Is Christianity being hijacked by non-Christians to dilute its impact?
Christianity is documented in the history of the Old Testament and fulfilled in the New Testament with the birth, death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. In order to sway opinion, some say, "I am a Christian and I don't believe Jesus is God," or "I am a Christian and I don't believe getting married is necessary in order to have sex," or any other position a person chooses to support. Some refer to it as the "social" gospel. Doesn't all of this confuse just what Christianity is?
As a former Christian, I simply changed my mind - as I and others are entitled to do. Now, if I went to try to have your church shut down or to silence you from worship, then you could say I was "hijacking' your religion, but to insinuate that those who don't believe like you are victimizing you somehow is a bit childish and disingenuous towards a whole lot of people you share this Earth with who don't happen to be Christian.
Hi Christin, maybe I didn't explain "hijack" We all have free will and if you choose to not associate with Christians, that is your right. Going to church does not make one a Christian. I went for 27 yrs & my dad was a pastor. I wasn't a Chri
Christin,it appears the only one"insinuating that thosewho don't believe like u are victimizing u"IS YOU.Diane simply asked a question,Do people who pretend to be Christians but aren't confuse just what Christianity is?U are the childish 1.
No, words like "hijack" are inflammatory, no one is "hijacking" anyone's belief system for simply stating opinions. That is not "hijacking". I don't care what you think of me TSAD
I kind of have to agree that "hijacking" is a bad use of the term. Who died in the 9/11 hijackings? If it is not meant that way, then that really does not matter does it. It is word association. Discernment is required of Christians.
You start off attacking Diane by misstating her question then attributing motives to your mistatement. Hijacking is appropriate to her Q and having turned your back on Jesus Christ you simply want to denigrate her because she is a Christian.
I used "hijack" because yesterday I read an article about the 5 types of evangelicals. Some of the difference was generational and interpretation. The last category was evangelicals who don't go to church, read the Bible, etc. I don't see the point
Christin gets to act like that. A Christian does not.
I'm sorry. I have no disrespect for Diane, I wasn't "attacking" her, but vehemently disagreeing with the notion that disagreement is "hijacking". We all have brains and free will, others opinions shouldn't have power over your faith if it's strong.
Christin, I was not talking about having a disagreement with anyone. I was talking about the characteristics of groups and self affiliation with a group when the characteristics are not there. If you seen my post, I am never combative.
I suggest the question of what Christianity "is," is greatly confused amongst those professing Christianity. Is it a collection of people claiming to be morally superior? Yet are in reality way inferior?
I don't think Christianity needs non-Christians to confuse what it is. I identified as a Christian when I was younger and even then I found myself interpreting things differently than others. I never thought there was anything wrong with that. If you all feel that you have a relationship with Jesus/God and try to live your life accordingly then what's the problem?
I think you'll find that most religions have followers who interpret it differently than others. That's why you see radical groups emerge from every religion.
I think if you're starting to worry about whether or not everyone else is doing Christianity "right" then you're missing the point. Everyone is an individual and it should come as no surprise that two different people could research, assess, and believe in something differently.
Thank you for your comments Aime. My point is that there are characteristics that fit labels. We observe people and make assumptions about what they are by their behavior. The question is "What is a Christian?"
It isn't that there can be different interpretations,the problem is when it can be shown implicitly that they are literally false &those people continue in error to profess to have truth.These are cults.of Christianity& do confuse people.
I must say that this question looks like a set up. Set up to say that any Christian with a different slant on their belief than yours is not a Christian but a satanic terrorist ready to hijack your brand of Christianity.
I knew a man who was an agnostic, he became an atheist, then he studied and became a Buddhist. And at last he became a Christian and is now a preacher man with a healthy church. When was he a Christian? I suggest that he was always a Christian, he just had a longer road to get to where he understood that.
Differing views and beliefs within a Church of Love, on the intricacies of the Bible and faith are just that - differing views and different phases of our walk with Christ. Peter denied 3 times, Paul was Saul. And Luke came by it much later yet is an Apostle.
If we go around labeling folks at a different stage or on a different path we pre-judge them before their day of judgment. We are not to judge in that way anyway.
