Heterophobia on HubPages and anywhere else...

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  1. Uninvited Writer profile image80
    Uninvited Writerposted 14 years ago

    So why hasn't all this happened in the past 40 years?

    1. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I dunno.  Maybe because before now we didn't have an abominable President foolish enough to try to demoralize our children.

      1. Uninvited Writer profile image80
        Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Lol, you make me laugh lol

        1. profile image0
          Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          As you wish.
          But it's not a laughing matter.

  2. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    Well, that answers it for me pretty clearly, Brenda.

    I would urge you to take note of James 3:1-12.  I will include them here for your easy reference, in their completion.

    1  Not many of you should presume to be teachers, my brothers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly. 2  We all stumble in many ways. If anyone is never at fault in what he says, he is a perfect man, able to keep his whole body in check.

    3  When we put bits into the mouths of horses to make them obey us, we can turn the whole animal. 4  Or take ships as an example. Although they are so large and are driven by strong winds, they are steered by a very small rudder wherever the pilot wants to go. 5  Likewise the tongue is a small part of the body, but it makes great boasts. Consider what a great forest is set on fire by a small spark. 6  The tongue also is a fire, a world of evil among the parts of the body. It corrupts the whole person, sets the whole course of his life on fire, and is itself set on fire by hell.

    7  All kinds of animals, birds, reptiles and creatures of the sea are being tamed and have been tamed by man, 8  but no man can tame the tongue. It is a restless evil, full of deadly poison.

    9  With the tongue we praise our Lord and Father, and with it we curse men, who have been made in God's likeness. 10  Out of the same mouth come praise and cursing. My brothers, this should not be. 11  Can both fresh water and salt[a] water flow from the same spring? 12  My brothers, can a fig tree bear olives, or a grapevine bear figs? Neither can a salt spring produce fresh water.

    1. Pandoras Box profile image61
      Pandoras Boxposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Well put.

      (Knew that book was good for something...) wink

  3. profile image0
    PrettyPantherposted 14 years ago

    I was quite fascinated when I saw that Brenda had changed her avatar to a penetrating blue eye.  Much is revealed by that, I think.

    1. Hokey profile image60
      Hokeyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      The all seeing eye!  lol lol

  4. profile image0
    StormRyderposted 14 years ago

    I was harrassed by two heterosexual men today! Who do they think they are?? Damned straight guys think just because they aren't gay they can target us poor unexpecting women! big_smile

    I think I may be heterophobic now! lol

  5. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    It's actually an eye looking at the Cross.
    Ya know, that Cross which Jesus died on so that I and you and anyone who wants to be saved, can be saved.

    It matters not to me what most people think of me.  What matters to me is that Christ Loved me enough to die for me.
    Without Him I'm just dust.
    And with Him I'd still be dust if He wanted to do away with me.
    Thank God for His awesome mercy!

    Thank God that even an "adulteress" like me has been saved by Faith in Him!  I've never claimed to be sinless.  But I'm happy to be a sinner saved by grace!

    You can be too.

    If you don't forget the Cross....

    1. Mark Knowles profile image58
      Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Hmm hmm.

      So - what you are saying is - you can break the rules and go against the Word - but only if you have Faith.

      You can judge and cause fights and sin all you like - it matters not - as long as you have Faith.

      This explains why Christians are always preaching, but never following the Word.  They do not have to follow the rules because they have Faith.

      You sin today and point a finger at another sinner - but that is OK. Because you have Faith. You do not need to be sin free to cast the first stone. I get it. Having Faith in Him gives you the right to break the Law. lol

      What a ridiculous, hypocritical religion. Thanks for reminding me why I despise it.

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Tell ya what, Mark.
        Since you're so against re-marriage, especially re-marriage that's NOT a joining with the first spouse,  why don't you get you up a petition to your Congressman/woman advocating that ALL people should have to stay married to whoever they first marry?

        Wonder if that would work?....hmmm.....well heck no!  'Cause then all those gay-"rights" activists would have to STAY married to whoever they marry,  even if their spouse turns out to be a cheater.  Sheesh!  What WAS I thinking?!

        And what about if a spouse is into beastiality?  You'd have to stay married to her, Mark!

        Wouldn't that be great?  There'd be no divorce!  Awesome!
        ...Maybe more spouses killin' each other....but NO divorce!  Yessiree buddy!

        Or make a petition that EVERYONE can just do whatever the heck they please!   Even adulteresses like me.  Come on, Mark----you're so pro-gay-"rights"  and "anything-goes",  give it a shot!   Or is it just ME you're so INTOLERANT of? 

        You can't stand anyone having any morals, because you yourself can't stand for anything good.

        1. Mark Knowles profile image58
          Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          I am not against any such thing Brenda. You misunderstood completely.

          It is God and Jesus who are against divorce and re-marriage. Says so right there in the bible.   wink

    2. profile image0
      Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Wow, do you understand anything Christ taught?
      How are YOU saved?

    3. profile image0
      Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      So you can commit adultery and you're saved, but gay people can't be saved?

      This is your earlier statement about gay folks

      Brenda Durham wrote:

      You mean they've been taught to be politically-correct enough to say it's okay to be gay and have gay "rights".
      And what the heck does being against homosexual teachings in our schools have to do with kids being beaten and hungry?
      Kids should be sheltered from ALL those things.

      WHO THE HELL are you??

      As you might say:

      IT'S TIME TO REPENT BRENDA

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Who the heck are YOU?

        Have you no common sense?

        Apparently not.

        1. profile image0
          Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Much, much more common sense then you.

    4. skyfire profile image79
      skyfireposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      This reminds me of one character in this movie...

      http://www.entertainmentwallpaper.com/images/desktops/movie/the_mist1.jpg

  6. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    Brenda,

    You have some of the most incredibly odd twists in logic.

  7. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    It's getting pretty tiresome arguing with apparently-heterophobic people.   Were some people just never taught decent morals or what?!

  8. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    Personal attacks, while apparently your stock and trade (though that violates Scripture), are against the forum rules.

    Please go back through this thread and look at some of the things you've said, and consider the negative impact you're having on not only yourself but others.

  9. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    I repented long ago, Deborah, for the sin that Mark and others keep accusing me of.

    Repentance is always required in order to be saved.

    Anyone, including gays, can be saved if they repent and turn from their wicked ways.

    1. profile image0
      Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      So did you divorce your husband so you would no longer sin?
      Or did you ask for forgiveness and remain married?

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        No, I divorced my husband because he refused to keep his appendage out of wrong places, like other women.

        Is that plain enough for you?

        1. profile image0
          Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Well, if you knew that for certain then it's OK because it says you can divorce if your spouse commits fornication.

          YOU are the one that stated "Adulteress".

          But your hate is not in align with Christ's teachings

          1. profile image0
            Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            I did commit adultery.
            That's a sin I got redemption for.
            I brought it up again because that's what livelonger and Mark and some others keep trying to throw up in my face in order to deflect from the intent of this thread and deflect from the problem of the gay agenda.

            Oh but indeed my "hate" IS aligned with Christ's teachings!
            Because my "hate" is for the actions of people, not for the people themselves.

            Many people are SO defensive!  That's something they should work on instead of going around accusing conservatives like me of hatred.

            Apparently they like defining things in a twisted way.  Just like "they" defined "homophobia" for their own agenda.

            1. profile image0
              Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              OK..you've got to remember there are certain things that fulfill scripture..so it has to be..not one jot will pass....let it go..
              You have to let it go for your own sake..

              1. profile image0
                Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                LOL

                Nice try.  But it isn't me that's so upset here.  It's obviously others, people who don't like what they see written here and in the Bible.

                I guess it does sting a bit when their haze of desensitization is broken, but hey that's a good thing.  It must be hard to breathe when one's head is buried in the sand too long.

                1. profile image0
                  Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  You completely missed what I said.
                  Might want to reread it.

                2. mythbuster profile image72
                  mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Brenda Durham,

                  How many references to homosexuality are in the Bible? Earlier, you posted on (OT) Romans 1: 27 and (New Testament text) Leviticus 18: 22.

