Ever since I have been coming to this Religion forum I have seen new Christian members start threads just to be attacked by godless morons and vile new age jerks that are regulars here. They also attack Muslims or people of any organized religion. I've seen many good people come here, post a nice thread just to be attacked and then never to see them again. I'm fed up with it.
It's like these regular godless morons and vile new age jerks want to run good people out of here so they can control this forum for themselves.
We very seldom see a person from one religion attack a post submitted by a person from another religion. And we very seldom see a person from one Christian denomination attack a post submitted by a person from another Christian denomination.
It's always the same godless morons and vile new age jerks doing the attacking. HubPages won't change it if you complain. It makes me wonder whether the administration of HubPages is godless themselves. Cause the way this place is it is not a Religion forum, no matter what anyone says.
One of the regular Christians that comes here, aka-dj started a new thread titled "Leave us alone", politely requesting that these godless morons and vile new age jerks leave our threads alone and stop attacking us. But it has turned into a 17 page thread mostly dominated by these same godless morons and vile new age jerks, from the very first reply.
Like I say, this is not a Religion forum the way it is. Coming to this so-called Religion forum feels like coming to a communist environment surrounded by satan's minions.
So who else is fed up?
And who wants to do something about it?
I'm suggesting that we all gather in this thread to decide on another forum to attend and give this so called Religion forum over to the godless morons and vile new age jerks. Let them have this piece of trash.
What do you say?
Add your reply if you want to migrate to a different forum.
Then we can decide what forum to migrate to.
Mike - I have some sympathy for your theme and might have more if the original post looked less like an exercise in keyword stuffing. In fairness (if you are interested in being fair) I think you'd have to admit that intelligent, open-minded individuals (BDazzler comes to mind) who treat others with respect are treated respectfully in return, while some others who come across as dogmatic and closed-minded are certainly given a hard time. My recent thread (called 'a generous game to play') invited everyone to talk about what was best in a religion or philosophy other than their own. While the response was enthusiastic, it was interesting and rather sad that very few of the more fundamentalist people here had anything to offer on the subject. Why should that have been?
I agree, Paraglider. Personally, I think the evangelist-baiting has got out of hand recently, with even quite moderate statements being jumped on with both feet and teeth bared. I've even seen fundamentalists being attacked about their beliefs on other threads, where they weren't talking about religion at all. I know the baiters (you know who you are!) are enjoying themselves hugely, but the joke's getting a bit tired for everyone else, IMO.
However, Mike, the solution is in your hands. Forums are for discussion, not for preaching in. If you make a post declaring that your own beliefs are the absolute truth, you must expect them to be questioned and debated by the large numbers of people in this world who don't agree with you.
Also, the religious forum is only a place for Hubbers to congregate socially, it's not the purpose of HubPages. You could participate in HubPages just as effectively by writing your Hubs here, but taking your religious discussions elsewhere. I'm sure there are numerous fundamentalist forums where you could debate with like-minded people, without any unwelcome interruptions.
I think you're on the right track Mike, and Marisa also makes some good points. I've gravitated to the religious theme recently so I've hung out there when I've been here. But it is in the way it is handled and raised, and there are times when the response is more about defending positions and opinions (because they've been attacked, or felt attacked) then in providing a sound theme. Arguements, particularly in religion have never led to enlightenment. There's a certain openness and flexibility and investigation required, and Mike btw I liked the moderation and inquiry of your views in one of the other forums.
Paraglider- I totally agree with you that Bdazzler indeed is a very broad minded person and respectful of others. Friends needn't agree on everything but we all can certainly disagree agreeably. In fact when I have differences with some very conservative people I sometimes don't even try to explain since I see little point and whereas when somebody like BDazzler says something I take notice of it (and have even written a hub after one such statement). Once again thanks for that wonderful thread and hopefully we all get to better appreciate each others point of view by the gesture started by you
You are right that for the most part, (and certailnly always by you, Para) I have been treated with respect. A couple of times people didn't "get" my humor and a couple of other times I was feeling particularly grumpy, so I had to back off ...
I am frequetly more frustrated by people who believe "close" to what I do than polar opposites.
The only person I really didn't understand was Julie Grimes ... I noticed her profile is gone.