One must accept that the trinity is a man made construct. I believe in it. But others believe that Jesus is the Son of God and not God himself. Others believe that the Holy Spirit is of God but not God. Maybe we are just at different phases of acceptance and we should lift each other up in our journey rather than say a mean thing like they are "hijacking" what I believe. A man tired starting at the beginning of the climb, needs more encouragement than the man descending who is likewise tired. And it is right to search for all who are at least on their way to the mountain top.
Eric, I guess I'm horrible at writing these questions. I tried to give a couple of examples to explain. I know there are many interpretations however, if a person doesn't believe in Jesus Christ, how can he be a Christian. I don't attack anyone ev
You used a perfect example and you are good at writing the questions to stir interest and dialogue. I applaud you for that. Your example 1 was Jesus not being God. That is only a trinity point of view. Jesus is son of God is more in line for many.
Eric, I don't know any Christian denominations that refute the Trinity. As a matter of fact, denial of the Trinity is considered to be evidence of a cult.
Diane, how many times is Trinity mentioned in the Bible? Did Jesus ever use the term or one that means the same? Trinity is a religion made construct. I follow it in my Apostles Creed and in the Nicene Creed. But I do not follow it because Jesus did.
It is not stated as "trinity"; however, there are passage that state the co-existence of the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit. One notable: after Jesus was baptized, the Holy Spirit flew over and the Father said this is my Son in whom I am well...
Well said Diane, showing there are three. God calls Jesus his son and that he is well pleased with him. Would a God say that of himself? You make the case against the Trinity, not for it. It is not Biblical it is man made. Again, I believe in it.
No I don't Eric. Do you remember Jesus saying, "You have seen me, you have seen the Father." Also, Scriptures point to the Holy Spirit and Jesus participating in creation. Thomas said, "My Lord and My God" when he touched Jesus' wounds. Analyses..
Well done Diane. So many take what you say and create a Trinity. Others have other explanation. A man back then sent his son to negotiate, he would say "if you see my son you see me" it means authority - not really the dad.
Eric, I went to Catholic elementary school = the Trinity was described as a divine mystery.
1 Cor 13:12 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I have been fully known. Faith
Historically all religious people have "cherry picked" which beliefs in their dogma they will choose to observe or believe. Just because one doesn't follow every rule down to the "t" should not mean they cannot call themselves a Christian.
There are members of the KKK who call themselves Christians!
"For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not."
I would think it would be good thing for religion if more people identified themselves as believers. Then again religion has always been one of tools devised to separate and discriminate against one another. "My God is the (true) God!"
"We're going to heaven and you're going to hell!" (And so on).
Anyone who has studied how the bible was (put together) during canonization process where a group of people determined which books to include and exclude in the bible; it should come as no surprise why many people "question" motives and political climate.
Maybe that's why there is so many different denominations among Christians. I think it's kind of silly to be so concerned with how other people choose to embrace their faith. Life is a (personal) journey!
I think it's kind of silly to be so concerned with how other people choose to embrace their faith. Life is a (personal) journey! Exactly this!
Christin, how would you feel if someone paraphrased one of your Hubs and published it. What if they change some of the information to conflict within itself? What if they then called you a fraud?
G. Diane, No one I have heard of is re-writing the bible!
People have always "cherry picked" to verses of the bible. It's open to interpretation so much so that there are several Christian denominations! Don't worry about what others think..
There are definitely people rewriting the Bible. There was a group that felt that God was a woman. A version of the BIble was written changing "He" to "She." JR's came out with the New World Bible. They change enough words for their narrative.
You do realize the Jewish spelling of Yahweh is spelled with 2 "male" letters and 2 "female" letters, right? So God is technically equally male and female, so if you don't like the other bible calling God "she," why keep the one that says "he"?
And you do realise that the multiple translations, and versions, have 're-written' the Bible. Some of the newer versions have words that don't have an Arahmaic, Ancient Greek or Hebrew equivalent, so modern social interpretations have entered.
If you will go to biblestudytools.com, you will see that multiple versions are provided for side by side comparison. I have not observed, or heard anyone state a concern, that the versions were not congruent. You can also purchase a parallel Bible
Well Diane.....I wouldn't say you're "horrible" at asking questions. You should probably try to understand that when you ask anything at all about RELIGION or Politics (those 2 topics in particular)....let's just say, "One size does not fit all."
