HP/TAG mining content from Discover

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   Shesabutterflyposted 2 days ago

   Just wanted to give everyone a heads up that HP has started the process of mining articles from Discover. The new Owlcation articles have the same title as the ones on Discover (in most cases) and the URLs are identical as well. The only difference is the beginning. For example, owlcation/humanities/facts-about-malcolm-x verse discover.hubpages/politics/facts-about-malcolm-x.
   
   They are rewriting our articles and in some cases with the help of AI. This is an editor's note at the bottom of one of the Owlcation articles they blatantly re-wrote from Discover. "Editor's Note: While we may use AI to assist with research, compilation, and organization of the content on Owlcation, every article is reviewed and curated by real editors and informed by human insight and discretion from our editorial team."
   
   They have copied one of Paul's and now one of mine. The one I just complained about losing all my views from. Am I wrong to believe in foul-play now? This is too much of a coincidence to believe otherwise. This is also one of two articles of mine that suddenly had ChatGPT views.

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      WriterJanisposted 2 days agoin reply to this

      Doesn't that mean if you're currently moved to Owlcation that you'll no longer get paid for the views?

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         Shesabutterflyposted 2 days agoin reply to this

         They are not moving the original article to Owlcation. They are creating derivative works from our content. I can only assume to regain earnings lost by allowing us to take our content to Discover in the first place. Rather than offer to pay us as they have for those previously on AxleAddict (per a forum post by Jerry Fisher https://hubpages.com/community/forum/36 … m-hp-today ), they are choosing this route instead. No doubt these articles will quickly out rank our Discover articles in SERPS.
         
         Completely within the realm of their TOS if we keep our content on HubPages Discover. I was letting people know in case they wanted to remove their content. I will be doing so, I'm just making sure I have all my ducks in a row first.

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            Genna Eastposted 2 days agoin reply to this

            Excuse me, but they have no right to do this as it appears to infer copyright infringement. I'm a little confused as to how this is within the realm of their TOS.  In addition, these actions appear to negate the emails we received a few months ago, advising us of the option to move our content from certain niche sites to Discover and the reasons why.  Am I missing something?  Is Owlcation an exception?

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               theraggededgeposted 2 days agoin reply to this

               The Terms of Use doesn't allow me to copy and paste the contents (that's something they did not extend to us writers, is it?), but here's a screenshot:
               
               

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               Shesabutterflyposted 2 days agoin reply to this

               As Bev has posted, as long as our content is on HP/Discover we have granted them the ability to create other works directly from our original content.
               
               However, we can remove our content from HP and then they will need to remove the work they created and put on niche sites (so far only Owlcation, but I do not believe that is where they are stopping). We will retain all copyrights including those to derivative works which means they will no longer be able to create articles from our work.
               
               The only way to stop this, is to remove our content from HP unfortunately. Now I need to figure out who to contact once I remove all my articles from HP. I'll be notifying them of copyright infringement and to remove their derivative work.

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                  Patty Inglish, MSposted 47 hours agoin reply to this

                  Yes. I also can no longer find a listing in the statistics field of my HP articles that tells me which articles have been copied. Not a good sign. I guess I need to remove content.

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                     Shesabutterflyposted 43 hours agoin reply to this

                     Wow! I did not notice that last night. They also removed the Q&A from our articles/profile pages. Although that might have happened earlier in the year?
                     
                     I only noticed because the article they created from mine has a FAQ section, yet my Discover articles no longer have them. They were there in the beginning of 2025 prior to moving my articles to Discover. I know I used them when editing my article for my own site. Confirmed via the wayback machine.
                     
                     I'm very glad I have already posted this particular article years ago on my own website. As well as have multiple copies of my article edits saved over the years.

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                        Patty Inglish, MSposted 23 hours agoin reply to this

                        WOW.

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                  Genna Eastposted 28 hours agoin reply to this

                  The never advised or informed the authors of this.  The email they sent to use regarding moving our content from certain niche sites to Discover was, in part, to avoid this.  If they are now infringing copyrights via Discover without notification or advisement in addition to other covert changes, theft and plagiarism, that is a huge, legal faux pas on their part, and is actionable. My guess is they are testing the waters.

