Free Will - Self contradictory?

Jump to Last Post 1-8 of 8 discussions (13 posts)
  1. Dgerrimea profile image61
    Dgerrimeaposted 8 years ago

    Hey everyone.
    I've got a feeling that there is no free will. My train of thought is thus:

    Either each event (B) has a cause (A), or it does not have a cause.

    If A causes B, then you can never have one without the other, thus each is proof of the other. If B is not caused, then B is necessarily random, as its nature and/or qualities are not the result of the nature/qualities of the universe, because it was not caused by anything (in the universe).

    Most people's definition of free will requires that there be multiple possible outcomes, and a conscious decider to pick one. If the concious decider (A) picks one (B), then there was only one choice. If there was more than one choice, there could be no cause for any of them.

    Discuss.

    1. mohitmisra profile image58
      mohitmisraposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Where are these thoughts coming from? From god the source who is orchestrating this entire universe.We are like puppets playing out our part. smile

  2. Cagsil profile image81
    Cagsilposted 8 years ago

    You are comparing cause and effect against free will of choice?

    This comparsion isn't fair.

    Free will is about thoughts and the ability to think such thoughts. How you act on those thoughts is what cause and effect is really.

    Cause and effect happens only when action has been taken. The effect the cause creates is determined by what sort of action was taken.

    Self-contradictory? No in the slightest. Being SELF-responsible for your own thoughts and actions, you can limit the cause and effect, on society.

    1. The Rope profile image54
      The Ropeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Cagsil, I may be missing the point but while I agree with your first two points, the last assumes that each effect is "caused" by said person which isn't always true.  I personally believe the domino effect - every cause does have an effect but it may or may not be to the person making the decision.

  3. Dgerrimea profile image61
    Dgerrimeaposted 8 years ago

    But even thought processes are events which were either caused or not caused. If they were caused, then they are part of the 'domino' chain and there is no real choice because there is no real outcome. If they are not caused, then they are random and unrelated to personality, desire, anything else. It would be like making every decision by rolling some dice, only less deterministic.

  4. Inspirepub profile image75
    Inspirepubposted 8 years ago

    You are assuming that only one outcome exists in "reality".

    If you look at quantum physics, it is entirely possible that all the alternatives are equally real, and the "choice" is not which alternative will become "real" and all others then become "not real", but rather, which alternative to observe/experience in this "lifetime" - sequence of moments of experience.

    In that case, both free will and determinism are true, across an infinite number of possible universes. Each sequence of events is determined (including determinations made by the mechanism of random selection), and every possible sequence of events actually exists at once.

    Free will enters in when one point of consciousness moves along a sequence, as it can can only visit one branch of each choice point.

    The other branches do not cease to exist, but they become invisible (inexperiencable) to the point of consciousness once it is on the part of the timeline "after" the choice is made.

    Jenny

    1. Dgerrimea profile image61
      Dgerrimeaposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Free will and determinism aren't qualities of a particle, they are, and if my logic is valid and sound, then there can never be free will in any universe.

      And even if you do play the quantum card and say that multiple possible outcomes can exist/co exist, then you are agreeing with me because the conscious agent is not the one making the choice.

      Events are either caused or random. Neither option allows for free will.

  5. profile image0
    sneakorocksolidposted 8 years ago

    Do you mean free will or free agency?

    1. Dgerrimea profile image61
      Dgerrimeaposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      What are your definitions of these terms?

  6. kess profile image61
    kessposted 8 years ago

    We cannot deny the reality of the free will in the decisions we are faced with in our lives.

    But as we seek to understand further, we do realize our limitations. These limitations though does not negate the reality of free will but rather embraces them.

    The limitations are a result of our individual thoughts can be ultimately categorized in to Good or evil.

    As we continue further we would also realize that truth and Good are inextricably linked likewise lies and evil.

    For any evil to exist it must be  established with some good or truth otherwise it will self destruct. And therefore for Good to exist, it must be with purity of truth, for any lie will corrupt good and transform it into evil. 

    I have said all this to say, yes there is a freewill which is embraced by the motivation for Good or for evil of which all truth vs truth and lie as the options.

