Do you think america is headed to socialism?

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Nick Lucasposted 12 years ago
I was doing research for a hub and in the process realized how close we are to being a socialist country, what do you think? Our country has nationalized many industries and if you read the communist manifesto its like watching the news.
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  YES.
  
  And many of us are jumping for joy about it.... as if the 20th century was not littered with millions of those who believed in those systems, or were forced to serve under them.
  
  65 million in the People's Republic of China
  
  40 million in the Soviet Union
  
  2 million in Cambodia
  
  2 million in North Korea
  
  1.7 million in Africa
  
  1.5 million in Afghanistan
  
  1 million in the Communist states of Eastern Europe
  
  1 million in Vietnam
  
  150,000 in Latin America
  
  10,000 deaths "resulting from actions of the international Communist movement and Communist parties not in power."
  
  Courtois claims that Communist regimes are responsible for a greater number of deaths than any other political ideal or movement, including Nazism. The statistics of victims includes executions, intentional destruction of population by starvation, and deaths resulting from deportations, physical confinement, or through forced labor.
  
  Soviet repressions
  
  Repressions and famines occurring in the Soviet Union under the regime of Joseph Stalin described in the book include: the executions of tens of thousands of hostages and prisoners, and the murder of hundreds of thousands of rebellious workers and peasants from 1918 to 1922 (See also: Red Terror)
  
  the Russian famine of 1921, which caused the death of 5 million people
  
  the extermination and deportation of the Don Cossacks in 1920
  
  the murder of tens of thousands in concentration camps in the period between 1918 and 1930
  
  the Great Purge which killed almost 690,000 people
  
  the deportation of 2 million so-called "kulaks" from 1930 to 1932
  
  the deaths of 4 million Ukrainians (Holodomor) and 2 million others during
  
  the famine of 1932 and 1933
  
  the deportations of Poles, Ukrainians, Moldavians and people from the Baltic Republics from 1939 to 1941 and from 1944 to 1945
  
  the deportation of the Volga Germans in 1941
  
  the deportation of the Crimean Tatars in 1943
  
  the deportation of the Chechens in 1944
  
  the deportation of the Ingush in 1944.(p. 9-10) (See also: Population
  transfer in the Soviet Union)
  
  Just a few dead on account of the demented children of Marx.
  
  Yes lets run right into it... run run people... embrace your new masters.
  
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Black_ … _Communism
  
  And do not be fooled... it always begins with the Marxists, then the Socialists and useful idiots come into the fray... then the Communists take control... till the Facist among them slaughters them and takes control.
  
  A sick cycle. And that our kids are being brain washed into it, and its, Marxism/Socialism/Communism -s- history has been white washed, is just sickening.
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  Repairguy47posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I'm sure the you're paranoid posts should appear soon. From some countries we probably appear very right wing in comparison to their own, but we are so far left from where we were 30 years ago its scary. Incremental steps is the plan.
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, creeping incrementalism... it is insidious and has been going on for a century now.
  
  America is so screwed, repair... it isn't even funny.
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  Paul Wingertposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Newsflash! America IS a socialist country and we have been that day since the colony days. We have a mix capitalist and socalist economic system like China, Canada, Russia, Western Europe. etc. I'm proud to be a socialist/capitalist!
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Newsflash!.... wrong!
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  Paul Wingertposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  You're not very observent are you?
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  Nick Lucasposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  news flash........you need to read more! educate yourself more!
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  Danny R Handposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Our country is going to sh%t!!! And the main reason is disengagement of the people. People don't care about anything unless it affects their morning Starbucks! Our problems are cultural, not political!
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  Eaglekiwiposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  You could be correct.
  United we stand -divided we fall.
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  Ralph Deedsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  America heading to socialism? Nothing could be further from the truth. We are becoming a corporatist oligarchy marked by increasing millions sloshing around in Washington, DC and state houses around the country which has resulted, among other things, a huge and growing gap between the richest and the rest of Americans.
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  lovemychrisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, and we are supposed to feel sorry for the poor poor billionaires..OH, the unfairness of it all dahhhling.
  
