Is someone allowed to attack you by writing a hub about you

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   Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years ago

   I think I reported an article to Hubpages at the time it was written because it was a personal attack - and it was never removed. I'm not quite sure why. Perhaps it went missing in the action.
   
   However, it has just been brought to my attention.
   
   The hub's name is "Dedicated to the most negative woman on Hubpages!"
   
   Is this kind of thing permitted on HubPages? It's an Ad Hominem attack and I had a valid point on what she had written!

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      Marisa Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      How did you report it?  The only way that works is flagging - if you send them an email it doesn't seem to work.
      
      It's interesting that the Hub about making millions was written more than six months ago - I wonder if she's made her million yet?

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         lyndreposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         

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         Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Marisa, she also said that she was going to write 100 hubs in the next 30 days. She's written 74 in total.

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2. 61

   CASE1WORKERposted 12 years ago

   I flagged it on the basis that since it was written HP have introduced new flagging rules and it may offend one ( or maybe even two)
   I do actually agree telling people you can make a $ million on HP in six months is not a constructive pass time.

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      Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      thanks. Appreciated.

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3. 82

   Mark Ewbieposted 12 years ago

   I was flattered by this...
   
   http://suzettenaples.hubpages.com/hub/C … Mark-Ewbie
   
   
   ... but please don't flag it.
   
   All publicity is good publicity, as far as my particular brand of, er, quality writing is concerned.
   
   Seriously. Do not flag it.  I'm cool with it.

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      WriteAngledposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      This amuses me, because the title is "a poem dedicated to Mark Ewbie",
      
      but I don't see a poem there :frown:

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      FloraBreenRobisonposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Yes, the nature of why suzette wrote it was totally different and you can tell by reading it. But the hub Sophia means is an attack, not an appeal to her to stop attacking new poets.

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   Cassie Smithposted 12 years ago

   I'm not sure how it was a personal attack.  You made a negative comment on her hub.  She wrote about what an unsupportive comment it was.  You were trying to tell her the goal was unrealistic and she didn't appreciate it.  It's a disagreement. You shouldn't let it bother you, if anything people might want to read your hubs.

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      psycheskinnerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I think a personal insult is more than a disagreement.  It just makes Hubpages look like a school playground.

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         Cassie Smithposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Sophia Angelique did comment that she was dreaming.  Not exactly tactful and not at all supportive.  In fact someone would think it could be insulting.  By the way, intriguewriter on her hub said that she was taking up the challenge to earn a million dollars in a variety of writing ways in six months, not just hubbing.

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            Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Cassie, you grew up in a culture where 'being supportive' is something of a holy grail.   There is no reason for me to be supportive of an article in which she was encouraging people to buy into a scheme (I suspect it was network marketing) that was going to make her a millionaire. The piece of writing was on Xomba - not on hub pages.
            
            She changed her tune as a result of what I said to her and changed it into writing. None of what she said had any substance and would seriously have misled many.
            
            Do you think enough people in the world have been misled by the powers that be?
            
            Why is there an ethical obligation to be supportive of people who are misleading others?

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               Marisa Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Aha!  I thought it sounded very much like she was getting around to promoting some get-rich-quick scheme.

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               Cassie Smithposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Well Sophia, you don't have to be supportive of anyone and ethics has nothing to do with it.  Just as no one has to be supportive of you in your endeavors.  However, if you are going to make a negative statement, be prepared when people say something about it, which the hubber did.  I don't see her hub as a personal attack on you.  You're just upset that she called you the most negative person on hubpages.  If you can't take it don't dish it out.

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                  Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  Cassie, let me be quite clear about this. I am not in the least upset. I think it's a bad thing for other reasons. She is not the type of person that I could ever take seriously. However, I was not going to sit by while she led a whole lot of people up the garden path. That would be unethical.
                  
                  With regard to it having nothing to do with ethics, I can only think you don't understand what ethics are. Every single decision made in the entire world, from the moment you get up to the moment you go to sleep, is either ethical or not. Ethical means that the action will not harm anyone else. Unethical means it will.
                  
                  Of course it is a personal attack on me. She didn't say, "That is the most negative remark." She said, "That is the most negative person."
                  
                  There is a name for this kind of thing. It is called an Ad Hominem attack. It is considered an acceptable form of behavior and you can read elsewhere where I speak about it.

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                     Cassie Smithposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                     Well for someone who's not upset you're making a big stink about it.

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                        IzzyMposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                        She wasn't actually. I think she started this thread because she was surprised to find this attacking hub still there. Not just with an attack but the hub was purely personal and when we have just lost a well-loved hubber we wonder why this hub has been allowed to stay up.
                        
                        But then you came along with comments about how it wasn't a personal attack, in your opinion. That of course brought others in to agree or disagree.

