Obama Supporters: Do you feel the knife in your back?

1. 66

   nicompposted 13 years ago

   Here's your 'change'. A fine is not a tax, therefore no tax increase. Taxes in the name of 'responsibility' are not taxes.
   
   Obama Goes Toe-To-Toe With Stephanopoulos On "Tax Increases":
   
   On "This Week," George Stephanopoulos and President Obama have a colorful discussion over Obama's health care reform proposal.
   
   Stephanopoulos takes issue with a mandate that obligates Americans to purchase health insurance, or risk being fined as much as $900. "How is that not a tax?"
   
   "A responsibility to get health insurance is not a tax increase," Obama said.
   
   Stephanopoulos then tells Obama that he looked up the definition of "tax" in Merriam Webster's dictionary.
   
   "The fact that you looked up... the definition of tax increase indicates that you're stretching a little bit right now," Obama responded.

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      cosetteposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      well
      
      i don't see how looking up something is 'stretching'. i see it as precise journalism. like George Stephanopoulos doesn't know the definition. he was making a point. there are some people, like young college students, who are not on their parent's insurance but are very healthy and who may not think they need insurance.
      
      risky, i know, because accidents happen.
      
      but i don't like the idea of compelling - no, MANDATING people to purchase health insurance. if they can't afford health insurance, how on God's Green Earth are they going to be able to afford the president's penalty fines for it? some people's budgets are stretched at the seams as it is. and what happens if they DON'T pay their fines? is he going to have them arrested?

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         Madame Xposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Yeah, kind of like how the IRS puts you in jail if you don't pay your taxes.

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      2. 66

         nicompposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Don't pay the fine, get arrested, have a public defender appointed, go to trial, get convicted, go to federal prison...
         
         and you'll have free health care!!

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            cosetteposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            haha...i just love life's little ironies...

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         Plenopticposted 13 years agoin reply to this

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2. 77

   Eaglekiwiposted 13 years ago

   If disallowing large companies previous benefits like Company cars , travel write-offs, discounts on insurance ,property taxes,etc etc , plus all the nickel n dime freebies ( which to you an me are not nickel n time amounts) are no longer available , woohoooo , major savings for the country!!
   
   No wonder many are squealing and complaining , they only get one vacation now instead of 3 or 4

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   1. 66

      nicompposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Be careful. The vaunted "Small Business" gets those write-offs as well. The Schedule C is a powerful tool for whittling down your tax obligation through all kinds of nifty deductions.
      
      By the way, corporations shouldn't pay taxes anyway.

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         Madame Xposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Yes they should. They're the only ones who should because their status is a privilege granted by the govt to exist as a corporeal entity.
         
         Besides, corporate perqs should only be decided by the corporation itself in a free market system - not a busybody govt.

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         1. 66

            nicompposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Corporations don't actually pay their taxes now. Their customers and employees pay them. Any corporate tax is an indirect tax on individual citizens.
            
            You have to understand where the profits go; any income left over after expenses (including taxes) is paid to the shareholders and employees or used to buy stuff, which creates more jobs.

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         Poppa Bluesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Corporations DON"T pay taxes, they pass them along to you and me! Thanks Obama!

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         Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Why shouldnt they pay ?

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         1. 66

            nicompposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Please see my previous post in this thread.

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            Madame Xposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Yeah, why shouldn't they? Your previous post only explains how they do pay and where the money comes from.

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               Poppa Bluesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Therein lies your answer. It's the nature of corporations and how they derive their income. They sell a product or service and determine after costs what profit margin they can obtain to determine a price. Those costs include their tax burden. Ultimately all taxes are paid by consumers that's what makes the current income tax system in the USA sooo evil, because it punishes labor, productivity, savings, investment and risk instead of rewarding those things, which I think we all can agree are GOOD things! This is why under Obama Americans will experience economic pain not seen since Jimmy Carter!

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                  Madame Xposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Oooo, sing those blues baby

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                     Poppa Bluesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     LOL
                     
                     "Woke up this moirning people, everything I had was gone
                     Woke up this moirning people, everything I had was gone
                     Uncle Same he came and, took away my farm!"

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            2. 66

               nicompposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Scroll up a little more and read my previous previous post. I explained it there. They are paying with money that you would otherwise earn.

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                  Madame Xposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  That doesn't mean they shouldn't pay. If there is anyone who shouldn't pay it's the individual. We aren't govt privilege-granted entities.

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   Leta Sposted 13 years ago

   What a brilliant thread post!  Wow!

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4. 73

   rhamsonposted 13 years ago

   The idea of mandated health insurance is a novel idea but puts more of a strain on the working poor that they cannot bare.  If you switch jobs faily regularly due to your occupation or lay offs and you have a pre-existing condition such as hearts deseas or diabetes a practical ploicy you can afford cannot happen with out public option to lower the costs.
   
   If you think this is a far too slim example think again. We do not need some more feel good legislation but something that works and this cannot work.

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5. 78

   jiberishposted 13 years ago

   Just wait, Crap & Trade will make taxes go up ever further.

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6. 81

   bgpappaposted 13 years ago

   I feel the right has done nothing and Congressional Democrats are weak.  Obama is bringing change, and everyone is fighting it.  No knife. Give it time

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