Title My Belief or Non Belief

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marinealways24posted 16 years ago
-Hello, I need help and guidance. I don't know what my title of belief is. If I don't believe the bible, does this make me an atheist? Hmm. I need help, what is my belief or non belief title?
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  That's up for you to decide not another, thought you were all about individuals and free thinking why would you need someone else to tell you what your beliefs are then...unless this is just another thread to stir up an argument.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Does not all belief have a title?
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I'm not aware of that. I have no title for my belief...as its been labeled 18 different things on these forums by theists and Atheists alike (Yes I've been counting) Here's a question for you. If what you believe explains what you need and gives you the answers you seek why can't that be enough? Why the need for titles and names, which ultimately only serve to categorize you and alienate you from others.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I don't know why most everyone wants or needs a title on their belief. This is why I want a title on mine. So I can fit in and know how it is to have a titled belief.
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Well in that case I'll title your beliefs: argumentative....both ironic and descriptive.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I will have to agree with you there. But, i'm not always argumentative, so this could't be my title. The search continues. lol
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  prettydarkhorseposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  hi marine.....being atheist means you dont believe in a deity (GOD)..........but it doesnt mean to say you gonna believe the bible too, you can create your own world belief....and your own bible, as long as you follow kharma......
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  What if none of my belief is absolute. So I could or couldn't believe in a creator without absolute belief. Can non absolute belief have a title?
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  prettydarkhorseposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  yes, you can have beliefs which are not absolute, absolute are scary...
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  So my belief could be titled "unabsolute", or "Not a clue". lol
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I think that's called skepticism. How about Fluidism...the belief in no constants, and no absolutes.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  That might be me! Plus, Fluidism is a cool sounding title.
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  You must become like water my son
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I am mostly made of water! I am on the path to fluidness!
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  TimTurnerposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I don't believe in the bible or anyones god. But I'm very spiritual and that's what I tell people.
  
  I'm not atheist or agnostic. I'm spiritual
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  sooner than laterposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  this is another cry for attention in which Marine explains how "individual" he is, and mayby now he is going to say he has created a new movement that has no name yet.
  
  riveting.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Good try prophet! Keep studying your bible.
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  A Texanposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Wouldn't that title mean you are a member of that belief system? Then it would certainly mean you are a member of that group, and then that is your government, weird.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  And you don't think the bible is a government?
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  sooner than laterposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  you won't get one person to believe what you conjured up while high. how many threads are you going to start with the same message? boring.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I don't have to prove anything, it proves itself. You worship a government. Any grouped belief is a government. Maybe you should get high.
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  A Texanposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  What does the bible have to do with your choice to form your own government. You have said many times that you are against any government, the bible means nothing to me, you are just not very consistent. Try again!
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  lol Try what again? What am I forming? Is it a conspiracy?
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  Vladimir Uhriposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Come on marinealway, do not mix up things. Keep definition straight. Bible is document not the govenrment.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Amazing. Does the government not write bills and documents? Is that too much for you?
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  aka-djposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Confused.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Me too!
  
  Wouldn't be any fun if it made sense would it?
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  aka-djposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Stop sniffing that baby. It makes me nervous.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Why is that?
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  aka-djposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Dunno. It just does.
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  Jawa Lunkposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Does it matter?
  
  If you have no belief, then you are an unbeliever.
  
  But it really doesn't matter because what one believes or does not believe has no bearing on reality, just on your final destination.
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  ceciliabeltranposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Why do you need a label? You don't have to explain anything to anyone other than yourself. Once you do that, your title will come from you.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Maybe my favorite comment of the thread! I started this thread in sarcasm to see the responses I would get of those who title themselves and others. Do you have any titles?
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  awareposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  you surely must be kidding. if not your title is ... empty
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  Dgerrimeaposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Yes the OP is kidding.
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  ediggityposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Your belief is OODA. The search continues.....
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, it should always be continuous. Why should belief be content in an evolving world? Make sense to you? If you are done searching, you are done learning.
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Life is a search of knowledge and understanding. No knowledge can be too much and No understanding can ever be enough.
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  ediggityposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  There are plenty of things to learn about besides belief. Even when you find your belief, you can continue to learn about it.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Unless.....Your belief is absolute through faith. Absolute is content.
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  ediggityposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Please see definition.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Webster is back in the building!
  
