Mr. Trump’s Recklessness Causes Deportation Of American Jobs
Out of control recklessness and insanity: Seriously, what else but an intentional or unintentional economic disaster did you expect from an out of control individual who bankrupted several casinos in New Jersey, can’t seem to put two sentences together without help from a teleprompter, appears to pledge his allegiance to Vladimir Putin while dividing our NATO Allies every chance he gets and wastes most of our precious time either sleeping late, watching television, eating a bucket of greasy KFC, and golfing or crying, whining and complaining on twitter or fox channel?
"To Trump, Harley’s tariff decision is a personal — and unexpected — betrayal"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business … a1108d57faJake, Kinda scary, no? Check out this study regarding authoritarianism and Trump supporters. Does it put a chill in your spine? I have always suspected this from the right wing of things. I don't think that our right leaning posters are willing to go as far, but obviously there are some in the general population that would...
https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/t … ncna877886Credence , First ,one thing you should know by now , because you read something that supports your own tendencies towards overt racism , it doesn't mean that it's all true . And two , NBC ?............really? Enough said.
There is proba ly more truth there than falsehood, just as is with your attacks on the left? You know ultimately that is what you all really want, push come to shove..... your man is the darling of the rightwing hate groups. They are not all s upporting him for nothing. Trump takes on the language and the swagger of a fascist dictator, and that is virtually orgasmic for his true believers.
I don't give a rat's behind about Trump. But fascists? Somehow I don't think you understand the meaning of the word or are just willfully blind to current events. Even older liberals are now bemoaning the fascist behavior of the new left.
“When and if fascism comes to America it will not be labeled ‘made in Germany’; it will not be marked with a swastika; it will not even be called fascism; it will be called, of course, ‘Americanism'” – An uncredited New York Times reporter covering Halford E. Luccock in an article published September 12, 1938.
And it will be an entitled generation always so spoiled that they demand it from government when daddy and mommy close off the purse strings for them at the young age of 40 or so .
? What is that for a random comment. We were talking about the word fascism and not parenthood.
Well I'm not surprised you don't get the origins of the new fascists , they are the new college grads working in kitchens and as store clerks with $150,000 diploma's demanding a guaranteed basic income , free college loans for "furthering" their education , unlimited health care for illicit drug OD's , dropping one job to the next , marching in protests for "good causes ", burning police cruisers ,...............Where are the new fascists coming from , look on any college campus , they await you..........
As LivetoLearn rightly said. Don't use the word fascist lightly. A good article to read, to understand what the the word fascism means is the definition Umberto Eco gives.
1. The cult of tradition. “One has only to look at the syllabus of every fascist movement to find the major traditionalist thinkers. The Nazi gnosis was nourished by traditionalist, syncretistic, occult elements.”
2.The rejection of modernism. “The Enlightenment, the Age of Reason, is seen as the beginning of modern depravity. In this sense Ur-Fascism can be defined as irrationalism.”
3. The cult of action for action’s sake. “Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, any previous reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation.”
4. Disagreement is treason. “The critical spirit makes distinctions, and to distinguish is a sign of modernism. In modern culture the scientific community praises disagreement as a way to improve knowledge.”
5. Fear of difference. “The first appeal of a fascist or prematurely fascist movement is an appeal against the intruders. Thus Ur-Fascism is racist by definition.”
6. Appeal to social frustration. “One of the most typical features of the historical fascism was the appeal to a frustrated middle class, a class suffering from an economic crisis or feelings of political humiliation, and frightened by the pressure of lower social groups.”
7. The obsession with a plot. “The followers must feel besieged. The easiest way to solve the plot is the appeal to xenophobia.”
8. The enemy is both strong and weak. “By a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak.”
9. Pacifism is trafficking with the enemy. “For Ur-Fascism there is no struggle for life but, rather, life is lived for struggle.”
10. Contempt for the weak. “Elitism is a typical aspect of any reactionary ideology.”
11. Everybody is educated to become a hero. “In Ur-Fascist ideology, heroism is the norm. This cult of heroism is strictly linked with the cult of death.”
12. Machismo and weaponry. “Machismo implies both disdain for women and intolerance and condemnation of nonstandard sexual habits, from chastity to homosexuality.”
13. Selective populism. “There is in our future a TV or Internet populism, in which the emotional response of a selected group of citizens can be presented and accepted as the Voice of the People.”
14. Ur-Fascism speaks Newspeak. “All the Nazi or Fascist schoolbooks made use of an impoverished vocabulary, and an elementary syntax, in order to limit the instruments for complex and critical reasoning.”
Sorry for the long post, but I think it's good to reflect on these points and compare them with the society we live in nowadays.No apology necessary as It's a good post , we can't forget who is being accused of fascism and yet who is accusing , Anarchy is the obvious party platform and yet the left isn't simply acting out of confusion , this is all very well planned by those on campuses , in the news rooms , the" Soro's" of this movement have control of both the classrooms and the newsrooms .
This is NOT any act of chance but a well planned agenda.I think Americans already understand who the fascist is: Another sign of Mr. Trump's insane, megalomaniacal dictatorial tendencies is his desperate attempts to isolate the USA from our former allies such as Canada, Mexico, the UK etc by constructing a useless pile of concrete at the borders and executing economy destroying trade wars which are killing his own cultee fans: Laying the groundwork for Vladimir Putin is not out of the question either
'Hail Trump' scream his weirdo white nationalist followers in private: NICE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1o6-bi3jlxk
Harley Davidson is just another American company that is deporting American jobs to avoid the unnecessary inflation of thousands to the cost of one of their motorcycles, a massive tax hike to the American consumer instigated by Mr. Trump's extreme ignorance of economics and shear recklessness: But what else did you expect from an elderly old bizarre looking man who bankrupted casinos in Atlantic City leaving citizens with his bills and 'stiffed' American workers who did jobs for him?: And let's not forget all the law suits filed against him by employees who say they're not getting paid: NICE:
Layoffs begin from Mr. Trump's retarded ignorance but he could care less about you, our workers, your children or anything else because his allegiance is obviously not with the USA and he knows he'll be gone very soon:
"The first layoffs from Trump's tariffs are here"
http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ … story.htmlTo put 30℅ Tariff's on solar panels is an all out war on the natural environment. There is a thriving city of 3 million people in China and their main source of energy is solar.
The World will just have to work around Trump.Wonder where they bought their battery. And where they get all the wood to cook on.
live in the largest eco village in Canada. No water, no hydro, we made everything ourselves. We had a community water well.
I had a rocket stove and heater with free paper logs, with a back up butane. A $3500 solar system supplied all power including workshop.
Only one legal eco village in Canada did not have half the self substainable abilities as we did. That is why we were shut down, not enough on the corporate grid.
Had enough of Canada and US synthetic corruption. The Colombians natives will benefit this both healthy system investment as a personally and business investment.
My hero is a 107 year old man. Who farms and rides a bike every day. Then has sex occasionally. Not some injured millionaire boxer or football player, to win a game of chess.
The tit-for-tat strategy is beneficial to use on social and psychologists to reduce conflict and stress. A chess game for individuals like in sports or politics who have been overly competitive for a period of time no longer trust one another. Creating more losers in life than winners.
The most effective game in the world strategy is tit for tat. Not the game of Political Authorities chess.Is that the reason you were given when they shut you down? That you didn't buy enough electricity from the grid to keep the power company happy?
One house hooked to the grid hydro. They did not offer to pay solar power to return to the grid.
I want nothing to do with those con-men anyways.
Looks like you have some experiences and perspectives worth writing about, I for one would be interested in reading more.I'm a good story tellers, just not a good writer. When I get more settled will work on a film documentary assisted by writers.
Could you be more precise ahorseback. Its a incredibly vage accusasion towards student. Supporting anti-intelectualism tendencies and conspiracy theories.
Students have always been a danger for the establishment, the powers that be. Trump is not the first who wants to descredit students. Have you been on university, if so then you know that students want to find out for themselves how the world works. They start to think for themselves...dangerous....
You should put some more trust in students, let them rebbel, thats good. Later on in live they can always go back and be another brick in the wall if they want too.
So you care about "left-leaners" committing violence, but you don't care about Nazis and White Supremacists whose ideologies literally advocate genocide.. Gotcha.
Also, between 2008 and 2017 domestic extremists were responsible for 387 murders. 71% were committed by right-wing extremists (more than Islamic extremists at 26%). 3% were committed by left-wing extremists(1).
So who's in denial?
(1) https://www.adl.org/media/10827/download
Show me one Fascist , I will show you ten non-funny vulgar ex-comedians who hate Trump AND the right more than the thought of catching the plague .