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                     PaulGoodman67posted 27 hours agoin reply to this

                     I don't think they're "testing the waters", I think they're taking everything they want before they close down HP.com/Discover.

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                        Eric Cauncaposted 26 hours agoin reply to this

                        Yes. I agree with you. I also think about that. They also planning something about HP or Discover.

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                        Kenna McHughposted 25 hours agoin reply to this

                        How can I share this thread with someone outside HP/TAG?

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                           theraggededgeposted 24 hours agoin reply to this

                           Just send them the link. You don't have to be a member.

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                     Shesabutterflyposted 25 hours agoin reply to this

                     I agree with Paul. I do not think they are testing the waters. They know exactly what they are doing.
                     
                     The TOS are at the bottom of every page. Beyond that, they are under no obligation to notify us of changes. These specific terms/addendums have been around since at least 2021/2022.
                     
                     I'm trying to refrain from saying too much more beyond what TAG is actively doing on Owlcation, however you're more than welcome to join the email group Andrea is trying to create.

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                        Genna Eastposted 10 hours agoin reply to this

                        Thank you.  I look forward to learning more about the email group. As long as Arena does not commit any form of theft/plagiarism, their TOS will in all probability hold up, so to speak. This is in accordance with what my attorney advised.

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                           TheShadowSpecterposted 5 hours agoin reply to this

                           Genna?  I know that this may not be directly related to what is happening, but something else that is very peculiar has been going on with TAG.  For nearly a year, now and then whenever I attempt to save my changes on an article after editing it, the changes do not save.  Sometimes I can salvage them by using the "recover draft" feature, but not always.  I've lost valuable text from my articles because of it.  I've complained about this same problem on a number of occasions to the HubPages Team, and they tell me that they're working to fix it.  However, they never do, and now they're not even responding to my complaints about it.  It's not just this one problem, but a number of other anomalies that I have been encountering, which are things that never used to happen back in 2016 when I first joined HubPages as a writer.  Why do you think they're being negligent in this manner?  Some people on this forum believe that HubPages is getting ready to fold as evidenced by their actions.  A lot of these types of problems were going on with Infobarrel before they vanished altogether from the Internet.

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                           Genna Eastposted 3 hours agoin reply to this

                           By the way, I neglected to mention that I left HP in 2020, and did not return until late 2023.  During that time, I never received any emails or notifications regarding Arena’s takeover, changes in TOS, and so forth.  One of my fellow creative writers who no longer contributes content to HP advised that Hubpages, “Has lost its soul.”  I could not agree more.

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                              Genna Eastposted 2 hours agoin reply to this

                              I neglected to mention that I left HP in 2020, and did not return until late 2023.  During that time, I never received any emails or notifications regarding Arena’s takeover, changes in TOS, and so forth. One of my fellow creative writers who no longer contributes content to HP advised, "Hubpages has lost its soul.”  I could not agree more.  Are they getting ready to fold?  It certainly seems evident by their actions and inactions that this is the case.

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                  Genna Eastposted 22 hours agoin reply to this

                  I'm sorry, but my attorney advised me that this cannot apply to authors who have especially and legally copyrighted their work.  For example, the bulk of my work that is published was copyrighted before Arena's purchase and takeover of HP.  Nor did I ever receive an email or notification of Arena's absurd TOS.  If they infringe these rights, they will be sued...and they will lose.  Has anyone here actually copyrighted their own work?

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                     PaulGoodman67posted 22 hours agoin reply to this

                     Genna - Did your attorney advise you to personally and publicly engage with the company that you're considering taking legal action against? That's almost always a big no-no.

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                        Genna Eastposted 21 hours agoin reply to this

                        Hi Paul.  IF they do this regarding my work, which has yet to be determined, then I would delete/close my account and file a lawsuit.  And my initial engagement with HP was long before Arena ever came into the picture.  Regarding TOS, whatever they assert does not mean they have the actual legal right to do this regarding authors who have copyrighted their work.
                        
                        Once again, the email they sent to us a few months back did not infer that Arena planned to do this with content which was moved to Discover.  I know a couple of creative writers who were also careful to copyright their own work. They have since deleted their HP accounts upon receipt of that email.
                        
