Do you think human beings really evolved from primates?

1. 60

   LCGreenposted 12 years ago

   So I guess everything we create as man is just stupid? I'm sorry, but I have a little more dignity and integrity than to call my being created stupid. You stand where you stand VoltaireZ and I stand where I stand. Thank you for your insight.

   replyreport
2. 65

   NathanielZhuposted 12 years ago

   The detailed work of evolution is what makes it so cool. It's a system in which big change is made from finely tuned little changes (which is why macroevolution is merely microevolution over a long time span). That's how you get such complexity as your giraffe example. As the selective factors like environment/climate/predators slowly changed, the effects of natural selection selectively caused the death of thousands of giraffes over thousands of years which lead to the modern giraffe.
   
   Is it such a hard concept to grasp? We don't simply go from metal to cars. It requires a combination of tiny processes and modifications to create the image of perfection.

   replyreport
   1. 61

      qwarkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Yep Zhu!
      Qwark

      replyreport
3. 60

   LCGreenposted 12 years ago

   I wonder also, if you make something from your hands that may have the same blueprint as say a cell phone, wouldn't you want to be accredited for it just the same? As in art, you can take a painting and tweak it and make your own and still want your name for everyone to see, as well as music. Take two beats and mesh them to make one and put new words to the feeling of it, you would want it to be yours. I'm not saying dismiss what was before us as nothing, but realize that open mindedness is something we all have to have with evolution and the same with creationism. If I believed in evolution how miraculous it is to find that something that was nothing is not something more. Why do I have to be stupid or ignorant to believe creationism (just as miraculous if not more). It hurts to know that people out there believe that I me, myself, my personality, my individuality was from something far less. I'm sorry but I don't believe that. I'm too intricate. My brain is far superior than any chimpanzee or animal for a reason. Why would it be stupid to believe with open mindedness that someone couldn't make this. And, why would it be stupid if they did?

   replyreport
4. 61

   TMMasonposted 12 years ago

   And it required intelligence to create that car from metal.
   
   Or was you ignoring that part of it?
   
   The metal did not just become a car... man applied knowledge and work to the metal, and created that car... after he created the metal from the ore. And you know something, if certain parts of that car are not on it or were never put on at a certian point... it does not work. So then we get into irreducably complex, and that doesn't help Darwin.
   
   Please, a lil more than a assainine anlogy like that if you want to impress. We, I and some few others here, are not Leftists, we do not fall over in awe of circular reasoning and flawed logic.
   
   There are multiple systems which stump evolutionists in the human body and in nature, the eye, the mind. C'mon.
   
   Again, Evolution exists... just not in the way you all want it to, nor in the fashion you all want to apply.
   
   And as far as the tail bone... just because it is there does not mean there was a tail connected to it. More leaps. One, you would have to show a tail is all that is for,... and that is BS...
   
   
   http://www.angelfire.com/mi/dinosaurs/tailbone.html
   
   I got my, "Darwin is Dead", shirt on right now ...

   replyreport
   1. 96

      wildernessposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I assume that you will agree that bacteria can and do mutate into something they were not with abilities, strengths and weaknesses they did not have.
      
      I would expect you to say the same thing about Mendels fruit flies, but have you chosen a point beyond which it is Gods work rather than evolution?
      
      You mention irreducable complexity - is it any animal that has an eyeball that is the determining point where evolution cannot occur?

      replyreport
      1. 61

         TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         No, I won't... they are still bacteria in the end, Wild.
         
         We know traits can come and go... but those traits are within a species, and do not give rise to a new species.
         
         Could a specimen form one end of the spectrum of a species, become so far from the other end of the spectrum, that reproduction and other things are impossible... sure... but it is still the same species.
         
         Evolution is a tool of and within creation... not the source of creation.

         replyreport
         1. 96

            wildernessposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Thank you.  Your stance begins to make some sense to me - I begin to understand, finally, what you mean.
            
            Correct me if I'm wrong, but you seem to be saying that evolution can and does occur within a species, giving rise to new traits and abilities, but that it cannot produce a new species.  Am I right here so far?
            
            You produce this sophistry by re-defining the meaning of the word "species".  I checked three different sources and all three agree that the ability to interbreed is a key ingredient in determining what species an animal is.  While a few different species can interbreed (donkey-horse for instance) ALL members of a particular species can do so.  Traits, appearance, etc. matter and should be considered, but the ability to breed is a primary trait to evaluate.
            
