Anger. Fear. Democracy. Voting. Connected?

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  1. tsmog profile image83
    tsmogposted 4 months ago

    An interesting article I read; How Fear and Anger Impact Democracy (May 21, 2019) brings some light on the OP title. It is an essay published in Items, Insights from the Social Sciences of the Social Science Research Council.

    The article in my view shares what we may have long suspected and lived validated by science. People’s fears and anger affect voting. It is about a ten-minute read, yet skimming you can stop here and there. There are graphics illustrating their points. You will see the following subheadings:

    https://items.ssrc.org/democracy-papers … democracy/

    ** What we have long believed

    ** What has long been hidden

    ** What fear and anger do

    ** Some evidence on what fear and anger actually do

    ** The different ramifications of fear and of anger

    The introduction states:

    “Observing the rise of right-wing extremism across the world has led many to a familiar and long-established explanation: fear fosters support for far-right parties and politicians. This explanation continues a long tradition in political thought and commentary that attributes a foundational role to fear. In this essay, I will use new thinking about emotion that draws on recent scholarship in neuroscience and empirical research on the role of emotion in political reasoning to argue that scholars need to distinguish between fear and anger as distinct negative reactions, each with different political consequences. The popular focus on fear has obscured the role anger plays in pushing voters to extreme positions when facing political threats. In order to respond effectively to political threats, we need to understand the different emotions that threats elicit among citizens. Moreover, the political system needs to take into account that fear and anger each identify different features of threats, and each requires different political remedies. Responding as if all threats provoke fear and only fear will leave democracies vulnerable because of their inattention to anger.

    So, what do you think? Thoughts?

    What are your feelings on fear and anger in your political life? Do those two have a different effect on your thinking about politics in general, your personal ideology, and finally voting?

    How much do you think fear and/or anger will drive voters to the 2024 polls? Will we see a new voter turnout record set come this 2024?

    Newton's Third Law: Action & Reaction - His third law states that for every action (force) in nature, there is an equal and opposite reaction. In that respect do you feel the fear and anger of one political interest is met by the reaction of another as in conservative vs. liberal?

    Is that law occurring with such rapid-fire today the reason for the great cavernous ravine between factions along with enormous turmoil occurring today; Democrats vs. Republicans, Liberal vs. Conservative, and perhaps metro vs. rural?

    We know the elite political minds running campaigns know what the article points out. How do you feel they take the opportunity to exercise its thematic relevance to gaining votes? Do you think they do it responsibly or is it simply a dog-eat-dog world?

    Should it be concerning to our leadership, today, how fear and anger are affecting our heralded Democracy here in the USA?

    [EDIT: Oops! It appears I did not have enough coffee earlier this morning. I forgot to post the link to the article. I inserted it.]

    1. Castlepaloma profile image76
      Castlepalomaposted 4 months agoin reply to this

      In my adult life , I've eliminated fear and anger and avoid voting helps.
      Anger leads to fear or inefficiency. Then greater to hate which can leads to possibilities of supporting murder. Murder being the top mental illness. When ever centroism divides people, they often join into us against them.  The positive emotional replacement for me, tops, is love, health, freedom, passion and so on. People suffer more from negative emotional than from emotional intelligence or mental intelligence. Exspeacilly in groups in an over ego world. I look at people as individuals first. Being honest and Live and let live is a great policy and humor helps.  Just look at Jew's and Muslims or right or left divided, I accept some of their ideas, just not their ever ending wars.

    2. Credence2 profile image79
      Credence2posted 4 months agoin reply to this

      My primary goal is too keep reactionaries and authoritarians out of office. It is instinctive for me to generally vote against conservative, Republican, rightwing oriented candidates. These people are generally the more problematic racists and race baiters and are Anti-Democratic more frequently and brazenly, not adhering to our rules of governance.

      I believe that 2024 will be a pivotal year where we either decide to concede to dictators and tyrannical candidates and beliefs or we fight to maintain democratic institutions encouraging the participation of all eligible voters, working incrementally to make it better.

      As in your example of Newton's Third Law, yes. Both sides will rush to the ballot box out of fear and distrust of the other in a way not seen in the past.

      Rural people are afraid of the trend that eventually will prove not in their favor and that their comforting and provincial world is disappearing. All of this includes  "traditional values" stuff, overbearing religion, comforting racism, etc. The capitalist class in the minority piggyback on this resentment of larger populations to reach their goal of less government, less regulation allowing them to act with no oversite, controlling others with impunity. Such, is the need to prevail as a shrinking minority in the face of inevitable change. That reality is partways why the divide between left and right, Democrat and Republican are so stark today.

      You get to people's root fears to draw them out. It is the stuff that is not PC, but they all gather at the sound of the dog whistle, but they forget that many for whom the intended decibel range was to remain inaudible, hear it all quite the same.

      It is the fear of tyrants and those that want to dispense with democracy that will guarantee my casting a ballot.

      1. tsmog profile image83
        tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

        Thanks, Cred. Noted!! No challenges or anything to add. What you said speaks volumes as I see it supported by your knowledge and experience in Life.

        1. savvydating profile image89
          savvydatingposted 3 months agoin reply to this

          tsmog, you’re a Democrat. Stop calling yourself a “conservative.”
          The race baiters love you, but when the rubber meets the road, they won’t honor your loyalty.
          Granted, you have no idea what that means, but they do.

          1. tsmog profile image83
            tsmogposted 3 months agoin reply to this

            I have to giggle at that!! I am much more conservative than many perceive. I am presently writing my autobiography. I spent a good portion of that with my career in scouting including earning the God and County award. hmmm . . . I was in the eighth then at age 12.

            Erik Erikson's theory of Human Development says that is Stage 5: Identity vs. confusion. (12 - 18) "At this psychosocial development stage, your child faces the challenge of developing a sense of self. They form their identity by examining their beliefs, goals, and values."

            I firmly established my identity at that time. However, when I experienced amnesia from a horrific car crash there was confusion, of course. I guess any liberal leanings I have I will blame on that perhaps an act of God. Who knows. ha-ha wink

            1. savvydating profile image89
              savvydatingposted 3 months agoin reply to this

              tsmog, You’re a kind man, and in that respect you have conservative leanings that were certainly developed early on.

              However, anytime one praises race baiters or those who have said “Israel deserved what they got…” that’s a problem.

              I have faith that you will see the difference between those who love freedom and those who do not.

              1. tsmog profile image83
                tsmogposted 3 months agoin reply to this

                I see . . . okay . . . respectfully, a problem for who? No need to go further. With the same respect should I take that to mean I have been warned?

                1. Ken Burgess profile image79
                  Ken Burgessposted 3 months agoin reply to this

                  Savvy has a unusual way of making friends and influencing people, I have been on the receiving end of such types of replies.

                  It makes a good example of perspective.  Your comments may seem very 'Conservative' to some, while Savvy sees you as a "Democrat".

                  1. savvydating profile image89
                    savvydatingposted 3 months agoin reply to this

                    Lol. I’m the first to laugh at myself. True, I sometimes take to task those who can take the heat. It’s my funny way of showing respect for those I like.

                2. savvydating profile image89
                  savvydatingposted 3 months agoin reply to this

                  Tsmog, I was thinking in terms of your possibly choosing to vote for Teddy Roosevelt in the next election. That won’t help the conservative cause.
                  Congratulations on writing your autobiography!

                  1. tsmog profile image83
                    tsmogposted 3 months agoin reply to this

                    Just kidding about. Right now Haley has my vote. If she doesn't make the ticket Teddy is looking good to me.

      2. Castlepaloma profile image76
        Castlepalomaposted 4 months agoin reply to this

        If democracy truly worked, the tiny group of genderism would be  not able to change the free speech laws for the first time in the  English language history. And half of the world's population being female wouldn't fear  modern woman with cocks and beards into their safe female spaces. Like washrooms, gyms, Sports, prisons.  And cutting off the gendertilla of their own children. Wars , budgets, laws are pushed through without general public approval.

        1. Credence2 profile image79
          Credence2posted 4 months agoin reply to this

          Well, as imperfect as it has been, it has worked here better than any alternative over the last couple of centuries.

          What do you propose should replace democracy?  I won't let anyone rule over me without my permission, AKA the votes of majority of the people.

          I don't care as much about the cultural aberrations, they have always been there with each passing generation.  But still, I am not keen on this genderism stuff all the same. But an introduction of a fascist Hitler like regime in response is certainly not the answer.

          1. Ken Burgess profile image79
            Ken Burgessposted 4 months agoin reply to this

            We fear the same things.

            We just have a different belief as to what is bringing it about.

            Castle sees things more clearly than most regarding this Nation's government.

            This is not a Democracy run by the people... that is an illusion you and many others still buy into.  He sees the reality, as do I.

            The politicians listen to the Institutions and Corporations that don't answer to the American people, therefore our government doesn't answer to the American people.

            Do you think the people really wanted Biden?  HAH!

            The DNC pulling the strings, and the people pulling the DNC's strings, said here you are... here is your Democrat who will save you from that awful Trump who has done so many bad things to you for four years now.

            You might have wanted Warren, or Sanders, or Gabbard... to F'n bad.  You get what we give you to vote for... and you will like it... or we will cast you down with the rest of the deplorables and then you will have no where to belong.

            Credence, you were forged in the 60s, you in many ways are still stuck in the 60s.  Its hard for many older people to grasp the fact that the Democratic Party got hijacked decades ago, and it licks the boots of corporations and corruption in ways that even most Republicans resist (not all, there is still the likes of Graham who puts most of them to shame).

            It pushes for wars more than any Republican ever did, with more reckless abandon than any sane person would imagine possible 25 years ago.

            There is no parties, there is just the establishment, the illusions they feed you, meanwhile they are destroying the world, the country, to rebuild it into what they want... not what you want, not what the disrespected, the discarded, the victims of racism or sexism want (well not the sane ones).

            They are so far ahead of the game, they make what was done in Germany in the 30s and 40s child's play compared to how deeply they have pushed this into the American psyche.

            Our kids are going to wake up to a country that is more intrusive and controlling than China's is today, and Americans are going to skip right along to the Pied Piper that brings us to it.

            Those that don't like it, well, they are just deplorables, they need to be reprogrammed or removed from society all together.  You and I are going to live just long enough to see their NWO being incorporated... if these lunatics don't destroy the world in WWIII before then.

            1. Credence2 profile image79
              Credence2posted 4 months agoin reply to this

              Well, Ken we do have different beliefs, that is for sure.

              Neither you nor Castle has told me yet what the alternative to the present system should be.

              If you been reading the papers, the RNC is playing the same games, with Trump trying to give himself the advantage in the delegate counts.

              Obviously, the people voted for and preferred Biden with over almost 8 million votes, that is enough for me. So, now you are saying that the people don't know who and what they vote for?

              Ken, Trump sucks, period, from virtually every angle from which one might want to look.

              Yes, I would have preferred Warren or Sanders, but more Democrats wanted someone more moderate. What would make me believe that my preference would necessarily be that of the party as a whole? Does that mean that I would embrace Trump and Republicans as any serious alternative? Hell no!!

              I was a kid during the 1960s, I was hardly forged there. Let's just say that the almost 60 years since have had a much greater influence on my present opinions. It is my opinion that Republicans are far more autocratic, patronizing to the corporate class and retrograde in values over the Democrats. The so called idea of Democrats fomenting wars is just a matter of opinion. I seem to remember the longest war against AlQuida was started in a nation that had nothing to do with it, Iraq, don't you remember?

              If it all an illusion, what would I want with the side that is clearly and starkly operating against my interests? Is Trump and the Republicans going to build the nation to the desire I want? That is even a lesser probability.

              Show me a better alternative, besides a race baiting TV star and his cult like following?........

              I have to go with lesser of two evils knowing full well the intrinsic corruption in politics, that lesser in my view is never Trump and the Republicans

              1. Ken Burgess profile image79
                Ken Burgessposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                There may have been a time when I was attempting to sway you, or others, to see one political candidate or party over another.

                That was the past.

                Now I try to just open your perspective, to get you to give up this belief which you espouse these days that Republicans are evil, racist, greedy, sexist, etc. ... or using the very word Republican as code for something else which means essentially the same or worse.

