To those who keep saying Obama is a Muslim...Why does it matter? Why is being Muslim a negative thing?
To those who keep getting offended when others say Obama is a Muslim...Why does it matter? Why is being Muslim a negative thing?
It's offensive because of the way the right-wing uses it.
Calling Obama a Muslim is code for a more insidious opinion. Asking them what evidence they have that he is reveals the nature of the code.
There's nothing wrong with being any religion. I happen to find almost all religious beliefs to be ridiculous; therefore, I would not single out Islam as absurd anymore than another, unless that religion is dominant in the society I live in and people try to make public policy based on it, such as people using Christianity to push homophobia and creationism. When this occurs, I will voice my disapproval.
Since when is being a Muslim a negative thing? Unless you're a right wing nut case. People who take this Obama/Muslim and the birth certificate thing need to get a life since they're both email rumors passed along by Karl Rove and other rigfht wing nuts!
It's a negative thing because people will say they aren't voting for Obama simply because he is a Muslim.
It's a negative thing also because people are getting overly-offended when other people say Obama is a Muslim.
It exists on both the Right and Left side.
And I agree, it should not be a negative thing, yet people are getting fussy over it! Who cares if the man is a Muslim?
The need to defend Obama from the Muslim charge is what I find most interesting. To a liberal its a terrible insult but they say nothing is wrong with being a Muslim, so where is the insult?
I don't know. I think it's fine to be annoyed that there is a lie, but I also think the extreme left have more in common with the extreme right than they care to admit. I don't see people getting as butt-hurt over allegations of Obama getting a divorce, for example. That's (probably) a lie, too, and has about as much basis as the Muslim thing. Yet people are more offended with the Muslim thing.
How do we know its a lie? How do we know for sure he isn't a Muslim? How do we know George W Bush wasn't a satanist? The truth is we don't.
The problem is right wing nuts go beyond just ranting and raving. Eventually they want to round up all those not like them, stick them in concentration camps, gas chambers and mass graves and the rest of the people go along with it because they are to scared to disagree, because they know if they do, they will find something, to make them the next targets. We just seem to learn nothing from history and it just keeps repeating itself.
I think that's a little absurd. Even if it wasn't, there's no way those nuts could gather enough votes to get any power on a national level.
70 Years ago in a European country they could, unfortunately for this poster in America it would never happen.
We are capable of learning from history.
Also, at that time, the media was more controlled. There was no internet, no bad media leaking out about the leaders and political figures. At that time I would suppose that any person whom was openly against the power would die a mysterious, untimely death. Or flee the country.
With the amount of transparency we have today, there's little chance that would happen. Members of the military get prison sentences for torturing enemies over seas. These days, if it's discovered that you committed any kind of misdemeanor, or done anything less than ethical, it screws the chances of you running for office to hell. Your character is judged on everything. Just wait until the internet has an older history than like 20 years, and see all the shit we can dig up on everyone who ever posted anything, ever.
I am sorry, but the more info we put on the net the more misinformation becomes part of it. There is little control of the accuracy of any content on the Internet and unless people really are into research.
The net may wind up being more of a problem than a source of transparency. It is already the number one recruitment tool for extremism.
All it takes is a lousy economy, enough unemployed people, a scapegoat and a someone with the gift of gab. Germany is not the only country in history to commit genocide, but all the places that have always have the same type of formula. We are capable of learning from history but we haven't.
It would matter if he was a Muslim and said he was a Christian because that would be a lie.
The reasoning is that because he had a Muslim father and had some exposure to Islam, he must be a Muslim.
I had a Christian mother and a Jewish father. According to Christians, I must be a Jew because my father is a Jew. According to Jews, I was a gentile because my mother was a gentile.
Actually, I was a secular Miss!
Later I converted to Judaism.
There is no way that Obama is a Muslim. If one knew how Islam worked, one would know that.
And there is no way I was a Jew, and if Christians knew that one could only be a Jew if one's mother was a fully orthodox Jew, then they would have know I couldn't possibly be a Jew.
It's a combination of ignorance and resentment that makes people hang on to myths as above.
