The Democrats held a glad-handing press conference today and presented Articles of Impeachment to the American public....the American public responded with a resounding and hearty laugh. Where is the so called quid-pro-quo charge, or bribery, or extortion, or pay for play, or any of the other bogus charges they tried to make stick. Obstruction of Congress isn't an impeachable offense - the Executive and Legislative are EQUAL branches of government - Congress doesn't have a superior status over the office of the President. Abuse of Power is vague and doesn't say anything substantial (can't wait until the Senate get's their turn).
The Democrats are rushing this through in hopes that their global money-laundering schemes aren't exposed (which they will be). The FISA abuses are already spreading like wildfire and there is no amount of damage control the left can muster to stop what's coming next. Impeachment is nothing more than a diversion for the left - they've destroyed the subpoena power of Congress, made themselves look like fools, and have ZERO chance of removing Trump from office.
I agree with you. It is a shame the country has to put through this experience. The left is violent. I worry what will happen when he is elected to a second term.
Do the Democrats are doing to themselves? This damage is going to last for many years.
Apparently you guys are okay with a future POTUS--perhaps a democrat--with no oversight by Congress to check his abuse of power?
Either of you would have $#!t a brick if a Dem defied all oversight.
I agree with one thing said, it's a shame our country has to go through this, but this POS needs to go.
I think it unlikely you are able to speak on behalf of all of the American public.
What impressed me about the impeachment articles is the fact that the Democrats have resisted taking a shotgun approach. There are many things that could have been included. Mueller practically invited Congress to impeach on obstruction in relation to the attempt to get him fired etc, but the Democrats have kept it simple.
I think this is part of a strategy to ensure the case can be made to the public, regardless of what the Republican controlled Senate does (it will almost certainly find Trump not guilty).
A complex case with lots of articles and sub-articles would have made the case difficult to follow. Instead we have (paraphrasing): 1) Trump abused the authority of the presidency by seeking help with the election, from a foreign country; 2) Trump obstructed Congress from investigating that issue and tried to avoid accountability. Those are things most people (including those who don't usually pay attention to politics) can get relate to. They're easy to explain.
E.g. the Constitution only allows Congress to deal with the misconduct of a sitting president. By refusing to allow Congress to investigate a serious allegation against him, Trump has effectively made himself above the law. That's bad because it would mean the US is effectively no longer a democracy, but more like a dictatorship. The message: no one should be above the law, is an easy one to understand and deliver to the public. So I can see why the Democrats may have taken this route, and I think it makes sense.
Me, too, although it pains me that they have taken his obstruction lying down. You put it eloquently, so I have nothing to add. I've been to the Soviet Union, so I know what it's like to have to watch one's Ps and Qs under a dictatorship. Ten days of fear were enough for me. In fact our whole group were ready to get out of there and go home. Americans are so naive. They don't know what they could be facing if something isn't done with this Putin A**kisser.
That's it, Miz. They have no clue where letting this cretin get away with this crap will lead to. To put it delicately..
'I went to Russia for 10 days... oh, it was so scary … Americans have no clue.'
You have no clue... 10 days... what a joke.
Anyone still pushing the Russian conspiracy is lost, totally out of touch with reality or worse.
And this makes you found, totally in touch with reality or better?
I'll have to say, that is deep for you, Ken.
I'd like to see how long a few of these "deep-thinking" Trumpers would last under those circumstances, Randy. These people actually believe that they could go to Russia and act like Trump does here. Like I said their ilk would be the first to wet their pants, or worse.
Delusion is right, you don't bully the KGB, and you can't run to our government to get you out. It takes years of negotiations and it is expensive.
That's because you hate Trump, Miz. That's the line the right is pushing now. It's not because he's a lying POS, it's because you hate him for being so honest.
Yes, Randy, it is obvious we are filled with crazed, irrational hate for no reason other than he's a Republican and he won the election. I mean, who wouldn't love President Trump? His integrity, kindness, unmatched intellect, his sincere desire to bring Americans together. And that big, beautiful wall! My God, one would have to be insane to not support such a wonderful man.
uhmmm . . . As one that also can't pull off decent sarcasm, yours is as bad as mine. You should try another tact.
Lol, you don't think it played well, huh?
We have to face facts PrettyPanther, neither of us can do sarcasm well.