    If you then contend that I have proven that freewill does not exist for we are either agents for Good using only truth as our standard, or we are agents for evil using some truth and some lies as our standard.
    I also fully agree.

    All good exist as God and truth exist as his Son Christ.

  7. aka-dj profile image77
    aka-djposted 8 years ago

    I do not have the (free) will to answer this question. It's my destiny.
    Something forced my hand and fingers to type. lol

  8. tantrum profile image59
    tantrumposted 8 years ago

    Free Will is the inheritance we should leave to our children

    1. aka-dj profile image77
      aka-djposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      "They" will find a way to tax that too!

 
working

This website uses cookies

As a user in the EEA, your approval is needed on a few things. To provide a better website experience, hubpages.com uses cookies (and other similar technologies) and may collect, process, and share personal data. Please choose which areas of our service you consent to our doing so.

For more information on managing or withdrawing consents and how we handle data, visit our Privacy Policy at: https://hubpages.com/privacy-policy#gdpr

Show Details
Necessary
HubPages Device IDThis is used to identify particular browsers or devices when the access the service, and is used for security reasons.
LoginThis is necessary to sign in to the HubPages Service.
Google RecaptchaThis is used to prevent bots and spam. (Privacy Policy)
AkismetThis is used to detect comment spam. (Privacy Policy)
HubPages Google AnalyticsThis is used to provide data on traffic to our website, all personally identifyable data is anonymized. (Privacy Policy)
HubPages Traffic PixelThis is used to collect data on traffic to articles and other pages on our site. Unless you are signed in to a HubPages account, all personally identifiable information is anonymized.
Amazon Web ServicesThis is a cloud services platform that we used to host our service. (Privacy Policy)
CloudflareThis is a cloud CDN service that we use to efficiently deliver files required for our service to operate such as javascript, cascading style sheets, images, and videos. (Privacy Policy)
Google Hosted LibrariesJavascript software libraries such as jQuery are loaded at endpoints on the googleapis.com or gstatic.com domains, for performance and efficiency reasons. (Privacy Policy)
Features
Google Custom SearchThis is feature allows you to search the site. (Privacy Policy)
Google MapsSome articles have Google Maps embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
Google ChartsThis is used to display charts and graphs on articles and the author center. (Privacy Policy)
Google AdSense Host APIThis service allows you to sign up for or associate a Google AdSense account with HubPages, so that you can earn money from ads on your articles. No data is shared unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Google YouTubeSome articles have YouTube videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
VimeoSome articles have Vimeo videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
PaypalThis is used for a registered author who enrolls in the HubPages Earnings program and requests to be paid via PayPal. No data is shared with Paypal unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook LoginYou can use this to streamline signing up for, or signing in to your Hubpages account. No data is shared with Facebook unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
MavenThis supports the Maven widget and search functionality. (Privacy Policy)
Marketing
Google AdSenseThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Google DoubleClickGoogle provides ad serving technology and runs an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Index ExchangeThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
SovrnThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook AdsThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Unified Ad MarketplaceThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
AppNexusThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
OpenxThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Rubicon ProjectThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
TripleLiftThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Say MediaWe partner with Say Media to deliver ad campaigns on our sites. (Privacy Policy)
Remarketing PixelsWe may use remarketing pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to advertise the HubPages Service to people that have visited our sites.
Conversion Tracking PixelsWe may use conversion tracking pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to identify when an advertisement has successfully resulted in the desired action, such as signing up for the HubPages Service or publishing an article on the HubPages Service.
Statistics
Author Google AnalyticsThis is used to provide traffic data and reports to the authors of articles on the HubPages Service. (Privacy Policy)
ComscoreComScore is a media measurement and analytics company providing marketing data and analytics to enterprises, media and advertising agencies, and publishers. Non-consent will result in ComScore only processing obfuscated personal data. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Tracking PixelSome articles display amazon products as part of the Amazon Affiliate program, this pixel provides traffic statistics for those products (Privacy Policy)