Where was the outcry!

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spiderpamposted 14 years ago
The news we never heard~

Tragic!
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?pageId=81459
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  Maddie Ruudposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  One book cannot make you kill yourself. You have to be depressed already to be that affected.
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  spiderpamposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You didn't read the entire article. He was bullied for being a Christian.
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  Friendlywordposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The boy was bullied because of his Christian belief. The book was not a part of the curriculum. Why was it suggested to this one student?
  I fight bullies everyday and this is an example of it.
  He should have been sent to Catholic or some other private school.
  
  However the father made this statement:
  Here's another thing," he continued. "If my son was a professing homosexual, and a professor challenged him to read [a book called] 'Preventing Homosexuality'… If my son was gay and [the book] made him feel bad, hopeless, and he killed himself, and that came out in the press, there would be an outcry.
  
  There is such a book. It's called the bible, and people use it to attack me every day.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  And I believe you !
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  Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  He was 22...obviously able to make his own decisions as to where to go to school
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Christians should only go to Christians schools? Gays should all move to San Francisco and gay schools.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Oh please!
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Agree!
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  lyricsingrayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  unless he killed himself with the book itself
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  Crazdwriterposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I agree with maddie on this one. no one takes their lives over a book.
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  sandra rinckposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I don't know if that is entirely true. You take for instance, that Christians base their lives on the idea that God is real and is going to come back and it gives them hope... he very well could have been depressed but at some point he is given evidence against it, he cannot refute it, he loses faith and figures there isn't anything to live for.
  
  He ponders why the entire world has lied to him, that would be enough to make me extremely depressed, now he is extremely depressed, he has no reason to live, he cannot talk to anyone about it because he is afraid of what they might say so...
  
  He goes and shoots himself in the woods because he read a book. Regardless of what book he read and what order they were read it.
  
  Religions are a dangerous thing and it seems that the Koran is enough to make thousands of people happily kill themselves.
  
  So, the statement that 1 book cannot make you kill yourself is false.
  
  It is sad, really sad.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Books don't kill!
  It's your own insecurity, your own mind.
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  sandra rinckposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Your right, books don't kill but 'faith' or lack of 'faith' does.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That would explain why atheist suicides rate have increased lately
  http://www.conservapedia.com/Atheism_and_suicide
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  Len Cannonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Not because they were bullied by mean ol' Christians?
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  Presigoposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hopelessness is on the increase everywhere. Its time for people to turn their focus away from them and live a life of love and hope. Pillars of the christian faith
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That only proves what they are: people that don't believe in God
  
  So what's your point ?
  That suicides are due to insecureness ?
  That's not news, Is it ?
  
  Just like this poor kid.
  and it's very sad to bring his misery into debate just to prove atheists are wrong.
  It's a shame !!!
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  R.G. San Ramonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  As the article reported, he was consistently being challenged of his beliefs, perhaps ever since he started debating about them. And the book might have been long...maybe even killing his faith one chapter after another, making him depressed even more. I say the father has the right to complain, if it is true that a teacher challenged the student "in class" to read the book despite it not being included in the curriculum. The teacher should have seen the consequences of his (or her) actions. Even if Jesse is already 22, this is an issue of responsible and ethical teaching practice.
  
  It's easy to fall into the "He should not have killed himself for just a book...it's just a book" kind of thinking. But we should always look at other people's perspectives. The important thing to note here is that the book is a medium to transmit a message. It has propaganda. It's no different when parents blame the media for their anorexic teen.
  
  At one point in our lives we find ourselves broken, with a single principle that holds us and glues the pieces together. In Jesse's case, that principle was shattered. He probably tried to look for help, or tried to fix it himself, but to no avail. He lost hope of everything. Maybe he wasn't that strong. Maybe the book was just too strong. Or maybe he didn't find help when help was needed.
  
  This is not about Christianity and Atheism. Again, this is an issue of responsible and ethical teaching practice.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Are you Jesse ??
  How do you know ?
  and again. Don't you think Jesse case is painful enough as to go over and over again making foolish suppositions ?
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  poor tantrum, blind bat!
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  R.G. San Ramonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  No. And if you're smart enough you should know the answer.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The answer is, don't suppose. It's a lack of respect.
  You're a joke
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  you're the punchline, now ignore me.
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  R.G. San Ramonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Gosh, as if you know what respect means.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  And you're trying to prove ....???
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  Quilligrapherposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hi Pam. I read the entire article and I think I can suggest a reason why it represents “news we never heard.”
  
  Where was the outcry? Unless I missed something, only one person asserts that a book reading assignment from a college professor is responsible for his son’s suicide. This is a tragic story but no one seems to really know the reason why this young man took his own life. Usually in cases of suicide, the deceased leaves a note but there is no mention of a note in this article. You and I, and the rest of Hubberville, can offer theories until the cows come home and, in the end, we will still not know the cause of his action.
  
  Your theory, Pam, if I read you correctly, is that he killed himself because he was “bullied” by non-Christians. That may be a valid theory. We all know that bullies are everywhere. Yet, it remains an unsupported theory subject to acceptance or rejection by others. We also know that one of the goals of college is to encourage students to find their own evidence to support their beliefs and not to blindly accept arguments that they have not examined and validated for themselves. In this environment, it seems natural for a professor to suggest additional reading to one student who challenges the validity of arguments found in the reading assigned to the students as a whole.
  