But, we can take some solace from the fact, (at least as I see it), that very few of the others, (here), have done it very well either.
There should be a rule: If you haven't published and sold more than Twain, or if you can't trace your lineage to Nietzsche, then it should be illegal for you to try sarcasm. ;-)
Hey, GA, I thought her sarcasm was pretty good, but I guess a Republican wouldn't appreciate it.
Oh damn, now you are just encouraging her. I will ask the next Republican I see what they think of it, but I am not optimistic.
Ha! GA just wanted someone to share his uh poor sarcasm skills. ;-) I don't mind.
Their ilk? So trite. So typical of left wing desire to insult in order to pretend you have a valid point.
Who's pretending? You chose and support the most insulting arrogant POTUS in history but you don't like anyone insulting his followers? BWAHAHA! I haven't heard anyone from your ilk say they want their children or grandchildren to be like him when they grow up, or even now for that matter.
But you can prove me wrong by stating you want yours to emulate his behavior. I'll be waiting...
Oh, Randy, I don't think it does any good to try to explain to Trump or his supporters because they only understand 8th grade level or lower. I guess I'll have to go back to my newspaper journalism training and try to keep my posts on that level. "Ilk" just means "kind", "sort", or "type." It wasn't meant as an insult. If she doesn't have enough sense to know what the word means, let her stew. But thanks, anyway.
LTL, You just showed your lack of knowledge of the English language, but I guess that's typical of a Trump supporter. Use of the word "ilk" is not an insult nor was it intended to be. It means "of that kind" or "of that type." This is what Merriam Webster has to say:
"Centuries ago a misunderstanding arose concerning the Scots phrase: it was interpreted as meaning "of that kind or sort," a usage that found its way into modern English. Ilk has been established in English with its current meaning and part of speech since the late 18th century."
I understand the English language. In response I'll state it is typical of a leftist to use terminology not infrequently used in a derogatory manner and then feign surprise that it was taken as such.
So you laugh at me, Ken, when I try to warn people what it is like to live under the KGB. The only reason that one of our party wasn't arrested by the KGB for violating a minor rule, that of using American money to buy something from a local merchant instead of Russian money, was because he'd been bribing the hotel guards with cigars (this was in 1989 when that worked) You would probably be the first to wet your pants in fear. You certainly would not be expressing opinions contrary to those sanctioned by the government. They would take that swagger from you in an instant.
Yes I do laugh, not meaning to be mean spirited, but that limited amount of exposure to a foreign nation is just that... limited, in scope and depth.
MIZBejabbers I spent many years in foreign lands and hostile situations.
Your lack of experience, and then trying to condemn me for pointing it out, I would find offensive actually, but I realize you have no idea as to the amount of time I spent overseas, or my experiences.
I'd trade ONE HOUR of my worst day in Somalia for your 10 days in Russia.
In reality, the beliefs you have and the candidates you so dearly defend are the ones that were determined to bring the reality to us that you feared, a police state like the U.S.S.R.... your lack of truly knowing what is out there in the world, who was directing our government and what their goals were, and how truly frightening it all can be, makes you incapable of seeing the true threat.
Trump isn't the threat... he is, to my surprise, successfully dismantling it... Brenan, Comey, etc. were the real threat. Clinton was a true psychotic individual that many feared, from the Secret Service that defended her to the Generals and Ambassadors that had to follow her directives.
We averted, to my amazement still, what would have brought America into an existence that would have greatly resembled if not the U.S.S.R. than China's C.P. State today.
The articles certainly do not come close to what the Dem's claimed he did? This was all a political move, and it has backfired... Sad we the people have to put up with this kind of governing. The Dems knew as well as the Rep this was going nowhere. Yes, the laughter is deafening. And it's clear we should not be laughing but crying that we have this kind of cheap politicking, and some actually buy into it.
You'll be crying soon enough if Bolton and others are allowed to testify in the Senate, Shar. I'll wager you're hoping they don't get to, right?
Hello? Sharlee........what's your response?
I hope to see a trial, not sure why you would think I wouldn't? I do realize the president will use is his privilege. That would be expected. The Dems should have realized this and just come up with some facts before coming up with articles of impeachment
I have stated several times on HP threads that I feel this impeachment should go to trial. I think it's to put the cat back in the bag... It's time we have a look at the Dem's allegations as well as Trump's allegations against the Biden's. Hopefully, it goes to trial, and we can put all of this behind us, one way or the other.
