Hopefully someone from Hubpages HQ can look into this.
I believe that those of us that are using a hosted account with Adsense are not getting any ad revenue on impressions from the niche sites.
I base this on the fact that my daily impressions on Hubpages vs Adsense differ by a factor of about 100.
Since almost all my traffic goes through the niche sites this can only make sense if Adsense is not counting the traffic through the niche sites. I also have all the niche sites verified with Adsense so that is not to blame.
Further, since this is a hosted account it should only work for a single domain, in my case Hubpages. And it seems that Adsense does not include the niche sites into a Hubpages bundle.
Now I hope someone from Hubpages can look into this as Adsense won't even acknowledge my existence let alone answer my questions.
Besides, there is also the question of Hubpages losing ad revenue of this is true.
I would like to know if this is an issue. If so Hubpage should have a help page on it to avoid any of us missing out on our income.
AdSense already has a help page on this. See the link I left earlier in this thread.
...and it seems to me that the link you posted answers the question. Either I'm missing something or I don't understand what you're talking about because I have a blog as well as two sites here on HP and I also have tons of hubs on the niche sites and earnings are very good as far as I can see.
TT2, The thing I was talking about at the beginning of this thread was about the probability that she did not authorize the niche sites in her AdSense. This is only necessary if you have specified the setting to only accept ads from auntorized sites. The default, I believe, is to accept ads from any site anyway. In that case you don't need to authorize each site. But this gets confusing because I believe it only applies to those of us who had old versions of AdSense.
Having said that, there seems to be another issue for people who got their AdSense accounts after Google made the changes that only accept host accounts. There might be a problem if the host is only HubPages main site. But I don't know if that is actually what's happening. It needs to be determined.
As for people like you and I who have old version accounts with AdSense, we are not in that category since we applied for AdSense many years ago, and not through HubPages. Like you, I also have no problem getting paid for every single niche site that my hubs are in. And I also have tons of hubs on niche sites. I also use my AdSense on other sites with no problem.
I even tested using only AdSense a month ago and saw that they report the impressions and the clicks for each hub, including those on niche sites. That's neat. But nevertheless, I switched back to the HubPages Ad program because I didn't make as much using only AdSense. As you said in another thread, you do better with only AdSense — it all depends on what niche we're in, I guess. For me, the HubPages Ad program works best.
I hope I cleared up what you missed from my prior comments. Let me know if it's still not clear. I know this can get pretty confusing. And there still are unanswered questions for newbies who have hubs on the niche sites and have applied for their AdSense via HubPages.
The only thing you said that is confusing is that I DID sign up for Adsense through HP, even though I did it years ago. If this is a case of penalizing new hubbers,then Paul or somebody needs to look into it...I don't understand the underlying reasons if, in fact, this is the case.
I switched to Adsense in mid April when we all were talking about it, and boy am I glad I did! Earnings have more than doubled...so I'm staying put until I see that this changes.
That's the point TT2! You signed up years ago, just as I had. That was before AdSense rules had changed, but we are grandfathered in.
OK, but I still think Adsense is really being unfair to new writers. In the case of HP, this ruins any opportunity they might have to move up to the niche sites, which is where the real success comes.
Yes, I agree with that, but we don't know yet for sure if that's the problem. The only way to know for sure is for a newbie to place the URLs of his or her niche hubs in the URL Channel list in their AdSense account and then monitor it to see if it's reporting impressions and clicks.
I added the URLs to the URL channel list when you showed me this was possible a couple of weeks ago. To date not a single impression is shown there for the niche sites, only impressions from articles on the hubpages.com domain.
And as for this only affecting newbies, I signed up over 2 years ago and it affects me. It should affect everyone that signed up after december 2012.
https://adsense.googleblog.com/2012/11/ … -host.html
Thanks Saarith, between you and Maz Fouche we may actually determine the truth. He also added his hubs to the URL Channels.
Your data already seems to show the terrible news that everyone is thinking–that newbie AdSense accounts only register a single hosted domain. One question I have for you, just to be sure, did you also add the niche domain names to the list of authorized sites under "Settings>MySites"? And click the verified site on/off button to "on"?
Or Hubpages staff could... um, look at it and tell us.
It is a harsh decision on Google's part. We don't know for sure if it affects the niche sites, but it definitely means that, for instance, once someone has signed up for HubPages then they can't sign up for Wizzley or any other writing site that uses Adsense. I'm guessing it's just another step in their vendetta against writing sites.
If you read the link provided by one of the posters here, it seems to say only that there will be a requirement for people to seek further permission if they want to use Adsense other sites. https://adsense.googleblog.com/2012/11/ … -host.html
No, that's a post from 2012! Up until last year, those instructions were correct.
Why the heck don't they remove that old stuff! So irritating!
Actually on reading it again, it's still correct because it talks about applying for permission to run Adsense on your own blog, which you can still do.
It doesn't say anything about applying for permission to run Adsense on other shared websites, which is the issue we're talking about here.
To be honest, I still can't quite believe the new rule exists. It seems so unfair! I keep hoping I misread it. It's frustrating because I can't find it in Adsense Help, and I can't find the thread on these forums where someone did link to the relevant section. I'd love to study it again.
It's possible that you are only allowing AdSense ads for authorized sites in your AdSense settings. In that case you need to authorize every vertical niche site where you have hubs. Go to "Settings > My Sites" in your AdSense account and enter the sites you want to authorize. You may notice that the sites already were automatically added to the list, but you still need to authorize them.
More info: https://support.google.com/adsense/answer/2781214?hl=en
Thanks for your input.
But no, I already have all the niche sites both added and authorized. And this continues to be an issue even if I remove the verification requirement.
Also, under "Setting -> Access and authorization -> Third Party Access" there is only Hubpages and Youtube listed.
Saarith, "Third Party Access" has nothing to do with it. Mine says "0% of search revenue" because I'm not using any third parties. I'm sure you're not either.
I would recommend that you add the URL of every hub to your "URL Channels" (found under MyAds). Then you can track every single hub individually with accurate results in the "Performance Reports". That's what I do.
