Sharp decline in page eCPM: Is it due to wide format ads on top?

1. 60

   premsinghposted 15 years ago

   I have noticed a sharp decline in page eCPM  in previous week. I am afraid if it is the result of wide format ads displayed on top of the page (above the hub title). I'll appreciate comments from other hubbers.
   
   Prem

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2. 58

   weblogposted 15 years ago

   Prem, I think you are right. There are some non-google ads showing in hubs and tag pages. They mostly show on top (leaderboard) and on right hand side (skyscrapper) of the pages. Some of them are Flash ads, I guess they get some of our adsense clicks!!!

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3. 0

   Ronald Daniarposted 15 years ago

   It happened to me also, normal visitors, very less clicks!

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4. 61

   SunSevenposted 15 years ago

   I think its a site wide effect. Now I see more ads on the blank area on the right too. Now, we have more ads and less revenue!

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      weblogposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      More ads, but not all are google ads. Yes, less revenue

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5. 0

   Ronald Daniarposted 15 years ago

   Just a thought. Is it related to the Ads setting when we edit our hub? I unchecked the box "this hub may be considered commercial" and the ads banner on the top is gone. I also set the ads into medium.

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      weblogposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      I think setting ad level to 'medium' will also minimise google ads. Again, less revenue? I doubt

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6. 85

   Rik Ravadoposted 15 years ago

   Yes I agree.  My clicks and earnings are down but the traffic is fine.  I hope the Hub Team will explain the new ads.  They certainly don't enhance our Hubs and if we are loosing financially as a result then this seems unfair.

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7. 58

   Mark Knowlesposted 15 years ago

   Have any of you checked to see if these ads are showing on your impressions? I cannot imagine that hub pages would test a new ad provider on your impressions which you do not get paid for.
   
   If they are testing some other provider, I would bet they are only using their own impressions.

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      premsinghposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      These ads are powerd by yieldbuild. If I am not wrong, yieldbuild is a hubpage subsidiary. Mark, you may throw more light on it.

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         Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Yield build is owned by hubpages and serves all the ads such as google adsense and attempts to optimize them for the best results.
         
         That doesn't change the fact that I very much doubt it is serving ads that you will not be paid for on your impressions. Any more than they tested the kontera ads on your impressions before adding them as an advertiser.

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8. 85

   Rik Ravadoposted 15 years ago

   Yes I think you are right Mark.  I've checked the page source and where I did get the new ads they were on HubPages impressions.  They didn't appear on the few impressions of mine I checked.  Not conclusive but your logic seems pretty sound.  Perhaps click rate is low for other reasons...

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   GK16posted 15 years ago

   I saw some awful ads on one of my hubs today. Disgusting

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      hassamposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Most of these ads are links selling some products. Is hubpages trying their fortune in selling  some of their own products??They may be on hubpages' impression but I am seeing a decline in clicks although this month the traffic has increased for me.

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10. 58

    guidebabaposted 15 years ago

    My Adsense income has dropped drastically since last 5-6 days.

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11. 60

    premsinghposted 15 years ago

    Yes, these ads are very attractive and all the clicks are likely to be directed to these ads. I am sure all the viewers will click on these ads and not on google ads. I request HP staff to clarify. I have earned less in 10 days period of this month what I earned in a day in last month. Page views are significantly more in this month compared to previous month during the same period.

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12. 58

    guidebabaposted 15 years ago

    Same is the case with me.
    
    

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13. 85

    Isabella Snowposted 15 years ago

    Your earnings may be down, but those yieldbuild ads are not showing in your impressions. You can check that easily enough.

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14. 73

    hassamposted 15 years ago

    They obviously are not appearing in our impressions, there may be some other reason for this decline in eCPM.

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15. STAFF

    pauldeedsposted 15 years ago

    As has been mentioned the additional ad along the top and in the sidebar only display in the HubPages share of impressions.  We're using them to experiment with various new ad networks.  If we find something that works well, we will figure out a way to pass on the increased earnings to authors (most of the networks we are testing are not setup to pay small publishers directly).
    
    As for the reduced CPM, the YieldBuild team has shifted to a new algorithm in the author's share of impressions that necessitated restarting the learning process.  It will take some time to train, but the end result should be higher earnings over the long term.

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    1. 0

       daflaposted 15 years agoin reply to this

       Thank you, Paul. I would add that there has been talk everywhere of lower adsense clicks and income, and in part it is due to the economy.  People just aren't buying non-essentials right now.
       