  Webster isn't absolute either. Just words and definitions we use in attempts to explain conscious thought. So you aren't certain about your belief in the bible? You said you had faith in the bible. Is your faith not absolute and content?
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  ediggityposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I am certain, as supported by the widely accepted Webster definition. You and Cagsil should start your own dictionary. That way you can document, and receive credit for the stuff you make up. The search continues...
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Everything you know or think you know is made up by your conscious or unconscious mind and faith.
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  ediggityposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Sounds like you are onto something. I hope my "conscious or unconscious mind and faith" continue to steer me in the right direction. Good luck with your philosophies, someone besides you may actually believe them.
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  You make a 'belief' sound like it has substance and it doesn't have any substance in reality.
  
  A belief has to be formed on the basis of the reality of facts.
  
  If you form a belief on any other basis, you can never 100% believe it to be real.
  
  Your own consciousness, conscience and sub-conscious will not allow you to 100% belief in something that isn't real.
  
  Regardless of what you say, it's impossible for you to accomplish that task. There is always going to be a sliver of doubt, because you really do not know. You are hoping.
  
  That is not a firm foundation for any belief system.
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  ediggityposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I love the way you like to make up your own definitions for
  things. Here, let merriam help you out:
  
  Main Entry: be·lief
  Pronunciation: \bə-ˈlēf\
  Function: noun
  Etymology: Middle English beleave, probably alteration of Old English gelēafa, from ge-, associative prefix + lēafa; akin to Old English lȳfan — more at believe
  Date: 12th century
  1 : a state or habit of mind in which trust or confidence is placed in some person or thing
  2 : something believed; especially : a tenet or body of tenets held by a group
  3 : conviction of the truth of some statement or the reality of some being or phenomenon especially when based on examination of evidence
  synonyms belief, faith, credence, credit mean assent to the truth of something offered for acceptance. belief may or may not imply certitude in the believer <my belief that I had caught all the errors>. faith almost always implies certitude even where there is no evidence or proof <an unshakable faith in God>. credence suggests intellectual assent without implying anything about grounds for assent <a theory now given credence by scientists>. credit may imply assent on grounds other than direct proof <gave full credit to the statement of a reputable witness>.
  synonyms see in addition opinion
  
  There is a very important part of that definition I would like you to pay attention to. it reads, "may or may not imply certitude"
  
  No offense, but your Philosophy/definition of belief means nothing to me.
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  Stimpposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Why do you feel you need a title. You can be spiritual and not believe in everything the Bible says. Who wrote the bible....people wrote the bible, right. I don't believe everything that everyone says nor do I believe everything I read. it is what it is....is your new title....LOL
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  The 'myth' of him needing a title, was to draw attention from people only.
  
  Especially, those who practice any sort of religion, because belief among religions is that their religion is correct and all else are wrong. Include, thinking for yourself.
  
  If you think for yourself, then your outted by all religion beliefs and those who practice religion. You are considered a non-believer. Even, though that label is just that a label.
  
  When you form logical thought about labelling others, you in essence go against the teachings of religion.
  
  So, he is simply showing how someone's belief in religion is distorting their own perception of reality about life.
  
  He is trying to get people to see through their own eyes and not through someone else's perception about life.
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  Stimpposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Oooppss....Guess I got sucked into that one. ~Yaaaawwwn~ I'm tired today. I need to pay more attention.
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  
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  mobilephone guideposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  don't be labeled. re-evaluate your belief as many times as you want.
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tantrumposted 16 years ago
YOU ARE UNBELIEVABLE !!
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  lol Thank You! Likewise!
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  
  nice 2 C U !
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  You as well! Nothing like some belief searching on a Monday morn. lol
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Jonathan Jancoposted 16 years ago
There is no need to pigeon hole belief. If you can not define what you believe, consider yourself lucky and unique.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I want to have a title on my belief so me an others know what I believe.
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  Jonathan Jancoposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  OK, if it's absolutely necessary, I'd go with existentialism.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  So my belief is that I exist? That could be an illusion. lol
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  Jonathan Jancoposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, it certainly could be an illusion. Have you ever studied A Course in Miracles?
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Is that a real course?
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  Jonathan Jancoposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Well, it's a large, Bible-sized book that you can find in bookstores. I know a few people who study it, and I guess it's as real as anything else, which we both concede could be an illusion.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Ah, I call that the book of contradictions. lol
  In the search of absolutes, I definately believe the miracle book is an illusion when it defines a contradictory creator. lol
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  elayne001posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry, I would call you lost - do you want me to send the missionaries?
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  How you can form a belief on something not of facts is ludicris, to say the least.
  
