        1. Jane Bovary profile image83
          Jane Bovaryposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I'm not a relativist either but how can any of us prove what we believe to be right is objective truth? We can only go by what seems most reasonable.

          1. Cagsil profile image60
            Cagsilposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Prove what is believed is right? Well, my earlier post in this thread isn't a belief. Anyone who reads what I wrote, then makes the claim it's not right, either needs to get over themselves or have their head examined. lol

            1. paradigmsearch profile image85
              paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              o hello, let us chat

            2. mischeviousme profile image60
              mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              I never said you were wrong and I never claimed to be right. I only stated my philosophical mindset. This is how I feel and it is relative to me. You can disagree with it or you can accept it. It is a reallity that one should live with and I have no plans to change. If God or whatever it is chooses for me to change I will, but I don't see that happening in the near future.

              1. Cagsil profile image60
                Cagsilposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                And yes I would disagree with your philosophical mindset, because you're deluding yourself(convincingly) that there's no right way(path).

                Understanding Life isn't that difficult.

                1. mischeviousme profile image60
                  mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  And yet I wasn't talking about life. I was talking about subjective reallity. The objective reallity is of another realm altogether, which I wasn't talking about. Yes we tend to objectify just about every aspect of our lives, but it has nothing to do with subjectivity. I speak my mind as I see it, you can disagree all you'd like or you can see the truth in it. The choice is yours, hence it being subjective in nature.

                  1. Cagsil profile image60
                    Cagsilposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    If you were talking about religion, which you were, then you are talking about life.
                    Reality isn't subjective. Only those who don't understand their own life would think that, because the world around you is explained to you through objective means.
                    You don't know what you're talking about period.

                  2. kess profile image60
                    kessposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    In Life Objectivity and subjectivity should be one and the same... and it is.
                    This why Life is a singularity.

                    For Objectivity of Life is always subjective to the person who is also Life.

                    Therefore though men disagree, none is wrong and all is right.

                    A man is wrong only when he believes himself to be and at that point he becomes wrong and he only believes himself to be wrong because he also believes all others to also be wrong...

                    So when a man is right as he is always, and he believes himself to be wrong, this create a division in himself and this division is his Death...for he does not have Life as it objective. but instead the life if death is his objective.

                    (The Life of death begins in nothing and ends there.)

                    And dead is he indeed for He is at odds with Life itself 

                    Life is Objective but subjective to him who is death so therefore death is ultimately the man.

                    Do all thats in you to understand for Life is at stake... and if you cant then death will take over...

                    Do you best not to be doubtful...for death and doubt are one and the same.

    2. autumn18 profile image67
      autumn18posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Very well said and I completely agree.

      1. Cagsil profile image60
        Cagsilposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Thank you Autumn. smile

  3. paradigmsearch profile image85
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    I mean, seriously,...

  4. paradigmsearch profile image85
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    Am I wrong?...

  5. paradigmsearch profile image85
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    Yes. I am.

  6. paradigmsearch profile image85
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    Or not.

  7. paradigmsearch profile image85
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    x

  8. tillsontitan profile image89
    tillsontitanposted 5 years ago

    Religion can be subjective in that our religion is based on what we believe.  To me it is indisputable there is a God - call Him God, Yahweh, Sun, Creator - whatever.  There is a being greater than we.  Religion is the way we follow that being and the morals we chose to follow in our life.  Without religion there is emotional chaos.  No guiding path to follow, no right from wrong.  What we truly believe, not just what we say we believe, but what we truly believe is indeed right for us.  It may not be right for the next person because he/she may not truly believe.  Any religion requires faith as well as belief, without these there is chaos. You can't make up the rules as you go along; they were made up for you centuries ago.

    1. Jane Bovary profile image83
      Jane Bovaryposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      "Without religion there is emotional chaos.  No guiding path to follow, no right from wrong"

      Those are just brute assertions.."believe this because I say so". Not very convincing.

      Edited to add:

      "You can't make up the rules as you go along; they were made up for you centuries ago."