                  Those passages, I've looked up and read...

                  But are there more passages where you get your viewpoint on the homosexuality topic?

            2. Pandoras Box profile image61
              Pandoras Boxposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              Yep, they're out to get you Brenda. If you let them love and be loved they will destroy the world! Can't have that.

              hmm

  10. skyfire profile image79
    skyfireposted 14 years ago

    maybe you can come up with list-hub for morals ...

  11. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    You've often discussed the Bible in these forums, Deborah.

    Don't you believe there's such a thing as salvation in Jesus Christ?  Or not?

    1. profile image0
      Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      What does my belief have to do with it?

      Christ is LOVE not hate.

      God is judge not us.

      To be a CHRISTIAN doesn't just mean to believe IN Christ. It means to do what he taught. To follow his example

      Christ taught that
      LOVE IS THE LAW (Through FAITH)
      If we love self and others we don't: Kill, steal, etc
      Romans 13:8: "Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law."
      Galatians 5:14: "For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself."
      (Not just those who aren't Gay)

      Gay people are not so by choice..they are born that way.
      You are asking/demanding that they change their whole nature..yet you can't control your hate for others. you can't even control your temper.

  12. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    Ya know what,  several of you including Mark are probably laughin' your rears off because you think you've managed to deflect from the topic of this thread.

    This thread is about heterophobia and attacks by proponents of it toward citizens who don't want the immoral homosexual agenda to be sanctioned by America's legal system.

    You might wanna stay on-topic;  otherwise, this thread will end up being about ME, and I know that gets some people's hackles up.  Especially I think Mark would love for it to be about him.

    Oh wait---maybe it is.  I don't recall if he's ever said whether he's a gay-agenda activist or not....

    1. Pandoras Box profile image61
      Pandoras Boxposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Brenda there's not much to say about heterophobia, cause I don't think it exists. Maybe something like fundiephobia, or fear of christian nationalists, but that's about it.

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        If that were true, there'd be no such thing as homophobia either.  Actually, there isn't such a thing as homophobia! 
        Which is the point of this thread!  The aversion to the straight lifestyle is a real problem.

        1. Mark Knowles profile image58
          Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          By straight lifestyle do you mean adultery?

          I know you favor that. Well - when you do it, but I am sure it is against the rules for everybody else. wink

          1. Pandoras Box profile image61
            Pandoras Boxposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Hey sexy. Glad you switched your picture back. The clown wasn't doing anything for me.

            1. Mark Knowles profile image58
              Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              I only put the clown up to scare the religionist away. wink

  13. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    Brenda,

    I can assure you I'm not laughing here.  There is nothing funny about this thread, it is a sad thing to see a person so wrapped up in their own prejudice and hatred that they don't realize the ripples of their actions.

    As an aside, Hubpages' forums are a living breathing entity given direction by the flow of active conversation.  A thread could begin in one pathway, but move to a different topic as natural conversations do.

    What I see here in this thread is a topic created by someone who is possibly bitter with life, a topic that is ridiculous and presented to sow seeds of discord.  This observance I have made is perpetuated by your liberal(meaning frequent) application of derogatory talking points and discriminatory viewpoints.  You frequently make tangent points that are political or chaotically insulting in nature, yet rail against any countering statements made by others in the thread.

    You skip entire posts to keep the drama ball rolling, and apparently have yet to realize the full breadth of your behaviors here in this thread.  I hope you do come to realize the tone, presentation, and reception of your words has caused the reaction you see in these 26 pages.  I also hope that you work through your anger, prejudice, hatred and intolerance.

    1. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      So....people can post whatever they want to,  like thread after thread about threesomes or masturbation or animal sex or whatever, but you choose to pick on MY threads!   WOW.

      Well I guess it's a good thing it's interesting to some people!

  14. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    Brenda - Why do you continue to pick and choose slivers of my posts to you to acknowledge and completely ignore the major points?

    1. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I didn't ignore them.  They're just not worth discussing, because you've accused me of so many things!  Things like anger, hatred, intolerance, and prejudice.   Those are things that are coming from you;  those are apparently things coming from your OWN heart toward both me and the Bible.   You don't tolerate the Word very well, do you?   You're prejudiced against conservatives, aren't you?
      You're heterophobic, aren't you?

      1. livelonger profile image86
        livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        All of these heterosexuals are heterophobic. lol This is the logic that only works in Brenda's mind.

        Brenda, you don't tolerate the Word very well, do you? You defy Christ's word to defend divorce, trying to "reason" that we should allow it. Do you believe your powers of reason are better than Jesus Christ's?

        And I don't know how you think living as a fornicating adulteress is something you can repent from unless you leave this "sham" of a marriage and return to your first husband. I refer you to Matthew 5: 31-32, Matthew 19:9, Mark 10:11-12, Luke 16:18 and Romans 7:2-3 - ALL of which explicitly prohibit divorce and remarriage. The only way to repent is to turn away from the remarriage and return to your first husband. You can't just loudly profess a love of Christ and attack gay people and think that's enough.

        If you want to abandon the commandments of Christ and use your own "common sense" instead with respect to divorce and remarriage, then don't bitch and moan about other people doing the exact same thing about homosexuality, which gets a far more cursory treatment in the New Testament than does divorce.

        1. profile image0
          Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          livelonger,
          let's do the scenario (even though I'm getting really tired of your nasty accusations).  I'll tolerate it this time again.  I have a lot of patience....sometimes.

          So...you would have me, as you put it,  "leave" this "sham of a marriage."  Correct?

          So how does another sin (divorcing my current husband) equate to repentance and redemption?  I'd just be adding the sin of divorce (again, in your opinion! even though I had a Biblical right to divorce my first husband)  to my life.   And my husband would be adding the sin of divorce to HIS life.  And even if I (or we both!) became a nun (he a monk),  how does that equate to making things right?  (For one thing, we're not Catholics and wouldn't become nun/monk anyway, but you get my drift I'm sure.)

          Now, the sin of homosexuality isn't even something a person can make right by getting "married" via gay "marriage" because the sin is an abomination in the first place.

          So your equation, your comparison, to the two issues doesn't even add up.

          Maybe YOU would be pleased if I divorce my husband,  but God wouldn't.   And I'm sure you realize I don't put any stock in what YOU say, but I do in what He says.

          As far as "punishment" for what I did, I could tell you the story of the consequences of my divorce/remarriage,  and I could tell you the story of how the Lord forgave me for my actions, and I could tell you how even Christians have to live with the results of what they've done,  and I could tell you how Christ's Love and mercy far outweigh the former things, but indeed you're bent on attacking me instead of listening, so I will refrain.

          1. William R. Wilson profile image62
            William R. Wilsonposted 14 years agoin reply to this



            I like how you know what god says.  LOL.

            1. profile image0
              Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              Really?


              Well, God does have the Love and Power to forgive people.
              Apparently some people do not.
              Perhaps you're one of those people?

              1. William R. Wilson profile image62
                William R. Wilsonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                I didn't realize you were asking for my forgiveness...

          2. livelonger profile image86
            livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            No, you clearly don't care what God says and ignore it willfully when it comes to your own continuing unrepentant sin. There is nothing to reason with; convincing me that you're right is completely immaterial. You claim to be a Christian so you must follow Christ's commandments. In case you've forgotten them, the relevant scripture is here:

            Matthew 5: 31-32, Matthew 19:9, Mark 10:11-12, Luke 16:18 and Romans 7:2-3

            If you manage to explain away and/or ignore these very explicit condemnations of divorce and remarriage, then that simply means you're ignoring what you believe is the Word and pretending to speak on behalf of Jesus Christ. Yet another sin.

            1. profile image0
              Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              So,  you're saying the Bible tells me to commit the sin of divorce a second time?

              Hmmm....and you wonder why I don't listen to your hogwash!




              This thread is apparently a timely one.

              Wonder if any other heterophobic people will show up?

              1. livelonger profile image86
                livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                No, your second marriage DOES NOT EXIST. In the eyes of Jesus Christ, you were never remarried. You're living in a state of adultery with the man you call your husband. According to Christianity, you're not married to him (no matter what the state/Caesar says, right?)