  Starving children and US veterans living on the streets is not a sign of Socialism, but Crapitalism run amuck..and over any semblance of humanity.
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  iQwestposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Seriously, Ralph! Why can't people figure this out? It's so obvious. The only socialism happening in this country is in the form of money flowing from the pockets of the hard working American people to pay for entitlements for GE, Exxon, the banks, and countless other uber corporations that hoard obscene profits at the expense of cutting American jobs only to be rewarded by receiving even more tax cuts to relocate overseas.
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knolyourselfposted 12 years ago
America is the least socialist country in the world.
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  CHRIS57posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Agree - the US couldn´t be farther away from socialism.
  Funny that people even think about that.
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  Nick Lucasposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  under Obama we have nationalized parts of the auto industry, mortgage lenders, student loans, and healthcare....that falls under the definition of socialism.......higher taxes falls under the category of redistribution of wealth...he said he wants to spread the wealth around during his campaign so if its not socialism then what is it?
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  CHRIS57posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  A true Marxist would address those nationalizations to be STAMOCAP "state monopoly capitalism". That is nothing to be proud of, there are certainly better ways to overcome economic weaknesses, but to call it socialism...?
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  STAMOCAP... sort of sounds like Communism, Statism(NAZIism), as in the Peoples Republic of China.
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knolyourselfposted 12 years ago
"under Obama we have nationalized parts of the auto industry". Who owns the auto industry the corporations or the tax payers? Who owns the health care industry the corporations or the tax payers? and on... I'll relent a little. The US has the most socialism in the world for the Corporations. They go broke and the tax payers bails them out.
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  Nick Lucasposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  the tax payers have no control....we do not own anything....the US Gov takes are money and they own those things.....
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  No, the corporations own those things.
  
  Even if you are correct, that doesn't make for socialism, maybe state capitalism but never socialism.
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  Nick Lucasposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  "The term State capitalism has various different meanings, but is usually described as management of business and productive forces by the state-- especially when such management is done in a capitalist manner, even if the state is nominally socialist."
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  With the emphasis on nominally! How ever you twist it, it isn't true socialism.
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  Nick Lucasposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  it is what it is and history is on my side....if it looks like (bleep) and smells like ( bleep) then it probably is (bleep).......in Obama we trust!
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Eaglekiwiposted 12 years ago
A Socialist country is a country where the government or the public as a whole has control over the economy. In a socialist country, the producing and dispersing of goods is owned by the government. Socialism is placed in between capitalism and communism.

USA sure falls into the Socialist category to me.
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Actually, in a true socialist country the producing and dispersing of goods is owned by the people,not the government.
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  Nick Lucasposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  socialism doesnt work....history has proven that
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  Paul Wingertposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Tell that to the industrialized nations (Western Europe) that outranks us in healthcare, economy, and education. Pure socialism does not work but socialism/capitalism does and history proves that.
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  How do all the people decide and operate a machine like that?
  
  They do not... and that is where the Communists come in, someone has to control the goodies... and of course there is always a Facist among them waiting for the opportunity to slaughter his fellows and take control... and "poof" you got the marxist eutopia.
  
  I have laid this out for you before, John.
  
  The marxist stir up the youth and convince them of the BS... the youth "useful idiots" and those who are true believers "Socialists", betray their own country and people to over-throw and remake the system... then the Communists who are in control of daily operations of the machine, -because as much as you claim it can be, millions of "people" cannot operate such a thing as a state without massive problems-.... and they, the Communists, slaughter the Socialists, because we all know you cannot trust one who will betray their own... then the facist see his opportunitty and poof... dead commmies everywhere... and there you have your Marxist eutopia.
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  Paul Wingertposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Do you have a clue what a Communist or a Fascist is?
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  A communist or fascist is anybody with a different outlook to TM. See, he does know
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Yes.
  
  http://tmmason.hubpages.com/hub/Whatt-i … l-the-Same
  
  Do you?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Isnt that more Capitalist?
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  er, no, that's socialism, mind you that is all the people, not just the chosen few.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Ok,well either way its definately NOT democratic!
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Not democratic!! Surely the ultimate in democracy.
  Everybody having control of their own lives.
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I am still waiting for an answer john. how do 309 million people have a say in the daily operations of the machine and not cause deadlock and bungle funks?
  