In addition, are you using only AdSense or the HubPages ad program? If you're using the latter, then only very few impressions will show up on your AdSense because most of the impressions will be with other ads under the HubPages ad program.
Alright, I have added the urls. Let's see what that tells me tomorrow. Thanks for showing me this feature by the way.
I am using the HP program, but as I understand it there is still a single "pure" adsense ad at the bottom of the page.
Is it possible that the difference in daily page views is about 10 shown on adsense for every 1000 shown on hubpages?
Yes that is correct that there is still an AdSense ad at the bottom, that's why I said very few impressions will show up on your AdSense.
It's hard to compare the ratio because AdSense reports based on midnight to midnight, and HubPages reports based on the passed 24 hours (rolling count). However, I just took an average for the passed week and my page views work out to about 13.5 AdSense for every 1000 HubPages.
It's been more than 24 hours since I added all my pages to the URL Channels.
The only articles that show up are the ones with hubpages.com domain. Out of 26 views according to Hubpages I got 6 impressions on Adsense for those two articles. That's ok in and of itself.
Here's the problem. Articles with the Hubpages.com domain only get about 2% of my total traffic. Why is the other 98% of my traffic not showing up in Adsense?
I know you previously said that you authorized all the niche sites. But if you're not seeing the traffic for AdSense then it seems that they are not authorized properly. Did you confirm that each one of them has the on/off switch turned on?
Yes, they are all authorized
See the screenshot
I also see that you joined HP six years ago so you have a full Adsense account. HP users that got an Adsense account before November 7 2012 have a full account and should not have this problem. Only those that got the account later have a Hosted Account version.
Source: https://adsense.googleblog.com/2012/11/ … -host.html
I am now 99% sure that this is either a general problem with hosted accounts or a problem with my account.
Is there any way to contact HP directly about this as they are not pipping in here on the forum.
Edit: the screenshot is very small, but you hopefully can see the green tabs, at least they all look like the one below.
True, I had my AdSense account long before HubPages. I realize things are different for people who signup for AdSense under HubPages, but I don't know what differences there are since it's not the way I did it. So I recommend you contact the team at email@example.com and refer them to this thread.
I also use the HP program but, like Glenn, had my Adsense account before joining Hubpages. I have articles on PetHelpful and Pairedlife. Impressions, views, clicks and earnings are showing against these on Adsense, as well as the original Hubpages site.
My page views only differ by a factor of 10. So, if HP is showing 5,000 views over 7 days, Adsense is showing 500.
Not sure if this helps, but at least it gives you some sort of comparison.
Hi Marketing Merit.
It's becoming obvious to me now that I am not getting any page views or impressions on Adsense from the niche sides.I had suspected it for some time, but the URL trick Glenn showed me confirms it.
What I don't know is if this is something just affecting me or is a systemic problem.
Sorry, but can't help with this aspect. Best wait for site team to respond to your email.
It would be a great help to us all of your sent this inquiry directly using the Help link above. I have been meaning to look at my own stats and see but life keepings getting in the way, andit seems like hubstaff should have a definitive answer for this potentially important issue.
I don't know why, but the staff never chimes in on these Adsense issues.
Were you able to find a solution Saarith?
I am also not getting any ad revenue from impressions on the niche sites. I changed my earnings to Adsense only 2 weeks ago, and before my last article was moved to a niche site, Adsense reflected some daily impressions. As soon as the article was moved to a niche site my Adsense views flatlined. It has been zero for days even though the hubs are clearly getting views.
Not sure if I should just go back to HP programs.
Thank you. Hopefully the issue can be resolved.
I will change back to HP programs.
This is potentially a huge issue.
When I got my Adsense account, once you had it, you could use it anywhere.
Then Google changed it so that you were granted an Adsense account for use on one particular site only - and if you wanted to use it on other sites, you had to apply for permission before you could earn anything from those other sites.
Just a few months ago, someone posted here to say it's changed again. Now, if you get approval to use Adsense on a shared site (like HubPages) then that's it - it's called a "hosted account". With a hosted account, you will never get approval to use your Adsense account on any other site, unless you own the site.
In other words, if you get approved to use Adsense on HubPages, then the only other place you can use Adsense is on your own blog - and even then, you have to convince Google it's good enough quality.
I didn't believe it at the time, but when I researched it, it did seem to be true. I hadn't thought of it, but it has HUGE implications for Hubbers - because of course, the niche sites are not part of HubPages.com. That's the whole point of them - that they are stand-alone, separate sites. So will newbies be able to earn from Adsense on those sites? And since we're not supposed to use HP Ads unless we have Adsense, what's the implication for them?
So does that mean we won't be able to earn money from the niche sites if only the site owners can have an applicable Adsense account?
Because that's seriously troubling news.
It is seriously troubling.
The question would be, can Hubbers still earn from the HubPages Ad Program on the niche sites? If so, then it's no big deal.
Currently, to earn from the HP Ads Program, you must have an Adsense account. That's because many of the ads on the HP Ads Program are Adsense, so you must have an approved Adsense account to share in those earnings. If that means we need approval for every site the ads appear on, then newbies are in real trouble.
To clarify it is only the pure Adsense earnings I was referring to in the original post. I can tell you that I do indeed earn from the HP ad program on the niche sites. If those earnings are lower than they should be I cannot say.
What I can say is that the reported impressions I get are about 1 for every 4 page views. I always felt that was rather low, but I thought it might be the way Hubpages divides the revenue between us, them and ad networks.
Now I begin to wonder if I am also losing impressions also through the HP ad program. Do you have a similar impressions vs page view ratio?
I hope staff members can chime in on this issue then and clear things up for us.
I am commenting here so I can follow this thread - all very disturbing - hope it can be resolved by the HubPages team
Just wanted to let folks know that we've been reaching out to the Adsense host API team to get an answer. While still a potential issue the HubPages ad program may be a better option for folks that created their Adsense account through HubPages.
Just a footnote:
I have been paid both ways without any problems whatsoever. Currently I'm using just the Adsense program...no issues at all.
