I'm pleased to announce that the new HubPages fashion & beauty site, Bellatory.com is live! Feel free to stop by and check it out and let us know if you notice any pesky bugs. Happy Hubbing!
I took a quick peek at a few of the hubs and noticed that the photos and writing on them is huge. It also seems that many of them are professional, not from public domain, etc. Have permissions been given for these, or is the team once again just looking the other way. Just curious.
I think this only matters when it matters. The ability to publish a media rich article about the President of the United States of American shouldn't only be for those who've been to where they could take a picture of said person.
Attributing an image is all that should matter, in my humble opinion, until the image creator simply dislikes the use of the image enough to complain.
It is far too elitist to say someone can't use an image unless they created it. That would mean one could only write about something they also were able to photograph.
FYI: It is against the copyright laws to use professionally prepared photos without permission, which is why they should be accredited properly. Using photos illegally is the same as stealing, so it matters big time! If you earned your living as a photographer, would you want somebody else making money from your work while you got nothing...not even recognition? I doubt it!
What?? It's OK to steal when there is something you want but don't have? You know better than that, Wesman!
It may be "elitist", but the fact is, unless you have the permission to use an image, you should keep looking for one with the appropriate rights. As an artist, I'd have more respect for someone who came into my living room and stole my television than someone who used my copyrighted photo without permission, simply because they were too lazy, or too stupid, to find one with more liberal permissions.
+1 I am really tired of seeing stolen photos on this site, especially when I work so hard to make sure I use legal photos. I think very little of people who do this type of thing and think even less of them when I hear they are getting tons of views. It's disgusting!
+1 to all the above responses
Plus it's also worth highlighting that many of those who have images stolen now go straight to Google to report the copyright infringement - which is so easy to do since they provided that nice form
The other incentive to report to Google is because it also appears to take the view that if and when Google gets too many copyright infringements about a site reported to it, it removes the site from the index and/or buries the site on Google.
I've never been quite sure why article sites have never taken this aspect of authors reporting copyright infringements to them more seriously since this started to happen.
I'm afraid I must take serious exception to your comment, Mr. Shaw. I have had too many of my photos used on other websites without my permission. That is stealing, plain and simple. There are photos available that are in the public domain that can be used freely. It is just as wrong to use someone else's photo as it is to use their writing and claim it as your own. I've spent a lot of time and effort taking and curating my photos. There are mine to do with as I please, not anyone else's. How would you like it if someone took your vacation photos and used them to illustrate their own web page? I don't think you would.
In a way I agree with Mr. Shaw when it comes to pictures of people who are always in the public view, and the picture is everywhere you look. I often write about people. If it's a really famous photo, so much that I actually know the photographer who took it, I attribute it. But if the picture is already on every newspaper, magazine and website going, I don't think it's such a big deal. Especially if it's posed at a public event.
Ms. Bakula, you would be well advised to do some research on fair use. It is illegal to use photos from newspaper, magazines and websites without permission. You are leaving yourself open to legal action. The media doesn't nicely ask you to take photos down, they sue anyone who is illegally using their photos. I hope that you will think twice before stealing other people's work in the future.
Aren't we being a bit heavy handed here? Jean does what most people do with widely disseminated pics of people. And there is fair use copyright law on some of this.
A little bit of common sense goes along way. I hope you keep that in mind for before calling people thieves by stating they are stealing. I guess im a thief too because I do the same thing.
There is absolutely no difference at all between stealing a photographers image and using it without a license and somebody copying and pasting your hubs and publishing them on their own blog.
Almost all photographers are freelancers and only paid when an image is licensed for use, and they can't pay their rent with 'attribution', not to mention their camera bodies, lenses, software, press cards, or travel expenses. They can spend hundreds attending an event, upload hundreds of images to macro sites, and not sell a single one.