Let's see. Left leaners have publicly called for violence against Trump workers. Left leaners have posted threats on Twitter against Trump's son and granddaughter. Other threats have been made against the children of Trump workers. A guy has been arrested in Florida for threatening to kidnap and kill the children of a handicapped veteran who is a Republican congressman.
You tell me who's in denial. I say it's you.
Edit. Forgot about the shooting at the ball field. And you call Trump scary. Give me a break.What else could you possibly expect when the Russian Sympathizer moron in chief constantly lies, sabotages our healthcare system, gives trillions to Wall Street elitists, abuses children by the thousands, endorses a loser accused of pedophilia for U.S, Senate, negotiates illegal deals with China, supports a Chinese company which commits espionage against the USA, constantly degrades our CIA and FBI, degrades our POWs, attacks Gold Star families and attacks John McCain an American hero while licking the boots of Kim Jung Un and now, instigates an unwinnable trade war which will destroy his own voters, destroy buying power, destroy the already crashing stock market and destroy American jobs:
What kind of prize would you like to award this dangerous idiot for all that?What else can I expect??
See Jake, this is exactly why I said you scare me. I don't expect threats of violence against children and shots fired at a baseball game just because you don't like a president. If you can't see what is wrong with that you should seek help before you do something to get yourself incarcerated.Valid reasons to hate Mr. Trump: He's an unstable, mentally retarded dangerous 3rd rate dictator who is trying desperately to appease Vladimir Putin by weakening NATO, turn Mexico and Canada our long time allies into enemies, sabotage our healthcare system, undermine our once vibrant economy and trash our constitution:
There is something very askew with an individual who doesn't hate Mr. Trump:
"The Trump trade war has been blamed for all of the events above. What’s more, a wide range of analysts and studies shows that the Trump tariffs are likely to kill the jobs of many more American workers, either because protectionist trade policies push companies to shift jobs overseas or because companies are forced to eliminate jobs entirely after finding they can no longer compete in the global marketplace."
http://time.com/money/5322347/trump-tariffs-jobs/Your support and claim that violence and pedophilia against children is acceptable is demented. Period. Anything else you have to say will always be overshadowed by that sick and twisted admission. May God have mercy on your soul.
I never said that but you know who did: God will never have mercy on Donny Boy's dark empty hole where a soul belongs, he's going straight to hell and he knows it, why do you think he's trying to take as many many gullible Earthlings as possibly with him? Just like fellow weirdos Marshall Applewhite and Jim Jones:
Just a reminder of who the abominable national disgrace truly is:
"DONALD TRUMP STAKED HIS REPUTATION ON ACCUSED CHILD MOLESTER ROY MOORE—AND LOST"
http://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-ro … ama-746396
BTW: It looks like Bozo Trump's crashing stock market is on the verge of another catastrophe if it doesn't hold and immediately rebound dramatically from 24,000: Perhaps instigating an insane trade war with our former allies was yet destructive another directive from Vladimir Putin?
If it looks, acts and quacks like a traitor:Yes you did ask me what I expected, as if that behavior is justified. Sorry. Pedophilia may be your idea of political disagreement. You stand with perverts, alone.
Your GOD hypocrisy is showing your true colors Jake , Yet I love the act , you know why ? Trump Obstruction like you display here day after day after day , Is solidly contributing to the successful re-election of Trump Fact! Hispanic polls support is up 10 % , women polls up , Trumps popularity is rising like the morning sun .
Keep up the awesome work !
Anybody here ever meet that one person at the party that never listens BUT constantly spews forth with a memorized monolog that doesn't allow another voice to speak , when you sit in a group and suffer the one grating voice that rolls on and on and on but doesn't allow another word from you or anyone else to enter into the conversation , you can predict every word they speak , you make eye contact with the other attendees and they are all speaking the reflecting lines with their eye's each word , each phony laugh ? And the next dinner you attend , There is that same person and you know that you're going to endure one more endless boring monolog lasting for hours . " Groundhog day "
Welcome to the political forums .Sadly, only the mature and decent people are making those sideways looks. It's already been proven here that if you hate Trump, no matter the violence of your views, no matter how depraved, there are those who quickly jump to your defense....but hide under rocks when you've crossed the line of decency. So, I assume, that they can pretend they didn't hear your filthy words.
Every single word you typed is ludicrous and so far beyond reality. You should be hospitalized for your own good. Or the meds just aren't working. I'm sure there is a crisis hotline you could call. It is okay to need help. I've certainly been there.
Wesman, still no answers as to why Mr. Trump's allegiance is to Vladimir Putin and not the USA? Still no answers as to why he could care less about you or your family? Still no answers as to why he started an insane trade war with our allies which is essentially a massive tax increase on Americans and is destroying his own fans?
Still just more personal attacks? I guess the truth hurts right?Your questions are delusional. Were I to play along I'd be validating your insanity for you. I'm not devious enough or mean enough to do that. Almost nothing you say or allege has any basis in reality. I really do think you need help. I'm just not the person qualified to help such conditions, nor am I licensed to prescribe meds.
You don't have any proof that Trump has some sort of nefarious ~allegiance~ to Vlad Putin. That's an unsubstantiated fantasy of the leftist press. But to play along with you, I HOPE that Trump most certainly does have an allegiance and friendship with the great Vlad Putin.
Peace between the US and Russia was something everyone craved just a few decades ago. Now we seem to have some sort of peace going, and these morons who run the leftist press are trying to make it sound like a bad thing.
Which is stupid. Pathetically stupid. And it is Russophobic. You people act like Russians are evil. That's xenophobic of you.
Trump doesn't care about me and my family? Well, I wouldn't expect Donald J. Trump, the 45th President of the United States of America to have ever heard of Wesman Todd Shaw, or the Shaw family of Kaufman, Texas.
I don't know, but I've never considered myself to be so important that the President is supposed to have heard of me, and know of me enough to care about me personally, and my family. I'm not suffering delusions of grandeur at this time.
Maybe I'll try that later, but it doesn't seem to work well for people when they do it.I detected one tiny morsel of truth in your entire angry, attack filled narrative: Yes Wesman, you are correct, I'll bet Mr. Trump has no clue who Wesman Todd Shaw is or the Shaw family of Kaufman Texas, nor does he care one iota:
A+ comment (where's the thumbs up when you need it?)
Hey thanks. I really do understand or empathize with this guy's off kilter screeching. I have very honestly been in that exact sort of shape before. I eventually cracked up and had to sit in a psych ward for a bit, take some meds for some years, and realize that worrying about things beyond my control all day leads to bad things.
Worrying about things you can't control. Hating people you have never met. Believing something you hear without seeing the proof (or having evidence). Yup, those things don't lead to a stable or happy life.
Waking up and finding out your job was just exported to a foreign country may lead to an unstable, unhappy life as well: But Mr. Trump really could care less about anyone's life as he betrays the USA with his insane, massive tax increase tariffs which is leaving companies such as Harley Davidson no choice but to set up shop over seas leaving Americans with less employment options:
"Harley-Davidson says it is moving some production out of U.S. to avoid EU tariffs"
http://www.latimes.com/business/autos/l … story.html
President Trump has created 3.4 million jobs in his short time in office. Not sure the title is factual? GDP 4.1... Our economy is thriving. Time will tell how Trump does with trade agreements.
Bozo Trump created millions of jobs as the beneficiary of President Obama's miraculous robust economic turn around which has lasted years, but unfortunately they will all be lost in the abyss due to Tubby Trump's total ineptitude and insane trade wars with our friends:
His public loyalty to Vladimir Putin must be factored into his crazy destruction of our once great economy as well:
With all the damning criminal evidence seemingly surfacing almost hourly, Traitor Trump will should be sucking iron bars in prison very soon or worse and that alone might save this devastating dark downward spiral we are now experiencing:
"Trump’s Trade Policies Threaten Millions of Jobs, U.S. Chamber of Commerce Says"
https://www.wsj.com/articles/trumps-tra … 1527792627Trumps economic policy created 219,000 jobs last month ................and did yours ?
Jobs have been created due to cutting Obama's job killing regulations, nd tax cuts. America has becomea more furtile place to do business. Plus, big busness love having a progressive president that is worried about America.
Eccononmic stats just don't support your threroy. In regards to Trump's trade policys. To soon to judge.
