Your 2018 wish list, politically speaking

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   PrettyPantherposted 5 years ago

   What would you like to see accomplished this year?
   
   Mine:
   
   1) Bipartisan cooperation on a clean infrastructure bill.
   2) Trump resigns.
   3) Democrats win out in the midterm elections and take control of the House and Senate.
   4) Young people vote in record numbers.
   5) The House and Senate become more diverse than ever before.
   6) Medicare for all becomes a realistic option.
   7) The Mueller investigation concludes and we finally know exactly what did or did not happen.
   
   What would you like to see accomplished this year?

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      Credence2posted 5 years agoin reply to this

      You have got to be telepathic or psychic, add more instances of overwhelming minority turnout like I saw in the latest senatorial contest in Alabama and we are on the same plane.
      
      So, check this out,  Panther, just another reason why I can't stand this fellow, Trump.
      
      "On Christmas, President Trump tweeted that he’d be heading “back to work” the next day. He then played golf at one of his golf courses in Florida on seven consecutive days. During the first White House news briefing of the year on Tuesday, Press Secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders was asked to defend Trump’s golf habit. Though Trump repeatedly criticized President Obama for golfing while he was in office and vowed that he was “not going to have time to go play golf” on the campaign trail, he’s golfed more than three times as much as Obama did to this point in his term. “Can you tell me the single biggest thing the president has accomplished for the American people during his time on the golf course?”

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         PrettyPantherposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         Credence, if we can duplicate the Alabama turnout nationally, then the 2018 midterms will be a happy day for us.
         
         How do you think South Koreans feel about Trump's bragging about the size of his button?
         Do you think they feel safer now?

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            Credence2posted 5 years agoin reply to this

            Gee, I guess "my button is bigger than your button". How childish can you get?
            
            Doesn't Trump have an appreciation or concept of the game he is playing. But again, reflection and wisdom is not part of his repertoire.

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         wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         “Can you tell me the single biggest thing the president has accomplished for the American people during his time on the golf course?”
         
         Can you (honestly) say that he did nothing during his stay in the area of the course?  Presumably he didn't accomplish much while swinging a club, but that only takes a few hours per day, leaving 16 or so.  Do you know what he did each minute of that 16 hours?

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            PrettyPantherposted 5 years agoin reply to this

            Speaking for myself, I don't care how much he golfs. I do care that he is a liar and a hypocrite who, while campaigning,  lambasted Obama for playing golf and promised he (Trump) would not play golf because he would be too busy working. I remember his adoring crowds robustly cheering every time he said it.
            
            Like most things he is criticized for, Trump brought it on himself by being a lying hypocrite.

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            Credence2posted 5 years agoin reply to this

            “Can you tell me the single biggest thing the president has accomplished for the American people during his time on the golf course?”
            
            Can you (honestly) say that he did nothing during his stay in the area of the course?  Presumably he didn't accomplish much while swinging a club, but that only takes a few hours per day, leaving 16 or so.  Do you know what he did each minute of that 16 hours?
            -----------------------
            Wilderness, Panther has made my point earlier. It is not the golf per SE, its the hypocrisy of Trump statements criticizing Obama for taking too many vacations and playing too much golf when he boasts to his adoring throngs that as president he would not have the time to play golf.
            
            I guess because Trump is a defus white rightwinger Republican he gets a free pass? Do you not think I don't clearly see the hypocrisy? I will hold him accountable for it and everything else he says, as I should. This is not made up by the "liberal press" but are words direct from that pie hole of his.
            
            Did Obama deserve the same "benefit of the doubt" you so easily grant Trump?

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      wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      7)  Not going to happen.  The investigation is going to end with no significant collusion found, and the liberals of the country are going to declare that it was a flawed investigation because they know there was something, anything, shady going on.  Can't find it, can't point to it, but they "know" it's there anyway.  Just like Obama's birth certificate - the quite legal one that was promptly declared a forgery and photoshopped.

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         PrettyPantherposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         LOL, did you misread #7?
         
         "7) The Mueller investigation concludes and we finally know exactly what did or did not happen."
         
         Did you miss the "did or did not happen" part?
         
         Geez, you're awfully defensive about that investigation.

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            wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

            You misunderstand.  You're never going to know what "did or did not happen" because the investigation is going to say nothing happened. And the liberal community is going to discard the answer because they "know" better, leaving the question still open. There will never be a general consensus throughout the nation because some (millions) will refuse to accept the results regardless of which way they go.  Re: the birth certificate.

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               PrettyPantherposted 5 years agoin reply to this

               I didn't realize you had a fool-proof crystal ball. Learn something new every day.

