A few weeks ago I commented on a hub but the hubber deleted all mine as well as others comments since they didn't agree with his views of the Bible. I found the hub on 3-16 and the hubber took one of my removed comments and is now using it as a quote without my permission within the hub.
I want nothing to do with this hub and want my quote removed as I find the hub offensive. I flagged the hub on 3-16 and twice more over the weekend but I have yet to hear from HP staff. I even contacted one of the staff directly. No response. The hub is still published. I don't want the hub taken down, just any reference to me removed.
What does it take to get HP staff to respond when you flag a hub?
depends on how many flagged it...it should reach sufficient number to remove that hub...offensive is subjective term....for some saying jesus as son of god or god is offensive , for some saying jesus was normal human being is offensive, for some bible being word of god is offensive , for some bible not being word of god is offensive...
I don't want the hub pulled down. I believe in the First Amendment as much as anyone. However, I don't want my comments deleted only to then be used in the hub itself without my approval. I don't want be associated with the hub in that way.
Feel free to put all your comments back into my hub, so that all these people can really see them.
I originally purged the comment section because there were no relevant comments on the content of my hub. Again, I even added reference numbers to make it easier when commenting on a particular issue.
Quoting the bible is the whole reason for my hub in the first place, Is the bible out of date, and is it merely fiction.
Since you voluntarily submitted the comment, then why are you against it being on the hub?
Weeks ago, I disagreed with the hub content and the hubber kept deleting everyone's comments he didn't like, including mine.
Then I did a search for "longhunter" on Friday to see if anyone had done a hub on what a longhunter was historically. I found where the hubber had changed the name of the hub and is now using one of my comments as a quote within the hub as if I discussed it with him before hand and approved my words being used. Commenting is one thing. Having my comments stripped out of the comments section then used in the hub I don't think should be done without my approval. Believe me, he would not have gotten it, if requested.
I don't want the hub pulled down. I believe in the First Amendment as much as anyone. However, I don't want my comments deleted only to then be used in the hub itself without my approval. I don't want be associated with the hub in that way.
After flagging the hub three times in four days and contacting a member of the staff directly via email, I've gotten no response.
Thus the question - What does it take to get HP staff to respond when you flag a hub?
I assume they do not have to respond to your emails, Longhunter. They certainly feel they don't have to explain why they they ban some members for reasons others get by with. As I was told on other writing sites, there is no guarantee of fairness by some online content sites. Free speech is not required by these businesses. In other words, "Hard Cheese"! LOL!
Hard cheese? Oh, randy you make me laugh! That's a new phrase for me.
Okay. I didn't know it was used in the UK. I do know a lot of UK television. I just haven't seen that yet. It does remind me a bit of phrases that Col. Potter used on M*A*S*H. They were not swear words. They just sounded like they were with the right tone of voice. My favourite is "Horse hockey!"
Randy -I understand what you mean. For me it was a boon to find that thread that lovemechris started because things that were confusing me about my own posts and comments in comments capsules were cleared up. Now, no matter what happens, I will at least know why: and that is essential to my my well being.
My favourite swear word that is not really a swear word unless you use the right voice inflections: Bloody. It isn't a bad word. But when you yell it is.
I found this interesting comment on the word:
"Although widely believed to be a blasphemous reference to the blood of God or Christ, as in the archaic oath 'S-blood or God's blood, the informal use of bloody was probably, in the first place, simply a reference to young bloods (that is 'young aristocrats', or children of 'good blood'), who behaved in a rowdy manner; in the 17th century the phrase bloody drunk meant 'drunk as a blood' or 'drunk as a lord'."
The citation is from "Word History", published in 2004 by Oxford University Press
I love rooting round etymological matters!
Another of Col. Potter's expletives I liked was, "Bull Cookies"!
Trying hard to avoid being banned this week by using mild terms, Flora! It's been a while since I've gone several weeks without being put in the corner!
We do not consider the comment section of a Hub to be neutral territory (as compared to the forums, for instance). The author of the Hub has complete discretion as to what comments are displayed, so long as the content of those comments does not cause the hub to be in violation of our rules. Some authors may "abuse" that privilege, but that's their prerogative.
Flagging a hub will cause it to be reviewed for content violations. It doesn't sound like the Hub in question is violating any of our publishing policies. We don't typically respond to flags by email.