  If you have to base your belief on a mystical realm which is outside reality, then you've got real problems.
  
  To believe IN something is to know it is factual 100% authentic.
  
  The human race has been around for over 10000 years. The 'bible' or religion has been around for less, much less 6000 years.
  
  The religious text at best is history notes with a mix of mythology. Not factual. Words were left out and purposely, so your mind could dream up whatever 'god' you could imagine.
  
  Jesus Christ understood what a false god was and could see religious leaders as fakes. Why do you think they had him executed? Not for our sins, but because Jesus Christ knew religion was a hoax.
  
  That's why he specifically told his disciples not to worship any false gods or idols.
  
  That is precisely what he told them. Yet, the entire world is engulfed in religion. The interpretation can not be any more BOLD, as to the truth of his words.
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Scott.Lifeposted 16 years ago
I was just wondering last night where you've been. You missed out on all the holiday super religious debates. It just wasn't the same without you.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Thank You. I have tried to be more productive with my time lately taking a vacation from the forums. They don't pay and they give me a headache. lol
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Scott.Lifeposted 16 years ago
You could be really bold and strike out on your own and create a whole new belief system complete with holy book and dogma. that would be a life's work for sure.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I think I could do that. But, this would go against everything I stand for. The reason I despise religion is because it teaches a 1 belief system. A contradicion to having an individual mind.
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah but it will be your own religion, you don't have to share it. That could be commandment number 1...Keepeth the hand off my holy book.
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Scott.Lifeposted 16 years ago
Wait I think we're on to something here. Next time someone asks me what I believe I'll say "I'm Fluid" Then walk away, let them figure it out.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  lol That is a great idea. Always fun to make minds scramble.
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  Jonathan Jancoposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  And the human body is made mostly of water, so I guess we're all fluid.
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  See it's clever, novel, and mostly true, that's close enough for fact by most religious standards.
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Scott.Lifeposted 16 years ago
I have attained fluidity...Ohhmm....Ohhmmm
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Jonathan Jancoposted 16 years ago
Scott, I think you may have just started the next big trend.
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Damnit now I'll have to rebel again so as not to conform to my own trend. where does it end?
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marinealways24posted 16 years ago
Absolute Fluidity should be when you only go number 1 and never again go number 2!
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Hmmm...true but do we want to institute conditions for membership? then we'd be solid not fluid.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Yes! We can make money and control people like religions do!
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Well if there's money to be made and global domination at stake then I'm in. Besides we all know preaching something doesn't mean we have to do it. We are becoming a real religion.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, all we would have to do is group our ideas and belief for an agenda and give follower minds something to believe. This is the religious way. lol
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I'm not quite sure. I don't have a lot of knowledge on the freemasons. But, isn't this what they were and did. A group of individual minds/republic that set agendas to control the followers?
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The Ropeposted 16 years ago
Humans being human = structures and rules. Define yourself and the "label" will come. Since humans are 90% water (or so we've been told by the water marketers), I vote for Scott's "Fluidity" However, believing in a diety and following your beliefs is usually called "spiritual".
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underhiswingsposted 16 years ago
The title of your belief is:

"KNOW NOTHING"

That is your prevailing statement time and again in the forums.
And you defend this belief with fierceness.

This releases you for the rest of your life from ever knowing anything and all of your fellow "Know Nothings" will collectively know the sum total of absolutely nothing.

Therefore you have no capacity to teach anyone because you know nothing.
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Someone is cranky today.
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  My title is :
  I KNOW THERE'S NOTHING
  Nothing to be afraid of.
  Nothing to be happy for.
  Nothing to cling to.
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  Jeramiposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  And a little bit of something to be glad that ya got a grip on. And you have a good grip on it.
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  hi jerami ! nice 2 C U !
  Always trying to get a good grip on things
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  underhiswingsposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  So is that your title Tantrum or his ?
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  As it says there, It's my title.
  I speak for myself.
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  underhiswingsposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Nothing to be happy for? About?
  
  You cling to nothing? Hope? Love?
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I Am talking about God , which I don't believe. Aren't we all ?
  
  So I don't believe I have to be afraid of him, nor be happy about him, nor cling to him
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  The sad thing is, you know nothing as well!!! All you have are your silly biblical assumptions of absolute belief! If you opened your little mind to understanding absolutes, you would understand how little you know.
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underhiswingsposted 16 years ago
No Marine, cannot say that I am sir.

Just gave an honest reply, called it like I saw it honestly.