                        I am still curious regarding who, here, has copyrighted their own work. In addition, if one does delete an article from HP, does this mean it would automatically protect said publication since Arena already has a copy of it and/or begun to "mine" its content?

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                           TheShadowSpecterposted 19 hours agoin reply to this

                           From what I understand about American copyright law is that once you create an article or any type of publication, it is automatically copyrighted.  It may be different in other nations.

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                              Genna Eastposted 11 hours agoin reply to this

                              You are correct, but filing/registering a copyright provides the author with additional legal protections.

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                  lobobrandonposted 22 hours agoin reply to this

                  You should submit a DMCA request to Google to have that link removed from its search results. If you delete your article, the AI-generated article may be considered the "original" source. You might want to add your article to the Wayback Machine if you want to use it as proof with another authority: https://web.archive.org/

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                     viryaboposted 22 hours agoin reply to this

                     Good advice.

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                     Genna Eastposted 21 hours agoin reply to this

                     Excellent point.

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                        PaulGoodman67posted 20 hours agoin reply to this

                        TAG/HP are able to delete our articles at any point they wish. So, even if the articles are similar enough to qualify as plagiarism in Google's eyes (which I believe is far from clear) that still won't work, as TAG can just get rid of your work.

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            Ken Burgessposted 46 hours agoin reply to this

            With AIs growing capabilities and major publishers already using AI to generate (or steal and modify) content (IE - SI) being able to make decent income from the likes of HubPages in the future will be a challenge.

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               theraggededgeposted 46 hours agoin reply to this

               Well we didn't think our work would be stolen by the very platform it's published on. I've never heard anything like it.

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      CYong74posted 2 days agoin reply to this

      Thanks for the heads-up. I took a look at Owlcation and the newest one about Yokai is mine. They changed some of the entries but what remains is largely similar.

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         Kenna McHughposted 47 hours agoin reply to this

         Ced, oh my goodness. I can't believe this is happening, such an offense in the writer/editor/publisher world.

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            theraggededgeposted 47 hours agoin reply to this

            No honour among thieves.
            
            I was just talking to my other half. Trying to decide whether to wait and see or to give up the $50-$75 a month, which is nothing given previous earnings. I feel so angry about this, especially after all Matt's reassurances that 'HubPages is here to stay'.
            
            Have deleted two non-performing articles to see if my saved (in an app) versions disappear. If they do, I need to get them all copied and saved - again.
            
            If I do delete them all, at least it simplifies my taxes.

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               Kenna McHughposted 45 hours agoin reply to this

               I agree. The energy I have invested in this platform and the return I have received lately are heartbreaking. Now, TAG is stealing our work. TOS? It's covert and underhanded.

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               Patty Inglish, MSposted 45 hours agoin reply to this

               I see Matt's LinkedIn profile shows he's been operations Mgr of TAG instead of HP since 2018. Who here thinks HP is a slush pile from which to choose material to rewrite for profit? idk

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      SerenityHaloposted 46 hours agoin reply to this

      I think it’s time a private email list among us is formed, those who frequent in the forums.
      
      I think we might need to have some talks.

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         Shesabutterflyposted 44 hours agoin reply to this

         I'd love to take some kind of action without having to remove my content, but I don't see how that is possible.

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            SerenityHaloposted 43 hours agoin reply to this

            I have some thoughts, but I think it would be best to put it together in an email chain.

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               Shesabutterflyposted 43 hours agoin reply to this

               I'm open to that. I do not know many e-mails though. I did open my account back up to be contacted by other's if that's helpful.

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                  theraggededgeposted 43 hours agoin reply to this

                  I have too.

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                  SerenityHaloposted 40 hours agoin reply to this

                  I’ll put my email here for now and people can respond. I’ll use the contact button to try to reach out to people who seem active/helpful. I do think there are some things we can do.
                  
                  AndreaLawrenceWriting@gmail.com.

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                     Kenna McHughposted 35 hours agoin reply to this

                     You can contact me through my profile. I agree, we need to step up and take action.

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                        theraggededgeposted 33 hours agoin reply to this

                        Perhaps the first step would be to contact someone at TAG via an email 'signed' by all of us who are concerned? Start a bit of push-back.

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                           Kenna McHughposted 25 hours agoin reply to this

                           Agree!