  I found two other opinions of Mr. Kilgore to be very interesting. He is quoted, "This guy was his best friend, and about the only other Christian on campus.” Is he saying he really believes that his son and his friend were the only two Christians in the student body? The other point is when “he suggested the moral is for Christians simply to abandon public schools wholly.” This conclusion seems to be a huge leap to make for someone who begins with the feeling that a book reading assignment from one college professor is responsible for his son’s suicide.
  
  Thanks for the link to this article, Pam. It is always interesting to read about things not widely covered in the more popular media.
  
  Q.
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Excellent response.
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  spiderpamposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks for your insights.
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  Ohmaposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Outrage at what?
  It is a very sad thing that this young man commited suicide but it most certainly was not the fault of the teacher, the school, the education system or the author of the book.
  He was obviously a very troubled and confused young man. If we are going to blame any of the afore mentioned why not blame the father who obviously painted such a harsh picture of what it meant to be a Christian that the boy, when he had trouble, felt that he could not discuss his concerns with Dad.
  I am not saying that Dad was to blame I am mearly pointing out that the kind of logic employed to get to the conclusion that any of the entities mentioned could or should be held accountable can be used to to plant the seeds of doubt on anyone this boy had contact with.
  At the end of the day only he and God know for certain what happened.
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  cosetteposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  well this should settle this whole thing. excellent comment.
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  mobilephone guideposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  hahahaha this is like cultural hegemony!
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  Bibowenposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I had not heard of this. That is very sad. I agree with some that a book could not make a person kill themselves, but that is a straw man. The question is influence, not determinism. For a young man who is dealing with life's issues, is atheism likely to lead to hope or despair? Atheism is not usually associated with being a "hopeful" point of view and I doubt is going to help a younger man as he struggles with life's issues, especially a man that want's a life that's not just free, but meaningful.
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  Make Moneyposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Jesse's father said "I want to hold schools accountable for what they're teaching our kids. This was malpractice,"
  
  I agree. It's time to hold them accountable. Valerie is right when she says this.
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  alexandriaruthkposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  My goodness, it is just not the book, dont pass the blame,
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lyricsingrayposted 14 years ago
here we go
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Rayalternatelyposted 14 years ago
least they're leaving Ozzy Osbourne alone this time!
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  lyricsingrayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  
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spiderpamposted 14 years ago
From the atricle
"Here's another thing," he continued. "If my son was a professing homosexual, and a professor challenged him to read [a book called] 'Preventing Homosexuality'… If my son was gay and [the book] made him feel bad, hopeless, and he killed himself, and that came out in the press, there would be an outcry.

"He would have been a victim of a hate crime and the professor would have been forced to undergo sensitivity training, and there may have even been a wrongful death lawsuit.

"But because he's a Christian, I don't even get a return telephone call," the father told WND.

That's so true and would have led the charge, Maddie.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  This is the core of the matter here. Why don't they get it?
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Because it's not the matter here.
  Religion is not a human condition, it's a farce
  Homosexuality is not.
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  Valerie Fposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Says you. But some people find their reason to live in "farce." If it keeps people good, happy, and alive, don't knock it.
  
  I wouldn't blame Dawkins' book for this. It's just incidental. It's fairly apparent that the boy was depressed. However, some people find materialist atheism, the idea that this world with its fleeting pleasures and abundant hard knocks is all there is and there is nothing better, nothing perfect, depressing.
  
  As for teaching practice, if religion has no place in public schools, neither does atheism. The professor had no business promoting his belief or lack thereof over any other.
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  Presigoposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Absolutley right ! Thank you
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  
  I said millions of times that I don't believe in anything.
  So i can't care less what you think about Atheism and Dawkins.
  
  And religion is a farce.
  My opinion.
  If you guys don't like it, then don't pay attention to me.
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  R.G. San Ramonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  As if this is not too overrated. You always say, "If you don't like it, then don't read it, or don't pay any attention to it." Talk about lack of harmony with thoughts and actions.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  And here you come again !
  Do you want an autograph ?
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  R.G. San Ramonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  No. Aww, someone desperate of having a fan... clap clap.
  
  GTG!
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  And again !
  Bravo !!
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Obviously the young man was depressed. We are not talking about grade school or high school, but university level learning. At this point, as an adult, one should have the ability to think for one's self and critically analyze theories and what they mean to your own world outlook.
  
  This article was written with a certain biased point of view in mind.
  
  I am a theist, but I don't want to be lumped in with those who would promote such a view of 'Christian' victimization and quote, quote, 'values' instruction.
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awareposted 14 years ago
god had nothing to do with it
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  Rayalternatelyposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Does he have an alibi?
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awareposted 14 years ago
whos this he person?
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thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years ago
WOW! No respect here!
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awareposted 14 years ago
my idea of god doesnt need to take a pee
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  lyricsingrayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  But I do
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Uninvited Writerposted 14 years ago
It is very sad this boy committed suicide but to blame it on a book or his professor is ridiculous. The father must be suffering but he is talking nonsense.
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thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years ago
Spider, if it gets too disrespectful here have them close this thread.
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  spiderpamposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I know they're not even reading the article.
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  Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That is not true. Just because you say something is disrespectful does not make it so.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Really ?
  and you're trying to prove ...??
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  earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That is because everyone knows your sources!
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  lyricsingrayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Why do you say others don't read the article when the thread is based on a book you would be too scared to ever read.
  