                You must return to your first husband and, despite the adultery, find a way to live together again.

                Why do you need me to explain this to you? Read the scripture I provided!

                1. profile image0
                  Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  "Find a way to live together again"?.....

                  umm....like common-law "marriage" or something?  Live "platonically" with him, and therefore sin again??
                  LOLOL
                  livelonger, you've lost it totally I think!  hahaaaa

                  My patience with your accusations disguised as Biblical ignorance is out of steam.

                  1. livelonger profile image86
                    livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                    Again, you're trying to argue against the Word. (Something you don't afford people who believe gays and lesbians should be treated equally)

                    What Jesus Christ must think of your arrogance...

                    Ah well, since your eternal fate is sealed, try to enjoy the good times here on Earth.

              2. profile image0
                Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                Because I believe we should leave stuff between other people and God and because I don't agree with you and don't hate gay people..
                Are you saying I am gay and heterophobic?
                Better not be saying this because it's a lie.
                I'm married..to the same man since I was 18 and never had the desire to be with another man nor with a woman.

                Ever read about shadow selves? One of the meanings is that we hate in others the things we hate/are ashamed of in ourselves.

                We are in such denial we hide it even from ourselves.....hummmmm

                1. profile image0
                  Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Nope, never read about "shadow selves" and have no need to.
                  I have, though, read about sin and repentance and conscience and mercy and Truth and redemption and all the things one needs to know about.

          3. mythbuster profile image72
            mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Could you show me all the places where homosexuality is called an "abomination'?

  15. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    I realize that you are not attempting to put me on the defensive, but regardless of that I will address your post in it's entirety, a courtesy you have yet to give me.

    First, as to the accusations as you say - I am pointing out to you the perception of an outsider as based on just the words on the screen.

    I am not forcing you to type the horrible things you have in the course of this thread.  You are the one in control of the words you use, the face you present to the world.  If you seek not to be seen as angry, filled with prejudice and hate, then perhaps a different approach is in order on your part.

    I am not a Christian.  I do not need to be a Christian to have studied the Bible, though, and appreciate the behavioral guide it can present.

    I do not take political affiliation into account when forming an opinion on someone.  I have friends from all points in the political spectrum, and am capable of disagreeing with the viewpoints of others while remaining friends with them.

    Edit(since you edited your post to add more accusatory insults):  I am not heterophobic, either.  I strive for a higher appreciation of life and my fellow human.

  16. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    I haven't seen anyone in the thread who has expressed a fear of difference except for you, Brenda.

  17. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    Bawney Fwank?! 
    Arne Duncan?!
    Kevin Jennings?!
    Obama?!

    Are y'all around here??

    1. mythbuster profile image72
      mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      What do these names/personalities have to do with gamergirl's questions? Or heterophobia, the term you set out as a topic of discourse here?

    2. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Just wanting to see if they're around here.   They're everywhere else, mostly where they don't need to be,  like in America's legal and school system.

  18. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    Brenda,

    You really don't like to read and answer straight, do you?

    livelonger is saying that your first marriage shouldn't have ended in divorce, and reinforces the point with Scripture.  He is saying that from a Biblical standpoint, your second marriage is not sanctioned by Scripture, and that your first divorce should not have occurred.  That you should return to your rightful husband, and lean on the Word and the Lord to help your hearts heal, help you find a way to forgive, and help you learn to love one another properly as husband and wife again - because THOSE concepts ARE sanctioned by the Bible.

    1. profile image0
      Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      She stated he had sex with other women

      Matthew 19:9.."And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery."

      If she knew it for certain then she was OK to divorce him.
      Now it will depend on if her new husband has been married before her.


      A true marriage is one like my parents. They were married only to each other..After 56 years of marriage my mom passed away. My dad never dated nor remarried after her death and remained so until he died..To him, he was still married to my mom.

      1. profile image0
        Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        fornicate |ˈfôrniˌkāt|
        verb [ intrans. ]
        (of two people not married to each other) have sexual intercourse.

        1. mythbuster profile image72
          mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Actually, all marriage is a SOCIAL CONSTRUCTION...and this isn't a 'modern' thing...Marriage has always been a social construction, created and developed by PEOPLE and inserted into the books of the Bible.

          1. LiamBean profile image80
            LiamBeanposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Much of what is in the bible (the Pentateuch in particular) was in much earlier law. The Babylonians had many of the same prohibitions that we think of as Judaic-Christian. And the Babylonians based their law on Sumerian law.

            The biggest difference between the two is that Sumerian's monetized all "sins" whereas the Babylonian laws demanded flesh or forfeit-of-life payment. Both systems had the same basic laws though; only the punishment was different.

            Sin is a very old concept. It is certainly NOT Judaic or Christian in origin.

            1. profile image0
              Twenty One Daysposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              wow, someone is actually awake besides me. amen to that!

            2. profile image0
              Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              Sin is Satanic in origin.

              And of course the concept and punishment for it came from God.
              You may talk about it not being Christian in origin,  but of course I know it is, because God is the Christians' God.  Debate that if you will, but it's what the Bible says.  Doesn't matter what nation or group of people had different punishments for whatever, it was God who formed Adam and Eve, so the original EVERYTHING came from the beginning, not originating through some other religion.

              The Old Testament laid down major punishment for sins....and those are still what mankind is deserving of, for all sins;  but of course when Jesus came to save us from those sins,  the literal punishment became more of a spiritual punishment for the heart sins, or many of those.  Same God, same rules, same punishment, just different avenues for the sin and punishment.

    2. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I understand that concept.
      But it still doesn't answer the question of how I could divorce my current husband without it being a sin, for him and for me.

      And my current marriage is already sanctioned by God.

      The Lord is merciful to those who Repent.

      Many of you are simply trying to find fault where fault has already been removed "as far as the east is from the west" in the eyes of God.  And in the eyes of man's legal system.


      There is no sanction for unrepentant living, period.  Key word is unrepentant.
      And there is no sanction for engaging in a willing homosexual lifestyle, period, no matter whether gay "marriage" is legalized by man's laws or not.

      1. livelonger profile image86
        livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        There are tons of gay Christians who repent and are just as sure as you are that they are not living in a life of unrepentant sin.

        Depends on how strict you think God is. But if he's strict, he's strict about your divorce and remarriage, too.

        1. profile image0
          Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Ummm....no they're not as sure.
          Not if they're still willingly engaging in homosexual activity.

          But yes, If they're not engaging in that activity,  then of course there's redemption if they're born-again Christians.  I know some people like that.

  19. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    It's great that some of your parents were married to only each other for so long!  There are many like that, and it's good.
    smile

  20. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    That is a powerful word ---
    the word REPENT.

    No wonder John the Baptist used it, and Jesus used it, and the Bible uses it.

    Powerful word;  Amen.

  21. Cagsil profile image69
    Cagsilposted 14 years ago

    Repent? A religious term, for which, to downgrade a human being from being what they want to be or choose to be.

    Repent? A fictional term used in mythical stories of religious life, some centuries ago and dependent on a weak-willed individual, who supposedly doesn't understand their own life.

    Repent? Who are you suppose to repent to? The only person any person has to repent to would be oneself or someone who they wronged.

    Otherwise, acceptance isn't required by anything else. There isn't anything to answer for when dead. When dead, your conscious life will have come to an end and should there be anything after-death, then you are not likely to be aware of it anyways.

    Just my thoughts. smile

  22. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    Doesn't that view make you less likely to think of others while you're alive?

    I think that if I didn't believe my spirit/soul would live on after physical death, I'd be different while I'm alive.

    I think I'd be much more selfish and do many things that I don't do now, and want things and money and engage in lust and anything that would give me temporary pleasure......

    Do you think you'd behave differently or live your life differently in some ways if you believed in an afterlife?  If there was something to repent for to a Creator?