I did get it through HP when I joined about 5 1/2 years ago. It pays both on HP hubs and niche site articles, as does HP when I'm using it.
Don't know if this helps, but that's my situation.
I think the issue is not about getting paid by AdSense but getting paid for each article that has the AdSense code. Some of my articles are getting paid and some are not.
How do you know that? Why wouldn't Adsense pay for each article? I don't get this..
No, the issue is getting paid for some niche sites and not for others. Which, for people with a long-standing Adsense account, is most likely caused by a setting on your Adsense account.
It doesn't help, TT2, because the rules changed only a few months ago. It's only the newbies who joined since then, who may have a problem.
Since the rules changed, any new Hubbers who get an Adsense account for HubPages, can't use Adsense on any other article-writing site, ever. Pretty harsh, huh?
It's not just HubPages, it's any "third party" site. So, say someone applied for an Adsense account to use on Wizzley, then that would be the only place they could use it. You can only use it on the first place you applied for.
The only other place they can use Adsense is on their own blog, and even then they have to apply for permission - and it won't be approved unless the blog is high quality and has plenty of content already.
I originally applied for an Google AdSense account when I set up an account on Wizzley (which I never really pursued as a site).
That accounts now lists as recognised sites:
* MY first (independent) niche website
* MY second (independent) niche website
AND virtually all the earnings come from one of my niche websites where I host AdSense adverts
However I do get some HubPages earnings - for that one Google Adsense advert we get on each hub.
I can't comment on the HubPages Niche sites as I don't have any hubs on those.
You can view WHICH SITES ARE LISTED ON YOUR ADSENSE ACCOUNT by logging into Google AdSense and then reviewing which sites are listed as relevant to the account - and whether or not they are earning anything.
How to do this
1) Login to Google AdSense
2) Click Settings
3) Click "My Sites" - and review what is listed
This page states the following
"Here's a list of all your sites. We recommend that you keep it up to date. Verify sites that you know are yours, and add new ones manually. Learn more "
Next - go to your AdSense Dashboard overview and click the Sites Report. This tells you which sites get traffic and earnings
Just a thought - maybe hubbers with hubs on niche sites need to add their niche sites manually?
We've been through this in the rest of the thread, MaM.
The issue is with people who have obtained their Adsense accounts in the last year or so, after the rules changed.
Seem odd to me. I've never known Google use different rules for different people. Sometimes the roll-out to different countries can be a bit slow - but different rules is not something I've come across before unless the reason is legislative (eg EU cookies)
I've known the rules change several times.
For instance, when I applied for my Adsense account years ago, there was almost no barrier - you could apply with an empty blog. You were granted an Adsense account with NO restrictions, and could immediately use it on any site you wished.
Over time, they got tougher, demanding that you have a certain amount of published content before they would approve you (and applying a six month probation period to everyone from Asia and Africa).
Then came a major change in 2012. Now when you apply for an Adsense account with a site like HubPages or Wizzley, you get approval to use that account on the site you applied with and nowhere else. If you want to use it on another site, you have to obtain permission first. If you try to use the code on a non-approved site, it won't record any earnings.
https://adsense.googleblog.com/2012/11/ … -host.html
The question is whether the niche sites are part of the HubPages network (and therefore covered by the original approval) or regarded as totally separate sites (in which case, Hubbers would need to apply for permission for each of them individually).
What is truly frightening is there's a suggestion that such permission would not be granted. The 2012 memo talks specifically about being allowed to apply for permission to use your codes on other sites which you own.
I have seen a post, which I can't find now, which says the rules have changed again. If you get approval for Adsense through a revenue-sharing site, you can apply for approval to use that account on your own blogs, but you will not be granted permission to use it on any other revenue-sharing site. It seems too harsh to be true, but I guess it would be in line with Google's dislike of the rev-sharing market.
Changing rules I understand - but that's NOT what I said.
I was commenting on different treatment for different people relating to the same product i.e. a Google AdSense account.
Inconsistent treatment is no basis for having a contestable/defendable case in law - which is why companies almost always tend to avoid different treatment for the same product.
I don't see what relevance that statement has to the discussion at hand.
Google does treat people in some Asian countries differently, actually (by insisting they serve a six month probation which we don't have to), but that's not relevant to this discussion.
We believe that the people who appear to have difficulty earning from Adsense on the niche sites are people who joined after the rule change.
Again - different treatment for people in different countries is fine - because Google operates with different legal national identities as well as its overarching Google Group ID. Just as Google MUST comply with legal requirements re data in the EU which it doesn't have to do in the USA
I know what I mean and I'm pretty sure I'm right as to the legal wisdom of treating all people in the same country the same.
If they are differentiating they MUST have written it down somewhere in the terms and conditions of the contract (because terms and conditions for products where money changes hands is exactly that - a contract)
So the logical way to identify what's going on is compare the terms and conditions of somebody like us with somebody enrolling now and see what's different
Mark, you didn't mention when you got your AdSense. I would assume you got it before they changed the rules that we've been talking about in this thread. I also had my AdSense from a long long time ago and I get paid for my hubs on the niche sites. The problem is with newbies who fall under the new rules.
We're not absolutely sure yet, but it seems that since the new rules only allow using AdSense to be used on the hosted account domain, then the niche sites don't qualify if they signed up via a hosted site such as HubPages. Adding them to the authorized list doesn't seem to help. Two people so far confirmed that they authorized their niche hubs and also listed them in the URL channels to be able to watch each hub individually.
Maz Fouche gave good results that seem to confirm that newbies have a problem with getting paid for niche hubs. He added the niche hubs manually as you suggested Mark. We all know that doesn't seem to work for newbies who have AdSense from a hosted site. That is becoming more and more obvious.
Hopefully, if that conclusion is correct, HubPages will be able to work something out with Google to accept niche sites for new AdSense subscribers.
That's very very interesting.
I wonder if you set up your AdSense Account on your own wholly independent site whether you could then add in HubPages (or one of the niche sites) to the sites listed as OK.
It suggests people need to think very, very carefully where they put their content if earning income is important to them. Sounds like the only income newer members will earn from niche sites is from Amazon.
