Another disgruntled employee

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   IslandBitesposted 4 years ago

   How many more? But you, Trump supporters, surely know better.
   
   I spent over 300 mornings in the Oval Office briefing the president and his senior staff. I had the privilege to manage, edit and deliver the president’s Daily Brief a summary of the most timely and critical intelligence threats to the U.S. from 2010 to 2014.
   
   ----
   
   Since I have been eligible to vote, I have never registered with a political party. I remain an independent with a history of voting for candidates I believe in — I focused on their policy and not their party. Before this election, I have never spoken out for or against a candidate for any office.
   
   But I can be silent no longer.
   
   ----
   
   I know what it takes to succeed at the highest levels of our government — intellectual curiosity, the strength of moral purpose and a commitment to selfless service. Broadly speaking, I can personally attest that Americans were very well served by those they elected to fill critical national security positions.
   
   There is one important exception to that statement — our current president.
   
   ----
   
   And as damaging as his faulty leadership has been, four more years would be devastating.
   
   We must elect a thoughtful, moral, responsible, respectful leader on Nov. 3. Our current president is not that leader.
   
   READ what someone that do know Trump thinks about him
   
   Robert Cardillo retired as the director of the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency after 36 years of public service

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      GA Andersonposted 4 years agoin reply to this

      Your link makes some serious charges, and they are charges we have heard from multiple sources. I know your title was a bit of playful sarcasm, and I don't automatically dismiss the claims as those of a disgruntled employee. I think there is substance to Cardillo's opinion piece and I can understand why it makes perfect sense to anti-Trump folks.
      
      But, and not as an argument against Cardillo's opinion, check out a link Mike provided in another thread. It is also an opinion piece, but it is pro-Trump. I think you will see some understanding of why so many hold a different perspective.
      
      Letter to the Editor: Theory on Trump
      
      Here is a carrot; this is the closing paragraph:
      
      "So, say anything you want about this president - I get it - he can be vulgar, he can be crude, he can be undignified at times. I don't care. I can't spare this man. He fights for America!"
      
      GA

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         Credence2posted 4 years agoin reply to this

         "So, say anything you want about this president - I get it - he can be vulgar, he can be crude, he can be undignified at times. I don't care. I can't spare this man. He fights for America!"
         
         
         That was what Lincoln said to Mary Todd in response to her claims that Grant was a butcher on the battlefield raking up unacceptable casualties.
         
         Lincoln's answer was more than appropriate during wartime and the prosecution of a war, but trying to compare that statement and US Grant in regards to a man like Trump is like comparing a turd with a diamond tiara.
         
         Conservatives actually think that they gain traction with absurd analogies like this?
         
         Trump fights only for himself, that is pretty transparent to me why are others virtually blind in not seeing this?

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            PrettyPantherposted 4 years agoin reply to this

            How anyone can look at Donald Trump's life and conclude otherwise is beyond my comprehension. I understand that many of his supporters have neither the interest nor the ability to properly study and evaluate his life. It's those who do have the ability and choose to ignore the obvious that keep me up at night. You know, the ones who keep finding ways to give him the benefit of the doubt while acknowledging he is a horrible man who has done horrible things. Watching this is like being given a master class in how authoritarians grab power from the people,

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               Credence2posted 4 years agoin reply to this

               Well, Panther, that is the $64,000 question. In the face of the absurb, what is REALLY behind his support and what drives his supporters to back someone who would be the laughtrack for any sitcom?
               
               I think the true answer would be one that people just as soon not acknowledge.

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                  PrettyPantherposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                  I know exactly what you're talking about.

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               GA Andersonposted 4 years agoin reply to this

               That is your perspective. The point of my original comment was to offer a comparison of explanations for understanding 'other' perspectives.
               
               And I bet that the folks with perspectives that agree with the opinion of Mike's link also think that after three and one-half years of relentless attacks and accusations, and lies, find it easy to give him the benefit of the doubt.
               
               Consider the proof in the pudding—right here on these forums. With all of the obvious and incontrovertible stuff that Trump hands and daily and "Tweetly" why do the anti-Trump folks still present hyperbole and unsupportable claims? They, (the anti-Trumpers), are then  pulling a Trump and handing their opposition, (the pro-Trumpers), the same credibility challenges.
               
               GA

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                  PrettyPantherposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                  Human nature. It was no different with Obama and Bush. From my perspective, the use of hyperbole from supporters and detractors has not changed from presidency to presidency. What has changed is the level of dysfunction tolerated (actually, not just tolerated but cheered) by Trump supporters. If any other previous president had behaved like Trump, they would have been long gone.
                  
                  Surely, you have not forgotten the hyperbole leveled at Obama? At Bush? The difference now is how truly disgusting Trump is as a human being and as a president.

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                  Ken Burgessposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                  I think it is beyond that however, there are two extremes, but while one is rightly vilified by our society (White Supremacy, KKK) another is heralded as the heroes (BLM, Marxism).
                  
                  And to extrapolate that problem and perception, we have people like Rayshard Brooks and Jacob Blake that had been arrested in their past for committing acts of violence, who resist arrest, fight the police, being labeled as heroes or made into martyrs.
                  
