That's up for you to decide not another, thought you were all about individuals and free thinking why would you need someone else to tell you what your beliefs are then...unless this is just another thread to stir up an argument.
I'm not aware of that. I have no title for my belief...as its been labeled 18 different things on these forums by theists and Atheists alike (Yes I've been counting) Here's a question for you. If what you believe explains what you need and gives you the answers you seek why can't that be enough? Why the need for titles and names, which ultimately only serve to categorize you and alienate you from others.
hi marine.....being atheist means you dont believe in a deity (GOD)..........but it doesnt mean to say you gonna believe the bible too, you can create your own world belief....and your own bible, as long as you follow kharma......
What does the bible have to do with your choice to form your own government. You have said many times that you are against any government, the bible means nothing to me, you are just not very consistent. Try again!
Webster isn't absolute either. Just words and definitions we use in attempts to explain conscious thought. So you aren't certain about your belief in the bible? You said you had faith in the bible. Is your faith not absolute and content?
I am certain, as supported by the widely accepted Webster definition. You and Cagsil should start your own dictionary. That way you can document, and receive credit for the stuff you make up. The search continues...
Sounds like you are onto something. I hope my "conscious or unconscious mind and faith" continue to steer me in the right direction. Good luck with your philosophies, someone besides you may actually believe them.
I love the way you like to make up your own definitions for things. Here, let merriam help you out:
Main Entry: be·lief Pronunciation: \bə-ˈlēf\ Function: noun Etymology: Middle English beleave, probably alteration of Old English gelēafa, from ge-, associative prefix + lēafa; akin to Old English lȳfan — more at believe Date: 12th century 1 : a state or habit of mind in which trust or confidence is placed in some person or thing 2 : something believed; especially : a tenet or body of tenets held by a group 3 : conviction of the truth of some statement or the reality of some being or phenomenon especially when based on examination of evidence synonyms belief, faith, credence, credit mean assent to the truth of something offered for acceptance. belief may or may not imply certitude in the believer <my belief that I had caught all the errors>. faith almost always implies certitude even where there is no evidence or proof <an unshakable faith in God>. credence suggests intellectual assent without implying anything about grounds for assent <a theory now given credence by scientists>. credit may imply assent on grounds other than direct proof <gave full credit to the statement of a reputable witness>. synonyms see in addition opinion
There is a very important part of that definition I would like you to pay attention to. it reads, "may or may not imply certitude"
No offense, but your Philosophy/definition of belief means nothing to me.
Why do you feel you need a title. You can be spiritual and not believe in everything the Bible says. Who wrote the bible....people wrote the bible, right. I don't believe everything that everyone says nor do I believe everything I read. it is what it is....is your new title....LOL
Humans being human = structures and rules. Define yourself and the "label" will come. Since humans are 90% water (or so we've been told by the water marketers), I vote for Scott's "Fluidity" However, believing in a diety and following your beliefs is usually called "spiritual".
The sad thing is, you know nothing as well!!! All you have are your silly biblical assumptions of absolute belief! If you opened your little mind to understanding absolutes, you would understand how little you know.
If could explain what you do believe, as well as/instead of what you don't believe, then we can decide on an appropriate title. Titles only matter when speaking to people with a lot of preconceptions, especially those unwilling to rethink their semantics.
The only thing I believe as absolute is my family because I choose to believe them absolute. This could be wrong as they and myself could be an illusion. So even that belief isn't completely absolute. However, I prefer them absolute!
You are an atheist because you lack belief in a personal god, and you are a sceptic because you are open minded, but require evidence before forming concrete beliefs.
I agree with you on everything except free will. If you define free will as lack of outside intervention into the decisions you make then I agree, but I wouldn't word it so generously. I believe free will to be a self contradictory idea.
lol Your title is wrong. If I ruled out the possibility of a creator, then I would be atheist. How did you come to your conclusive assumption? I don't have any concrete beliefs except for my family. There is no evidence that my family isn't an illusion. I simply have faith to believe in them. This does not make them absolute. I was created by my parents, it is logical to me for the possibility of a creator, not absolute. What do you mean free will as self contradictory, because we can die and lose free will at any given time?