Hmmmm. I can think of a number of concerns but to keep it simple how about misrepresenting yourself during an election? If confirmed one can't help but wonder what else. Not weighing in on if that is the case or not, but answering your question about "so what if?".
To those who keep saying he is Muslim - you know you are a liar
To those who get offended by this lie - good on you !! resisting such insidious lies and misrepresentation with the real possibility of convincing some really stupid people, but people who still have a vote, you know them there kristian folks who alreadysupport bombing the cr@p out of Muslims of any kind.
Yes, but why is it offensive for him to be Muslim?
Or are they offended that it's a lie? (How would they know for sure, anyway?) I usually only see people getting offended over lies if they are negative lies. I don't see as many people taking offense to other lies, such as birth certificates not being legitimate (lies said about Obama and McCain in the last election). Not very many people get offended when Obama is said to be a socialist, either.
So what's the deal with Muslims? Why would it matter? Screams religious intolerance to me. I'm sure it's not very different than the people that won't vote for Romney simply because he is Mormon.
You said it yourself - it smacks of intoerance, and this is why the lie is offensive - it works on those stupid christians who seem to thrive on hate and intolerance. Or like a fool in another thread who only believe in what they want and deny evreything else around them, even though it is clearly ridiculous to every other contributor, including other christians. And I didn't know that Romney was a moron.
You didn't know Romney was a moron?
Where ya been for the past 6 years he's been running for president?
It sounds like you may be intolerant. How do you take yourself seriously? You are a glittering jewel of intolerance as you rail against intolerance. You funny!
I guess you are right puppet man - I am really intolerant of bigots and fools - I guess somewhere along the line I offended you huh
Okay, so my friend Amabo is out at the biggest club in our area, let's call it Murrca. He's trying to sweet-talk some ladies, and a bunch of our friends have a running bet over whether he's gonna get some within the next 4 years.
Now, he should be allowed to sweet talk these ladies all he wants, and if they like what he's got to say, they're the ones who decide the outcome of our bet.
But my one friend Grant keeps following him around, and as soon as he leaves one group, Grant's like "You know that dude's gay right? He's just trying to trick you into doing something stupid for this bet."
Now I could not give a hoot whether Amabo is gay, but how is he supposed to win over these ladies if they actually believe Grant? Also, what is wrong with these women, that they seriously believe some guy with a vested interest in the bet when he says Amabo is gay? How dumb do you have to be? Obviously he just wants to win the pot and have bragging rights for the next 4 years at Murrca so he can score with all the ladies. He's so annoying about it that a lot of people are talking about just finding a new club if that happens.
So I go up to these ladies and I'm like "Don't listen to Grant. He's a ****." and they're like "Uhm, why do you care if Amabo is gay? Got something about gays?"
Of course not, I just want you to know, because you seem to think Amabo is trying to pull a fast one or something. Also, because you need to be informed that Grant is a skeeze who goes around lying to pretty ladies just to win a bet.
............ Is my metaphor still on track? I'm so lost. Oh well time to hit the "post" button.
Yes, exactly. It's absurd. I'm not even Pro-Obama or Pro-Romney, or Pro-anything; but some of the criticisms of Obama are irrelevant, absurd and beside the point: He's Muslim, he's Kenyan, he's Socialist. What they are really trying to say is that he's "other". He's not "us". Be afraid. Absurd.
There's a great video up on Youtube where a woman is yelling that Obama is communist. The reporter decides to actually put the mic in her face and ask what she means by that (she was yelling it while he interviewed someone else) and she can't explain what a communist is / what about Obama links him with it.
It's so, so sad.
That is very funny and I believe it, seen many people like that. Sad is the right word to describe to it. Ultimately, it's very sad. There's nothing about Obama that implies he's Communist, good or bad, that is certain. The label is an old stand-by, that's all. And they know they'll get flack for using the N-word, their other stand-by.
"Naming is a very convenient way of disposing of things and of people - by saying that they are Germans, Japanese, Americans, Hindus, you can give them a label and destroy the label. If you do not give a label to people you are forced to look at them and then it is much more difficult to kill somebody.