And Jake in regards to Wall Street. Wall street is the indicater of our ecconomy. If wall street shows less money being invested we can all start worrying. Especailly those that want socialium. jake, we have to have fat cats to support flowery programs. However, fat cats did not get fat supporting flowery progrmams. They got fat on keeping their cash safe. It times are bad here, they will take their cash elsewhere. You know like they did the last 20 some years. The fat cats have reurned t our shores, this should mke you happy Jake....All those 'regulations' you and that orange clown in the white house keep trumpeting at one time prior to Vladimir Putin embedding his little stooge, prevented mining companies from poisoning our waterways with mercury and other toxic 'DUMPS" into our critically important streams and rivers, today under Bozo Trump those same mining companies are free to poison our water, the same with our environment all in the name of trying to save a few OBSOLETE jobs:
Bozo Trump also made extreme animal cruelty in Alaska possible bu unilaterally rescinding animal protection laws: I'll bet animal lovers must really adore Donald now:
So, to say Bozo Trump came up with this brilliant plan to save jobs is shear nonsense, he just doesn't care so he simply unilaterally rescinded protections which were established to save our water, our air we need to breathe and of course our planet: he's a mentally ill megalomaniac idiot who could care less about anything or anyone:
As for this big GDP farse of 4%, it's a projected number not realized yet if it ever comes to fruition with Bozo's insane trade wars beginning to take effect, another of his catastrophes which is destroying a once great economy created by the genius of President Obama and even if 4% is achieved soon, it does absolutely nothing for the average working class or senior citizen American unless of course increasing the wealth of Wall Street counts as a direct benefit to the little guy which would be considered a ridiculous assessment:
Vladimir Putin really got his monies worth with Poodle Trump and then some, he's the only corrupt evil dictator on this planet that I know of who is celebrating:
BTW: President Obama achieved in excess of 4% GDP several times during his magnificent tenure:
"Trump trade policies threaten 2.6 million US jobs, Chamber of Commerce says"
https://money.cnn.com/2018/05/31/news/c … index.htmlEmployment — Total nonfarm employment grew by more than 3.2 million during the president’s first 17 months in office, according to the most recent figures available from the. Resoruce Bureau of Labor Statistics.
" President Obama achieved in excess of 4% GDP several times during his magnificent tenure:" Twice in 8 years ...
Trump's trade policies are being played out. No reason to think they will fail. In fact, his accomplishments speak louder than speculation.President Obama also achieved over 5% GDP so 4% if it happens and that's a big if considering Vladimir Putin is using his poodle Donald to institute job killing tariffs to undermine our economy, is nothing unusual despite the orange clown's claims to the contrary:
In reality, Bozo Trump has already turned this economy into a disaster which is exactly what Russia has been aiming for and everyone knows it:
Even the Koch Brothers are gunning for him:
"Billionaire Koch brothers take on Trump over tariffs"
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-44366737Yes in 2014 Obama did reach a GDP of 5.1% for the third quarter, which by the fourth quarter plummeted to 2%. Obama had a very flat economy poor jobs reports, a very bad unemployment record. The only thing his numbers were high in the Obama years was the welfare rolls and food stamps.
https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growthIn Reality, President Obama miraculously resuscitated the catastrophic republican / George W Bush economy when Bush did the same thing Bozo Trump did, gave all of our wealth to greedy, anti-American elite Wall Streeters which triggered the depression:
After President Obama miraculously fixed what the Russian controlled republicans did, he presided over a roaring economy which produced 80 straight months of job growth with varying degrees of success with GDP, and GDP numbers mean absolutely nothing to the average worker anyway, it just increases or decreases the wealth of the elites:Jake The (GDP) Gross domestic product is the indicator that products are being produced, and money is being spent. More jobs, more people working, more people spending... " U.S. households added $1 trillion to their wealth in the first three months of this year, boosted by rising stock prices and home values, the Federal Reserve said on Thursday." Reuters this is a good article that gives a non-bias description of the present ecconomy.-
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- … SKCN1J3269
Live to Learn & shorseback: Instead of manufacturing off topic fairy tales about me to desperately try to divert attention away from the subject of this discussion which is nothing less than devastating for American workers, especially 'Trump Cultees' and our economy, perhaps if you read more about the insane trade war tariffs Mr. Trump is instigating, you'd understand Harley Davidson is escaping Trump's madness by moving production to a foreign land so buyers of new Harley's here and elsewhere will not get gouged by thousands which would have been added to the price tag of each motorcycle by Mr. Trump's nose bleed higher taxes:
Mr. Trump's insane roll out of billions in higher taxes are forcing many other American companies to move production OUT of the USA as well which will devastate American jobs: But don't worry, at this point in time, Donald as impotent and incoherent as he is, at least is aware of the fact that he can do what he pleases to his brainwashed sheep with impunity, even drive them into poverty and take their guns:
"Why Harley-Davidson Is Moving Production Overseas"
"The quintessential American brand, Harley-Davidson, is shifting some production overseas to avoid EU regulatory tariffs — but not without some commentary from the President Donald Trump."
http://fortune.com/2018/06/26/harley-da … -overseas/Credence 2: "Trump takes on the language and the swagger of a fascist dictator, and that is virtually orgasmic for his true believers."
LOL, The phrasing is funny, but the reality is not. This nails it.
As part of political letter writing campaigns, I listened in on calls to constituents for a couple of years in the latter half of the Obama Administration The calls were from lobbying efforts, but this was never revealed. At least 90% of the campaigns were right-wing efforts. Most were almost entirely misleading, and I heard this directly from the horses mouth at times.
So many, mainly "older" folks, and some younger were saying "Obama wants to be a dictator" and getting really worked up about it, even laughing when speaking of it and then stating something about revolting against the federal government, taking it to the streets, etc.
Almost inevitably, something akin to this would follow: "We need someone strong in there to get things done, fix things and not be pushed around."
It was clear they wanted a dictator, just not a black one.
Another odd thing, with defense campaigns, a common caller script included how Obama was so weak on Russia. Putin had new ultrasonic low level missiles that could not be detected by radar, and Obama just didn't seem to care. Chuck Hagel was the devil because he once said something about teaming with Russia in efforts to end the Iranian nuclear program...etc, etc.
People were calling Obama a trader, racial names, etc. because he clearly just wanted Ruskies to invade. Two years later, they voted for the guy who praises Putin and Russia every chance he gets.
Swaying in the wind...things that may go hmmm.Credence 2: "Trump takes on the language and the swagger of a fascist dictator, and that is virtually orgasmic for his true believers."
LOL, The phrasing is funny, but the reality is not. This nails it.
------------------
Thanks, Don
The hypocritical distinctions between how the Right explains international affairs during the Obama administration to that of Donald Trump is astounding. How long did I have to listen to the drivel from this group accusing Obama of wanting to preside for a third term? This was just a diversionary tactic from people who are fundamentally without character. I am more fearful that the real threat of that is found in this current administration
------------------
Almost inevitably, something akin to this would follow: "We need someone strong in there to get things done, fix things and not be pushed around."
In the American tradition, there are those that are so weak as to willingly give up the American democratic model. Is fascism and authoritarianism such an attractive Alternative for them? Did they ever learn anything in civics class?
---------------------
It was clear they wanted a dictator, just not a black one.
The rightwinger is fundamentally weak and fearful, impatient with popular sovereignty and democracy, this makes them both pathetic and dangerous, simultaneously.
The only world leaders that Trump openingly confesses to admire are 3 of the worst dictators and tyrants of modern times, the President of the Philippines, Putin and Kim jung UN of NK. He has dismissed other democratic societies in its stead and this is a first from any previous "Leader of the Free World".
Credence 2 "How long did I have to listen to the drivel from this group accusing Obama of wanting to preside for a third term? This was just a diversionary tactic from people who are fundamentally without character. I am more fearful that the real threat of that is found in this current administration."
Yeah, diversionary tactics started by those with the biggest money interests, More fear means more blind support and more blind hate. It was easy to play on fears with a President named Barack Obama. But, then emphasize how he is weak and we are strong. The threat is indeed real, at least to an extent, with this administration. Trump saves them from the "threat" Obama presented by being what they supposedly feared, but speaking and being more like them instead. So, if he says Russia is now our friend, then Russia is now our friend. If he says jump, they ask how high.
It's so clear that the silver-spooned, failed real estate tycoon, who must turn to foreign loan sharks for funds is on the side of real Americans. Whatever.Yes indeed, Don, "it is the old monied interests manipulating the masses trick". Trump playing on fears of upcoming demographic changes among those weak minded fools so easily susceptible to Jedi Mind Tricks. We all know that the "Farce" has a profound affect on the weak minded. Well, they trade in this uncertainty for the future in exchange for being screwed today, in the here and now.
The forces of reaction and resentment will reach a point when Democracy itself will become an inconvenience, it is then when the Rightwinger will have a purpose for all armament that he never ceases to gather. Trump has sent all the messages, admiration for the temerity of tyrants, and the fealty of their subjects. Trump likes the idea of "president for life" and was actually dumb enough to reveal that publically, since FDR served more than 2 terms, why can't he?
Absolutely totally brain dead to the Constitution and its provisions, not taking a proactive role in its understanding, let alone its preservation.