The issue of taking comments out of the comment capsule and placing them in the Hub itself is a legally a more complex situation, and not something that would typically be evaluated based on a flag.
Contacting individual staff members is really not the best way to deal with any issue on HubPages. Individual staff members work various schedules and also take vacations. That fact is called out on the contact page, where it says "For general HubPages questions, please do not contact individual staff members directly". Instead we recommend that you contact our general support account using this form, which routes questions to the person most capable of answering them in a timely way. That said, if you do contact individual staff, generally they will forward your question to the appropriate place when they get to it.
For straightforward questions we typically respond in 24 hours or less (perhaps a bit longer on weekends). However, for more complex question that require investigation, such as yours, it may take longer. We get hundreds of emails a day.
I have a question that I hope will be taken in the spirit in which it is intended.
Since you're the Co-Founder and General Manager of HubPages, if I were to now use your comments on my forum and write a hub about HubPages, something you rightfully feel passionate about, and you felt they were taken out of context or you just out-and-out disagreed with the hub, what actions would be taken?
There are no quotes from you or comments on my hub, Is the Bible out of Date.
Instead of coming to me you go behind my back and stab me.
"There are no quotes from you or comments on my hub, Is the Bible out of Date."
The comments were removed then I found my name, Longhunter, within the hub weeks later. I see that it's now been removed and should remain that way.
"Instead of coming to me you go behind my back and stab me."
Having dealt with you before, I felt it best to go to HP staff and let them handle it lest I be banned. It's simple, IB, for good reason, I don't trust you.
Do they use your actual name? If not, then there is no proof you ever submitted it (if it has been deleted as you say) so technically it's their word against yours that your originally wrote that.
I'll bet deleted comments are still backed up somewhere, especially since the "comment has been deleted by user" corpse seems to remain in the comments section for all time.
It's an obscure reason to flag a hub, though; doesn't really fall under the normal offenses. You may just want to contact the staff via email, but it'll be their judgment call as to whether they want to do anything about it. Worst case scenario, hey, now you know not to comment on that person's hubs.
EDIT: Skipped over the part where you said you'd already emailed them somehow.
Simply put, I'm a Christian. I commented on a hub that was anti-Christian. My comments were then deleted and weeks later I found where one of my comments and my name now IN the hub. Other than my comments in the comments section taken in the right context, I don't want to be associated with this hub.
I will not be commenting on anymore of this person's hubs as I don't believe he is to be trusted.
This situation has also opened my eyes greatly to the mindset of the HP staff and their ways of doing things. IMHO, fairness and rules are not always evenly used within our little community.
Not taking sides but I think if you post something on someone's hub it becomes their property and is not copyright protected.
If you were to comment on one of my hubs you disagreed with and I then rewrote the hub, inserting your comment as your quote WITHOUT your permission, how would you feel? I'm not being combative but I have a feeling you wouldn't like it much. Would you?
What you should do is get the hub in question and review it to your liking as another hub. That way you will have absolute right to say what your comment would have said without anyone deleting it.
Longhunter, if I'm getting the gist of this, the hubber in question took your comments out of context and manipulated them to his liking. Hey, I'd be ticked off too. But it happens all the time. The media is real good at it.
ngureco suggested what may be your best alternative to deal with the situation. That or invite the offender to the octagon.
Longhunter, I have not seen the hub, so I don't know if the writer used your quote in a way that would be inappropriate or offensive to you, but since you willingly wrote the comment about his hub content, it became an actual quote pertaining to the subjet.
The question is whether or not he coud make it sound like you expressed it before the hub was published, but at this point I wonder: is it really so critical?
Also, have you tried contucting the hubber directly asking to take the quote off?
I'm not trying to take sides, just seeing the situation with objective eyes.
About your original question, sorry but I don't know what it takes to take down a hub after it has been flagged.
The hub was about the Bible or, more appropriately against the Bible. I'm a Christian. I wrote a several comments, all of which were deleted. That's the hubber's choice. I don't do it but that's all of our choice.
I came across the hub weeks later and found where one of my comments is now within it as if I gave the quote FOR the hub. Other than making a disagreeing comment, I have no desire to be associated with the hub. I simply want the part associated with me removed by the hubber.
I've also been here long enough to know it's better to let the HP police handle certain things rather than going it alone lest I be suspended or banned myself. Unfortunately, there seems to be no other recourse but to contact the hubber myself, something I know won't go well as my opinion of this person is lower than a snake's belly.
