Why are Democrats rushing on Healthcare Reform???

1. 68

   TimTurnerposted 15 years ago

   On Yahoo today, they said the Democrats are "scrambling" to get votes to back the public healthcare plan:  http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091023/ap_ … e_overhaul
   
   Can someone please tell me why this issue has been a "rush" to get done??
   
   I feel like the Democrats are just trying to hurry and push this through without going through every detail thoroughly.  I've even read Congress is against putting up the final version of the Bill 48 hours online before the vote.
   
   I like the public option and I'm glad they are reconsidering it but I don't want a rushed bill voted on in a hurry, just to get it passed.  Because who will pay if things weren't properly thought out?  Taxpayers.

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   kirstenblogposted 15 years ago

   I also like the idea of a public option. It does seem like it is important enough to actually take a bit of time on it tho. I am not sure what valid reason there could be for rushing it. I wonder if its the speed that is upsetting so many people. It can take some of us a while to get our heads around an idea and giving the public that time could be a greater benefit then rushing it.

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      TimTurnerposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Yeah, I think it is the "rushing" that is scaring most people.  Or that they feel uninformed.
      
      I seriously want Ross Perot to pay for a 30-minute infomercial and bust out his charts and explain this thing to me in detail...haha.
      
      Obama is so good with speeches, yet, he has failed to go over this plan thoroughly with people.  Granted, it's still being put together but I don't even think the common person (including myself) knows the basics of it.

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   Poppa Bluesposted 15 years ago

   They're rushing it through because if anyone really looks at it it won't get passed!
   Everything about this process is a game of deception.
   First there's the cost, 900 billion. They needed to get it under 1 trillion to get people to vote for it!
   The deception here is the cost is over ten years, but for the first 5 years there are no benefits, just the collection of money!! So the actual cost of this bill is 900 billion over 5 years!
   
   Oh and the other deception, they extracted the medicare payments to doctors (200 billion) and put that in a separate bill!!! Otherwise this one would have been 1.1 trillion!!
   
   Now why would you want a "public option"? Why would you want the government to get into the insurance business?

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      TimTurnerposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Well, thats what I mean.  I need to take a class on this plan just to understand it.
      
      I think options are good for people.
      
      But what I would prefer is a UNIVERSAL system like Europe and I'll gladly pay more taxes for it.
      
      But, again, I need to see details of everything.

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         Poppa Bluesposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Well good luck with that! The bill is over 1500 pages right now of legal mumbo jumbo! You should take a look at it I think you'll be shocked at just what they are trying to do! And after all this there will still be 20 million uninsured!

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         livelongerposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         It would have been nice to have conservatives acknowledge the reality that universal coverage can cost a lot less, cover everyone, and have better outcomes. You're the first I've ever seen that's done that.

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            TimTurnerposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Thank you

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            Poppa Bluesposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            You don't get something for nothing! Europe controls the cost by limiting care, it's that simple. In any market it's suplly and demand that drives pricing. Health care costs run higher here because the people that are using it aren't paying for it, if they were, they wouldn't use it as much and the costs would be lower.
            
            These bills for universal care do nothing to lower the cost. The hope is, and it is just a hope, that by having a public option, insurance companies will lower their costs. They won't because they can't. As it stands the big HMOs only had a profit less than 4%. Microsoft had a 24% profit to put this in perspective. If they were to reduce this to 2% or 1% what would the "public option" pricing be 1 to 2% lower?
            So the "savings" is all in the profit, but that won't stop costs from rising as more people will be using the system and still (as far as they are concerned) won't be paying for it (it's free!)

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               livelongerposted 15 years agoin reply to this

               Of course universal health care isn't free, but the costs are borne across the entire population and across all age groups. Europe controls costs by limiting care, but not as much as our private-insurance system does. Are you really unaware that insurance companies' business involves limiting care?
               Look at the outcomes. European countries, despite spending substantially less than us, have better health outcomes that we do. So if they're limiting care, they're doing it far more judiciously, or less, than we do.

