Another list of lovely things... Patheic

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   Matthew Kirkposted 12 years ago

   I won't name the hubber who I am talking about, many of you will know them though and many I'm sure will have a problem with what I am about to say.
   
   Every few weeks (although I am not a follower) I get a new hub about the "100 best thing about childrens smiles" or pathetic fan letters, which are really just another list of a famous persons filmography or landmarks in their life. It is never written in a compelling style, it is usually literally just a stupid list with between a sentence and a paragraph at the top of the pages i.e.
   
   100 ways to enjoy a cup of coffee
   
   I love coffee and enjoy it often. We need to be reminded of the good things in life like coffee, so remember that coffee tastes best when doing the following:
   1. In a cafe listening to the radio
   2. Watching TV after dinner
   3. At the table reading the paper
   4. When you friend comes round for a suprise visit
   5. When I'm in bed in the dark with chocolate smothered around my nipples
   .......
   
   Okay the last one was a joke. And the above is an example, but a very close one of the endless stream of non specific hubs without any function or use. This person does actually have some fairly decent hubs, at least some of them have some real substance, i.e. they are a recipe or an article that informs. I will be honest, the writing style isn't the best, but is far from the worst.
   
   What annoys me more than anything is the sheer amount of comments, likes and shares each hub gets! It must take a person of average intelligence 5 seconds to come up with these nonsense hub ideas, they are unlike anything else on here and not in a good way, is there something I'm missing? This goes back to a forum post I got in trouble for a while back - should we really be commenting and encouraging poor or average hubs?
   
   I don't have a personal problem with this person, in fact I'm sure the hubber is lovely in person, but they stand for everything I take a strong dislike to on hub pages, this false community of praising utter rubbish for the sake of it, in fact this particular hubber is their god by the looks of it.
   
   Why is this utter tat praised to high heaven? Am I missing something? Should this kind of hub even be allowed as it gives us all a bad name. I would name the person or specific hubs but I don't think it is allowed. If you know who I am talking about then I want to know your thoughts.

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      Hollie Thomasposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I don't, but you tend to do this often, Matthew. You'll slate someones hubs and then hint at who they are. I don't get you, you say it's the number of comments and likes that bother you, but whether you like it or not social networking is a a part of this site. If it's because you want the likes and the shares, then network more. Personally, I rarely comment on hubs, only when I think them exceptional do I bother.
      
      And it's a bit mean to keep doing this, hinting at another hubber and then asking the community to give their opinion.

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         Matthew Kirkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Hollie, that is not the point, I wouldn't want a comment or a like for something that is poor poor quality, what is the point of these hubs?

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            Uninvited Writerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            So why take the extra step of posting an insulting comment on a hub if you don't like it? Just ignore it. Obviously others disagree with you.

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               Matthew Kirkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               I don't know whether they do disagree, I don't think anyone thinks it is as brilliant as they say it is. I feel I have to make the comment, I think it is important to let people know they don't have to be so nicey nicey all of the time and to balance it out a bit.

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            Hollie Thomasposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            What might be poor quality to you might be 'cool' in the eyes of another. The quality of reading material is subjective, as is any other form of entertainment (If I can use that term?) What you might find stimulating and informative may be completely the opposite to what another finds stimulating and objective. Yes, there is a lot of crap out there, but the crap tends to earn and you cannot and should not try to censor anyone elses reading material. That's not your job.

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               Matthew Kirkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               I think I am well within my rights to discuss this Hollie, and I don't think I'm being out of order.
               
               I understand your point about subjectivity, but there has to be a general standard.

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                  Hollie Thomasposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  And who defines the general standard? And do you feel that it's within your rights to keep hinting and teasing out specific hubbers? Why do you do that?

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                     Matthew Kirkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                     We all know and feel high standards, example the taming of the shrew = masterpiece (however annoying), The come-back girl (katie price) = lowest possible form of literature.

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                        Hollie Thomasposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                        Katie Price has earned millions. Clearly you are not writing for the money, but some people are. You have no right to say how people should earn or who should enjoy their work. What you think is about this is irrelevant.

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                  recommend1posted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  The general standard is just - a general standard.  And it is determined by what people want - not by any particular 'quality'.
                  