  Will you read the book or is your faith not strong enough?
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Look out marine. They may have to kill themselves if they discover life is not worth living unless they get to go to heaven.
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, it would be asking some too much to do good simply for doing good rather than a mythical favored afterlife for their belief. I think it would be interesting to see how many believers faith are strong enough to read his book without letting the devil in.
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  aguasilverposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I read Dawkins' God Delusion three years ago, it's a good book, in fact I'm writing a hub around it at the moment and I'm going to offer if from Amazon, I may as well make some cash from it as well as High Priest Dawkins!
  
  Personally I would make it required reading for every Christian so that they can decide whether they are disciples of Christ or non believers.
  
  If ALL Christians read it, our churches would be more dynamic because only those who had a Holy Spirit relationship would be there and we could start making an impact again in this sick world.
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Alright, give me an honest answer. How many christians would read the book without fear of letting the devil in?
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  aguasilverposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Honest answer.... my guess, and I'm basing it on Europe, would be about 70%, in the States don't really know, I have about 50 buddies on the list I write with, but all of them are mature strong believers so for them 100%.
  
  In reality God seems to have hidden His 'remnant' amongst all the 33,000 denominations that man has created, and the reason is that when Mark & Cº get stronger, and as the AC starts up, being hidden amongst a whole lot of pew warmers will be a safe way to stay alive when the real persecution starts, so there are a whole heap of people out there who have been going through the motions and singing their hallelujahs, paying their tithes and doing their good deeds, but they still are not actually 'sold out' to Christ.
  
  Then there are those who are hidden and will stay that way, though it seems we are now near enough to the end for the cry "Come out of her my people" to be shouted from the rooftops.
  
  I was asked to preach at a church once and had no subject until I got there (I'd been asked a month before) when God said, preach on OSAS, so I did, I preached a safe preach in a safe church of older people who had been Praising the Lord for longer than I had been out of diapers, and the preach was:
  
  "I believe in Once Saved Always Saved"
  
  Relief big time from all the elders....
  
  "But the emphasis is in the word 'ONCE'..."
  
  Then I outlined what Christ sets out to be the standard for 'knowing' Him and asked "Do you fit the bill"
  
  Pandemonium and it took 20 minutes for the mob to die down, the pastor (who was alive) told me it took him two weeks to explain what I meant and to calm things down.
  
  So you tell me, how many do you think would be shaken out of their beliefs?
  
  Dawkins is very logical, but then so am I, and I did get to a point about one third through when I was asking God "Why am I reading this?" - and then I found out why and had the antidote to his premises that will set any real believer back on course, or advise a pew warmer how best to make his exit and start enjoying what life he has left before the end.
  
  My theory, if you are a Christian because you fear Hell, you're probably lost anyway... I changed teams because I saw that God won and it's no fun being with the losers, even if they do get all the glory here on earth.
  
  Besides which I had gotten a little too deeply involved with the other team and I became aware that I had demons on my back, so I wanted to get free from them NOW, like whilst I'm alive, because they were problematic enough here and now, so I did not want to face any afterlife in their presence.... if you see what I mean!
  
  Anyhow, there's a hub hers so I'll stop and you can read more if you want to when it's posted!
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  Valerie Fposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I don't really fear "letting the devil in." I do rather have a natural intolerance for groundless accusations that whole groups of people are delusional simply on the basis of having different beliefs. And I'm not masochistic enough to try to slog through a book the author has been gracious enough to say in the very title, "I Think You, Madame Reader, Are Delusional."
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Shouldn't be post in the first place
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  pylos26posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  And, just run away and hide.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
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  lyricsingrayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  again
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Len Cannonposted 14 years ago
A hate crime must be attached to another crime. Challenging a person's belief system is not a crime. If it was, you would long have been sent to jail.

Of course, the real gist of it is that if the father is to believed, he committed suicide not because he was bullied but because he lost faith and found himself agreeing with those who challenged him. It is, indeed, a very difficult thing to have what you believe in shattered.

If someone is planning to be outspoken in their beliefs in a science course, I think it is only natural that the professor challenge him as he had been challenged. It sounds, though, like there was more going on for this young man than simply questioning his faith.

The only real proof in the article is a bereaved father lashing out. Suicide is senseless. I lost someone I loved very dearly this past year and dealing with it was often more than I could handle. I can not really convey the anger a person can feel towards everything and everyone when they feel that someone irreplaceable has been taken far, far too soon. Often times, that anger is directed as much at yourself as it is at others.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Wow, So your answer is just don't be Christian. He was picked on constantly he never believed it he was getting good grades, man you didn't it all either.
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Len Cannonposted 14 years ago
That was not my answer at all.

Here is a quote regarding the deceased's crisis of faith from the article I did not read but you, apparently, did.

"He mentioned the book he had been reading 'The God Delusion' by Richard Dawkins and how it along with the science classes he had take[n] had eroded his faith. Jesse was always great about defending his beliefs, but somehow, the professors and the book had presented him information that he found to be irrefutable. He had not talked … about it because he was afraid of how you might react. ... and that he knew most of your defenses of Christianity because he himself used them often. Maybe he had used them against his professors and had the ideas shot down.""
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  Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Sounds like he killed himself because he could not bear to disappoint his father...
  