I find it odd that when a disagreement arises, it's all about how we should let the HP police handle it. Unfortunately, when we do, they won't, and we're left to put ourselves in peril of being suspended or banned by doing what they tell us not to do in the first place. The term "Catch-22" comes to mind.
Paul said at the end of his post "However, for more complex question that require investigation, such as yours, it may take longer."
That suggests to me that they are looking into it, and not ignoring you. I would hush a little bit longer to see what they say
I understand what you're saying, Izzy, but the "Catch-22" has been on my mind since being suspended for three days from the forums a while back. I've tried to stay within the rules since, even when it was obvious others were not.
My urgency has been due to the fact I don't want to be associated with the hub as I passionately disagree with it's message and the hubber as I now know he's more than a little underhanded in his ways of doing things and I don't trust him.
I could have handled this myself but it wouldn't have been pretty and given what I've seen, I have no doubt it probably would been me that got banned.
Longhunter, did you use the "Flag" button on the Hub, or did you write the team an email explaining the situation?
As Paul pointed out, "Flagging" is a way to report specific, defined breaches of HubPages Terms of Service. It goes into a queue and is checked by moderators trained to identify such breaches. Your complaint didn't fall into one of the categories they're trained to deal with, so they probably dismissed it.
So if you did flag it, it's not going to produce results and you need to email team@, explaining clearly what your problem is. I had to read your opening post a few times to work it out, so make sure you cut the preamble and just say, "I posted a comment on x's Hub, he deleted it, but he has now used that comment on his own Hub and I object."
@OP - I can't imagine anyone believing that you are associated with that specific Hub in any way. The writer did not distinguish their own comments in such a way as to make it clear which words were their own and which were supposedly yours. I was tempted to comment on one hilarious historical inaccuracy in the Hub, but honestly didn't feel it was worth wasting my time or effort. Better just to let the whole Hub go unnoticed to whatever extent possible.
OP means "original post" or "original poster" - in this case, that's you. When I wrote my post, there was a reason why I chose to address you that way, but I've already forgotten why it was! So sorry! (a Senior Moment, perhaps?)
"I can't imagine anyone believing that you are associated with that specific Hub in any way."
I would hope not but I still don't like my name being associated with such a hub accept as a comment in the context in which I intended. I'm sure you can understand that.
"The writer did not distinguish their own comments in such a way as to make it clear which words were their own and which were supposedly yours."
That's part of the problem. Another reason I don't want my name associated with it. I certainly wouldn't want his words attributed to me even due to his poor form.
"I was tempted to comment on one hilarious historical inaccuracy in the Hub, but honestly didn't feel it was worth wasting my time or effort."
Then you would have loved his original title. It's what caught my eye.
"Better just to let the whole Hub go unnoticed to whatever extent possible."
I could have done that but it was also the principle of it. He didn't ask for my permission to use my words within his hub and, honestly, I felt somewhat defamed. If no one else ever reads it, I still don't want my name associated with such a hub.
Well, yes, I really do understand your feelings in this situation, particularly since you have had other interactions with that Hubber.
Ohhhhboyyyy, my imagination is going to town now. Maybe something about "setting the record straight" or something similar? I want to laugh at all the armchair scholars I've seen here, except for the fact that some people don't know how dreadfully inaccurate they are.
I think Paul Deeds' posts are worth reviewing again. There really is some important blog-conversation going on in the Virtual World about who owns what content on the internet and what constitutes defamation. I hope you have read the articles he linked.
I have no idea which hub is involved, because I do not read religious hubs. I suppose you could write a hub on the same topic giving your view of the subject, insert the very same words of yours in the context that you wish them to appear and mention they appear on another hub out of context and without your permission. A careful choice of keywords and tags will cause your hub to appear as a related hub whenever anyone views the other one, and people may follow-up by reading yours.
WA, I've purposely not said who the hubber is or what the hub's title is because I don't want to give him any undeserved publicity and him see his number go up. With a little research, a person could easily find the one I'm referring to but it's not worth it. It's really a personal thing for me and not wanting to be associated with the hub or the hubber.
I could do as you and others have suggested here by writing my own corresponding hub but, again, I don't want to draw undue attention to the other hubber.