There are certain things that we believers have to be aware of when posting in public:
1. Not everybody accepts the authority of the Bible and therefore using the bible as "proof" is pretty worthless when not among a group of mostly believers. (Like hub pages)
2. Not everybody has had the same set of experirences we have, so it's not really fair of us to expect others to "know" what we "know". If people act like they're not Christian, it's probably because they aren't Christians
3. Jesus said to do good to those who "persecute" and "spitefully use us" .... the thing is about it, 9 times out of 10, when you start doing good, they quit persecuting and spitefully using ... and pretty soon you run out of enemies. Odd how that works out
4. While we're on the topic of scripture ... this is a note to all the bible believers... guys, it's a sword, be careful how you swing it, you can hurt someone!
5. Speaking of combat. We don't struggle against flesh and blood ... that means people are not the enemy. Certian ideas, wrong thinking, yeah, even demons are the enemy. But if Jesus died for the whole world, for all people, he sees them as precious ... whether they agree with us or not, we need to as well!
Thanks again Para for your comments.
I am fed up when you say Jesus is the only way and put down his other brother Prophets who say exactly the same thing as he does.All Religion and Prophets are equal-all come from the LIGHT.
1.the Holy Bible- King James Version
2.Ponder Awhile- Mohit.K.Misra
5.Holy Bible, New International Version
You are insulting the Light- god
http://find.franklin.com/nav/ca/spiritu … r/ebooks/0
Yeah, the problem has been reported to hp many times already but they don't see a problem with it even when some of the others hubbers say for even admin to read that they are there to ridicule anyone who believes in God, but apparently this is not a qualification enough to have the problem looked at.
I also put up a hub about a new forum to talk about religion on for the same exact reasons, that we can't talk about religion peaceful without a couple of other hubbers out to specifically target and degrade and frustrate intentionally the discussions taking place.
So here is a forum we could go to and hopefully those who don't want to talk about religion with us wont follow because we are trying to get away from you and back to what we want to talk about.
try http://thanksgod.org/?page_id=42 and unfortunately the hub I put up was flagged by other hubbers and pulled by hp. So while I think communist is a little bit of a reach, I do feel the same way.
That yes, everyone should have an opinion and we should be able to talk about our beliefs but like so many other hubbers, we see them come and go because they are being attacked right away and a lot of people are leaving hub pages because of it.
I think that especially in a thread that says, please leave us alone, that the hubbers who don't like us should have respectfully left us alone but that didn't happen either. So there ya go.
that it is like this...
You know you are absolutely right. It is a forum for Religion. Not a forum for BASHING RELIGIOUS posters. If I have been guilty of this I ask that you accept my apology. But you are absolutely correct in thinking that this forum and the posters should be given ample respect and freedoms to discuss there religious faiths with out being ran off or down graded.
My opinion for what it is worth, is that anyone who participates in this forum and is a zealot or a person who has a lot of love and zeal for their faith; band together and bombard the hell out out of the hub team. Hopefully with positive suggestions. I noticed that the hubber hangout has particular rules and regulations to follow- why not apply the same idea to this forum. Maybe a signed petition for change can be started by someone as a hub and try that angle. I have a prof. who was on this site and got ran off from not only the religious hub forum, but she was pretty harassed to a point that she shut down her site altogether. I fortunately haven't had any bad experiences. But I'm a guy. She is a middle aged woman. My hormones work differently than hers I suspect. Back on track; she was still ran off from her beliefs and ideas.
This is a religious forum. A forum on Religion. It has the potential to be great- but right now it's a bad place to hang out at.
While the short name of the forum is "Religion", the description is far more encompassing: "world religions, theology, epistemology, and the philosophy of religion". In areas like religion and politics where people hold strong and widely varying beliefs, a bit of fervent disagreement is natural in an open forum. However, I encourage all participants to be respectful of other posters, and mindful of the HubPages forum rules, in particular:
Making Personal Attacks: debate and disagreements on points of substance are all right, but personal attacks, petty bickering, and thread hijacking will be dealt with swiftly.
Paul - good post, and specially good for being "omnipresent" and aware of what's going on in your patch! Impressed
I am just wondering how Mike calling me moron and jerk is NOT a personal attack, and me giving him a finger in reply IS. His post stays, my was removed. Not impressed...
LOL I object! He just type that - ummm - text in, and I spent countless hours looking for appropriate smiley
The same points could have been made with FAR less namecalling and venom.
Likewise, if you feel there is a serious and grave enough problem that lasting change need be made, the Hubpages staff is the direction to look, not a lengthy post on the forums.