  Part of being at university is being challenged in your beliefs, no matter what they are.
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lyricsingrayposted 14 years ago
com on, am I seriously here? close your eyes Kim, your not really here, close your eyes. geeez
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spiderpamposted 14 years ago
I'd like to say I'm surpried, but I'm not.
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  lyricsingrayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  ever think about that? Sorry your not surprised.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Of course you aren't !
  You knew perfectly well what the reaction was goung to be.
  Pleassseee !
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pylos26posted 14 years ago
Spider...as beautiful and sexy as you are...your'e trying to support heresay in your posts.
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Uninvited Writerposted 14 years ago
Actually, most people on this thread have been respectful. Yet, you choose to concentrate on the negative...as usual.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Who invited you?
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awareposted 14 years ago
here near me we had a homicide on thanksgiving day one of the victims was a 6 year old girl it disturbed me greatly that the parents of the slain girl said god took her home. god didn't shoot anyone . why do the faithful blame god for everything?
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Because it's a scapegoat kind of god.
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awareposted 14 years ago
for the record religions do not own my idea of god.
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awareposted 14 years ago
no individual people kill people it has nothing to do with faith religion or books. its the primal instinct to kill . we are mammals. animal.
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  sandra rinckposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  We are talking about suicide here.
  
  His faith was challenged and he killed himself.
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awareposted 14 years ago
and where did you hear that atheist suicide is on the rise? let me guess the onion
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awareposted 14 years ago
or steven colbert
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awareposted 14 years ago
i sat in front of a mirror for hour with a gun to my head crying my eyes out. i slashed my hand to the bone while saying to someone you want blood here it is. you know what drove these acts? a incoherent rush of emotions . no faith no religion no books . just confused fear and hate
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  Presigoposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  An incredible testimony, I thank you for having the courage to share, I pray that it helps keep the tragedy of suicide into perspective
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fatfistposted 14 years ago
Either:

a) God had a "higher" purpose for him, so "He" decided to take him early. So all is well and nobody should be upset at God.

OR

b) There is NO God, and the "reality" of the situation hit him so hard, that he couldn't go on any longer. He became a VICTIM from years of religious brainwashing. Just like child rape victims take their lives after years of abuse, when they finally discover what reality is.

When things go well in a Christian's life, they praise God.
When things go bad in a Christian's life, they don't blame God.
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  aguasilverposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Job 2:10
  
  .... Thou speakest as one of the foolish women speaketh. What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil? In all this did not Job sin with his lips.
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awareposted 14 years ago
well ty presigo nice to meet you im going to check out your hubs
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earnestshubposted 14 years ago
"and it's very sad to bring his misery into debate just to prove atheists are wrong.
It's a shame !!!"
...................well stated tantrum.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  All in name of God!
  Nice !!
  Why don't they feel ashamed ?
  
  God took the conscience from them. My opinion.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Look whose talking?
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  
  Is the truth hurting that much ?
  You're so transparent, that I feel sorry for you !
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Pity from an atheist! Keep it. Is that even possible?
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  i don't pity you at all !
  I was trying to be kind !
  Anyway!
  A waste of time with you !
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  kindness from an atheist! HA! btw when you had that creepy eye as your avatar I thought your were a man, weird
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I can be whatever you want, honey !
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  earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Some of the kindest most decent people are atheists, no self dillusions you see!
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Coming from you.... Stop insulting tantrum!
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  earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  No, I would never insult tantrum, tantrum can think!
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Absolutely !
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You mean she can think like you.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I definitely don't think like you.
  I think that's clear.
  
  And I don't think as anybody else.
  I have my own thinking
  and I respect Earnest for his way of thinking.
  
  I
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  because he thinks like you.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  In many thinks, he doesn't.
  But he never tries to make me think or approve the way he does
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thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years ago
Well I guess it's official if a homosexual gets bullied he's a victim(protest, ACLU the works), If a Christian get bullied he had it coming. Way to liberals, So much for tolerance.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  And here you go again !!
  What Homosexuality has to do with being a Christian ??
  
  Homosexuality is a human condition.
  Religion is a farce
  
  Don't see any things in common as to put them together as an example
  
  but of course, Whatever !
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  earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  He is a self confessed homophobe.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Christophobe!
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  earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  n.
  
  1.
  
  Fear of or contempt for lesbians and gay men.
  2.
  
  Behavior based on such a feeling.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Christophobe
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Nope they're are both choices, That don’t have to be endorsed but should be respected.
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  aguasilverposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I think you would find that in law the USA allows freedom of religion WITHOUT persecution alongside freedom of sexuality, but it's not my country and hey! maybe you guys feel that the American way of freedom, tolerance and fairness is outmoded anyhow in todays 'new age'.
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  Len Cannonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Good talk, thetruthhurts2009 IF THAT IS YOUR REAL NAME
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  Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Name one case where the ACLU has protested a gay person being bullied when it did not involve violence.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Really? you don't know?
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  Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Name one.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  google it, They hate Christians!
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  Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You brought it up, name one
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Prop 8
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  Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That had nothing to do with an individual being bullied...
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Christians were bullied, harassed had property destroyed, but hey that's what you call progress. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h02jtMIauIA
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  Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  It has absolutely nothing to do with one person being bullied. The ACLU did not condone what was done by a minority.
  Completely different than this case.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  If you say so!
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  Crazdwriterposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Same thing has happened to other relgions, don't make it seem like whoa is the christian.
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thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years ago
Hey spider you gone?
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  Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Don't worry, she will rise again.
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tantrumposted 14 years ago
He ??
Oh , I thought the truthhurts was a woman !