The OP has not told us the hub in question. But on a closer look at his Hubtivity 5 weeks ago may suggest a hub by the title “Is the bible out of date”.
longhunter-I understand focusing on the principle of the thing. I have done so myself. For my own experience here during the whole 9 months I have been here, like Paul says, the amount of time varies. I've had things dealt with within hours of the flag-both sides, by the way-, and I've had things dealt with three weeks later. It is very stressful waiting for an answer. But when it is complex, things cannot be rushed.
Sorry you are are going through this.
I understand that now. In the past, they've always responded within 24 hours. I guess I was expecting the same turn around this time.
Perhaps this forum will also spark some thinking about defamation over all. I have been guilty of crossing a line or two and have either apologized and was suspended once. It's a sense of fairness to me, as well. I would not have done this to this particular hubber and will not sit back and let it happen to me, not without raising some Cain first.
There is some sort of personal vendetta in this forum initiated by the creator I appreciated those comments that looked at the issue objectively, and if anyone did actually view my hub, Is the Bible out of date, then they can make a better judgement.
I have given the hub several polls to form their opinions on the questions asked in the hub. I also included a tutorial on what I expected for the comments on the hub. Basically, that I expected relevant comments on the content of the hub itself. I marked each paragraph with a number to make referencing a comment easier.
I have given my opinions, cited my references, and asked questions, and put in polls for reader participation.
I try very hard not to make my hubs or comments personal.
I will say that there has been a dearth of comments on the hub, and on a few poll takers, so you can see that I am totally surprised here.
There are two sides to every story. And if the OPs quote wasn't used and his name wasn't mentioned I don't see how there can be any issues.
Hopefully everyone is happy now?
IB, all I wanted is for there to be any reference to me, Longhunter, removed from your hub as I do not want to associated with it in any way as I do not agree with it's content.
I see that my name has been removed. I would suggest that, in the future, perhaps you should ask the other hubber BEFORE using their name within your hubs. That won't be a problem for me as I can assure you I won't be back to any of your hubs as I, personally, don't believe you can be trusted.
I'll be honest. I am totally confused.
Longhunter opened this thread 12 hours ago, and your first hub comment, from yourself, was 7 hours ago.
I don't see a quote attributed to him on this hub.
You should sic Homeland Security on this drama queen for confusing you.
The hub in question was published 6 weeks ago. Due to the controversial nature, I would guess (actually it's more than a guess) there were dozens of comments on it.
But then, Jimmy Hoffa disappeared too.
I love this line: "I will say there has been a dearth of comments on the hub . . ."
I will say this is funny as Hades.
Could it be so possible to think the author wanted to include the "awesome!" comment in their hub and give credit, versus leaving it where most may not even read it? Most people do not read all the comments and perhaps this hubber like the comment in any direction and thought it added value to the hub.
Perhaps it would of been best that the author contact that particular hubber and said either "Hey! We may not disagree here, but I think your comment could really value my hub, ya mind?" OR "Hi there, really liked your comment and though it would be great in my hub, and think people should read what YOU have to say, ya mind?"
See either way there is contact, good intentions, and all are merry.
Folks, do you realize the number of hubs that are published a day? No? Then experiment if you will, select all the topics to receive an email notification, I mean everyone of of them and see the plethora of content trying to be pushed through, even in one topic in one day.
There has to be some set rules whether they make sense to the writing community or not. You don't have to write here, no one is forcing you.
You also do not have to visit that hub or hubber, with the amount of writers here, I am sure you can find another group of fellows that will embrace you and send their hub love your way.
"Could it be so possible to think the author wanted to include the "awesome!" comment in their hub and give credit, versus leaving it where most may not even read it?"
Not likely, Jen. The hub was originally titled "The scriptures and other fictions."
I made a comment as did others. Those comments were then deleted. I washed my hands of it and the hubber and moved on.
Weeks later, I do a search for 'longhunter' as I'm considering writing a hub on the men called longhunters in the18th century.
I found where my name, Longhunter, was within this hub that I didn't agree with and the name had been changed.
Now, I ask you the same thing I asked Uninvited Writer above, if you were to comment on one of my hubs you disagreed with and I then rewrote the hub, inserting your comment as your quote WITHOUT your permission, how would you feel? I'm not being combative but I have a feeling you wouldn't like it much. Would you?
"You don't have to write here, no one is forcing you."
Nor do you but, same as I, you want to. In doing so, I suspect you expect the same as I, to be treated fairly. IMO, that's not what happened here. I simply stood up for myself and would do it again.