By many people's definitions you would be an atheist because you lack belief in a creator. You don't have to rule it out to qualify for 'atheist'. Richard Dawkins doesn't rule out the possibility of a creator.
With regard to free will, the reason it is contradictory is because it requires both multiple possible outcomes and a consciousness to choose between them. These two things are never both true in the same instance.
If you admit to forming concrete beliefs despite lack of evidence then I retract my labelling of you as a sceptic.
Is it possible to have a concrete belief when not believing in absolutes? The dawkins example is a perfect example of how believers will generalize and class individuals together that don't believe the silly bible. I think believers feel that everyone that doesn't believe the bible must share a non belief since they themselves are belief dependent.
Whether you believe in absolutes or not, you will hold some beliefs more strongly than others. When I say 'concrete beliefs', you should read this as 'the strongest kinds of beliefs that you do/can hold'.
I realize that your own ego would not get high enough to reach godly status, per se, but why don't you get yourself a little bit more credit.
What your opinion of me and how I think is completely my doing. You want to see me in a negative aspect, go right ahead. You will be the one doing damage to your life.
Your negativity isn't for me to judge, but I would like to let you in on a little secret I learned a long time ago- never view anything in a negative aspect- it creates unwarranted stress on the body and ages you more quickly.
And, you know what- YOU are right- I don't deserve a 'god' in my life. I have control of my life and I live my life according to my upbringing, moral standard and a high value on life.
I do not NEED a 'god' in my life. I am doing just fine without him or it.
I couldn't agree more. I have tried to get marine to understand the things that HE says. I cant move forward with the subject until I correct his missuse of the words and their deffinitions that make up the english language.
but he is one of many. most of the time I ignore him and those like him, but sometimes I wonder if one of these are educating children right now... and I have to interject so that we don't get any dumber. But it really could be a full time job and it's hardly worth it.
Maybe your right, I do not find many people I dislike personally. I never bother with religion away from the forums. I get right up there about blockheads having a god that finds car keys for em though! The world needs better help than that from a god!
I am focused Sir. I am amused when the bible believers come in to assault any individual ideas or beliefs. They never fail, quite predictable like their book of belief.
This is what happens when they have absolute belief. They lose self awareness and accept contradictions through faith. Quite cultish. I also enjoy when they get emotional over their beliefs. Another flaw in absolute belief when it is driven by emotion.
That is why we must be water and let their attacks flow through us and keep on going, meanwhile our constant pressure will slowly erode the bedrock of their fragile hold on reality, water carved the grand canyon man. Be FLUID
Ever seen fire flow across a floor, there's nothing more Fluid, constantly changing and adapting to find more fuel. Fire is a living breathing thing. It's a beast that hunts and kills, it gives life to barren landscapes and empty forests. It creates by destroying, that's Fluid for sure.
I figured I should add an example to explain myself.
Take a serial rapist/killer that has lived a life of crime. What would an emotional punishment be? Most likely death.
I believe the emotions should be separated. I belive a logical decision would be to study this persons mind, psychology, upbringing to see where the parents and society went wrong in raising this person. If the person was put to death, we would learn nothing. If we studied the person, we could possibly limit future repeated crimes if we learned how they begin.
Believe is such a strong word, is it not true that if you believe in something you will do anything to defend it, even make up your own stuff just to prove a point? You'll probably even ignore evidence that's thrown in your face if you "believe" in something, maybe having an idea is better? I think it keeps you more open to reality and have better judgement=)
No, because it's not quite true. 'Atheist' and 'agnostic' have different meanings depending on who you are talking to. 'Agnostic' typically means either lack of knowledge, or denial of the possibility of knowledge. 'Atheist' typically means either lack of belief in gods, or belief that there are no gods.