    1. Ron Montgomery profile image60
      Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      How's your Mom doing?

    2. Cagsil profile image69
      Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      This shows how much you don't really know about your life.
      Of course you would act differently because you would have to face the reality of life and it's short duration.
      This would only happen, should you lack the knowledge you already lack about life. It wouldn't be a surprise...look around at the many people, even religious ones, doing whatever they want, without accountability. There is no shame anymore and it's become even more obvious than ever.
      Excuse me, I spent the first 35 years involved in religion in some way or another and when I realized that the Christian Doctrine were false, then I was able to truly understand the meaning of my life.

      Do I understand the meaning of your life? I am not saying that I do. However, I do know how to obtain meaning for one's life and to instill a purpose that can allow any single person to gain a better understanding.

      On a side note, I have learned how to use greed(which you say is a sin) and turn it into a positive selfless action. This very concept you will most likely dismiss.

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Oh...I think I remember a thread of yours (??) sometime back about that concept of turning greed into good.

        I don't believe that's possible.  Not if it's one's own greed.

        But hey thanks for your replies.

    3. mythbuster profile image72
      mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Brenda Durham,

      What if...just "what if" you aren't correct about all of this? What if your reading of Scriptures is "off"? What if your views on "marriage" and "divorce" are not the words of the divine but of an ancient human, man-made law of the land?

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Then those laws would still be correct.
        But I'm not wrong.
        Humanity's sense of morality comes from a little thing called our conscience,  our God-given conscience I will add.  There's just no getting around those facts.

        What if THOSE people who propose what you suggest are wrong?

        1. livelonger profile image86
          livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Is Jesus wrong? He considers you a fornicating adulteress and thus an unrepentant sinner.

          1. profile image0
            Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Does He now?

            Have you talked to Him lately?

            What else did He say?

            Are you sure it wasn't the atheists' "Jeebus" or Lucifer in disguise?

            wink

            1. livelonger profile image86
              livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              Apparently you're not familiar with the Bible. Unfortunately for you, ignorance is apparently not an excuse.

              1. profile image0
                Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                Do you go around urging everyone, including Christians, who've been divorced and re-married, to divorce their spouses?

                Or is it just me you're wanting to fix?

                1. livelonger profile image86
                  livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Matthew 7:1-5
                  Matthew 6:1-6
                  Matthew 15:1-9
                  pretty much all of Matthew 23

        2. mythbuster profile image72
          mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          BD: "Then those laws would still be correct.
          But I'm not wrong.
          Humanity's sense of morality comes from a little thing called our conscience,  our God-given conscience I will add.  There's just no getting around those facts.

          What if THOSE people who propose what you suggest are wrong?"

          Which people? Who propose what? I wasn't talking about ANY KIND or specific people, Brenda... I asked plain, simple questions not involving or drawing any other people into my questions.

          I asked YOU about - what if you're wrong and what if what you're referring back to in the Sciptures is man-made laws? I asked - what if your reading of Scriptures is 'off'?

          Do you have the background knowledge of where these Scriptures come from? Which cultures wrote or conveyed certain portions of the text? Do you understand the CONTEXT of each volume of text documents within each portion of the Bible? BEFORE you so strongly argue points using quotes from within?

          How can you be so sure you have the right viewpoint - I mean, you're obviously aware of how many viewpoints there are coming out of Scriptures - wars have been fought over these words... by people claiming "TO KNOW" that their God and ONLY the GOD AS THEY KNOW HIM - meant for certain divine messages to be passed down to them...

          So I'll ask again... What if YOUR reading of the Scriptures is 'off'? Will you continue to argue incessantly just so you don't lose face, just so you can be "right"? Or are you interested in understanding that there are other viewpoints that are valid here?

          1. profile image0
            Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            On the matters discussed in this thread,  I'm 100% sure that my interpretation of the Scriptures is not "off".
            You did read those I pointed out, right?   Or not?   At the end of your other post, you asked for more Scriptures.   I'm not interested in running through your hoops.  You DID say at first that if I could prove my viewpoint via Scripture, you'd consider that, leading people to think you might be unbiased and truly looking for the right thing.   But you haven't, and you aren't! Instead you've ignored the very specific ones and tried to sway MY viewpoint.
            Not gonna happen.
            So we're at the same standstill;  the same crossroads and we know which way the other one is going.
            Debate closed, it seems, because you said you'd like to discuss, but seems you only wanted to try to crack the foundation of this issue.  Again, not gonna happen.


            P.S.  I totally disagree that horseradish won't hurt ya!  hahahhaa
            I'm kidding.  I  just can't stand horseradish.

            1. mythbuster profile image72
              mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              BD, there is no 'standstill' and no 'debate,' except the ones that you keep imposing. I have not been trying to 'crack the foundation' of this issue. I'm trying to understand the foundations you're insisting are underneath your very strong arguments.

              Yes, I have looked up and done a careful reading of the two Scriptures you've been so good as to recommend, one from Leviticus, one from Romans. You've provided very little context from the quotes, only saying, basically that they are plain words and from God's rulebook, so to speak.

              Yes, I did say I would like to "discuss," and discussions aren't debates.

              Actually, I'm going to explain myself better because I did use a 'tactic' of conversation in the above post...which you have deemed, somehow, as 'part of my hoops' or something of the sort.

              BD, I wasn't getting full answers, so I asked more questions (above), thinking that you would extrapolate a bit on your current belief system - to SHOW ME HOW you came to believe in your way of Christianity and what your principles say about homosexuality.

              Naturally, while questions usually lead to responses with more NEW information, questions in a debate usually lead to responses that turn back on old arguments - except, I'm not debating here - I'm aiming for discourse and conversation.

              To my knowledge, there are less than a dozen references to homosexuality in the Bible - you've provided two instances - the most commonly cited ones. I've asked that you provide me with additional instances in the Bible where the words specify that homosexuality is wrong. I do not know where these other references are, but I'm sure that you do, since you've expressed that you're well informed on the issue of homosexuality and 'rules against' in the Bible.

              I understand that in at least ONE of the referrences so far, there has been a gross error in translation and that 2 words most Christians (in Leviticus) have read to pertain to homosexuals is actually directed at Christian clergy and practices of prostitution that were going on in ancient times under the clergy's noses - which they were 'overlooking' but were told to do something about, correct, and neither put up with nor engage in any longer. In this point, the truth isn't a matter of interpretation - it's a matter of people denying the facts in this one instance. A matter of "too bad, I'm not changing my viewpoint even if there are substantial facts to back up a new truth." For the quote from Romans, I am not aware of any alternate meaning than the one you're implying. If this WERE a debate, you'd have me on that one.

              For other references, I'm still hoping you'll guide me to those so I can have a look at them critically.

              I understand you're not interested in running through hoops - but now it has been explained that there are no hoops...

              Perhaps you can email me some links if you know where there are articles online that support your Baptist (you're Baptist, right?) viewpoint. That way, I could learn more on your viewpoint without you having to answer a ton of questions - since the discussion keeps being misunderstood and is obviously rife with tension. I would be willing to read any articles you can point me to - even take a week or so to "LEARN" some points on Baptist viewpoint, according to your direction.

              BTW - the horseradish comment IS A DEBATE lol The resolution is: "Aside from the case of having an allergy to the sustance of horseradish, horseradish cannot hurt you."

              1. profile image0
                Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                haha I love it! (the horseradish debate!)

                I think I might make that another one of my commonly-used words.
                Hogwash!  Drat!  Horseradish!  LOL

  23. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    Better I hope.
    The home health nurse is gonna come by later to check her vitals, etc. and see if she's recuperating from all the pneumonia.
    Thanks for asking.

    1. Ron Montgomery profile image60
      Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I'm glad she has family to be with.

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Me too.
        You're being nice to me, Ron.

        Is part of it 'cause you think I'm also Padrino?  I noticed you questioning the timing of our posts in the other thread.

        Don't be paranoid.   I'm only me.  And I don't think I'd even be capable of keeping up with two accounts like some people do!
        I don't know who Padrino is, but I like some of his posts.
        Ya know, there ARE other people who think similarly to me on some topics!   Not all of the world has turned totally Left!  haha

        1. Padrino profile image60
          Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          And now I'm you? Yesterday I was someone called TK, its getting hard to keep up with myself.