It won't be much of a trial according to Mitch this morning. They don't want any fact witnesses to testify, just as I predicted. They're are terrified of just what Bolton will say, not to mention the other witnesses in the know about the extortion attempt.
According to the House Rules, the Party in charge gets to decide how the inquiries are to be handled....which they did with plenty of people on the Republican side upset that they couldn't have leaker Ciaremella on the stand or members of Adam Schiff's staff that met with leaker and others to plan this illegal coup...now the shoe is on the other foot. Your side had their turn and failed miserably to show America that they had an impeachable offense. Now the GOP gets to tell their side of the story. My gut tells me that the Democrats are the ones terrified at having so many of their illegal activities exposed and then there is that Hunter Biden thing and all the children of Democrats getting these high-paying foreign jobs.....
It ain't gonna happen. Mitch has already said "no witnesses". There'll be a quick vote and nothing else. It looks like Mitch is going to prevent even his side from telling "its" truth.
I will hold on to hope that the Senate will see the only way to satisfy all the American people is to conduct a trial. Yes, It does look as if you are correct. Today is a sad, a frighting day, to see what is going on in the "Peoples House". A trial would certainly work to heal the Country. One way or the other... I hope we both get a surprise.
I doubt it. The only thing that will "heal" the lift is impeachment...and that isn't going to do much for those that voted Trump into office and likes the results of his presidency. We already see, right here in the HP forums, more than a few that are decrying the trial because of the expected verdict, that hasn't even happened yet.
Would you like to hear from Bolton and others with inside knowledge, along with the pertinent documents, in the Senate trial, Dan? Or are you afraid of what these witnesses will say and the documents indicate?
I disagree with you (you're surprised I'm sure) about the healing of the country. A full trial would do much to dispel the false claims on either side of the aisle as nothing else could.
*shrug* If he was exonerated in a trial the left would cry "FOUL!" If he was convicted the right would cry "FOUL!"
I don't see any healing going on in either case.
Try responding to the first paragraph now. I'd like to see your answer.
We've already heard one "witness" admit that she witnessed nothing at all. Would you care to hear the rest of them say the same thing, given that they tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth? Your "insider documents" are just more flak, without a hint of truth in them.
You're afraid to hear them testify, and yes it would help Trump if they said the same, wouldn't it?
If the witnesses and documents would clear Trump, he'd have already furnished them and this would be over. People on your side claim he's simply fighting for the rights of future presidents and against corruption. What a load, especially for this guy.
I have my opinion on how a trial might turn out. I can not see the Dem's having any further facts to present at trial. Not sure if anyone has considered Trump could call Mulvany and Bolton, I don't feel there is anything they could add to change the facts, there are no facts. I truly think Trump would love a trial, he will most likely after seeing what went down today be screaming for a trial. He has a rally here in Michigan this evening, I think he will start talking about the need for a trial. I am just not sure why the Dems continue to fall into the exact spot he wants them, in a bull's eye...
I am not sure if a president could demand a trial and override the Majority Leader of the United States Senate?
I have never in all my years been so ashamed of the Congress as I am today. This kind of governing should not be accepted by anyone. Such hate such corruption.
Are you serious, Shar? You don't believe Bolton and Pompeo knew anything about this "drug deal" as Bolton termed it? Why do you think he resigned right after he found out what Rudy and Trump had going on?
This wasn't part of US policy to hold up the approved funding , and simply a ploy on Rudy and Trump's part.
I'm astonished at those on the Right who have no curiosity to hear evidence from the very people who know the details.
Astonished.....but not surprised as I predicted this reaction from the Trumpsters.
You do realize Trump could call Mulvany and Bolton, and many others as witnesses. I would lo to see them called as witnesses. As I have said we need a trial. You must also understand Congress cold push it in court all the way to the Supreme Court to make an attempt to have Trump's executive privilege waved. They did not go that route, I would think because they knew the Constitution would protect his rights.
This is a muddled mess, I have been trying to put forth, there is no winner here... The impeachment has widened the divide, made Trump supporters dig in, and make many citizens mad because of the waste of time and money. We all knew the outcome, so we have to just move on to the next kind of crazy to argue about. Come on, we all knew... Fair to us, no, but that's politics.