Let's face it, there is trouble in River City, these days......
For Sure Credence2...trouble has been brewing for years, but the snake oil -salesman-in-chief is ensuring big trouble. The possibilities are endless with his combination of willful disregard of law and plain ignorance. Will he order the military to do something so unconstitutional and or inhumane that some generals revolt? Or, I can certainly see your Democracy as an inconvenience scenario. When people are convinced that God is behind someone they support that someone at all costs, democracy be damned.
As far as taking up arms, as I stated before, I heard so many right-wingers bring this up in conversations ranging from healthcare to gambling laws. I think It would take the backing of some faction of the military to support any such armed defense of authoritarianism, but that's definitely not an impossibility.
The "president for life" comment is just crazy and reflects upon the easily manipulated you brought up. But, Obama, the Constitutional scholar, was the one out to tear up the document that holds our union together. Sometimes I just can't find the words for the lunacy.
BTW, I had to look up the trouble in River City reference. Indeed, Trump is no savior anymore than Harold is a musician.You know, he the one that said that he "loved the uneducated", can we hazard a guess as to why it is desirable that ignorance be wrapped around oneself like a blanket?
I don't believe that even he is stupid enough to issue the military clearly unlawful orders, to consolidate his power.
Who would trade something of immense value in exchange for trinkets, feel good fantasies and a cornucopia of assorted BS?
But it has been done successfully since the days of the pharaohs. You get people to blame their neighbors and immigrants for their personal economic misfortunes. This diverts from the structural changes in the economy; foreign work force that work for far less than their American counterpart and technological innovation that are making human beings obsolete in so many tasks.
The explanation for this phenomena lie at the very feet of the Capitalists, but they don't want to attract too much attention, so they are going redirect your attention elsewhere, of course.
General Motors, once known for providing generations financial security and paths to the middle class, compensating labor at well paid union scales, is now a thing of the past. Robots today are well capable of working the assembly line at a fraction of the cost.
Teump promises his subjects a return to the past when, like FRED Flintstone, everybody had their respective, good paying rock quarry jobs. Trump talks of empty promises, like Benito Mussolini and his fascist hoards promising the gullible Italians a revival of the greatness that was once Ancient Rome. The clock cannot be turned back without breaking it.
The reality is a global economy, one that Trump has certainly used to butter his bread.
But Trump knows all this already, he just is banking on the wish that enough people are "uneducated enough" to ignore what is clearly around them and take him at this word. How much of the labor in his empire is outsourced, where he can pay pennies on the dollar?
There was a billboard sign in Virginia that warned progressives of 2nd Amendment reprisals if Trump is impeached, but nothing there even alluded to the remote possibility that Trump can be legally removed through due process of law for high crimes and misdemeanors. It was as if their KING was sacrosanct and could not be guilty of any crime outside of annoying liberals. It was just a threat, period.
Quote, from actor Robert Preston's character in the musical "The Music Man""General Motors, once known for providing generations financial security and paths to the middle class, compensating labor at well paid union scales, is now a thing of the past."
You're right. It's what happens when unions control a company without any concern over the bottom line. Eventually that bottom line catches up to greed and the outlandish wages cease, whether through failure of the company or a simple reduction.
Union greed caused the decay and destruction of Detroit far more than any company policies.I think that could be similarly or comparatively equated to what we have seen going on in American politics, and the combined corruption in D.C. with the lunacy of the 'Progressive' movements.
What used to be considered felony offenses, unspeakable behavior, or even treasonous activity is now daily occurrence with our politicians, and those who roam the halls of D.C. in prestigious positions.
And I am not inferring any one party, McCain is as corrupt as Pelosi, both have earned hundreds of millions over the course of their decades of "service" in Congress. Both have put their pocketbooks ahead of American interests time and again. And ANY politician that has spent decades in D.C. is guilty of the same thing. These politicians that have been there for 30, 40, 50 years are the cause of more problems than anything else in this country.
They don't have 'any concern over the bottom line'. Because when the bill comes due, they won't be the ones paying it, we will.It worked fine from the thirties through the early 1980's, Wilderness. It was just when the foreign competition began building better cars for less, did this all began to unravel. Before competition brought forth a new reality, wages just rose and was paid for by higher prices to the consumer.
Hi Cred. I stumbled across a relevant tidbit in another quest.
Relevant to this GM topic, part of their, (non-Detroit car makers), "less" was their health insurance costs per car. The article said GM's health insurance benefit cost were $1500 per car, Toyota's was $201 per car for cars they made in the U.S., and $97 per car for cars made in Japan.
Did it really work "fine"? The premise and SOP of the union was to squeeze the company for all it could get - it was necessary that the union members earned more than non-union.
The result was companies that failed and went under because of high labor costs (Detroit car makers were not the only ones unionized). Another result was that non-union members fell behind as prices rose in response to union demands but their wages did not.
Unions did a tremendous job of increasing workplace conditions and wages, but there was also a very high price to be paid, and it didn't come from union workers. It came from business owners and from people outside the unions.And what was management or the companies job? Was it not pay as little to the workers and provide as few benefits as possible to increase their bottom line? So, both sides had a purpose, when things got out of balance there is the problem. But, without an advocate, labor becomes nothing less than slavery.
Wesman Todd Shaw...."Peace between the US and Russia was something everyone craved just a few decades ago. Now we seem to have some sort of peace going, and these morons who run the leftist press are trying to make it sound like a bad thing. Which is stupid. Pathetically stupid. And it is Russophobic. You people act like Russians are evil. That's xenophobic of you"
Trump in 2014: "'Russia's our biggest problem, and Russia is, you know, really something,'
I also know first-hand the the right wing used the "dangers" of Russia as a platform to pass many bills. This wasn't started by the left.Sorry hard sun, but you don't strive for peace with Russia by appeasing Vladimir Putin which is exactly what traitor Trump is doing, right after they manipulated our presidential election system to embed their stooge Donny Boy: They are still orchestrating espionage on the USA and our election process as we speak while Donny Boy wanders around the oval office in an angry panic rage screaming at the television and his twitter page:
The chaos and danger Vladimir's stooge in the white house is intentional causing is unprecedented and has reduced the USA to a declining 3rd world dictatorship where you and your family mean absolutely nothing in the grand scheme:
You may agree with Mr. Trump's obsessions with undermining our healthcare system, destroying our invaluable institutions, degrading our FBI, CIA and law enforcement and severely weakening NATO all of which are priorities on Vladimir Putin's agenda, but the overwhelming majority of Americans are obstructing this dangerous maniac and will soon see this mentally unstable Russian poodle locked up, just like so many of his campaign accomplices:
Another agenda item on Vladimir Putin's list is the degradation of the economy of the USA which Mr. Trump's insane trade wars with our allies has already resulted in dire consequences for American workers: Who do you believe instructed Bozo Trump to destroy our economy? I'm certain it wasn't Nancy Pelosi, or President Obama, sounds more like a directive from the Kremlin to me:Peace between Russia and the US? There is peace, but there is something else. Vengeance. Russia hasn't forgotten the humiliation of being degraded as a third party. It want's to be a world player.
Putin and Trump understand each other as they are both dominant capitalist alpha males. Problem is, Trump is a terrible deal maker, he looses the trade and power struggle on every front.
Putin uses Trump to break the west. The west is crumbling. For the first time since WW2 the USA is not a friend of Europe anymore. Merkel said it right when she said that we (Europe) can not count on the US anymore and have to go our own way.
With Brexit (a gift for Putin) the UK too can't be seen as a economic and military partner anymore for Europe.
Putin is breaking the west apart with the help of a US president who is transforming the US into a nation that is leaving the world stage.
China is ready to step into the vacuum that Trump is creating.
A trade war with China...it will hurt the US dearly. China too, of course. But China can endure and wait and doesn't need votes. Can the US hold a trade war for a decade or more? Expensive phones, computer prices going up. I wonder. How many farmers have to get broke before this madness stops.Where do these ideas come from?
This is stuff from alternate reality and comic book writers.
I have written plenty of articles on Russia, China, etc. many of which can be found here at HubPages, so I am not going to go into a belabored response.
But let me point out some facts.
Iraq - Libya - Syria
All three former U.S.S.R. allies that then became Russian allies.
We (America, the West, however you want to label it) destroyed all 3 nations.
Ukraine - Georgia - Latvia, etc.
All former Soviet bloc nations that 'We' have since interfered with internally and externally as much as, if not more than Russia itself.
The only thing Russia is trying to do is survive, and thrive, like any other nation.
Russia has partnered with China in BRICS, in a Russia-China economic alliance, which makes complete sense for both nations. Both fear the economic and military might of America. China can manufacture anything, and Russia is sitting on the world's largest reserves of natural gas and oil.