          1. profile image0
            Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            LOL
            I know, Padrino!

            It's rather funny how things get confusing on a forum like this.

            And irritating too!

            Hey, I don't think I've ever directly said Hello to you and Welcome to HubPages!

            So hey and Welcome.  smile

            1. Padrino profile image60
              Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              Thank you and hello to you too! What is a TK, do you know?

          2. thisisoli profile image72
            thisisoliposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            I thought you were me?

            1. Padrino profile image60
              Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              I might be.

            2. skyfire profile image79
              skyfireposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              Nah oli i've often observed you making spell mistakes( like teh) which is something padrino lacks. tongue

        2. Ron Montgomery profile image60
          Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          No, I've never thought of you as Padrino.  I think people can disagree (even vehemently) on many subjects yet still have common ground, and some common values.  Having an elderly parent with a serious health issue would be troubling to any of us whether we are religious, atheist, or agnostic.

          Even the TK group has some positive aspect.  None that have been shown in our forums, but I still have faith that they exist.

  24. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    No I don't, sorry.

  25. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    There are many passages which talk about sin in general,  but as far as additional ones that are specifically about homosexuality, I'm not sure how many there are.   I'll try to look up any others.

    Did you find the ones I posted interesting?  They're very definite and specific, aren't they?

    1. livelonger profile image86
      livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Here are some more very interesting, very specific passages:

      Matthew 5: 31-32
      Matthew 19:9
      Mark 10:11-12
      Luke 16:18
      Romans 7:2-3

      ALL New Testament!

    2. mythbuster profile image72
      mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Brenda Durham, if a recent post is meant for me:

      "There are many passages which talk about sin in general,  but as far as additional ones that are specifically about homosexuality, I'm not sure how many there are.   I'll try to look up any others.

      Did you find the ones I posted interesting?  They're very definite and specific, aren't they?"

      Here is my response:  I'm glad you've said you'll look up any others. Thank you. I'll be away (going to class this afternoon and evening) for several hours but will check in on this thread when I get home. I appreciate that you're willing to double-check passages with me. Myself, I've found very few references to sexuality/homosexuality in the Scriptures - but hopefully, you can point to them for me so I can have a critical look at what's in the Scriptures on this topic.

      Yes, I found the 2 Scriptures very interesting - and yes, they're quite specific.

  26. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    Sin did not originate with the Christian religion.  Considering that there have been societies and religions for a very very long time before Christianity even started forming.

    Eastern religions had systems of spiritual checks and balances, it's called Karma.

    1. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I understood what was meant by that.
      It's just that I consider Christianity the true religion, so I referred back to God on that......

      I don't understand the point that's being made, though, on this subject.....

      As I said, sin originated from Satan's greed......

      Are y'all trying to say that societies make their own system of sin and punishment apart from God?

      1. LiamBean profile image80
        LiamBeanposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        I would say that societies create systems of law to keep those societies from self-destructing. To get full compliance they claim a divine source for those laws.

        1. mythbuster profile image72
          mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Well said, IMO - I like the word 'compliance' better than the term I was thinking of.

          (oppression)

      2. Ron Montgomery profile image60
        Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        This thread could, and probably will go on all day.

        Enjoy yourselves.

        Brenda's philosophy in a nutshell is that "The" Bible (she's never really indicated which of the many conflicting versions is "The" )Trumps any other information- especially that which can be verified.

        You can offer her verifiable truths 'til the cows come home; it requires an open mind to consider those truths.

        1. livelonger profile image86
          livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          She *has* indicated which version of the Bible she believes in...one that excises significant portions having to do with divorce and remarriage.

          Typical Cafeteria Christian.

          1. Ron Montgomery profile image60
            Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            I don't doubt her sincerity, just the information it's based on.

            1. livelonger profile image86
              livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              I think the motivation is more telling than the sincerity.

  27. Ohma profile image61
    Ohmaposted 14 years ago

    Since Christianity is purely a political movement I would have to say yes.

  28. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    Brenda,

    I'm saying that societies have had their own systems of punishment and reward based on their faith-based values for thousands of years, prior to the invention of Christianity.

  29. Shadesbreath profile image79
    Shadesbreathposted 14 years ago

    For what it's worth, I have solved this issue for both sides of the debate in the hub I just published.  (Yes, shameless self promotion, but... yes, it's solved if anyone cares to have a look.)

    1. mythbuster profile image72
      mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Great article! lol

      You're a "Swift" fan, are you?

      Gay Carpenters, of course! *slaps forehead* It really is a great article.

      1. Shadesbreath profile image79
        Shadesbreathposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Yes, I am.  Did you find the line I stole directly from him in tribute?

        1. mythbuster profile image72
          mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          This one?

          " I propose a modest and entirely feasible solution to the problem that should see both sides at least mollified to the extent where life can begin to function more normally and funds and effort can be put to better use."

          ??

          A Modest Proposal??

          1. profile image0
            Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Indeed a rather immodest proposal.

          2. Shadesbreath profile image79
            Shadesbreathposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Hah, no.  That one's all me.  Right essay, though.

            1. mythbuster profile image72
              mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              I dare NOT dig out my Brit Lit books or Victorian Lit books, don't make me, Shadesbreath! lol I get the tone - wonderful hub you wrote. Transported me back to Victorian and "Brit Lit" classes....... *shakes head* oh the sarcasm - how pointed is your tongue?? Not going to dig through that hub again to find the quote...

              *thumbsup*

  30. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    Brenda,

    You're still trying to hold a conversation by picking and choosing what to respond to?  Don't you think that's a little rude?

    1. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Am I held to a higher standard than the others here who are VEWWWY rude, not just a little rude?

      And it's pretty hard to respond in-depth to everyone.
      And I think I've already answered your questions, gamergirl.

  31. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    What God hath cleansed, call not that unfit.

    1. livelonger profile image86
      livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      And what do you call gay repentant Christians?

      Do you disagree with the Word of Jesus Christ, Brenda?
      Matthew 5: 31-32
      Matthew 19:9
      Mark 10:11-12
      Luke 16:18
      Romans 7:2-3

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        All repentant Christians are covered by the blood of the Lamb and have put away their old lifestyles in favor of following Jesus.

        This thread isn't about repentant people.  The issue of it is about UNrepentant people who're trying to legalize things in the United States that shouldn't be legalized.

        1. Mark Knowles profile image58
          Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          So - you are saying that - as the bible says - divorce should be illegal? Certainly - I can agree with you there Brenda. People who swear to God should be legally obliged to keep that promise.

          Otherwise they would be hypocrites.

          Which is - I believe - a sin - in and of itself. wink

          1. profile image0
            Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Who swears to God?

            1. Mark Knowles profile image58
              Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              People who go to church and swear in front of god to stay together in matrimony until the other is dead.

              "'till death us do part."

              1. Ron Montgomery profile image60
                Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                King Henry the VIII was able to deal with that minor inconvenience, why can't all Christians?

                1. profile image0
                  Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  teehee
                  that was almost funny!  lol

                  1. Ron Montgomery profile image60
                    Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                    If you had beheaded your former husband instead of divorcing him, you wouldn't be facing this crisis of morality.

                    Hell, you could have even started your own church like Henry did..

                    the Church of Kentucky?  You could have colonels instead of bishops...

                    (for those unfamiliar, colonel is an honor given to prominent Kentuckians, there is no military link)

            2. gamergirl profile image84
              gamergirlposted 14 years agoin reply to this
        2. livelonger profile image86
          livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Gay repentant Christians are just as repentant as those who continue to live in second marriages after the first ended in divorce. Both have made their peace with God. Right?

          1. profile image0
            Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Have you ever been saved, livelonger?

            1. livelonger profile image86
              livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              No, I haven't. I suppose I'll be going to hell. Thank goodness you'll be there to keep me company. big_smile

              1. Ron Montgomery profile image60
                Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                If you don't have a reservation, do you have to wait at the bar to get in?

                1. livelonger profile image86
                  livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  I'm pretty sure Brenda will be a VIP there; she'll get me in past the ropes without having to wait.