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  earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Really? I thought she was male for some reason. No information on the profile and every hub is about religion!
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pylos26posted 14 years ago
Tantrum...you are a pillar to our community here...and cute too.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Kiss kiss.
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caravalhophotoposted 14 years ago
This is just sad...taking of one's life is one of the greatest sin's that can be committed...his father needs to blame someone and unfortunetly it is the book and his son's professor.
Time will heal and bring understanding of his son's reasons and I'm sure he'll find his son's problems were deeper than he was aware of.
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spiderpamposted 14 years ago
I requested this to be closed.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  thanks God !
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  earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Yes of course you did!
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  Crazdwriterposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Good then it can disappear with other threads pushing it down.
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Uninvited Writerposted 14 years ago
Of course, we can't have debate now can we? Truth won't have to prove his statements.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You proved it for me.
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cosetteposted 14 years ago
actually, the tragedy is that this young man was so afraid of his father that he felt he had to hide this book under his mattress, instead of feeling free to have it in plain sight and even dicsuss it with his father. to even hint that this book is responsible for this tragedy is absurd.
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Uninvited Writerposted 14 years ago
I don't know why I bother...

This thread is about a young man who killed himself. His grieving father is blaming it on a book. It is very sad but it is not a case of martyrdom.

Out of the religious forums for now. I like to think of more positive things around Christmas time.
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  spiderpamposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  martyrdom? no one even implied that, It's about bullying, but I guess Christians don't count. Your spin makes my head spin.
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  Crazdwriterposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  And again I will say it, Christains aren't the only ones who get bulleyd so get off your high horse jeez!
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  This one story that I didn't get hear about. It needed to be told. You don't like it move on!
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  Crazdwriterposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  With ppl like you around I will GLADLY move on!
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  C-ya!
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  Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Are you sure you want this closed?
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cosetteposted 14 years ago
how a professor challenging a student to broaden his perspective qualifies as 'bullying' is beyond me. we become open to new philosophies, new experiences, new ideas in college - if his father wanted to keep his son cloistered forever, he should have made him go to a religious college. the son should have felt that he could share anything with his father instead of being ashamed of it so that he hid it under his mattress like a dirty magazine.
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  Crazdwriterposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  AMEN COSETTE!
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Oh brother!
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  cosetteposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I know, right? It's too bad that his son didn't feel close enough to his father to talk to him about these things
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Brenda Durhamposted 14 years ago
Sure looks like bullying to me. The teacher used his position and power to attack the boy's Faith, and whether the "law" holds him responsible or not, the Law of God will take it into account.
Yep; the teacher would've been accused of discrimination if the boy had been homosexual or a Muslim or some other so-called "civil rights" whiner.
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Uninvited Writerposted 14 years ago
Well, whatever, we don't know the whole story of what happened, just what his father says.

Universities are there to challenge your beliefs, not let you go merrily along your way without any thought.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  WOW
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  Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  It is true. Good professors will not let you get away with anything without having to justify it, regardless of your beliefs...political, religious, etc.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  YAWN! you're re-uninvited
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  Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I disagree.
  Universities are there to challenge one's mind and knowledge, not to break one's spirit.
  Universities are there to teach "higher learning" which means further knowledge, adult knowledge, but NOT further stupidity, and not to indoctrinate or push a liberal agenda on students.
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  Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  How do you know if he challenged other's beliefs or not? I expect a university professor to challenge me on everything.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Because you believe in nothing!
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  Uninvited Writerposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Bye...have a Merry Christmas...
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  ronjer1posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  break one's spirit? no such thing. he was a big boy. if he can impregnate, then he don't need daddy or you christians making excuses for him.
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  Valerie Fposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Univesities do not exist to serve as bully pulpits from which professors can foist their personal opinions upon more-or-less captive audiences, particularly if their beliefs are irrelevant to the subjects they teach.
  
  Atheism is a philosophical stance and has no business in a biology class.
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Perhaps, but I would have read it (and indeed understood something about the prof) at that age and mentally filed it appropriately.
  
  I cannot remember where one viewpoint was taught as 'correct' in university level lectures.
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Sanctus Vesaniaposted 14 years ago
If a Christian goes and kills themselves because of a book; then their faith wasn't very strong to begin with.
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  Valerie Fposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That's rather judgmental. Consider all the facts. It wasn't just the book. He'd been called out and embarrassed in class for his beliefs- in a class where there's really no reason to be discussing atheism in the first place. And he was a military veteran, so who knew what else had happened that had shaken his faith or made him otherwise feel his life was pointless?
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  Sanctus Vesaniaposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Again, if he killed himself, because of a book, or because people were mocking his beliefs, then his faith wasn't that strong.
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  There is always the option to quit the class. Students are paying for it. What people need to realize is that they are consumers of this education. Should have complained, quit and taken another class more conducive to learning if this was the case. I would have done it in a heart beat.
  