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                           SerenityHaloposted 20 hours agoin reply to this

                           100%, I think we need to contact HP before we get lost in the weeds. It’s possible this has been a misunderstanding, or that they’re unaware of what some people are doing in their company.

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                              Kenna McHughposted 20 hours agoin reply to this

                              They should know by now, or, at least, Matt should know.

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                                 SerenityHaloposted 20 hours agoin reply to this

                                 I agree. Who knows what is happening on the other side of things. A flurry of actions to figure things out or… nothing.

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      Miebakagh57posted 45 hours agoin reply to this

      Really? And that's worrisome. Hubpages is now set to steal our articles? Shameful.

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      Patty Inglish, MSposted 23 hours agoin reply to this

      My work is being accessed often by Google's Copilot - maybe for rewriting.

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   Venkatachari Mposted 2 days ago

   Yes, I am also confused. Shesha's first post says they are rewriting the articles and placing them on Owlcation or AxleAddict. The next observation states that the original article is on Discover, and we hope to be allowed to move our content to Discover.
   So, when the article is already on Discover, what is the point in hoping that we be allowed?
   I have moved all my articles to Discover as per HP's previous notices.

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      theraggededgeposted 2 days agoin reply to this

      The articles are on two sites; the original is on Discover (after being moved from the network site), while a copied/rewritten version appears on Owlcation. That version will not generate any income for the writer.

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         WriterJanisposted 2 days agoin reply to this

         I've been confused, but this seems to clear things up. Thank you.

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   theraggededgeposted 46 hours ago

   We could issue them with DMCAs. But then I suppose they would hit us with the Terms of Use.

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      Shesabutterflyposted 44 hours agoin reply to this

      They would have to remove their content when we remove our originals from Discover. I don't see us having any recourse prior to that though.
      
      My problem is I don't know where to send such an email. My last email to team@hubpages took a week. I don't want my content garnering them traffic while I wait for them to respond and remove the infringing content.

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   Eric Cauncaposted 46 hours ago

   The copied one rank # 1 on Google, while mine, the original one, ranks # 2.

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      theraggededgeposted 46 hours agoin reply to this

      That's awful, Eric. Maybe you can get the stolen one deindexed from Google?

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      Ken Burgessposted 45 hours agoin reply to this

      Search Engines... AIs... will be trafficked toward the preferred article...

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         SerenityHaloposted 40 hours agoin reply to this

         More likely the search engine will favor Google’s AI, and other forms of AI will be deindexed. AI slop isn’t what people want to read, so it’s falling out of favor.

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            Ken Burgessposted 40 hours agoin reply to this

            Yes, we even see it in the forums, people now constantly quote ChatGPT and its links as if it were gospel.
            
            I think that was what was most surprising to me about these AI aids so far... that people who are far more active on here writing articles than I am were so quick to jump to it and start using it... even for their arguments in the forums...
            
            That tells me if hard working writers that have the experience and ability to research and develop their own perspectives are so willing to switch to ChatGPT... then the world will be dependent on AI quicker and with far less resistance than anyone imagined.

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               SerenityHaloposted 36 hours agoin reply to this

               If anyone uses ChatGPT to make their points in a forum, I think they’ve effectively given up.
               
               I can’t take someone seriously who does that. I scroll past AI answers in things. It looks like bots to me or bad advertising.

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   PaulGoodman67posted 43 hours ago

   It's appalling but not surprising.
   
   The truth is that AI can take any article from anywhere and rewrite it. The traditional copyright laws no longer help us because AI rewords and does it in seconds for next to nothing.
   
   If an article is online and in the public domain, AI has access to it.

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      theraggededgeposted 42 hours agoin reply to this

      I think the point is that TAG people think they have the moral right to do this. It's not AI's fault, it's theirs.
      
      And who are these so-called writers attaching their by-line to hubbers' work?

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         PaulGoodman67posted 41 hours agoin reply to this

         I see it as about legal rights. I doubt that they're much concerned about the morality.
         
         There's no question it's bad but whether it can be stopped and how much it's happening elsewhere too, I don't know for certain...
         