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                        Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                        Cassie, no, I came to the 'report a problem'page, and asked a question, "Was this kind of thing permitted on hub pages?" I actually wanted a response because I had been thinking about writing a particular article for some time - and this was the perfect example. I've just written it!

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                  Uninvited Writerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  Writing a hub attacking a Hubber is completely against the site's TOS and I can guarantee you it will be removed. If the person did not like the comment she could have said so on the hub the comment appeared on.

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      Marisa Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      It was a personal attack because she used the title of the Hub to call Sophie "the most negative woman on HubPages". 
      
      If she'd expressed that opinion as part of a larger Hub,that would be one thing, but to make that opinion the focus of an entire Hub - that's rude.

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         Cassie Smithposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Anyone who read that would know it was an opinion piece, who would think that is factual?  And as for being rude, so was Sophia Angelique.

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   paradigmsearchposted 12 years ago

   Can anybody recommend a hubber I can attack? The only requirement is that the hub will generate lots of hpads views.

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      Pcunixposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Attack me.  You'll get lots of laudatory comments.

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         paradigmsearchposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Alas, "pcunix" only gets 110 global searches a month.
         
         I get all of 22.
         
         Paul E. only gets 1000.
         
         Donald Duck [exact] gets 201,000.
         
         What a town...

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         WriteAngledposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         *attack* *attack* *all guns blazing* *target: PCUnix"
         
         laudatory comments to WriteAngled please

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   Pcunixposted 12 years ago

   Maybe I'm missing something, but I woudnt think that was an attack.  I wouldn't even be insulted. She said one thing silly, you said so, she says you are negative.
   
   Umm, a person who thinks they are going to make a million dollars here in 6 months thinks you are negative?  Her opinions lack much credibility.
   
   Has she said how  that is working out?

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   LoriSoardposted 12 years ago

   Personally, I would ignore it. She'll likely just increase your traffic and some of those people will read your hubs and follow you. I know negativity hurts, but there is something to be said for publicity. One time a review completely TRASHED one of my books. I sold more copies of that book after that review than after any positive review. I guess people wanted to see if what she said was true. Whatever the guess, I gained new fans from it and proved her wrong in the end without ever having to say a word to her.

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      Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      LoriSoard, that is funny. However, I have raised this for a reason. There are far too many Ad Hominem attacks taking place these days. It has carried right through to our political system.
      
      Ad Hominem attacks mean that someone attacks the character of a person because they cannot negate what is being said.

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   rachellrobinsonposted 12 years ago

   I have read hubs that attacked my writing. The think is like Mark said, these hubs only give you more attention and when it comes to getting your writing noticed any attention is good. Perhaps Sophia you should take on Mark's tact and apologize to her for what you wrote, it is clear that your comment hurt her and really is that what we want to hurt other people. If you do not think making a million in six months is possible that is alright but to tell other people they cannot do it is kind of a mean thing to say and really like she said not at all supportive.

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      Marisa Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      So, Rachel, if you wrote a Hub saying your friend made a million dollars in six months on some internet scheme so you will too, what would you prefer me to say?
      
      Be "supportive" and say, "Yeah, go for it!"?  Or be realistic and say, "Er, I think your friend may have told you a lie." 
      
      That's all Sophia did.  Perhaps she could have phrased it more kindly, but she did explain things more clearly in a follow-up comment.  The Hub owner answered her adequately in the comments on the original Hub - to write another Hub purely to bash Sophia was totally unnecessary and attention-seeking.

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      Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      RachelRobinson, my traffic is 98% organic. I get very little hubpages traffic. Not the kind of traffic I want, anyway. I have no issue with her saying that the remark is the most negative that anyone has ever made to her. However, she has used an ad hominem attack - not dealing with he criticism, but attacking the character of the person because she is unable to deal with the criticism.

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   Mark Ewbieposted 12 years ago

   Having read the most negative woman thing I will say it is purely personal, infinitely boring and yes an attack.
   
   A comment is one thing.  A whole article in a hissy fit?  Quite another.
   
   I'm with Sophia on this. 
   
   As for my little upset.  Well, I kind of deserved it and for me, seriously, it is good publicity.
   
   One other thing.  I particularly hate the crowds of smiley people who suddenly turn into rabid monsters when someone from outside the crowd dares to speak out of turn.  It is then that they show their true face - in my opinion.

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      Cassie Smithposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Yeah, that happens too often on the forums as well. C'est la vie.

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      Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Thank you, Mark.

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    Muldaniaposted 12 years ago

    Peronal attacks are unnecessary.  I believe it is acceptable to criticise someone's opinions, especially if they are bigoted.  However, even then, this should not extend to an attack on the person.

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       Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       Thank you, Muldania. The name for this is an Ad Hominem attack. It means it's an attempt to negate something said by attacking the character of the person who has said it. It's lame, it's unethical, and it shouldn't be permitted.