China is a legitimate economic threat because of their manufacturing ability, Russia is a potential economic heavyweight because it is sitting on a wealth of oil reserves greater than Saudi Arabia or any Nation.
Neither of those nations want a war with America, they want what Americans want, to be able to thrive, and give their kids a better future than they had... to be free from oppression of foreign government intervention or economic ruination.Ken, you are saying exactly the same thing as I do, only with other words.
Fact is that the US started a trade war, something that will hit home. China can loose half a million people by poverty, the US can't as in the US you have public opinion and a vote system. China can sit out a trade war for a long time and suffer, the US does not have this "luxury." Therefore it was a bad move.
An interesting read I found was "Why the west rules...for now" by Ian Morris. It shows the battle between the west and east in a historic context. A perspective where China will dominate at the end of this century. Trump is only accelerating the process that would happen anyway, whatever president.You are incorrect, China has no desire to entertain a trade war, they can't afford a trade war, their economy is on the brink of collapse.... ours is not, not matter what rhetoric you may hear.
China cannot afford to have America cut it off... 500 BILLION dollars a year go to China from America (that is our trade deficit), they are not in a position at this time to deal with such a loss in revenues.
Its possible they are willing to let half a million of their citizens die of starvation, but that is irrelevant to the other issues. They are but a few years away from being able to shrug off America cutting it off, but that is their problem, they are still a few years away... and right now they have to give in, or their entire economy may collapse if they do not.On paper it would seem that with a trade war the US would be stronger. But at what costs? A financial crisis? This will cost the lower, working and middle class dearly. A crisis is great for those who have money to spent, but not for the average Joe.
A financial crisis will benefit the president personally and the 1%, but not the Americans as a whole..
As in the end products like mobile phones, Nike sneakers and clothing needs to be manufactured somewhere. And I doubt it if Americans will work for the same costs as the Chinese. So those products become more expensive.
Most of the articles I read are about financial numbers but in the end we talk about millions of lives that will be effected by an unnecessary trade .war.But will they become more expensive? When all the costs, including unemployment, welfare, free Obamacare, bankruptcies, crime from poverty, etc. from the lack of jobs in the US, are those things really cheaper? And we haven't touched on the psychology of being dependent on govt. charity rather than being able to support ones self yet.
That's why Bozo Trump's and republican's criminal corporate welfare tax cut scam must be repealed ASAP: It's a crime to give billionaires who are already hoarding trillions of our money in foreign lands even more of our money while working class Americans could have been using those funds for life's necessities like healthcare, unemployment for when the CEO terminates their employment etc:
It is way beyond me, why so many here support giving billionaire and trillionaire more breaks for highest profits making wail giving the rest of us less and less.
Call it the ultimate crime because poverty kills more than anything.That is because many of us don't listen to the media, we don't get our information from listening to CNN or whatever.
We research what the new tax law actually is, what benefits it gives.
Same with the tariff/trade war going on with China, do you know how many people on here ranting against it actually know what is going on with China's economy, it's banks, it's other international efforts?... None of them.
If they understood China's position, if they understood what a lack of tariffs on China's products had cost this nation, they would be backing Trump's moves.
But most people are ignorant, the listen to CNN or NPR rant and rave and tell them the world is coming to an end, and they are dupes enough to believe it.
You want to find out what is going on with China, don't listen to the media, do your own research, for anything else as well. Even I have written articles about this issue that are more informative than what CNN puts out."...if they understood what a lack of tariffs on China's products had cost this nation..."
At a minimum it has cost the deportation of millions of jobs, billions in unemployment and far more billions in welfare costs for those that had no jobs. On the other end (China) it resulted in the creation of an industrial nation rivaling our own.
Between the two, it isn't hard to see who benefited and who paid. When the actual, total, cost of those cheap (and cheaply made) products is considered even our consumers buying them didn't benefit that much. Not nearly as much as they think they did.
Misuse of the word 'criminal.' I suspect you can't name a single law Trump has broken. You don't care. You say 'criminal' with no regard to the meaning of the word. It's like talking to someone who is hallucinating. Maybe when you say 'banana,' what you really mean is pizza. Who can tell for sure what someone who refuses to use words correctly ever means?
More personal attacks? I understand the truth frightens you Wesman but remaining in denial when the mountain of evidence against Mr. Trump is nothing less than breathtaking does you nor your family any good because he could care less what happens to you, your children or significant other:
I know you'll simply pretend this evidence doesn't exist, but here's one major law called our constitution that Bozo Trump violates every single day: If we still have laws, he'll be going to prison or worse very soon for this alone, not to mention his treachery, constant undermining of our healthcare system and innumerable other serious, dreadfully inhumane crimes:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68gbVran0acPointing out your misuse of the English language is not a personal attack. Remember when you said Trump was an 'imposter?' LOL.
I'd suggest that you go back and read your own comment: I guess accusing an individual of hallucinating is not a personal attack in your world which is understandable coming from someone who tries to defend the indefensible almost every day when Mr. Trump commits another atrocity:
If it looks, acts and quacks like a traitor, it probably is one, not a bona fide president of the USA: What does Bozo trump need to do to convince you and other conservatives? Slap a 'I'm a traitor' sticker on his orange forehead? Honestly, would you even believe him then?How would I know whether or not you are hallucinating? You constantly make baseless claims, and that is an indication one isn't exactly on the level.
Like this 'traitor' business. Our President is the finest patriot to have lived in the White House in my lifetime.Moo...moo moo mmooahha haahhaahaa
Sorry MAD cow disease.
Wesman, honestly, what do think you gain by expressing falsehoods about me? I almost always provide fact based links when warranted to support the truth and everyone around here knows it: They can just go back and read my comments if they wish to discover you're just plain wrong:
No response to the film which explains Mr. Trump's emoluments clause crimes? His family using our white house for personal gain while Donny Boy sabotages our healthcare and law enforcement?Ah, you live in a magical land of fantasy. How do you get back home from there, do you click your magic slippers, or did you lose those somewhere on the candy cane road? Oh wait....let me guess, Trump stole your magic slippers and so you're stuck in fantasy land.
Since we're in the land of make believe, I'll join in. I like this one. Yeah....this is cool.
What a nightmare, all that money going to trillionaires.
A true lion would turn on him.
It's a shame and an embarrassment to the entire USA that Traitor Trump, a weak, cowardly clown who shames women for their appearance, undermines our law enforcement while worshiping our enemy Vladimir Putin every chance he gets, really looks like this:In the land of make believe you can just say things like 'traitor Trump,' and pretend that Trump is a traitor because you said so! Isn't it exciting living in the land of make believe? Yay!!!! Go go make believe earthshine rangers!!! Yay!!!!
All the costs...Welfare is a great thing for the economy. People who do not have anything to spent do not contribute to the economy.
It's simple, a government will profit more from people who have money to spent (whatever it is) then poor people who have to beg for money on the streets.
And if you give people more welfare, there will be less crime because of poverty. (so you need less police to pay)
If you give people more welfare, they will have a healthier lifestyle, and go less to the hospital and dentist etc.
What is the function of a government but to take care of it's citizens? That's were it's for. (but apparently many politicians see it more as a business to fill there own pockets..- and screw the electorate... not only in the US)Hello peterstreep, was that a satirical comment, or were you serious?
If you were serious, this thought occurs; (and it is just a thought, not a researched position), isn't increasing welfare benefits, (giving recipients more money), just what we have been doing for the last forty or so, years? Do you think it has accomplished what you said doing so would?
When you speak of the government "profiting" from this action, are you considering that the only money the government has is money it takes from its citizens, so to give more it must take more. Is that you idea of profiting?
As for the government's purpose, we both know how contentiously debated that question is, but I would view 'to protect its citizens' to be a much more accurate description of its responsibilities than your idea that its function is to "take care of its citizens." I don't think the two are synonymous.
GAHi GA,
What I mean with the government proviting is by supporting peoplle in need, you will get people who will support the economy.
The tax from where the wellfare is paid of is spent in many ways.
You dont have to raise tex to give people a better support, its a matter of spending regulation.
Fact is that if people do not spent money you will have a economic problem. So in my view its better to minimilize the poor people in a country. And with some support they can improve their situation social wise, work opertunities and less crime.
With “take care of its citizens” I do not mean pampering, but its more then just protecting with police and army, thats what every police state can do..
Its organizng conditions so people can thrive and develope their posibilities to the max. Some people need more support to do so then others.
To wilderniss,
I’m definately not refering to the USSR, that was a dictatorship.