       I do hope they get this straightened out quickly, though, because my adsense income has been cut by 2/3rds this month.

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       hassamposted 15 years agoin reply to this

       Thanks a lot Paul for the insight.

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          weblogposted 15 years agoin reply to this

          Nice clarification. Thanks a lot Paul

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       Whitney05posted 15 years agoin reply to this

       I certainly hope the lower CPM is just temporary. Last month I averaged $10-$13 a day, and so far, I've been lucky for $7-$9 a day. Do you know how long it will take for the earnings to go back up?

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          hassamposted 15 years agoin reply to this

          Even I am beginning to wonder now how much time will it take for the eCPM to return to normal. For me some strange things have happened this month like; a drop down in hubpages' earnings and out of no where, my new blog is giving me clicks. Good for my blog but bad for my hubs.

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    4. 61

       SunSevenposted 15 years agoin reply to this

       Whatever. The authors are(perhaps some of us, at least) suffering from the new modifications(experiments). I am at a low(one third of my usual earnings) for more than one third of this month. Thumbs down for the experiments and new algorithms

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16. 58

    guidebabaposted 15 years ago

    Sir: Thank you for all the explanations. HP is always working to increase our revenue and make us Rich. @#

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17. 85

    Rik Ravadoposted 15 years ago

    Paul - Thanks for keeping us informed.  Good you are looking at additional future sources of revenue too.

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18. 58

    patnamohanposted 15 years ago

    Good!!

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19. 58

    guidebabaposted 15 years ago

    Today I noticed it going back to normal to some extent.
    
    Is Beijing Olympics also a reason ? Maybe many people are interested in Olympics News rather than other things. (Just Guess)
    
    

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20. 0

    Foreverposted 15 years ago

    I just checked  some of my pages, I noticed that some pages have a google ads on top and some does not have, and when I checked the adsense code those that has google ads on top is using the hubpages adsense code and those that doesn't have the ads on top page is using my adsense code.
    
    I hope you can put back the ads on top, because since the ads placement changed my number of click has decrease to half and my adsense earnings went down to more than half.

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21. 60

    premsinghposted 15 years ago

    Whenever  Scientists do research they take care of their subjects. Here casualties are too much   that this types of experiments are not at all recommended and should be discontinued. I agree with Sunseven.

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22. 72

    Inspirepubposted 15 years ago

    Paul,
    
    I have been wondering about this whole Yieldbuild "learning curve". Why does it reset to "pure stupidity"?
    
    Can't you at least have a base of generic HubPages site-wide "knowledge" so that CTRs don't drop so far when Yieldbuild starts over?
    
    It takes a long time for an individual Hubber to amass enough data to get rid of some of the ad styles which we all know have lower CTR - the unreadable black-text-on-dark-grey ones, for example.
    
    Surely there could be a minimal level of retaining the information that has been gained so far, even if it is generic across the site, and then tweaking from there, rather than the "scorched Earth" approach of going back to random ad styles?
    
    It would make you guys more money, too.
    
    Jenny

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23. 0

    Foreverposted 15 years ago

    I checked again today and those pages where their adsense code is attach the ad placement is normal.  It seems they are just doing the experiment on the hubbers share of impression, Can I ask how many adsense code does hubpage is using, because I have seen 2 different adsense code.

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       SunSevenposted 15 years agoin reply to this

       Might be the code of the person who referred you

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24. 0

    Foreverposted 15 years ago

    Thanks Sunseven, but nobody has referred me, I signed in straight to hubpages website.

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25. 0

    Marye Audetposted 15 years ago

    I do think that the Olympics may have something to do with it. I have several blogs and each of them was down in hits this past week end by a significant amount. For example, one blog averages 4500 hits a day and it was getting 3200.
    
    So, while it may be the shifting and such it could also be other reasons.
    

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26. 58

    guidebabaposted 15 years ago

    Thank you Marye for the explanation.

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27. 80

    rharperposted 15 years ago

    Interesting... I've noticed a decline on my website, also.
    
    I hope hubpages isn't dragged down the quality algorithm
    of my adsense account.
    
    Tell me it isn't so...

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28. 83

    Whitney05posted 15 years ago

    Paul or someone on the HP staff, please answer the questions posed by Jenny, as I too would like to know why it seems when YieldBuild makes some change CTR's drop and we all (hubbers at least) seem to suffer...
    