                The ability for humanity to reach a more enlightened existence with a One World Order, New World Order, Borderless World, and all the other concepts suggested by the UN, the WEF, driven largely by untouchable unelected bureaucrats throughout DC, Brussels, and other halls of power, is going to do for ALL of us... what Communism did for Russia.

                Instead of being given pause by the radical statements coming from your Democratic Party Leaders today, you echo them.

                When Clinton speaks of re-programming people, when Biden calls tens of millions of Americans threats to Democracy, when they define the opposition as traitors to the nation... this is language that speaks exactly to where this is headed, as seen in too many examples of history.

                In a 1920 speech Lenin said that communists must subordinate morality to the class struggle. Good was anything that destroyed “the old exploiting society” and helped to build a “new communist society.”

                In order to build their New World Order today, they are going to destroy this society... liberty, freedom, the Constitution... the very best ideas that this Nation stood for cannot cohabitate with a borderless NWO.

                “We are not waging war against individuals. We are exterminating the bourgeoisie as a class. . . . Do not look for evidence that the accused acted in word or deed against Soviet power. The first question should be to what class does he belong. . . . It is this that should determine his fate.”

                Lenin broke people down by class, today they are breaking people down by race and sex, you can rest assured no matter what happens... the Bezos and Gates of the world will be untouched, the truly elite like those who own the "Federal Reserve" will remain in control.

                While the Soviet Union redefined human nature, it also spread intellectual chaos. The term “political correctness” has its origin in the assumption that socialism, a system of collective ownership, was virtuous in itself, without need to evaluate its operations in light of transcendent moral criteria.

                We see all the same things occurring now in America, chosen pronouns, politically correct censorship, cancel culture, tearing down national monuments, the precursor to more significant change to come.

                We are seeing it with the open border policy that is a "secure border" a fully supported and operated war against Russia that is "supporting" Ukraine, mind boggling government spending that is devaluing the dollar so that they can usher in their fully controllable Digital Currency.

                Well, we are seeing it if we want to.

                Some of us want to focus on what is not real... Republican vs. Democrat, White vs. Black, whatever it is that distracts and divides from the real threats to us all.


                EDIT/ADD  -

                The point is, IMO, you are too wrapped up in this fight... Trump isn't the demon he is made out to be, he is the boogeyman being used to scare people into accepting something worse that they are ushering in.

                If you didn't have Trump to fight, and I admit he is perfect for the role that they have him playing... whether it is willingly or whether he is just that arrogant and egotistical... but then again, a person would have to have a unimaginably massive ego to try and take on the behemoth of power and corruption driving the Nation today.

                That is a conundrum I have been pondering since before he was elected... I still have no concrete resolution to whether he is a useful idiot for them to focus those who would resist the coming changes... or whether he is a legit  believer in himself to that degree.

                Clinton and others despise him so much, its hard to imagine it isn't legit.

                But they don't hate him because he is a Russian puppet or a threat to Democracy... they hate him because he usurped their control and power, he delayed their efforts, and he openly insulted them and exposed their corruption.

                1. Credence2 profile image79
                  Credence2posted 4 months agoin reply to this

                  "There may have been a time when I was attempting to sway you, or others, to see one political candidate or party over another."


                  I had an idea that is what you were attempting to do. But your views about American slavery, the place of women in society, etc, gave you away as hardly an objective neutral observer when making your points. No offense meant, but I smelled a rat.... Actually an advocate from what I consider the side of my adversary, but presenting himself otherwise.

                  I only define Republicans based on their policies and their behavior and not just a figment of my imagination. All of this has been quite evident, so until they change their behavior, associations and policies, I am going to believe my own lying eyes... The Republicans are at least as corrupt as the Democrats, if not more so, in my opinion. So,where is your solution?

                  You still have not told me what you think will be a better system and why. What is the alternative to all of these "traitorous" Democrats? Traitorous  Republicans?

                  1. Ken Burgess profile image79
                    Ken Burgessposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                    True we view family values differently. The demise of traditional roles just happens to coincide with the many issues arising today in our society.

                    We see slavery the same way, where we differ is in view of indentured servitude and how that was the 'slavery' that built America in its first hundred years of making long before slavery of Africans became big business in the western world.

                    I recognize the Uniparty as being in control.  This is why I no longer debate the matter of which party.  I recognize it is not a government of the people and by the people anymore.

                    The really hard shift occurred after the collapse of the USSR.  By the time Clinton was out of office the MIC and International Corporations had seized control.

                    Technology has much to do with it as well.

                2. Credence2 profile image79
                  Credence2posted 4 months agoin reply to this

                  Ken, you did say that I had a problem with Republicans, here is just a couple of things that stuck in my craw.

                  Why is it when Trump has a rally there a handful of Blacks with signs saying "Blacks for Trump"? The people strategically placed within panning range of the camera, while Trump speaks. Do conservatives/Republicans really believed that I am going to be influenced by such a display? If the Blacks there were Trump supporters, why the need for the billboards? This was never done even in earlier gatherings of Republican candidates. Did the Trump campaign or the RNC pay these people to make such a display of themselves? If Republicans think that we can be so easily influenced, they have no idea of our demographic nor can appreciate our issues and objectives.

                  And then there was Herschel Walker in the 2022 Senate race against the Democrat Warnock. Again, Republicans and conservatives remain naive as to the true nature of the Black vote. You all really believed that putting a totally brain dead, immoral person in a position to run against Warnock to attract more black votes would actually work. But I sure  saw how close it was because whites would vote for a dog over considering leaving the seat for a Democrat. Such are the divisions in Georgia politics and in many other states just like it.

                  The Republican/conservative neither know nor understand us, and that continues to give us and me reason to distrust them.

                  Just a couple of examples and there are many more.

                  1. tsmog profile image83
                    tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                    You are right in the sense that the Black voting bloc cannot be ignored. And, that they have a historical trend with whom they will vote for. The Democrat ticket. You know more than I do, yet here is some of what I learned this morning from a Pew Research study (10/12/22). It is:

                    Key facts about Black eligible voters in 2022
                    https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads … s-in-2022/

                    An except states:

                    "In an August 2022 Pew Research Center survey, 70% of Black registered voters said they would vote for or were leaning to the Democratic U.S. House candidate in their district in the coming election. Another 24% were either unsure or said they would back another candidate. Just 6% of Black registered voters said they would back the Republican candidate in the race to represent their district in the House of Representatives."

                    The opening paragraph for the article/study is:

                    The number of Black eligible voters in the United States has grown at a modest pace in recent years and is projected to reach 32.7 million in November 2022. At the same time, Black eligible voters stand out for their relatively high voter turnout rates – 51% in 2018, higher than the turnout rates for Latino and Asian eligible voters in the same year (40% each).

                    The key talking point subheadings are:

                    ** Black Americans are projected to account for 13.6% of all eligible voters in the United States in November

                    ** As of 2020, eight states are home to about half of all Black eligible voters in the United States

                    ** Black voters made up nearly half (46%) of all eligible voters in the District of Columbia in 2020, a higher share than any state

                    ** Seven-in-ten Black people in the U.S. are eligible to vote

                    ** Black eligible voters differ from the broader population of eligible voters by age, education and other factors.

                    Worth a skim to peek at the graphics giving insight into the Black voting bloc. Some of it may be surprising such as Texas had the most Black eligible voters in 2020. And, for demographics the graphic in the fifth or last subheading is interesting. It compares Black eligible voters to all eligible voters.

                  2. Ken Burgess profile image79
                    Ken Burgessposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                    I'm not a Republican, I'm certainly not a Democrat either.

                    I fall somewhere between Independant and Libertarian, anyways, there are just as many strange or unseemly decisions made by the Democratic Party.

                    The point I try to make, these are small potatoes, they are the side dish most people allow themselves to get stirred up over.  The main meal is what is transforming the country.

                    The other point is that you have way too much venom for Republicans, the Republicans doing stupid things trying to win votes and influence people is not the same thing as the Democrats supporting so many of the unpopular changes we are seeing within our country as well as the wars ongoing without.

                    I know what you are trying to say, the alternative to you (that being the Republicans) is worse, so far as you are concerned.

                    The problem, for a growing amount of Americans, is that both Parties, and what is occurring in our nation, is totally unacceptable... right now those people are being denigrated and labelled as Trumpsters and Traitors.

                    For a growing number of Americans, this government no longer represents them, what they want, what they believe... its a runaway train... the trainwreck is coming.

    3. Sharlee01 profile image79
      Sharlee01posted 4 months agoin reply to this

      In my view,  fear and anger can have a profound impact on the health and stability of any democratic society.  While democracy thrives on open debate, informed decisions, and the peaceful exchange of ideas, these emotions can disrupt the balance big time.  Fear, for instance, can lead to an erosion of civil liberties, as citizens may be overly willing to sacrifice personal freedoms in the name of security. It can also fuel the rise of demagogues who exploit public anxieties to consolidate power.

      Similarly, anger can polarize communities and hinder constructive dialogue, pushing people towards extreme positions and away from the spirit of compromise that is often essential in a democratic system.

      "What are your feelings on fear and anger in your political life? Do those two have a different effect on your thinking about politics in general, your personal ideology, and finally voting?"

      Both anger and fear affect my thinking equally when it comes to voting.  My fears ultimately initiate research and much of the time my research initiates anger.  My common sense takes hold, and my decision-making comes down to using what I learn about a candidate, their past capabilities to do the job, and their general demeanor also plays a part.

      My thought process regarding voting is equally influenced by both anger and fear. Often, my concerns and apprehensions are the catalyst for conducting research. Interestingly, this research can sometimes provoke feelings of anger. However, throughout this process, I strive to maintain a sense of rationality. Ultimately, my decision-making hinges on a combination of factors: the information I gather about a candidate, their track record in the role, and their overall demeanor also play a significant role in shaping my voting choices.

      In regard to the 2024 election, I have no problem sharing I will be voting for the Republican candidate. I feel no connection to the Democrat's ideologies. I feel the current administration has all but ruined this country.

      To be honest --- I think anger and fear will work to get Democracy back on the right track. I feel many have now become very aware of the serious derailment. I think most will be voting for a new conductor.

      I say this frequently --- I mean what next?  The country is in trouble,

      1. Castlepaloma profile image76
        Castlepalomaposted 4 months agoin reply to this

        Sometimes I think the world is run by fear.
        Yet, in my heart says love conquers all.

        1. Sharlee01 profile image79
          Sharlee01posted 4 months agoin reply to this

          Fear and love are two powerful contrasting human emotions. Fear can be both rational, such as fearing physical harm or danger, and irrational, such as phobias or anxieties about the unknown.

          Love is a complex and multifaceted emotion, that encompasses a wide spectrum of feelings, from affection to passion. Love fosters connection, compassion, and a sense of belonging.

          In my view, both influence our decision-making and behavior. Fear can work to drive us away from potential threats, while love draws us closer to what we see as positive, and tend to value.

          1. Castlepaloma profile image76
            Castlepalomaposted 4 months agoin reply to this

            Being fearless dose not mean I'm not afraid. It means I'm brave enough to confront the problems, the unknowns or bullies.

            1. Sharlee01 profile image79
              Sharlee01posted 4 months agoin reply to this

              I attribute that to innate common sense. One that just does not let fear control a situation has a good dose of common sense. I feel common sense has been attributed to our societal divide. Fear, love, anger -- ultimately one that has an abundance of common sense can maneuver their way through emotions such as love, anger, and fear as well as hate.

              1. Castlepaloma profile image76
                Castlepalomaposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                I list a positive means to an end feeling I want most in life by priority. 1.Love, 2. Healthy, 3.Free, 4.,Consciousness  5..Joy, 6. Fun, 7 8. Passion, 9.Security and  lesser important felling and etc.

                Negative feeling I want to avoid most  1. Frustration, 2.Overwhelm. Sadness, Humiliation, Dwelling,, and so on working on most.

                Fear, angry, loneliness, depression, revenge, hate, envy, jealousy I've actually mastered to avoid.

                Concept is avoid as much suffering as possible. Then send more times happy and pleasure feeling, as a means to an end.

      2. tsmog profile image83
        tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

        Thanks, Sharlee, for sharing how fear and anger interact with your own pathway with voting. You have shared in the past how you approach voting. I admire that you put in the due diligence. Do you do that with initiatives and measures too? However, as an opinion, I think a minority of voters do put in that effort. I would suspect only a portion of the 44% of Americans that are college-educated.