As you should longhunter and have every right to! If the scenario described in the forum did occur to me, I would just let it roll off, in the end. Not to say I would feel a little confused about an author disbuting my opinioin then later using my words.
However, I would contact them and humbly state, "hey saw my comment in you hub, flattered that you saw it worthy to be included. In all fairness would greatly appreciate you at least link my name"....or something of that nature.
I see the author of the hub has been here, and perhaps they may feel that they should do the right thing as in writing an intro to your comment, explain why they felt it added to the hub and link your profile to it.
Now, whether it was against or for the idea of the article, at least you are outlined there, given credit, and readers can decide for themselves on the issue or article. I would hope that this would be the outcome after this thread.
Authors need to embrace both sides of an article, especially those that are a bit controversial, religion is one of them, they need to accept diverse comments that will come to the topic, embrace it, not fight it.
I would have contacted the hubber personally, Jen, except for the fact he had been, IMHO, difficult at best to communicate with. I felt it best to let HP staff handle it lest I be suspended or banned.
As to him linking to my profile, suits me. If it drives more people to my page, so be it. Free publicity shall we say.
I typically steer clear of religious hubs as I'm more than a little tired of people running down my Christian faith. In the future, I will be doing that even more so.
As stated before, I see that my name has been removed.
I would suggest that, in the future, perhaps you should ask the other hubber BEFORE using their name within your hubs. That won't be a problem for me as I can assure you I won't be back to any of your hubs as I, personally, don't believe you can be trusted.
diverse comments are not the issue here, irrelevant comments are the issue. When comments are made without reference to the specific content of the hub, then they are not relevant.
Did you read the hub?
When someone comments on one of your hubs, you have every right to delete that comments as do I. I don't as I realize not everyone will agree with my hubs and I can handle the spirited give and take that may arise brought on by my own words.
The ISSUE is you used my name within your hub without my permission. It's been removed and I'm happy as I have no desire to be associated with your "work."
Again, I would suggest that, in the future, perhaps you should ask the other hubber BEFORE using their name within your hubs.
I guess this modern day Spanish Inquisition is the Christian thing to do for you. People who haven't even read my hub are condemning me and the hub. You didn't have any relevant comment in my hub, so I purged them all and started fresh. I even numbered the paragraphs so that it would be easy to reference when commenting.
I don't run ads in my hubs, and that means that I don't get money from it. I really don't care about how much traffic they get, but I do care that I have inspired a meaningful dialogue on the issues in them.
There are no references to you in my hubs, and there was never any comments from you that were relevant to the issues in the hub. The bible is not self authenticating period.....
"There are no references to you in my hubs, and there was never any comments from you that were relevant to the issues in the hub."
There were and I see that my name has been removed. That's all I care about as I do not want to be associated with this or any of your other hubs.
I would suggest that, in the future, perhaps you should ask the other hubber BEFORE using their name within your hubs. It's really just that simple, IB.
Have a good day.
Just let it roll. If they feel comfortable with using your comment and pointing you out publicly it is just more publicity for you. I know it appears to be something as big as a mountain; but really it is just a speck of dust. Eventually it will disappear into hubland and won't appear for a long period of time.
Focus on you and what you write and don't worry about someone taking your comment and posting it on their hub. It will truly be okay. I am sure there wasn't any type of malice intent.
For this forum, I felt it necessary and have apologized to Paul Deeds personally.
I jumped the gun in setting up the forum. In the past, all of my questions and concerns had always been handled within 24 hours. When this one was not, I, admittedly, felt it was being ignored on something I felt very strongly about.
Again, I sincerely apologize to Paul Deeds and the HP staff.
I think that this forum has run its course, there are no references in the hub to any comments from any one. The reasons for this forum don't seem Godly, and they don't seem American.
If you or anyone else thinks that the hub should be taken down, then go on it and make your arguments. Be specific as to the reason, using the content of the hub, and not generalizations.
Forums are very difficult for me to trace through the threads and make any kind of sense of what is happening. It is like reading a book without page numbers and the pages were collated into it randomly.
Perhaps, as some have suggested to you in this forum, that you should write your own hub on these issues.
I won't be back to this forum..
I simply wanted my name removed from your hub. That's been done and I'm happy as I don't wish to associated with your "work" and will make it a point to avoid your page all together. This is due to my distrust of you brought on by how you handled yourself in this situation.
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