When you steal a photo from NYpost, you aren't actually stealing it from NYpost, they've only paid a license to use it on their site. You are stealing from the freelance photographer who sold them a license to use that image.
The systems that these macro sites have in place to pursue infringers are getting a lot smarter, photographers are pursuing infringement much more. In fact, I've seen photographers say that they make more money from chasing infringers than they do selling initial licenses.
When you get an invoice for $$$$ from the legal department of Getty or Alamy chasing payment for an image, that's probably been done at the request of the photographer. They don't mess around.
When I was a hubber I used to steal loads of images for use in hubs. But how can it be rationalised? Its not cool to pirate music and deprive a musician of their royalties, its not cool to steal writing from bloggers, so using a photograph without permission isn't cool either. Its exactly the same as downloading an MP3 album without paying..... One guy pays for it, uploads it, then 300 people download it for free?
I have never stolen hundreds of images, but used some for people who posed for publicity in the public domain. I have written to photographers hundreds of times to ask if I could use a photo, and never got one response, so apparently you care more about their work than they do.
As far as stealing hubs, many of my hubs are well written and have been stolen, to the point I rarely write here, HP can use software to protect it's writer's more, but chooses not to.
You seem to be admitting to stealing hundreds of things others have written. I have never done that with one word.
I write about Astrology and often use photos from Nasa.gov or an organization who is publishing photos for teaching purposes, which is my reason for writing.
"You seem to be admitting to stealing hundreds of things others have written"
Not sure how you managed to deduce that from my post. What are you talking about?
Here's an example of a photographer caring about somebody stealing their photograph:
http://discussion.alamy.com/index.php?/ … sting-day/
And here are some replies, all from stock photographers:
"A single infringment compensation exceeded all my gross Alamy income for the last 3 years"
"I usually had the matter over to local debt collectors"
Be careful that you don't get yourself a legal letter from Getty Images, because you'll hope that they give up and go away, and they never will.
https://www.google.co.uk/?gfe_rd=cr& … ght+letter
The photos on Getty ARE from freelance photographers. They don't do most of their own chasing, they report to their agency to chase the money. Getty is merely an agency, the photographers retain the rights to their images.
If you think that not getting a reply to a message constitutes permission to infringe copyright then good luck using that line in court.
If you don't think this can happen to a 'hubber' then think again:
http://hubpages.com/community/forum/101 … ssion-help
Chasing infringements is a fast growing revenue stream for these agencies, simply not worth the risk of ever using a photograph unless you have good reason to believe it is free for commercial use or you have express permission from the photographer to use it.
Four of my hubs are moved to bellatory.com
Hoping for positive result..
In terms of design are these new sites going to be properly branded at some point? I mean, they are based on the Hubpages template at the moment and the gray/black squareness doesn't really say "beauty site" to me at all. It creates a strange dissonance between the style and the content which I would find odd and ultimately, off-putting.
I see a bug. At the bottom of the Bellatory page there is no “Link to this Page” to include your referral tracker. Or are referral trackers being discontinued?
If Bellatory is a part of HUBPages, why can't my signing in to HP take me to the site without me having to sign in again when I get to the Bellatory home page. P.S. I like the name Bellatory. It's cool!
Hiya, question, how do we get to read these new sites? I mean, for example the normal ones show up in our emails, will these show up as new ones? and can we comment on them? thanks
Hi Nell, yes we can also comment on the Bellatory articles. If you have any Hubs that are "Fashion and Beauty" you will see them in your Hub account, you will notice that those Hubs are being edited by HubPro.
Will there be a photography or similar niche? Don't care about "when" but about the "if"
Ok, I'll be the one to ask. "Bellatory"?
Meanwhile, at least one of bellatory's hubs have already made it to the Google index. Something to do with orange hair.
I don't know about "Bellatory," but "Bellator" is apparently some sort of mixed martial arts. Apparently "Bellator" is a Latin word which means "warrior."