                  1. Ron Montgomery profile image60
                    Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                    VIP?  Do they get ice water?

  32. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    Now we get to the crux of the matter:  that pesky little word, shouldn't.

    Thank you for presenting your opinion.

    I hope you spend some time at Church this weekend praying for forgiveness for sowing seeds of discord and contention amongst your fellow man, for judging others, and for choosing to support one portion of the Bible while sweeping another five or six portions of it under the rug.

  33. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    Actually, I agree somewhat with Mark's reference and maybe livelonger's reference that divorce should...at least...be harder to obtain.   These days, all a person really has to do is claim "incompatibility" and they can easily get a divorce.

    But I think the laws have been made tighter on that.   I've heard of couples who had to go through long months of counseling, etc., before their divorce gets finalized.  Maybe that's usually if they have children from the marriage, I dunno.

    But yes I think the legal rules for both marriage and for divorce should be stricter.
    We all need rules.  The looser the rules are, the more humans are tempted to want NO rules.

    1. Mark Knowles profile image58
      Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      For other people anyway... wink

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Nope. Not just for other people.
        For me too.
        I think I've said this before-----if I hadn't had rules,  and especially the rules God laid out,  I'd probably have done even much more rebelliion than I did.   I did my share of sinful things;  I've never said any different!
        That aspect of God that so many people complain about (His Judgement!) is as much a part of Him as is His Love.   Many would like Him to be just all mushy love.  But when anyone (especially God) Loves somebody, as He Loves everybody, He sets up rules for them to live by, a way of life he wants them to strive to attain.

        I've missed the mark many times,  and God was gracious enough to allow me time to repent.   There is a heaven and a "hell", and I hold myself to just as much accountability as others are held to.   It's just that I know I'm forgiven for my sins,  and no amount of accusations will deter me from that knowledge.
        In the Bible, Paul says he "dies daily".   He was referring to the persecution he faced, but also to the temptations he faced daily.
        Sometimes a Christian has to repent daily too.  Sometimes Christianity is a progressive thing,  where gradually we gain enough strength to force those things that tempt us out of our lives.
        God knows each person's heart.

        1. mythbuster profile image72
          mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Brenda Durham,

          How did you gain your knowledge and interpretations of the Scriptures?

          You identify as Baptist, right? I'm still tryin' to get a handle on how you're interpreting this stuff about homosexuality - but along the way, your additional posts in this thread on the topics of marriage, church, gov't, etc are interesting...and based on how you interpret Scriptures.

          I'm truly still tryin' to put myself in your shoes to try and understand how you can feel the way you do about these issues and about certain types of people...

          Also still waiting for more references in the Scriptures on what is said about homosexuality...

          1. Shadesbreath profile image79
            Shadesbreathposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Ain't gonna get it.  It's just all hate spew.  30-some-odd pages and she still hasn't come with anything.

            Frankly, I'd have more respect for this thread if she'd just come out and say, "Look, I got nothing specific, I just hate them.  They're gross."

            I could honestly, totally accept that. At least it's honest and not pretending to be rooted in something greater.

            I hate lots of stuff.  I hate romance novels.  I hate Twighlight.  I hate Horseraddish.  I hate country music.  I can give reasons why, but I couldn't win an argument with a dispassionate, articulate, stable rhetorician if I tried to prove that my opinion was "right."

            1. mythbuster profile image72
              mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              okay hold on just a minute here....

              I get that you can't stand Twilight or romance novels. Country music isn't for everybody...I can hear that - but c'mon, horseradish won't hurt ya! lol

            2. profile image0
              Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              This post is so messed-up!

              I bet you DO wish I'd say those things!  But I won't, because they're not true!

              I canNOT honestly say that I hate anyone at all.  I don't hate homosexuals.

              I CAN honestly say that I hate the blatant sin of homosexuality and the agenda to make it legal in the USA.

              I can say I hate horseradish, rare steak, those bits of gristle or whatever in hamburger and sausage, and Twilight, among other things.   Twilight is a horrible movie series!  It tries to legitimatize monsters, and is akin to promoting beastiality.



              I now ask you if you hate any person?!
              Because your words here seem to indicate that you do indeed.

              1. Beelzedad profile image59
                Beelzedadposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                The important thing to remember is whether or not Jesus hated anything and then ask yourself if you follow those teachings. smile

                1. profile image0
                  Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Certainly He hated some things.

                  1. Beelzedad profile image59
                    Beelzedadposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                    What were those things, Brenda? Do you agree with hating those things as well? smile

                  2. livelonger profile image86
                    livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                    Which did Jesus hate more, Brenda? Homosexuality, or divorce/remarriage?

                    Please don't rely on your personal guesswork; refer to His Word in the Bible.

                    If you don't respond, I'll assume you understand that it's divorce/remarriage.

    2. Mark Knowles profile image58
      Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      LOL

  34. Cagsil profile image69
    Cagsilposted 14 years ago

    If more people understood the word Integrity and applied it to their life....then rules/laws wouldn't be needed as much.

    Just my thought. smile

    1. gamergirl profile image84
      gamergirlposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Agreed!

      On the other hand, I also think that there should be a five year waiting period between divorce and remarriage, and that if your religion has structures condemning divorce, that you should be required to attend marriage counseling through your church.

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        You're proposing even more of a closing in the gap between the so-called "separation of church and state"??

        I'd have never thought a liberal (I assume you're a liberal) would EVEN or EVER propose such a thing!

        1. Padrino profile image60
          Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          You never thought a liberal would try and legislate something that is none of their business?

          You gotta start paying more attention!

          1. gamergirl profile image84
            gamergirlposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            My opinion stinks to you, but then, opinions ARE like buttholes. ;-)

          2. livelonger profile image86
            livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            What are your opinions on gay marriage and abortion, Padrino?

          3. profile image0
            Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            haahhaha Padrino!  You're right!

            1. livelonger profile image86
              livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              Oh, the irony.

              1. gamergirl profile image84
                gamergirlposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                You -might- wind up defining that for her, otherwise she's going to twist it to benefit her "cause" here.

                1. livelonger profile image86
                  livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  No doubt. That's the annoying thing about hypocrites. roll

              2. Maddie Ruud profile image72
                Maddie Ruudposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                Yes, interesting that a self-professed conservative, who argues for less gov't intervention in everything, still wants the gov't to interfere in people's bedroom activities and/or family structure.  I've never understood that.

                1. profile image0
                  Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  I don't argue for less government.
                  I argue for a better, more morally decent government.

        2. gamergirl profile image84
          gamergirlposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          There's no such thing as separation of church and state, Brenda.  It's sad, but true.

          You shouldn't assume anything about anyone - perhaps that's another of your problems.  smile

          Though, I suppose I could clear things up for you by saying I'm a married genderqueer who is into BDSM (gasp! Sexual freedom and passionate exploration!) and believes the entire system of government we have currently is bloated, fat, and necrotic, and that as a result the people of this country are irreverent, complacent and more satisfied with bickering about the numerous flaws of every President's failings, every party's failings, than actually getting out into the world and making a better place of it.

          I hope THAT was clear enough for you. smile

          1. profile image0
            Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Wow.
            I've been telling the liberals there's no such thing as separation of church and state for a long time!
            But what I meant was that their view of "church" meant "morality" really.
            The "separation of church and state" was a concept that prevented the Church of England or a similar entity from taking over the newly-formed America.  It wasn't meant to exclude the Christian basis this nation had.

            Now, you say there's no separation of church and state?!
            I'm amazed.  Never heard a liberal say that before....

            1. gamergirl profile image84
              gamergirlposted 14 years agoin reply to this

              Hey Brenda, what do you take for motion sickness?  Watching your thread posts is like running around in circles over, and over, and over until I vomit.

              1. profile image0
                wordscribe41posted 14 years agoin reply to this

                lol lol  I like you, gamergirl!

                1. gamergirl profile image84
                  gamergirlposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  LOL Thanks!! I like me too.

