Jump to Last Post 1-3 of 3 discussions (18 posts)
  1. Arjumand01 profile image61
    Arjumand01posted 8 years ago

    Let us see the context of the verse John 10:30
    23 And Jesus walked in the temple in Solomon's porch.
    24 Then came the Jews round about him. And said unto him, How
    long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us
    They surrounded him. Brandishing their fingers in his face, they began
    accusing him and provoking him; saying that he had not put forth his claim
    plainly enough, clearly enough. That he was talking ambiguously. They were
    trying to work themselves into a frenzy to assault him. In fact, their real
    complaint was that they did not like his method of preaching - his invectives,
    the manner in which he condemned them for their formalism, their
    ceremonialism, their going for the letter of the law and forgetting the spirit.
    But Jesus could not afford to provoke them any further - there were too
    many and they were itching for a fight.
    25 Jesus answered them, I told you, and you believed not: the
    works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.
    26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said
    unto you.
    Jesus rebuts the false charge of his enemies that he was ambiguous in his
    claims to being the Messiah that they were waiting for. He says that he did
    tell them clearly enough, yet they would not listen to him, but
    27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow
    28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish,
    neither shall any man PLUCK THEM OUT OF MY HAND.
    29 My Father which gave them me, is greater than all, and no
    man is able to PLUCK THEM OUT OF MY FATHER'S HAND.
    30 I and my Father are one.
    If Jesus(pbuh) and God are same and equal, then  why does Jesus say ‘my father is greater than all’?
    Let us see the context of John 14:8
    Thomas saith unto him, Lord, we know not whither thou goest; and how can we know the way?
    6.  Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
    7.  If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
    8.  Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
    9.  Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou [then], Shew us the Father?
    10.  Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
    11.  Believe me that I [am] in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake.
    12.  Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater [works] than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
    Verse 6,and 7 say that once person knows Jesus(pbuh) he will know God also. Jesus says  that he is the way and the right path. ‘To see the father’ means to know the father. The only way to know the father is to know Jesus(pbuh) .Jesus is not saying that he is same as the father. What he wants to say is that if you know him you will know the father, if you see him you can see the father. It is the father who does the works. He also says that the father can GREATER works than what he (Jesus) does, which are by His(Father’s ) permission. This clearly prove that ‘the son’ and ‘the father’ are not equal and not the same beings. If they both are same why did Jesus(pbuh) pray to ‘the father’.

    1. jay_kumar_07 profile image60
      jay_kumar_07posted 8 years agoin reply to this

      The problems are
      We are seeing - not proberly
      We are Hearing - not properly
      We are Speaking - not properly
      Totally we are all fail to use our Body & Mind.
      [ Example- One who posses Blackberry but do not know how to operate ]

    2. profile image0
      kimberlyslyricsposted 8 years agoin reply to this


      can't even read if I didn't a;ready not want too


      I dont even read hubs that long  lol  lol

      cracking me up

      i love this string!

  2. hanging out profile image59
    hanging outposted 8 years ago

    Jesus was our example of how WE should operate as a christian on the earth. God clearly called jesus his son, but if we look at the word son in hebrew definition it means: inheritor. The son inherits what the father has, it does not speak of two different people necessarily, son is the title of the inheritor.
    Colossians 3:24 "Knowing that of the Lord ye shall receive the reward of the inheritance: for ye serve the Lord Christ".

    Jesus prayed to the father, but jesus also had continual conversation with the father, not by means of prayer but God squashed down, compressed and living inside of jesus, for jesus was created in part of the seed of a woman but also the seed of the father, God, yahweh, and yet because of that human part of jesus he felt sorrow, pain, affliction of soul, human qualities one of the reasons for his appearance in the flesh, when jesus was afflicted he prayed (garden of gethsemane) as we do when we are afflicted. Just because jesus prayed in the spirit does not infer two completely seperate and different people.