I am going to stop here, and hope that you have a fantastic rest of the evening.
Just a Vile New Ager Who Tries Not to be a Jerk
aka - Gamergirl.
It's really THAT bad, MM?
I'm sorry... I don't pay that much attention to religion--feel one has a right to one's beliefs as long as they don't infringe on others' rights. Also that discussion is NOT a bad thing...
RK--You are not talking about a Julie Grimes, are you??
There was a woman, Julie Grimes, who became irate and basically was 'run out of here.' Don't know the specifics. Do think she probably had some kind of hormonal (maybe) or other problem. She was some kind of teacher of religion--that's why I ask.
I got it. I'll ask Wetridge what her profile name was. Her expirence was so bad, I was left intriqued. Kind like when my parents gave me the sex talk. After that, I couldn't wait to get started. Anything that sounds bad from your parents; most likely is to good too be true!
Man, though I'd hate for anybody to be ran off from any site. Even though I like Misha's smiley thing- was it uncalled for- yeah. It was. Misha- whats up with that man? Come on. Telling someone to fuck off; well that's just wrong dude.
You know RK, godless morons, communist dolphin haters and child molesters do even more evil things
And of course you can have this smiley, especially considering I stole it myself from another thread - another godless misdeed
RK--Um, well... From what I've observed, there is a group of 'Apex' hubbers on the forums that kind of act as volunteer moderators. You need to sort of know how to deal with them (they aren't bad after that, lol) who take issue with all kinds--but usually, from what I've seen, religious types and maybe certain guys (hey--you are doing well, basically) are sort of targeted. And the promoters--they don't like those, either...
I personally believe everyone has a right to their opinion, to be heard---though I also believe I have a right to disagree, essentially.
Godless moron - tick
Vile new age jerk - probably not
Satan's minion -
I believe aka-dj has stated many times that he enjoys the cut and thrust that allows him to expand his horizons, and I would have thought this forum might get a little boring if all that is left is a few fundamentalists posting videos of children stating their parent's political beliefs and great swathes of copied text with a slew of "very insightful" and "thanks for posting this" comments.
I think the 'wouldn't you' covers it Mark . It would appear that some of the 'yous' don't.
Dang Mark, if we start agreeing on too much the whole time space continuum may be in danger again ... still ...
I truly enjoy my "home" of like minded people, but like dj, I need to see what's out here, not to have friends keep telling me they agreee with me.
I've also discovered that many of us being different ages, cultures and religious backgrounds often use different words to mean the same thing OR we mean different things by the same words.
Yeah, Mark, you're godless, not exactly a moron, but sometimes you can be a jerk ... but even when you're a jerk, you're not boring!
And even though you are satan's minion, if you decide not to go to hell and drink Evan Williams come on up to heaven, I'll have a place saved at the table for you with some Single Barrel Jack. You will, however, have to admit God exists to get in ... but it's OK for you to ask Him to nuke child molesting clergy.
We do seem to agree on a lot of things
As for the godless moron - if Mike thinks I am a godless moron, then as far as he's concerned I am a godless moron.
I very much try to stick with Morihei Ueshiba's teachings - having spent much of my "spiritual development" studying and practicing Aikido. And pretty much this can be summed up by using another's strengths and aggressions against them.
Mike would therefore have gotten what I felt he gave to me. And I can totally understand why he thinks I am a godless moron. Maybe he will turn that around on himself and see what I see. Who knows? At the end of the day, everyone follows their own path.
You are usually a reasonable thinking person, so I try to show you a reasonable, thinking person. That is not what I show Mike
Evan Williams? I might be able to cope with that. Scotch - no way I am up there.......
I like the Religion Forum. I've learnt many things, I've met some great intelligent debaters and thinkers. Above all I've come to understand that what I'm doing and the way I'm doing it is right for me and I know I'm not going to hell in a handbasket. I know I'm not a moron, not always and I know I'm not a jerk, but can do jerk if I have to. Listening to evangelical Christians teaches me tolerance also and that can't be a bad thing, can it?
I am not vile, nor angry, nor discusting, nor a new ager--whatever that is because you never really answered that quesiton. When I stated about what I believed in another forum, you went off and felt that it was imperitive that you correct me. I then posted as to where you would get that it was your responsibility that I am totaly wrong about what I believe and you began to JAM your beliefs and YOUR religion right down and past my throat. What do you expect a reaction would be to that. Then I come here and you are still thinking that you are almighty as God and you put yourself on the perverbial pedestal. Watch who you crush when you fall there. Do unto Others as you wish them to do unto you.