But you can have a more social system and a capitalist system at the same time. It’s a matter of money comming in and spending. Do you rather spent your money on millatery and police equipment or hospitals just to name something.I think I understand your perspective peterstreep, but, beyond the basic principles, ie. by helping people in need, those people will in turn contribute to the economy, "... its a matter of spending regulation," etc, which I agree with, our differences in perspective are great.
I am not intending to be nit-picky, or sharp-shooting your words, but it is your choice of words that, I think, illustrates our different thoughts on this issue.
You use "government" in places I think would be better described using our nation, which means I think you see the government as a deciding agency, whereas I think our citizens should be the deciding agency. You use "support," where I would use "help."
Regarding the "tax money" part, given our spending restrictions due to non-discretionary spending; SS, Medicare, debt interest, and other similar "must-pay" liabilities, it is very much the case that taxes would have to be raised to expand our discretionary social welfare programs. Military spending could be cut, but it would take a gutting of the defense budget - not just cuts, to even begin to support additional welfare program increases.
The heart of your thoughts are in the right place, but, there are a lot more factors involved in this issue, and many of them have frequently been discussed in depth in this forum, (alas, before your joining), and the bottom line is always the degrees of what constitutes "help" and what becomes unconditional "support." What taxation is a legitimate civil duty, and what taxation is the theft of wealth-redistribution, in the guise of 'helping the poor.'?
On a lighter note, you have stumbled onto one of those "Don't get me started!" topics which I, and, I am sure, several others will be more than glad to dive into - again. :-)
GAYes GA, it's a complicated topic.
I was talking in general terms as I do not live in the US, so I do not really know the ins and outs of the government spending behaviour. (but to me it looks that the military spending is out of proportion if you compare it with other nations.(China or Russia) - Trump was just asking the European countries to spent more on military - But why should they, is it not a far better idea to cut the spending of the US and use this money on a nobler thing - education, healthcare or culture to name a thing.)
I'm Dutch and live in Spain, and these two countries have a complete different attitude towards welfare. I prefer the Dutch where the support is much better. But I've learned that every country has it's own peculiarities and way of handling things. And a perfect political system does not exists.
And no, you do not help the poor to simply give them money. The best thing in my opinion to help the poor is good education. Good affordable education for everybody.
As a good economy needs a broad and well educated middle class. and well trained "working class" (I hate these labels...)
As a 1% elite and 99% uneducated class does not work, as it is bound to steer a nation into crisis.(Like the USSR, or any other dictatorship where you have an elite and "the canon fodder")Your background helps me understand your perspective better now, and your closing is full of points I agree with.
I understand that most knowledgeable commentators say Pres. Trump's 4% GDP bar for Nato spending was unrealistic, but, to one of your points, his effort is to reduce our military NATO support costs. ie. reduce overall military spending.
But, I don't think a massive reapportionment from defense spending to social welfare spending would be in our best interests. You say our military spending is out of proportion to other nations, but I would say that -- setting aside waste, fraud, and abuse issues -- there is a valid reason we spend more; our national defense issues are no longer simply border defense requirements, and our position and commitments on the world stage, demand that we have no Maginot Lines, Dunkirks, or Pearl Harbors.
GAYes, I understand the massive defence budget. But it is still a mater of choice.
Do you want to invade Iraq or not....?
Yes, the US is the biggest military power, I understand that. And I prefer the US highly above Russia or China. But is the money spent on "defence" in proportion of what you gain worldwide? Or can you do a better shop keeping job. Spent less money with the same results.
I do not know and have my doubts about the spending behaviour. As there are a lot of powers involved in the weapon industry..
It's complicated.Perhaps if Spain, Holland and the other NATO countries would provide their share of NATO's military needs the US could cut its own spending?
That's not a bad idea Wilderness,
But I think that every country has a different idea about military needs.
So you have to negotiate. It could well be that the US is spending to much on the NATO.
If President Trump thinks that the US is spending to much on NATO then he simply should cut the costs.
But what he actually wants is other nations to spent more ( read buy more arms from America) - It is about the arms business, not about cutting costs. but about selling a product.
And I think that President Trump is unwilling or unable to cut in his own military spending because of the arms lobby.
I'm a little confused here. How is helping the economy to give a third party's money to the poor but not to a cop or a soldier? Or to a worker making guns or bullets?
Whether I'd spend money on a hospital or the military (or a cop) would have to depend on whether I was sick and whether I was in danger from another country or person. How about you? Would you rather give it to a hospital or to the cop taking aim at a criminal beating you to death?We used to hold police officers (especially county and state) to a high standard, and we expected professionalism from them, like EMTs and Nurses they were a part of the community and respected.
We have lowered the standards and expectations for police officers, and they face a society that considers belligerence and insane acts done in public their rights as Americans.
The majority of police have to contend with life and death scenarios almost daily. We don't ward the insane and keep them away from the public anymore, we give them drugs, tell them to take them (which eventually they don't), and put them back on the streets. Decades ago, they put such threats to society away.
We force our police officers to give special protection to convicted pedophiles that are allowed to live amongst us. Police are forced to tolerate disrespect and assaults on their persons for fear of losing their jobs or being accused of some racist or sexist crime.
We put people in uniform that couldn't run a block without having a seizure or tearing up a knee, because it is considered discriminatory to keep someone off the force because they are female, 5'3, and 300 pounds.
This is the state of affairs in America today, the criminals and the insane have taken control of the asylum, and the remaining decent and sane people are losing all defenses against them.I cannot agree that we don't hold police to high standards, and even higher than in the past. More training is required, far more self control (as you point out) and they must have a better knowledge of the law. We even require them to be knowledgeable in mental health today so as to treat the mentally ill differently.
But none of this has anything to do with my post; I merely question how it helps the economy to give money to the poor but it doesn't do the same thing - put money into circulation - to do it with the police.
What you are saying Wilderness. You only want to pay for things you use yourself.
So you don't want to pay for a road you do not drive, a football stadium you never visit, A cure you do not use, a movie you do not watch. A vegetable you do not eat. etc.
If that's the case, why should people help you. Because only if people work together a society grows. Without tax, no man on the moon, no inventions like the telephone. no subsidy for farmers, no maintenance on roads etc.
What you propose is super individualism. This is not a system that works.
Well maybe you could live as a Mormon. But even the Mormons have a tax system of sorts. They work for each other as a collective.You asked where I would rather spend my money, and you got an answer on where I'd rather spend my money. Don't complain.
But you have refused to explain how giving money to a cop doesn't help the economy while giving it to the poor does. Through several exchanges, you've neglected to answer that simple question, a question that arose because you made the claim it was true. Want to finally try for it?
"But you have refused to explain how giving money to a cop doesn't help the economy while giving it to the poor does."
How much police do you want. If you pay a policemen, that person has a job and has money to spent to rent a house and buy stuff. So he/she does help the economy.
Helping the poor to improve their living standards also helps the economy and thus the society as a whole.
To give people a decent welfare will help a lot of people.
In the end nobody really wants welfare, but if you give people the opportunity to get out of their shitty situation (for whatever reason, may it be single mother, disabled, without proper education, wrong neighbourhood etc.) It will be easier to improve themselves if they have some money for a roof, food and education.
So both will help a society.
The policemen will help the neighbourhood and the unemployed teenage mother will get a chance not to follow her mother who was an alcoholic but to step out of it thanks to government support (in the form of money or support in learning a new job - which will be tough with two toddlers...)
In the end the two toddlers will grow up and in a good surrounding and don't need welfare. - So by giving proper help to the teenage mother, you save money on the long run by creating to persons who do not live in poverty.Trickery of leftist taxation justification ;
Take the worst possible example {welfare ],Tie it to the best possible example [police ] taxation ,one to justify the other .
Yet can't separate the two , guess what , the left actually despises both .
Please ahorseback, follow the conversation.
I was asked about the policemen and welfare.
twitter one-liners and memes are a bit tiresome to read and don't add anything of value to the conversation.
Sorry. I'm happy to discuss opinions with you, but only if you give proper arguments and not just a statement.
You're kidding, right? You don't really mean that taking from one person and giving it to another produces more money to spend? That it somehow doubles during the transaction?
No, the function of government is not to provide all the needs and wants of it's citizens. That's been tried over and over and so far it is an abysmal failure every time. There isn't much reason to think it will succeed, ever, for removing responsibility for self from self and putting it on some political committee somewhere will never improve the person being "helped" at all.
A partial comment by 'peterstreep' well worth a second look: If it looks, acts and quacks like a traitor, it probably is one and just because Mr. Trump commits treachery and other atrocious offenses in broad daylight, doesn't mean they are NOT a crimes:
"Putin uses Trump to break the west. The west is crumbling. For the first time since WW2 the USA is not a friend of Europe anymore. Merkel said it right when she said that we (Europe) can not count on the US anymore and have to go our own way.