That's not laughter you are hearing. That's the deafening roar of demands for impeachment that has taken to the streets.
Here are people rioting in the streets against their President
They have been at it for a year.
The President is Macron, France's arrogant elitist leader.
Here are the Americans taking to the streets:
I know I am going off subject... However, I am watching the Trump Rally live, he is not on stage as of yet. But, I thought some might get a kick out of this. His choice for pre-show music, the Village Peoples Macho Man --- and Frank Sinatra'sI Did It My Way -- followed up by Neil Young's Rockin The In Free World. I have a feeling this is going to be a rally that will "burn the house down". History is being made in "Our House". Got a feeling Trump is going to come out shooting. Just saying. LOL
Shar, there's no doubt he'll come out "shooting".....off his mouth, of course. Thank goodness he's been impeached. Perhaps now he'll learn what he didn't after the Mueller Report.
The rally is going to come in November 2020.
The Democrats have decided the 2020 election, which I am not happy about, I was hoping for an actual choice for all Americans between people looking forward.... perhaps Yang even.
Instead we will have a corrupt establishment front-man in Biden who is already into his first stages of senility offering nothing but past lies, like the ACA will allow you to keep your doctors and save you money.
Its a shame, but I am hopeful because as I read pieces in today's news from moderate sources, you could see the condemnation for this act bubbling up already, here are some excerpts from a WSJ opine that resembles my thoughts:
House Democrats voted Wednesday evening to impeach Donald Trump but, media high-fives aside, what have they accomplished? They have failed to persuade the country; they have set a new, low standard for impeaching a President; Mr. Trump will be acquitted in the Senate; and Democrats may have helped Mr. Trump win re-election. Congratulations to The Resistance.
The impeachment press will deride the GOP as either afraid of Donald Trump or moral sellouts. But note that even the 20 GOP Members who are retiring from the House and not running for another office voted against impeachment. GOP Members like Peter King (N.Y.), Jim Sensenbrenner (Wis.) and Will Hurd (Texas) have been unafraid to break with party leaders or Presidents in the past.
The problem isn’t GOP consciences, it’s the weak and dishonest Democratic case for impeachment. One issue is the unfair House process. Democrats refused GOP witness requests in the Intelligence Committee, denied the GOP a hearing day in the Judiciary Committee, and rushed the impeachment debate and vote. They claim impeachment is a serious, solemn moment but then sprinted to judgment.
On the substance, Democrats have taken an episode of Mr. Trump’s reckless foreign-policy judgment and distorted it into broad claims of bribery and extortion. The evidence of weakness is that their own articles of impeachment include no allegations of specific crimes.
Democrats are impeaching Mr. Trump not for Ukraine, but because they believe he is simply unfit to be President. Democratic Rep. Adam Schiff has been explicit in justifying impeachment to prevent Mr. Trump from being able to “cheat in one more election” in 2020—a pre-emptive impeachment.
Where is that in the Constitution?
Chuck Schumer, the Senate Minority Leader, is demanding to hear from witnesses like John Bolton whom the House refused to subpoena. Mr. Schumer wants to feed the impeachment maelstrom as well as prevent Republicans from calling Hunter or Joe Biden. The GOP is under no obligation to play along and, based on the House evidence, Senators are justified in voting to acquit without hearing anyone.
As for the politics, Mr. Trump is now likely to be the first impeached President to run for re-election. Democrats clearly hope the Scarlet “I” will work against him, but Mr. Trump will tout the partisan vote as illegitimate and his Senate acquittal as vindication. He will also argue that Democrats and the media never accepted his 2016 victory and tried to overrule the verdict of voters. He will be right.
You know when Saturday Night Live starts running skits showing the democrats as a bunch of bullies that the left has seriously misstepped.
I was not before this impeachment business, but am now a Trump supporter. He behaved like a jerk, but he is not what the Left claims him to be. Jerks make good business decicions for America. I do want a kid with his personality (though I have one) but I welcome kids with his confifence and spirit.
Correction: I DO NOT want kids with his personality. I love the one that I have. Living with that ego is a challenge. I will NOT pretend I enjoy it. I endure it.
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