I am tired of all of the Christian's such as yourself who do think that you are better than anyone else and that your way is the only way and no one else has a right to live.
Are you sure your not vile? Response was. You're something else Lady. Disturbing, yeah that fits. From now on your nickname should be disturbed.
I think you're right Lady Guinevere. I think it's been going both ways. I may not have been commenting, but I, and probably many others, have been reading. Sometimes it goes well, and sometimes it doesn't. I say well said, ladyG.
I didn't notice that your post was removed, but I must wonder why you assumed you were part of the 'godless morons and vile new age jerks' class? You're way above that. As for me, I easily excluded myself from 'morons' and also from 'vile' and 'jerks'. In fact, I wasn't quite sure who Mike was talking to...
Paraglider- Good to hear your point of view.
Misha- It wasn't even a specific mention but even if it was specifically mentioned I still hope that you shouldn't take it personally i.e., If I call you a genius like Einstein do you become one and same way if somebody calls you a "moron" do you become one?
You are what you are and even if somebody specifically calls you names then it should at best be ignored. We shouldn't let somebody's opinion of us interfere with our peace of mind. Have a great day
Thank you CW-girl, you are too sweet
I definitely take it easy, I just thought it was an appropriate response to Mike's bitching. And still think so
Misha- It is not what someone says that matters to me but how I choose to react to it. If I get similarly irritated by someone then technically I am as "short tempered" as the other person and in adult life using the kids logic "you started first" leads us nowhere. In general I have seen sometimes when I have nothing better to say then being silent at that time works to my advantage in the long run(both in educational and professional life so far). Btw thanks for the "sweet" mention and glad to know you are taking it easy
Not that I took it seriously personally, but formally yes - I do post on religion forum often, I am godless in Mike's definition, and I am pretty close to new age, and most importantly I often disagree to him - so all what he said refers to me personally
LOL David, if all Christians were like you, the World would have been a very different place
Sandy I won't argue with you, but I disagree to your current message on many accounts, and you know this
Good luck with your forum
Well thank you Misha, but what exactly is my current message?
Oh, you just wrote half a page on this I won't repeat it
Glad he liked it
And if you are calling this "a lot of crap", you probably did not frequent some other forums that I once did. This is even not a light breeze yet
OMG, I know. I've been reading.
That "Lady" chick on here. What's her deal? You've been here longer than me. I understand if nothing needs to be said, but man- she's annoying. Vile actually.
LG is actually a very nice person. Just don't (as she says) try to shove your religion down her throat, or tell her she's stupid/satanic/mentally disturbed if she doesn't believe in the Bible. Then you'll get the kind of reaction you saw in that post. You have to remember that she has been insulted by the original poster a few times and so her words weren't just in response to this thread but to the history on other threads.
She certainly doesn't deserve the treatment she's getting here.
"It's like these regular godless morons and vile new age jerks want to run good people out of here so they can control this forum for themselves. "
Nine months and two Hubs...with a crap score, no fans...spewing off at the grill here...Hypocrite. You are more than vile...hater of God, backbiter...reference it moron. Paul wrote it genius..opinionated dweeb.
LOL Rich, you are taking it too serious my friend. It's just letters on your screen
Pest- I agree with Misha about you taking this seriously my friend. Sometimes elder folks may say things not in the most appropriate way and even I feel a better choice of words would have conveyed the meaning more effectively but we still should try to respect them.
About his profile I would just like to add that his google adsense was removed and hence he lost the motivation to write hubs. I have seen his knowledge/opinions especially about Israel/Palestine issues and about Catholic(Christian) topics and if need be he certainly has enough material to write many hubs. Hence giving him a benefit of doubt maybe if he would have written more hubs then he would have had more fans and visitors(leading to higher hub scores).
At the same time my friend please forgive me if my response in anyway seems offensive to you.
LOL LG is actually a very nice person, until you try to sell your religion to her. As well as Mark
I was talking about other places, not HP. Is it really your first Internet forum?
It would be a lot easier to sell if money came with it! LOL.