With Brexit (a gift for Putin) the UK too can't be seen as a economic and military partner anymore for Europe.
Putin is breaking the west apart with the help of a US president who is transforming the US into a nation that is leaving the world stage.
China is ready to step into the vacuum that Trump is creating."Another Sign that Trump is breaking up with Europe is his threat to step out of the NATO!!!
The most stunning comment came from a source reported by Reuters: “Trump said they must raise spending by January 2019 or the United States would go it alone.”
= Guardian.co.ukNewsflash..
Trump stabbs Theresa May in the back by calling Boris Johnson a great Prime minister. He wants a broken UK with a hard Brexit.
Trump wants to make America great again by crushing its allies. Sounds like suicide to me.
JAKE Earthshine "Sorry hard sun, but you don't strive for peace with Russia by appeasing Vladimir Putin which is exactly what traitor Trump is doing, right after they manipulated our presidential election system to embed their stooge Donny Boy"
I think you misinterpreted my comment. In no way do I support appeasing Putin or the way Trump is cowing him.hard sun, my apologies if I misunderstood your comment, it happens on occasion:
As you can see, there are a few cultish radical right wingers around who despite his constant sabotaging of our once great nation, still actually believe Donald Trump has the best interest of the USA in mind which is an absurd notion and sometimes it can be a little difficult to distinguish the 'good' commentators from the 'bad',
Credence2 You see, he said he loves the uneducated, but that's not what he really meant. You just have to not take him so literally. Anything it takes to justify his actions.
I do think he could attempt to issue unlawful military orders. He spoke of doing such while campaigning. The only way the right-wingers would truly be able to carry out any sort of "all armament" of consequence is through part of the military. Maybe Trump's Space Force will truly be his SS or Hussein's Republican Guard. Nothing is off the table with the chaos president/god of proudly ignorant. Especially if he gets another term.Credence2 You see, he said he loves the uneducated, but that's not what he really meant. You just have to not take him so literally. Anything it takes to justify his actions.
--------
He seems to have a problem with saying a lot of things that he doesn't really mean. There has to be a pattern beyond just a series of faut pas on Trump's part.
There are plenty of his thistle headed followers that would be more than happy to give Trump complete control, in exchange for a feel good "fix".
I certainly hope that what you suspect does not come to pass, military people are professionals who take an oath to defend and protect the Constitution, not the whims of any one man.
His "space force" is to be composed of "Space Cadets". I would rather see a greater and growing NASA and the peaceful and international exploration of space. I don't see a purpose for another military branch in this area. Are we talking about "Starship Troopers" here?
We are in more danger of tyrannical forces today than anytime in our history, and that has to be, relative to Trump, his administration's goals and the man's attitude and temperament, more than mere coincidence but is indicative of an ominous pattern.
- ahorsebackposted 5 years ago
0Trump's number one priority is the economic , political , military health and strength of the US , Period . No more US Government pay days for NATO countries , no more US deficit climbing BECAUSE we are paying for world defense of all these European nations . And thank God no more Obama One World order ,
Actually, according to his public words and deeds, Mr. Trump's number one priority is the appeasement of our enemy Vladimir Putin and if we still have laws, he'll be imprisoned for life at an absolute minimum:
The destruction of patriotic companies like Harley Davidson is a case in point:Harley Davidson , committed economic suicide long ago , a piece of shyte bike , unreliable , short on gas mileage , guaranteed to vibrate the crap out of anyone riding one , overpriced under marketed and wholly unreliable............ One ,
Two , Jake please , please , please begin to use facts , even a close to a fact -lie , but please stop making your own alt-reality up.As usual, you are just factually incorrect again ahorseback, just like your soon to be indicted orange Russian poodle sitting in his filthy cesspool of ultra-corruption in our oval office:
Forth quarter 2017 earnings for Harley Davidson were up and better than expected which means demand was strong for their product prior to Bozo Trump's insane tax hike which forced them to export American jobs to foreign lands to keep the cost competitive:
Many other American companies are doing the same which is killing Trump cultees but they are hopeless and of course oblivious to the truth by now:
"Feb 12, 2018 (ACCESSWIRE via COMTEX) -- LONDON, UK / ACCESSWIRE / February 12, 2018 / Active-Investors.com has just released a free earnings report on Harley-Davidson, Inc. HOG, -0.72% If you want access to this report all you need to do is sign up now by clicking the following link www.active-investors.com/registration-sg/?symbol=HOG. The Company reported its fourth quarter fiscal 2017 and full fiscal year 2017 preliminary operating and financial results on January 30, 2018. The motorcycle Company reported better than expected quarterly sales and earnings results, and provided guidance for FY18. Register today and get access to over 1000 Free Research Reports by joining our site below:"
Better pray Mr. Trump is thrown in prison very very soon so we can attempt to salvage whats remaining of the rubble: Estimate of Job LOSS as a direct result of his utter ignorance of economic drivers and Anti-American Pro Russian sentiment:
"Trump trade policies threaten 2.6 million US jobs, Chamber of Commerce says"
https://money.cnn.com/2018/05/31/news/c … index.htmlLast I heard we had more jobs than applicants. Please try to keep informed.
Low paying jobs, the same as with Obama and Obama admitted that too many of the jobs created under his administration were low wage, no benefit, jobs.
Half the people I know have two jobs, or more, just to make ends meet. That's not good. We have room for improvement and we should fight for that as workers.So what's wrong with working two jobs , I did that from 1976 after high school right up to 1995 or so . Why , because my wants were more than my ability to pay for them on one salary . " Making ends meet " has taken on an entirely new meaning in the last few generations , New cars , $600 smart phones, big screens , mortgage instead of renting , kids at too early marriage years , ATV's , Look around you at the supposed crowds of young people ...."making ends meet " , It's a far different world than the sixties and seventies .
First, you have to the value of the dollar. Back in the 60s and 70s, your money went much further, so you could spend it on that souped up Gremlin, mullet hair cut, and Hamm's beer all you wanted to. At the end of the day, you could still afford that rent, which was more likely to be a mortgage.
In fact, according to the US Censue Bureau, effective income is dropping precipitously for the majority of the bottom half of earners. So, yes, it is much different, and harder, to earn a living nowadays. So that claim is just not true. https://www.advisorperspectives.com/ima … 16293b.png
Second. home ownership is at its lowest level since about 1960, so that's just not true. So, basically, nothing you stated is based in truth at all.
I love work. But I like to do it on my terms and avoid wage slavery when possible. Freedom is good.. Progress is good. Evolution is meant to strive to make life easier for all beings.You complain about wage slavery today with the amounts of jobs availed you ? I guess you actually had to be there in the sixties to know wages and the value of a dollar ,
Some things were more expensive then , who you pick and chose for sources is as biased as you choseHorse, do you really believe that statistics from the census bureau is fake news? Righties have been led down the primrose path to are greatest extent than I thought.
I remember the sixties and seventies as being no easier , for instance 1973 I'm paying $250 a month rent and bringing home $61.00 a week myself . Yes two incomes were required then as they are now , There is far more opportunity now for work , competitive pricings , higher education etc.......The single biggest difference from then to now however ..............A "softer " generation or two who want far more than they're willing to work contribute to acquire .
I remember all that stuff, too. But do our personal experiences substitute for scientifically collected data applied over vastly larger population samples?
Your using TVs as an example to counter Census Bureau statistics? The price of electronics always go down with time. That's a horrid example. And, you have no understanding of cognitive biases?
How about this chart: https://res.cloudinary.com/apartment-li … rej5gh.jpg
"To better understand how rents and affordability have changed over time, Apartment List analyzed Census data from 1960 – 2014. We find that inflation-adjusted rents have risen by 64%, but real household incomes only increased by 18%."
Once again, this is taken from Census Data. But, I'll just take your word, and your meme example, extrapolate that to mean things were much harder in the 60s. Sorry, you don't get to make up facts and have me go, oh damn I was wrong. Besides, aren't your facts supposed to be approved by Trump?
I also understand that no matter how many facts you are faced with, you will believe as you want to believe. Whatever it takes is was my grandma always said.
Yes hard sun, wilderness is way off base as usual as is ahorseback, not only is he wrong about the number of jobs he claims are available, but yes, they are low paying jobs because the vast majority of the wealth soon to be imprisoned Donald Trump and his Russian controlled republican congress-persons recently gave away to corporate America and greedy Wall Street worms, was funneled into stock buy backs, not wage raises for hard working individuals but that was to be expected from a mentally retarded idiot like Donald Trump who truly believes wages for American workers are TOO High: :
Moreover, the fake GDP number of 4% is just that, a fake number coming from a serial lying fake white house and even if it someday becomes a true number, there would be absolutely zero benefit for the average worker or senior citizen, just another increase in wealth for the elite class: That's the FAILED capitalism system which needs to be exchanged ASAP for something that works for EVERYONE:
"Harley-Davidson, blaming tariffs, will shift some manufacturing overseas"
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/harley-dav … g-tariffs/Agree. Though things have been worse economically...say before the recovery during Obama's first term. However, there's more than enough time for Trump and his cronies to have us racing to the bottom before its over...it looks like it may have started as you pointed out.