We've all been aware for a long time that Google really dislikes what it calls 'content farms'. It makes me think that they may well have come up with a new way of deterring people from contributing......
I wonder if HubPages will allow people to switch their hubs back to the core site so they can continue to earn from AdSense via their traffic?
P.S. people keep talking about "the new rules" but can anybody point me to a page on Google which stipulates what these rules are?
Or is everybody just "surmising"?
MaM, I assumed you'd read Glenn's earlier explanation which is why I couldn't understand why you were splitting hairs about this.
We are surmising to some extent. The relevant links are:
https://adsense.googleblog.com/2012/11/ … -host.html
You'll notice one of these gives the example that if you got your Adsense account through Youtube, then you can't use Adsense on Blogger without permission - stunning, considering they are both Google properties.
The grey area is whether the niche sites are regarded as part of HubPages' host partner agreement with Adsense or not. I'm not aware of any other host partner who runs a network of separate websites, so it's a unique situation.
In answer to your question - if you applied with your own independent blog then you would have a full Adsense account, not a hosted account, and you'd be able to use it anywhere.
Mark, I think you need to read through this thread carefully so you understand the problem. No one is surmising anything. There seems to be a clear problem for newbies who sign up for AdSense under HubPages as a hosted service.
Marisa answered you with a very clear and precise explanation, including links to the new AdSense rules that you requested, so no need for me to repeat it.
I just need to respond to your statement about moving hubs back to the main site. You talk about content farms. So why are you suggesting making a content farm all over again by combining hubs under one domain!?! That was one of the reasons for making niche sites. Content farms are obvious to search engines because they have unrelated articles all under one domain.
Our vertical niche sites have only one niche, which is why we are making so much more money now with our hubs that were moved. Those of us who are grand-fathered in with the old rules, or even newbies who signed up for AdSense directly (not under a hosted site) do not have the problem being discussed.
If the problem is proven to be correct, as it is becoming obvious, HubPages needs to do something for newbies who get a hosted AdSense via HubPages.
I'm not suggesting combining all hubs again.
What I'm talking about are those people who are not earning anything from AdSense on niche sites because of what is perceived to be "the hosted AdSense account problem" and (I'm guessing) probably shouldn't be earning from HubPages Adverts on a niche account either as THAT assumes a valid AdSense account.
(i.e. you can't be benefiting from the niche sites if you're not earning anything)
If their hubs were moved temporarily back to HubPages while this is all sorted out then they could at least keep earning income from adverts from their traffic.
Personally speaking, IMO the simplest and most effective solution would be for HubPages to sort this out with Google AdSense PDQ.
It's in everybody's best interests (including those that are attracting income from AdSense on niche sites) - because otherwise the business model is screwed.
I understand what you're saying Mark. But I think as long as people stay with the HubPages Ad program they will not lose out on niche sites. The only ad impression they won't get paid for is the one single AdSense ad at the bottom of each hub.
The big problem is for those who opt out of HPs ad program and try to use their own AdSense that they acquired via HubPages as a hosted account. That's the account that falls under the new rules that will only pay for the main hosed domain. It seems to me that that is the main problem—as I analyze the entire results so far received.
HubPages, on the other hand, has an old AdSense account that allows all the other domains. And they also use other ad agencies. So if newbies use the HP Ad program, they will get paid for those.
What I said here is only based on my own analysis so far, as I mentioned, and needs to be confirmed.
Hmmm - I guess your analysis depends on who owns the site and why HubPages requires the AdSense Account details from individuals
I'm not sure I'd be as confident in your analysis. I guess it rather depends on what the terms and conditions of the HubPages GA account says.....
I recall from something I read a long time ago from one of HubPages' staff, AdSense requires HubPages to include the requirement in the HubPages Ad Program that Hubbers need to be approved for AdSense. The reason Google insisted on this is because HubPages is using AdSense in the ad program.
That's why HubPages requires the AdSense Account details from individuals.
Yes - which means to ME that if the Google AdSense account used for generating advert income from the individual advert is invalid (for the purposes of the niche site if originally obtained via a hosted site) then - ergo - that same account MUST also be invalid for the HubPages ad Program on those niche sites.
In other words, an account might be fine on HubPages - but if it doesn't work for the individual advert on a niche site because it was obtained via a hosted site I can't see for the life of me how that GA account can be valid for the HubPages Ad program on niche sites.
The operative word is VALID
Mark, HubPages has an old AdSense account which is under the old rules. However, you do have a valid point, to some degree, about the fact that Google only allows HubPages to apply their AdSense earnings to people who also have been accepted into AdSense. HubPages has a close relationship with Google as far as I can tell, so they must have covered that in their agreements.
That's a mighty big assumption Glenn.
Plus if HubPages has a close relationship with Google, how come Google keeps trying to damage the business such that it needs to keep reconfiguring to meet Google's requirements?
That aside, I was trained to take an intelligent approach to risk management - and assumptions play absolutely no part in making sure people don't lose out. The only sensible thing to do is check it out - which I understand Hubpages is doing.
On that basis my conclusion would be that the current situation is NOT covered by their agreements.
Mark, I don't make assumptions. I state comments based on posted facts, unless I specifically state that something I said is IMO.
FACT: Paul Edmondson said he is reaching out to the AdSense API team about this. Source: http://hubpages.com/forum/post/2903362
As for your other comment, you have to understand that HubPages is not the only website on the Internet that Google is dealing with. Google is constantly making changes based on the overall web experience. HubPages is simply keeping up a well as they can.
You have to give HP credit for their achievement. So many other writing sites have gone out of business because they didn't keep up, as I predicted in my hub about the demise of a few of them.
Glenn - the assumption I was referencing was
"HubPages has a close relationship with Google as far as I can tell, so they must have covered that in their agreements"
"Must" seemed like a pretty big assumption to be. Yes it would have been sensible - but did it happen? We don't know.
I agree HP has done well to keep up with Google's changes. I think the strategy with the niche sites is the right one. Whether they've thought of all the angles to this new strategy is debatable.