I just hope some of these beautiful women of Hubpages still make some time for poor little me. Hey, if we could get a swimsuit calendar made up and delivered as a bonus to hardworking scribblers, that might help ease some of my lonesome pinning
I was pleased to have one of mine selected for this niche. I did not see Amazon ads on it, though in edit mode they show up. I'm OK with it either way. I don't think these particular ads were producing.
Found it. Good one! Even though I have no interest in the subject, I still enjoyed the names. Those who are interested in the subject will love them.
Thanks, Paradigm I appreciate your interest (or even your non-interest in this case.)
I was just notified that another one of mine was added.. It's about purses, though I rarely carry one.
Is Hubpages registering these domains with the guidance of a trademark / IP lawyer, or at least doing a basic USPTO search themselves?
There appears to be a very recently approved live trademark for 'Bellator' which pertains to "Athletic bags; Backpacks; Duffel bags".
Creating monetized content on the subject of bags on this fashion site is potentially dodgy ground?
Only if you don't understand how trademarks actually work.
Bellatory is an appallingly-dreadful name for a fashion and beauty website. But it's not a trademark violation.
There has actually been a fair bit of precedent for UDRP disputes for "confusingly similar" domains.
But yes, the domain names are poor. If you want good .com's you have to pay good money for them and it doesn't look like hubpages want to do that.
I tried to send a link to a hub a fellow hubber wrote on HP that's now on the bellatory site. I shared it on Facebook and someone commentedf, "WTF is that site? It sounds like the new purgatory"
Bella-what now? Sounds like a bad Goth-rock band.
Ehh, whatever. I don't write about beauty/fashion anyway. Wake me up when you get to the niche sites devoted to rock and roll music and bad movies. (shrugs)
Feels so good that 2 of my hubs are now on Bellatory. Thanks team@hubpages
I see I'm not the only one inquiring/commenting about the name choice. There has to be a method to HP's madness. Whoever successfully entices HP to tell us what it is wins a kewpie doll.
It makes no sense to me - the other domains were readily apparent what they were about, this not so much. What a terrible domain name choice - sorry, but not sorry.
Terrible name choice, it rhymes with something not so beautiful.
I agree; it seems not many people know what "Bellatory" is supposed to mean in this context. Look up the word, and it is linked to mixed martial arts. I think it's an odd choice for a beauty site.
Interesting. To me it seems like they tried to get the word beauty in the domain name with the word "story" without the "s".
It's not memorable and hard to spell. They should have picked something different. But what do I know.
Hi Mister Hollywood,
The names are awful, aren't they? But people will Google the topic they want, and will be lead to the niche sites no matter how silly the niche site name is. The name for the Metaphysical stuff, astrology, tarot, crystals, reincarnation, etc, is mixed up with vampires and things that have nothing to do with my topics. It's niche site name is Exemplore, a word I've never heard of before.
I puzzled about bellatory too until I figured "bella" beauty. Whatever.
Thanks for your kind defense of me. I have written to so many photographers to get permission to use their work, and never got one answer. And I certainly never copied anyone else's hub, although most of my best have been stolen. HP provides a clue or two, but they don't lead anywhere. If you write to the site, it's already out of business, or they never answer you. I sometimes wonder if all the people who say they get all their work off sites with DMCA's are telling the truth. I can almost never manage it, except for a few. And that's mostly when it's on a blogger site, and I write the person and just nicely ask them to take my work down.
Bella means beautiful. But, what does 'tory' signify? How about Bellatime? Or BellaArt?
How in the name of heavens does one pronounce the word "Bellatory" ? Is it seriously called that? I really have to know why. Someone please, please, tell me why? Lol.
I can only guess the "tory" part means room. Like lavatory means wash room, Bellatory may mean beautiful room.
Got it. No reason to assume that people interested in beauty tips shouldn't also know a little Latin.
Room? Never heard that. Tory also means a colonist who supported the British side during the American Revolution. Bella is Italian and usually means beautiful or a girl's name.