        As to fear and anger until reading the article I thought fear to be the culprit for pushing people toward the right and affecting voting. That is traditional thought. It is the fight or flight mechanism a reaction to the fear felt by a threat. Two examples are transgenderism and the border.

        However, they share anger is what pushes people to the polls. They studied the French 2017 general elections, and the people had the impact of the 2015 Paris terrorist attack fresh in their minds. What they discovered is the more fear the less inclined to vote. The more anger the more inclined to vote and how they vote.

        With that in mind, I ponder if the right media strategy is capitalizing on that knowledge – there is more to gain from anger than fear. What are your thoughts? Do the likes of CNN and FOX both seek the emotion of anger from their audience . . . the voters? Are they successful? Which of those two emotions has caused more turmoil in today's society with the deep divide between parties?

        1. Castlepaloma profile image76
          Castlepalomaposted 4 months agoin reply to this

          That is why emotional intelligence is more important than mental intelligence. A good EIQ leads with the hearts shortly follow by the mind. Anger and fear causes negativties and more often negative results, caught in vicious cycle. The media and Politicans create the fake monster then the public throws money at it. Because of their fears to do anything about it. There is nothing in life that anyone can throw at me, that I'm not able to handle within my circle. When half my money is in some way ends up going to the Government to create even more monsters. That motivate me in my personal and business life to creates other new ways of thinking.

        2. Sharlee01 profile image79
          Sharlee01posted 4 months agoin reply to this

          Ultimately, the decision to capitalize on anger or fear as part of a media strategy depends on the goals and values of the specific news outlet and the interests of its target audience. I feel, that media strategies employed by news outlets like CNN and FOX can vary, and do offer just what their target audience is looking for. It is clear more than ever Americans do not share all of the same ideologies, and will tune into the network that compliments their own. 

          CNN is generally considered to lean to the left, and it typically focuses on delivering news, that can evoke anger, relying on reporting that truely is meant to grab the social side of a story and engage in discussions and debates that could trigger emotions in their viewers. Sometimes, unrealistically not offer a common sense view.

          FOX News, on the other hand, is known for its conservative-leaning commentary and offers opinion shows.  In my view, some of its programs are more likely to use both emotional appeals, all carefully crafted to include the anger appeals.  I think this is why they have a larger audience.  They often feature hosts and guests who express strong, opinionated views that resonate with a particular audience. Fox most definitely generates strong emotions -- anger, fear, smack in the face common sense.  These are our strongest emotions, our true fight-or-flight emotions. 

          I feel both networks use sensationalism which involves exaggerating news events to provoke strong emotional responses from the audience.  Which spans from empathy to anger, and fear. CNN draws empathy, which ultimately can enlist emotions such as anger and fear. They just take a roundabout path to bring their viewers to these emotions. Fox, comes right at ya... They evoke immediate fight or flight. Get right to the emotion they are looking for.
           
          Both engage in fear-inducing tactics. Both aim to instill in the audience a sense of deprivation in various aspects of their lives, whether it's freedom, values, common sense, human kindness, or fairness.

          I have come to watch Fox more than CNN. I am a creature of common sense, and feel emotions (although very important in my day-to-day personal life) can be detrimental in figuring out politics, and can be detrimental in making decisions under the many crisis issues that we see in the media today. I look at crisis with a very realistic eye. 

          "Are they successful? Which of those two emotions has caused more turmoil in today's society with the deep divide between parties?"

          Both are very successful, I feel both are equally successful in pushing their venue. Fox is more successful in drawing an audience.

          In my view, anger had a big lead, until most recently. Fear will soon overtake anger due to the many crises we have endured under this president. In my view, I have witnessed a perfect domino effect that began with anger due to our economy, huge ideology clashes, a proxy war, and our border crisis, and now we face a very dangerous problem in the Middle East. So much more --  So, now we face fear, a fear mixed with anger.

          I predict we will see record numbers come out to vote --- out of fear.
          Anger will take a back seat this time around.

          I don't feel the final domino has fallen. Do you?

          1. Castlepaloma profile image76
            Castlepalomaposted 4 months agoin reply to this

            At least Fox has a little humor I can sometimes bare. I carry a BS detector that helps me change the channel. Comedians doing the news do it well, and in a good way of expressing truth deeper. Without getting cancelled or blocked so fast.
            I have Problems with carbonism tax my gas tank went up 20% and our owners who own people, not me of course.
            Carlin says it best, well ahead of his time.

            https://youtu.be/t8O_CcGhLD8?si=VyvE5IukCTkkYz_5

    4. Nathanville profile image92
      Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

      For the forthcoming 2024 General Election in the UK, perhaps ‘anger’ is too a strong a word (but perhaps the right sentiment), but certainly the current state of the UK economy (the cost of living crisis, and the fuel crisis over the last two winters - caused mainly by Brexit, the pandemic and the Ukrainian war); plus the NHS crisis caused by the pandemic followed by continued NHS industrial action against the Government (their paymaster) since the summer of last year (18 months), has made the current UK Conservative Government very unpopular, and they are currently on course for a humiliating electoral defeat next year (potential landslide victory to socialism) – as this recent video clip shows:

      Oct 2023: Conservatives suffer DOUBLE by-election defeat as Labour (socialists) wins the second biggest victory (swing to the left) in any election since WW2. https://youtu.be/RkA5zjGwTWo

      1. tsmog profile image83
        tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

        Hello, Arthur!! How was your mini-vacation? It was a mini-vacation, right? I hope it was full of fun, fun, fun, and family fellowship.

        It appears from your list of discontentment they parallel a few to many that are here. Thanks for the video. What caught my attention in the beginning the interviewee used the term 'rage' several times.

        In my world, rage is an action of 'anger'. Then as the video progressed I got a good idea as to why the sentiment bears emotion(s). The history was interesting as well.

        Here in the US, from my perspective, there is 'fear' from the conservative side more than the liberal. And, anger as well, which one may say is the more dominant emotion.

        The article I shared in the OP, pointed out that 'anger' is the cause that 'push' people to the polls to vote. One graphic shares that the more fear a person has the less likely one will go to the polls, but the more anger a person experiences the more likely they will go to the polls and vote.

        My observation is conservatives, yes, do 'fear' liberals. However, they are angry about the border issue with immigrants some say that is invading our nation. With the revolution of transgenderism, there are pressures on society to change and perhaps conform to their 'demands', i.e., the bathroom issue, biological males competing in women's sports, etc. Forcing conformity is a key element.

        And, as you shared for the UK, the economic status today. Fresh on minds is the steep climb of inflation especially with fuel both for home - natural gas and electricity, and our vehicles. I am angry about that myself.

        From experience, I have learned once a price increases due to inflation rarely does it go back to where it started from before the climb. Yes, inflation may slow to 2% or a little above. But, the starting point for that measurement is the new price as a result of the earlier 8%.

        BTW . . . I wrote a HubPages article on my adventure with Medicare, medical groups, and bringing information to the new doctor one will have as a result of the change. Link following.

        I hope I don't get penalized by HP as we are not supposed to promote our articles. Oh Well! I have seen others do it. Beware, it is about 15 minutes to read due to all the information provided.

        Luck, Medical Groups, Medicare Part C, and an Adventure
        https://discover.hubpages.com/health/lu … -adventure

        1. Nathanville profile image92
          Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

          I’ll respond to your first question here, and the rest of your comments later in a separate post – as the response to your first question is going to be a lengthy one!

          What you’ve called a “mini-vacation” is what we call a holiday in the UK e.g. a vacation lasting a week or more; a mini-break/long weekend are holidays (vacations) of typically 2 to 4 days, and a day trip is a local vacation for just a day or half day out.

          Our holiday was a mixed experience, but we enjoyed it:-

          The main purpose of the holiday was to watch the 1066 (Battle of Hastings) re-enactment over the weekend, on the very spot where the original battle of Hastings took place in 1066 – in a town (just a few miles north west of Hastings called ‘Battle’ (named after the Battle of Hastings); the town Battle has a population of 6,673.  William the Conqueror (on the orders of the Pope of Rome) built an Abbey (Battle Abbey) in 1094 on the very spot of the battle, in ‘penance for killing so many people during his conquest of England – the ‘high altar’ of the church being built on the very spot that King Harold was killed during the battle on 14th October 1066.

          The location of the re-enactment took place in part of the field, in the grounds of Battle Abbey, in Battle, Sussex, where the original battle took place, on the same day (14th October), with a repeat performance the following day (Sunday).  For the re-enactment, we took with us folding chairs, flask of hot water (for coffee) and a freezer bag on wheels (with our packed lunch); and picking a suitable spot in the field, made ourselves comfortable for the day – and between performances (in the breaks) we took it in turn to explore the rest of the Abbey grounds, other side events, and market stalls on site.

          The weekend weather was great (hotter than most of July and August), warm with blue sky and sun; so I think like September, October is going to be the hottest October on record (global warming).

          Anyway, all went well until the end of the day, as we were packing up, and everyone was leaving; when suddenly, our son was knocked down by a big/heavy mobility scooter – he and the big lens he was using went flying, and his camera was run over by the mobility scooter; he pulled a muscle in his leg, but of more concern was his camera equipment, worth over $6,000 – which he depends on for his livelihood (professional photographer). 

          The disabled driver was very apologetic, and gave his full details (name and address) without hesitation; the camera lens is a right-off and the camera is damaged and will need repair, but still working to a fashion.

          Fortunately, as it is his profession, our son’s camera equipment is fully insured, so the replacement lens and repairs for the camera will be paid for by insurance – so that’s not an issue.  This issue is that he needs his equipment for his work.  Fortunately, a close friend of ours has an almost identical lens and similar camera (amateur photographer), and agreed to lend them to our son for a few months, while the camera is in for repairs and the insurance money comes through to buy a replacement lens.

          The intention was to swing by Portsmouth (where our friend lives) from Hastings, on the way back to Bristol at the end of the holiday:  But for ‘the best-laid plans of mice and men’ that was not to be!  On the Wednesday my wife fell ill with a bad throat infection – She phoned the NHS 111 phone line at 10am, gave them her details (so that they could access her medical records) and gave them her symptoms; and then we spent the day in Hastings near the pier to see one of the many Martello towers in the area, and for our son to get atmospheric photos of Hasting’s pier in the storm (Storm Babet):-

          Martello towers are small defensive forts that were built across the British Empire (mostly coastal forts) during the 19th century, from the time of the French Revolutionary Wars onwards.

          The UK was hit by Storm Babet from Wednesday, it swept through South East England on Wednesday (just the one day), and battered South West England until Friday morning, and then ravaged Northern Ireland and Scotland, causing severe flooding and power outages there.  A contrast in weather e.g. over the weekend, while at the re-enactment of the Battle of Hastings, we were in summer clothes; on Wednesday, to keep warm and dry against the storm, I was wearing six layers of winter clothes.

          Anyway, at 2:30pm that day, while we were having a late lunch in a local café in Hastings, the NHS (111 phone line) phoned back to say they’d looked at her medical records, consulted with a doctor, and passed an order for a prescription of antibiotics onto a local pharmacy near the caravan holiday park that we were staying at – and they gave us the address of the pharmacy where we could pick up the prescription (free prescription of course).  So after our meal, and on our way back to the caravan holiday park we stopped at the local pharmacy and picked up the prescription.

          Come Friday, when it was time to make our way back to Bristol, although the antibiotics had helped, my wife wasn’t in a fit state to make a detour to Portsmouth to pick up the camera and lens from our friend, so we just made a beeline for Bristol – But even that was an eventful journey.

          On entering the M4 motorway, from the M25 motorway (ring road around London), both our Sat-Nav and the motorway message boards were telling us that the M4 was blocked outside of Bristol; so I Googled the M4 traffic up-date, to learn that in Storm Babet a lorry had flipped over, blocking the M4 motorway (in both directions) on the outskirts of Bristol.  When we got to the Reading motorway Service Station for a rest-bite the lorry had been cleared but the traffic on the motorway at that point was at a standstill, with an estimated 45 minute delay – and by the time we got close to Bristol, no change:  So rather than be stuck in a hour long traffic queue, and not moving for up to an hour on the motorway, we decided to come off at Swindon (the last motorway junction before Bristol), and drive the rest of the way on the side roads – a journey which should have taken an hour, but took 90 minutes because, not only did other drivers have the same idea (adding to the traffic) but with Storm Babet having passed through the area just hours earlier, for the first 10 miles (1/3rd of the route), a lot of the local roads were flooded; passable (with up to six inches of flood water on the roads), but it meant driving slowly and carefully through the flood water. 