I guess I'm only surprised that they didn't seek to discuss with Google AdSense how sprouting independent niche sites might be accommodated within the hosted account for HubPages. Or maybe they did but either HP or both sides didn't understand all the ramifications at the time?
No I don't know!
What link? Where?
I've been up and down this thread and I can't find any link from you to a post by Paul. Are you thinking of a different thread? I did notice a comment by you referencing a non-existent link http://hubpages.com/community/forum/142 … ost2899612
Paul: One of the posters said that he believes the problem is that Adsense is not paying for every article. Do you think this is the issue?
Well if there were issues with the HP ad program then we would've seen it by now but I've been earnings from HP and the niche sites with no problems.
I too got my Adsense account via Hubpages 2 1/2 years ago.
I'm a newbie here and my Adsense sites report (last 30 days) only picks up Hubpages as a site. This data from my latest article while it was still on Hubpages.
I did try the activation of each niche site as mentioned in this thread a while ago, just to make sure this wasn't the issue, but still no niche sites displayed in the sites list.
The niche site articles were definitely getting views but no activity was being seen by Adsense reporting. My Adsense reports (last 7 days) all show as 'no data available'. I don't have any more articles on Hubpages for it to monitor is the only explanation I can think of. So yesterday I moved back to HP Programs.
I have added the URL channels of each and am willing to switch back to Adsense only earnings for a few days, for the sake of testing.
Maz, Thanks for that input. Since you added your niche hubs to your URL Channels, you can monitor it to see if the individual hubs show any data.
You said you're willing to switch back to AdSense Only for a while. That would help a lot, although it still may pick up the one single AdSense ad from the bottom of your hubs without needing to disable the HP Ad Program. But by switching back for a few days, the report will be more populated with data and easier to determine quickly if anything, at all, is being reported.
The need to complete an upgrade application to get those earnings seems like something people need to see up front to avoid earnings losses.
New help page?
Has any staff member been directly asked about this?
A week ago I added the URL channels of each niche site article to my Adsense account and switched over to Adsense only earnings for testing purposes. I have checked each URL report this morning and the result is no page views were picked up by Adsense. Not one.
Each URL channel report (for the last 7 days) indicates 'no data available.'
The channels show as active and each niche site has been verified in the My Sites section, Double checked that.
I am switching back to HP earnings program as of today.
Hope this feedback helps.
As long as we're still able to earn from the ad program then it shouldn't be a problem.
I don't understand the logic behind such strict rules if they're true, wouldn't they want to earn more ad revenue from bloggers/contributors?
The problem is that legally, to benefit from the HubPages Ad Program, you must have a valid Adsense account for the site where the ads are displayed.
Right now, HP is paying out on the Ad Program for the niche sites even though the status of these newbie accounts isn't clear. But if Adsense comes back and clarifies that their Adsense isn't valid for the niche sites, then legally they shouldn't be allowed to use HP Ads either.
I concur. That's why I was coming at it from the legal perspective.
However I thought the problem was that HubPages was not paying out AsSense for the niche sites for those with a hosted account - as per OP? (see quote below)
"I believe that those of us that are using a hosted account with Adsense are not getting any ad revenue on impressions from the niche sites."
I'm guessing Google's perspective is something along the lines of "one hosted site only" - but that's a total guess.
I wonder if people cancelled their existing accounts opened via HubPages and started again by applying for AdSense "on their own account" (which means they MUST have an independent website non-Blogger blog with good content) and then added niche sites to the new account whether there would be a problem. I'm guessing probably not - given that people with existing independent sites as host don't have a problem.
However I think I'd very much like to see a pathway and checklist developed for that way of resolving the mess before anybody does that - or they could end up in an even worse mess!
It's incredibly worrying because it would essentially be the end of Hubpages and all of these trafficked articles on the niche sites would be obsolete.
I don't think I'd even be able to get another AdSense account if I got one via Hubpages if the rules are correct.
So it'd be a double edge sword with not earning on here and not being able to transfer my articles to my own site because I wouldn't be able to get another AdSense account.
Time to panic?
I THINK (emphasis on THINK!) what you'd have to do is
1) cancel your existing account and then
2) get another one the basis of the content of an independent site you own outside HubPages or any of the niche sites.
3) then add on your hubpages and niche account sites to that new one
However like I said I think I'd strongly recommend you wait for somebody to come up with the pathway and checklist of how to do that before making that move.
Not necessarily. How long ago did you get your Adsense account? Is it hosted or non-hosted?
The niche sites wouldn't disappear and they would go on getting traffic (traffic doesn't depend on Adsense). All the established Hubbers, who hold unrestricted Adsense accounts - and HubPages itself, of course - can continue to earn normally.
The problem is new Hubbers. We do need a constant influx of new, fresh writers to keep adding new material, and if they can't earn, then they won't join. So HubPages would have to find an alternative way of giving them an income.
The niche sites won't disappear - but the content belonging to those not getting paid for adverts might.
The business model assumes a constant influx of newbies - and by and large by those who don't have independent sites and don't already have AdSense Accounts i.e. they sign up for AdSense via HubPages.
So like I said, if HubPages does not resolve the problem with Google AdSense, then a very significant factor underpinning the business model for the site(s) (ie constant turnover of new content from new people) is badly affected.
Any new solution also has to be seen to be equitable - so that's another conundrum. HubPages needs to resolve this with Google - but I wouldn't bet on HubPages and the hosted people getting what they want.
One solution might be that all those wanting to sign up for HubPages MUST already have a Google AdSense account obtained from an independent site they own which has already passed the test (i.e. no sign-ups for AdSense via HubPages). Some might think that's not a bad quality control for those contributing to HubPages....
Besides which Google might just pull the scope for hosted AdSense accounts in any case - maybe not now but maybe in the future....
If I understood it correctly, HOSTED adsense accounts--at the moment--don't earn from niche sites with the "adsense only earning program." Does this mean HOSTED adsense accounts also don't earn with the "adsense only ad" found at the bottom of each hub (the only ad that's not part of the hubpages earning program)?
I may have got this wrong but it seems to me that the issue is either the Hosted HubPages AdSense account is valid for earning on the niche sites or not.