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                  Ralph Deedsposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                  Very true.

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                  Ralph Deedsposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                  Very true.

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4. 68

   arthritickneeposted 15 years ago

   I'm not sure there is quite so much of a rush when the concept of reform has been around for ages.
   Its not like the idea came up yesterday and they want to pass it today.
   
   I remain intrigued by how afraid many Americans are of health care reform. Will it make your life so bad? You don't think it will make you a communist do you?
   How communist is Canada, Australia and the United Kingdom?
   They have all been doing it for years and yet they survive. Wow

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      TimTurnerposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      It's not that.  We don't know how we are going to pay for all the reform.  We are already in debt of trillions to China.
      
      Americans aren't scared of reform but how is it going to happen, how much will it cost, who is paying for it and what exactly will change?

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      A Texanposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      If this were health care reform we might not be against it, this is the first step into a single payer system accompanied by rationing. Health care reform would actually be great but nobody seems interested in that!

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      rsmalloryposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Well, large parts of the Uk are predominately Muslim and acting under Sharia law... Don't know much about Australia or Canada. But what I do know about America is the government has no business deciding or running my healthcare choices for me.

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         R P Chapmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         This statement is incorrect. Around 2.5% of the population are muslims, and vast majority of them happy to abide by UK law.

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         egivposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Are you serious? That's your argument against the vastly better system that exists in the UK? Muslims in the UK cannot practice Sharia... they follow British laws.
         
         Do you realize who IS deciding your healthcare for you now? BUREAUCRATS. Except instead of government bureaucrats, it is private insurance company bureaucrats who are only interested in making money.

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         Ralph Deedsposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Well, when you get to age 65 I assume you will decline to be covered by Medicare and pay your own hospital and medical bills which may well reach 100s of thousands of dollars. Or maybe you'll be lucky and drop dead on your 65th birthday.

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            tksenseiposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            That will be up to 'The Panel'...

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               Ralph Deedsposted 15 years agoin reply to this

               Ha! I hope the Dems will be in the majority on "the panel!"

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                  tksenseiposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                  Oh, it will be exclusively democrat.

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                     Ralph Deedsposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                     That's fine with me!

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   C.J. Wrightposted 15 years ago

   The idea is as old as Ted Kennedy.....however they are trying rush something through while they have a majority and a popular sitting President.

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      A Texanposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      I wish it were as dead as Ted!

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         C.J. Wrightposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Yep. Hopefully it will be soon. Its a set up. Get it done now, make it effective for the next election year. Its Politics as usual from someone who ran on change.

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            A Texanposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Yup!

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      rsmalloryposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      What's crazy about the rush is they want it passed now, but not effective until after the next election...is it just me or does that make absolutely no sense?

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         rhamsonposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         They don't have the money to do it now.

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            Poppa Bluesposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            They won't have the money later either! As it stands they are playing tricks to get the CBO to rate it as deficit neutral, showing a 250 billion dollar cut in Medicare to pay for it in the health care bill, but adding that money back in a separate bill! And as you say the benefits don't kick in until after the elections in 2013, so the costs don't include any payments for benefits in the beginning years while they collect money to get it started.
            It's likely the 10 years after 2013 this bill will cost 2 trillion dollars! Bend over America the government is going to stick it to ya once again!

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               rhamsonposted 15 years agoin reply to this

               Boo! Hiss! Bad Government! Bad Government!  Go sit in the corner and take a time out Government.  Leave us alone.
               
               Whats your point without the bias.

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                  Poppa Bluesposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                  Bias? What bias? Those are the facts and as usual when the left is confronted with the facts a sleight of hand is used to change the subject.
                  My point is the government is lying about the cost. They are doing so in order to make it more palatable to congress and the American people and to provide the cover of ignorance when their lies are uncovered.