                  1. Mark Knowles profile image58
                    Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                    Me three. big_smile

                  2. profile image0
                    wordscribe41posted 14 years agoin reply to this

                    You're very level headed in the forums.  I enjoy sitting back and reading your posts.  As you share all my views, and can communicate in such a reasonable, intelligent and nonbelligerent manner, I just sit back and enjoy.  smile

                  3. livelonger profile image86
                    livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                    Me four! wink

              2. profile image0
                Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                Very funny.
                roll

                I take Dramamine, the non-drowsy kind.
                And I compensate by not traveling very far.  Makes life more boring, but I can't help it.   Saves travelin' money too though!

              3. Mark Knowles profile image58
                Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                Hey - I love it. If there is a type that turns people away from Christianity - she is it. Her Master must be pleeeezed. Hissssss.

                See- there is only 144,000 of them allowed so the more she turns away from the Wurd - the more room for adulteresses. wink

                And I said that without hisssing.....

                1. profile image0
                  Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  You DID hiss.
                  Did Randy let you borrow his snaky hiss?

      2. Cagsil profile image69
        Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Religion has no say in the laws. The word "marriage" is coined as a religious term, but has a different meaning for those who are not religious.

        This is the main problem. The word is open to more than one interpretation. Hence, the problem.

        Personally, who marries who is not my concern. What one does in their own bedroom, isn't my concern either. The privacy of what is done in that aspect is none of my business, as well, as it is none of anyone else's business either.

        The pure and simple fact that other people are sticking their damn nose in to how other people are to live their life is ridiculous and without any form or merit. Regardless of religious belief.

        There are too many people who think they have the right to choose what other people can or cannot do. How pathetic is that?

        Just my thoughts. smile

        1. profile image0
          Kathryn LJposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          And they are well argued too!!

  35. gamergirl profile image84
    gamergirlposted 14 years ago

    Brenda,

    I think I've about reached my threshold for trying to speak to you in a calm and collected manner.  Therefore, please accept my final insights and review of this thread:

    1.)  You believe yourself to be righteous in your indignation versus those who fight for civil rights.  This is very similar to the way that "status quo" folks (like the political buzz word I used? It fits!) believed and behaved in the days before the end of segregation.

    2.)  You -are- what others have called you, a cafeteria Christian.  The argument that the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross, the Blood of the Lamb, etc, excuses you from abiding by all the tenets of the Bible is a convenient slippery slope to "I can sin, and will, but go to Heaven regardless."  Prior sacrifice does not excuse lack of due diligence in following a Christ-like life.

    3.)  You think that anyone who disagrees with you is a liberal, or leftist, or anything like that.  This is not going to be the case in all situations.

    4.)  Somewhere beyond the rhetoric and sheeple tendencies lies a person with wit and possibly even a good heart.  Genuinely good people have believed strongly in terrible causes before, it's not unheard of.

    In closing, I have hope that you will, in time, grow in spirit and heart, and find a happy place within yourself where you won't have need for threads like this, beliefs like this, deep rooted intolerance and disgust like what you have presented here.

    Truly wishing you all the best,
    Gamergirl

  36. profile image0
    SwampDonkeyposted 14 years ago

    Ha Ha Brenda! lol   Your post was number 666! lol lol

    1. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      What do you mean?

      1. profile image0
        SwampDonkeyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        You were the 666th post on this thread! lol lol

  37. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    Oh.  Okay, I get it;  the number of posts in this thread.

    Are you superstitious or something?  The number 666 occurs many times in life and in reference to many posts everywhere.

    It's interesting that you noticed that, though!
    Or do you believe in Bible prophecy?

    1. profile image0
      SwampDonkeyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I dont believe the bible is facts. Only metaphores. Just seemed funny that someone devout as you would post on 666. Very ironic.

  38. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    Even more ironic that you'd notice that and make an issue of it in a thread about heterophobia.
    Are you heterophobic and/or anti-Christian?

  39. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    Always funny how people who don't claim to believe the Word still are drawn to it in some way or other.

    1. profile image0
      SwampDonkeyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Drawn to trying to help others escape their delusions.

    2. mythbuster profile image72
      mythbusterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      More fundamental attribution errors

  40. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago

    Maybe you could help Tom Cruise realize the error of Scientology?!
    haha

  41. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 13 years ago

    Your assumptions are horseradish!
    big_smile

    1. livelonger profile image86
      livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      So you're saying Jesus Christ was wrong, then.

      Your sacrilege knows no bounds.

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        No.
        I'm saying it ...seems like....your attitude might be......hate-filled, anti-Christian and heterophobic.
        But hey, I'm not making any accusations!

        1. livelonger profile image86
          livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          Please google "Fundamental Attribution Error." Mythbuster even pointed it out to you. My beliefs and I are completely irrelevant.

          You didn't answer my question (it should be easy, given how versed in the Bible you claim to be): which did Jesus Christ hate more, homosexuality or divorce & remarriage?

  42. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 13 years ago

    The Word says to be joyful when men persecute Christians for His sake.
    I am very joyful today!
    And yesterday.
    And the day before...
    smile

    1. livelonger profile image86
      livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Then why do you constantly persecute gay Christians? Do they not deserve to be joyful too?

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        I don't persecute gay Christians.
        Unless you mean gays who claim to be Christians and claim that God condones their active homosexual lifestyles.
        Notice I said "active lifestyles".
        And then I don't "persecute" anyone personally.
        I do indeed speak against the sin of homosexuality, and the gay agenda that wants to legalize sodomy in my USA.
        A person who has homosexual temptations is not so unique in needing Salvation.  We're all sinners;  some of us are just sinners saved by His grace.   That's what makes the difference.
        It's whether or not they choose to turn away from acting upon those lusts that makes the difference between a sinner and a sinner saved.

        I've already said this.  Why do you keep asking me?
        Oh wait....I already know.
        It's because you're still intent on making this a personal thing against me, because I speak the Word;  and you wish to ignore the fact that I've gotten redemption from my own sins.

        Well, shucks!  Hallelujah to that again!

        1. Mark Knowles profile image58
          Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          But - the Word says that women are not to preach. Oh - that is right.... You can go against the Word because you are saved. lol lol

          "Do as I say, not as I do."

          The Kornerstone of the Kristian Faith. wink

        2. livelonger profile image86
          livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          When are you going to return to your first husband, or are you going to continue to be an unsaved sinner?

          You do realize that that's what Jesus says in the Bible - not me, livelonger - right? Christ states that your remarriage is invalid and you are living in a state of adultery. You can only rectify this by returning to your first husband, forgiving him of his infidelities, and getting on with your life together.

          My feelings on the matter are completely immaterial. But until you remove that giant plank out of your own eye, pointing out the speck in gays' eyes is just a matter of you being a self-indulgent hypocrite. As your own Savior very, very clearly stated.

          1. profile image0
            Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            livelonger,

            how many times will you continue to twist the Word in order to try to condemn the forgiven?


            My sins are covered by His blood.
            I would wish yours were too.

            1. tantrum profile image59
              tantrumposted 13 years agoin reply to this

              That sounds bloody dramatic, Brenda ! yikes

              big_smile

      2. LovelyThoughts profile image59
        LovelyThoughtsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        Maybe you should just ban her like you ban everyone else.  Go ahead and ban me for saying that, but it is true.

        1. Maddie Ruud profile image72
          Maddie Ruudposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          For the record, no ordinary user can ban another user.  He or she might flag your posts for admin review, but staff are the only ones who can actually ban.



          Don't recall doing so, but I've moved it to "United States" within the Politics category.

  43. Sab Oh profile image54
    Sab Ohposted 13 years ago

    Can't the religious stuff stay on the religion forum?

    1. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      I dunno.  I don't remember if I put this in "Politics" or in "Religion"......

      But I do know I'm not the one who put it in the "Conspiracy Theories" forum.   Guess maybe Maddie or some other power-that-be put it here.....

  44. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 13 years ago

    Mark, today's hub is dedicated to you, as I indicated I'd do sometime.
    I'm sure you'll be pleased as punch.
    wink

    1. Mark Knowles profile image58
      Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      If by "pleased as punch" you mean acknowledging that you are going against the Word of God - um... sure.