          At the moment I’m just editing the video footage from our car cams of that part of the journey, for posting to YouTube later in the week.

          In spite of the above mentioned issues, the rest of our holiday was good: 

          Although our son’s camera isn’t fully functional (because of the accident), it has enough working functions for him to carry on using it on holiday, with his other lenses.

          We visited quite a few Martello towers along the coast, piers at both Hastings and Eastbourne, the RNLI lifeboat station at Hastings, and the maritime museum, Rye Harbour nature reserve, and the spectacular views at Beachy Head, where we also had a superb meal in the local restaurant there.

          The only other irritation to our son was a coach load of young teenage Germans at Beachy Head, who got in his way while he was trying to take landscape photos; and the following day, when we visited the opposite end of Hastings to the pier, the same German coach, with the same teenagers, arrived in the same carpark as we did, at the same time as us - to our son’s annoyance; but which both my wife and I found amusing!

          Anyway, our friend from Portsmouth is kind enough to visit us tomorrow (and stay for a couple of days) so that he can bring up his lens and camera, for our son to borrow while he’s getting his camera repaired, and getting a replacement lens – So all’s well that ends well – and I’ve got lots of video footage to edit and process for YouTube (particularly of the 1066 Battle of Hastings re-enactment).

          1. tsmog profile image83
            tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

            Responding now to the quite adventuresome journey you and your family experienced. A mini-vacation is not an American term I know of it. It is a term I made up. In my working days, I got 1-1/2 days off a week for about 24 years.

            The last 14 years are when I did data mining, report creation, and research projects. Importantly there were close to a dozen reports and half were daily ones that only I knew how to do. So, on my vacations, I went to the office and did them after the stores were closed say around 10 p.m. In essence I did not have a vacation. So, if I got two full days off in a row I declared that a mini-vacation.

            Back to your adventure. I am saddened your wife encountered the illness. Yet, very happy with the NHS system it was resolved. I, also, am bummed about your son's camera. I wonder what the gentleman was paying attention to when he ran him over. I have to dodge them when walking on the sidewalks alongside the street going on an errand. They are bullies in my mind with the attitude they have.

            It appears the storm through a wrench in the works. Not good!

            Overall, though, it seemed like the family did get enjoyment, especially with the reenactment observed. As they say, "things work out for the best." With your son resolving his camera problem through a friend, finally getting home traversing the atrocious storm damage, and as they say "home sweet home".  I bet everyone grew a smile.

            On the East Coast both south and north there are battle reenactments for the Civil War. I think there are some for the Revolutionary War too. I don't know of any here in Southern California. If there were it would be the Spaniards with the Native Americans or the U.S. with the Mexicans with the Mexican-American War of 1946 for California's independence from Mexico. But, I have not heard of reenactments.

            There is a battle site less than 20 miles from me for a notable battle of the Mexican-American war called the Battle of San Pasqual. It is known as one of the bloodiest battles and is significant. It is a state park now. Next is a link to a site to explore at leisure. I will do that myself at a later time. I would be good for me to know some of the history where I live, right?

            San Pasqual Battlefield Site Location Project
            https://sanpasqual.org/

            1. Nathanville profile image92
              Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

              I’m still rather busy doing other things so I’ll respond to this post in two separate parts; the first part being your first two paragraphs – which caught my eye:

              For clarification, where you say: “In my working days, I got 1-1/2 days off a week for about 24 years.” That’s 78 days a year (1.5 x 52), so are you talking about the weekend, and did you not get paid vacation leave on top of that?

              In the UK and EU the working week is generally 5 days a week; and the legal minimum in the EU and UK for paid leave (vacation) is 30 days (6 weeks paid leave) per year - Plus Bank/Public holidays of course.

              And being in a large organisation like the civil service I also had flexi leave (paid leave in lieu of credit hours) to a maximum entitlement of 3 days paid flexi leave per 4 week period e.g. I used to work 9 hours a day instead of my standard 7.4 hours per day to build up flexi time and then take 3 days paid flexi leave off a month; on top of my six weeks paid annual leave per year.

              What caught my attention is your comment that you would go into work on your days off; which is a common theme I frequently see in American films e.g. a culture of where Americans put work before family and personal life, and where the boss expects their employees to sacrifice their vacation time to do important and urgent work in the office?

              It’s a theme that is played out time and time again in American films.  But in contrast, cultural attitudes by both British Commerce (employer) and employee is that the six weeks paid annual leave is sacrosanct; in fact, in the UK an employer will take a dim view if an employee tries not to take their full annual paid leave (vacation) entitlement.

              Have I gone off-beam or did I understand you correctly?

              1. tsmog profile image83
                tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                Oops! Nathan, forgive me this is long. I chopped and chopped. I got it down to this to explain what I felt may make it understandable. I don't know if I did a good job or not. I wound up with a part 2.

                First, the average American worker (age 16+) works 38.7 days per week. Over 32% of single job holders work weekends while 58% of multiple job holders work weekends. Take a peek at the next link with a graphic for the average weekly hours by demographic.

                A short skim is informative. Doing that discovered is about 40 hours per week is normal. So, the theme seen in films perhaps is the exception with the goal centered on a conflict for dramatic purposes. For instance, executives are the minority.

                What Is The Average Work Hours Per Week In The US? [2023] by Zippia - Career Expert (Jan 9, 2023)
                https://www.zippia.com/advice/average-w … -per-week/

                ************************
                Next, I will address your two following quotes:

                “For clarification, where you say: “In my working days, I got 1-1/2 days off a week for about 24 years.” That’s 78 days a year (1.5 x 52), so are you talking about the weekend, and did you not get paid vacation leave on top of that?”

                And,

                “What caught my attention is your comment that you would go to work on your days off;”

                **************************
                Before I answer for background, for the last 24 years of my 40-year career, I worked for a chain of Automotive Tire and Service stores. By the time I left, there were 24 U.S. stores, 2 warehouses, and the corporate office located at the main warehouse. Plus, we had six stores in Mexico with a warehouse.

                Right off you will see it is retail-orientated and was a seven-day operation for the stores and warehouses. While in the corporate office for the last 14 years before I retired I had responsibilities to each entity, all management, and employees.

                I will stick to the last 14 years when I worked in the corporate office. I have like you a part 2 discussing the whys regarding days off for the positions in the company, vacations, holidays, and a retirement investment tool.

                I feel you might find that interesting as a compare/contrast with your work background. However, not every independent business has the same structure we had. Nor, public entities such as governments, schools, and transportation systems.

                The short answer is, that my days off were Thursday and a half-day on Sunday. Thursday was my choice. Sunday was not. Yes, I worked Saturdays. I worked Saturdays my whole working career with them. That is explained in part 2.

                One important reason why I worked Sundays in the evenings was someone was available for computer malfunctions and administrative challenges. I could solve most problems like a frozen computer screen. Sometimes things like the drawer did not balance. They had to report that to me as I was the auditor for daily cash and credit card receipts.

                On my day off they reported it to their district manager. For computer problems, the district manager called the vice president who was responsible for the computer system. Not me as it was my day off. She would resolve the problem from her home. She could access the mainframe from there if need be.

                I should also say my hours were from 1 p.m. until I went home. Except for Sundays when I came at 5 p.m. and worked until I went home. That was my half day.

                The time I left for home was after the last store closed, I posted the business to the main frame, did the reports, and distributed them. If everything went smoothly I was off by ten or eight hours of work plus one hour for lunch. On my half day, it was between four and five hours of work.

                So, six days a week the management from store to corporate had their reports on the following morning. On the day following my day off the vice president would come in early before the stores and warehouses opened and post the business to the mainframe.

                I got there an hour early on Fridays and did the reports. But, they weren’t pleased with that really. Who cared what yesterday’s business was? Half the day was gone. So, I was always in hot water. Ha-ha!

                They wanted to see the progress report for that day, which I did at that time. I also got in hot water when sales were low. It was my fault since I did the reports. wink

                I went in on vacation days to post the daily business and do the reporting, not my one day off. If everything went smoothly it was only two hours. If it was an end-of-month then it was longer no matter what day of the week.

                The reason why I was the only one to do the reports is the owner of the company only allowed me access to my desktop PC with its information. And, access to the mainframe for data transfers.

                That could only be accomplished with my PC. A trust issue is seen. The security he wanted meant when I left my PC I had to log off. It was password protected of course. He was the only other person to know the password. I would bet my bottom dollar he forgot it pretty quickly.

                There were a few incidents where the vice president called me to do something on my PC on my day off. I was usually at home. I had no reservations about going in. I can’t remember any time I was not home when that happened. Luck for them?

                Yes, I got paid vacations. I had three weeks a year. I achieved that after five years of service. More in part 2. And, I got paid for my time to go into the office to post the daily business and do the reports during any vacation days I took. However, it was not hourly. I was salaried with a bonus. It was computed into my bonus.

                A notation is the owner of the company knew my sacrifices. Our working relationship was closer to a tight friendship than me as his employee. He took care of me on several occasions.

                One was I had an emergency thoracotomy for my right lung. He paid me the whole time I was off. I was not off long enough to collect disability. I was off for two weeks. He took care of me when I left the business too. Nice! Consider we did not have retirement.

                1. Nathanville profile image92
                  Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                  Thanks for your comprehensive reply, which I think has helped to give some clarity.

                  Where you say “I went in on vacation days to post the daily business and do the reporting…” and “There were a few incidents where the vice president called me to do something on my PC on my day off.”  - that is the very stuff of what I often see in American films e.g. in the UK the very idea of going into work while on holiday leave is in all but exceptional circumstances unthinkable.

                  Also, where you say “I got paid for my time to go into the office to post the daily business and do the reports during any vacation days I took.”; in the UK it is illegal to get paid in lieu of holiday leave e.g. if for any reason you have to cancel your holiday because of crisis at work not only would your employer have to pay you, but also you would keep your holiday to use another time – and if you had to go into work outside of your normal working time your employer would have to pay overtime rates e.g. 1.5 x your hourly rate, or double your hourly rate if it’s a Sunday.

                  I can understand the ‘trust’ issue you reference e.g. it’s your PC and the security issues etc. but nevertheless if work needs to be done when you’re not there, surly it’s management issue, and management has the responsibility to train others to cover for you in your absence – and in the UK those others trained up to cover for you would be given their own Computer and Account passwords so that they could log into your PC under their name (for audit purposes). 

                  Thanks for the link showing the average American worker works 38.7 hours per week; in the civil service I worked 37 hours per week, which is above the average for the UK – the average working week in the UK is 35.9 hours per week.

                  I look forward to seeing your part 2:  in the meantime, for comparison between USA & UK, below is a summary of UK Labour Laws (which is very similar to EU Labour Laws):

                  1.    Paid Annual Leave (Vacation): 

                  Under EU & UK laws every single employee, from the time they leave school e.g. from the age of 16, have a legal minimum of six weeks paid leave (vacation) from their first day in work.

                  2.    Sick Leave: 

                  Uncertified sick leave with pay e.g. taking the odd day off without a doctor certificate, such as having an upset stomach:  There is no legal number of sick days an employee is allowed, so it’s up to each employer to set their own limit (which should be reasonable and proportionate – statistically in the UK it’s currently 4.4 days per year.
                  Paid certified sick leave e.g. sick leave with a doctor’s certificate because of flu or a broken leg etc.  The employee is entitled to 28 weeks paid certified sick leave per year.

                  Doctors/Dentist appointments:  An employer has a legal obligation to allow their employees to visit a doctor or dentist during work hours, on full pay.

                  3.    Maternity Leave: 

                  In the UK a woman is entitled to up to 52 weeks maternity leave, of which the first 39 weeks is paid, and the remainder is unpaid.  By law the mother has to legally take at least 2 weeks maternity leave, minimum (after the baby is born).  If the mother choose to take the full 52 weeks maternity leave then her employers is legally obligated to keep her job open for her e.g. employ temporary staff to cover her work until she returns from maternity leave.