         I admire Elton John's campaign against AI stealing musician's work, but again, I worry about whether it will have the desired effect... Governments seem to have decided that they're going to make lots of money from AI and don't want to restrict it in any way.

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         CYong74posted 37 hours agoin reply to this

         Yup. My stolen Yokai hub now has thr byline for some big timer with how-many-years of writing experience. But he seems clueless about ethics, if he's a real person at all.

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            SerenityHaloposted 36 hours agoin reply to this

            I am really upset this happened to you. The article you wrote clearly requires a specific knowledge and interest. I think it is sick that they’re taking articles from Discover with this much specificity and acting like someone else did the work. That and yours is in the doom and gloom of Discover ads while the other one isn’t.
            
            I do think the person is real after looking at their LinkedIn and Substack.
            
            I personally don’t think any of us should take this lightly and should pushback.

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               Eric Cauncaposted 36 hours agoin reply to this

               Imagine, it took a month for me to finish some articles.

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               CYong74posted 35 hours agoin reply to this

               Thank you for commiserating. Imagine my horror when I launched Owlcation and saw my header staring at me.
               
               And they caught me at an awful time. I'm in the middle of house shifting, literally surrounded by boxes and bags, when I saw this.
               
               Yes, I agree. Something should be done. Its absurd that TAG invites us to move our stuff back to Discover only for them to be copied this way.

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                  SerenityHaloposted 19 hours agoin reply to this

                  I am sorry this happened and at a bad time.

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      Shesabutterflyposted 42 hours agoin reply to this

      That may be true, but this is a bit different than an AI model scraping articles and producing search results.
      
      HP/TAG made an intentional decision to use AI to profit off of other people's work. That's not right. If I remove my content, they no longer have the authority to create content based off my work. Despite AI, we still own the copyright to our original work. The use of AI did not change the new article much if at all. The ideas, the content, formatting, Q&A, are all ideas taken from my original work.
      
      That's comparable to saying I can use AI to rewrite Stephen King novels and then turn around and sell them under my name with no repercussions. He printed them, the content is out there, and AI has access.

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         PaulGoodman67posted 41 hours agoin reply to this

         You're right to not take my legal opinion seriously, I'm not a copyright lawyer. You should get proper advice if you believe you're correct.

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         Ken Burgessposted 41 hours agoin reply to this

         I am sure in order to publish your articles on HP... and keep them here, over the years of changes, you have given over considerable authority as to what can be done regarding any works still remaining on HP.

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            Shesabutterflyposted 41 hours agoin reply to this

            I am aware of what rights I gave HP/TAG while my content resides here.

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         SerenityHaloposted 40 hours agoin reply to this

         It’s exploitation of their writers work. They’ve dumped us out of Owlcation among other niche sites. Now it appears they’re rewriting the same articles we wrote using AI, or just rewriting them in general to profit from the same ideas and cut us out.
         
         Either someone new was hired and is very bad at their job with these counterfeit articles or TAG has lowered its standards to an ugly degree.
         
         I don’t think we should be glib about it. I think we should be starting some conversations with people who can help and put a stop to this—for this particular platform.
         
         They’re stealing from the writers who helped them build this platform. It’s wild. It’s bad behavior. It’s unethical.
         
         We’re also not supposed to use AI for our writing, so if they’re using it and then having human editors fix it… that’s not good enough.

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            Miebakagh57posted 27 hours agoin reply to this

            I completely agree with you. What hubpages did is intentional, then to plagialism our works. No new editor would have had done that. Is Pauld Edmonton, a new man?

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               SerenityHaloposted 19 hours agoin reply to this

               I am hoping this has all been a misunderstanding, and somehow things can be resolved. I know that’s super optimistic, but I’m trying not to assume the worst possible scenario(s). At least, today I’m trying to be hopeful that with communication something can be improved or explained.

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            Miebakagh57posted 27 hours agoin reply to this

            I completely agree with you. What hubpages did is intentional, then to plagialism our works. No new editor would have had done that. Is Paul  Edmonton, a new man?

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      Ken Burgessposted 41 hours agoin reply to this

      Exactly, I am sure this is not the only place where this is occurring, it is most likely across all publishing platforms used, feeding them to AI to do a quick update and rewrite.
      
      Like Disney is doing with all their content... remaking Little Mermaid and Snow White to conform to today's politics and perspectives.