You can destroy the label with a bomb and feel righteous, but if you do not give a label and must therefore look at the individual thing - whether it is a man or a flower or an incident or an emotion - then you are forced to consider your relationship with it, and with the action following. So terming or giving a label is a very convenient way of disposing of anything, of denying, condemning or justifying it." [J. Krishnamurti]
This is a thought-provoking topic, KK.
Thanks for introducing it.
Why would it be offensive for the POTUS to be a Muslim? Because Muslims are the enemy. America needs an enemy to rally against. Since 9/11, that enemy is the nation of Islam. They want to destroy our country.
His middle name is Hussein -- so he MUST be a Muslim, right?
His politics are unAmerican. He wants to _____________________fill in your own blank on the evils he has perpetrated and/or plans to perpetrated on our freedoms.
Being a Muslim is way, way worse the being a Mormon. Mormonism is at least an American-based religion.
Why do we get offended when ignorant, bigoted people call Barack Obama a Muslim?
Because it is offensive. It is intended as the ultimate insult. It is disrespectful of our duly elected president.
I personally get offended not so much for Obama, but more for us as a nation. Such comments dismay me. They confirm just how small-minded and willfully gullible some people can be.
This whole Muslim thing has the potential to be the 2010 decade's version of McCarthyism. That was a dark time in our history.
It's offensive to me because Obama is NOT a muslim. The far right wants to use this paint to turn certain voters against him. Such voters think, "It's not bad enough that he's black - he's also a Kenyan-born muslim communist!" It astounds me at the number of people who honestly believe Obama is a muslim.
It astounds me that some people believe a proven liar! How do you know he isn't a Muslim? Is it because he said so?
Romney has lied, too, as have practically ALL politicians alive. Obama has attended a Christian church for years.
And he drinks beer, so if he is a Muslim he's not a very good one!
Ok, is that an answer or are you just using the democrat rulebook?
Wow - talk about uncanny timing. A computer guy just came to look at our internet connection, and we somehow got on politics. He told me he wasn't voting for Obama, mostly because the POTUS is a muslim. I tried arguing with him, but he said Obama visited some country that only allows muslims in. I have no idea what he's talking about. Ugh.
Seriously though, it's frightening that people will cast their vote based on their ignorance about a candidates religion, (perceived or real religious orientation) although I'm no fan of Mitts, I think some of the rhetoric and negative remarks around his faith are equally disturbing. Like you, Habee, I have no clue where this Muslim only country can be found!
Maybe he meant Mecca, it's not a country but it's a city and only Muslims are allowed in.. I don't think Obama has visited though the Muslim world would be very angry if he had I imagine.
First reaction to your post, Habee.
Thank you for being the John McCain of this election.
I have seen many times recently that exchange between McCain and some lady who said "Obama's an ARAB."
"No ma'am. He's not. He's an American."
Your democrat party can have john McCain if they like, he certainly isn't a Republican.
I'm starting to think there should be a "bullshit test" for voters. These forums have opened up my eyes to the extreme Right, and the extreme Left. What is an Independent voter to do?
I have always appreciated your constructive, thoughtful, hate-free responses, by the way, MM.
Wow this has really grown in my absense.
So far, I see two reasons why people find being Muslim offensive: 1. It's not true, and 2. They are intolerant.
And to the person who called Romney a moron... I think calling someone a moron is more offensive than calling someone a Muslim, because moron is a blatent insult, wheras Muslim is a religion.
And the person with the not-actually-gay man hitting on woman analogy: Kind of says "Muslims(gays) are not emotionally compatable with Americans(women)" lol.
The extreme left is far more militant and dangerous than the extreme right.
the worse thing about the Internet is that it is the land of assumptions.
Man this a lengthy thread it's like reading an essay - i'm staying away. Obama is a Muslim - he just hasn't realised it yet :-)
Wow! Unbelieveable! rotflmao...He's a muslim? lmao....Give me a break! Watch out everyone Romney is a Mormon! They believe Jesus lives on the Planet Kolob! And they have a "living Prophet", that speaks to God! Romney must follow the words of the Prophet (living today who speaks to God) in his daily decision making. So if the Prophet says go to war, I guess he would have to! RIght? LMAO
The President is not a Muslim because he eats pig, drinks alcohol, smokes, and don't face East and pray five times a day.
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