            By this means you are able to then claim that animals that have evolved so far from the baseline of its species that they can no longer interbreed are still the same species - that no new species was produced by evolution.  This is patently false by the definitions used by evolution and biology, but quite reasonable when using your personal definition.
            
            By your reasoning however, you are the same species as a gorilla as we share a common ancestor.  Evolution within a species has produced very different beings, but they are still the same species because of that common ancestry.  You are also a redwood tree for the same reason - some piece of slime long long ago got a different mutation than it's brother and took a different road but, hey, they're still the same species!

            replyreport
            1. 61

               qwarkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               ....love it!
               Qwark

               replyreport
               1. 96

                  wildernessposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  The problem, Qwark, is I doubt it is intentional.  I don't believe that TM spent days and days figuring out just how to subtly twist that one word, not for a minute.
                  
                  Rather, it is the fundie way of debate.  Listen to others that have done just that and see if it makes sense to the religious view.  It does?  Then use the same invalid argument.
                  
                  I once debated with a hubber on her hub - she was finally reduced to saying that if I could show her a dog giving birth to a cat, see it with her own eyes on every common street corner, then and only then would evolution be proven.  Every other requirement she proposed was met, but the method was to then say "I didn't mean that, I mean this and raise the bar of proof to something more difficult.  Culminating with the dog/cat thing.
                  
                  Some can be taught to reason and think - some have their indoctrination and desires driven far too deeply to ever permit it.

                  replyreport
                  1. 61

                     qwarkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                     I have compiled a list of those who have proven to be functioning, intellectually, at the level of simple bacteria.
                     I don't respond to them.
                     The list is growing...:
                     Qwark

                     replyreport
                     1. 96

                        wildernessposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                        Same here.  I will only respond as a joke or if I think that my comments might help someone else.
                        
                        At the same time the list contains some that, outside of the religio-politico forums, can be fun to talk to and provide some insightful thoughts.  And I can sometimes learn something new even there in how people "think" - how they come to their conclusions.

                        replyreport
                        1. 61

                           qwarkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                           ...agree!
                           Entertainment, here in the forum, is important for me, so there are those whom I repond to for that reason...yep  :
                           Qwark

                           replyreport
5. 61

   qwarkposted 12 years ago

   Preacher Don just made my list...:
   
   Qwark

   replyreport
6. 65

   NathanielZhuposted 12 years ago

   It seems to me (TMMason and LCGreen) that you believe humans couldn't have evolved due to our superior intelligence. Well for one, why do you think we are intelligent? Because we simply have no one else smarter than us? Why not compare ourselves within our own species and say we are NOT smart. You can see this in those who suffer from down's syndrome (trisomy 21). Do you know why they are as dumb as the other animals? It is simply because of 1 single mutation on chromosome 21. Intelligence comes from the genes, and only a single mutation differs us from the other animals. Then how can we assume that we could not have evolved from a dumber predecessor when we can return to our dumb state instantly with a single mutation?

   replyreport
7. 58

   nomaDicVenturesposted 12 years ago

   The past exists only as a memory in the now-
   
   the story of evolution is the source code for your current creation-
   
   when your done looking for the answers, youll be right here- ready to enjoy the creation

   replyreport
8. 76

   BukowskiBabeposted 12 years ago

   While I don't believe we evolved from apes, adaptations occur all around us. As I believe in G-d, I believe that he created us in his image. Now, I know to many this belief appears to defy logic. I understand. Perhaps the truth is somewhere in between. I have speculated that perhaps, after the fall of man, mankind was forced to evolve in some sense. Yes, yes, it's speculation.

   replyreport
   1. 71

      getitriteposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      ?????

      replyreport
   2. 57

      Evolution Guyposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      No. This belief does defy logic. There is no in between - this is just you denying facts in order to keep believing nonsense. Yes - illogical speculation to defend a belief that is obviously wrong. People do it all the time. You will get there. Humans evolved. There is no question of this. You choosing to believe nonsense will not change that fact.
      
