The Kavanaugh/Ford Hearing

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  1. peoplepower73 profile image93
    peoplepower73posted 7 weeks ago

    What was the purpose of that hearing? In my opinion it was a dog and pony show that served no purpose and had no mission statement.  It proved absolutely nothing.  However it did give those who are worried about the mid-terms something to ponder.  The judge is a shoe-in to be elevated to the highest court. 

    In the final analysis, it doesn't matter where the truth is, he will be confirmed.  The GOP has the firepower.   I think the only new thing that came out of the hearing is the term about the democrats called "search and destroy."  You can be sure that will be entered into the GOP playbook and used many times from this point forward.

    1. Kathryn L Hill profile image78
      Kathryn L Hillposted 7 weeks agoin reply to this

      Peoplepower73:
      You say:
      The hearing gives those who are considering the mid-terms something to think about. (Like what? How bad the Republicans are?)

      It is guaranteed that Brett K. will be confirmed for the highest court because the Republicans have the power. (Not necessarily. What a victim mentality this comment reveals.)

      The "search and destroy" tactics of the democrats will be used by Republicans for years to come. ( I call it crucifixion and no they WILL NOT stoop to this.)

      How dare you!

      1. promisem profile image99
        promisemposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        It is not guaranteed if only one or two Republican senators vote against the nomination.

        The two women Republican senators are known to have concerns, especially Susan Collins.

      2. crankalicious profile image95
        crankaliciousposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        Oh, now we're creating moral equivalencies? As if the Republicans are somehow better than the Democrats? Remember, your president is a pussy-grabbing, porn star screwing, dirty-mouthed man-child. Further, the Republicans created this scenario by blocking the legitimate nomination of Merrick Garland.

        And people are coming out of the woodwork now about Kavanaugh. He was the quintessential drunk frat boy. Of course he denies nearly raping anyone. He can't remember all the nights he was black-out drunk. He legitimately doesn't remember.

        Why is this so hard. A conservative is going to be confirmed to the Supreme Court. All Trump has to do is go find someone who wasn't a drunk women-assaulter.

        1. Live to Learn profile image79
          Live to Learnposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

          I suppose the idea of fairness is lost on the left. I get it. When the democrats are in power it's lost in the right.

          How very sad.

        2. hard sun profile image90
          hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

          "Oh, now we're creating moral equivalencies? As if the Republicans are somehow better than the Democrats? Remember, your president is a pussy-grabbing, porn star screwing, dirty-mouthed man-child. Further, the Republicans created this scenario by blocking the legitimate nomination of Merrick Garland."

          That's all that needs to be said. You have no moral standing on politics if you still support Trump. And, now they are outraged at the politics of attempting to block Supreme Court nominees. The hypocrisy is mind-numbing, and Trump supporters who pay attention at all know this. They just choose to overlook it.

          1. wilderness profile image96
            wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

            I would have said you have no moral standing if you support half of that committee refusing to do their appointed task as employees of the United States people.  You have no moral standing if you support their activities in intentionally ruining lives for political gain.  You have no moral standing if your hatred of Trump results in such pathetic and destructive behavior as we saw yesterday by the entire Democratic lineup.

            1. hard sun profile image90
              hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

              I don't support any of the circus. But, I do think Trump's lack of morality and good judgement has accelerated the buffoonery of our national govt.

              1. peoplepower73 profile image93
                peoplepower73posted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                Kavanaugh said that boofing means flatulence and devils triangle means a drinking game.  However, the urban dictionary defines boofng as anal sex and devils triangle as two guys having sex with one women.  Here is my source. 

                Sorry I have to stoop to this level, but in my opinion the Trump era causes us to get down in the mud. He is not a very good role model for the country with his lack of morality, even for those who choose to look the other way.

                https://www.newsweek.com/devils-triangl … gh-1142748

                1. PrettyPanther profile image88
                  PrettyPantherposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                  At the very least, he is a liar, under oath no less.

                  That alone should be enough to disqualify him.

                  1. hard sun profile image90
                    hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                    Yup...but lying is the new truth..it's the Christian thing to do. I guess you didn't get the message.

                  2. gmwilliams profile image82
                    gmwilliamsposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                    Of course, Kavanaugh is a liar.  He is GUILTY AS SIN regarding Ms. Ford & the other witnesses.  He engaged in the behavior mentioned.

