Bible Study - Matthew 5:39-48

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   vector7posted 12 years ago

   Any Christians who would like to engage in discussion on understanding our Lords words better please join in!
   
   If you aren't a Christian welcome! We're glad to see you.
   
   If anyone strays from the purpose of understanding the Word to questioning it's Truth, please ignore the post as it is irrelevant to the OP.
   
   The purpose and given objective here in this thread is to understand the teachings of Jesus Christ.
   
   
   ==================================
   
   A few questions to begin:
   
   
   In verse 39 does Jesus mean even if the person is harming another person, such as a child, or mother, or brother?
   
   
   In verse 42, are we to give everything we own away if we are asked?
   
   
   If not, what does this imply?
   
   
   If so, do you believe this is tempting God by expecting Him to provide while others are being 'responsible' and saving for the future and we are giving everything away at a simple request?
   
   
   In verse 44, to what extent do we bless people who are being ugly, hateful, evil, etc.? If it makes them angry to bless them, should we stop or continue despite their objections to it?
   
   
   
   Is verse 46 an answer to people's questions regarding whether God is fair? Does Jesus' statement imply that God is indeed fair and just to all?
   
   
   
   I'll leave the last three verses open for free questions and discussion.
   
   
   ======================================
   
   If you have understanding in God's Word through His Holy Spirit, by all means, please share!
   
   
   

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      Disappearingheadposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      39: No he is talking about a situation where oneself is being assaulted, not another person. The point is to show that you need not retaliate.
      
      42: No this is about not being miserly, but to help those in need. It's not about giving everything away, but giving that which we have to someone who is desperate. If I have two coats and my neighbour is freezing i must give him one.
      
      44: No. It's about not retaliating which just escalates the problem. You see this all the time in this forum; tit for tat, each one trying to have the last say. By blessing those that persecute, you stop the quarrelling.
      
      46: this implies that God does not just love those who love him. He loves everyone and does good to all, and thereby sets the example. Thus eternal torment in hell or annihilation for unbelievers is directly contradicted by verses 43-48.

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         vector7posted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Well, Jesus' analogy doesn't refer to Hell directly, so lets leave that for another discussion, and agree on disagreeing. However much I like to stir bees, I'd rather not turn this into conflict but a Christian discussion with common love for God.
         
         So back to the scripture.
         
         Verse 44, I like how you alluded to those who are 'peacemakers' and believe you hit the nail on the head perfectly.
         
         
         
         Quick question. If you only have one coat and noticed your neighbor freezing, do you give it to him in the name of Jesus? Is that a worthy sacrifice?
         
         

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            Disappearingheadposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Apologies, i do tend to get on my soap box about hell, etc.
            
            I wouldn't think I was giving my coat in the name of Jesus, more like just giving him the coat because it would be the right thing to do at the time.

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      Brenda Durhamposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Verse 39, I believe, means two things---we're not to react without first thinking and reasoning, and we're not to try to exact personal vengeance upon those who hurt us.  Those people may indeed deserve "an eye for an eye", but we are to show some semblance of mercy and understanding in situations where that's possible.   No, I don't think it means we shouldn't protect our children and others.  Nor even ourselves! It just means to couple mercy with rational response.
      
      42--Means submit to authority, perhaps?  Plus, to "go the extra mile" since it's our duty to our fellow man in need.
      
      44---Love them with the Love of God.  We may not even like them, but we're commanded to Love them with agape Love, with their eternal souls in mind.
      
      46--Again, with the Love of God, we are to Love all people, even our enemies.  Common sense tells us, though, that we don't have to be their doormats simply for the sake of their ego; if they're receptive to Love at some point, then the plan of God will come to fruition in their lives as well as our own.
      
      I think verse 45 states the human condition.  It's not about God being "fair" (even though He is by judging our actions in accordance with the state of our hearts);  it's just that we're all human and subject to both the good in life and the hardness of life; we should try to relate to everyone in that manner if possible, knowing they're subject to temptations just as we are, and try to show them the one thing that can change our hearts----the Love of God.
      
      vector7, these are great points of discussion, and I'm also curious to see how others respond!   Cool thread.