  It is impossible.
  
  There will always be a small cadre who has control... and they end up Communists. No one when they aquire that centralized authority and wealth will willingly let it go. And do not be idealist and talk about trustworthy leaders.
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  309 million people don't have say in the daily operations. They do have a say in who oversees the daily operations though.
  
  They don't acquire the wealth and authority unless the workers give it to them.
  
  Simple.
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  Danny R Handposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Really! Noone pays attention to the political venue, so we all get screwed in the process. Meanwhile we pay atheletes millons of dollars while our teachers are lucky to get 30K a year. We put more money into our prisons annually than we do our public education!Our infrastructure is falling apart and we won't spend revenue to fix it because were to busy policing Iraq, Afgan., Korea, Japan, and Europe. We let our own people despair while our government caters to financial institutions and foreign nations. We don't have problems? Right!
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  What has that got to do with what I said?
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  Danny R Handposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Let me rephrase. There is no such thing as true socialism, like true communism, greed of those in control gets in the way.
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Yup.
  
  Someone gets it.
  
  And those would be the Communists who always end up in control. Untill the facist comes along and makes his move... then dead commies are littered everywhere.
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Only because neither have been tried.
  
  True socialism does not allow power grabbing.
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  Danny R Handposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Instill the human factor and now your dreams are crushed!
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Ah, it all ways ends in tears
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  Danny R Handposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  How do you remove greed from the human aspect of ANYTHING?
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knolyourselfposted 12 years ago
Do you drive on roads?
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  Nick Lucasposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  um sometimes I use the sidewalk...faster...no traffic.....
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Dave Powellposted 12 years ago
I'm always amazed at how readily people throw around the "socialism" label... like an epithet! Very few countries (including ours) are completely "democratic" and "socialist" countries are technically socialist in varying degrees. When the Democrats tried to reform America's staggeringly flawed healthcare system, Republicans rather successfully cried that federally mandated/managed healthcare would be "socialism." But we ALREADY have government mandated and managed health care! It's called Medicare. And while it too is administratively flawed, the outcry from citizens of both political parties would be deafening if someone tried to eliminate it.

An interesting research topic for you would be whether Americans truly understand "socialism"... and how politicians have capitalized on our varying levels of ignorance.
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  From my limited experience on these forum, I'd say that the average American does not understand socialism at all.
  They seem to use it as a catch all for any system that they disagree with.
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  Nick Lucasposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  well I do from working for the Federal Gov and traveling many places as well as my formal education, I have a good grasp
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Why would working for the Federal Gov give you a good grasp of what socialism is?
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  lovemychrisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Which Goverment?
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  Paul Wingertposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I'm suprised the number of people in this country know what socialist actually is. These "anti socialists" went to a public school, collect social security, and their hospital bills picked up by Medicare.
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TMMasonposted 12 years ago
Socialism, A Short history of.

(edit)-- I cut this so they do not dupe my hub.

http://tmmason.hubpages.com/hub/Whatt-i … l-the-Same

I am very aware of what Socialism is, and the varying degrees of European style Socialism in the world. So some may not know... but others of us do know perfectly well.

It is all a matter of degrees.
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Why, exactly, do you think that's a laugh?
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Because as a nation it is puny... and as such is not a true and accurate measure of the value and effectiveness of Socialism as a ideology for governance.
  
  And don't you like my definition of Socialism?
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  John Holdenposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Ah, not a big warmongering country then!
  