      Yes, you can. In fact that's what we've been doing all along. If we didn't we'd still be stoning people to death, burning witches and condoning slavery.

      1. mischeviousme profile image60
        mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        You are talking about moral platitude and religious law and again, I will either follow the rules or not. This the dillema of free will. Some choose to do wrong and some choose to do wrong. I'd like to think that my actions are considered right. I don't stone people and I never burn anyone however, I can be very vengeful, within the constraints of the law of course.

    2. mischeviousme profile image60
      mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Free will makes any rules made for me, moot. I follow what is morally right because I believe morals and justice are a good thing. With free will rules made by men can either be followed or ignored. This too is subjective in nature and is the point of the entire thread.

  9. paradigmsearch profile image85
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    o m hi?

    1. paradigmsearch profile image85
      paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I want to be paid.

      1. mischeviousme profile image60
        mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        write a hub and advertise. How are you? Do you enjoy my attempts at witt and sarcasm or my jabs at being intellectual?

  10. GoldenBird profile image60
    GoldenBirdposted 5 years ago

    "... there is no language spoken or written that can convince me that anyone has the right answer."

    -I agree. But there may be many books we have never read; and many people we have never spoken to, or heard of..

    1. mischeviousme profile image60
      mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Meher Baba said that "The beauty of life is that it is life". He didn't speak with his mouth, for he had taken a vow of silence in his early twenties. Instead he used a board with an alphabet to point out what he had to say. Now I could agree with the things he said or I can ignore them, the nature of such a topic is subjective to the reader, or one can choose to be objective, but over all it is up to the reader.

          I claim no religion because as a member of the human race, I've been exhausted by all the piety and haughtiness of people that claim to be one way or another. While I am not an atheist, some would think that I am because I don't see God the way they do. I can no more make you understand the pain that I feel when I stub my toe. There simply are no words that could make you feel my pain.

      1. GoldenBird profile image60
        GoldenBirdposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        I do understand where you stand in your journey. You mentioned Meher Baba, the Indian mystic.

        Now I will suggest another Indian mystic, named Rabindranath Tagore. He was a poet. He wrote one poem that may give you some light-




        "A wandering madman was seeking the touchstone, with matted locks
        tawny and dust-laden, and body worn to a shadow, his lips
        tight-pressed, like the shut-up doors of his heart, his burning
        eyes like the lamp of a glow-worm seeking its mate.

        Before him the endless ocean roared.
        The garrulous waves ceaselessly talked of hidden treasures,
        mocking the ignorance that knew not their meaning.
        Maybe he now had no hope remaining, yet he would not rest, for
        the search had become his life,—

        Just as the ocean for ever lifts its arms to the sky for the
        unattainable—
        Just as the stars go in circles, yet seeking a goal that can
        never be reached—
        Even so on the lonely shore the madman with dusty tawny locks
        still roamed in search of the touchstone.

        One day a village boy came up and asked, "Tell me, where did you
        come at this golden chain about your waist?"
        The madman started—the chain that once was iron was verily gold;
        it was not a dream, but he did not know when it had changed.
        He struck his forehead wildly—where, O where had he without
        knowing it achieved success?
        It had grown into a habit, to pick up pebbles and touch the
        chain, and to throw them away without looking to see if a
        change had come; thus the madman found and lost the touchstone.

        The sun was sinking low in the west, the sky was of gold.
        The madman returned on his footsteps to seek anew the lost
        treasure, with his strength gone, his body bent, and his heart
        in the dust, like a tree uprooted."

        1. mischeviousme profile image60
          mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Are you calling me insane? Just kidding. I understand the meaning, when one searches for this kind of truth, it get's lost in all the paths that may be taken.

             I don't remember what it is but I'd like to say that I follow the way of no way, so that I may someday know my own way.

          1. GoldenBird profile image60
            GoldenBirdposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            True!

            If you stay truthful, I believe you will.

            By the way, that mad man did win a Nobel Prize smile  ..not so mad!

 
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