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   psycheskinnerposted 42 hours ago

   It has seemed obvious to me, albeit challenging to prove, that they have used our content to select successful articles they can reproduce on staff like a dumber, more exploitative version of what AI does.  Even deleting my articles won't stop them from exploring that historic data.

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   Rupert Taylorposted 40 hours ago

   I recall a few months ago that when Paul Edmondson was appointed CEO of TAG that euphoria (too strong a word perhaps?) spread through the ranks. He was going to restore HubPages to its former glory was the hope.
   
   If things are going down as described above, and TAG is borrowing (stealing is such an ugly word) our articles then that seems to mark a major betrayal.
   
   It would be nice if someone with authority would join this thread and offer a full and clear explanation. (No messing about with management-speak with intent to obscure meaning.) Then, we can all decide whether we want to participate or not.
   
   Is there anybody there?

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      CYong74posted 38 hours agoin reply to this

      Maybe P.Edmondson is behind this. After all, who knows the platform better than him?

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         Eric Cauncaposted 36 hours agoin reply to this

         Is wordpress.com good?

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            CYong74posted 26 hours agoin reply to this

            Wordpress is a content management platform. By itself, it doesn't earn. You will need to pay for your own domain and successfully apply for an ad service like Adsense to earn.

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               Eric Cauncaposted 26 hours agoin reply to this

               How about blogger.com?

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                  eugbugposted 26 hours agoin reply to this

                  I have a blog that was published in December 2023, with 200 science and engineering articles. So far I've made 54 cent. Granted, Google hasn't indexed it yet for some reason.

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                     Shesabutterflyposted 25 hours agoin reply to this

                     You are more tech savvy than me and might have done this already, however, I had to manually submit my url's from my squarespace site. Despite Google crawling the pages for whatever reason they would not index them. I did the same over at Bing.

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                        eugbugposted 25 hours agoin reply to this

                        Bing eventually indexed it. I submitted the site using Google's Search Console and it has a sitemap that should provide information. I eventually managed to contact someone in Google support and they're getting me to try different things to sort the issue.

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                        PaulGoodman67posted 24 hours agoin reply to this

                        You'll get them indexed at some point, that issue is almost always temporary, in my experience.
                        
                        The problem is getting good positions in the SERPs and setting up an ad system that provides reasonable remuneration.

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                  CYong74posted 25 hours agoin reply to this

                  To be honest, if revenue is the long term intention, you need to get your own domain. Using hosted domains like blogger can have some revenue but unless your content is very good, it's hard to rank because these sites are full of rubbish.

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            Miebakagh57posted 26 hours agoin reply to this

            Does wordpress.com paid freelance writers?

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               theraggededgeposted 24 hours agoin reply to this

               No. You would have to generate your own income. It's just a blogging and website platform.

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                  Miebakagh57posted 15 hours agoin reply to this

                  How Bev?

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                     theraggededgeposted 8 hours agoin reply to this

                     Start a different thread, Miebakagh. But, in short, It's the same as any other blogging platform... you offer something; a service, product, subscription, whatever.

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         viryaboposted 28 hours agoin reply to this

         Yes, you are right, who knows!

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      PaulGoodman67posted 23 hours agoin reply to this

      Paul E stopped being CEO of HupPages many years ago and took a salaried corporate management role. I'm sure he has some nostalgic feelings for the company he helped set up but I don't believe he's been directly involved for many years.
      
      He's aways been a tech businessman, not the cavalry rushing to save a prized possession. He explained at the time of the merger the problems with HP operating as a private company and why it had to become part of Maven, later TAG. People seem to skip all that bit and focus on when he was in the role of CEO of an independent HP.
      
      Nobody of authority has been involved in this forum for many years. Matt is an operations manager, that role typically involves overseeing the day-to-day running of a site. The editors (when they existed here) were, as their name suggests, concerned with editing.
      
      I'm just suggesting that you might be setting your hopes too high, Rupert. They may not believe it to be in their interests to engage with us. It looks like they're cannibalizing what's left before closing everything down. No need to maintain a relationship if that's the scenario.
      
      Also, legally, it's usually best to say nothing rather than engage when there's any threat of legal action.
      