Come on Julianna, I can be nasty if I want to
And I don't mind it staying at all, we have a lot of fun on this thread
I see that you do and I love the posting that Paul left about petty bickering,I wonder if someone snitched or if you was watching??? In case I know you and that is what I like best as you can put up a good fight. and normally you and Mark win!!! It is like a tag team, except for nobody's rolling in the mud....Lol:)
Is he gone? Mike I mean. I've noticed that it seems he's buck-tail and hasn't posted any rebuttals or explanations. What's up with that?
I thought he made his position pretty clear actually. He is fed up and has gone off to talk about god somewhere without any godless morons and vile new age jerks to contend with. I have no doubt there are plenty of places where the faithful can discuss whatever it is they discuss without interference from awkward questions and contrary opinions.
Vile new age jerks?
Crap I thought it was a new vial of aged jerk ... great stuff for Jamaican cooking!
Nothing's simple. I appreciated a lot of Mike's input on the political forum in particular. His position on a couple of long-running threads on Palestine was well researched, articulate and fair. I'm hoping he'll be back.
LOL Jumping to conclusions again
Mike was probably having a bad day, I too hope he will be back
Apparently you don't know about the differing time zones that work here.
Shut up Lady. Can I say that? Just shut your trap or cut off your fingers Lady.
I was talking about Mike the Money guy. Not BDazzle. We not you were talking about Mike and if he was truly gone or not.
Just a few of us here discussing religion, and we can't stop calling names. Seems an accurate reflection of real world!!!
LG: What wrong did you do to deserve this? :
Well this RKHenry has no manners it appears. This person wants to start a fight with me as they tried several times in another forum. Just ignore them---or give them more of what they want---cut off their fingers!! and Shut UP! Now does RKHenry lke that? How doe that work for them? Do unto Others as You would have them do to you---I guess they want that? Beats me!! Some people are sadistic.
I did nothing to them.
Boy did you jump to the wrong conclusions on that!!! It hink you should shut up and read a bit more of what and whom you are posting too.
The response was about Mark Knowles. It wouldn't matter to whom it was too there are still time zone differences my dear.
LG, sweetie, if you follow the path of the thread, the Mike they're talking about being a jerk is the OP, Make Money.
I'd say two days is a long time if we're talking about time zones, anything over 12 hours or so and I would say it's not a time zone issue at all.
Yes, I know. I was giving him the benefit of the doubt as to why he has not come back here. He may just be reading and not responding----something like God......................... hehehehehe.
The time zone things still stands. For instance I am EST US and Mark is 6 hours ahead of me, so while I am up writing at 6 in the evening he may be sleeping because it is midnight his time. If he has a job then he may not have time to post until 6 pm his time. There are many other times zones and even days. The thing is everyone isn't always on here all the time
I don't know what you did to upset Ms. Henry LG - But I suggest you do it some more.
I see brotherly, sisterly love in here, I had better get back to work I will have to catch up on this thread in the evening after I put on my golden gloves...
Is it worth looking at?
Sorry - your user-name is pretty androgynous so I guessed. I suppose I had a 50/50 chance of getting it right and if I had said Mr. - you would be offering to show me your tits?
Nah, being called a bloody christian somehow made it shrivel. It's hiding.
OIC telling me to cut my fingers off is Christian?
Find where my Jewish black ass has ever said I was a fucking Christian. Go on little girl. Shew! Find it. As for being Jewish, Im not too much of a believer of that crap either. Off you go.
Christian. Yeah. Good one.
Now there are many words in the English language that you could use besides cussing. I really don't care for that and it just shows how immature you are.
I truly don't have the faintest idea what your problem is here. You have been egging for a fight in every forum and I have ignored you and I will still do that because I don't want a fight as you want. Discussion yes, but not a fight just to fight. Off with You! Good day!
That's what I thought too - then I realized I was not in the cooking forum.
Hasn't this thread been drama and negativity enough for everyone?
Please.. just.. don't.
I know, LG, but a time frame of 48 hours or more, and no response from Make Money, leads one to believe that it is not a matter of time zones as far as Make Money is concerned. That's what I am trying to get at.
Pretty sure he has left us for more fertile ground.
Good to see smart people around here.
But still. Whats the use of posting a post like this, if he never [for "lady's sake; MakeMoney]
planned on sticking around. He wrote a question and requested an act to referendums, not a dear John letter. Says alot about the man really. Too bad.
"I guess you'd like me to unzipp my pants "
How about unzipping your brain or is that oxymoronic?
Thread closed by admin.
Healthy, polite discussion and difference of opinion is encouraged, but this thread has degenerated into mere bickering and name-calling.
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