                  3. wilderness profile image96
                    wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                    Ummm...Did you use a dictionary from 35 years ago, and dedicated to the East?

                    Most of us know definitions, especially teenage slang, change and are VERY region specific.  Personally, I never heard either term and I was still young then.

                    (According to "urbandictionary.com", "boofing" does not refer to anal sex at all).

                2. hard sun profile image90
                  hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                  Ouch, yeah...good catch. It gets worse each day and they keep pointing the finger at others. I know right from wrong. I don't care if 90% of Americans don't.

        3. wilderness profile image96
          wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

          "Remember, your president is a pussy-grabbing, porn star screwing, dirty-mouthed man-child."

          And therefore Kavanaugh is unfit to serve.  Good thinking!

        4. wilderness profile image96
          wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

          "Further, the Republicans created this scenario by blocking the legitimate nomination of Merrick Garland."

          Sorry, poor behavior from one (person, party, country, whatever) neither creates nor excuses poor behavior by others.  Each is responsible for their own actions, no one else.

    2. promisem profile image99
      promisemposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

      Anyone who reads enough American history should find that search and destroy in politics goes all the way back to the country's independence.

      If voters want civility in politics, they have to demand it from both parties.

      1. wilderness profile image96
        wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        Closest I've seen to that is "We must demand civility, but your  politician did it so it's OK for mine to do the same".

        1. promisem profile image99
          promisemposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

          By people on both sides. Anyone who says the other side is always wrong is simply a closed-minded political bigot.

          1. wilderness profile image96
            wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

            Absolutely.  Both sides are 100% guilty.  It is up to "the people" to clean up the swamp - will we begin in Nov by voting in all new legislators?  Experience says "No".  "Your man did bad so I'll leave mine there to do it for me".

    3. wilderness profile image96
      wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

      I agree with you (Don't fall off your chair!) - it was a political show for power.  Democratic questions of Ford were non-existent while each Senator gave a nice speech indicating sorrow about her plight.  Republican questions through the prosecutor were valid and reasonable, though, looking for credibility and facts.

      Democratic questions of Kavanaugh were limited to "Why won't you play our political game delaying your confirmation and request a FBI hearing?" while Republican questions were (almost) limited to sorrow and apologies coupled with speeches attacking Democratic handling of the information.  While there was considerable validity (IMO) in those attacks and they DID point out how it was a game to some Senators, they did not search for truth or credibility; the purpose of the meeting was lost in attacking political rivals.

    4. Ken Burgess profile image88
      Ken Burgessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

      You answered your own question, it is all about political maneuvering, it is all about maximizing the negative views not on Kavanaugh, who wasn't their primary target... but the ability of the Democrats to paint the Republicans as enemies of women, those who have been victims, etc.

      No other explanation suffices, there is no reason why they held these accusations back, if not for maximum political effect and damage to the Republicans.  Putting them in a bind.  If these charges had been lain out weeks prior, that would have given everyone concerned plenty of time to investigate the charges and still be confident about their decision to confirm or deny his seat.

      1. JAKE Earthshine profile image79
        JAKE Earthshineposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        But in reality, republicans are indeed the enemies of women: Republicans are trying to control women's bodies and rights through the supreme court, limit their access to critically important healthcare and just look at that unbelievable display of misogyny and disrespect all those elderly, white racist in some cases senile men horribly exhibited at the Kavanaugh charade yesterday:

        1. wilderness profile image96
          wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

          Will you next add Tea Party members?  Atheists?  Anyone in the Elks club or that was a boy scout?

          Pretty you'll be the only one left; the Supreme Arbiter of All That Is Moral in this country and ranting about every other person. lol

          1. PrettyPanther profile image88
            PrettyPantherposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

            Very silly and disingenuous comment. Jake only mentioned Republicans. It is a fact that Republican legislators at both the state and federal levels are the ones repeatedly enacting or attempted to enact laws that limit a woman's ability to obtain an abortion, that attempt to defund Planned Parenthood and other programs that help women, that attempt to limit health insurance coverage for birth control, and more.

            These are real issues that affect women's daily lives and Republicans are almost entirely responsible for these actions.

            1. wilderness profile image96
              wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

              Well, it started with Trump long ago.  Then any of Trump's family.  Then anyone connected to Trump in any way.  Then all Republicans - half the country.  The logical progression is to include everyone but himself in his rants, isn't it?

