Iraq

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   egivposted 14 years ago

   After todays bombing and other recent acts of terrorism, one is left wondering if the "Iraq problem" will just fade away like America wants it to... Thoughts?

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      Scott.Lifeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      No its not going to fade away. The problem is, whether or not its wrong or even acceptable to those of us in the west, that culture respects strength. Until someone rises to the occasion and consolidates power there is going to be instability and unrest.
      
      Democracy just does not work in some places and cultures. The sooner this is understood the better off world affairs will be. We tried to impose our will and vision of government on this nation without ever really asking them what they wanted in the first place. Case in point Saddam was one man, amongst millions. he stayed in power because his people allowed him to.
      
      Like it or not until the first gulf war Iraq was a very prosperous and modern nation, and one of the few in the region where religion was not allowed to control the gov't. Saddam was for all intents an atheist, worshiping himself as God. he did all he could to keep the clerics from rising to power and even refused to allow Bin Laden into his nation, as he saw him as a threat to his total power. There was no Al Queda in Iraq before 2003, at least that's the intelligence we uncovered while i was there.

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         tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         I find that sentiment utterly offensive.

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            Scott.Lifeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            I guess you'll get over it or wake up and realize the world is not the pretty place you hope it is. Some people do not want and will not accept democracy wake up!

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               tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Who told you Democracy was "pretty"?

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               tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/24988
               
               
               

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                  Scott.Lifeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Well done I wondered if you'd notice a reference to your own past comments.

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                     tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     WAKE UP! YOU ARE TOO SLEEPY TO AGREE WITH MY GENERALIZATIONS (and perhaps even bigotry?)!!!!!OPEN YOUR EYES, THINK FOR YOURSELF, AND GROW UP!!!!!
                     
                     RARRRAAARRRRRAAAAARRRRAAAAAAA!!!

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         earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Hello Scott. You make some very good points.
         I wonder why America stood by while this despot built all his palaces.
         I cannot believe America did not know what he was doing all those years ago when he became "god" surely they should have stepped in then, when he was still accepted by the USA as the leader.

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            tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Do you really wonder why?

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               earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               I have theories. What do you think?

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         tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         He stayed in power because he terrorized and brutally repressed 'his' people.

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            Scott.Lifeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            He stayed in power because the masses refused to stand up for themselves and take unified action. Those who will not fight for their own freedom will never deserve it.The Iraqi people certainly have not had a problem standing up to the American occupation.

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               tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               So all peoples who have ever suffered under a murderous tyrant had it coming?

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         C.J. Wrightposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         You absolutely right on this. You can't view the Middle East through American eyes.....

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            rhamsonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            YES, YES GET OUT NOW!!

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      sooner than laterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      No, it won't and sooner than later Iraq will not be our biggest problem.

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   earnestshubposted 14 years ago

   egic, it certainly is food for thought. I believe the USA will be trying to get leverage from what Pakistan is doing, as it seems the Taliban are strongly based there.
   
   I do not see an easy way to ease the ethnic violence in Iraq soon.

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   awareposted 14 years ago

   Im not sure what you mean by the Iraq problem.as a American  im not wanting to forget about the Iraqi people or their plight.  .The newest bombings have me wondering >For what? Why? Do the ones wanting to topple the government have a better one in mind. Who do they want to lead in Iraq? What do they want for the people of Iraq? From what i see they want death.From what i see they still want war and fear.We could stay and give them both.As we leave and violence continues  .America wont be easy to blame anymore. It is painfully obvious that we cant fix things.Im left wondering will the Iraqi people ever  be able to .

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   TimTurnerposted 14 years ago

   I think we need to realize that what we are doing in Iraq and Afghanistan is the future of U.S. military action.
   
   Terrorism will always have its pockets around the world and the U.S. and Israel will always be the targets for most of the terrorists.
   
   I do not care about Israel (that's another post) but for the U.S. to survive, we will have to take matters in our own hands to combat the terrorists.  Granted, Iraq didn't start as a terrorist haven but could be in the future.
   
   The stability of Iraq is crucial for U.S. interests.
   
   The same is for Afghanistan.  We do need to get countries like Pakistan to put a good amount of resources and troops to the cause and I'm glad they are doing that.
   
   But, for the most part, U.S. troop will be used for the majority of the wars against terrorism.  And until Russia and China have terrorism problems originating outside of their countries, we can't expect them to help.
   
   I don't think we need to build our armies against other nations anymore.  We will have a military to protect our homeland from terrorism.  And these little pockets of unrest and wars will be commonplace around the world.
   
   I don't see anyway around that and we need to accept the new reality.

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   tksenseiposted 14 years ago

   And the moment we don't have a military capable of defending against a hostile state guess what will happen?

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      TimTurnerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Russia and China know this but taking over the U.S. isn't in their interests.  The only 2 countries that would love to do that but don't have the power is North Korea and Iran.
      
      But Russia and China know we are spread thin and couldn't defend against a homeland attack by either country.  But that is just not in their best interests, especially since we owe China trillions

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         tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Of course we could.

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            sooner than laterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            We have major problems in Iraq because we want to establish democracy, reduce colateral damage and maintain our "police" status with world affairs.
            
            Home security against Russia or China would be a diff ballgame. that among other things keeps them at bay for the moment.

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               tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Their own inability to project power also keeps them at bay.

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            TimTurnerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            I don't think we could with over half of our military all over the world.  But a deterrent would be nuclear weapons and that would be our main defense at this point.
            
            But my point is that fighting small pockets of terrorism (and resistance in the future) will be our future enemies, not whole countries, unless their leaders are terrorists, like in Afghanistan.

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   Mishaposted 14 years ago

   There was a mistake to enter this war in the first place. When mistake is recognized, usually the most beneficial course of action is to cut loses short...

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   K Partinposted 14 years ago

   GET OUT NOW!!

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      rhamsonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      YES, YES GET OUT NOW!!

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   egivposted 14 years ago

   Ok, trying to steer this away from becoming another petty tit-for-tat argument, I think there have been a lot of good points. I think the biggest problem is that we invaded, and by doing that we took a bat to a bee hive, creating a mess that we were barely able to understand, let alone combat. We destroyed the only thing that was holding the country together, even if it was doing this through fear and violence. We unleashed powerful, complex ethnic tensions that have deep historical roots.
   
   We have absolutely made progress since then, but progress is only really measured in terms of how bad or less bad it is. As we saw yesterday, the country has not reached even the minimal level of stability that allows one to go outside without the fear of a bomb going off.
   
   This is why I believe that we should not have pulled out from Iraq (I wrote a couple hubs on it) as much as we did, not because I want to "win" or kill "bad guys," but because we left it a mess, and it doesn't take a foreign policy expert to see that it is not going to get better just because America wills it to.

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   Dame Scribeposted 14 years ago

   Rhamson, the US is withdrawing and security is being handled by Iraqi's for Iraq. they tear themselves apart not US or their allies.

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      rhamsonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Whether they tear themselves apart or not is their business.  Let them figure this out for themselves.  If they allow someone from within their country to attack us again then they along with their confederates will be dealt with.

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