                  Under another name here I have some poetry, now I am a 'trained' poet in some regard because it was part of my degree course, and I have been published hard copy, not online, and I used to teach poetry for University.  My best effort is pretty much correct, and it is also correct  on many levels that  people without an education specifically in poetry would not understand.  Yet emotive quasi-religious greeting card puke gets far more attention and hits, I mean far far more!   
                  
                  I am afraid that the benchmark is what people want - not what we might like them to have.   Now that the uneducated and unwashed are the majority they dictate taste and quality.

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      Uninvited Writerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      You don't have to read them...

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         Matthew Kirkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         I try not to

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      Cardisaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Matthew, believe or not, these types of articles have their place in the web. People like to read top ten or 100 lists. One of my best performing hubs is a top ten and I have another fairly new hub about ten reasons to live and that is doing well too.
      
      I know the hubber you are referring to, at least I think I do and her hubs are sometimes a breath of fresh air. I see no problem with her lists.

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      Matthew Kirkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Well this has got you all wound up. I take on board some of your points. But other points I do not, I still think everyone is too supportive on here often over rubbish.
      
      Where I come from most people call a spade a spade.

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         Cardisaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         My point is, if people want to support rubbish as you call it, isn't it their prerogative? If the hub is plagiarized, bad spelling and grammar, nonsense or gibberish (spun), then I would certainly call attention to the hub and make a fuss. But these hubs are original in their own right and they do have a place in the internet and you don't like them so what? Why make a big deal? I don't get it

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   Peanutritiousposted 12 years ago

   I'm not exactly sure who the hubber you refer to is but I have read a number of hubs like this. I agree, they're not particularly inspiring. I often feel that the best hubs are the ones which I would be ashamed to write. I've had ad's on my hubs disbled for mentioning topics such as 'suicide'. I think hubpages prefers nice, safe articles but I'd rather not bother quite frankly!

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      Peanutritiousposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      by 'best' I mean, the most popular not the ones I think are the best!

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         Matthew Kirkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         I would prefer to read something serious like that by far, and I can't see something like suicide doing SE damage or otherwise.

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         terinah14posted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Does that mean i can't write about depression and the like?

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   Sunshine625posted 12 years ago

   Quick question for you Matthew...If you aren't following me, how are you getting a new hub every few weeks? Are you possibly stalking me? If you don't like or appreciate my hubs just simply stop reading them and posting negative comments.
   If you have nothing nice to say then say nothing at all. Is that too difficult for you to do?
   I could create a list for you if you'd like.

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      Matthew Kirkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Create it...

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         Sunshine625posted 12 years agoin reply to this

         I already did, many months ago. "If You Can't Say Something Nice..."

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      tussinposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      In my feed I get notifications of new hubs written by people I don't follow.

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         Motown2Chitownposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         If you receive notifications in your feed of hubs written by people you don't follow, it's because you have asked to receive notifications in topics that you do follow.  You can always change your filters.

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      Cardisaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Sunshine, I actually replied before seeing your post. Don't let it get to you. If someone doesn't like your hubs then they shouldn't read or follow you.
      
      I don't always like all the hubs of the people I follow but I don't criticize them for it.

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         Sunshine625posted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Hi Cardisa
         Matthew doesn't bother me. I find him entertaining in an annoying kind of way.

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      K9keystrokesposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      "I could create a list for you if you'd like." HA!! Love it, Linda!

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         Sunshine625posted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Hi India, there's a good reason I'm called the Queen of Lists!

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            Barbara Kayposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Sunshine625, Now all his complaining has given me some new ideas. If I write a list, he'll just have to ignore it.

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               Barbara Kayposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               And besides I've read Sunshine's hubs and they are a breath of fresh air.

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               Sunshine625posted 12 years agoin reply to this

               I look forward to your list Barbara! I visited your crochet hub tonight...great links are included!

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                  kathleenkatposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  I, too, am encouraged to write a list.
                  
                  I think we should ALL write lists.

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            terinah14posted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Yeah! Every writer has their own label and differences. Like in music, we have our own genres. If you don't like a musician you don't go telling them to stop creating music.

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      daisydayzposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Well said Sunshine! He should just quit being a bore, and keep his opinions to himself. I enjoy some of your lists, nice change from uber serious stuff sometime!