              It is a fact that "the rest of the country", meaning Demcrats, are tryiing to make all bathrooms unisex.  Democrats continue to demand more and more of what we build for ourselves.  Democrats wish us to support millions and millions of illegal aliens. 

              Believe it or not, as you wish, but there are more issues in this country than abortion; more even than those termed "women's issues".  One of them is that a mere unsupported allegation is sufficient now to ruin lives and prevent employment.  Another is the continued notion that if legislators refuse to do their job it's a good thing.

              1. PrettyPanther profile image88
                PrettyPantherposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                Of course, but he was specifically addressing    women and how many of us view Republicans. Access to affordable birth control and the ability to make your own decisions about your own pregnancy shouldn't be an issue in this day and age. Republicans continue to make them an issue. This is not 1950 but it seems many Republicans wish it were.

                Add to that Republican support for a self-admitted sexual assaulter for president, rushing through an accused sexual assaulter for a lifetime appointment to the SC, Republican voters selecting an accused pedophile for their Senatorial candidate....the record is clear. Republicans are not supportive of women in this current political atmosphere.

                At least Senator Flake allowed himself to act his conscience yesterday so maybe there is hope.

            2. peoplepower73 profile image93
              peoplepower73posted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

              Ed Fisher (aka ahorseback), Yes I'm back.  Tell me how was the judge deprived of life, liberty, and property in this hearing that is not even a judicial court?

              due process of law:
              n. a fundamental principle of fairness in all legal matters, both civil and criminal, especially in the courts. All legal procedures set by statute and court practice, including notice of rights, must be followed for each individual so that no prejudicial or unequal treatment will result. While somewhat indefinite, the term can be gauged by its aim to safeguard both private and public rights against unfairness. The universal guarantee of due process is in the Fifth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, which provides "No person shall…be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law," and is applied to all states by the 14th Amendment. From this basic principle flows many legal decisions determining both procedural and substantive rights.

              1. wilderness profile image96
                wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                "All legal procedures set by statute and court practice, including notice of rights, must be followed for each individual so that no prejudicial or unequal treatment will result. While somewhat indefinite, the term can be gauged by its aim to safeguard both private and public rights against unfairness. "

                While still incomplete, the now stated and obvious intent is to deprive Kavanaugh of employment.  It is also deprived him of the liberty he once had to coach and to teach.  These things are being done without trial by peers, without proof of wrongdoing; they are extremely "prejudicial and unequal" for they ignore the concept of "innocent until proven guilty" that are all afforded.  The actions taken go to great length to bypass and ignore "rights against unfairness"; the goal is to avoid "fairness" if at all possible.

                Now you can complain and whine that the goal is NOT to delay Kavanaugh's confirmation until after the mid-terms in the hope he won't be confirmed at all, but not a single thinking, honest person will believe you.  Your choice.

                1. peoplepower73 profile image93
                  peoplepower73posted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                  Wilderness:   

                  1.  Was Hillary innocent with Bengahzi until proven guilty?  No.  She was presumed guilty for three years with Bengahzi and then after three years of wasting tax payers money Troy Gowdy  admitted there was no wrong doing and he just gave up.

                  2.  You are right, this hearing was not a trial, it was not even a court of law.  It was a dog and pony show.  Therefore there was no presumption of innocence or guilt on either side.

                  3.  You are telling me he still can't be employed as a judge or a coach and teach because of this hearing? Those are all statements that he made by his demeanor in the hearing.  No one is depriving him of anything other than what he believes he is being deprived of.

                  4.  However, here is something to ponder.  He was under oath to tell the truth.  If in fact in the FBI investigation, if they find out he was lying about the definition of Boofing and the Devils Triangle, then he has perjured himself. 

                  It doesn't matter when he wrote that in his calendar.  What does matter is that under oath, in this moment in time, he lied because he was trying to protect himself and his family from embarrassment.

                  1. wilderness profile image96
                    wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                    1.  Are you trying to excuse bad, completely reprehensible, behavior because someone else in the past did it?  By that reasoning you can validate slavery.

                    2.  Again, you have GOT to be kidding.  The questions asked, if nothing else, clearly show a presumption of innocence of Ford and guilt of Kavanaugh...by Democrats.  And the behavior/questions of Republicans clearly show a presumption of innocence of Kavanaugh.  You know that, I know that - the whole world knows that.  Why would you make such a statement?  This is not a political arena and I'm not a politician; you don't have to pose for the cameras and you don't need to posture.  It only hurts your debate points.