  Yeah, it sounds like the young man should have talked to someone... Honestly, it reads as if he had been religiously indonctrinated in a very fundamental way and when these beliefs were challenged, didn't have the psychological tools (faith) to combat doubt.
  
  My case against fundamentalism perhaps, unfortunately, proven. Something about 'glass houses' somehow fits.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  WOW, blaming the victim and his family classic!
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Well, if that's how you read that, obviously you have reading comprehension problems.
  
  Stay away from colleges, though. I hear they are scary.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Yep, I must uneducated, wow. Is there a script you guys read from.
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You are not 'educated' in a way I'd consider educated. I don't care what actual level you've obtained.
  
  This is why I wouldn't want to be associated with so-called theists such as yourself. Sorry.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Because I don't think like you. Don't apologize.
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Yes. Because you are looking for victimization and 'liberal' stances and read what I wrote...well, in a BEYOND fundamental way, actually.
  
  Try that in any of the post secondary humanities. Yeah, good luck.
  
  And I just find it scary.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  How tolerant of you!
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  It has nothing to do with 'tolerance.' It has to do with how I find your comprehension of what I wrote (lacking).
  
  You are free to believe as you believe.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Now that I have your blessing thank you.
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  sneakorocksolidposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Wow, thats harsh!
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  Friendlywordposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I'm not sure, but it seems like 17 to 25 is a very stressful time in a young person's life. I think you have to be careful with people this age. Why did this professor give this one student that book? Something stinks here. If the young man was attacking the Professor with his religious beliefs; he could have just shut the conversation down. Why did he destroy this young man's total belief system? It was bullying. I dont like it no matter who does it. If he wasn't attacking somebody with his religion he should have been able to express his beliefs without being ridiculed or attacked or converted.
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Most people would agree with you to some extent, Friendly. I may even. I just found that the article was very slanted. Who knows what really occurred.
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  cosetteposted 14 years agoin reply to this
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Or maybe he had other motives to kill himself, and the father, not coping with his son killing himself is blaming a teacher and a book.
  who knows !
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  cosetteposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  right on!
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  SO AGAIN !
  Why are you all assuming a teacher or a book are guilty ?
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Because picking on the family is in bad taste.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Blaming a teacher as well.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Why? He's alive and did wrong, you're not ignoring me tsk tsk
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  And why should I ignore you?
  You're the ones that have to ignore me
  
  Do you know the teacher ?
  Do you know what he said?
  Do you know that he did wrong ?
  
  Easier to blame a teacher than a father.a family or an environment.
  Easier to blame a third party.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Did you know the kid. Were you there? NO! Why blame the fam?
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Instead of ranting nonsense, why don't you read Yoshi's post ???
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  tantrum "Don't you think Jesse case is painful enough as to go over and over again making foolish suppositions ?" and you're doing the same thing. What a hyocrite, now ignore me.
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h.a.borcichposted 14 years ago
Well, bullying is a powerful tool. Maybe it happened, maybe it didn't. Hopefully those involved will ask themselves and possibly become more sensitive to others.

In any scenario, it is a sad event that a young man took his life. His family is devastated, maybe they could be allowed some slack while they come to terms with the loss.

We might accept this as an oppotunity to personally evaluate how we conduct ourselves in regards to bullying. Is it ok to bully someone for any reason?

Just mho
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  h.a.borcichposted 14 years agoin reply to this
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  No bullying here.
  No proof of it
  No one kills oneself because someone bullies.
  there's always some inner, deeper explanation to suicide.
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  Valerie Fposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Obviously you have no idea the depressive effect bullying can have on people. Some people when pushed learn to stand up for themselves. Some people become bullies themselves. Some lash out violently in response to bullying. And some people internalize the hurt that is caused by bullying. They start to really believe they'll amount to nothing. And so they react to bullying with self-destructive attitudes and behaviors.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  What a terrible society America has !!!
  I didn't know it was that bad !!
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Don't believe it...there is a bit of 'the victim' thing here being played on.
  
  Q. makes most sense. And he's a theist. Just not one who needs the slippery slope for whatever reason they do...
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I know Lita.
  I'm trying to make this person see, what a stupid remark He /she made.
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  She's interesting. Quite bright and writes well, but does carry a torch for Christianity more than most Catholics I know. lol
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Torchs can burn you . LOL
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  Valerie Fposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  This is no indictment on US society, but on the act of bullying itself, which does happen in Canada, too. Get your head out of the sand. Maybe learn some of the psychology of bullying and the effects of verbal abuse.
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cosetteposted 14 years ago
i hear Christians say that a lot...about how colleges are 'forcing their liberal agenda on our innocent children'.

really?

how do they do that, i wonder.

is it a grand conspiracy or something?

hmm...
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Did you not even read the article?
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  cosetteposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  yes, I did.
  
  the book was "suggested" to him by one of his professors. he checked it out from the library.
  
  the father is saying he essentially threw his son under the bus when he allowed his son into the hands of those "secular fiends".
  
  why didn't his son tell his father or mother of his anguish instead of his friends? he didn't feel he could talk to his parents, which is horrible.
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yoshi97posted 14 years ago
The book didn't kill the boy ... his own confusion did him in. Nowhere does such a book deliver the message ... 'If you are a Christian then you must kill yourself'.

The boy should have dropped the class when he realized it conflicted with his beliefs. Instead, he stuck it out and allowed the class to destabilize his beliefs.