To me whether or not you are on the Hubpages advert program is an irrelevance because it's still the same hosted account account and it's NOT being used on HubPages.
We're not sure right now, but it does seem that hosted accounts aren't earning Adsense from the niche sites. But they will still be earning from the Adsense ads on the main HubPages site because that's what their account is valid for
Which is why I suggested up above that one solution for the affected lensmasters in the short term - to maintain income - would be for them to switch their content back to the main HubPages site.
That would be pretty stupid while they are still earning from the HP Ads Program on the niche sites. You may note Paul's advice that they can continue to use that program.
I am still surprised that HubPages feels able to let them participate in the HP Ads program, given that I understood participants had to have a valid Adsense account. However that's for HubPages to decide, I'm sure they've had legal advice on it.
IF at some future point, HubPages decides they're not eligible to earn from the HP Ads Program either, that will be the time to consider a move back.
"I am still surprised that HubPages feels able to let them participate in the HP Ads program, given that I understood participants had to have a valid Adsense account."
I AGREE! The operative word is VALID.
"However that's for HubPages to decide, I'm sure they've had legal advice on it. "
I'm not sure I'd go so far to say "I'm sure" - however what I would be concerned about (ex Finance Manager hat on here) is that if they have NOT taken GOOD legal advice then they may face a big bill for repayment of income to Google AdSense.
Not quite sure how they'd reclaim that from hubbers other than by netting off against future income - hence the imperative to not surmise and for HubPages to ensure it has received
* sound Legal advice to the right question asked
* AND confirmation from Google AdSense that "the invalid accounts" are not a problem
* AND/OR Google confirms a "workaround" solution.
We've been in touch with AdSense this week and are hoping for a solution. The HP Ad program works, but you may not be earning from your own Adsense account if you signed up from it through HubPages or another host service.
I'd recommend new users use HP Ads.
Thanks Paul, That confirms what I was saying earlier in my post at http://hubpages.com/community/forum/142 … ost2905346
Was I also right what I said about the single ad at the bottom?
How does the HP Ad Program work? Do you mean it still generates income earned from advertisers other than Google AdSense?
The bit I don't understand is why a Google AdSense account which is not valid for a niche site - and cannot generate the "one advert at the bottom" - can be valid for Google AdSense income via the HubPages program
Surely "an invalid account" for the niche sites (ie one generated via a "hosted site") cannot be valid to generate Google AdSense income - no matter how that is generated (ie via own account or via hosted HP Program account)?
Well I guess there's no sense in trying to write for the niche sites until things get resolved.
If everything gets moved back to Hubpages then I'm assuming traffic will take a huge hit since the content will no longer be part of a niche site.
I guess it's time to say goodbye to any side income if that's the case.
HubPages is not planning to move anything back to the main site, that's pure speculation on MakingaMark`s part. Paul has said you can still earn from the HP Ads program on the niche sites. In case you don't know, he owns the company so I think you can have reasonable confidence in what he says.
Chris, you're talking as if no one gets paid for niche hubs. This issue is only affecting people who signed up for a hosted AdSense account after the new rules were in place, and only if they opt out of the HP Ad Program. None of the rest of us are experiencing this problem either way.
There's no reason to dwell on anything then unti things get resolved or make any irrational changes without guidelines in place.
Except that dwelling on issues - and pointing out the implications - sometimes actually prompts more thinking and stimulates action and follow through to remedy problems.
My 'speculation' was purely about what were the possible options for people caught out by this problem if Google won't budge - which is perfectly possible - however this is only limited to those affected by the problem.
If they're looking into it then they're at least being proactive, I am uncertain exactly who is being affected by it. I was told that those who got the account before the new rules were unaffected, but when exactly did the rules come into effect.
What's the cut off date, is it just newbies (whatever that definition is: less than year?) or those who have had the account for a while but not exceeding 5 years.
Chris - the issue is about HOW you got your account.
(the date for when the rules changed for applications for adsense via a hosted account is sometime around the end of 2012 - see https://adsense.googleblog.com/2012/11/ … -host.html)
My understanding is that it is NOT to do with newbies per se.
It's more to do with newbies are more likely to apply for AdSense via the HubPages hosted account - and the rules are different for hosted account applications <5 years old
If you got your account on the basis of an independent application direct to Google on the back of a website or blog with lots of good content that you owned then you are OK. eg
* a newbie coming along with an existing AdSense account is not going to have a problem.
* A newbie who has an existing site and applies for AdSense via that site does not have a problem.
However if you applied for an AdSense account via a "hosted account" (after the end of 2012) - and HubPages is one of those - then there is an issue insofar as you can't add any new sites to the account without an application for review of that account (ie each site has to be independently reviewed). However it seems as though this doesn't work for the new niche sites - assuming people have requested the review for each new niche site using the right form.
Which is why the new niche sites - which are not sub-domains of HubPages - get caught and cannot generate income because the individual does not have a valid AdSense account for those sites.
Bottom line the subdomains used to be OK - the new niche sites are not for those who got their AdSense approved via a hosted account after the end of 2012.
In relation to whether or not the HubSense Ad Program works, personally I can't see how HP can assume it's OK because Google makes explicit that the only people who can benefit are those with VALID AdSense accounts for the sites in question - and that is the crux of the problem.
The "AdSense via Hosted application" accounts started after 2012 are not valid for niche sites - because Google differentiates between independent site applications and hosted site applications for an AdSense account. There are much stricter limits on sites being added to those accounts approved via a hosted site application (as in you can't!)
(IMO HubPages should stop taking any applications for a hosted AdSense account until this is sorted - or at least put up warnings and give those with an option to apply independently the chance to do so)
Well then my concerns are warranted as I've gotten my AdSense account via Hubpages, which means the ad program would be invalid for any article on the niche sites.
Even if they were to move those articles back to Hubpages, I imagine my earnings/view count would plummet to almost nothing.
Given you only joined HubPages two years ago then you have one of the newer "hosted" accounts and yes, you are affected.