So, is it beautiful colonists?
On a more serious note, I don't really want any of my articles to be hijacked onto one of these other sites (should one be created for which my content is considered suitable).
Am I correct that there's no opt-out this time, as there was with the editing thing? If that's the case, is the only way to protect my content to remove it and go elsewhere? I'm not trying to be provocative and I dare say this has all been bashed out somewhere, but I'm rarely on the forums.
Anyone be kind enough to enlighten me?
There is no opt out. However, I wouldn't go rushing to remove my content because nobody knows what will happen or how things will work out. Keep her steady as she goes until the ashes settle. If you don't like it, you can always leave later.
Thanks for the reply. I don't like the idea of my portfolio being split up - some here, some there.
I've been thinking sometime of just starting my own niche educational site, transferring things across there and then building it out on a self-hosted Wordpress domain. I don't know. Maybe now is the time to do it, before this new thing happens. I do think these "new sites" look just awful; self-scraped mini-hubpages. I don't have much faith in this move. It seems a bit scrappy and desperate to me.
My traffic and engagement remains good on all my hubs, but earnings have plummeted into the bowels of beyond and I don't see this making any difference. "Bellatory" is just mystifying.
I'm more inclined to strike out on my own. It certainly couldn't make things worse!
I've been rethinking my comments on this thread in the light of other things I've been reading. I still don't like Bellatory, but that's kinda none of my business as I will never write a "beauty" article ever in any case.
And I've been looking back over the history and performance of my stuff here and thinking that I have been hasty to think of running off because the new changes make me nervous. So I've decided to stick around - even up my productivity - and see how it goes. I'll just back everything up so that I can have that security if things do go down the pan at some point.
But I'd like to publicly retract some of my apparent criticisms of Hubpages, I guess. Maybe it was a bit of a knee-jerk response.
I felt unsure about the changes too, but now a lot of my hubs are being edited, and they haven't changed a word. Only one kept the Amazon capsule. They moved one to a niche site, but seem to be editing the hubs with the most views, ones with over 10,000 views on my account.
Bellatory had me stumped too. But then I thought, bella, beauty, and figured it had to do with beautiful things, like Fashion or Cosmetics. I'm glad I wasn't too far off.
How do we get on these sites if we aren't sure what all the names are? I copied a list, but new sites are being added very quickly. I think the team did a good job with hub choices for them so far.
My highest trafficked hub was moved over there... with no noticeable change. Just glad the stats are still here on HP, or is that going to change too?
Sorry, but I think the name is awful. It reminds me of "lavatory". I'm guessing it's supposed to mean something like "place of beauty", but I'm not sure it works.
Yes- that's what I think: "place/room/site of beauty".
But I really don't think it's "awful"! But I have learned I'm in the minority here.
I guess that there have probably been countless numbers of brandable domains which have evoked an "Eh?" when launched but all that really matters I suppose is that they are reasonably radio friendly / memorable and as they become synonymous with people they forget that they didn't like the domain. What does "Twitter" mean without the big blue bird giving it some context, and "Instagram" sounds like something from the 1920's, a quick Telegram?
But I just question how much planning Hubpages are doing here. Does the fact that I hand registered PoetPages.com last week suggest that they haven't yet had a look for Poetry domains, for example?
I just realized I have a Fashion and Beauty hub! I kid you not.
The traffic sucks. The pictures suck. And as for the writing on this particular hub...
Please give me beautiful pictures. Feel free to rewrite to your heart's content. Once the hub is suitably awesome, I await its transfer. Drop me a note when that happens.
Just another wayward Hubber
[Update] I just went and made it a little better, mainly throwing out a bunch of excessive commas and a half-dozen "that"'s.
I'm going to be courageous and bold here. But, I actually like the name "Bellatory". I think it has a nice little ring to it and it's somewhat catchy. I realize I am possibly the only hubber who shares this sentiment with HP staff, however.