                    3.  He will likely not get the job on SCOTUS now, and almost certainly would have.  Few locations will hire or use a convicted sex criminal as a small girl's soccer coach.  Most schools will not hire a convicted sex criminal.  And make no mistake - is has absolutely been convicted in the minds of millions upon millions of democrats.  Just as the Democratic committee members intended and as you intend with your comments.

                    4.  And your point?  That IF proven guilty he is guilty of perjury as well?  Does that include if no evidence is found of guilt then Ford is guilty of perjury...and slander as well?

                    Thank you.  The last sentence shows exactly what I said; he is convicted in the minds of millions without a single shred of evidence.  We might as well add in that evidence showing his innocence "doesn't matter", for you just stated that as well.

  2. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    When did liberals abandon the meaning of due process ?

  3. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    With Bill Clinton's rape allegations , ?

    1. promisem profile image99
      promisemposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

      The same Bill Clinton who got impeached for consensual sex with an intern? That Bill Clinton?

      1. Ed Fisher profile image61
        Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        Oh THAT sexual encounter ? What , A Clinton on the job training program ?

      2. wilderness profile image96
        wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        Now why would you post a lie like that?  Or are you really that ignorant of relatively recent history?

  4. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    Kavanaugh's character assassinators  are going to pay dearly in November .  You are all ignoring  the dems who believe Kavanaugh's testimony .

  5. JAKE Earthshine profile image79
    JAKE Earthshineposted 6 weeks ago

    It's INSANE that Bret Kavanot is STILL under consideration by Russian republican congress persons to actually sit on our supreme court !! Given the strong evidence against him and his mentally disturbed unhinged demeanor at the republican sham hearing the other day, he should absolutely be impeached from his current position !!

    Allison Burnett

    Verified account

    @Allison_Burnett

    Follow Follow @Allison_Burnett

    More

    Buckle your seatbelt:  I just heard from an impeccable FIRSTHAND source that @MichaelAvenatti's client's claims are true. The culture at Georgetown Prep was debauched and sexually criminal.Only a "gentleman's code" keeps it secret. Ideally this is the week that it ends.

    4:32 PM - 28 Sep 2018 from Los Angeles, CA

    6,904 Retweets 23,399 Likes

    1. Ed Fisher profile image61
      Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

      Now Twitter too becomes the court choice of a trial by media and  social media especially ?

      There is no shame in liberal tactics .

      1. hard sun profile image90
        hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        As opposed to Pizzagate, Benghazi, etc? The thing is many of these Trump related rumors are proving to be true, even according to the FBI, federal prosecutors, juries, etc. Republicans played dirty with fantasies. My bet is Avenatti has something if he says so...tapes, etc. You see these things are real, not fantasy that's been dis-proven by years of FBI investigations.

        We'll see how this plays out.

        1. PrettyPanther profile image88
          PrettyPantherposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

          I attended the University of Oregon from 1979-1983. It was known as a party school (the movie Animal House was filmed there). I saw drunken, criminal behavior committed by mostly boys (but, yes, a few girls, too). The culture was such that, unless it was directly witnessed by university staff, it was useless to report or complain. I was lucky that I came from a lower middle class blue-collar background and had a natural aversion to the frat/sorority culture. Still, it was hard to avoid witnessing some of their behavior or hearing about bad things that happened to girls, or boys who were hospitalized from hazing.

          I have no problem believing these things happened.

          1. promisem profile image99
            promisemposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

            Some people consistently reject any accusation of rape or sexual assault, especially for their favorite politicians.

            Otherwise, they minimize or rationalize the behavior, i.e., our esteemed President. Oh, it happened years ago, so just get over it.

            Or maybe they think sexual assault and rape are no big deal.

            They'll change their minds fast if it happens to someone close to them.

            1. wilderness profile image96
              wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

              Some do.  And some...some greedily reach for any accusations of rape or sexual misbehavior as long as it concerns someone of a different political persuasion.

              Pretty common, I'd say, and we see it even with the few participants here, don't we?

          2. hard sun profile image90
            hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

            I fully understand this, as much as I possibly can, being a man.

            Attending college in Indiana in the early 90's seemed to be very little different, and I came from the same type of blue-collar background. I found myself at a couple frat parties and it was ridiculous. I think I was thrown out of each of these parties I came to be at...I wasn't a saint but the idiocy just pissed me off so I told them they were idiots...lol. I can certainly see Kavanugh as one such disrespectful punk that had to have his buddies at his back at all times.