      The hubbers who are threatening HP in the forums with legal action are not doing themselves any favors. No lawyer would advise that it's a good idea to get embroiled or make public your feelings or intentions in that situation.

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         Kenna McHughposted 21 hours agoin reply to this

         I believe a class-action lawsuit would be a practical approach. It would set a precedent for other platforms and publishers considering the same approach.

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            theraggededgeposted 21 hours agoin reply to this

            I think that, while someone has an open account here, they have no recourse to legal action as they are limited by the Terms of Use. The ToU are clear beyond all doubt that the administrators of the platform can do what they like with our work. It's the price we pay.
            
            However if TAG uses work after the account is closed then they are violating copyright law.

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               PaulGoodman67posted 20 hours agoin reply to this

               What's the source for that legal opinion, Bev?
               
               I'm wary of unqualified interpretations of US copyright law and the ToS.
               
               I'm not trying to single you out. I'm generally seeing a lot of legal opinions on here that seem untrustworthy. Everyone sees themselves as legal experts, apparently.

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                  theraggededgeposted 18 hours agoin reply to this

                  I'm no legal expert but am simply using logic: use the platform and you have abide by the Terms of Use. Leave the platform and those Terms of Use no longer apply.

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               Kenna McHughposted 20 hours agoin reply to this

               I see, well, each day here gets more disheartening.

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                  viryaboposted 3 hours agoin reply to this

                  It does, doesn't it

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               Genna Eastposted 13 hours agoin reply to this

               I believe that the issue with TOS which I tried to explain earlier is the fact that authors such as myself had the bulk of their work copyrighted years before Arena took over as this provides additional levels of legal protection.  I can’t believe that Arena would just infringe on those rights in terms of plagiarism, etc.  (TOS cannot legitimize plagiarism.) It does, however, make more “sense” (for want of a better word) in terms of how they market said content.  As for myself, I would not process any legal action against them unless they did attempt to steal it.

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         SerenityHaloposted 20 hours agoin reply to this

         Hopefully, we aren’t in the worst case scenario. It’s possible that what happened is someone new was hired and made some bad decisions about selecting Discover content and copying it in a very questionable manner.
         
         It’s possible if/when we get a hold of Matt or HP staff that this issue can be resolved and they won’t plagiarize or go through loopholes to steal content and cut original writers out. I don’t think any of us are making large enough earnings that it puts HP at risk. If they were trying to reroute content to increase their earnings, I don’t think it would be significant for their pocketbooks.
         
         It’s reasonable that all of this would create alarm. I’m hopeful this was all a misunderstanding… time will tell.

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      TheShadowSpecterposted 19 hours agoin reply to this

      Rupert?  Do you think that this same AI thing is happening with articles on the Medium writing platform?

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   Drew Agravanteposted 32 hours ago

   So that's why my traffic suddenly plunged. I just saw a few of my articles transferred to Discover on google search as part of Hobbylark too. What's happening?

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      theraggededgeposted 31 hours agoin reply to this

      They should be on Discover if you want to retain income and control. However, if you read through this thread you will see what is happening right now. It's not good.

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   Genna Eastposted 30 hours ago

   My attorney files all of my copyrights for me.  HP/Arena/TAG does not have my permission to infringe upon those copyrights in any way.  Any such actions on their part will result in a lawsuit.  Period.

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      Miebakagh57posted 26 hours agoin reply to this

      Glad to noted that.

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    eugbugposted 26 hours ago

    Post this forum post on their socials and embarrass them.
    They're bragging about how wonderful they are at the moment.

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       theraggededgeposted 24 hours agoin reply to this

       This is an excellent idea. Whoever does it must be prepared to be banned though.

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          PaulGoodman67posted 23 hours agoin reply to this

          I don't think getting banned is necessarily a big issue, as I suspect that this site won't exist soon.
          
          It's quite possible that they'll delete the social media posts and block you on social media.
          
          But who knows, they've left this thread going so far.

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       TheShadowSpecterposted 19 hours agoin reply to this

       Sounds like a good idea  I'll do it.

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    Kyler J Falkposted 25 hours ago

    We could create a change.org petition to get some visibility on the issue.
    