    The many works shall ye do and even greater... first let me say that i can think of no greater work than to raise the dead or heal diseases, topping those is going to be quite amazing, so i will hazard to assume the context of this just off the top of my head; because we are totally human born of the human seed of man and woman, into sin where we spent x amount of time, the fact that we will even DO these things is greater, um, more extravagant, larger in the sense of coming from an unexpected place. Let me diminish the word greater and say that greater does not mean better. We do the same works but to the astonishment or grandeur because we were so far from any such thing.

    "If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly". Yes they wanted to know, but recall that jesus never openly admitted this not even to pilate. If jesus had said that, there would have been outrage or/and people would have quoted that jesus said he was the messiah in the wrong places to the wrong people and jesus cannot tell a lie. Jesus had to walk very carefully amongst even his own people. The confession of being the actual messiah openly could have jeopardized his mission considerably.

  3. profile image0
    AMBASSADOR BUTLERposted 8 years ago

    The true understanding of Jesus is plain and simple; for you to know and understand and apply to your life on the earth and throughout all eternity. IT IS THIS. YOU ARE LOVE YOU ARE PEACE YOU ARE FREE NOW BE LOVE NOW BE PEACE NOW BE FREE THIS IS WHO YOU ARE AND EVERYBODY ELSE ON THE PLANET EARTH.THANK YOU.

    1. earnestshub profile image88
      earnestshubposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      According to any mainstream religions you can only have peace and love conditionally.

      A "you can be loved if" psychology. That is neurotic. smile

      1. profile image0
        AMBASSADOR BUTLERposted 8 years agoin reply to this

        This is not mainstream religion. This is the truth of every human being unconditional. YOU can not have love peace free conditionally because this is who you and everybody else on the earth is to the core of their being. This has to be revealed to you by you alone and everybody else alone that is living on the earth. This truth shall surely set you and everybody on the earth free when they come to realized that yes to the core of their being they are LOVE PEACE FREE. ANYTHING ELSE PRODUCE A DIFFERENT RESULT THAT YOU SEE ALL AROUND YOU EVERY MOMENT OF EVERY DAY. THANK YOU.

        1. earnestshub profile image88
          earnestshubposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          NOT according to the bible and quoran. smile

          1. profile image0
            AMBASSADOR BUTLERposted 8 years agoin reply to this

            We were created in GOD image which is LOVE PEACE FREE among other quality but lost it when man disobey GOD. SO mankind is now lost and have to get back to his original creation of being LOVE PEACE FREE so that Jesus came to the earth to show man how to get back to his original creation that GOD had created him with and mankind is still LOVE PEACE FREE to the core of his being. Mankind free will and choose keeps him from knowing that he is LOVE PEACE FREE to the core of his being. What you are seeing in the world today is the opposite because of free will and man does not know who he is?  I have made it as plain as I could do it. NOW DO WITH IT AS YOU PLEASE. IT WILL STAND ON ITS OWN FROM NOW ON TO FOREVERMORE. THANK YOU AND GO IN PEACE. THIS IS IT. IT IS FINISH.

            1. earnestshub profile image88
              earnestshubposted 8 years agoin reply to this

              It wouldn't even stand on it's own if you set it in concrete.

              It is a lot of old fairy stories perpetrated on an ignorant, easily frightened people. smile

              1. hanging out profile image59
                hanging outposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                you're not allowed to just repeat this anymore when you can't come up with a real response.
                live in reality, like you have told others to do.

                1. earnestshub profile image88
                  earnestshubposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                  Not allowed?? Repeated where?

                  I will say and do as I see fit, and certainly don't need your assistance or permission to do so!

                  1. hanging out profile image59
                    hanging outposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                    you cheese out too often, instead of backing yourself up. you just say oh this information is for stupid people or something like that. This is not within the rules of debating. If you want to play with the big boys you will have to post big boy posts with some substance to it, not just loosely threaten people or call them early childhood names.
                    Proper decorum does not allow you.
                    I just skim over you.

                    did you notice i answered your weak ezekiel 18 quandry, which really was no quandry at all.