Your account is not valid for any of the new niche sites
That's what HubPages is looking into. Given there was a quite clear policy decision taken 5 years ago I think it's unlikely they will get Google to change their minds on this. Also since the hosted account relates to the HubPages domain I can't see how they can use it to generate advert income via the HubPages program for the niche sites - because the hosted account only relates to the HubPages domain.
HubPages seems to be treating the niche sites as sub-domains for the purposes of AdSense when actually they're supposed to be independent sites.
I guess the issue is whether or not Google will go along with an idea that the owner of the host (for the host accounts) can add independent URLs to their host scheme for AdSense (ie HubPages Program)
For those with an old Hosted account then the issue is whether or not you have added your niche site URLs to your account and verified them
We don't know.
Presumably we will know more after Google gets back to HP.
If you read back up the thread I made one suggestion as to a way out if Google won't budge - and I think there's a chance they won't - but I don't think it's a fast fix.
Essentially, it involves cancellation of the existing account and starting out again with an application for a new account based on content of an independent website.
That certainly wouldn't be an option for everybody - but it did strike me as a good way forward in terms of new people coming on board i.e. stop offering the host account - and then they just add HubPages and the niche sites to their existing account as and when they make hubs
So I'd have to create my own site say via WordPress, cancel the AdSense account for Hubpages, get approved for an AdSense account on the independent site and then add the niche sites to the new account.
Could I transfer several featured hubs and make a new website out of that because I don't have my own site right now.
I'm not jumping the gun because there's a lot of unknowns but I would like to be prepared if worse comes to worse.
In principle correct
However my strong recommendation Chris is:
1) wait and see what the outcome of the discussions with Google are
2) if they go well - you won't have a problem
3) if Google won't budge then I think it behoves HubPages to suggest a pathway and process for people to be able to continue to contribute to the niche sites.
The only logical way I can think of is to do it via an independent account - and that needs to have well-defined step by step process for how to do that.
Bottom line don't make a difficult situation worse by trying to execute a speedy solution where you could make a mistake which makes the situation worse. (e.g. bear in mind most people can't have two AdSense accounts and timing on changes like this is really important!)
Also - as a general principle - if you have a topic which would merit a specialised niche site of its own - then it's worth giving serious thought to having an independent website/blog of your very own and of course if you wanted to put AdSense on that you would need an independent account.
That's the "never put all your eggs in one basket" philosophy that all of us who were with Squidoo now follow!
Certainly patience is required; I'd just like to know my options in case like you said, "Google doesn't budge". If I was earning scraps then it wouldn't be a big deal but a lot of hubbers earn a significant side income, and it would be a shame for us to lose out.
Thank you for your responses, I appreciate your advice and know how much experience you have with this.
Since we can't have two AdSense accounts then how would that work. Would I just have the account for the independent site then and cancel the hosted one.
Yes - in principle it would be something like
1) set up new site
2) transfer content but don't publish until you have enough
3) delete hubs
5) delete hosted account (being careful to do so after payday)
6) THEN apply for independent account on the basis of new coherent website with good quality content
7) wait for approval - if your content is good that shouldn't be a problem
8) set up adsense on new site once approved
9) add HP and niche sites to new AS account - shouldn't be a problem (might need a short wait)
10) add new a/c to HP settings
IDEALLY if Google won't budget, what HP could get ask them to agree to is parallel running of a hosted and an independent AdSense accounts for (say) 2-3 months while people switched to independent accounts i.e. once people got the new site up and running and got their independent application agreed then they cancel the hosted account and add in the HP/Niche site URLs to the independent account.
I've not looked at any of your hubs. However producing 120+ hubs in 2.5 years is good going. They also seem to be very topical and have excellent titles - and you've got an excellent author score so HP likes you!
I'd say you should give some serious thought to having an independent site in time. However if you do, go for one that has a website and a blog together. The blog is great for keeping the traffic up and reminding people what's on the rest of the site over time. Also go for a mega niche - i.e. highly specialised but one where you have a lot of content to offer. Then think very carefully about how to structure it. Then transfer the content slowly to the new site and build it slowly. It's creating new content (which you inevitably rewrite as you transfer) which creates the presence and gets you the traffic.
That said you can still continue to have sites on HP and the niche sites running parallel for all those topics that don't merit an external site
Chris, I'm really confused. You got your Adsense account 2 or 3 years ago, if I recall. Are you saying you're also being affected by this problem? Have you actually checked your Adsense account to see?
The bottom line is - if you are seeing earnings (even a few cents) from the niche sites on your Adsense account, then you have nothing to worry about. You, and all the rest of us with older accounts, are grandfathered in. It's not going to affect you.
The change in the rule about Hosted Accounts happened at the end of 2012 - see https://adsense.googleblog.com/2012/11/ … -host.html
The reason people will never have noticed it is because it wouldn't have affected anybody on HubPages because all hubs were run as sub-domains.
The reason it does now is because niche sites are "supposed to be" totally independent of HubPages i.e. they are not part of the HubPages domain and are theoretically independent
Maybe Google is making a point? ie you can't make niche sites independent so Google doesn't think they are part of a content farm and then say they're actually part of the hosted account so not really independent.
For some reason HubPages is still running the hosted HubPages program as if hosted accounts are valid on independent sites - so not many have noticed the issue.
However those who have actually looked at their Google AdSense dashboard and their reports will see that none of their niche hubs have been added to their account nor are they earning any income - but only if they have:
* tried adding them
* and only if they have a hosted account started after the change of rules at the end of 2012.
I think the issue is that each site added to a hosted account has to go through a process of being individually vetted as indicated by the 2012 blog post.
That suggests that every time a niche site needs to be added it has got to be individually approved by Google - so
* people may not have used the right form
* or there could be a backlog of approvals
* or Google might have another reason for not adding them.
I am having the same problem. It's like they are no longer acknowledging hubs once they are moved to niche sites.
An independent site was my goal eventually, it would be nice if I was able to still earn from HP and the niche sites along with my own site.
I have a good sense of where I'd want to go with it but there's a lot to learn about which platform to use and definitely how to structure it.
