Truth

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   mischeviousmeposted 11 years ago

   It's true that there is space and water, we see it, we feel it, we're made of it. These are undeniable truths, but their still being filtered through perception. Perceptions are molded, never changed. We are habitual creatures in this way, our perceptions become attachments of sorts. We confuse said attachments with reality and apply it(indirectly)to our identity. Thus we are always right, within our selve's, we make judgements based on our sense of self.
   
   We make our own truths, basically.
   
   
   Is this a reasonable statement?

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      Shadesbreathposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Depends which philosopher you like. Locke or Descartes might go with that, Derrida would not. Always fun to think about though, ain't it?

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      Deborah Sextonposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      _____________________
      
      No

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         mischeviousmeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Why not? Is your indoctrination that deep, that you have no opinion of your own?

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            Deborah Sextonposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            ********
            
            All that I believe is mine and I am not indoctrinated. You will find no one else whose beliefs are like mine. So my "NO" is only because I disagree with you.
            
            I'm sorry you can't allow others to have their own opinions, and because of that, you seem very indoctrinated with a very strange doctrine.
            
            I'm sorry I couldn't agree with you the way you want.

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               mischeviousmeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               I asked if it was reasonable, not that you see it my way. I'm sorry if it came off wrong...

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   knolyourselfposted 11 years ago

   Of course one makes one's own truth by what one wants to believe. And people can believe anything in the mind.

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      mischeviousmeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Truth is nothing but perception, we learn through our individual attitudes/positions and it has an effect on our identity. If if one can let go of identity, he/she may become free of mind.

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      1. 61

         Druid Dudeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         I can perceive that something is true, you can perceive that the opposite is true, but the truth can actually be somewhere between your perception and mine, or it can exist outside of OUR perception. In short, we both might be full of it. Real truth remains regardless of what I or you perceive it to be.

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            Emile Rposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            That about sums it up.

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            jonnycomelatelyposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            I disagree.  The perception of truth requires a consciousness to perceive it.  If you/I are conscious of something then we can give description to it.  Without you/I, there is nothing.
            
            I return to the original statement of "mischeviousme."  He asked "is this a reasonable statement."  I see several statements, not just one.  I don't need to agree with all of it or any part of it.  I have choice, so do you. 
            
            Those who are indoctrinated will say they have no choice, only what "the Lord" puts into their mind.

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               Druid Dudeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               The earth is here=statement of truth. If you or I were not here, if no human being was here, I assure you, the earth still would be, unless it is a mass illusion dependent on our existence. Kind of a spooky concept that last part. (Not totally out of the realm of possibility, either!)

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                  Druid Dudeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  The truth would still be truth if no one perceived it. What you said suggests that the room beyond the door doesn't really exist until someone opens the door and looks in. The room may not exist on a totally personal level, but in material reality the room existed outside of your experience. That is all.

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                     mischeviousmeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     What of the great egress? P.T. Barnum had a tent leading to the egress, people stood in long lines to see it... Turned out to be the exit. People for the most part, are naive. "One born every minute", as the saying goes. Our perceptions can be fooled, so then can our deepest minds. The illusions of life are of our own creation and we are easily swayed by them.

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   knolyourselfposted 11 years ago

   One can say there is the truth of the body which is feelings. One can say there is the truth of Identities which are the creation of the mind. Identities can definitely be and often are delusional, and where most of the trouble comes from. But Identities can
   be eliminated or changed.

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4. 61

   Druid Dudeposted 11 years ago

   Only if you are:1) in the witness protection program
                            2) in the C.I.A.
                            3) A member of ODESSA

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5. 67

   Saleeln18posted 11 years ago

   I believe it is a reasonable statement, it does necessarily apply to everything and anything but it is definitely a legitimate statement for some people and some situations. I think people believe what they want to believe, and see truth in what they want to be is true (also known as being naive).
   
   For example: A girl is romantically involved with a guy who is well known "player", still she continues to pursue and committ to him.
   
   Now, everyone else knows he is cheating on her, and deep down i'm sure she does as well. But she stays naive to this due to her own reasons: she won't accept the truth instead she will let her own truth about him suffice.

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      jonnycomelatelyposted 11 years agoin reply to this

        Very glad to see you have some flexibility of mind.  We can only surmise and consider - keeping an honest and enquiring outlook, thank you.
      
      
      
      The first paragraph could be true... if the door of the mind can be opened sufficiently to perceive it.  This would be outside of many, if not most, minds.  I appreciate that.  The colloquial religion is designed to avoid too much mental strain.
      
      For the second paragraph, yes, I can accept that is how most of us would see the situation.

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   jonnycomelatelyposted 11 years ago

   And yet you cannot see the truth of what I have written!  So you presume that I do not speak the truth?
   
   Is it because of what I write, or is it because you cannot see?

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   1. 61

      Druid Dudeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Now why would you expect me to disrespect you like that. The question remains; do you believe that a thing doesn't exist until it is perceived to exist?

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         jonnycomelatelyposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         At the present time, Yes.  I do believe that.  Not to say my mind will never change of course. 
         
         In my previous post: "So you presume that I do not speak the truth?"  No, I was not assuming you would not respect me, sorry for conveying that idea.  Greatly respect your contributions.

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            Druid Dudeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Now, you lazy, idiotic, good for naught....JUST KIDDING! You may be miscomprehending the observation that the act of observing an experiment changes the experiment. Otherwise, your point is quite delusional. because there are 3 billion chinese, most of whom I would suggest, you have never seen. Things do exist which you have never witnessed. I will add that it is a typical euro opinion you state. euros think that the continents I stand on didn't exist until Columbus "perceived" them.

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               jonnycomelatelyposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Druid Dude, this is a quote from your own Profile:  "I believe that we are all on the threshold of a new age, a new understanding."
               
               Would you like to explain to us how you envisage the "new understanding" coming about, if we don't "look beyond the square" and consider all ideas and possibilities, even if they do appear at first sight to be idiotic or improbable?

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               A Troubled Manposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Seriously dude, that is one of the most weakest, lamest arguments one can use to support anything. It's also a fallacy.

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   mischeviousmeposted 11 years ago

   What ever I proclaim, I percieve as true...

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      aka-djposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Deception produces understanding that seem true, but are in fact lies.
      
      So, proclaiming perceived truth, can be a lie!

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         mischeviousmeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Absolutely... When a child learns something and retains said knowledge into adulthood, it is hard for certain aspects of said knowledge, to be unlearned. When it is taught as truth, there is little room for change. It has become a knowing, instead of an idea or understanding.

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            aka-djposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            But, it doesn't stop there, or stay that way, once TRUTH is revealed.
            To stay in deception thereafter is deliberate denial.
            
            To accept truth means to change.
            
            No-one is born again without such a transformation. NO ONE.

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            1. 60

               mischeviousmeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Every moment gone is a form of death, every moment not yet lived is a rebirth. A moment ago I was here, but I am here now. Every moment I exist, my brain is creating a picture for me and it shows via personality. So then the idea of God would be that very thing, a noun...

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