                  Paternity Leave:  The father is legally entitled to two week paid paternity leave.

                  Parental Leave:  The mother can choose to give some or most of her maternity leave to the father (parental leave) e.g. the father gets paid for staying at home to look after the baby instead of the mother – or they can split her maternity leave so that the mother has time off before the birth and then both parents stay at home to look after the baby.

                  4.    Flexible Working e.g. part-time, job sharing, flexible hours, home working etc. 

                  In 2014 the UK Conservative Government amended the laws on ‘flexible working’ to make it a legal right for any employee to request ‘flexible working’.  Under the law, an employer doesn’t have to accept the request, but if they don’t they have to give a valid reason for not doing so e.g. if the employer’s reason is wishy-washy then they run the risk of their refusal to flexible working be challenged in an Industrial Tribunal – In the UK the Industrial Tribunal is a ‘free’ government service.

                  This short video is how a Retail Company and Car Manufacturer responded to the new laws on flexible working in the UK – which I think helps to highlight some of the different cultural attitudes between the USA & UK:  https://youtu.be/2Qs0EL6JWD0

                  I’d be interested to hear how the above UK laws and practices differ to the USA.

                  1. tsmog profile image83
                    tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                    Thanks, Nathan! Yes, the UK have embed laws for 'benefits' that we do no have. Hooray, for the UK as I see it. IMHO, the reason we do not is we are centered more on the free trade principle and that should even things out as they say.

                    The relationship of labor with business and the influence of capitalism is at the crux of it as I see it.  Most 'voluntary benefits' becoming typical are the result of unions fighting for them through negotiations and strikes. Yet, one must bear in mind those benefits are really enticements and are not mandatory.

                    A note is this year alone there has been 312 strikes involving 453,000 workers. Many with large unions like United Auto Workers. They are just now coming to agreements with the different manufacturers with workers returning to the assembly line soon. Another significant strike was health care workers, e.g. nurses.

                    Why so many workers are striking in 2023: ‘Strikes can often be contagious,’ says expert by CNBC (Oct 9, 2023)
                    https://www.cnbc.com/2023/10/09/from-ua … -year.html

                    I will post the first part of the part 2 I am working on.

                    Before I get into how the company I worked for set up days off for scheduling purposes, vacation policy, holidays, and pay structure let’s peek at the following regarding what our Federal government says. Remember state laws may vary from one to another. But, Federal law trumps state laws.

                    First, Not all benefits are required by Federal law. Benefits here in the U.S. are two types.

                    Statutory – Those are benefits to full-time employees required by law. Federal statutory legal employee benefits for employers include:

                    ** Social Security and Medicare
                    ** Unemployment insurance
                    ** Workers' compensation insurance
                    ** Family and Medical Leave Act (FMLA) protections

                    Then there are voluntary benefits. Some of those are:

                    ** Paid vacation time
                    ** Contributions to retirement savings plans
                    ** Education assistance
                    ** Wellness programs
                    ** Childcare assistance
                    ** Paid sick leave
                    ** How many days off per workweek
                    ** And, others

                    There are caveats. One is part-time and the other is if a company has 50 or more employees. Also, states have their own laws too. For a full explanation of the Federal laws follow the next link.

                    Mandatory (Statutory) Benefits a Company Must Provide Full-time Employees by PayChex (Updated 08/01/23) It is a 7-minute read.
                    https://www.paychex.com/articles/employ … st-provide

                    I will mention there are laws for pay. One is the minimum wage. The federal minimum wage is $7.25 (£5.99). For people who receive tips, there is a formula for that. The minimum wage for employees who receive tips is $2.13 per hour. The amount of tips plus the $2.13 must reach at least $7.25 per hour. If not, your employer must pay to make up the difference.

                    Additional information is states do set their minimum wage as well as some cities. California, where I live, minimum wage is $15.50 (£12.80). Within the boundaries of San Diego City proper the minimum wage beginning 2024 is $16.85 (£13.91).

                    Of course, any business can have an entry minimum wage. For instance, for In-n-Out Burger starting wage is $19.08 (£15.06).

                    Two is overtime pay. Basically, you are paid overtime when you work over 40 hours per week at the rate of time and a half. Follow the next link for that. Some companies pay time and a half for working on Sundays. But, pay double time for holidays. It varies.

                    However, there are exemptions. Basically, it is for salaried employees. Those are:

                    ** Executive
                    ** Administrative
                    ** Professional
                    ** Computer employee
                    ** Outside Sales representative
                    ** High salaried employees

                    Overtime Pay by the U.S. Dept. of Labor (Very short read)
                    https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/overtime

                    Fact Sheet #17A: Exemption for Executive, Administrative, Professional, Computer & Outside Sales Employees Under the Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA) by the U.S. Dept. of Labor (Kind of a medium read?)
                    https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/fact-s … a-overtime

                    An interesting article about the five-day work is at the next link.
                    A brief history of the five-day workweek by SideKick (11/15/22) 4 minute read
                    https://www.morningbrew.com/sidekick/st … -work-week

                    It is apparent to you I am sure it is quite different than in the U.K. There are many voluntary benefits here that are embedded into the law there.

                    With my part 2, it turns the page to the structure for the company I worked at for twenty-four years before retiring. I am chopping it down now. I think you would find it interesting especially relating it to:

                    ** what the statutory benefits are through Federal law here

                    ** the voluntary benefits that became traditional like paid vacation time

                    ** compare/contrast with your work experience in the UK and overall view of independent private businesses.   

                    Addressing my situation I endured with going in on my vacation time to do the numbers. Remember, I always had the privilege to quit and go somewhere else. So, it is my fault as much as it was the company, right? Also, I did get paid for it through my bonus. 

                    As far as the stringent security with my job and the PC. The only thing I can say is, the owner was burned once for over two million dollars embezzled by an employee. Using his privilege with the computer system he manipulated it to his personal benefit. He was prosecuted, it took over a year for the owner to win the case, yet he never recovered the loss. That is the cause of his trust issue. He had a lot of trust and faith in me.

            2. Nathanville profile image92
              Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

              Thanks for the link to the San Pasqual Battlefield Site Location Project; it was a good read - I and my family love that sort of stuff.  In fact we occasionally take a day trip to Warwickshire Castle and Berkeley Castle, Gloucestershire to see medieval war re-enactments e.g. the War of the Roses (1455 to 1487) and the English Civil War 1642 to 1651.

              The War of the Roses (1455 to 1487) was a civil war in England between the different Royal Houses fighting for the Crown (claim to the throne).  It’s a complex war to explain in just a few words; but in brief summary:-

              The war of the Roses was fought two rival branches of the royal House: The Royal family in Lancashire (red rose) and the royal family in Yorkshire (white rose). The wars extinguished the last male line of the House of Lancaster in 1471, leading to the Tudor royal family to inherit the Lancastrian claim to the throne.  Following the war and the extinction of the last male line of the House of York in 1483, a politically arranged marriage in 1487 united the Houses of Tudor and York, creating a new royal dynasty which inherited the Yorkist claim as well, thereby resolving the conflict.

              The English civil war of 1642 to 1651 is a lot simpler to explain; in simple terms, it was a civil war between Parliament (Government) fighting to impose a Protestant rule over England, against a Catholic King who wanted to keep the religious status quo.

              Both Berkeley Castle (18 miles from where we live) and Warwick Castle (95 miles from where we live) are two fully intact castles that were vital strongholds in the War of the Roses (1455 to 1487) and the English civil war of 1642 to 1651.

              Berkeley Castle was on the side of the Royalists (King/Catholics) during the English civil war and Warwick castle was on the side of the Parliamentarians (Protestants).  Most castles that sided with the Royalists (like Bristol castle) were raised to the ground (destroyed) by Oliver Cromwell, after the civil war – Berkeley Castle somehow escaped that fate.

              Below are a couple of videos I made of the ‘War of the Roses’ from our last trip to Warwick Castle:

              Trebuchet Live Demonstration at Warwick Castle (Trebuchet being the Weapon of Mass Destruction during the War of the Roses) https://youtu.be/peQwMoYGRZE

              Wars of the Roses Re-enactment at Warwick Castle:  https://youtu.be/acqLpUlMHLk?si=cejDTki … &t=240

              The other English civil war was ‘The Anarchy Years’ (1138 to 1153) when two first cousins (Stephen and Matilda) fought each other for the crown; 15 years of ‘no rule of law in England’ (Anarchy).  The war only ended when the church brokered a peace treaty between Stephen and Matilda, and during the peace negotiations Stephen’s son (his chosen heir to the throne died), so instead Stephen agreed that Matilda’s son (Henry) would become King on his death, and that until then Stephen would rule England – the following year Stephen died and Matilda’s son became King Henry II; ending 15 years of anarchy.

              1. tsmog profile image83
                tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                Thanks for the history and the videos. You as I have an interest in history. Fortunately, for you, the history of your country for the European medieval period is in your backyard, literally.

                I began penning a book many years ago about a wayward character, Sir Sremmus, and his adventures in England and later in Scandinavia. The adventure began with the Crusades era. He met Princess Lennas, a warrior princess who brought him to Scandinavia.

                I stopped writing because with learning I recognized I had gotten two eras mixed between themselves and were not historically correct.

                I have an interest in the Norse Viking era from studying literature in Norse mythology. I enjoy Greek mythology as well, yet Norse seems more attractive to me. For a period one could say I was polytheistic in nature.

                1. Nathanville profile image92
                  Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                  Yes, I do feel lucky and privileged to live in a country strewn with countless historic and prehistoric sites dating back over 10 millennia (10 thousand years), the Neolithic period (new stone age).  Whenever on holiday, we almost always make a point of visiting as many as we can wherever we are.

                  With your interest in the Norse Vikings (Vikings from Norway), did you touch on the Danish Vikings (the Danes Vikings)?  The main reason for asking is that from 864 AD until 954 AD England was two countries; Northern England was ruled by the Dane Vikings, and was called Danelaw, while southern England was ruled by the Saxons, and called Wessex (ruled by Edward the Elder) and Mercia (ruled by his sister, Æthelflæd) – see map in this short (2 minute) video below:-

                  What was Viking Danelaw? https://youtu.be/GVhDsGn0Dn0

                  The main reason I referenced Danelaw is that although Northern England was under Viking rule for only a relatively short period (less than 100 years), and it was almost a 1,000 years ago; culturally and socially, the north south divide that is shown in the map, in the above video, still exists to this day!!!

                  People from the North of England have a distinct different characteristic and personality to we southerners e.g. they are noticeably more sociable and friendly, and more willing to share in times of need.  There is also a distinct economic and political divide between the north and south of England e.g. people in the north tend to be less wealthy and less well educated, and until the last General Election a stronghold for the Labour Party (The Red Wall – Red being socialism in Europe, and blue being Conservatives in Europe).  During the last General Election the Conservatives managed to smash the red wall and turn it blue, which helped them to power; and to try to maintain their gain the Conservatives introduced a policy called ‘Levelling Up’ e.g. invest more money in the North in an attempt to buy votes?  However, in spite of the Conservative Government creating a new Government Department called the ‘Department for Levelling Up’, they’ve done a poor job in doing so – so all the signs are is that come the next General Election the Conservatives are likely to lose all or most of the gains they made in the North during the last General Election.

                  Are UK Red Wall Towns Levelling Up?  https://youtu.be/6n7l_zqAXtI

                  NOVEL WRITING
                  Your story line for the book you started writing sounds really interesting; and it’s a shame that you stopped – I don’t see any issue with mixing different eras (artistic licence), as long as you let your readers know what your storyline is based on e.g. The ‘Game of Thrones’ (American fantasy drama TV Series – filmed in Europe).

                  I don’t know if you’ve ever watched the Game of Thrones TV Series.

                  The Game of Thrones was principally based on the English ‘War of the Roses’ (1455-1485), but also takes inspiration from the Roman Empire, the legend of Atlantis, the Viking era and the ‘hundred year’s war’ (war between France and Britain) from 1337 to 1453 etc.

                  In spite of mixing and matching different eras, the Game of Thrones was a very successful and popular TV Series; and in watching it, where you are familiar with a particular historical fact or setting e.g. Hadrian’s Wall, it can be fun spotting it in the TV Series.