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         2. 68

            rsmalloryposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            They'll never have the money to do it-they'll be robbing peter to pay paul so to speak for years. Our children and grnadchildren will be paying for this for decades to come.
            
            You know, if I don't have the money for something, I just don't buy it. Government has no concept of this.

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   Denno66posted 15 years ago

   I think at this point it is a matter of passing any kind of healthcare reform. Is it going to cost money? Everything does; so no 'Bad Government', that's just the way it is. Spending has gone haywire, yes, but no fix is really not an option. The healthcare system is broken. This 'rush' has really been going on for quite some time. An answer is needed, but it needs to be a consensus effort, not that of a divided congress.

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      rhamsonposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      I concur!

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      TimTurnerposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      It's been a rush since Obama took office.  And the funny thing is that it's not UNIVERSAL.  About 19 million Americans will still not have health insurance.  And the others who don't have it but will have it under this new bill, will be FORCED to get it or face a fine.
      
      That's absurd.
      
      Create a truly UNIVERSAL plan that helps everyone and not forcing people to buy insurance.
      
      Mandating car insurance is obviously needed because you can kill innocent people with your car.  The last time I checked, eating fast food for years won't kill anyone but myself.
      
      Making people buy health insurance is not a good road to go down.  Where will it end?
      
      We need to have a system based on European countries but even those are flawed.
      
      In the end, the people with good insurance will be pissed about this bill.  And the people without insurance will be pissed that they have to buy it.
      
      Quality of insurance will go down and no one will win.
      
      The amount of time and resources spent on this bill is ridiculous considering there are far bigger worries in the world and in our own country.

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         jiberishposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Confussion and 'crisis' are this administration's way of leading us into the fire.

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   Poppa Bluesposted 15 years ago

   First of all you DON"T have to buy insurance to drive a car. You only have to show proof of financial ability in the amount specified by law. Most people buy insurance rather than tying up their assets.
   
   Secondly, the States control insurance law, not the feds. The federal government DOES NOT have the constitutional authority to FORCE citizens to BUY anything let alone health insurance! They would need a constitutional amendment to do so!

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      rhamsonposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Where do you live? I want to get my car registered in your state.  Here in Maryland car insurance is mandatory.  One day without insurance coverage and you are fined $150.00 and I believe $35.00 every day after that up to I believe $3,500.00.  There is no wiggle room with this.  And if you never pay the fine you can't register any car in your name until the fine is paid.  I don't think they care about your assets.

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         Poppa Bluesposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Are you sure you can't post a bond?

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            rhamsonposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Quite sure.  We have a no fault based system where the insurance companies duke it out with each other.  Not a fair fight when it comes to the individual kind of thing.  The state wants the insurance companies to have quick access to cash to settle disputes.  Of course if there is extreme circumstances such as negligent vehicular homocide there are a whole new bunch of people you will meet in civil court and circuit court at the cost of your freedom and money.

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      TimTurnerposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      The fines are up to $900 for an individual and $1,400 for a family if they don't get insurance under this bill.  Or it was one of the bills.
      
      And I've never heard that you didn't have to buy car insurance.  No one has ever given me the option to have assets of "X" amount as to not get insurance.

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         Poppa Bluesposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         All states are different of course and as I said most people elect to buy insurance rather than post a million dollar bond but there is that option, at least in my state.

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            Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Well, in New Hampshire you don't have to have insurance on your car. That is just one example. I agree with Poppa Blues on that point.

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   Manly Manposted 15 years ago

   So the drug and insurance companies won't have time to shoot it down?
   
   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3q6Walwg … r_embedded
   
   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVpX5fUvPlg&NR=1

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      rhamsonposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      LOL Thats a good one.  Let the mayhem begin again.  I guess when Patrick Henry said "Give me liberty or give me death" he was being so prophetic.

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   zadrobiposted 15 years ago

   I think everyone should read some of the bill before they say anything about it. There's even plain english summaries of the more salient details out there. Give it a whirl.

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