How was the Garden of Eden paradise, when it had a demon in it?

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   bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years ago

   How was the Garden of Eden paradise, when it had a demon in it?
   
   Can you really consider the Garden a paradise? In the bible, God never warned his children that there was evil in the garden. It is like saying to a child don't touch the stove, and not tell them about the very hot burner. Of course the child will be curious and like most children will find out the hard way. A good parent will also look out for the children while they are young to train them. God didn't do anything of the things.
   
   Would a human parent put a cobra into a children's sand box?
   You would expect a higher intelligence from a God. What does paradise look like from that Goc?
   
   

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   Zelkiiroposted 8 years ago

   God does a LOOOOOT of stupid crap in the Bible, yet somehow believers claim he is all-knowing. This is why the Advice God meme exists:
   
   http://memegenerator.net/Advice-God
   
   First bright idea: "Hey, I know! I'll create light! But I'ma wait three days to actually create a light source..."
   
   Second bright idea: "Hey, I know! I'll put a talking snake into the Garden of Eden alongside my human creations who have no concept of deception! I'm sure this will go swimmingly!"
   
   Third bright idea: "Hey, I know! I'll destroy humanity with a flood so that evil and Original Sin are gone! Oh, and I'll spare a handful of them because I'm such a nice guy. Wait, what do you mean, 'What about the whole Original Sin thing?'"
   
   (Also, the serpent wasn't Satan or a demon. The Bible literally says it's just a snake. Jewish scholars say it's just a snake. The original Hebrew text says it's just a snake. Therefore, it's just a snake.)

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      The bibles are only  stories at best. And a snake doesn't talk, and the tree didn't have any knowledge, as Adam and Eve weren't any smarter after eating the apple. People are basically evil, and nothing in history has shown any change.

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      Kiss andTalesposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Next you are visually thinking a snake was a bad animal at that time. NO , Adam named all the animals so the actual snake was no threat , but satan use the snakes body to throw his voice from.

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   Fox Riversposted 8 years ago

   Your'e missing the point.  The serpent posed no real physical threat. The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil was the equivalent of the 'hot stove' and God did warn his 'children' not to eat from it and fully explained the consequences.   Since God created man and woman with free will it was their choice to listen to Him or not, exactly like our own children.   Begging your pardon, but you seem skeptical about the existence of God. which is rather typical today.  If you don't mind, I'd like your input on 4 thought provoking questions that may challenge your current understanding.
   First though, lets agree on a simple definition of the term 'universe'
   The Columbia Encyclopedia, Sixth Edition:
   universe - totality of matter and energy in existence.
   So, when I use the term "universe" below, I refer to the totality of the universe including its origin, content and, especially, life.
   I'll ask my four questions one at a time and check back for your responses.
   Question 1. Has the universe always existed (is it eternal) or did it have a beginning?

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      The Serpent posed a real threat, the loss of paradise. How can paradise include the serpent?
      As far as science, the BBT is just a theory, and it really doesn't matter how the universe started because we can't change it.

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      Zelkiiroposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      A scientific theory isn't the same as a rhetorical theory. The fact that the Earth orbits the Sun, for example, is also a scientific theory, and so are the existence of microorganisms and plate tectonics.

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      The difference between BBT, and the Earth revolving around the Sun, is that that latter is a proven fact. That replaced the theory posed by the church, debunked by Copernicus, and the church believing in their bibles killed Galileo for not believing

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      Fox Riversposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Lets restart.
      1. What do you mean by 'paradise'?
      2. Do you feel the book of Genesis presents the Garden of Eden as a 'paradise' in the way you define the term? Why/Why not?

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Ezekial 28:13
      What do you think was the Garden of Eden
      A work farm for Adam?

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   Oztinatoposted 8 years ago

   All atheists must by logical necessity study the bible scientifically and anthropologically. If they argue that "God put the snake there" it is non sequitur ie doesn't make logical sense as atheists claim there is no God.
   Apparently they claim they do this to show how dumb the bible is but this does not hold true with the rule of logic.
   Anthropoligically the story of the garden is an allegory. Allegories are easily understood by atheists in the reading of Shakespeare but for some reason biblical allegories aren't accepted by alleged "scientific " atheists. Believe it.....or not.

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      Zelkiiroposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Believers think the stories are literal, so it makes sense to demolish them in the literal sense; there's no fun in simply saying "It's just an allegory," because as true as that is, it doesn't give me the satisfaction of watching them squirm.