  Your definition of socialism is like the curates egg, good in parts.
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knolyourselfposted 12 years ago
Change greed. It's a change of values usually called elevated consciousness. What can be more amazing than a tree, and if it were not for the tree no one would exist. There are millions of them and they are usually free. Or I need a vineyard so
I can brag about it at parties.
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  Danny R Handposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Now try changing those who have their own will. Your ideas hold much less value to them than their desires. Call me a cynic. However, I'm right. You can't change others will by your own philosophy.
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Evan G Rogersposted 12 years ago
Headed to?

Buddy, we're there.
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  Nick Lucasposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  sad to say but I agree
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recommend1posted 12 years ago
America is heading toward being nothing much ! all the money is in the hands of a very few people and they have shipped much of their wealth out of the US and spread it around the world - why do you think you don't have any ???

They will happily leave you to fight among yourselves soon.
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  noxadariposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  What wealth? the U.S. national debt is $14,666,269,749,955.87. That is more than quadruple of several other countries that I have looked at.
  France $2,420,029,319,154.96
  Germany $2,738,043,810,203.93
  Spain $901,937,662,550.06
  
  America is one of the poorest countries in the world right now, regardless of how much money it actually makes or takes from the people.
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  lovemychrisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Ye, Dubai and Paraguya are LOVELY this time of year.
  
  No taxes on your income dahhhling, and very many serfs to serve you.
  
  Oh, and I DO believe there is a no extradition treaty with the USA...my how CONvenient.
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DonDWestposted 12 years ago
Why can't people tell the difference between socialism and fascism? Since when is the merger between state and corporate power socialism? Some people have a lot of history to read up. . .
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  lovemychrisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Since they want to get Obama out so they can continue their corporate raiding of America.
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Thousands of new regulations every day, and you all want to cry about the corporations owning America... what a joke.
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  lovemychrisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  NAME ONE that happened today.
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  Ralph Deedsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Who do you think are writing the regulations? Answer: corporate lobbyists.
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Right now Obama and his croonies.
  
  You really think his regulatory Czar is a Right-wing corporate Capitalist.
  
  Ah you guys are a laugh a minute.
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  DonDWestposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Fascism is the merger between state and corporate power. Major corporations get together with Obama to write up the rules that stifle competiton. Why is this so difficult to udnerstand?
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  TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  The rules he and his are writing, are stifling whole sectors of the economy... and the economy as a whole... not just some compitition.
  
  What is so hard about that to understand?
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  Mighty Momposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Oh, so it's Obama's RULES that are stifling the economy?
  If it's so simple, then why doesn't Obama just CHANGE the rules and STIMULATE the economy???
  Or wave his magic wand and give every American a fully benefitted job paying $100,000K per year?
  
  Either the man IS that powerful ... or he's NOT.
  You guys can't seem to make up your minds on that one!
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  Mighty Momposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Really?
  Is that why they are blocking the merger of AT&T and T Mobile on the ground that it would create in essence a monopoly on the cellular industry?
  That seems to me a PRO-competition move....
  But then, it's so easy to get confused on such matters.
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manlypoetrymanposted 12 years ago
This sure ain't my Father's America...anymore!

(Got'ta remember that line...it's a good one!)
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manlypoetrymanposted 12 years ago
Hey...whether this is appropiate or not at this point in this discussion...I interject it. Well...just 'cause...It is cool...and true. Peace! (What a great thread to put it into anyways...)

http://youtu.be/y9RJYxMdMrY
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Wizard Of Whimsyposted 12 years ago
http://youtu.be/rxzE8x2pnK4
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  lovemychrisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Spot On!
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lovemychrisposted 12 years ago
Shared by a blogger on my local site: The truth the Obama-Bashers don't want you to see:

http://www.ourfuture.org/blog-entry/201 … rother-law
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  Repairguy47posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I see the spin doctors have taken control of the graphs again. Here's one not from the Obama fabrication network.
  
  http://www.google.com/publicdata?ds=usu … &dl=en
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Wizard Of Whimsyposted 12 years ago
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Wizard Of Whimsyposted 12 years ago
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  lovemychrisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Exactly!
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Wizard Of Whimsyposted 12 years ago
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