                  As was stated in this video (below), which details very well the problems which are more pronounced today, five years ago, there is no one willing to listen to the other side, there is no desire to compromise.
                  
                  The issue here... is that this battle is NOT one of the Extreme Left vs the Extreme Right.
                  
                  This is a battle of the Extreme Left vs. all others, the moderates, the libertarians, the neutrals that want nothing to do with politics at all.
                  
                  This is a situation where the Social Media Platforms and the MSM News organizations (minus Fox) and the Democratic Party and extremist groups like BLM and many other 'non-profits' that push for radical agendas are unified in breaking this battle down to "you are either with us, or you are against us, there will be no neutral parties, there will be no compromise".
                  
                  And Americans need to wake up to this reality... before the Nation is consumed by it.
                  
                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8PGNSa_Irg

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            GA Andersonposted 4 years agoin reply to this

            Color me surprised. Never would I have expected such a reply from you. ;-0
            
            But, that was also my first thought, comparing Trump to Grant . . . However, when you read the piece it is obvious the only comparison being made is one of why either was able to remain in position.
            
            GA

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         IslandBitesposted 4 years agoin reply to this

         I get that many think so despite all the evidence against it. The problem is that he's not only vulgar, crude or undignified.
         
         This is what Cardillo, -a person that worked close to Trump- thinks about him, and what resumes what we (non Trump supporters) see as crystal-clear obvious:
         
         "Our current president bases his decisions on his instincts, and his instincts are based upon a personal value proposition — what’s in it for me?"

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         PrettyPantherposted 4 years agoin reply to this

         He doesn't fight for America. He fights for Donald Trump. Every time. In every situation. No matter the stakes.

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         PrettyPantherposted 4 years agoin reply to this

         How, exactly, is America better now compared to when Trump took office? Where has Trump's "fighting for America" gotten us now?

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            wildernessposted 4 years agoin reply to this

            It has many more miles of wall protecting our southern border...   It also has a Supreme Court making decisions based on law rather than what liberals want to see - that counts for quite a bit.

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               PrettyPantherposted 4 years agoin reply to this

               Is that your measure of this country?

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                  wildernessposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                  You asked what he had done for the country, not an opinion on the morality of protecting our borders from invaders.
                  
                  And yes, anything to prevent or even reduce, the amount of legislating from the bench is a major positive.  Believe it or not, we are, and should be, a nation of laws rather than depending on the personal morality and opinions of liberal judges.

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                     PrettyPantherposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                     What I meant with that question is: When asked to evaluate where we are now as a country versus where we were when Trump was elected, you mention the border wall and the Supreme Court appointments. Are those two items how you measure the "greatness" of this country?

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                        wildernessposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                        They certainly add to it.  That we encouraged, and even formed, a second class citizenry to do our grunt labor without having the rights of citizens was pathetic and wrong.  That we ignore our most basic set of laws in favor of political dogma is also absolutely wrong.
                        
                        So yes, that is a measure of our "greatness" that we are making an effort to change both.  There are others, of course, but I also recognize that anything that smacks of Trump will be denied as good or even happening, so won't continue the list any further.

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                           PrettyPantherposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                           We are so far apart on our notion of what makes a nation "great" we might as well be from different planets. It's sad, really.

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                              wildernessposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                              Yes it.  Sad, that is.  The liberal goal is to enslave the population to the whims of the aristocracy, the conservative is to create a self sufficient, self regulating, responsible citizenry needing a minimum of "oversight" from their laws.
                              
                              The two are indeed very far apart.

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                                 PrettyPantherposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                                 You are completely wrong  about "the liberal goal." That certainly isn't my goal but you are not truly interested in that. It's so much easier on you to pigeonhole us as outlandish and extreme, even if it's a lie.

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                                    wildernessposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                                    Of course it is.  Liberals have found that if they can just give enough money to people they will have formed a chain that is virtually unbreakable.  And the have proceeded to do just that whenever possible - rather than provide jobs they give money.  It will work 99 times out of a hundred, too.

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                                       PrettyPantherposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                                       You have built yourself quite the fantasy liberal there, wilderness.

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   IslandBitesposted 4 years ago

   Exactly. See, GA?

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      GA Andersonposted 4 years agoin reply to this

      I think your companion quote is just as descriptive: ""Our current president bases his decisions on his instincts, and his instincts are based upon a personal value proposition — what’s in it for me?""
      
      And to that point, someone that is satisfied with, or even enthusiastic about, his policy results, will see truth in the lead-up to that final blurb from Mike's link.
      
      With all the cross-aisle charges of idiot Trump supporters and socialist violent Leftist Liberals, I think the two compared links are a good showcase for the reasoning behind different perspectives.
      
      If the appreciated results benefit America, (one perspective), then what does it matter if his actions are self-motivated?
      
      If one side feels they are in a serious culture war, and the other side feels they are too, then war it will be. Both perspectives have valid points, but only one side shows any tolerance for a point from the other side:
      "So, say anything you want about this president - I get it - he can be vulgar, he can be crude, he can be undignified at times. I don't care. I can't spare this man. He fights for America!"
      
      GA

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         IslandBitesposted 4 years agoin reply to this

         Is that your example of tolerance? Im sure most non trumpist also think "say anything you want about this president - I get it - (make a long list)  I don't care."

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