    My CTR when compared to last month have dropped even lower since my last post.
    
    On a similar note, did you guys change anything with the ebay and amazon codes, as I'm showing much lower earnings on those two programs as well. Although, I never made 100's, I'm only seeing single digits with ebay and barely double digits with amazon, and by this time normally they're a good bit higher.

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29. 62

    Mishaposted 15 years ago

    Did you notice we are in a depression guys? People don't buy as much as they did at better times. Advertisers tighten their budgets. And it will get only worse - all of us will have to work harder to get less money. Well, the good thing is - the money will get more value

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30. 0

    Marye Audetposted 15 years ago

    I dunno, MIsha...all of this happened pretty fast...and from what I can see here in the Dallas area people are still spreading around cash like manure on a melon patch.

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       Mishaposted 15 years agoin reply to this

       I think we are just in the beginning. I would be glad to be wrong, but I expect to see things similar to what happened back in 1929-33, or even worse...

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31. 58

    Mark Knowlesposted 15 years ago

    I think Misha may have hit the nail on the head. For the first time ever, I have just seen a google public service ad on the top of the "Hot hubs" page

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32. 58

    Mark Knowlesposted 15 years ago

    I agree with you Misha - this is just the beginning I'm afraid.

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33. STAFF

    pauldeedsposted 15 years ago

    I think this has been explained a few times but I'll try and explain it better now.
    
    When we switch to a new YieldBuild algorithm, in some (but not every case) the learning process has to restart from scratch (for purely for technical reasons).  While it is in the early stages of learning after a restart the CTR and CPM will be lower as it tests a lot of different layouts.  Typically it will get very close to previous levels after a few days, but it may continue grind out the last 5-10% over the course of a week or two.  That's just the way it works.
    
    It was restarted on August 6th in the Hubbers' share of impressions, and as best we can tell earnings are back to normal (or higher) now than they were before.   While we've restarted it for testing in our share many times, this is the first restart in your share in several months.
    
    The YieldBuild team is continually working to improve the initial configuration, the learning speed, and the top level optimization.  One reason we decided to restart in your share at this time is because we think the new algorithm will result in a higher ceiling in terms of earnings.  There are some things we could probably do to smooth the earnings through the transition (making the transition take longer), but the net result will be the same -- a short term loss for what should be a long term gain.
    
    As for eBay and Amazon we haven't changed a thing with them.
    
    ( Learn more about YieldBuild or check out what Jason is up to these days on YieldBuild Blog )

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       premsinghposted 15 years agoin reply to this

       This has been explained very well by pauldeeds and evident also that CTR and CPM declined with restart of process on August 6 and now there is some improvement. Decline is mainly due to experimentation of yieldbuild and nothing to do with depression or Olympics. We've to believe pauldeeds that end result will be the same.

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       1. STAFF

          pauldeedsposted 15 years agoin reply to this

          I appreciate the confidence!  But, there are, of course, factors outside of our control that can impact traffic and the advertising market.  I'm not saying the Olympics or the the economy has had an effect, but I'm not saying they haven't or won't either.  It's impossible to tell with our relatively narrow view into things ...

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             premsinghposted 15 years agoin reply to this

             There are chances that Olympics may have some effects on the traffic but reference to economy or depression makes less sense. Decline in earnings began in August 08 only and economic depression has taken place since last quarter of 2007. In few cases traffic may have gone down but it is consistent in majority of cases.

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    Marye Audetposted 15 years ago

    It doesn't seem to be just the earnings though..My page views are down close to half of what is average for me.  Very weird.
    
    Not being a sports enthusiast I STILL blame the Olympics!  It is my story and I am sticking to it.

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35. 0

    shinujohn2008posted 15 years ago

    It is a fact , that hub pages are using wide ads that are eye catching. But,the most interesting and Happy news at present is that, hub pages have started using Adsense Ads with "Blue links" and "White" Back ground. 
    
    From past 2 days,most of the hubs have ads of this type which is more Impressive and attracts the attention of visitors.
    
    I strongly believe that,if hub pages uses this ad format colour PERMANENTLY(without using other ad colours as back ground),the CPM and number of clicks from visitors will surely increase.
    
    In last week,most hubs had coloured ads,which were not even visible to people and had ugly colours  which caused decline in earnings. But.now i see better Adsense ads with all blue links and white back ground,which blends and matches with the hub pages.

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