            1. wilderness profile image96
              wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

              "I can certainly see Kavanugh as one such disrespectful punk that had to have his buddies at his back at all times."

              Why?  Did you know him?  Do you know enough Yale graduates that you feel it reasonable to apply a characterization of one graduate to all of them?  Are you just biased against anyone with wealthy parents?  In your mind is anyone that drinks beer a "disrespectful punk that had to have his buddies at his back at all times."?  Do you have evidence that Kavanaugh never left home without multiple "buddies at his back"? 

              What reasoning do you utilize to conclude Kavanaugh is/was a "disrespectful punk that had to have his buddies at his back at all times."

              Or is it just irrational hatred of Republicans, Trump, wealthy people or all conservatives?

              1. hard sun profile image90
                hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                It's my opinion based on the the things he said and the way he acted in front of the Senate committee and my experiences. Not complicated. I don't think I said anything about all Yale grads. Geesh...and I thought liberals were supposed to be the PC police.

                1. wilderness profile image96
                  wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                  I see.  I was grasping for possibilities, that's all.  Curious, though, that you could look at something like 2 hours of speech in a criminal hearing and decide that the man was a punk 35 years ago.  You must be really good!

                  1. hard sun profile image90
                    hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                    He's a punk now is what I said. But, generally, once a punk always a punk..I think it's a genetic trait. Yes. that's my opinion also. It doesn't take that good to see through snivels who likes beer, the yearbook, etc. Like I said, an educated opinion. Is Brett your old drinking buddy or what?

  6. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    Interesting that not many here wonder about a fifteen year old girl and HER judgement of going to any kind of drinking parties ?  1965 75 or  85 ,  there are always two people who're at these parties , boys and girls  and all of the drinking and sexual games that go with them ,  for all we know Prof. Ford is a" jilted ex-lover "with a guilty conscience about her promiscuous years .

    1. PrettyPanther profile image88
      PrettyPantherposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

      What took you so long? My money was on wilderness being the first to blame the girl, but you were my second choice.

      I've been on these forums too long.

      1. hard sun profile image90
        hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        Yeah...wow. I'm not Mr PC but implying  a 15 year old girl deserved it or is lying cause she went to a party? Something else.

      2. wilderness profile image96
        wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        Wow.  I'd have to say you are right.

        You've been on these forums too long.  That's really hurtful and when you've reached the point of posting intentionally hurtful crap you've been on here too long.

  7. paradigmsearch profile image88
    paradigmsearchposted 6 weeks ago

    I mean seriously, we count, who cares?

  8. paradigmsearch profile image88
    paradigmsearchposted 6 weeks ago

    Negate.

  9. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    https://hubstatic.com/14229887.png

    The Economist .

  10. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    https://hubstatic.com/14230144.png

    Fact not emoting , This is what The Economist thinks of the collective Kavanagh haters .

    1. hard sun profile image90
      hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

      This is not fact unless you're stating that it's a fact that this is The Economist's conglomeration of an aggregate of  opinions that it assembled, on the probability of  whether Kavanaugh will be affirmed. The chart is  a survey of opinions.

      That's all that can be said right now about the confirmation ...opinion, not fact, since he hasn't been affirmed. It's likely that many of these opinions have much of their basis in "emoting" since none of us have anywhere near all the facts.

      My opinion is he likely will be affirmed. Just like I offered my assessment that he's a punk. It's all opinion.

      You offered a good argument for including intuition in a decision.

      1. peoplepower73 profile image93
        peoplepower73posted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        Ed and Wilderness:  Many decisions throughout the ages have been based on wisdom driven by intuition.  You guys call it opinion based on emotion. It is also called gut feelings.

        Most decisions are based on not having all the facts and involve a degree of intuition or gut feeling.  You make a choice and you make adjustments along the way to support your decision if things don't go as expected.

        Trump made a decision to select Kavanaugh.  Is it the right one?  Who knows?  Kavanaugh did state that he would allow Trump to be pardoned if he were impeached. Don't you think that factors into Trump's decision to select him?

        I believe Kavanaugh acted like a punk in his teenage years based on his yearbook entries and his calendar.  I also believe he lied under oath as to the meanings of many of the entries.  If that is the case and the FBI comes to the same determination, I believe things will not bode well for him as he made those statements under oath. 