You are guaranteeing yourself a multitude of different replies. First comes HOW your question is translated by the reader. Then of course, based on the hundreds, if not thousands of different beliefs-faiths-religions-... anything goes.
As for the basic question you seemed to settle for after a few responses, "What is Christianity?" Believe it girl....you have STILL opened it up for a different answer from most anyone. Surely, you have found this to be so, where ever you go.
You said a couple of things I'll mention because I'm hoping you'll "think" long & hard about your own words. "There are characteristics that fit labels." and THIS is huge: "We observe people and make assumptions about what they are by their behavior." Both of those statements speak loudly of people "Judging" others. Is that Christian? NO, not at all. You need maybe to ask yourself why it's so important for you to KNOW if a person is a Christian or another religion or atheist or even a cultist. and it's senseless for you to be concerned that someone refers to their self as a Christian, but in your opinion (OR even according to your bible) they don't APPEAR to be Christian. That is simply not for mortal men to question. It's just not.
The vast majority of people prefer to remain private in what they feel is a personal matter. Some never even speak of their beliefs. Isn't this OK? Would it shock you to know that I have had friends for as long as 50 years and never once have we questioned one another nor discussed this topic? WHY does it matter?
What is in your heart, whatever that may be, if it is good, true to you and gives you peace, NO ONE or nothing should be able to hijack from you. It's yours...within you. The only other one that should matter is the God who knows your heart.
FOR MYSELF personally....What I believe is what I believe. What I don't believe is simply what I don't believe. If you or anyone judge me, berate me, correct me, warn me, preach to me, insult me or beat me once a day with a bible ....I am still ME. That's how 98% of the human race is.
Do you honestly think that one's strong beliefs or dis-beliefs can be diluted by what people say and do? Let's hope not. We all have a brain.
Thank you for your in depth response Paula. You are a great writer and a critical thinker! I think "audience" is the issue here. I selected my category to get responses from1) Christians 2) who read the Bible, 3) pray, 4) fellowship (no space)
This happens often to other hubbers. You are always allowed to limit/control WHO you wish to answer. B-4 UR Q. simply say: Christians Only pls reply. Or whatever the topic is...for instance, Parents Only, etc.
Paula, I thought I read something about that somewhere but I would not want to be unkind to anyone. I just like peaceful discussions, exchanging ideas and thoughts with no browbeating. I would only bar someone after they are rude like, uh, uh, uh..
Diane, you are a good question asker. A good woman. And you should feel just fine editing. It is your question. If you deleted my comments I would still hold you in esteem.
No way would I delete your comments Eric. It's a discussion. We respected each other and had differing views. God knows our hearts.
Paula,I don't think the question is aimed at what a strong Christian believes. The point of the Q&A is,or if it isn't should be,what the unbeliever believes about Christianity.Cults of Christianity( do mislead everyone about true Christianity
Exactly T.. Non-belvrs should NOT listen to man. All that's needed is 4 them to reach up to take God's hand. Christianity IS Jesus Christ. When He's in our heart, what man can hijack Him? None of that matters. Christ knows His own as they know Him.
Thank you Paula. Yes, T! The article I read on the 5 types of evangelicals did not appear to be written by a Christian but an observer who probably talked to people who SAID they are evangelicals and then talked about personal beliefs.
Diane...As the OP of Q&A or forum....One is NOT "being unkind" by limiting whom they want to respond. It's actually practical & lessens the chaos that occurs. Utililize the few rights we have here at HP.
Thank you Paula! i have some heavy things I want to write about and I think HP is not the place. I don't want to have to delete stuff constantly. I write from experience. If that is not the experience of others, the venom flows! Thanks again!
Didn't JESUS chg the world's thinking re:"religion?" What if they would have "deleted" HIS WORD?
It's as Paula says, "What I blv is what I blv," but it's a Christian's job 2 "teach!"
"GOD is no respecter of persons" (Acts 10:34), why r u?
The Scripture says there is a battle of good and evil going on around us that we do not see. Yes I believe the evil one, satan, tries to break up the true followers of Christ because he knows when they get together and pray it is a powerful thing.
The evil one uses people to go into a Christian church to cause problems and stir up trouble. These people call themselves Christians but some of them are practicing witchcraft or Satanists. It's true. It is happening.