      2. hanging out profile image59
        hanging outposted 8 years agoin reply to this

        okay so you're child is growing up and wants to get a tattoo of a giant flaming skull over her entire back. You don't want this and heated debate surrounds this topic. You say no! and put your foot down, she moves out at 16, lives with a heroin junkie who's on the dole and within the year she is preggers, addicted, living in poverty with a big huge flaming skull on her back.
        As i have seen in most people who do not have the nature of god in them, their love is accessible by a route of good circumstances, once the good circumstances are removed the attitude of that person quickly changes. You may think that you love the wayward child but this persons actions do not purport love, instead the non-visitations, the conflict and neglect of birthdays tell a different story. Her and your love will ammend once the situation has been corrected and the child is living a straight life, unaddicted, in a good job, earning her way in life and never letting you see the flaming skull, she now has a good boyfriend, etc.

        Should God be any different? All our lives we live in sin and do things that mess up our parents plans for us our lives and the lives of those around us, but as soon as we are repentant and turn from those ways, God is ever quick to receive us. The fact that his love is of a higher standard than ours is that he, inspite of getting slapped in the face by us even after salvation, is still there. Some earthly parents never ever talk to their children.

        1. earnestshub profile image88
          earnestshubposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          You miss the point entirely.
          Conditional love is not love at all.
          "I will love you only if you obey me" is not love. I have children and grandchildren and all know they are loved unconditionally.

          I let them know very early in their lives that my love has no conditions. If they get in to trouble guess what they do?

          They talk about it, because nobody is withdrawing love as a means of control.

          I may strongly dislike their behaviour, but they know that it is their behaviour I don't like, not them.

          1. hanging out profile image59
            hanging outposted 8 years agoin reply to this

            God is no different. Lets see what happens when your grandchildren commit bigger atrocities, on the scale of the 10 commandments. Of course no ages are given here, i am left to assume they are young and so we will have to wait till oh say, early teens, before your perfect love is put to the test.

            Lets see how you love your grandchild as an adult when it breaks up a marriage via adultery. Or lets see how you feel when you want your Gchilds time and they are off following idols of their own (other things) and you are at home alone. How about murder are you okay with that? But for present your boundless love is being tested with broken dolls, a slipped dinner plate, pulling the dogs tail too much.
                                     This is how god feels.
            From your favorite book:
            Ezekiel 33:11   Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?
            and again this God did for us when we never asked him too.
            john 3:16 for God so loved the world he gave his only begotton Son...etc.
            Even though we sin and sin horrible.. 1.73 million abortions a year in the united states alone and yet God is prepared to forgive if the soil be right, the parable about the seed that sown by the wayside, rocky ground, shallow ground and some fertile ground.. coming to God via repentance of sin is fertile ground. So yes God has some conditions, minor as they are they mean a great deal. The grounds that you love your Gkids are minor breakages we will have to wait for the major breakages to occur.
            Would you love your murdering gchild if it showed no repentance and gave you the idea that it just might do it again.. we are not even discussing why the murder occurred.

            1. earnestshub profile image88
              earnestshubposted 8 years agoin reply to this

              I have three very well adjusted and successful grown up children, so I am well aware of how to bring up children thank you.

              All my children are compassionate people who I am very proud of. My grandchildren range from 17 to 5 years old so I am not expecting an outbreak of "early teens"

              My early teens grandchild is more interested in art and her ballet than being a problem.

              Kids are all good, there are only bad parents.

            2. profile image56
              exorterposted 8 years agoin reply to this

              you would love your children no matter what, if they were mass murderers, you would still love them, you might not be able to stand what they have become,
              God so loved the world that He gave His Son
              the world is sinners.
              we are sinners
              Christians have someone to turn to,
              To help us become better( nicer, more loving to the world)
              better at being more like Christ


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