Jesus god-the-father: a fallacy of Catholics Protestants

Jump to Last Post 1-4 of 4 discussions (38 posts)
  1. profile image58
    paarsurreyposted 6 years ago

    Catholics Protestants think Jesus was god; rather as some say he was "god-the-father"; then the Christians say that Mary was begotten by god-the-father.

    It is a wrong concept; because that would makes Jesus , I take refuge with the Creator God, husband of Mary.

    I don't think it is a correct concept that Jesus ever believed.

    When the Catholics Protestants  say "Yashua was God the Father Himself manifest in the flesh"; what exactly they mean.

    I want to understand.

    1. A Troubled Man profile image58
      A Troubled Manposted 6 years agoin reply to this

      No, you don't. You just want to continue your onslaught of other religions while propagating the virtues of your religion.

      You must also believe we're really stupid.

    2. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 6 years agoin reply to this

      Mary wasn't anybody's wife except Joseph's.
      God was not Mary's husband.  Jesus was not Mary's husband.
      God has no literal wife.

      Jesus was a manifestation of God the Father.
      Father, Son, and Holy Spirit ARE God;  they are One, with distinct manifestations and purposes but totally inseparable.

      1. profile image58
        paarsurreyposted 6 years agoin reply to this

        That makes Jesus a messenger prophet of the Creator God; every messenger prophet manifests the attributes of the Creator God; nothing different from others.

    3. couturepopcafe profile image60
      couturepopcafeposted 6 years agoin reply to this

      paars - I would explain it like this:  The Supreme One is able to project Himself in a way that is visible to humans so we can understand that it is possible to be perfect.  IMO, Jesus was a projection of the mind of God, sent to teach us how to live.  When we reach a point in our own life of perfection, this is Nirvana, Heaven, when we will have the same power Jesus had.

      1. profile image58
        paarsurreyposted 6 years agoin reply to this

        That is with every prophet messenger of the Creator God; they were perfect human beings who achieved attributes of the Creator God as one mortal can;  this way they became in image of the Creator God; nothing special with human Jesus.

        1. couturepopcafe profile image60
          couturepopcafeposted 6 years agoin reply to this

          Exactly - at least in theory.  The special part is that he did it - we have not.  So if there is one person who excels, he is special in that regard.

    4. Dave Mathews profile image61
      Dave Mathewsposted 6 years agoin reply to this

      paarsurrey: The truth, the fact is you do not want to understand. You simply wish to attack other people who do not believe as you believe.

      There is ( 1 )one God, but within this one there is 3 seperate persona known as God the Father, (Jesus) who is God, the "Son of God" and then there is The Holy Spirit of God who dwells within all of mankind as ones spiritual teacher and guide, and helper.

      1. profile image58
        paarsurreyposted 6 years agoin reply to this

        You are just one person; same way Trinity is mentioning 3 persons not one person.

        1. Dave Mathews profile image61
          Dave Mathewsposted 6 years agoin reply to this

          Have you ever heard of people having "Multiple Personality Disorder" where by one person has many different personalities inside that can be manifested?

          1. MelissaBarrett profile image60
            MelissaBarrettposted 6 years agoin reply to this

            Are you saying that Jesus had multiple personality disorder? That's awesome.

            1. Dave Mathews profile image61
              Dave Mathewsposted 6 years agoin reply to this

              Melissa: No! not at all am I saying this. I was merely trying to draw a comparison to the "Triune God" of Christianity using this disorder as an illustration in order to better explain how one could view a "Triune God". As you know Christianity believes that there is "ONE GOD" but THREE IDENTITIES in this "ONE GOD" The Father The Son and The Holy Spirit.

            2. Dave Mathews profile image61
              Dave Mathewsposted 6 years agoin reply to this

              Melissa I know you are smarter than that and you are merely joking around with such a comment.

              1. MelissaBarrett profile image60
                MelissaBarrettposted 6 years agoin reply to this

                I was joking Dave smile I have a sarcasm addiction.

          2. profile image58
            paarsurreyposted 6 years agoin reply to this

            You mean that Trinity is a case of personality disorder?

            The Creator God has created everything in systems and order which is exhibit everwhere in the Universe.

            Trinity and Multiple gods do create disorder and confusion; like not believing in the Creator God is only work of Doubt.

            1. Dave Mathews profile image61
              Dave Mathewsposted 6 years agoin reply to this

              As usual, you twist the words and thoughts and ideas or others to try and make them look  stupid, but with me you look mre stupid because you try and twist things.

  2. thooghun profile image82
    thooghunposted 6 years ago

    I'm not religious, but I have read the bible a few times. I'm sure a learned Christian could correct me, however the impression I got was:

    Jesus is neither man nor God. But a unity (the holy trinity) of three distinct natures, comprised of the father (God), the son (Jesus -- specifically the man) and the holy spirit.

    1. couturepopcafe profile image60
      couturepopcafeposted 6 years agoin reply to this

      That's pretty much the way I understand the concept.  Except it's God as Trinity.  I guess it really could go any which way if they are all the same being.  Father is mind, Son is heart, Spirit is soul just like we humans.