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      A fact is a fact, and it is proof, while everything else is just a story. The bible is vague and ambiguous because the people that wrote them were human and had no divine help. Even as an allegory, the snake tainted the illusion of paradise.

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   3. 75

      Oztinatoposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Zel
      by trying to literally demolish them requires a non sequitur stance which demeans the demolisher's logic. Stating God exists to prove He allegedly doesn't is pointless.

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Where and what is this literal demolish??

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      Oztinatoposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Read the comments. There's only a few of them.

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Can't see it!

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      Kiss andTalesposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Brad only after the flood animals would be afraid of human read Ge 9:1-2 A fear of you and a terror of you will continue upon every living creature of the earth and upon every flying creature of the heavens, upon everything ,
      No danger only satan.

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      The God of the Bible has failed at everything he tried to accomplish. The list of failures is long. It starts by discriminating against women, Eve was merely a reluctant choice for the position of Adam's helper, companion is what is mentioned in your

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   Kiss andTalesposted 8 years ago

   Really as you read the story closer it is much more detailed, example if you put medicine in a cabinet away from your children,  and they know where you keep it, and they know they have no right to reach it , open it , take it , after your warning and supervision, 
   That is a protection that you did warn them , you did tell them the danger and they are mature enough to follow your instructions,  if not why tell a baby anything. They were full grown perfect individuals.
   Satan position as a serpent created his own self , by wanting to be worshiped , and created himself into resister of his own God and Father,
   Like in a home say you have three sons , you raise them all , then when full grown,  you realize you have a rebel son in your house, he decides he
   Wants the other two sons to listen and follow his instructions instead of yours, he decided to tell the other two , that you have been lying and listen to him.
   He rebels and divides the home.
   This is the case of this fallen Angel known by satan which means resister.
   The Angels have always had the privilege of traveling back and forth from heaven to planet earth.
   Satan just used his opportunity of this to get worship for himself, 
   Was it just Adam and Eve who are victims here, no!
   Notice what this self made rebel has done.
   Re 12:10I heard a loud voice in heaven say: “Now have come to pass the salvation and the power and the Kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ, because the accuser of our brothers has been hurled down, who accuses them day and night before our God!
   
   
   
   Job 1:9 At that Satan answered Jehovah: “Is it for nothing that Job has feared God?
   Zec 3:1 And he showed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of Jehovah, and Satan was standing at his right hand to resist him.
   You see it is not all about us as humans.
   It is also about as the example the son
   Who rebels , disrespects the perants or parent.
   In this case satan has done this very thing, and has envolved humans also to take a stand against our heavenly father,
   Satan can not give life to any human or animal,
   But it is the Father who gave us this gift, as written he is the God of the living .
   Lu 20:38He is a God, not of the dead, but of the living, for they are all living to him.

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Are you saying that if you told your new to the world child not to touch something that would be good parenting? That it is the same thing as teaching your child?

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      Kiss andTalesposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      No I did not say newborn , because a new born can not comprehend right from wrong
      Adam and Eve new the situation and Eve repeated the warning  to satan . But she listen to the voice of satan , not her Father.

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      They are new borns, and it is the same as don't talk to strangers. There was no training. Leaving your child alone unsupervised with the serpent is not good parenting w/b like leaving them with a pedophile.. Why have the serpent in the first place?

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      Kiss andTalesposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Brad Adam lived to be 930 years old that is how perfect his body was until he betrayed his Father, we though can barely live to be 100 years that how far we have fallen from perfection,  No they were not babies, but they had free will, just as Jesus

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      All kids have free will, but they also deserve parents that will train them in spite of their free will. If someone did what God did, everyone would vote to put them in jail for child negligence. Your story just proved how bad a parent God was.

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      Kiss andTalesposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Brad you are picturing Adam and Eve as children,  remember only Adults can have children , they had children they fully knew right from wrong , Adam was created before  Eve he better then her.

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      bradmasterOCcalposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      They were the children of God, and we don't even know how long they were around before the Apple incident. They certainly lacked the experience of being more than children. There is no mention of what they knew.

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      Kiss andTalesposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Brad the scriptures simply says as Adam speak they are full grown Adults, not as a child , notice he calls Eve a, woman, not child, Also the scriptures does not indicate it was, an apple, 
      Ge 3:7 (Then they sewed fig leaves)
      Apple is not indicated

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