        We shall see how this plays out.  My gut feeling is Trump will walk him through to become our next supreme court justice, no matter what the outcome from the FBI.

        1. wilderness profile image96
          wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

          Disagree.  First, I see "intuition" as experience that cannot be readily put into words.  Hidden deep within memory it is there but is not something that can be pulled out and be easily verbalized.  It often isn't even used consciously.

          Hard Sun, on the other hand, has (my intuition tells me big_smile) gone into this with a predermination that Kavanaugh is not fit to sit on the court.  I believe he would hold that opinion if neither Kavanaugh nor Ford had ever said a single word, including her allegations.  An opinion based on idiotic media reports that he will kill people, end abortion and grant a pardon to Trump if he is ever impeached.  One based on Kavanaugh being recommended by Trump and one of those nasty Republicans to boot  He even says so (with regard to recommendation by Trump)..  A different matter completely.

          1. hard sun profile image90
            hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

            Well, I'm glad you expressed yourself. Maybe you'll learn someday how intuition and data go together to form opinions...most people have them. Mine is just better than your "idiotic" biases. The world will move forward after, or before, the old folks die off either way.

            Kananaugh is a punk..I didn't see the same for Gorsuch, another Trump nominee...you failed to quote me on that...though I'm flattered at your attempts to reconstruct my thinking.

            1. Live to Learn profile image79
              Live to Learnposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

              I wish someone could offer evidence. Hard evidence. This character assassination from nothing more than opinions looks more like vicious gossip run amok than clear judgment.

              1. hard sun profile image90
                hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                I call it how I see it...and the evidence is mounting..we'll see if Donny allows the "biased" FBI that helped win the election for him to do their jobs...that would help.

                Also where were you when statements like these were made " for all we know Prof. Ford is a" jilted ex-lover "with a guilty conscience about her promiscuous years."

                Trump is President...the king of viscous gossip, pussy grabbing, clownish behavior, all bets are off..this is what Trump voters invited...the Dems are playing hardball now and the R's don't like it.

                1. wilderness profile image96
                  wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                  "Also where were you when statements like these were made " for all we know Prof. Ford is a" jilted ex-lover "with a guilty conscience about her promiscuous years."

                  While technically true (it IS possible, just like Saturn being made of green cheese is) I haven't seen anyone make that foolish statement.  The equivalent about Kavanaugh, yes, but never about Ford; I assume one doesn't do that to a lady in tears, only men with emotions.

                  What forums do you frequent where such accusations are made about Ford?  The ones with Democrats crawling through the mud looking for that "hardball"?

                  1. IslandBites profile image87
                    IslandBitesposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                    hmm

                  2. hard sun profile image90
                    hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                    OK..since IslandBites rererence seems to be lost. The quote came from here and you even commented on it as though you were offended by it.

                    ED FISHER WROTE:
                    Interesting that not many here wonder about a fifteen year old girl and HER judgement of going to any kind of drinking parties ?  1965 75 or  85 ,  there are always two people who're at these parties , boys and girls  and all of the drinking and sexual games that go with them ,  for all we know Prof. Ford is a" jilted ex-lover "with a guilty conscience about her promiscuous years .

                    Is Saturn really made of cheese?

                2. Live to Learn profile image79
                  Live to Learnposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                  I don't see mounting evidence. I welcome evidence but I won't pretend it exists.

  11. hard sun profile image90
    hard sunposted 6 weeks ago

    My gut feeling about Kavanuagh is also likely affected by what I know about Trump. But, I don't get the same punk feelings toward Gorsuch. He seems composed and more intelligent than Kavanaugh. Probably making him more dangerous.

    Kavanaugh stating how much he liked beer, parties, etc. but didn't and doesn't have a drinking problem is also clearly a lie IMO. I did explain a bit about why I came to my punk conclusions earlier but this was all lost in the outrage over my having the nerve to call it like I see it.

    Ultimately, everyone's opinion on this matter right now have more to do with gut and intuition than anything.

  12. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    Gut feelings , emoting politics , ideological  paralysis , the politics of punkism , call it anything you wish , What is likely to happen is that Kavanaugh will be confirmed .     The SCOTUS will be complete ,  Too many good characters are assassinated in the left's #Metoo "stake burning" challenge and that's all it is given the hypocrisy of the left .