I'm going to go take cover now.
No rotten tomatoes here-- I think it is fine. We shall see.
I am not much into fashion/style stuff, being a recently converted country girl. But I am happy to have a couple of my hubs converted to this site. We shall see how it goes and hope for the best.
Yes, indeed! I'm hoping for the best as well. I have a few on there and suspect a couple more are on their way since they are now being editing by HubPro. I'm optimistic- the one hub I have on PetHelpful has seen a small increase in traffic... It's nothing to write home about, but it's on the rise. I'll take it! I think this is a very smart move on HP's part. I remain optimistic.
You probably like one-eyed cats and dogs with that haunted, mad look. Which is good, lol. Somebody needs to.
How do you pronounce Bellatory, by the way?
Bell-ah-tor-ee I would think....or however you wish. We don't care. If it works , we can even pronounce it xaity-peleep-quk, just spell it right. Bellatory.
Lol- how DID you know, Will? And I also like tripod animals.
^^ What Rochelle said:
"Bell-ah-tor-ee". "Bellatory" doesn't rhyme with "the lottery", that much I know. And I really don't mean that as a pun (meaning we're going to hit the jackpot here. Although I hope we do!).
Bellatory .... makes me think of Bela Lugosi. Now there is a great makeup artist for you.
I really like TT2's BellaMia.
Me too! Earlier I was thinking HP should have involved hubbers in the name game... But, then I came to my senses. That would have been a MESS.
But I like BellaMia.
BellaMia - both parts are Italian: bella is beautiful, mia is me. Yes, that is a good name.
Mia doesn't mean "me", but means "mine". Bella Mia: My Beautiful.
Fashionistas are often refered as Divas. They might have considered this as part of the domain name if reference was the goal.
Oops! You are right. Mia means mine. Thank for that correction.
or "my beauty"...A combination of Spanish and Italian.
Italian or Spanish the meaning remains the same. Bella means "beautiful", "beauty", "lovely", and so on. Bella Durmiente means Sleeping Beauty or a "bella ciudad" means a beautiful city or town for example.
So I don't really understand what you mean by "comination of Spanish and Italian". Can you explain more in depth, please TT2 ?
Everyone who likes Bellamia should know that the domain isn't available
Well, I did not check that out because HP is not going to change the name. They chose Bellatory and that will most likely not change. We are not asking Christy to change the name - just funnin' around.
eleganse.com is a couple of thousand dollars
looker101.com is 11 dollars.
Even 'Looker 101' is better than a one eyed cat.
I'm sure that there are many others.
I've got a few of my domains listed on this site: https://www.brandbucket.com/
That's where startups buy domains these days and that sites growth is the reason why its so hard to hand register good brandables these days, not only has the catalogue increased from around 10,000 to 25,000 in the past year, but for every one accepted countless others are rejected, people search for hours upon hours trying to find hand regs which are suitable for that site.
There could easily be a hundred subs in the pipeline, depending on the subject breadth they settle on.
That could mean a quarter of a million to half a million dollars paying through the nose on sites like Brandbucket. I wouldn't be prepared to spend that kind of money.
I am a fan of names that are easy to pronounce, though.
Tatring has bad associations for anyone from the UK of a certain age but is probably OK for the target audience. It is short and memorable. Words that you do not know how to pronounce are never going to be memorable. Fine if you can afford an ad campaign to ram the pronunciation home but that is a nonstarter, I reckon.
I wish them luck, obviously. And really I should keep out of these threads altogether, lol.
On the Namepros forum people flog Brandbucket rejects for like $20.... they hand reg them, submit them to brandbucket, they get rejected, and then they flog them for pennies. Some of them are really rather good. If they just posted on the Namepros wanted section "Wanted, brandable domains for these categories...." and then set the price "Will pay up to $100 for the right domains", they'd find some real gems for $50 to $100 direct from domainers. Wholesale price is a fraction of enduser price. As long as they didn't state that they are from Hubpages, because domainers are greedy and they'd see dollar signs.