Hi Dgerrimea: For many years I considered myself to be a "strong" atheist. I finally realized my "intellectual" mistake: there are no atheists. The "English" definition of atheist is: " One who denies the existence of god." One must be able to define, FACTUALLY, what this god thing is if one is to consider "it" as being anything other than an abstract concept conceived by the fancifull imagination of an incipient, fearful and superstitious human creature. There is no extant scripture that does that and, the English dictionary definition of "it" is vague and based soley upon opinion and conjecture. How can one deny the existence of "god" if "it" is unknown, unknowable, undefinable and incorporeal? One can only deny the imagined concept of it. There are no "atheists," only "atheistconcepts." Qwark
I never speak for others. "Stupid" is but dullness of mind. I speak from points backed by logic and reason. If one is "ignorant" and hasn't the intellectual acumen to visualize reality, then I can understand your response. Qwark
'How can one deny the existence of "god" if "it" is unknown, unknowable, undefinable and incorporeal? One can only deny the imagined concept of it. There are no "atheists," only "aconcepts." Qwark
Stating there are no atheist is speaking for others. I'm an Atheist, because I don't believe in God, or any god for the matter. Any person can deny God even if it's an incorporesal being. what we are denying as atheists in the idea of a God governing us. Creating us, looking after us, etc. I think we're capable of doing that ? It's not that we don't believe in concepts. Concepts are a fact, the moment a mind thinks about them. So we are not 'aconcepts'
That's why I said that if you didn't understand my answer ,you didn't understand your post. I think you got your 'concepts' all mixed up .
'Atheist' can also mean 'one who lacks a belief in gods'. This is a very common definition, and one under which one can be an atheist even without a definition for 'god'. However, even if you decide to define 'atheist' as 'one who denies the existence of gods', then only a vague definition for 'god' is needed because even a vague definition can be denied.
I am a native English speaking American. My English dictionary does not intimate that: " 'Atheist' can also mean 'one who lacks a belief in gods'(plural)." The word "god" is singular in the definition. If you'd like to consider "gods," their creation and purpose in the evolution of the human species, "they" have all been inspired by fear and superstition in the minds of an abjectly ignorant, infant species desperately trying to understand and survive. What makes one think that the 'god" of contemporary man has been created any differently? The vast majority of extant humanity, live life as it existed thousands of years ago. Science has progressed to the point of making ancient "gods" definable. Human sophistication has caused the "imagination" to create supernatural, abstract divinities which cannot be defined and only exist in the minds of the ignorant and easily led. Leaders of monotheistic movements understand this weakness in human nature and have taken full advantage of it, for many millenia, to gain and hold control and power over the multitudes. Logic and reason easily provide an attitude which denies "vague definitions." Qwark
It doesn't matter what the dictionary says about the meaning of 'atheist' because, contrary to popular belief, dictionaries don't define words. They are a guide to diction, and as a secondary function they provide a rough guide to the common usage of the word so that you know which word you're pronouncing. Words are defined by their usage. I'm not really sure what point you're trying to make by making that distinction, so take this as a general comment rather than a reply/rebuttal/argument/whatever.
...really? Dictionaries don't define words? Dang! Here I spent 6 college years wearing out the darn things! My profs never told me that it doeasn't matter what dictionaries say! I'm angry as hell! Here all the time I thought the dictionary was a reference book containing an alphabetical list of words, with information given for each word, usually including meaning, pronunciation, and etymology! Well, anyway, I got 2 graduate degrees before I met you on this forum, but it sure would'a been helpful if I could have met you before I wasted all that time money and hours studying the info in 'em...hey, it's never to late to learn! Thanks loads...:-) Qwark
I want to thank you profoundly(amen!) for the thoughtful(?), informative(?), knowledgeable(?) and well written(?) responses you provided. I hope others who are involved in this "format" read your comments and understand with clarity, the depth of your scholarly and erudite(?) approach to life and reality...:-)(chuckle) Qwark
I reject all religions. Each has nothing to do with life.