Gave it a lot of thought and tried to be fair sir.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Thought? Isn't this against your religion?
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Dgerrimeaposted 16 years ago
If could explain what you do believe, as well as/instead of what you don't believe, then we can decide on an appropriate title. Titles only matter when speaking to people with a lot of preconceptions, especially those unwilling to rethink their semantics.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  The only thing I believe as absolute is my family because I choose to believe them absolute. This could be wrong as they and myself could be an illusion. So even that belief isn't completely absolute. However, I prefer them absolute!
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  Dgerrimeaposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I'm not too fussed about 'absolute' beliefs, but what for example do you believe about god, the supernatural, fate, free will, morality?
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  An absolute belief is a belief that a person can consciously accept 100% based on facts. It's perfectly known.
  
  The absolutes I meantioned, are absolutes for every living human, about their life. Those will not change regardless.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Good questions.
  
  I don't rule out the possibility of a creator, just the bibles creator. The bible uses simple childish psychology to group believer/follwer minds into one.
  
  On the supernatural, there are a lot of unexplained things that exist. I believe in the possibility of the supernatural which can't be proven wrong through logic.
  
  I think fate is partially my decision of free will. I am mixed on this though. I could die an unexpected death on any given day, so possibly my fate isn't only in my hands.
  
  I think in the search of absolute free will, there are no laws telling an individual what to think or to believe or how to live. Free will to me is no intervention.
  
  Hmmm, morality I think can be found with group logic such as a republic. I think a lot of moral actions develop by not using contradictions if that makes any sense.
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  Dgerrimeaposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  You are an atheist because you lack belief in a personal god, and you are a sceptic because you are open minded, but require evidence before forming concrete beliefs.
  
  I agree with you on everything except free will. If you define free will as lack of outside intervention into the decisions you make then I agree, but I wouldn't word it so generously. I believe free will to be a self contradictory idea.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  lol Your title is wrong. If I ruled out the possibility of a creator, then I would be atheist. How did you come to your conclusive assumption? I don't have any concrete beliefs except for my family. There is no evidence that my family isn't an illusion. I simply have faith to believe in them. This does not make them absolute. I was created by my parents, it is logical to me for the possibility of a creator, not absolute. What do you mean free will as self contradictory, because we can die and lose free will at any given time?
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  Dgerrimeaposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  By many people's definitions you would be an atheist because you lack belief in a creator. You don't have to rule it out to qualify for 'atheist'. Richard Dawkins doesn't rule out the possibility of a creator.
  
  With regard to free will, the reason it is contradictory is because it requires both multiple possible outcomes and a consciousness to choose between them. These two things are never both true in the same instance.
  
  If you admit to forming concrete beliefs despite lack of evidence then I retract my labelling of you as a sceptic.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Is it possible to have a concrete belief when not believing in absolutes? The dawkins example is a perfect example of how believers will generalize and class individuals together that don't believe the silly bible. I think believers feel that everyone that doesn't believe the bible must share a non belief since they themselves are belief dependent.
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  Dgerrimeaposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Whether you believe in absolutes or not, you will hold some beliefs more strongly than others. When I say 'concrete beliefs', you should read this as 'the strongest kinds of beliefs that you do/can hold'.
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Jeramiposted 16 years ago
It is a good thing when we find something worth grippin onto.
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Cagsilposted 16 years ago
I have two absolutes for you....

(1) reality exists independent of desires, will, wishes or thoughts. reality is all knowable.

(2) moral right and wrong- any action that is beneficial to society is right and any action that is harmful to society is wrong.

You live by those two absolutes and there is no room for 'god' or belief in one.

If you take it one step further- religious beliefs require an individual to place themselves second to the word of 'god's' will.

To be human is to be self-responsible. You must take care of yourself, at all costs, to ensure you have a future.

To do so, you need to have FULL control over your life.

Besides- Jesus Christ wanted YOU to be a God on Earth(Heaven) and he did NOT want you to get sucked into religious teachings.

Jesus Christ, a human male, who saw atrocities happening, when he was alive. He saw millions of people enslaved to religious leaders. Because they didn't know any better.

Why do you think he told his disciples- Worship no false gods or idols. He didn't want you in religion.

The only GOD you are to worship is yourself. That's it!
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  Jeramiposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Ya might have a point BUT Are Ya sure Ya didn't leave anyone or something back at the station
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  sooner than laterposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  new age rubbish. We can't determine where a booger will hit the floor when we flick it, what makes you think we have and godly status.
  
  sorry, but I have heard all this before.
  