People even trade Brandbucket accepted domains for like $100 a piece, they can switch them between Brandbucket accounts.
My point about Brandbucket was primarily that sites like that (there are others) are what has made half decent brandable domains ridiculously scarce over the past couple of years (when trying to find one to hand register), rather than that hubpages should pay end user prices for domains. They almost certainly shouldn't be doing that, but when they are really stuck they should be looking at posting on Namepros acquiring from domainers at trade prices.
Hell, I've got a 7 year old business account with some good feedback built up over there and post frequently, in fact I've just held a logo design contest, so if they need somebody to do the leg work to acquire for them I'd do it for a small fee per acquisition!
Fashion is a really competitive niche and one of the harder ones to acquire good domains for, so have to give hubpages that.
I'll test my theory and see what PM's I get over the next couple of days:
https://www.namepros.com/threads/fashio … es.928979/
So I've had hundreds of domains in my inbox already, from dozens of people, and amongst the rough and very rough I was offered a quality BrandBucket listed diamond for $125 (down from $1600). I won't state it here out of respect for the owner (if I write online that somebody can have that domain for $125 it will hurt his chances of selling it at $1600, and I'm not going to buy it). I could PM you if you want to know.
PM me lol. Just out of curiosity. If that's okay with you.
Found it, have emailed, don't write the domain on this forum. You may disagree that it is better, give me your opinion.
Lobobrandon thinks its much better, I think Hubpages need set aside some sort of modest budget and then hire me to acquire their domains. I'm being serious too, I'd do it, I spend a lot of time buying and selling namepros as it is and can get brandbucket approved domains for like $100 to $150.
Not that I publish anything in beauty, but I like the name Bellatory. To me, it sounds like a science nerd's place for tutorials about beauty techniques and fashions and that's a good thing. A laboratory is where you go to experiment with science so a Bellatory must be somewhere you go to experiment with beauty. It also sounds a little sexy and sophisticated.
I think they put thought into how Bellatory would sound when people recommend it by word of mouth. It sounds both unique and pronounceable to me. It also seems to get people wondering about what it means; arousing curiosity is good.
If you don't like the name, take a moment to think about how odd and awkward Pinterest looks and sounds at first. Seriously, what's a p interest? It sounded kind of like a sexual kink I find icky to me when I first saw the name. I soon found out it's pronounced run together and that people love Pinterest, weird name and all.
Now that a couple of Hubbers gave their definition of Bellatory, now we can appreciate it for occupying our "Fashion & Beauty" articles. The topics consist of: Clothing, Fashion Accessories, Fashion Industry, Fragrances, Hair, Hygiene & Grooming, Make up, and Skin.
As of early Saturday morning (03/12/2016), looks like 60 bellatory hubs indexed so far. Pethelpful is at 1,700+, tatring at approx 550.
Really? What do you do...sit around and count indexed hubs? Must take forever!!
Nah, Google rats out website index counts in a heartbeat.
Example, entering ""bellatory.com" site:.bellatory.com" will display "About 62 results (0.21 seconds)" at top.
Takes about 10 seconds, you search this:
And it shows you every google result for that domain.
Although paradigmsearch's methodology is flawed, because a lot of the 1760 entries are not articles but these:
I have an article published about wearing the right colors for skin tone and etc. It may be perfect for this site but doesn't seem to fit in the categories listed. Then again, HP missed/skipped it altogether so maybe that's part of the plan. Hmm.
A 'Tory' may, or may not be seen as an insult in the UK. I once proudly sported a badge that stated 'I've never kissed a Tory'
Is this supposed to be "Belletory" as in "belle"? I've been trying to guess what each niche site is for (based on the names) and some I can get, but this one is very obscure.
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