Ever hear of someone wounded in church and now they are really mad at God and Jesus and can't stand Christians anymore? The evil one has won. Anyone out there searching for God and turn to Jesus -- keep this in mind -- you must first focus your eyes and attention on Jesus, not the church or people. God has promised anyone truly and sincerely searching for Him will find Him! But the evil one is also prowling around like a lion to steal, kill, and destroy and doesn't want anyone to know the truth or have fellowship with Jesus.
I love it Efficient. I guess the nearest comparison I can make is Muslims trying to disassociate themselves with ISIS. We know the majority of Muslims don't want to kill people. Media doesn't spend a lot of time promoting them.
If we really study the scripture properly and read between the lines, we realized Christ is the bad guy/demon pretending to be the good guy/god and the anti christ is the real good guy/god, which christ accuse to be the bad guy/demon.
Peter can you give us an example, citing the New Testament Bible passage? Thank you!
Ok Peter I have that page up. We are actually doing 40 Days of Revelation at Church. So what makes it seem like Christ is the antichrist. Rev. is divided into section. The first part is where He is speaking to the 7 churches. no room.
Forget what they teach in the church and read the whole page, make sure u read between the lines. Be active and critical of the passage, not passive, in your reading and you will find the answer, yourself.
Peter, reading between the lines is done based on prior knowledge and frame of reference. Since I have studied this information for over 30 years it would be impossible for me to see it your way unless you tell me what you are thinking.
More Dynamism, to an already colorful religion.
Fuel for the critics
The version of Christianity we follow today is what I refer to as new Christianity, a new version of Christianity we follow, based on our modern value. The real Christianity is not a very nice religion for example take a look at some of these bible passages
“If your brother, the son of your mother, or your son or your daughter or the wife you embrace or your friend who is as your own soul entices you secretly, saying, ‘Let us go and serve other gods,’ which neither you nor your fathers have known, some of the gods of the peoples who are around you, whether near you or far off from you, from the one end of the earth to the other, you shall not yield to him or listen to him, nor shall your eye pity him, nor shall you spare him, nor shall you conceal him. But you shall kill him. Your hand shall be first against him to put him to death, and afterward the hand of all the people. You shall stone him to death with stones, because he sought to draw you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery.
(Bible go ISIS style)
“If there is found among you, within any of your towns that the Lord your God is giving you, a man or woman who does what is evil in the sight of the Lord your God, in transgressing his covenant, and has gone and served other gods and worshiped them, or the sun or the moon or any of the host of heaven, which I have forbidden, and it is told you and you hear of it, then you shall inquire diligently, and if it is true and certain that such an abomination has been done in Israel, then you shall bring out to your gates that man or woman who has done this evil thing, and you shall stone that man or woman to death with stones.
(Bible go ISIS style)
"And the daughter of any priest, if she profane herself by playing the whore, she profaneth her father: she shall be burnt with fire." (Leviticus 21:9)
(Bible go Taliban style)
The real Christianity is really no better then ISIS, Osama Binladin or Taliban. Starting from the 17th century people started moving away from these problematic teaching, but there was still a very religious people in the west back then and the church still hold some power, as a result, instead of abandoning Christianity and become athiest, new Christianity emerged, which is the version of Christianity we follow today. But new Christianity is not real Christianity because the teaching frequently contradict the bible
Peter, God knew that we would never be able to keep the Mosaic law that required blood sacrifice. That's why Jesus came to be the blood sacrifice for all who accepted the gift. New Testament is fulfillment of that prophecy.
Peter. That same book also says "Don't hold a grudge against your kin but love your neighbor as yourself (Book of Leviticus chpater 18" If we did that almost all those issues would disappear!