This is no different than someone taking a class on Christian values, reading the Bible, and ending their life because they found themselves to be evil.

Would we blame the Bible for such a death? Most certainly not!

There are Christian colleges for a reason ... they exist to allow theist students a chance to receive an education that won't conflict with their beliefs. If a Christian decides to mainstream among the general populous then they need to understand they will be exposed to views that might not be their own, as not everyone in the world is a Christian.

There are laws against suicide, so even outside the Christian realm suicide is not an acceptable answer. The boy was conflicted inside, and I consider that a tragedy ... but I ask ... how did the father not see the conflict in his son and reach out to remove him from the college?

It's so easy to blame others for things we don't see ... bu we all must accept some of the blame when we miss the signs like everyone else does.

If every other person in the class can read the book without killing themselves then the message in the book is not one of glorified suicide.

Again, I am not trying to lessen what has happened. Suicide is always a tragedy. I'm just saying that we can't fault a book, a video game, or television every time a Christian takes their own life.

People commit suicide because they become in conflict with who they are and want to end the internal struggle. This metamorphosis can only occur when a person questions what they are and decides they want to be something else that they feel they can never obtain.

As a person who has lost two friends to suicide, I can tell you this is how it is ...
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  lyricsingrayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Yoshi, first, love the photo, second, as always you have such an amazing ability to put things in perspective when they need to be, bravo my friend, your wisdom always inspires me, thanks
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  So well said
  Nicely put !
  thanks Yoshi !!
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Valerie Fposted 14 years ago
Lita, I had the dubious privilege of attending a sociology lecture by a professor who did nothing but mock Christians and brag about the drugs he did in the '60's. I learned very little of sociology from him.

I also was called mentally ill by a professor because I didn't agree with his view that all homeowners are on a type of government welfare program because they get a tax exemption. I was also told after the class that I had to go along with him or leave his class.

Grateful to have the option, I opted to take the same class from a different professor.

Just because you never attended a lecture where one viewpoint was taught as "correct" doesn't mean that professors don't get away with that anywhere else.
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I suppose it is possible. And yes, I received probably a more excellent education than I know.
  
  However, even in a class where one prof was promoting a certain artistic/intellectual outlook in contemporary literature and assumed 'I didn't understand' (I'm actually finding it hilarious now, as I am more well-published than she is), I had the where-with-all to know she was full of crap even at 21, .
  
  What I'm saying is that the 'world is always with us'... You've heard most serial killers read Catcher In the Rye. Does that mean the book is responsible for these individuals' killings?
  
  I think not.
  
  The guy was depressed. I find the blaming of the outside world (whatever the incidence is...and obviously, YOU didn't kill yourself in your examples) for a suicide is dangerous...a slippery slope argument.
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B.C. BOUTIQUEposted 14 years ago
1. as HUBBERS we should treat others with respect and not judge one another on each others religion, personal beliefs, looks, etc...have some love for HUMANITY, Please everyone

2. This does not surprise me, Dejavu! Remember the PMRC going after JUDAS PRIEST and a few other named hard Rock/Metal bands in the 1980's because some kid was high and killed himself while listening to music, and he just happpened to have a Judas Priest tape in the tape deck...
Books and Music do not "MAKE" someone commit suicide...DEPRESSION, ANGST, and other MENTAL INSTABILITIES and even SOCAL ISSUES drive people to suicide..it is not an artist or author, it is problems the person is having that makes them misjudge themselves and commit suicide..
Artists do not kill people by ART..same as Guns do not kill people, people kill people..

people simply neeed to see that the person needed help they did not receive and the end result was tragedy...
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Valerie Fposted 14 years ago
Education isn't just a consumer product, either. If you want a career, you need a degree, and in order to get the degree in the field of your choice, you are required to take certain classes.

Furthermore, with students paying as much as they do for their educations, it is even more important that professors stick to teaching their subjects.
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I still maintain that the blame for suicide (or cause...however it should be worded) rests with the individual.
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  Valerie Fposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  True. But blame for not teaching the subject and for bullying students (particularly in a way that is discriminatory) rests with the teacher.
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SweetiePieposted 14 years ago
Somehow I just think these characters are looking for a fight. Lita, you had it right on when you pointed out how the "discussions" about religion are more like a cartoon.
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  Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You are right, SP. Not very many reasonable voices here.
  
  Thank you.
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Singular Investorposted 14 years ago
A terrible story but what are we supposed to do ? Ban books ? Ban books that are anti-religion ? How many deaths has the Bible been responsible for ? Are we supposed to ban the Bible ? Are we all supposed to pretend to believe in stuff even if we don't just so as not to disturb the true believers ?
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  Friendlywordposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Well...Yea! I think you could try to understand. A lot of people grab on to religion as a lifeline. Some people are very troubled and looking for something to believe in out of desperation. Sometime, you just have to be kind, and listen. There a difference between these kind of religious people and the fire breathers.
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  tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The atheists are like that too.
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  h.a.borcichposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I have noticed there are so many varied members with unique views. Although I am very interested in participation, I have no intentions of trading in my beliefs or of imposing mine on anyone. Just a respectful curiosity and getting to know fellow hubbers.
  Thank you for the advices, Holly
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  tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  But the atheists have a singular ability to avoid seeing how they are exactly like everything they (in their great secular superiority) mock and dismiss. And some of those who like to tell themselves they are of the 'progressive' and 'tolerant' type are the most militant and unforgiving in their blatant, hateful bigotry. Kinda sad really.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Think of the poor boy instead of pushing your agenda. Sad? Yes - very. It is not important that atheists are superior right now.
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  tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  There ya go...
  