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         vector7posted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Thx Brenda.. God's idea.. lol
         
         Great statement - "...with their eternal souls in mind."
         
         2 Timothy 2:3-4 comes to mind, to remember that the goal is the eternal salvation of all through Christ.
         
         Verse 45, you don't see fair in it? But.. but... lol
         
         In coupling 45 with the next two, 46 and 47, I just see it as saying God loves all and treats us equally well with love. And that in like manner we should do as our Father does, verse 48, and learn from Him. I think we are somewhat in agreement, but I believe [personally that is] that Jesus' also means He doesn't give one an opportunity that He doesn't give another, with regard to the fact if we do good God honors us in it. Genesis 4:7 "If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. ..."
         
         So I think we are in the same boat, just on opposite ends.. lol
         
         

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   A Troubled Manposted 12 years ago

   Put the verses up so we know what you're talking about.

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   vector7posted 12 years ago

   For anyone who doesn't have a Bible I will post in the OP from now on:
   
   http://bibleresources.bible.com/bible_kjv.php

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      WD Curry 111posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I see you caught a forum frog on your first cast!

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         vector7posted 12 years agoin reply to this

         lol

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      A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      It's not a point of having a Bible, they are more readily available than condoms. You need to post the verses so we know to what you're referring.

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         brotheryochananposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         lol
         ever heard of internet?

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   brotheryochananposted 12 years ago

   In verse 39 does Jesus mean even if the person is harming another person, such as a child, or mother, or brother?
   Matthew 5:39   But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
     1) resist = continue... often actions against cause the action to continue. We should not cause evil to continue, but in all ways, according to the situation and what is necessary to deflate it, we must stop evils intent, even if that means to accept the occasional...
     2) smite = slap... here we are made aware that the person is not punching but slapping with the open palm. G4474; to slap with the palm of the hand. G5180 is the word which has much aggression to it, so this 4474 word is very explicit here in its context, but of course who slaps today? There is a big difference between someone who is trying to kill you and someone who in jewish society is physically rebuking you by slapping you. People today just punch and that would necessitate protectionist maneuvering on the christians part, but to be slapped one could easily turn the other cheek.
   The next verses of course mention also not allowing evil to continue.
   
   
   In verse 42, are we to give everything we own away if we are asked?
   Matthew 5:42   Give to him that asks thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.
       Notice that we have asks and borrows, two different words. Asks is used in the more desperate sense of demand something. There is more needfulness applied to one who asks than one who borrows, in this context - although i am sure we could think of scenarios to the opposite, i suggest we keep the saying appropriate to this context.
       So one who asks is perhaps driven by a need to have therefore, if it is in your power to fulfill, do so. The assessing of ones power to fulfill can only be arrived at by the individual, and to him that would borrow = loan on interest or lend, fulfill also if it is in your power to do so.
   
   If not, what does this imply?
   and even if not is not in question, as God gives to us we are to give freely to others. This implies that we have confidence in God to give to us and that our faith is in Him meeting our needs so that we in turn can give to others.
   This is Christs scriptural pattern for the christian.
   
   
   If so, do you believe this is tempting God by expecting Him to provide while others are being 'responsible' and saving for the future and we are giving everything away at a simple request?
   
   Tempting God would be to give without using some common sense. If all i have is rent money and someone needs to borrow it. My duty lay in first meeting my commitments and then of the excess, giving to others - if i have no excess then i am not obliged to give to others because, obviously, God has met my needs but not given me enough to meet others needs at this time.
       There is also a waiting on the Lord for instruction when it comes to giving because we can alleviate a trial or something God is doing by just fixing the situation, so it is wise to wait to discover what God says first. Sometimes He says no. Sometimes He says yes when it seems impossible. That is God.
   