And, yes, GDP means not much at all to most Americans as it states nothing about where the growth is coming from. Both Dems and Republicans are guilty of touting the number to brag about economic gains.
If someone wants to work two jobs that's all fine, but most Americans, and citizens of the world would rather have one full time job with healthcare, paid vacation time, pension etc. That's just a wild guess on my part. But, we Americans just like to see how much we can make each other suffer I guess.
I love work. But I like to do it on my terms and avoid wage slavery when possible. Freedom is good. Good things are good. Progress is good. Evolution is meant to strive to make life easier for all beings. That part was meant for a certain horse that rears its head in defiance of progress."Quarterly increases of at least 4 percent are not unheard of. That level was reached four times under President Barack Obama, including heights Trump has not yet reached, such as 4.6 percent (twice) and 5.2 percent (once). On two other occasions, Obama oversaw 3.9 percent growth."
https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-mete … t-economy/
Absolutely hard sun, 4% GDP if confirmed would be the first time it has been achieved since Bozo Trump was embedded by Vladimir Putin how many months ago? And how could anyone possibly believe a white house filled to the brim with serial liars so essentially, it will never be confirmed?
Moreover, GDP high or low does absolutely NOTHING for the average worker, only Wall Street and Corporate America benefit and even that's questionable with the destructive actions Mr. Trump has injected into our once great and vibrant economy which will act as buffers to mitigate any and perhaps all perceived GDP growth or loss:
- ahorsebackposted 5 years ago0
I bet your grandma also said "You kids today have it easy "
She was right about that too.Well, if she did, I was a kid in the 70s'...so LOL.
The decent 60s and 70s were grand times, no worries. Only a few hiccups.
When can we get that kind of world back?
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/01/adp-pri … imate.html
Reality refutes you Jake. Yet again."Trump's trade war is likely going to kill hundreds of thousands of jobs"
"President Donald Trump's trade war is supposed to help boost America's job market , but new tariffs could actually make things ugly for US workers."
https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-s … obs-2018-6Jake this link is to the government website where you can keep up on the actual progress of our economy and factual stats as they are reported.
US Bureau Of Economic
https://www.bea.gov/Sharlee01: How could you possibly believe a single solitary word Traitor Trump's white house says? He's up to 16 LIES per day: UNREAL and extremely Dangerous:
In reality, our once robust economy miraculously created by patriotic President Obama is in steep decline and gravely threatened by Traitor Trump's recklessly insane actions, directives to undermine our economy he appears to be following to the letter which we can only assume from his treasonous public behavior, are dictated to him behind the scenes by his owner Vladimir Putin: DANGER:
"Trump’s Trade Policies Threaten Millions of Jobs, U.S. Chamber of Commerce Says"
"Tom Donohue, chief executive officer of the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, warned in a memo that the Trump administration’s trade policies threaten to undermine the nation’s economic progress."
"The Trump administration’s trade policies will hamstring the U.S.’s robust economic growth and threaten as many as 2.6 million jobs, according to a memo from the U.S. Chamber of Commerce’s top official on Thursday."
https://www.wsj.com/articles/trumps-tra … 1527792627I often wonder what your Trump delusions feed you in return for the obvious foolishness that you print ? Where even democrats right now are looking at their own polls and scratching their chins wondering what to resist next ? Do you get paid to troll the truth with all of this nonsense , are you doing it for free ?
Jake, So, you are stating you do not believe the stats our Government provides on the status of the economy? I follow stat, the facts that our Government provide to judge the economy. I have no faith in most economic pundits. Jake facts will never leave you looking foolish. You see actual stats are the best way to judge good or bad turns in the economy, not the pundits.
Jake, remember the political pundits that predicted Trump could not win a primary? Remember those same pundits that said, "Trump has no chance of winning the electoral vote?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIdvEUxCN5o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWjXC-K8KiU
Pundits just were so wrong when it came to president Trump, now weren't they?
Asking me if I believe Charlatan Trump's Federal Government is like asking me if I believed Marshal Applewhite pictured above, a nutcase who led his followers to their pre-mature doom: They are both one in the same only Bozo Trump is much sicker, much more mentally ILL, much more dangerous, much more EVIL, much more dumb and he lies much more frequently, up to about 16 per day now which is absolutely criminal:
Traitor Trump is doing everything within his power to destroy President Obama's job creating juggernaut of an economy, and unfortunately for our farmers and rust belt workers, he's succeeding in spades:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQruDaf7bKsJake , don't like Trump ? Then stick to the slavery of a two party congress sitting on their hands giving you zip AND making millions of dollars doing so , Then stick to your media that would rather so denigrate a sitting president to build up their own capital of bias that they are destroying their own reputation , low as that already has become . Then stick to your own B.S lines and lines of lies and distortion . No one here believes anything you type anyway!
ahoresback, your weak personal attacks directed at yours truly will never be an adequate defense against Mr. Trump's crimes: I always back my comments up with hardcore sources:
BTW, this is a discussion about Mr. Trump undermining President Obama's once vibrant economy possibly at the direction of Vladimir Putin, not a place for rambling rants tossed at me:
GM along with many other US companies believes Mr. Trump is recklessly undermining our once great economy as well, with the end result a possible deportation of American jobs?:
"GM says new Trump auto tariffs threaten American jobs"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/bus … e1a12d7f0fGM , like Harley Davidson , like so many wouldn't even be in business today if it wasn't for cheap Gov,. loans , stimulus welfare checks and over -lenient tax breaks . Let them go to china or wherever , that takes some burden away from real taxpayers
There's this Heritage Foundation take on GDP: https://www.myheritage.org/news/why-the … erformance
"Why the GDP Is a Bad Measure of Economic Performance"I have to disagree a bit... The GDP is a good indicator of economic growth in the country. Although GPD can be fickled as we witnessed in the Obama tenure. I like where the economy is headed, and my opinion does not depend only on the promising GDP alone. Add in the record-breaking jobs reports, the very low unemployment rate and a soaring stock market that is due to the consumer as well as big business confidence. These indicators give me good confidence that the economy is good, and most likely will get better. I have added a link to an article that you might find interesting.
https://www.vox.com/cards/gdp-economic- … dp-measureSharlee , When liberals say the GDP doesn't matter , it's simply because its doing so well without their cooperation . Our only enemy now is higher interest and inflationary prices , a weird balance .
FACTS:
President Obama presided over an RECORD 75 consecutive months of job growth after miraculously saving the U.S. economy from the republican abyss under George W Bush: HISTORIC:
'Obama’s Final Jobs Report Marks 75 Consecutive Months of Growth'
https://www.theatlantic.com/business/ar … rt/512366/
President Obama exceeded 4% GDP several times during his tenure:
Just like Trump's republicans insane corporate welfare tax cut scam recently passed, GDP growth only makes the rich richer, it provides absolutely ZERO benefit for the average worker and everyone understands this fact:
Everyone new Traitor Trump would be an absolute disaster in every way possible and he's all that and more in spades: He needs to be removed ASAP before there's nothing left to salvage:Again, reality refutes you. Pay attention to the news, not just propaganda.
How much are you contributing to propaganda? The Atlantic Monthly is a responsible journalistic source.
What makes Right wing oriented types so certain that they do not have their "own" form of propaganda? Why are your sources to be considered credible? Fox News, infowars, Breitbart? (Rubbish)
Anything, but anything goes to discredit Obama and inflate Trump?Because we only have about eight percent of the media and so media bias to worry about where liberals are definitely attempting the herding of cats around with the other 92 % of phony news babble .
So, what does THAT have to do about making your side more credible?
I don't subscribe to Right-wing news....Of course you don't because you swallow the other liberal 90% so easily , stop being a party puppet.
"President Obama exceeded 4% GDP several times during his tenure:" Yes Obama did exceed 4%, in fact, he reached 5.2% in 2014 third quarter, then by the fourth quarter the GDP plummeted to 2% 3200 points! Sorry stats show factually that the market during his tenure was volatile with big swings and long flat periods. I certainly give him credit in regards to the market, he came into an economic mess.
President Trump is got the economy roaring. Pus he has accomplished many good things for the country. Sad you don't realize that. However, everyone has an opinion. That's what makes the world interesting.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/188 … in-the-us/
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