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                  Credence2posted 5 years agoin reply to this

                  You were right the first time " he doesn't".

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                     wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                     How about you, Cred?  When Mueller doesn't find anything significant will you accept that Trump and his campaign is clean or will you decide that it is a politically arranged "conclusion" without truth in it, made for the sole purpose of protecting the Republican party and it's members?  Or possibly blow a molehill into a mountain in order to say "See?  Told you so!"?
                     
                     I see where the house is already fighting over that investigation; Dems won't let go, saying "We didn't the answers we wanted!" while R's are saying "Enough is enough - there's nothing there!".  And it isn't going to change.

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                        PrettyPantherposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                        I can only speak for myself and say I will accept the results, period.
                        
                        Right now, it's the right wing that is putting forth an orchestrated effort to de-legitimize the Mueller investigation.  will you accept the results, no matter what?

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                           wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                           I believe you will, and it's to your credit.
                           
                           Sure - I believe Mueller is trying, is not corrupted (yet) and will tell whatever tale happened.  But it's not just the R's that are orchestrating an effort - the D's are doing whatever they can (and then some) to keep this thing going until something is found.  Something - anything - they can use to de-legitimize Trump, whether it has to do with Russian collusion or not.  And if it goes on long enough - it's getting close now - I'm going to turn the other way and decided that Mueller has been corrupted.  One has only to look at Comey or Reno to see that it can happen.

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                              PrettyPantherposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                              Well, I didn't qualify my acceptance of the results. I said I would accept them, period. I challenge you to do the same. :-)

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                        Credence2posted 5 years agoin reply to this

                        How about you, Cred?  When Mueller doesn't find anything significant will you accept that Trump and his campaign is clean or will you decide that it is a politically arranged "conclusion" without truth in it, made for the sole purpose of protecting the Republican party and it's members?  Or possibly blow a molehill into a mountain in order to say "See?  Told you so!"?
                        
                        I see where the house is already fighting over that investigation; Dems won't let go, saying "We didn't the answers we wanted!" while R's are saying "Enough is enough - there's nothing there!".  And it isn't going to change.
                        ---------------------------------
                        
                        Greetings, Wilderness, I told you in all honesty that I don't like the man, his policies, nor what he stands for, but I am satisfied that Mueller has been a dogged and impartial investigator so far and if Trump comes out clean from this investigation according to Mueller, I will be willing to allow Trump to dodge this bullet. There will be plenty more in the coming months.
                        
                        I am stuck with this guy, Trump, for a while, I won't trip him up unfairly. He can do that all by himself, he does not need me.

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                           wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                           "I am stuck with this guy, Trump, for a while, I won't trip him up unfairly."
                           
                           Really?  So far I haven't seen you award accolades to him for a single thing.  In a full year he hasn't done one thing right, whether large, small or in between.  He hasn't had a kind word for a child, hasn't pushed for one good bill, hasn't don't even the tiniest part of his job as President.
                           
                           What I have seen is an unending stream of complaints about things you feel he's done wrong, from having funny hair to having been proven to be buddy buddies with Putin.
                           
                           And you call this "fair"

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                              Credence2posted 5 years agoin reply to this

                              "I am stuck with this guy, Trump, for a while, I won't trip him up unfairly."
                              
                              
                              
                              HE DOESNT DERSERVE ANY, Wilderness. When he does something worthy of an accolade from me. you will be the first to know. I give him about the same credit that you gave Obama as someone "who never did anything right". That was a direct quote from you at on earlier occasion. So, it is ok for you, but not for me, huh?
                              
                              I got you back to your side of the Maginot, obviously. I told you that ideologically, I am going to have trouble with Trump, his values and belief systems, nothing to hide there. I don't like GOP philosophy, but Trump is the first Chief Executive, that I dislike; as a man, in regards to his policies, and regarding what he stands for.
                              
                              I could say that for Reagan or Bush, I never disliked them personally. We could share a cup of coffee or a beer, we just disagree.
                              
                              I am a progressive, it is going to be difficult for Trump to do anything that would be worth any positive response, it is just not in his nature. That is as 'fair' as it gets. Just because I don't like the guy and am not particularly impressed with his performance to date does not mean that I support using extra-legal or unethical methods to discredit him. I think that is 'fair' enough. I have said nothing about his hair or his association with Putin. But, there are plenty of things that I have said and I stand behind the words.

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                                 wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                                 I rest my case.