   
   In verse 44, to what extent do we bless people who are being ugly, hateful, evil, etc.? If it makes them angry to bless them, should we stop or continue despite their objections to it?
   
   Matthew 5:44   But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you,
       bless = speak well of; curse = speak bad of:
   
   do good to them that hate you,
       good = well, honestly; hate = detest:
   
     These are opposites one to another. We must always do good and put forth good first. Good is our goal toward all people, even those that seem not to deserve it.
   
   and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
      despitefully = slander, use threats, insult;
      persecute = a judicial tone of pursuing to do harm;
      pray = make supplication.
   
   Again another opposite. When the actions of the ungodly come against us, we are not to handle things our own way but to make supplication to God that He handle the situation on our behalf. In this we condition our heart towards love for the person and strengthen our reliance on God for his ability.
   
   
   Is verse 46 an answer to people's questions regarding whether God is fair? Does Jesus' statement imply that God is indeed fair and just to all?
   
   Matthew 5:46   For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
   
      Jesus uses the example of a tax collector in MATTHEWS (a former tax collector - ouch lord lol) book, which is one of the most hated persons to the jews to show the comradeship that those whom are like minded have one toward another. We are to be different, in fact, opposite. We are to love all people.
      Whether this is fair or not is not even a question it is a commandment and we need to grow into that commandment and experience it fully in our lives.
   
   
   Matthew 5:48   Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
   
   perfect = complete, of full age, grown up
   
   These rules do not make us perfect but they help to bring us unto the stature of a grown up person in the things of God. God is mature, he is sensible, he is complete in himself, and this completion or fullness of maturity should be our goal. Perfect rather reminds me of a list of things to do. "there i have done the list. Perfect. Complete shows a job well done. In context i would say that complete in Him, would be a fair extrapolation.

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      vector7posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Regarding verse 39, I agree. When someone is attempting to murder your child, protection by you is granted. I see it as a sin to not protect your child.
      
      There are some who believe differently, but Jesus came to the aid of a women to be stoned and saved her. He, of course, used His wisdom but nevertheless He did not stand idly by and let it go through.
      
      
      In verse 42, in giving, many times I give more than I am able. I see it as my duty and a test of my faith in my Father. He said to give to those in need. I don't think He means handouts to the rich or well-off. This is one that different scenarios come to mind. Maybe do an extra post on it.
      
      And, lol, glad you said that - I'll clarify now. I meant if not just give everything you have on a whim. I agree completely. God's commandments are just that... commandments.
      
      
      
      God is fair question - meant verse 45.. (typos, lol)
      
      I see God raining and shining on just and unjust as Christ telling us that God is INDEED very, very fair.  At least that is what I get from the analogy.
      
      
      And for 48, I just think though we can't be perfect yet, we are to strive to be close to God and seeking to be as perfect as we are able. Continued growth toward God and good as it were, not letting everything push you into this sin or that sin with little effort to do better.
      
      And in verse 47 - I wave to people all the time, and they just stare you down, lol. It keeps me reminded I'm truly following Christ, because some of them give you some pretty hateful looks..
      
      
      I like how you broke it all down. Even the definitions. It's awesome. Every word counts and the meaning of each makes the matter clear.
      
      

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         Woman Of Courageposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Verse 39, We are to protect our family from harm. Verse 42, I prefer to allow the spirit of God to lead me concerning giving. I love to give to those who are truly in need. We are to love people unconditionally, even when their personality is awful. ( Verse 44) Verse 46, Yes God is indeed just and fair, merciful and good to all. Great thread Vector7.

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            vector7posted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Thx WOC.
            
            I like how you said you prefer letting the Spirit of God lead you. I often find myself needing to ask our Father if this person is who to give to, or if there is another purpose in His will.
            
            I am one who likes to give and many times find it hard to keep anything.

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               Woman Of Courageposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Lol. Your last sentence is hilarious. Be careful for some will take advantage.

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