    Give it a pithy title, a tastefully sensational description, and share that widely across social media mediums. Promote it here to get the initial rush of signatures, and hope that it catches someone's eye.
    
    TAG's actions are disgusting, and they deserve to be held accountable for systematically dismantling our writing space.

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       Kenna McHughposted 25 hours agoin reply to this

       Kyler, I like that idea. Perhaps, we should start another thread on this.

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       Miebakagh57posted 15 hours agoin reply to this

       I agree. And why should they take us for a ride?

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    theraggededgeposted 24 hours ago

    We need to keep this thread on topic. Ask about other platforms on a different thread, pls.

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    psycheskinnerposted 24 hours ago

    It gave me the push to start permanently deleting my 205 hubs as I transfer them to my own site.  Time to get off the Titanic,

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       PaulGoodman67posted 24 hours agoin reply to this

       Yes. We don't know exactly what's happening but it looks like they're grabbing what they can before HP.com/Discover is closed down.

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       CYong74posted 24 hours agoin reply to this

       The same for me. I sat on it for months and my punishment is to have one of my favorite works openly stolen.

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    psycheskinnerposted 23 hours ago

    I posted a warning on the AbsoluteWrite forum to try to alert some hubbers who haven't been active for a while that their content isn't safe here.

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    Rupert Taylorposted 19 hours ago

    Jason - I have no idea about Medium. I left there a year ago.
    
    So far, I've no evidence that any of my articles (I had hundreds on Owlcation) have been ripped off. And, only one or two instances have been quoted in this thread.
    
    I too would be livid if TAG stole my work, but it hasn't happened (yet?). We should wait until we hear something definitive from TAG, although it's troubling that the serious accusations levelled here have been greeted, so far, by silence. Perhaps, I'm naive to hope that someone chimes in.
    
    So, I counsel that, at this stage, threatening legal action may be premature.

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       SerenityHaloposted 18 hours agoin reply to this

       I agree with you. Thank you for your careful approach.

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          TheShadowSpecterposted 17 hours agoin reply to this

          I've checked a couple of my more heavy-hitting articles to see if any of them been plagiarized to the Owlcation site, and I haven't found any.  Therefore, this could be an isolated incident.  If that's the case, then you and Rupert are probably right.  Until I hear anything further about it, I'm going to lay low.

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             Shesabutterflyposted 16 hours agoin reply to this

             I posted about four. There are a total of 23 new articles on Owlcation dating back to May 29th 2025. The most recent one was posted 15mins ago. 8 under Stem, 12 under Humanities, and 3 within Academia.
             
             More than half of them I can match up with articles on Discover. Either by the end of the url or exact title. A handful of them I remember from when our content was on Owlcation, which is the reason these articles caught my attention in the first place.

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    Eric Cauncaposted 11 hours ago

    I always make an effort to check all article titles on HP before publishing my articles just to avoid choosing titles similar to my co-authors’ work, so I don’t compete with them in Google SEO rankings. However, the HP itself ends up competing against my articles and theirs are all copied.

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    Eric Cauncaposted 9 hours ago

    I'm slowly moving my longer articles to Blogger, mostly the ones with way too many words. For now, I’ve been splitting pieces like my "Top 20 lists" in two, the first 10 move to Blogger, the rest stay on HubPages. Later, I will move them to my own sites.

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    viryaboposted 2 hours ago

    When/if they finally switch off the lights, which can be anytime from now, what happens to all our earnings across accounts?
    
    I'm having a really bad feeling about this!!

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       Shesabutterflyposted 113 minutes agoin reply to this

       "9. Account Closure, Inactivity, and Uncollected Payments
       1. In the event that the Earnings Program is terminated by TAG and/or TAG elects to cease your participation in the Earnings Program, then except in the event of breach by you, TAG will make payment of an Earned Balance in your Earnings Account that is greater than Ten Dollars ($10) within approximately ninety (90) days after the end of the calendar month in which the Earnings Program has stopped running. Any Earned Balance lesser than this payment threshold will be deemed to be forfeited by you (and you hereby waive any claim relating to the forfeiture of such amounts and disclaim any and all interest in such funds)"
       
       Per TAG's TOS addendum. https://thearenagroup.net/author-submis … -addendum/

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