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   WriteAngledposted 12 years ago

   Perhaps the hubber has discovered that this formula brings in a lot of views/clicks and enables a hub to be thrown together in minutes.
   
   If so, s/he is probably laughing all the way to the bank.
   
   It is evident from comments here and elsewhere that what succeeds best on the Net is pap that appeals to the lowest common denominator of (sub)humanity. Carefully researched material that expounds in detail on more complex topics is not wanted by the average surfer. Producing such articles is a luxury that not everyone can allow themselves, if they need to make a living from online writing.
   
   If the "100 best" is making this hubber a good income, kudos to her/him.

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      tussinposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Couldn't agree more.

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         Matthew Kirkposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         You're probably right, although I don't understand it at all. How can it keep someone on the page long enough to gain the money from the adverts?
         
         Are people really reading lists of 100 fun ways to sit on a chair?

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            Hollie Thomasposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Yes, perhaps that's because they find it a refreshing alternative to how to make your own pesto.

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            nightnightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Ha ha.... or perhaps 100 to ways to fall asleep....
            
            People are quite unpredictable! I just think that its a clever marketing technique. People are more likely to share 'funny' hubs to show their friends then 'serious' factual hubs. If it's working then I dont have any problem with it.
            
            (You could always write an opposing hub.... like '100 ways not to write a hub' I reckon it could become quite popular. (Well in the hubbing community that is!)

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            tussinposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            If they are at the moment sitting in a chair and wondering how to spice it up to the max....I suppose then they are reading such articles.

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               ReneeDC1979posted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Nice comment, love the bowtie.  According to this hub, he may see this as a meaningless reply so I hope you see this before I get denied.

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   kathleenkatposted 12 years ago

   Are you bothered because someone else is finding success in a way in which you've pre-determined to be stupid? If you don't like it, don't read it.
   
   Apparently other people like it though. I see it as another form of creative writing; of generating ideas within  whatever constraints.
   
   Publicly criticizing other people's creativity is a little out of bounds, I think. I mean, come on, it's not that hard for people to figure out who you're talking about. The sneaky part? You're covering your ass by not flat-out saying their name, so they can't report it as a personal attack.
   
   How do you think this person feels right now? Hopefully flattered; but probably not.

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   ReneeDC1979posted 12 years ago

   I say if you don't like it don't read it, and you spelled pathetic wrong.

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   American Viewposted 12 years ago

   Matthew,
   
   Why are you wasting our time? Your rant is the prefect reflection of what is wrong in our society today. Let me ask you this, who the hell died and made you boss? The world is filled with many people of many styles and I would not miss out on any one of them. If we allow attitudes like your dictator style to prevail, we would not be able to bask in the glow of diversity.
   
   So you do not like Mark Twain, then put the book down and move on. You are not happy with someone that has found a writers niche and is getting followers, to bad. Sounds like you are jealous. Oh wait, you only wrote 16 hubs in 9  months, yea you really set the standard. You want more followers, write more articles!! No one gets 100 followers just because they wrote one hub, it takes time to get a following. I personally like it that I have a small following, at least I know my followers are loyal readers.
   
   I know you say you do not have a personal problem with the hubber, but sorry, you do. Your thread here screams intolerance on many levels. Your critical of the writer, the subject matter, the followers, the comments, the sharing,and more. Are you one of those against success?  You may not like it but it works for her and her readers.
   
   Be honest Matthew, if any of us here including you were great quality writers, We Would Not Be Writing Here. We would be published or writing for something that paid us all very well. Some make money here, but most do it for themselves, for a release, and to socialize with others all across the globe. Nothing wrong with any of that.
   
   So Matthew My advise to you is as follows. Stop stalking and wondering what that hubber writes next. Follow and read the hubbers that peak your interest and skills. Last, lighten up, enjoy the site and all it has to offer, don't be so dam critical of the writers and fellow readers. If this is too much for you or you do not think you can do that, move on to something else because Hubpages is not for you. 
   
   No matter your decision, peace be with you.