  ...
  
  http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_gAM5-2e-isY/S … n-tail.jpg
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I know - but this is not the best time. Think of the poor boy instead of starting another fight.
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  Make Moneyposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hitler said something similar.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Well done make money. Quoting me in snippets out of context. Oh yes - lying is OK for Jesus. I forgot. Sorry.
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  sandra rinckposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  
  I think the point Mike was making is about being to extreme.
  
  He often brings up Communist Russia (extreme atheism) as well as Christian dictators (Hitler) as well as Muslim extremist (so many there I cannot put just one name down).
  
  Strong faith or strong lack of it is like a loaded weapon.
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  alexandriaruthkposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  they are always at the end of sprectrum extremes, scare though
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hitler was an evolutionist! Why is this hard for you guys to grasp,? He killed Christians, Jews, gays all to speed up evolution. He had bibles burned. .He used eugenics labs to breed a super white because he thought white, blond, blue people were the most evolved. He used Christians words, and he had himself photographed outside of catholic church to convince his soldiers he was doing God’s work, but it was just a show to gain power. Evolutionary thinking caused the holocaust.
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  marinealways24posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  So, because hitler did it, it means all other non believers have the same agenda, right? Brilliant
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  sandra rinckposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Honey, seriously. You don't understand evolution. If you did you wouldn't make that assumption.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Assumption? It's fact. Read the entire title of Darwin’s book. You know little about the myth evolution and it shows.
  
  http://www.straight-talk.net/evolution/ … ml#hitlink
  
  http://www.yecheadquarters.org/shame.2.html
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  sandra rinckposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  And you are assuming that because some atheist are also evolutionist that all evolutionist are atheist.
  
  Really Evolution has nothing to do with any belief or non belief.
  
  But people make it that way because you too afraid to change and ironically, not changing will kill us all... eventually.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hilter said that too!
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  sandra rinckposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You have no idea why I laugh at how ignorant this is.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I do, you think you're wise. Newsflash you are. Wise in the eyes of the world. Congrats.
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  Daniel Carterposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I don't know of any source that cites Darwin saying he was a complete atheist. What he did was document through his travels, the adaptations of plant, animal, and insect kingdom, which he concludes is a type of evolution. What that research did was simply help him draw other conclusions, which only put in question even more a belief in God. However, I know of no conclusive source where Darwin claims to have been an atheist. If so, quote it, so I can know.
  
  Some of Darwin's conclusions are considered archaic, although they were revolutionary in their day. His work was important in helping to see things differently. Those who are threatened by them fear that their own belief systems are not strong enough to withstand such scrutiny. Otherwise, there wouldn't be this intense need to overprotect and fight to the death.
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  earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Name some names tk!
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  Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Can't be me - I was agreeing with the spider woman. Poor kid - he killed himself when he found out there is no god. What sort of a belief system is that?
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  cosetteposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  
  lol @ "great secular superiority"
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  tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Sad, and ultimately self-destructive.
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h.a.borcichposted 14 years ago
I did not try to state if there was or wasn't.

All I am saying is that people need to recognize a bully and make a choice to tolerate it or stop it.

Is it ok to bully anyone for any reason?
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Bully will always happen. everywhere.
  I'm not concerned about and never was. It's of no importance.
  Childish thing, nobody should pay attention to it.
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Tell them that!
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T94hs1IgASY
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Luckily I'm not American and we don't have that kind of problems in our schools.
  As it seems all those problems are due to the bad education you get in your education agenda, and what parents teach their children at home.
  Bad examples creates bad habits.
  Not my problem.Your country is not mine.
  
  Nobody bullies in Argentina for beliefs or sexual orientation.
  Bullies here are childish stuff and parents and teachers fix this issues without problem.
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h.a.borcichposted 14 years ago
If bullying contributes to someone wounded enough to commit suicide, I think as a society we need to ask if we do it, or tolerate it or stop it.

That is not a compassionate response?
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h.a.borcichposted 14 years ago
In my opinion, bullying is repeatedly taunting and teasing mercilessly a target to the point they are completely distraught.

The kids in your country don't bully because the grown ups are a good example?

Kids everywhere need to be taught not to bully.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  We are a very open society. Even gay marriage is legal.
  and nobody makes fun of believers, as believers here are not so fanatical as in USA, it seems
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  cosetteposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I'm coming for a visit, tantrum!
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Whenever you want !. You're always welcome !
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tantrumposted 14 years ago
Well you didn't make American society look good. MHO
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  Valerie Fposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Lesson number one in bullying. Ad hominem attacks are a good start. Mocking someone for her beliefs, calling her remarks "stupid," and mocking her nationality all can count as bullying behavior.
  
  You're Canadian, and therefore proof that Canadians aren't as tolerant as you say.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  
  I'm from Argentina.
  and as I stated earlier we don't have that kind of bullying problems there
  
  And I'm not mocking your nationality.You are making a poor description of it
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  thetruthhurts2009posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Yep you're a bully alright.
  report

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