  You don't serve Him, you serve the devil. That simple.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Ignorance! Blame it on the devil.
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I realize that your own ego would not get high enough to reach godly status, per se, but why don't you get yourself a little bit more credit.
  
  What your opinion of me and how I think is completely my doing. You want to see me in a negative aspect, go right ahead. You will be the one doing damage to your life.
  
  Your negativity isn't for me to judge, but I would like to let you in on a little secret I learned a long time ago- never view anything in a negative aspect- it creates unwarranted stress on the body and ages you more quickly.
  
  And, you know what- YOU are right- I don't deserve a 'god' in my life. I have control of my life and I live my life according to my upbringing, moral standard and a high value on life.
  
  I do not NEED a 'god' in my life. I am doing just fine without him or it.
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sooner than laterposted 16 years ago
Yawn... nighty night marine.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Do you think I am posessed by the devil?
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  sooner than laterposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  You are "of" the devil. being as you have read... i mean... wait are 3/4 of the way through the bible "snicker", you would know why I said the word "of".
  
  do you know why i said "of".
  
  bet not.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I don't have a clue. The devil has blinded me! How am I of the devil?
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  sooner than laterposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Because you are not "of" God. See how easy scripture is.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I'm not favored to be "of" God? Why is that? Did God cast me to the devil?
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  Vladimir Uhriposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  sooner than later, do you agree with me, we have many empty poppy seed heads around? No wonder our country is dysfunctional. Whose fall is it?
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  sooner than laterposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I couldn't agree more. I have tried to get marine to understand the things that HE says. I cant move forward with the subject until I correct his missuse of the words and their deffinitions that make up the english language.
  
  but he is one of many. most of the time I ignore him and those like him, but sometimes I wonder if one of these are educating children right now... and I have to interject so that we don't get any dumber. But it really could be a full time job and it's hardly worth it.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  You are the ignorant one with no self awareness. You simply fail to see the psycology of your silly belief book. Keep praying to government.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  How many innocent deaths have been caused from your silly belief of absolutes thinking you are favored for your belief.
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sooner than laterposted 16 years ago
You lost some of my respect when you said you would read, and you didn't. You lost the rest when you started 15 threads with the same rubbish.

Now get your last word in because my much needed services are no longer available.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  lol you people really make things too easy. How am I not "of" God? How am I "of" the devil?
  
  Does this look logical and sane to you?
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underhiswingsposted 16 years ago
There is a difference between "the facts" and "the truth"
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Mine are not 'the facts' or ' the truths'
  they are 'my' facts and truths
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Excellent!
  
  Although, his faith blinded mind will not see how deep your comment goes since he believes in absolute faith and belief as all truth. He has no comprehension of an individual belief.
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Oh !
  Does this mean I pass to the next grade ?
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  No, this means you and I are "of" the devil and not "of" god because you don't believe the silly contradictory bible psychology!
  
  We wasn't supposed to think!
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  OH !.....
  
  .....I SEE !
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  You see the light!
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earnestshubposted 16 years ago
I do not accept that "Jesus" ever lived.
Like the bible, the reason it reads like it does is because it copies what came before it. Jesus is a long way from the first "Jesus like" story!
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  sooner than laterposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  yes earnest, we know. You have over 6,000 posts that say so. do do do do yo you have a stu stud studder in real life or just in the forums?
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  earnestshubposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I don't think so, but watch your math. You have over 700 in two months.
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sooner than laterposted 16 years ago
350 per month to your 500. Maybe I will get better as time goes on. Will you help me?

All jokes aside, I bet you and I would get along outside of religious beliefs.
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  earnestshubposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Maybe your right, I do not find many people I dislike personally. I never bother with religion away from the forums. I get right up there about blockheads having a god that finds car keys for em though! The world needs better help than that from a god!
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Scott.Lifeposted 16 years ago
You all aren't being too Fluid, you have to focus, these other religions are distracting you from your new belief.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I am focused Sir. I am amused when the bible believers come in to assault any individual ideas or beliefs. They never fail, quite predictable like their book of belief.
  