    On one hand with the history of the Clintons it was always "show us the evidence " , "Prove it " ...........we can't have it both ways people; there is either a rule of law or we are all lawless ,  its the same with Trump and Kavanaugh , What ? All of a sudden there is a conscience on the left  ?

    Please .......  No one here could likely stand an FBI background check and  THEN pass 6 of them , I know that .

    1. peoplepower73 profile image93
      peoplepower73posted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

      Ed:  You can thank your buddy Chuck Grassley for making it a hearing instead of a trial.  The hearing carries no weight.  As I said in the beginning it is and was a dog and pony show.  The same goes for the FBI investigation. 

      I don't believe the rule of law or the presumption of innocence applies to either one of them.  Trump wants this to be a cakewalk for Kavanaugh and it will be, no matter where the real truth is.

  13. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    Peoplepower , And where exactly is the truth my friend ? That is the larger question , you are correct though- it is a dog and pony show .  Ringling Bros. couldn't have brought on more entertainment. FBI background check # 7 ?  Oswald didn't get that many after JFK .

  14. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    Gut feeling is the first and most obvious place emoting begins .
    My head says , the Kavanaugh opposition is all emotion and no thought . Period .

  15. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    Besides we're waiting for anything resembling a dress with DNA on it so we can say ,
    " It depends on what the definition of is , is ."

    Sorry Bill .

    And yes , That's how ridiculous this charge is .

  16. hard sun profile image90
    hard sunposted 6 weeks ago

    I love beer. I don't pass out, I fall asleep. Snivel.

  17. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    I once did jury duty and in spite of all the evidence  , the defendant was found not guilty on multiple assault charges by hung jury  ,    As jury foreman I asked the one juror why she found him not guilty , and she replied "I just had a feeling he was innocent ".   I asked  "Well what about all the evidence ,the defendant's admission , photos ,  police reports ,  testimony ,fresh  scars , etc.......?"

    She replied ," I just had a gut feeling about it ", then  I remember she was a divorcee of a state trooper . 

    I replied " I understand  "

    Gut Feelings.

    1. hard sun profile image90
      hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

      Nice anecdote.  I think there's a much more involved discussion and definition of gut instinct that you chose to ignore. At this point, we are kind of into meaningless conversation territory.

  18. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    You 'll have to excuse those of us that believe in evidence and not emotion in the rule of law ,   In the corporate and political world we've  known since about 1960  that sex between men and women and its power struggles have infested any sense of decency  .

    So NOW #Metoo want's the mature men and women of today to roll back our consciences  to the Victorian days  and "hold Kavanaugh's feet to those fires ?"   Please !.........
    Next thing we know the Jersey Girls or the Kardashians or maybe Lady Ga Ga will be confirming  SCOTUS nominees .

    1. hard sun profile image90
      hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

      Do you have a form of Tourette's that applies to keyboards? It's cool, I'm not poking fun if you do. I just think it's something that maybe we should be aware of.

  19. Ed Fisher profile image61
    Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

    Hard sun , In the real world and in real world trials in the court of LAW justice system and not your media Dear Abbey generated gossip trials and so the sentencing by popular opinion ; hard questions like mine would be asked and rightfully so .   

    It's called Due Process , look it up sometime ,

    And you are college educated , right ?

    1. Ed Fisher profile image61
      Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

      Talk about "redacted ".

      Having watched Ford's almost entire testimony , I was amazed at how much of her memory was seemingly "redacted " , can't remember people ,where the party was , where the house was , who's house it was ,  how she got there , how she got home ,what date it was ,   if she told anyone then ,  if , if , if , if ..........
      But that didn't seem to account for her ideological supporters standing fast behind her . 

      Incidents of trauma alone do not dictate whether one has a complete memory of these incidents in general ,    Often times in fact , people have extremely detailed memories of trauma , Although a woman's emotional  ploys  can seem believable , I see Prof. Ford  as being a sacrificial lamb to an ideological agenda . There are too many people willing to sacrifice themselves  for the Trump resistance .

    2. Ed Fisher profile image61
      Ed Fisherposted 6 weeks ago

      Also you guys need to go read the just released prosecutors report to the senate committee on Prof. Fords testimony and letter ! Released today saying-------- "........ Prof. Ford  does not meet the preponderance of evidence for ANY charges ............."

      1. hard sun profile image90
        hard sunposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        He's not on trial, he's under consideration for Supreme Court...I thought we had got that through to you. Besides, while he may be innocent, you think this isn't what the prosecutor was hired to do?