  3. profile image50
    Arcjahadposted 6 years ago

    Trinity is a false doctrine our heavenly father is not the author of confusion the reason the trinity is confusing to some is because it is false , the messiah said he is the son of God not that he is God ,the Creator said that the messiah is my son not that he is me in the flesh , as a child growing up in a baptist church I always knew that when the grown ups said God died on the cross for us I always said they sounded stupid it's his son not him , children alway know spiritual truth

    1. couturepopcafe profile image60
      couturepopcafeposted 6 years agoin reply to this

      It's not confusing to me at all so I must be more enlightened than the 'some'.  The trinity is not doctrine at all, it's a concept created to allow man to understand the 3 aspects of life - mind, flesh/heart, spirit/soul/energy force.  There's nothing unclear about this.  All ascetics have learned this.  IMO, the habitual thought patterns of humans is what stands in the way of the genuine impressions of the One. 

      Jesus was also called the Son of Man, among other names.  He forgave the sins of those who had faith in his power.  Who can forgive sins but God only?  Mark 2:5-12 "Whether is it easier to say to the sick of the palsy, Thy sins be forgiven thee, or to say Arise and take up thy bed and walk?  But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins."  etc.  If you believe in the Christian doctrine, this clearly says Jesus is God as Man.

    2. profile image58
      paarsurreyposted 6 years agoin reply to this

      - created by clever Paul and the sinful writers of gospels; trinity is a false doctrine I agree with you.

      1. Greek One profile image75
        Greek Oneposted 6 years agoin reply to this

        sinful?

        Didn't you say they were misguided just the other day?

        Which one were they?

        1. profile image58
          paarsurreyposted 6 years agoin reply to this

          A misguided is a sinful person; it is the same thing in other words.

      2. Disappearinghead profile image76
        Disappearingheadposted 6 years agoin reply to this

        You dont think Muhamed was sinful then Paar?

        1. profile image58
          paarsurreyposted 6 years agoin reply to this

          All human beings are born innocent unless they commit a sin when they get mature.

          All messenger prophets of the Creator God were innocent; their selection for this high office by the Creator God is a proof they were all innocent; they did not committ any sin; and if they did my mistake they asked forgivenss from Him; and He is most Merciful  and the Most-forgiver.

          Muhammad was messenger prophet; he was, therefore, innocent.

      3. profile image0
        brotheryochananposted 6 years agoin reply to this

        clever paul and the sinful gospels

        I disagree with this statement utterly.

        trinity as false doctrine

        I agree. It does not need to be a doctrine. The perception that the bible places personification upon so very many items;
           Proverbs 1:20   Wisdom cries without; she utters her voice in the streets:
        does not always represent an actual personified entity.
        The Father - a unique and accurate way to express God in the New covenant - unprecedented and not normal considered in the OT.
        The Son - a unique expression to express relationship, certainly ties in with Father. A fitting expression since God produced the zygote.
        The Holy Spirit - a unique way to express Gods presence, omniscience and not to be confused with Gods "focal point - in heaven".

  4. profile image0
    Emile Rposted 6 years ago

    What I got from the story was that he was Son of God and Son of Man while on earth; which meant his spirit was the spirit of God. His flesh was that of a human. It was the flesh that made him the Son, but his spirit was fully the Ancient of Days. God didn't breathe life into his spirit, because his spirit was the breathe itself.

    It might be difficult for you to understand. It's to be expected. The sinful and errant muslim scribes screwed a lot up when taking dictation from mohamed.

    1. couturepopcafe profile image60
      couturepopcafeposted 6 years agoin reply to this

      That's how I see it, too.  He became flesh so we could know that it is possible to be as he was, perfect.  He showed us it's entirely possible, with enough faith, to walk on water, etc.  This is why ascetics train to be without. They can 'see' more clearly without all the distractions of civilization.

    2. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 6 years agoin reply to this

      Anytime the Ancient of Days is mentioned, I get hugely Blessed;  LOVE that name for the great I AM.

      1. couturepopcafe profile image60
        couturepopcafeposted 6 years agoin reply to this

        I do, too.  I guess when we all think about it, hope is the human spirit for believers and non of any nationality or religion.  Because the word ancient invokes something we can imagine as whatever we want it to be and in the case of those who believe in afterlife, the hope and belief in all that is good lays with the grandness of the Ancient of Days.

    3. Disappearinghead profile image76
      Disappearingheadposted 6 years agoin reply to this

      That's about the same as I see it. The son is an analogy of the fact that He came from Heaven to Earth (in the flesh) whilst simultaneously remaining in Heaven in spirit because He is omnipresent.

      This is a stumbling block for the Muslim because they believe we think God had an actual son as humans do, which Muhamed says is impossible. They can't understand the concept of God coming to Earth in the flesh.

    4. profile image58
      paarsurreyposted 6 years agoin reply to this

      That is a sinful rhetoric of the Church; Jesus never believed in it.