  This is what happens when they have absolute belief. They lose self awareness and accept contradictions through faith. Quite cultish. I also enjoy when they get emotional over their beliefs. Another flaw in absolute belief when it is driven by emotion.
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  That is why we must be water and let their attacks flow through us and keep on going, meanwhile our constant pressure will slowly erode the bedrock of their fragile hold on reality, water carved the grand canyon man. Be FLUID
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I agree and I like it!
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I can't. I'm a Hell of a FIRE !
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  Scott.Lifeposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Ever seen fire flow across a floor, there's nothing more Fluid, constantly changing and adapting to find more fuel. Fire is a living breathing thing. It's a beast that hunts and kills, it gives life to barren landscapes and empty forests. It creates by destroying, that's Fluid for sure.
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  But you were talking about water. fluid water.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Ah, but the fire must have oxygen. If the oxygen is taken, the fire dies. Where does oxygen play in?
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  If you don't have oxygen, you die as well
  Without oxygen water wouldn't exist either
  May be we should worship OXYGEN !
  
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  lol You have a point.
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Beliefs are always driven by emotions!
  A logical person doesn't have beliefs, he has 'proofs '
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I think thought and belief should be separated from emotions to find logic. I believe emotion contradicts logic. I could be wrong.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I figured I should add an example to explain myself.
  
  Take a serial rapist/killer that has lived a life of crime. What would an emotional punishment be? Most likely death.
  
  I believe the emotions should be separated. I belive a logical decision would be to study this persons mind, psychology, upbringing to see where the parents and society went wrong in raising this person. If the person was put to death, we would learn nothing. If we studied the person, we could possibly limit future repeated crimes if we learned how they begin.
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topgunjagerposted 16 years ago
Believe is such a strong word, is it not true that if you believe in something you will do anything to defend it, even make up your own stuff just to prove a point? You'll probably even ignore evidence that's thrown in your face if you "believe" in something, maybe having an idea is better? I think it keeps you more open to reality and have better judgement=)
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Well said. I agree with you. I think people allow their belief to take them over when it is based/driven/taught/preached through emotions.
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fishtiger58posted 16 years ago
Agnostic means you dont know if there is a god or not. Does that help
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  Dgerrimeaposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  No, because it's not quite true. 'Atheist' and 'agnostic' have different meanings depending on who you are talking to. 'Agnostic' typically means either lack of knowledge, or denial of the possibility of knowledge. 'Atheist' typically means either lack of belief in gods, or belief that there are no gods.
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  qwarkposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Hi Dgerrimea:
  For many years I considered myself to be a "strong" atheist. I finally realized my "intellectual" mistake: there are no atheists.
  The "English" definition of atheist is: " One who denies the existence of god."
  One must be able to define, FACTUALLY, what this god thing is if one is to consider "it" as being anything other than an abstract concept conceived by the fancifull imagination of an incipient, fearful and superstitious human creature.
  There is no extant scripture that does that and, the English dictionary definition of "it" is vague and based soley upon opinion and conjecture.
  How can one deny the existence of "god" if "it" is unknown, unknowable, undefinable and incorporeal? One can only deny the imagined concept of it.
  There are no "atheists," only "atheistconcepts."
  Qwark
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Speak for yourself!
  Don't assume others are so stupid as not knowing what they are or aren't !
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  qwarkposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I never speak for others. "Stupid" is but dullness of mind.
  I speak from points backed by logic and reason.
  If one is "ignorant" and hasn't the intellectual acumen to visualize reality, then I can understand your response.
  Qwark
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  You can't understand my response because you don't understand your post, then !
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  qwarkposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Why don't you respond with a, "hopefully" viable opposing comment? Are you able?
  Qwark
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  tantrumposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  sorry didn't get this earlier.
  You said
  
  'How can one deny the existence of "god" if "it" is unknown, unknowable, undefinable and incorporeal? One can only deny the imagined concept of it.
  There are no "atheists," only "aconcepts."
  Qwark
  
  Stating there are no atheist is speaking for others.
  I'm an Atheist, because I don't believe in God, or any god for the matter.
  Any person can deny God even if it's an incorporesal being. what we are denying as atheists in the idea of a God governing us. Creating us, looking after us, etc.
  I think we're capable of doing that ?
  It's not that we don't believe in concepts. Concepts are a fact, the moment a mind thinks about them. So we are not 'aconcepts'
  