                  The film locations included Northern Ireland, Iceland, Croatia and Spain have become big tourist attractions by fans:

                  Top 10 Game of Thrones Locations You Actually Can Visit https://youtu.be/04fdHz7Yi44

                  1. tsmog profile image83
                    tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                    Yeah, I should take up the pen again and work on that book. There is a fellow writer here at HP from northern England somewhere near the Scottish border. He is a historian and his articles here on HP are on Great Britain's history.

                    I fail to remember his name right now. Old guy stuff, my memory challenges. If I do remember I will post it for you. You two would get along great. He is in my eyes very knowledgeable. It was with a few back-and-forth conversations with him that I realized the timeline for my book was askew.

                    Anyway, he is why I stopped writing realizing the significance of being historically correct unless consider it historical fiction. That is the genre The Game of Thrones falls into alongside fantasy I presume.

                    No, I didn't see that series as I have basic cable. It streamed on a cable network station. I don't get those as basic is what fits my budget.

        2. Nathanville profile image92
          Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

          Thanks for the link – I loved the upside-down horse shoe (sends a strong message); although you’ve previously gone to great lengths to explain the American healthcare system to me, I still found your article hard reading because it’s all alien to me e.g. when my wife fell ill on holiday, and needed antibiotics urgently, all she did was dial 111 on her smart phone and within hours she had her antibiotics (free phone call, free prescription, and no paperwork) – Such a simple process compared to the complexities of the American system.

          In digesting the rest of your post:-

          In the UK, the form of fear the conservative have is panic in the realisation that they are almost certainly going to lose heavily to Labour – and with panic comes mistakes e.g. the Conservatives are panicking, and making mistakes in their policy direction, which will lose them as many votes as it gains.  The latest example (this week) is the fiasco over Section 21 (no-fault eviction) of the Housing Act introduced by the Conservative Government in 1988, it allows a landlord to evict a tenant without giving a reason; prior to that Act it would take over six months to get an eviction through the Courts.  To appease the voters (in the run up to the General Election next year) the current Conservative Government wants to repeal that section of the Act, but due to a large number of Conservative rebels (worried about losing votes from landlords) the Government has now delayed the process of the Bill through Parliament indefinitely.

          As well as fear and anger influencing voting, other emotions like ‘expectation’ can motivate voters e.g. the groundswell in support of the Green Party will encourage more voters in Britain to vote Green, with the prospect that the Green Party may well pick up a few more seats in the next General Election.  Speaking with my next door neighbour (during a social chat and drink a few weeks ago), he’s far more left wing than I am, so much so that the Labour Party is too right-wing for him, so he was intending not voting in the next General Election (despondent, apathy etc.); but on learning that voter popularity in Bristol is on the rise (the Greens now have a majority of seats in the Bristol local government), he has now decided that come the General Election he is going to vote Green.

          Yeah, anger (in its many forms) is certainly a motivator to get people voting.  The main issues you listed in your post as main issues from the Conservative perspective included the Economy, Immigration and Transgenderism.

          In the UK - Public Opinion - Voting Issues (as at 16th October), as follows:

          •    Economy = 56%
          •    NHS = 45%
          •    Immigration = 35%
          •    Environment = 25%
          •    Housing = 21%
          •    Crime = 21%
          •    Brexit = 15%
          •    Education = 14%
          •    Defence = 13%
          •    Tax = 11%
          •    Welfare Benefits (Social Security) = 9%
          •    Pensions = 6%
          •    Family life and childcare = 6%
          •    Transport = 4%

          So if a Political Party wants to win votes in the General Election next year in the UK they need to focus on the first six issues listed above.  The only one of the top six that the current UK Conservative Government has a good track record on is the Environment.

          Yes, where you say “once a price increases due to inflation rarely does it go back to where it started from before the climb” is largely true; but there are some notable exceptions, for example:-

          1.    I don’t know about the USA, but petrol (gas) although in the long term the trend is upward, in the medium term petrol prices in the UK fluctuate daily (sometimes quite dramatically up or down from week to week) e.g. last year, due to the Ukrainian war petrol prices in Britain shot-up overnight from around £1.50 ($1.84) per litre to £2.00 ($2.46) per litre, but then after a few weeks started to slowly fall again; and currently it’s back to around £1.50 ($1.84) per litre.

          2.    Seasonal crops, like potatoes go up and down throughout the year dramatically, but when in season can be quite cheap.

          3.    Also, in the UK there is a lot of stiff competition between the different supermarkets (large food shops) e.g. price wars; so if you shop around there are always bargains to be had e.g. products at half price etc.  That’s why we have a food store in our back garden e.g. my wife buys food products in bulk when they are cheap and keep them in our store; that way we save over $500 a year on our food bill.

          4.    But the one product area that does buck the trend is electronic equipment e.g. new technology tends to be very expensive when it’s first released, but over time it becomes cheaper and cheaper.  A prime examples are computers; 20 years ago the general rule of thumb for UK prices was around £300 for a level entry computer, £600 for a mid-range computer, and about £900 as the starting price for a high-end computer; today (over 20 years later) new computers are generally the same price in monetary terms e.g. much cheaper in real terms.

          I found your comment ‘though provoking’:  so above are just my first impression, random thoughts, triggered by your comments.  You’ve raised some interesting points for me to ponder; plenty for me to contemplate.

          1. tsmog profile image83
            tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

            Yes, most definitely the NHS is far and above what we have here. If I was in the situation as your wife for immediate care I would have three avenues.

            ** Go to my medical group Express Care which accepts walk-ins. But if I was out of town that won't work.

            ** With my present medical group I can do a video visit. But, I don't own a smartphone. So, if in your situation I would be out of luck. 

            ** Go to a hospital emergency room. That is what I would have to do if out of town.

            There may be other options I am not aware of.

            As far as pricing goes I am sharing about California. Our gas prices are the highest in the nation and a large margin compared to some states.

            Gasoline (Petrol) per gallon (3.75 liters)
            Aug 31, 2020 = $3.16 £2.58
            Aug 31, 2021 = $4.32 £3.52
            Aug 31, 2022 = $5.33 £4.35
            Aug 31, 2023 = $5.13 £4.19

            Data from California Retail Gas Price by YCharts
            https://ycharts.com/indicators/californ … ne_monthly

            Food
            Annual decreases (September 2022 to September 2023) have been most dramatic among the following indexes:

            ** Eggs (-14.5%).
            ** Other pork including roasts, steaks, and ribs (-4.3%).
            ** Oranges, including tangerines (-4.1%).
            ** Butter (-4%).
            ** Lettuce (-2.8%).
            ** Cheese and related products (-2.8%).

            Annual increases (September 2022 to September 2023) have been most dramatic among the following indexes:

            ** Frozen noncarbonated juices and drinks (+21.3%).
            ** Frozen vegetables (+11.6%).
            ** Uncooked beef steaks (+9.7%).
            ** White bread (+7.8%).
            ** Beef and veal (+7%).
            ** Crackers, bread, and cracker products (+6.9%).

            The Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) also found that:

            ** The index for food at home (groceries) is 2.4% higher year-over-year. From August to September, grocery costs increased slightly by 0.2%.

            **Restaurant patrons are still paying more (6.0%) for food than they did a year ago. And the price index rose 0.4% from August to September.

            ** Specifically, limited service meals (takeout only) rose 6.4% year-over-year, while full-service (sit-down restaurant) meals rose 5.1% year-over-year.

            ** Overall, the annual inflation rate has been declining.

            The Cost of Groceries: Are Food Prices Going Up?
            Food prices in August 2023 increased 4.3% from the same time in 2022.
            https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/fina … ce-of-food

            My natural gas this year went up close to 50%. That means electricity went up too because the plants run on natural gas. But, the state gave us two forms of credit to us for four months which took a big chunk out of the total billing.

            I get an advertisement/newsletter from Newegg a computer/electronics mass merchandiser. I am into computers as in building them and thus design. Yes, electronics of all sorts are inexpensive. I keep a close eye on computer components with the dream of building another one if I find some money somewhere ha-ha

            Newegg
            https://www.newegg.com/

            1. Nathanville profile image92
              Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

              This is just a quick response to your last paragraph, and a quick mention about ‘smartphones’ (which you mentioned) - as our friend from Portsmouth is due to arrive shortly with the lens and camera for my son, and he will be staying with us for a few days; so I’ll reply to the other parts of your post later in the week.

              Earlier this year, with help from our friend from Portsmouth, we custom built a new high-end computer for me and my wife – using the latest and most expensive components (no expense spared); which cost around $6,000.  Super-fast and highly powerful – it takes just 15 seconds from switching it on until it’s in Windows and ready to go; and opening programs is instant as I’ve installed Solid State Hard Drives (no moving parts); and its heavy and big – it took two of us to carry it up the stairs to our home-office, and it fits under the desk with about an inch to spare.

              We’ve only had smartphones for a couple of years, before that we had old bricks that did nothing other than make and receive phone calls. 

              I originally got myself and my wife a mobile phone each form O2 (service provider), on the same contract, hence on a family discount (two phones) back in 2000, for just $6 each per month. 

              A couple of years ago, without any notice O2 put the monthly subscription up from $6 per phone per month to about $30.  Rather than complaining, and having an argument with them, I just looked around for a new contract for smartphones, and found that Virgin Media was offering a phone deal for Apple iPhone 10 for just $10 per phone per month, with free phone calls, free text and 2GB free cloud storage.  And in getting two phones on the same contract (one each for me and my wife) they gave me a $2.50 monthly discount (family discount). 

              I took the offer, and once the new phones arrived I dialled the special number that automatically transfers your old mobile phone number to your new mobile phone; and within two minutes of me transferring the phone numbers over O2 phoned me to ask why I had changed Service Provider (in the hope of getting me to change my mind – which obviously I wasn’t going to do, and which the O2 chap at the other end understood, once I’d explained how they pushed their prices up without notice.  The chap was very apologetic, and to my surprise O2 refunded the money they took, back into my bank account a few days later – which was nice of them, as I didn’t even bother asking them to do that as I didn’t expect them to.

              Anyway, an ironic twist to the tale is that earlier this year Virgin Media sold their mobile phone service to O2 – So I’m back with O2 again; on the same price deal, but with improved conditions e.g. Free Cloud Storage increased from 2Gb to 10Gb, not that I use it because I regularly transfer any photos and videos I take on the smart phone to my computer anyway.

              And for the smart phones, I’m now paying $10 per month, per phone, subscription; compared to $6 per month per phone over 20 years ago for old bricks – So in real terms (taking 70% inflation into account since 2000), I’m paying about the same (in real terms) now for our mobile phones that I was paying over 20 years ago, but with a much improved technology.

            2. Nathanville profile image92
              Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

              Thanks for the link to your California Retail Gas Price chart; I found a similar chart for the UK that goes back to 2004 (image below); and comparing the two charts from October 2018 (which is when the California chart starts) the charts for both California and the UK have the same rollercoaster pattern e.g. oil prices in both are reflected by world events.

              https://hubstatic.com/16774176.jpg

              For a more direct comparison, I’ve taken the data you’ve provided for the four dates and crossed referenced them with the UK, as shown in the chart below:

              https://hubstatic.com/16774175.jpg

              The reason petrol (gasoline) is far more expensive in the UK & EU is that ever since the oil crisis of the 1970s European countries has always heavily tax petrol (gasoline).

              I haven’t been able to compile such a detailed grocery list of food inflation over the last 12 months, as you; although as in the USA, different food items have gone either up or down in prices dependent on supply and demand for that product.

              So instead, I’ve looked at UK inflation from September 2013 to September 2023 (ten years); which includes total inflation and food inflation separately – See chart below.

              UK inflation Sept 2022 to September 2023 was 6.3% (dark blue line in chart below), helped by the fall in the annual rate of food inflation from its peak of 19.2% (light blue line in chart) in March 2023 down to 12.2% in September 2023.

              Interestingly, looking at the chart, in the UK we actually had deflation in food prices from May 2014 to Jan 2017, and again from Nov 2020 to July 2021 e.g. food price changes below the ‘0’ (in the negative).

              https://hubstatic.com/16774178.jpg

              Yep, likewise, because of the world shortage of natural gas due to the Ukrainian war, the price of electricity and gas in the UK has risen by over 54% since April 2022; and likewise, last winter the UK Government automatically paid for a large chunk of the increased cost for every household on their domestic utility bills.