      1. couturepopcafe profile image60
        couturepopcafeposted 6 years agoin reply to this

        I think it's important to remember that much of the old language was literal.  When I talk to myself, I refer to the ruler of myself as either brain or heart.  For me the soul or spirit is refreshed or set back by the decisions I make, goverened by my head or my heart.

        The analogy is simplistic but illustrates how Jesus talked to his 'father'.  He not only believed and knew the father was one with him, but he talked to him as though talking to himself.  Remember, when people talk to themselves, if someone is listening, the self talker may be misunderstood.

        1. profile image58
          paarsurreyposted 6 years agoin reply to this

          Jesus was a normal real person not a patient of Schizophrenia.

        2. Dave Mathews profile image61
          Dave Mathewsposted 6 years agoin reply to this

          couturepopcafe: If? Before we became human, we were "Spirit" is it not possible that when we talk to ourselves from brain or heart, we are talking to our "Spirit" self. Is it not possible that when Jesus talked to his "Father God" he actually talked to His Spirit and His spirit talked to God who is Spirit over all?

          1. A Troubled Man profile image58
            A Troubled Manposted 6 years agoin reply to this

            So, you're saying there are billions and billions of spirits wandering around waiting for a human body to occupy? lol

          2. profile image58
            paarsurreyposted 6 years agoin reply to this

            Man has always been body and spirit; if one talks to one's own self often; that means one is phsycholigically ill.

            Jesus prayred to the Creator God, whom he referred as God-the-Father; Jesus was not the Creator God himself.

      2. profile image0
        Emile Rposted 6 years agoin reply to this

        Hmmm. I don't know. You asked a question, I just said what I got from the text. His use of the words I AM appear to contradict your statement.

        But, it's neither here nor there. People believe what they want, depending on what text they look to as scripture. You're a prime example of that. smile

 
working

This website uses cookies

As a user in the EEA, your approval is needed on a few things. To provide a better website experience, hubpages.com uses cookies (and other similar technologies) and may collect, process, and share personal data. Please choose which areas of our service you consent to our doing so.

For more information on managing or withdrawing consents and how we handle data, visit our Privacy Policy at: https://hubpages.com/privacy-policy#gdpr

Show Details
Necessary
HubPages Device IDThis is used to identify particular browsers or devices when the access the service, and is used for security reasons.
LoginThis is necessary to sign in to the HubPages Service.
Google RecaptchaThis is used to prevent bots and spam. (Privacy Policy)
AkismetThis is used to detect comment spam. (Privacy Policy)
HubPages Google AnalyticsThis is used to provide data on traffic to our website, all personally identifyable data is anonymized. (Privacy Policy)
HubPages Traffic PixelThis is used to collect data on traffic to articles and other pages on our site. Unless you are signed in to a HubPages account, all personally identifiable information is anonymized.
Amazon Web ServicesThis is a cloud services platform that we used to host our service. (Privacy Policy)
CloudflareThis is a cloud CDN service that we use to efficiently deliver files required for our service to operate such as javascript, cascading style sheets, images, and videos. (Privacy Policy)
Google Hosted LibrariesJavascript software libraries such as jQuery are loaded at endpoints on the googleapis.com or gstatic.com domains, for performance and efficiency reasons. (Privacy Policy)
Features
Google Custom SearchThis is feature allows you to search the site. (Privacy Policy)
Google MapsSome articles have Google Maps embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
Google ChartsThis is used to display charts and graphs on articles and the author center. (Privacy Policy)
Google AdSense Host APIThis service allows you to sign up for or associate a Google AdSense account with HubPages, so that you can earn money from ads on your articles. No data is shared unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Google YouTubeSome articles have YouTube videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
VimeoSome articles have Vimeo videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
PaypalThis is used for a registered author who enrolls in the HubPages Earnings program and requests to be paid via PayPal. No data is shared with Paypal unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook LoginYou can use this to streamline signing up for, or signing in to your Hubpages account. No data is shared with Facebook unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
MavenThis supports the Maven widget and search functionality. (Privacy Policy)
Marketing
Google AdSenseThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Google DoubleClickGoogle provides ad serving technology and runs an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Index ExchangeThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
SovrnThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook AdsThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Unified Ad MarketplaceThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
AppNexusThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
OpenxThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Rubicon ProjectThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
TripleLiftThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Say MediaWe partner with Say Media to deliver ad campaigns on our sites. (Privacy Policy)
Remarketing PixelsWe may use remarketing pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to advertise the HubPages Service to people that have visited our sites.
Conversion Tracking PixelsWe may use conversion tracking pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to identify when an advertisement has successfully resulted in the desired action, such as signing up for the HubPages Service or publishing an article on the HubPages Service.
Statistics
Author Google AnalyticsThis is used to provide traffic data and reports to the authors of articles on the HubPages Service. (Privacy Policy)
ComscoreComScore is a media measurement and analytics company providing marketing data and analytics to enterprises, media and advertising agencies, and publishers. Non-consent will result in ComScore only processing obfuscated personal data. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Tracking PixelSome articles display amazon products as part of the Amazon Affiliate program, this pixel provides traffic statistics for those products (Privacy Policy)