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                        crankaliciousposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                        They've already found significant activity. There's been no evidence that Trump himself was involved in any collusion, but there is already signficant evidence that his campaign was. That's been the assertion all along: collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia.
                        
                        We already know there were meetings between Trump campaign operatives and Russian spies.

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                           crankaliciousposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                           I should rescind my previous assertion that collusion has been proven. We just know that meetings, that look really bad, took place. Here's a link with a conclusion that supports Wilderness's claim that there was no collusion. It may just be that top Trump official were really naive and really stupid.
                           
                           http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/03/politics/ … index.html

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                              Marisa Wrightposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                              I'm sure that's the line the Trump campaign will pursue. It's always nice to find a scapegoat.

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                           wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                           I'm sorry; the assertion was begun as Trump and Putin put their heads together to fix the election.  Not that some minor member of his crew spoke to a minor Russian citizen sometime in the past 10 years.

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                        Marisa Wrightposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                        I think I get what you're saying, Wilderness. You're not saying there wasn't any collusion - you're not making a judgment on that. 
                        
                        What you're saying is, we have got to a crazy situation today where no one believes anyone.  So no matter what's reported or by how reliable an authority, there will be some people who refuse to believe it because it doesn't suit them.

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                           wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                           EUREKA!!!  Kudos to you, Marisa - that's exactly what I'm saying!  "Everybody knew" Obama was not a natural born citizen and could not be president as a result.  When he produced irrefutable, incontestable proof that he was..."everybody knew" he wasn't a natural born citizen because "everybody knows" Hawaii gave out a fake birth certificate. 
                           
                           And this time?  It isn't going to be a few thousand idiotic die-hards that refuse to accept what they don't want to hear - it's going to be millions of them.  Whatever Mueller reports there will be millions and millions of idiots calling him a liar because they don't like the report.

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                              IslandBitesposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                              Or corrupted, right?

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                                 wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                                 Most assuredly.  Again, whatever he reports there's a good chance there will be calls for Muellers resignation, firing or jailing.

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                  wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                  LOL  One doesn't need a crystal ball to figure out that people will believe what they want to - just history, the billions over the planet that all declare their god is the only one, the millions right now that "know" there was nothing to find (or that there is) or that Trump colluded with his best buddy Putin to fix the election.
                  
                  To think that 300 million people will agree when that agreement says that half of them were wrong and so many have an incredibly deep hatred of Trump they cannot spread further, is naive indeed.

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         crankaliciousposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         Wilderness, I am a little surprised that you're not more interested in the investigation. After all, Steve Bannon, of all people, is calling the meeting between Donald Trump Jr. and the Russians "treason" now. That's pretty serious stuff.
         
         I listened to an interesting story on NPR about the Steele dossier. Basically, Mueller is investigating money laundering and the Steele dossier was the first document to report this, although the FBI began a similar investigation independently of the Steele dossier. The basic conclusion was that the Trump organization was laundering money for the Russians in exchange for Russian support of Trump's, at the time, nascent political career.
         
         I already can guess some of the response to what I've written, but the interesting facts about the piece were that the Steele dossier was not a hit piece. It was an independent investigation done at the behest of the company's founders, one of whom was a conservative journalist for the Wall St. Journal. Steele did not even know who he was investigating. One conclusion, Steele and all his sources, are very reliable based on their past information.
         
         I would think you'd be more interested in all this since the implications for what it suggests are pretty serious.

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   Marisa Wrightposted 5 years ago

   My wish list - no war, please.  I'm at the point where I'm happy to settle for that.

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      PrettyPantherposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      I'm sure your wish is shared by most people.

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   Live to Learnposted 5 years ago

   I'm of one mind with Marissa. Either at home or abroad.
   
   Other than that, I have no hopes this government could accomplish anything I'd wish for this nation.

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      PrettyPantherposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      "We must accept infinite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope."--Martin Luther King, Jr.

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         Live to Learnposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         Judging by the intractable nature of our politicians and our citizens I think infinite hope is being strangled to death by infinite selfishness and arrogance.

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            PrettyPantherposted 5 years agoin reply to this

            Only if we allow it.

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      wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      Oh, I don't know...I do have hopes that something can be done with the DACA problem - something beyond simply ignoring the law as Obama did.  I think we could see some infrastructure done.  I doubt that we'll see much in the way of additional border protection, but it could happen.  Likewise, I doubt that the question of what to do about 20 million illegal residents will be addressed (outside of DACA), but it [/]could[/i] happen.
      
      And there is always the hope that the people, rather than the government, will institute term limits.  And do it in such a way that congress cannot simply change it back, like the Idaho legislature did.

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