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      Hollie Thomasposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      +1

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      terinah14posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      make that 2

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   Sherry Hewinsposted 12 years ago

   I don't usually go with the pack, but I'm going to have to agree with them on this one. Those lists do seem to be quite popular. If it works for that person, why would they stop doing it? Perhaps I get a little put out that something I wrote that I think is better gets ignored, but that's the nature of the beast. If you can't stand the heat, well you know...

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   SmartAndFunposted 12 years ago

   It could be argued that a writer who ends most of his summaries with exclamation points is just as cheesy as a writer who compiles "top 100" lists.

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    fpherj48posted 12 years ago

    Mr. Kirk of Liverpool...with 9 months, 13 hubs and 87 followers to your credit:  Listen up, young man.......
    There are 137,462 Users (Hubbers)  who have written and published to date, a total of 1,142,779  Hubs. This is surely a veritable smorgasbord for any and all readers to choose from.
    Consider yourself duly advised to cruise around our vast community, hub hop, peruse the limitless list of sites here and find the works that might appeal to you.  Choose from the many offered, those you enjoy, approve of and find interesting to read.
    To focus upon one writer, dwell on what YOU DO NOT LIKE AND/OR APPROVE OF, in terms of some of her material and to make unkind remarks, will NOT improve your own chances of being anywhere near as successful and popular as she is.  Quite the contrary, dear child, you will garner disgust at your audacity and disrespect of your opinions.  Surely, someone of your perceived level of intelligence, would be most aware of this.
    This post is most unacceptable, unnecessary and a seriously poor choice of topic, on your part.   If you wish to encourage thoughts and responses from fellow-writers on the forums, try posting an intelligent question on an exciting event or unique idea. 
    The vast majority of us here at HP, are fond of one another, respectful and supportive.  You, of course have the right to be as you choose.  In turn, it will most reasonable of you to expect consequences to your rudeness and ludicrous nonsense.

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       Cardisaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       fpherj48, you Rock girl!

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          fpherj48posted 12 years agoin reply to this

          And......to my own Drum, girl!!  Thank you!

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    terinah14posted 12 years ago

    Other people find Hubpages to be a place to express anything. Some hubs may not be useful for us but it can help other individuals. The Internet is vast and believe me, if you find other hubbers' hubs pathetic, you'll find more outside Hubpages.

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    Janhornerposted 12 years ago

    Hi All
    
    This thread has become a little heated! 
    
    Hub pages is a wonderful platform to learn by our mistakes (I had plenty of them in a story I posted over the last couple of days), and a fellow hubber pointed them out.  I took this as positive and not negative feed back.  The hubber was very polite in how he give the feed back and this is what matters to the author.
    
    Hub pages is a place you can improve your writing skills and we all need to keep improving.  It has helped me no end and I feel much more confident.
    
    If you feel unhappy with a hub I would say don't comment unless it is going to be friendly advice to improve and encourage. 
    
    Be peaceful, and have a lovely day all,
    
    Jan

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    Rain Defenceposted 12 years ago

    There is a lot of bilge on here. I contribute my share with the hubs I churn out. It's a community thing though, doesn't matter if someone's writing is good or crap, people on here often say its great.
    Doesn't really matter though, if it gets views then it's doing its job and if it doesn't then it'll get idled, so don't let the well meaning comments to hubs that you don't like worry you. They are just the social part of this site and often unrelated to a hubs actual quality. The hub will stand on its own 2 feet if people read it, if people bounce or don't bother clicking it'll die, so will be regulated that way.
    Basically what I'm saying is, don't worry about it maaaaan.

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    jimmythejockposted 12 years ago

    The "Secret of success" on Hubpages is to find a niche topic that works for you and write it to death. The Hubber that you are refering to has found her niche and is doing exactly that.
    The subject matter may seem trivial to you and maybe to a lot of other people too but if you open up any womans magazine you will find lists like these are often featured on the center spread.
    I know the Hubber that you are refering to and apart from being an outstanding writer and a great supporter of the Hubpages authors, she is a writer who understands her readership and targets her Hubs around them.
    I don't understand how anyone can disrespect a fellow writer on what they choose to write about or how often they write about it.
    I plan on writing a few Hubs this month Matthew, should I email them to you first for your approval before hitting the submit button?.....jimmy

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    paradigmsearchposted 12 years ago

    I'm thinking of republishing my Snooki hub...

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