              1. tsmog profile image83
                tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                I can see it easily with the charts/graphics. Thank you for providing the comparison too. Yes, my friend in Sweden and I chat about gas prices now and then. I know prices are high in the UK and EU.

                One thing to bear in mind and is of importance. The gas prices I shared are for where I live California, not the U.S. California is the highest for gas prices by leaps and bounds. And, it varies by county and if a city or not. Right now the Chevron I use is at $5.59 for regular (£4.61). For California, today's (10/29/23) average for regular gas is $5.30 (£4.37).

                For the state of Georgia, it is $2.97 (£2.45). The average for all states is $3.45 (£2.85). As seen a big difference. I frown when I hear someone here on HP complaining about gas prices. wink

                See the following link for gas prices by state from AAA I think they update it daily, so the prices may have changed from what I just quoted. There is a map too showing each state color-coded for grouped prices.

                https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/

                1. Nathanville profile image92
                  Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                  Wow, that is a big variation from State to State; the map clearly shows that the West is generally a lot more expensive than the East. 

                  In the UK there are slight variations from petrol station to petrol station; with the most expensive tending to be on the motorways (motorway services) – but the variations in price is never more than $0.25.

                  So when we travel we never fill up on the motorway, we look for a petrol station in a town or city near wherever we are; and to ensure we get the cheapest price my wife uses an ‘app’ on her smart phone that lists all the petrol stations near where we are, highlights the cheapest ones, and gives sat-nav type directions.

                  PetrolPrices app: To find cheap petrol prices near you: https://youtu.be/fmw6vSzxOH8

                  If the Tesco petrol station is one of the cheapest (as it often is) then my wife will head for a Tesco petrol station because she has a Tesco Loyalty card, and earns points for buying petrol from a Tesco petrol station, which she can subsequently redeem in a Tesco supermarket (food store).

                  Tesco Loyalty Card: How it Works: https://youtu.be/O5dtKgaFLjg

                  The above video makes a passing reference to the ‘Supermarket Price Comparison’ App, which we also use to compare prices between competing supermarkets, so that we can buy our food from whichever is the cheapest at the time – and when they offer ‘free home delivery’ (which one or the other of the supermarkets does periodically) then we opt for a home delivery e.g. saves us time and petrol cost.

                  1. tsmog profile image83
                    tsmogposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                    Yup, quite a variance between the states. I didn't notice the gradual decrease from the West to the East Coast until you pointed it out. I just knew the East Coast was cheaper. 

                    Interestingly enough, California has 17 refineries and is an oil-producing state. The refineries supposedly are sufficient for the demands of the state. So, why a higher price?

                    Environmental costs plus maintenance are continual at the refineries. Some of our largest spikes come from refineries being taken offline for maintenance. 

                    Yes, we have rewards programs giving us discounts on gas. Not quite the same system as the Tesco Loyalty card. There are rewards programs with the gas companies themselves, banking/credit card usage, and major grocery chains.

                    The rewards can be used for discounts. In the grocery store I shop at, Albertsons, rewards can be exchanged at 1 reward = $0.10 off per gallon with a singular fill-up. (£.08 - I don't know what that means per liter) You can use multiple rewards with the same singular fill-up.

                    You earn 1 point for every $1 (£0.82) spent in the store. It takes 100 points for one reward.

                    It doesn't help me, I am afraid. My weekly grocery expense is from $50 ( £41) to sometimes higher than $70 (£58). So, it takes a while to accumulate enough rewards to make a difference. Plus, I only get gas close to every other month. I drive about 2000 miles a year (3218 km).

                    Your guide to gas rewards programs by BankRate (05/03/23)
                    https://www.bankrate.com/finance/credit … ams-guide/

                    Question: What is diesel usage like in your neck of the woods? Here, besides being used with large commercial trucks and 18-wheelers, it is used with some large pickup trucks (3/4 ton - 1-ton models) and mainly imported cars. Mercedes is popular.

      2. Castlepaloma profile image76
        Castlepalomaposted 4 months agoin reply to this

        Tony Blair lost his election really bad over 9/11. Looks like Biden is using Hamas vs Israel another 9/11 false flag :to help his losing polls to Trump. Politician and wars are the ultimate part of their insanity. They better get a handle on this one.

        1. Nathanville profile image92
          Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

          You need to check your facts; 9/11 was in 2001 - Labour didn't loose power until 2010 e.g. following the UK economy taking a nosedive due to the worldwide financial crisis of 2008.

          1. Castlepaloma profile image76
            Castlepalomaposted 4 months agoin reply to this

            UK didn't realize how terrible the wars were on their economy until then.  Bush  was also very popular over 9/11.  Today generally public learned how much they are just Globalist puppets.

            1. Nathanville profile image92
              Nathanvilleposted 4 months agoin reply to this

              The Iraqi war and Afghanistan war had nothing to do with the UK economy; the UK economy took a nosedive years later, in 2008/09 because of the banking crisis in America.

              On 15 September 2008 the investment bank Lehman Brothers collapsed, sending shockwaves through the global financial system and beyond - causing  the most severe worldwide economic crisis since the Great Depression of 1929.

              1. Castlepaloma profile image76
                Castlepalomaposted 4 months agoin reply to this

                Hope I don't understand Politics and the head of the snake financial institutions as well as you do. I prefer to simplify and nothing is worst than murder and stealing

    5. peterstreep profile image81
      peterstreepposted 3 months agoin reply to this

      Fear and Anger are both emotions that are contagious.
      I think social media has a lot to answer for. Millions of experts ventilate their opinions about this or that without having actual knowledge. Influencers talking about stuff they don't know anything about, but are heard by billions of followers.
      Conspiracy theories are also highly contagious. broadcasters like Joe Rogan are terrible for society as he is a spreader of fake news and not making a distinction between fact or fiction. The only thing that counts is the mighty dollar bill. And if you can get more viewers by getting people upset and angry than by giving people courage and advice, talkshows will make people angry and upset.
      Fear sells and anger sells, and as the US finds money more important than anything else the results are that lies spread like viruses and undermine the democracy itself.

      1. Nathanville profile image92
        Nathanvilleposted 3 months agoin reply to this

        Yep, absolutely; and yes, as you say "Conspiracy theories are also highly contagious." smile

      2. tsmog profile image83
        tsmogposted 3 months agoin reply to this

        Agreed to social media's influence and as you say through influencers not only lacking in knowledge, yet a semblance of truth. I don't know about where you are, but here one current trend with Tik-Tok and Instagram is antisemitism. Some from what I hear are pretty vile and hateful.

  2. Kathryn L Hill profile image76
    Kathryn L Hillposted 4 months ago

    "Good governance, good journalism, good scholarship, and good citizenship depend on knowing the valuable roles, that anger and fear play."


    We must see and understand the anger and fear that lingers within the human psyche.

    ROLES????

    1. Kathryn L Hill profile image76
      Kathryn L Hillposted 4 months agoin reply to this

      What about the role of bravery?
      What emotion is bravery dependent on?
      Confidence?
      Confidence in what one is consciously aware of?

      Conscious awareness depends on the knowledge one acquires by the diligent search for the truth and the facts.

      Conclusion:  People should vote according to their conscious awareness of what is real and true.

      1. Castlepaloma profile image76
        Castlepalomaposted 4 months agoin reply to this

        Funny, my consciousness tells me not to vote. Cutting the stress or any unethical psychopaths leading me down a world of broken promises and lies.

  3. tsmog profile image83
    tsmogposted 4 months ago

    Anger. Fear. Democracy. Voting. Connected?

    That is the title of this OP!

    However, in another time and another place . . . .

    Jim Jordan lost the third round of voting!!

    I just now 9:53 am PDT got a notice from CNN Breaking News

    News Alert: Jim Jordan loses third vote for House speaker as he resists pressure to drop out of the race

    Republican Rep. Jim Jordan again failed to win the speaker’s gavel in a third vote on Friday, a loss that comes as he faces growing pressure from within his own party to drop out of the race and the House remains in a state of paralysis.

    Does the OP title apply? I wonder?

    UPDATE

    The latest on the House speaker fight

    Rep. Jim Jordan, R-Ohio, is no longer the speaker nominee. A secret ballot taken in the House caucus this afternoon had 112 ballots cast against him and 86 in favor, sources told NBC News.

  4. tsmog profile image83
    tsmogposted 4 months ago

    Breaking News - NBC on 10/24/23 at 7:45 PDT

    Mike Johnson clinches GOP nomination for House speaker: Live updates

    The House has been left rudderless for weeks after Kevin McCarthy was ousted from the top spot and three nominees to replace him dropped out of the running.
    https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congre … rcna121674

    After a day of playing pinball finally, there is a candidate to vote on for House Speaker. Hooray!! Seems a decision can be made in a timely fashion, huh? Unsure of that conclusion since it has been around three weeks without a speaker. Gasp!

    Vegas odds now have him pegged at about +800 with a 12% chance. It may be too early to determine those numbers, but, hey, got to start somewhere, right?

  5. tsmog profile image83
    tsmogposted 4 months ago

    Breaking News

    There is a new king in the House. Mike Johnson was elected as Speaker. Finally, there is a chance of stability and movement in one direction or another. Some say that is progress.

    1. Sharlee01 profile image79
      Sharlee01posted 4 months agoin reply to this

      Trump has offered support for Mike Johnson.  I know nothing about this man, he flys below the radar.

    2. Credence2 profile image79
      Credence2posted 4 months agoin reply to this

      I know who this Mike Johnson reminded me of, a character from an old early 1950s sitcom.  The title character played by the late Wally Cox, Mr. Peepers.....

      https://www.abebooks.co.uk/first-editio … &pid=1

  6. Kathleen Cochran profile image78
    Kathleen Cochranposted 3 months ago

    When a political party or a religion spend most of their time trying to convince you to be afraid of something or a litany of somethings - it's time to find a new one.

    1. Sharlee01 profile image79
      Sharlee01posted 3 months agoin reply to this

      Kathleen  --- Or try to convince you all is well when it is not.

      The acceptability of a political party or movement often depends on individual perspectives, values, and priorities. However, many people at this point do seem to appreciate political entities that don't address crises with a balanced and pragmatic approach or even acknowledge the severity of the issues at hand or work towards effective solutions.

      A party that excessively focuses on bloviating or exaggerating policy wins without meaningful policies or actions to support their views, can ultimately be seen as untruthful.

      Ideally, political parties that engage in responsible governance and effective problem-solving are more likely to garner citizen's support. This form of governing involves acknowledging the seriousness of crises, proposing evidence-based solutions, and fostering open and transparent communication with the public.

      Hopefully,  a majority of voters may favor parties that prioritize addressing issues with a clear understanding of their severity and a commitment to implementing practical, well-thought-out solutions.

      1. tsmog profile image83
        tsmogposted 3 months agoin reply to this

        Focusing, ONLY, on crisis is debatable if it garners support. Frankly. yes, tell me about the crisis from that political individual's perspective, but that person damn well better present reasonable solutions. Not radical ones that will further divide the nation that will send it in a tailspin worse than it is.

        I don't see that much in my view. Maybe I am blind to it. I see condemnation, the opposing side is evil, and the nation is going to Hell in a handbasket. That does not solve anything.

        Just, a perspective, and everyone has their own unique reality while seeking agreement and a sense of belonging. Perhaps, sadly, I personally feel no sense of belonging to either party at this time. Maybe I must be plain weird.

        1. Nathanville profile image92
          Nathanvilleposted 3 months agoin reply to this

          Not weird at all – In Britain you’d be classified as a ‘floating voter’.  As shown in the graph below, currently about a third of the British voting population are floating voters; and those are the voters that the political parties try to entice to their side during Elections.

          https://hubstatic.com/16790343_f1024.jpg

        2. Sharlee01 profile image79
          Sharlee01posted 3 months agoin reply to this

          "Focusing, ONLY, on crisis is debatable if it garners support. Frankly. yes, tell me about the crisis from that political individual's perspective, but that person damn well better present reasonable solutions. Not radical ones that will further divide the nation that will send it in a tailspin worse than it is"

          I'm seeking a leader who recognizes the gravity of crises, advocates for solutions grounded in evidence, and prioritizes open and transparent communication with the citizens. It's disheartening to hear claims about the thriving economy when my personal finances indicate otherwise. As an adult, being told to simply "eat your vegetables" feels patronizing and dismissive. An insult to my intelligence.