        "Mitchell, whom GOP senators selected to handle the questioning in last week’s hearing with Ford and Kavanaugh, is a registered Republican who is chief of the special victims division of the Maricopa County attorney’s office in Phoenix. Although she asked Ford all of the questions posed by Republican senators, she asked Kavanaugh only two rounds of questions until GOP senators began speaking again. "

        1. wilderness profile image96
          wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

          Republicans asked reasonable questions of Ford, designed to elicit truth of what happened.

          Democratic questions of Kavanaugh were limited to repeatedly asking "why won't you help us subvert the will of the committee and delay proceedings until we have the political power to deny your confirmation?"

          A reasonable conclusion by reasonable people might be that Democrats found Kavanaugh innocent of the charges against him.  Yes?

    3. hard sun profile image90
      hard sunposted 6 weeks ago

      https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar … gh/571915/

      Jeff Flake: ‘We Can’t Have That on the Court’
      The Arizona senator called Brett Kavanaugh’s interactions with lawmakers at a hearing last week “sharp and partisan.”

      Ha ha...SC members should be above this no matter what they are faced with. I could of handled myself better than Kavanaugh, and that's not saying much. I think Merrick Garland should be the next SC member.

    4. peoplepower73 profile image93
      peoplepower73posted 6 weeks ago

      Wilderness:  Oh really, that's why Trump loves to counter-punch as he calls it.  That's why he loves to call the legitimate press the fake news and insult their reporters without any provocation in front of the whole world. 

      In my estimation he is a poor role model for our young people.  So therefore by your statement, he and only he is totally responsible for his poor behavior as the president of the United States of America.

      He has the right to do and say anything he wants, but by the same token, he has a responsibility to respect the office of the president.  He is only harming himself in front of the world when he lashes out at people who are asking legitimate questions.

      https://mashable.com/article/trump-repo … XIHjmhSZqW

      1. wilderness profile image96
        wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

        "Oh really, that's why Trump loves to counter-punch as he calls it."

        Not sure where or how you're getting this "why" from anything I said.

        But I WILL say that yes, Trump and Trump alone is responsible for his comments (although he could be getting false information, but doubt that's what you're speaking of).

        And I will say that his is not a good role model for young children (where Kavanaugh, from little we have seen, is) any more than idiot performers and sports figures are.  This is nothing new - few of the "role models" children adore ARE good ones.

        I think Trump badly needs a clamp on his mouth.  I also think his actions (most of them) almost completely overrides any damage is silly tweets and such do.  "Actions" being actions taken in guiding the country, such as banning travel from countries that do not vet, slowing illegal alien entry, trade agreements, etc.

        Does that make you feel better?

        1. peoplepower73 profile image93
          peoplepower73posted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

          Wilderness:  I don't like the idea of having a sociopathic (my opinion), chronic liar as president.  Regardless of his supposedly great actions.  I believe that sooner or later his lies will catch up with him; and when they do, it is not going to be good for our country.

          The real problem is, in his mind, he has somehow convinced himself of thinking he is not lying. From all that I have read, that is a symptom of a sociopath.

          1. wilderness profile image96
            wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

            And you are welcome to your opinion.  If you're going to call him a sociopath I would suggest something more than "From all that I have read, that is a symptom of a sociopath." though - an actual diagnosis from a trained psychologist following an actual examination would be nice.  I understand it is only your opinion, but applying ugly labels to people without anything to back it up should thus be kept to yourself until you can supply something more than that.  IMO.

            1. peoplepower73 profile image93
              peoplepower73posted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

              Wilderness:  I can back it up and I've done it before. It is just a matter of you accepting it, which I know you wont. Trump's behavior fits a large part of this profile.  By the way, I feel we are just killing time now until we hear from the FBI investigation.

              https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-con … c-20353928

              1. wilderness profile image96
                wildernessposted 6 weeks agoin reply to this

                Great!  Link, please, to a trained, qualified psychologist or psychiatrist that has done a personal interview (and preferably treatment) with the conclusion he is a sociopath.  I await your "backup".

                And you're right - I won't accept a conclusion from some quack looking at a faux TV persona and making a public diagnosis of a perceived medical condition.

                Yes, we're spinning our wheels, waiting.  Except for attempting to teach that unsupported claims are worthless and name calling is not a reasonable method of supplying evidence.

     
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