I totally agree with you, and when I see others that claim to be Christians "watering down" the the Bible, Jesus Christ, or God himself... I find it very hard not to call out such people and to judge their claims. I realize that judging others is a sin, and that not one single human being ever created (excluding Jesus) was or is perfect, myself included. However, here's one of numerous examples I must judge: I find it very hard to indulge any Christian who goes around proclaiming that "God is love" and that all they have to do is "love other people" to be saved! In my opinion, these folks make Jesus appear like some hippy from Woodstock smoking weed and throwing a peace sign... they take away all of is holiness, grandness and awe-inspiring purity and they water it down to the equivalent of "God is love". What an empty, dead-end miniscule faith that is, like a dirt road washed away by a rainstorm, a spiritual "dead end". The problem is like you say, too many people going around professing false beliefs and false paths... I am not a Bible scholar by any means, but I have been reading and listening to the Bible long enough to be alerted by false faiths and man-made twists on God's word... to me these things are like demons masquerading around a bonfire in the darkness, taking joy in every soul that is being misled down a wrong path to another dead-end faith that is against God's very words. What you describe is not "dilution", it's far worse than that... it's people replacing God's holy baptismal water with gasoline, and lighting it on fire! We Christians are at war every day, against false prophets, our sinful natures, and even the very whispers of Satan's minions in our ears luring us to do wrong and turn from God at any moment... so every day we need to put on the armor of God, to polish it and make it shine after every skirmish in every battle so that we can try to shine and be a light for him in this ever-darkening world. I truly believe that being a falsely-converted Christian (by watering down the Bible, giving people feel-good sermons, prosperity gospels, etc) and leading their souls into eternal torment is probably the worst sin imaginable... equivalent to Judas betraying Jesus for money. I believe the apostle Paul often noted that we have to be more concerned about dead religion, false conversions, and counterfeit Christianity conjured up by narcissistic human naturalists than we do about atheists and muslim extremists that seek to kill us along with our beliefs... and I definitely believe Paul's right about that, especially today!
Good question. Actually I'm going to be controversial here and I think we evangelicals abandoned much of the gospel about a hundred years ago!
First of all I do believe that Jesus is co-eternal with the father and equal to the father (debating this on another question at the moment).
If you look at the early church and even the church down through the ages they ministered to the poor and destitute.
By the end of the second century the early church had feeding programs in Rome that was feeding upto 6,000 widows (and these were the persecuted chirstians!)
In the 'dark ages' it was Christians who kept the torches of learning burning, in the 18th century it was Christians who started schools for the poor (churches founded most of our universities)/
In the 19th century it was the Missionaries who took not only the gospel but education and medicine to the rest of the world, over here in NZ it was the Missionaries who stood up to the white men wanting to exploit the Maori and stood alongside the Maori because they knew that if you want to preach the gospel you've also got to take care of the temporal!!
In the 1900s when those who claimed Christ but weren't sure what they believed started making inroads into the social areas that had long been where real Christians were making an impact (Wesley, Wilberforce, Lord Shaftsbury, Abraham Lincoln, St Francis of Assisi etc) and those who showed their 'faith by their works that Christians began to take a 'backseat' so that we've given up that ground and in some ways given up the right to be heard!
Having said that we can earn that right back, but it's by rolling up our sleeves and getting our hands dirty with the poor and people who need us.
I personally am careful about what I say because Jesus himself didn't condemn the woman the religious leaders dragged before him for adultery, if he doesn't judge then should I?
Answer, they haven't 'hijacked' the gospel, we abandoned much of it years ago, and it's time to claim it back!
Thank you Lawrence. Someone once said, "Madeline Murray O'Hare didn't take prayer out of schools. Christians did." You answer reminds me of that statement. We've got to reclaim it Lawrence.
We need to be very careful with all of this. It's vital to keep church & State separate! Think about it....You want your kids taught about ISLAM? That would be the day I yank my kids from school!!
Paula, that's already starting to happen in some places.
Loli... Yes &I can't even bear to know this. Have no kids in school of course, but I have a whole tribe of grandchildren! Luckily, knowing my sons, they'd act swiftly and powerfully. This is what I mean. We CAN'T let that happen!
Ladies, having worked in inner city schools for the past 20 years, I see many, many kids that need hope and spiritual grounding. Their parents are absentee, dead or horrible parents for a variety of reasons. I direct them to a church on the block.
Diane....Bless your heart. That's where you should have directed them. Like I said, there's CHURCH & then there's State. We need them separate to maintain CHOICE. Who wants their kids exposed to a Radical Extremist religion?
Innercity schools are much more complex than famlies with working mom/dad and 2.4 kids. Everything they hear on media is sex, violence and drugs. Often there is no convenient church down the street. When they COME to me, I offer what I have.
I've no problem with that. All I want is for us to 'live out' Jesus teaching. Islam, Buddhim, Hinduism are all taught in the UK but not Christianity! When we do 99% of the problems on earth will disappear.
Expose them to 'radical' Christian Love
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