          " I see condemnation, the opposing side is evil, and the nation is going to Hell in a handbasket. That does not solve anything."

          Certainly, I concur. Nevertheless, I pose a direct inquiry. Isn't the nation currently grappling with a multitude of crises, each seemingly spiraling out of control simultaneously? Do you perceive the escalating national debt as a cause for concern? Moreover, do you acknowledge the challenges associated with accommodating millions of migrants, bearing in mind our responsibility for their education, healthcare, and often housing? Additionally, do you view the financial backing of two ongoing wars as a problematic issue? I'll conclude here, as I could elaborate extensively on this matter.

          It appears imperative for us, as Americans, to seek a president who is more inclined to address our existing issues rather than persist on a course that exacerbates them.

          Malevolence is evident in Washington, spanning across various factions. Should we merely express our concern and resort to crafting philosophical statements? Is the nation not facing a downward spiral? I invite you to highlight any positive aspects you perceive in the current state of the nation.

          I find myself detached from allegiance to any party or even to the nation in its present form. There's a sense of shame for both its government and, regrettably, a portion of its populace. The time for avoiding direct discussions has passed.

          1. tsmog profile image83
            tsmogposted 3 months agoin reply to this

            "Certainly, I concur. Nevertheless, I pose a direct inquiry. Isn't the nation currently grappling with a multitude of crises, each seemingly spiraling out of control simultaneously? Do you perceive the escalating national debt as a cause for concern? Moreover, do you acknowledge the challenges associated with accommodating millions of migrants, bearing in mind our responsibility for their education, healthcare, and often housing? Additionally, do you view the financial backing of two ongoing wars as a problematic issue? I'll conclude here, as I could elaborate extensively on this matter."

            Firstly are you suggesting I am ignorant of those? Seems so, from my perspective. Why?

            Foregoing philosophy . . .

            What are the solutions being offered? I would rather you point out those that our current political leaders campaigning for the top seat in government are proposing. Perhaps I am blind to that.

            I have seen a bit and a byte about their past performances in their careers. Kudos to them. Am I to assume that as a go-getter they 'automatically' will solve our problems today? Simply trust them and have faith? My Lord, half the nation did that last time, right? Lesson learned!!

            I certainly haven't seen proposed solutions and I at least skim about a dozen newsletters everyday. I hear they will fix this and that, but I want to know how. I do see send me money or buy a Trump bobble head or collector's card. I have checked their websites, too!

            As far as that goes the same with House leadership. For at least a decade or more all I see from that institution is investigate this or that. I don't care who held the majority.

            As pointed out our border  is a mess. I live it being in the San Diego area. I don't need to be informed it is mess. How about the House get off their silly butts and get some legislation going on new immigration laws. Is that a novel idea?

            Yes, I know the differences between the ideologies very well! Ideologies are not solutions in my mind. I want concrete solutions being presented, not as inferred the evils of the other party or the much discussed dementia of Biden as the cause of all things going to hell in a hand basket. We are stuck with him and have been!

            I want to know what a supposed replacement is going to do! I believe I am capable of a compare/contrast, but what am I do that with.

            In other words, I am not going to just assume the conservative/Republican ideology/Party platform is the solution. I respectfully would like to hear or read something that will entice my vote. Then again, as said, I may simply be uniformed or blind. I don't mind being told I am ignorant or stupid. As they say 'sticks and stones'.

            Forgive the little rant . . .

            1. Sharlee01 profile image79
              Sharlee01posted 3 months agoin reply to this

              "Firstly are you suggesting I am ignorant of those? Seems so, from my perspective. Why?"

              No, I meant no offense. Note my lead in " I pose a direct inquiry".
              I simply wanted to see if you feel these problems exist. I am very sure you realize many do not see any of the above-mentioned as true problems, and vehemently will debate the opposite.

              Just trying to get an idea if we are even indirectly on the same wavelength.  I was too direct. My apology.

              I do not argue for what you have shared, nor do I have solutions to how we as a people can truely set the ship right. I do know we can't be complacent.

              In my view, both political parties bear responsibility for disregarding the voices of the people, often tailoring their messages to manipulate public opinion. There's a blatant disregard for consistency, as they fail to reconcile current statements with contradictory ones from the past.

              In my opinion, the grand experiment we once held dear seems to have concluded. I previously in another thread outlined the qualities I seek in a leader, avoiding allegiance to any specific party. However, when I recently asked others to nominate a potential president, few could propose a suitable candidate. This raises the question of whether we, as a collective, are the root of the issue. If we struggle to identify a worthy leader, what does that imply?

              So, is the blame on the politicians, or have we, through our failure to hold them accountable, empowered their actions? It appears that many now vote for someone they don't vehemently oppose—using a strong term deliberately, as witnessed in the 2020 election. It seems likely that, once again, we'll reluctantly align with a candidate, holding our noses in the process.

              My intention wasn't to insult you but rather to highlight the uncomfortable reality of our current political climate. I appreciate that instead of engaging in a contentious debate about my concerns, you responded with vigor, offering more insight into your preferences for a candidate. Regarding how they would fix problems, rather than just talking about problems.  I now better understand your perspective and value the direct and honest way you expressed your thoughts.

              1. tsmog profile image83
                tsmogposted 3 months agoin reply to this

                Sharlee . . . I apologize if too candid. Consider I did not enter into the game of politics as a close observer until 2015. I was as many call it a sheeple voting the Republican party ticket since '72. I towed the line as they say. So, in essence I am just now learning how the game is played, and, frankly I feel it is lacking in integrity and authenticity.

                I was not really impressed with both candidates for 2016. My BS detector for both was like a gong heard for miles. It didn't change for 2020.

                My idea for what a leader should be is based on my experiences with business while being closely tied to the leaders I not only worked for, but side by side.

                Maybe my perspective may be skewed as the company I worked placed an emphasis on performance in that there must be a plan, work the plan, assess constantly, make adjustments, and continue.

                Each of the 24 store managers and 2 warehouse managers along with departments heads were held to the fire for that. The corporate managers did that also with the store managers and department heads.

                And, they were required to have weekly meetings to share those plans with the employees, the workers, and  in the sense of our nation . . . the people who are voters.

                Communication is 'Key'! I take the perspective if I don't know what the plan is or understand it then it is the leaders fault and they have the responsibility to correct it.

                That is my view of expectation for the leaders of our nation.

        3. Ken Burgess profile image79
          Ken Burgessposted 3 months agoin reply to this

          True, and I would suppose I have espoused the "opposing side is evil, and the nation is going to hell" more than once, in a variety of ways.

          However, if one identifies a problem, the first thing to solving the problem is identifying it, getting others to identify it as such, so that more people are aware of it, and if nothing else, voting and acting with that knowledge.

          It is important not to pretend, to be able to differentiate between MSM messaging and reality.  If one believes something, its not a bad idea to try and forward that information to others.

          I have been posting here for more than a decade, we have debated a lot of things, all throughout the Obama and Trump years, even under the influence of Fox News, I rarely, if ever, used the word evil.

          Unfortunately, we have arrived at a time where I recognize what we have for an Administration today as such, based on their actions and where they are leading the nation.

          1. tsmog profile image83
            tsmogposted 3 months agoin reply to this

            No disagreement, Ken. However, the sad part in my mind is as a nation, we have an ingrained Dichotomous Thinking Mindset through Conditioning. That stymies creative thought needed for solutions, which is a very important part of problem-solving from my understanding and studies.

            Yes, most certainly one party or the other will solve 'Some' problems while those will be much more aimed at the extreme fringes. Black then white, then black, then white. At least that is what I have observed in at least the last two decades. So, what has been happening is nothing gets done in the middle where, to me, the bulk of the challenges are. Progress as a 'Whole Nation' goes nowhere.

            However, as I shared with Sharlee, perhaps, I am ignorant, stupid, blind, or just a crotchety old guy, At least offered were four choices to choose from.

            1. Ken Burgess profile image79
              Ken Burgessposted 3 months agoin reply to this

              I think it is far more than a, we see things in Black or White.

              We see lies as truth, truth as lies, we've created a culture where being a victim is status, being a race means benefits, what sex you are is a choice, and so on.

              The Biden Administration is so corrupt and so dismissive of regulations and laws its not any one thing, it is all things.

              For instance, a House committee is investigating the Biden administration’s SEC for quietly working with its European Union counterparts to make European regulations as impactful as possible.

              Why does that Matter?

              Because in the process, the SEC is, as several U.S. lawmakers observed, “willfully circumventing the U.S. regulatory process by actively coordinating with foreign governments to dictate climate and economic policy to U.S. companies.” At the same time, the SEC has proposed its crushing Climate Disclosure Rule.

              In short, the Biden Administration is using the EU to force ESG, Equity, and all sorts of other BS down America's throat.

              And it is everything they do... Executive Orders to give Transgenders special protections and rights... funding wars no American wants to fund, even when the House shoots it down.  Its totally out of "the people's" control.

  7. Sharlee01 profile image79
    Sharlee01posted 3 months ago

    The acceptability of a political party or movement often depends on individual perspectives, values, and priorities. However, many people at this point do seem to appreciate political entities that don't address crises with a balanced and pragmatic approach or even acknowledge the severity of the issues at hand or work towards effective solutions.

    A party that excessively focuses on bloviating or exaggerating policy wins without meaningful policies or actions to support their views, can ultimately be seen as untruthful.

    Ideally, political parties that engage in responsible governance and effective problem-solving are more likely to garner citizen's support. This form of governing involves acknowledging the seriousness of crises, proposing evidence-based solutions, and fostering open and transparent communication with the public.

    Hopefully,  a majority of voters may favor parties that prioritize addressing issues with a clear understanding of their severity and a commitment to implementing practical, well-thought-out solutions.

  8. Ken Burgess profile image79
    Ken Burgessposted 3 months ago

    I swear you can't make this stuff up...

    Biden's Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) has implemented a new gender pronoun policy, requiring employees to use preferred pronouns or face firing.

    The move has been criticized by a former HHS official, Roger Severino, who argues that it violates employee rights and forces individuals to speak falsehoods.

    “HHS and the federal government is requiring its employees to speak falsehoods,” Severino stated.

    The Harvard graduate posted that HHS “imposed a transgender pronoun mandate on its employees who will now be forced to deny biological realities with their own words or face firing.”

    He pressed that the First Amendment serves as protection to staff from being forced to do so, as the move requires many employees to reject their own faith for the sake of embracing the State’s ideology.

    “These policies would require all of those things,” said Severino.

    The policy, supported by White House executive orders, aims to combat gender discrimination and protect gender identity rights.

    “All employees should be addressed [by] the names and pronouns they use to describe themselves,” an HHS email read.

    “All applicants and employees should be addressed by the names and pronouns they use to describe themselves. Using correct names and pronouns helps foster workplaces free of discrimination and harassment,” a statement by the U.S. Office of Personnel Management reads.

    The policy also allows individuals to use facilities based on their gender identity, raising concerns about privacy and civil rights.

    “Men who identify as female have the right to get naked in front of female colleagues in the locker room,” Severino pressed.

    “It used to be that if you allowed a man to get naked in front of a woman in the workplace that is instantly a violation of civil rights law,” he went on.

    “That’s the quintessential hostile work environment, subjecting women to that. Now, the policy says to the women who may be uncomfortable with that situation, they’re the ones who have to leave.”

    “Governments cannot compel speech and certainly cannot compel false speech,” he added, referring to West Virginia vs. Barnette.

    “We protect the right of political dissent and here it’s a pledge of allegiance to the Rainbow flag that’s been essentially required.”

    “They are faced with a horrible dilemma,” Severino said of employees with conflicting faith. “Do they hope that they can fly under the radar and try to avoid the issue and keep a low profile and perhaps hide their faith so they can keep their job, or do they stand up and say this policy is wrong and fight for their rights? And then see a gigantic target on their back after that.”

    Severino highlights the potential negative impact on morale and production among government employees.

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/biden … b&ei=3

    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/new-or … gal-expert

 
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