My suggestions would be to start doing your research about different platforms and comparative costs (it's not cheap running your own site - unless it's on a free platform like Blogger. I use Weebly Starter package and it gives me all I need - and I don't have to bother with the technical end of keeping it up and running!)
Also start reviewing your content and think about how it can cluster.
I used to make lens/now hubs in clusters of about 10 per subject - so I've got 2 websites up and running and 2 more on a slow simmer and I've still got a lot of hubs left after I transfer content for those 4 mega-niche sites.
The big trick is defining the scope of your site. Big enough to be able to keep expanding and refining it and not too high a level so that it stays niche oriented with a very precisely defined set of fans.
Chris, if an independent site is your goal, then start now.
Google looks for several things in a blog or website. They want to see a large amount of content, and they want to see new content being added regularly - but they also look for longevity. The longer your website or blog has been in existence, the better. So the earlier your website springs into existence, the better.
My advice would be, sign up for Wordpress.com, buy a good domain name that describes what your site is about, and start - even if all you do is write one post every couple of months.
I suggest Wordpress.com because it is the cheapest option. You can't put Adsense or any other type of ads on it, but if you're just using it to get started, that won't worry you. And the big advantage of Wordpress.com is that it's very, very easy to transfer your content somewhere else once you've decided what you want to do.
Do bear in mind, though, that MakingAMark is an acknowledged expert in her field, she has written books, she has been creating sites for several years and her websites are HUGE. Unless you are similarly expert, or really clever at research, you are likely to struggle to achieve that same level of success - and certainly it will be a long haul!
So having your independent AdSense account could provide for all of that content on, HP, the niche sites, and your personal sites correct?
I was either going to go with WordPress or Weebly, but I want to be sure before making that decision.
Compared to HP and the niche sites, how are your 4 sites doing in comparison (I assume much better) and is that the better long term option.
If so then it's probably a good thing for some hubbers if they have to create their own site to continue earning here. It might turn out to be even more profitable over time.
Then again a lot of hubbers will probably struggle to create enough or transfer enough quality content before getting accepted for AdSense on their own site.
Yes - mine has got HubPages on as well as my independent sites - because I applied for it via another one of websites/blogs. For some reason the idea of applying for the account via a host site never appealed to me.
I'm a big advocate of using HubPages alongside your own independent sites. You can try out topics and see what the response is from readers in terms of hits and comments and Amazon buys. If you think you have enough content - from the past and going forward -then you can try creating an independent site (but ONLY if you can be authoritative on a topic AND keep it fresh). Plus not everything fits with an independent niche site and HubPages makes a great home for those type of topics.
In relation to how well my independent sites are doing - well two of the sites are still in draft - so not live yet
Of the other two, both have been live for well over a year and both are now getting way more traffic than on HubPages - upwards of 10 times more. One is now #1 for the niche topic in Google rankings according to Alexa.
One site is going doing very well on Amazon because content can now be spread out over a lot of pages (I used to write VERY LONG HUBS) and so all the books I mention are highly relevant to the topic for that page. Plus I do book review type listings not advert type listings and the buy link is to the title not a "buy" button.
I don't have any adverts on that site as the long term plan is to offer hosted and screened adverts for very specific reasons on very specific pages only (eg from tutors) i.e. very refined control.
The other live site is gaining ground with very low profile AdSense adverts - absolutely nothing in your face or above the fold - done as images in boxes which I've found convert much better. Income is OK. They're becoming highly relevant to the topic so clicks are also improving. However I've not yet added in the code for mobile adverts which I need to do and which I know would help it convert better. Note however I went through my adsense categories with a fine toothcomb and eliminated all those that are not relevant to my topic(s) - which includes some of the not so palatable very high-earning ones you see on HubPages.
However I never liked seeing un-related adverts for certain topics on my hubs so I'm what I'm much more pleased about is that I have greatly increased control over which adverts run.
I just searched on the Inside AdSense blog run by Google for "host partner sites"
In the comments one person replied as follows
"You currently have a host-only account, so this ad code will show as a blank space outside of host partner sites. To find out how to get live ads on other websites, please refer to our Help Center."
I think that explains why the problem exists for Niche Sites on AdSense hosted accounts
Maybe we should now refer to all Adsense accounts applied for through HubPages as "Host Only AdSense Accounts"
How do I determine whether or not I have a "Host Only AdSense Account"?
If you look at Paul's post, it looks like the problem is now solved.
This site https://allbloggingtips.com/upgrade-ads … l-account/ for more on the issue and upgrade process
It has had a good go at a thorough explanation of
* the reasons for the differences between the two different types of AdSense accounts and
* what you have to do to upgrade from a "Host Site ONLY Adsense account" (relevant to partner sites such as partner sites of Google such as Blogspot, YouTube or HubPages) and an independent non-hosted AdSense account - which they NOW monitor much more closely
"However, getting a non-hosted Adsense account is not that easy anymore because many people tried to trick AdSense to get approved so they changed the policies. You have to fulfil all the requirements of AdSense to get approved."
The AdSense Host API Team whitelisted all of our niche sites. We can't see if it's working properly, so we need someone that has signed up for an account through us in the last year or two to see if the AdSense earnings are showing up for topical sites.
It should be working correctly.
For folks that aren't sure, HP Ads is where we are focusing on improving and it's the recommended option for earning via ad impressions.
But what about the observation that Adsense accounts approved for Hubpages only may not be able to earn from the niche sites?
If so, a lot of people are potentially losing money by allowing their hubs to go to niche sites, and they should be informed of this.
It would be good to get a firm yes/no on that issue.
It think it works now. I can now see stats on "My ads > Ad Units > URL Section" and the websites on the "Sites" list on the google adsense home page. Also, earnings have surged significantly (as seen on the google adsense home page) when there was virtually nothing in the past days, weeks, and months. Thanks!
Note: I'm using the Hubpages Earning Program. The few cents I see on my google adsense page are probably from the google adsense-only ad found on the bottom of every hub page.
I can confirm that I'm now able to earn AdSense from the niche sites where previously I wasn't able.
Now that I'm getting AdSense earnings, I can fully test which program works better, AdSense or the ad program.
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