If you seek spirituality, then I suggest you look inside yourself.
If you don't like what you see- then I suggest you CHANGE your attitude and way of thinking.
If you don't believe in yourself, then you will not be able to change anything about your life.
How ever, if you have the understanding that your life is your own, then you can realize that you can make whatever changes you decide.
If you can't realize that your life is your own or refuse to take responsibility for your thoughts and actions, then I would say that your view about life is skewed and wrong.
If you want to ask such questions of WHY does the human race lives? This question is too general to be answered based on the simple fact that people have individual thoughts and actions, and there is NO COLLECTIVE answer for the entire race. As each person can determine their own purpose, there is no collective purpose for mankind. Hence, that question is a question that never needs to be explained or answered.
How the Earth came? See science.
How the Universe came to be? See science.
Where did mankind come from? See science's uncompleted works.
Is Evolution a solid fact? Yes, Evolution is based on things mankind would eventually figure out or happen. The simple fact that YOU are walking around is proof of Evolution.
What proof? The Human Consciousness is solid proof of Evolution. Mankind was NOT always conscious of their existence. The leap from 'animal' instinctive living to human consciousness is proven fact of evolution.
Cagsil: You have the advantage. You have read my thoughts. I know nothing about you. Pick a subject. if you present it well, if your intellect piques my curiosity and the subject does the same, I'm always up for a "chat." Qwark
That's okay. I started talking to too many people in too many different forums.
Lost track of all the ones I visited. That's why so long for the reply.
Well, I not sure what to tell you. I'm a confident person who has discovered an unusual clarity about life. I don't see my kind of clarity in other people.
I'm still working on that. An unanswered question, I have.
Otherwise, I'm of no religious belief or affiliations. After 15 years as a catholic student, and many other years of research, I finally got questions I wanted answered, as pertaining to life. In my journey for answers- I was introduced to philosophers, science professors, guru's of all kinds, researchers and historians. I even learned more about the human being, the study of the body and mind.
I have learned that each person has the same ability as me and can have the same clarity, and focus I have. I've learned to appreciate life, because once it's gone- it's over.
There is no heaven, there is no hell, there is no satan, there is no god, there is no tooth-fairy, there is no santa clause.
Sorry folks- it's just us lonely little human beings, on this huge rock called - EARTH!
cagsil: "There is no heaven, there is no hell, there is no satan, there is no god, there is no tooth-fairy, there is no santa clause." "I've learned to appreciate life, because once it's gone- it's over." Well said! That IS reality! Thank you. Qwark
And, if MORE people realized that their life evolves around living in reality, then they would realize that there is no life after death or a after-life, and would appreciate and value their individual life MORE than they do.
Religion preaches that people are to have no pride. It preaches that mankind is no better than dirt.
We(humans) are seen by religion as nothing better than animals, when in FACT we are superior to every animal on the planet, because WE(humans) evolved to consciousness.
Mankind was NOT always a conscious individual. The Human Consciousness is proof of evolution exists.
Do you have knowledge and understanding of acoustic resonance frequencies? Do you believe the sound of a horn is loud when you hear it?
It is actually quite simple.
That is quite relevant to the topic, but you don't understand it, so therefore according to you, you will never believe it. And if you ever did believe it, what you know would be wrong, because you have no knowledge or understanding of it (unless however you studied it and gained knowledge and understanding of it). So, what you know and believe about a horn being loud is wrong, because you have no knowledge or understanding of why or what makes it that way. Only myself and other individuals who understand harmonics actually believe a horn is loud.
Again, you make things up to try and get your point across. In the end, I will take Webster, and my "belief" under your definition any day. LOL. Keep searching.....
There will be an execution tonite! I will rejoice at the "deletion" of a beastly member of the human species which proved itself to be worthy of "it's" Execution! I have written a "hub" on my feelings about punishment for the commitment of heinous and extremely offensive "capital" crimes. Qwark
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