      Good luck.

      replyreport
9. 90

   melporposted 12 years ago

   Preacherdon, the proof of evolution is in our DNA. We have a snip of DNA from every animal below us and every animal and plant in this world is still evolving. Every time a new generation of any plant or animal come into existence it is a slight change in them as a result of environmental pressure or that change from the previous generation is due to mutation brought on by the environmental pressure and due to the new combination of genetic material from the parent. This observation is what got Charles Darwin started on the development of the theory of evolution simply because he noticed each one of his children were different and the off-springs of all animals are slightly different from their parents. Evolution is no longer a theory and it has been proven many times that this process occurs based on current research. Today doctors are able to treat many diseases because we now have a better understanding of evolution and as a matter of fact just about all diseases is a result of evolution. The common cold is a good example of this fact. This why is why we have not found a cure for the common cold because the virus responsible for giving us a cold is constantly mutating through the process of evolution. The corn plant is another example of evolution. Through selective breeding by people living in, I believe in ancient Americas, grass seeds were transformed into the present day corn we are now eating.

   replyreport
   1. 61

      qwarkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      2 thumbs up Melpor!  :
      
      Qwark

      replyreport
   2. 64

      preacherdonposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      That sounds more lack micro-evolution than macro-evolution. Micro evolution I believe is biblical.

      replyreport
      1. 59

         A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         The latter process is exactly the same as the former, just over longer periods of time.

         replyreport
10. 61

    TMMasonposted 12 years ago

    The only proof they have is repetition... they seem to think it adds "fact" to the fire.
    
    They like to play the game of, "You don't believe in evolution!"... when we do... just not as they want to spout it as.

    replyreport
11. 76

    BukowskiBabeposted 12 years ago

    God doesn't need to evolve, rather our perception of him evolves.

    replyreport
12. 66

    awareposted 12 years ago

    Seeding is a plausible  idea i think.    Be it  deliberate or by   catastrophe .   I always ask    those that are questing for those answers what they   would do with them  if attained.  I thank my mom for my existence  . Therefor my answer to the primate question is no.
    Ray

    replyreport
    1. 96

       wildernessposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       Because you came from your mom (a primate) man did not come from primates? 
       
       What am I missing here?

       replyreport
       1. 84

          psycheskinnerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

          Maybe he is a case of immaculate conception....

          replyreport
13. 66

    awareposted 12 years ago

    Am i to understand that  in this civil dialogue . You immediately start  by  calling my mother a ape ? You seem to be missing the ability to exchange contrary ideas in a  understanding and tolerant  manner .
    Ray

    replyreport
    1. 57

       Evolution Guyposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       Your mother is an ape. As are you. As are we all. You seem to be missing a basic education.

       replyreport
       1. 96

          wildernessposted 12 years agoin reply to this

          Partially correct.  While the common term for the family in question is "great ape" the correct term is hominid or hominidae.
          
          The term "ape" is more commonly used to denote all of the hominid family except the genus "homo" - thus we are not apes.
          
          A matter of semantics.

          replyreport
          1. 84

             psycheskinnerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

             Scientifically that distinction makes very little sense.  But in any case the question was whether we come from primates--and that term is inclusive of humans.  So yes, we come from and are currently primates.

             replyreport
14. 66

    awareposted 12 years ago

    a arrangement of atoms. Im not shortsighted . 
    Ray

    replyreport
15. 0

    Sherlock221bposted 12 years ago

    ---“We are skeptical of claims for the ability of random mutation and natural selection to account for the complexity of life. Careful examination of the evidence for Darwinian theory should be encouraged.”---
    
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ty1Bo6Gm … re=related

    replyreport
16. 84

    psycheskinnerposted 12 years ago

    Wow, we've got a lot of mileage to get out of a made up assertion and an illogical question.

    replyreport
17. 0

    klarawieckposted 12 years ago

    Some primates are more "human" than us...
    
    
    

    replyreport
18. 80

    earnestshubposted 12 years ago

    As we are primates I don't see the point of this question.

    replyreport
19. 0

    Sherlock221bposted 12 years ago

    Religious views of how the universe came into being are perfectly ok, if the individual believer finds that believing man is the centre of the universe, and that there is something special about our planet amongst the trillions of others in the universe gives them a sense of importance in an otherwise meaningless existence.  However, this should be left to the individual, and they should not attempt to replace fact with belief in public education.  It is a dishonesty to teach children untruths about the universe. 
    
    All children should be presented with the evidence.  If they choose to deny that evidence, that is up to them.

    replyreport