  That's why I said that if you didn't understand my answer ,you didn't understand your post.
  I think you got your 'concepts' all mixed up .
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  Dgerrimeaposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  'Atheist' can also mean 'one who lacks a belief in gods'. This is a very common definition, and one under which one can be an atheist even without a definition for 'god'.
  However, even if you decide to define 'atheist' as 'one who denies the existence of gods', then only a vague definition for 'god' is needed because even a vague definition can be denied.
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  qwarkposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I am a native English speaking American. My English dictionary does not intimate that: " 'Atheist' can also mean 'one who lacks a belief in gods'(plural)." The word "god" is singular in the definition.
  If you'd like to consider "gods," their creation and purpose in the evolution of the human species, "they" have all been inspired by fear and superstition in the minds of an abjectly ignorant, infant species desperately trying to understand and survive. What makes one think that the 'god" of contemporary man has been created any differently?
  The vast majority of extant humanity, live life as it existed thousands of years ago.
  Science has progressed to the point of making ancient "gods" definable.
  Human sophistication has caused the "imagination" to create supernatural, abstract divinities which cannot be defined and only exist in the minds of the ignorant and easily led. Leaders of monotheistic movements understand this weakness in human nature and have taken full advantage of it, for many millenia, to gain and hold control and power over the multitudes.
  Logic and reason easily provide an attitude which denies "vague definitions."
  Qwark
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  Dgerrimeaposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  It doesn't matter what the dictionary says about the meaning of 'atheist' because, contrary to popular belief, dictionaries don't define words. They are a guide to diction, and as a secondary function they provide a rough guide to the common usage of the word so that you know which word you're pronouncing. Words are defined by their usage.
  I'm not really sure what point you're trying to make by making that distinction, so take this as a general comment rather than a reply/rebuttal/argument/whatever.
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  qwarkposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  ...really? Dictionaries don't define words? Dang! Here I spent 6 college years wearing out the darn things! My profs never told me that it doeasn't matter what dictionaries say! I'm angry as hell! Here all the time I thought the dictionary was a reference book containing an alphabetical list of words, with information given for each word, usually including meaning, pronunciation, and etymology! Well, anyway, I got 2 graduate degrees before I met you on this forum, but it sure would'a been helpful if I could have met you before I wasted all that time money and hours studying the info in 'em...hey, it's never to late to learn! Thanks loads...:-)
  Qwark
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  Dgerrimeaposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Hey just be thankful you didn't meet me any later in life, or you'd be even more disillusioned! Don't worry, the pain will numb and your sense of balance will return shortly.
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  qwarkposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I want to thank you profoundly(amen!) for the thoughtful(?), informative(?), knowledgeable(?) and well written(?) responses you provided.
  I hope others who are involved in this "format" read your comments and understand with clarity, the depth of your scholarly and erudite(?) approach to life and reality...:-)(chuckle)
  Qwark
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Cagsilposted 16 years ago
There is no 'title' for my belief or non-belief.

I follow NO religion whatsoever.

I reject all religions. Each has nothing to do with life.

If you seek spirituality, then I suggest you look inside yourself.

If you don't like what you see- then I suggest you CHANGE your attitude and way of thinking.

If you don't believe in yourself, then you will not be able to change anything about your life.

How ever, if you have the understanding that your life is your own, then you can realize that you can make whatever changes you decide.

If you can't realize that your life is your own or refuse to take responsibility for your thoughts and actions, then I would say that your view about life is skewed and wrong.

If you want to ask such questions of WHY does the human race lives? This question is too general to be answered based on the simple fact that people have individual thoughts and actions, and there is NO COLLECTIVE answer for the entire race. As each person can determine their own purpose, there is no collective purpose for mankind. Hence, that question is a question that never needs to be explained or answered.

How the Earth came? See science.

How the Universe came to be? See science.

Where did mankind come from? See science's uncompleted works.

Is Evolution a solid fact? Yes, Evolution is based on things mankind would eventually figure out or happen. The simple fact that YOU are walking around is proof of Evolution.

What proof? The Human Consciousness is solid proof of Evolution. Mankind was NOT always conscious of their existence. The leap from 'animal' instinctive living to human consciousness is proven fact of evolution.
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pylos26posted 16 years ago
For goodness sake!...all you bad bad people talking about precious jesus in such a bad bad manner…it just makes me ill ill ill…all you lugheads should be ashamed…and punished…in the name of jesus.

Pylos
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Dgerrimeaposted 16 years ago
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Cagsilposted 16 years ago
Are you two done?
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  qwarkposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  ..your turn Cagsil...lol
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Well, you can start?
  
  Where we going to begin?
  
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  qwarkposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Cagsil:
  You have the advantage. You have read my thoughts. I know nothing about you. Pick a subject. if you present it well, if your intellect piques my curiosity and the subject does the same, I'm always up for a "chat."
  Qwark
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  That's okay. I started talking to too many people in too many different forums.
  