      I see you do not have to follow the Word. I get that. You just have to spread ill-will. I am sure your Master is pleased.

      Very, very well done.

      Atheists whine huh? lol

      Winners and losers huh? lol

      That is sum good Kristian love right there. Thanks for the reminder. Pretty sure jeebus would be turning in his grave ....... if he had one . LOLOLOLO

      Like I said before - if heaven is full of people like you - give me eternal damnation any day of the week. wink

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        Turning in His grave?

        So you DO believe He's the risen Savior!

        Awesome, tantrum.

    2. tantrum profile image59
      tantrumposted 13 years ago

      lol

    3. tantrum profile image59
      tantrumposted 13 years ago

      What's awesome, Brenda ?

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        That you admit He's risen.

        Just in time for Easter too.

        I know you're not following Him, but you did admit you believe He's no longer in the grave?  Correct?

        1. tantrum profile image59
          tantrumposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          And where did I admit that ?.Never did !


          Nice poetry BTW. And my compliment is not a joke

          1. profile image0
            Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Oh drat!
            That wasn't you, it was Mark who said "Jeebus" didn't have a grave....

            I do apologize, tantrum.

    4. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 13 years ago

      I suppose, then, I should say it's awesome that MARK believes Jesus is RISEN!!!
      Awesome.

      1. Mark Knowles profile image58
        Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        I see.....

        So - telling lies for Jeebus is another Kornerstone of the Kristian faith? I am putting together a great list of Kommandments.

        The Ten Kommandments so far:

        1. Do as I say, not as I do
        2. Lie for Jeebus

        To be continued..................

        1. livelonger profile image86
          livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          I'd add:

          3. Condemn the sins of others, never your own.
          4. Restrict the freedoms of others, since they are a sin.
          5. Vote Republican.

    5. Uninvited Writer profile image80
      Uninvited Writerposted 13 years ago

      Brenda is special...

      1. livelonger profile image86
        livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        That's very generous of you. smile

    6. LovelyThoughts profile image59
      LovelyThoughtsposted 13 years ago

      I think Brenda's comments are offensive, but we need to be truthful here.  Jason Menayan is Livinglonger, and he pretends to be an ordinary member, when he is really part of the staff.  That is not very transparent.  Yes I know Jason is Livelonger, I did read his page and profile here:

      http://www.dyalogues.com/profile/jason_menayan

      1. IntimatEvolution profile image68
        IntimatEvolutionposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        Very good point LovelyThoughts. Why is a staffer promoting anger in a sensitive forum?  Where is the medial positioning, in which I'm sure he gets paid for?

        Food for thought.

        Just flag his aggressive comments and replies.

        1. LovelyThoughts profile image59
          LovelyThoughtsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          The plot thickens.  Check out this heartfelt blog where he talks about his dealings working with people that email him about a site he works for.  He might not mention Hubpages, but I have to wonder.  Jason is really sensitive towards others.  Yes Brenda is provocative, but why does Hubpages think it is funny to treat people like this:

          http://dailycandor.com/

          1. IntimatEvolution profile image68
            IntimatEvolutionposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            OMG, and he goes onto to calling hubbers dumbasses!!!  mad

            What is up with this comment of his, "I don’t really lower myself to engage in a flame war with these people – but I will amuse myself at their expense. Talking down to these people is a lot of funand pisses them off more than anything else." end quote

            1. livelonger profile image86
              livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

              You don't read very carefully, do you?



              If you want to defend those 3 dumbasses - who were not hubbers, if you want to read again - then go ahead. smile

            2. IntimatEvolution profile image68
              IntimatEvolutionposted 13 years agoin reply to this

              And calling hubbers dumbassess is no secret either?  Well it was news to me.

              You work for a small company, that makes money off of us.  Hubpages customers are the ones providing the money for YOUR paychecks.  And your response to that money, is to call hubbers dumbasses?  Amazing.mad


              And I do read carefully!  So I'm not the dumbass here.

              I'm not the one writing...," but I will amuse myself at their expense. Talking down to these people is a lot of fun and pisses them off more than anything else." end quote.

              So is this YOU talking down to me, and any other hubber who might not share your sentiment on hubbers being dumbasses and so forth?tongue

              1. livelonger profile image86
                livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                Which Hubbers did I call dumbasses IE? My blog post mentions 3 people who pissed me off and that I enjoyed taking the piss out of - NONE of whom were Hubbers.

                1. IntimatEvolution profile image68
                  IntimatEvolutionposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  So you upset now? 
                  YOU wrote that terrible stuff about people who participate in this community, on another website.

                  Then you come in here and argue with me, because I didn't like what you wrote.  Going so far as to insult my intelligence, in asking if I could read. 

                  It does not matter who the people are, what matters is how YOU represent your fellow team members and people under YOUR customer service care.

                  Don't like what I'm saying, then don't write terrible things like that.  That only looks bad on Hubpages.com and Paul Deeds.


                  Your post is a slam on the people who participate in Hubpages.com.  Whether that was your intention or not, is quite unclear.  However, YOUR aggressive performance towards me for quoting what you wrote, speaks volumes about your character.

                  How do we know none were hubbers?  You were so generalized in your statements, how ......, nevermind. 

                  YOUR POST!  YOUR BLOG!  YOUR WORDS! 


                  Own it, you wrote it.  They fact that you think I cannot read, because I find what I read insulting, says all we fellow hubbers need to know.....mad

                2. profile image0
                  sandra rinckposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Maybe regardless of who these people are/were, the point is that you enjoy talking down to people.  And, if you enjoy doing this and airing this for people to see, what makes any hubber so certain that you aren't doing it to them as well?

                  I did read the link.  I did find it amusing because let's face it, the yahoo email one was pretty stupid.  I have gotten emails from you and you have been polite so I cannot say that you aren't professional when working.

                  It's just knowing what you 'really' think that is disheartening.

                  1. IntimatEvolution profile image68
                    IntimatEvolutionposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                    Sandra, wonderfully written.

      2. profile image0
        cosetteposted 13 years agoin reply to this





        ....and who might YOU be?

        having fun outing Jason? what did he ever do to YOU? roll

        i have never understood people who use sites to trash people who work for said sites. if you guys think Jason (and HubPages) is so awful...

        there's the door!----------------->

        1. tantrum profile image59
          tantrumposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          lol

          So the door !----------------------------->  lol

          Bringing this up again is not good publicity for your friends.

        2. LovelyThoughts profile image59
          LovelyThoughtsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          Thanks for commanding me.  Anyway, I have nothing to feel bad about as I think both Brenda and Livelonger say things about people in a mean sort of way.  I do not like Brenda's agenda, but I think Livelonger is harsh towards her as well.  I did not trash anyone, simply shared an observation.  There is the difference, and I am not going to leave just because you told me so.  So I am mature and considerate of others, and unlike other people here that actually attack others I do not use swear words.  So as far as I am concerned you guys all like to attack, not I.

          1. Uninvited Writer profile image80
            Uninvited Writerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Bringing up what Jason said on another site and how you put it was definitely an attack whether you want to admit it or not.

            And even this statement was an attack on everyone else here who disagrees with you.

            1. tantrum profile image59
              tantrumposted 13 years agoin reply to this

              Stirring ,stirring the pot!
              Why is that I feel it's so hot ?

              lol

    7. livelonger profile image86
      livelongerposted 13 years ago

      Hardly a secret, but just something I don't make a big deal about. I keep my personal account (which predates the official one) for my personal sentiments, and my official one, obviously, for official matters.

      Besides, I play by the same rules of conduct that everyone else has to play by. The moderators can ban anyone for bad behavior, and no one is excluded. smile

      1. profile image0
        Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        Are you on the HubPages staff?

        1. tantrum profile image59
          tantrumposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          Surprise !! LOL

          and not even Maddie Ruud  knew about it, if we read this post LOL


          http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/38856?p … post927111


          an April Fool's joke, maybe ? hmm

     
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