  Lost track of all the ones I visited. That's why so long for the reply.
  
  Well, I not sure what to tell you. I'm a confident person who has discovered an unusual clarity about life. I don't see my kind of clarity in other people.
  
  I'm still working on that. An unanswered question, I have.
  
  Otherwise, I'm of no religious belief or affiliations. After 15 years as a catholic student, and many other years of research, I finally got questions I wanted answered, as pertaining to life. In my journey for answers- I was introduced to philosophers, science professors, guru's of all kinds, researchers and historians. I even learned more about the human being, the study of the body and mind.
  
  I have learned that each person has the same ability as me and can have the same clarity, and focus I have. I've learned to appreciate life, because once it's gone- it's over.
  
  There is no heaven, there is no hell, there is no satan, there is no god, there is no tooth-fairy, there is no santa clause.
  
  Sorry folks- it's just us lonely little human beings, on this huge rock called - EARTH!
  
  That's the reality of it.
  
  So, let's see where we go from here?
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  qwarkposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  cagsil:
  "There is no heaven, there is no hell, there is no satan, there is no god, there is no tooth-fairy, there is no santa clause." "I've learned to appreciate life, because once it's gone- it's over."
  Well said! That IS reality!
  Thank you.
  Qwark
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  And, if MORE people realized that their life evolves around living in reality, then they would realize that there is no life after death or a after-life, and would appreciate and value their individual life MORE than they do.
  
  Religion preaches that people are to have no pride. It preaches that mankind is no better than dirt.
  
  We(humans) are seen by religion as nothing better than animals, when in FACT we are superior to every animal on the planet, because WE(humans) evolved to consciousness.
  
  Mankind was NOT always a conscious individual. The Human Consciousness is proof of evolution exists.
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  qwarkposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  cagsil:
  Sorry, if you do not know that man IS an animal, ( a mammal,) there is no way we can chat "meaningfully."
  Your use of English leaves much to be desired.
  Qwark
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Cagsilposted 16 years ago
I sure it wouldn't considering you don't live life in reality 100% of the time.

I'm sure it would be really confusing.
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  ediggityposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah, I don't live life in reality. I'm not the one who is making things up to make a point, but I'm the one not living in reality. LOL, you kill me.
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  marinealways24posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Reality is what you believe it is.
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  ediggityposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Whatever you say. He brought it up not me.
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Reality exists free of independent thoughts, desires, will, or wishes. Reality is all knowable.
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  I'm not making up anything.
  
  Before you can FORM a belief? Or even think about forming a belief- you must have knowledge and understanding. If what you know is wrong or your understanding of what you know is wrong.
  
  Then your belief is wrong. That makes YOU wrong.
  
  It's actually quite simple.
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  ediggityposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Do you have knowledge and understanding of acoustic resonance frequencies? Do you believe the sound of a horn is loud when you hear it?
  
  It is actually quite simple.
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Cagsilposted 16 years ago
Can you say "stay on topic"?

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  ediggityposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  Do you have knowledge and understanding of acoustic resonance frequencies? Do you believe the sound of a horn is loud when you hear it?
  
  It is actually quite simple.
  
  That is quite relevant to the topic, but you don't understand it, so therefore according to you, you will never believe it. And if you ever did believe it, what you know would be wrong, because you have no knowledge or understanding of it (unless however you studied it and gained knowledge and understanding of it). So, what you know and believe about a horn being loud is wrong, because you have no knowledge or understanding of why or what makes it that way. Only myself and other individuals who understand harmonics actually believe a horn is loud.
  
  Again, you make things up to try and get your point across. In the end, I will take Webster, and my "belief" under your definition any day. LOL. Keep searching.....
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Denno66posted 16 years ago
Um, dude. Who stole my car?
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  
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  Denno66posted 16 years agoin reply to this
  You need to prove there is no afterlife before you say there isn't one. Psssst. Wanna buy a letter K?
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  Cagsilposted 16 years agoin reply to this
  
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  Denno66posted 16 years agoin reply to this
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Cagsilposted 16 years ago
Boy did this forum quiet all of a sudden.

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qwarkposted 16 years ago
There will be an execution tonite! I will rejoice at the "deletion" of a beastly member of the human species which proved itself to be worthy of "it's" Execution! I have written a "hub" on my feelings about punishment for the commitment of heinous and extremely offensive "capital" crimes.
Qwark
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qwarkposted 16 years ago
Have any of you thought seriously about what the purpose of "ALL" life on this planet is?
Qwark
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