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    Aficionadaposted 12 years ago

    At the same time, why bring anyone's attention to that article?  I can imagine it may have received more traffic in the past three hours than it had over the previous eleven months.  It could have fizzled into obscurity, just as so many other Hubs do.  How would anyone stumble across it without some form of promotion?
    
    EDIT: "anyone - other than HubPages staff"

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       FloraBreenRobisonposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       This is quite true. A sad commentary, but yes this will increase the traffic.

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       Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       Aficionada, Because someone found it on the web through google when searching for me. And THAT is not acceptable. That might have been a client. It is an Ad Hominem attack, i.e. an attack made on the character of a person because the person cannot deal with the criticism.

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12. 0

    Home Girlposted 12 years ago

    Attack me. I'll laugh at you.
    I think,Sophia,you should not pay any attention at all. There is no such thing as totaly black and completely lily-white when you are talking about people. It's just our opinion. We all have our negative and positive features. We all creatures of mood,circumstances,habits,weather,upbringing, what not. When my boss (one of them) is upset, she throws whatever she has in her hands at wall and swears like a gangster. The trick is to keep straight face and pretend that it's how people behave normally, that nothing is going on.
    If people write about you - you are a celebrity, enjoy it
    Remember, what people were saying about late M.Jackson? Exactly! That's my point. Joke aside - you think somebody is all bad - look into the mirror and be fair.

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       Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       So, Home Girl, in the years of my education I was taught that one dealt with the accusation and one didn't shoot the messenger. She could have negated what I said. She did not have any ethical right to attack my character.
       
       Then, again, this is America.  I notice that politicians attack the characters of other politicians, instead of dealing with the actual questions asked, or the situation by offering an explanation.
       
       She used an Ad Hominem attack.
       http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem
       
       An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man" or "to the person"), short for argumentum ad hominem, is an attempt to negate the truth of a claim by pointing out a negative characteristic or belief of the person supporting it.[1] Ad hominem reasoning is normally described as a logical fallacy

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    sunforgedposted 12 years ago

    Im not sure that discussing Sophie should be grounds for removal. As Authors in the World Wide Web we are open to public critique. It might be childish and strange but that aspect of it shouldnt be something that HP regulates.
    
    What if product owner XYZ didnt like your stated experience or Facebook didnt like your anti-change hub etc. etc.. its not a good trend to start
    
    
    hmmm ... but I do see it as a purely personal piece of drivel. I dont think it fits under the "make money" category either.
    
    Is there a "whiny bleat" category :p
    
    
    Im sure someone flagged after this forum post and its days are numbered

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       Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       There's a difference between saying it was a negative remark and disparaging my character. This is called shooting the messenger and not dealing with the message. It's setting a precedent. Where does one draw the line. And does hubpages permit it???

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    paradigmsearchposted 12 years ago

    Hey, folks! Have you plugged your username into the HP search tool at upper-right recently? You just might discover you have friends you never knew of. After the initial search, refine to hubs only.

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    FloraBreenRobisonposted 12 years ago

    She even says that she has not bothered to read Sophia's profile and knows nothing about her. But she will single her out anyway. Why not talk about people who leave negative comments in general?

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    paradigmsearchposted 12 years ago

    Please! Someone attack me! But only in a nice way...

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    rebekahELLEposted 12 years ago

    There are 6,987,012,258 people in the world, don't let one ruin your day. Post a comment on her hub and invite others to read your hubs.

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       Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       RebekahELLE. Somehow I sneaked this question into this thread because I thought everybody hung out at the hangout thread... I thought it was done when Case1Worker answered the question. But it's been interesting...

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    WhoBeYouBeposted 12 years ago

    You should be honored that you impress them so.
    
    And if you are really liked, they will create an entire thread, multiple threads even, attacking you... complete with your name in the titles.
    
    Then you know you are really loved.

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       Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       WhoBeYouBe. Loved????? Good Grief I'm as confused as Charlie Brown on this one!

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          WhoBeYouBeposted 12 years agoin reply to this

          The term "loved" is sarcastically used here... but the rest of the statement is 100% pure fact.
          
          I have seen whole threads started on here just for the sake of attacking certain individual(s) on here.

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             Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

             I guess I must live in another world. I would much rather write articles that challenge people to think about issues!

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    Kangaroo_Jaseposted 12 years ago

    Sophia,
    
    I have, in the interest of my own sanity seen comments about me on the Internet that I may deem as an attack against me.
    
    My reputation is intact as it is known by MY deeds and actions, not by the deeds and actions of others.
    
    I also verbally exclaim at a computer screen for that individual to go 'fornicate individually' so I personally take action by releasing my tension by that exclamation.
    
    It is a different world out there and I feel sometimes the asylum is overcrowded.

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       Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       Kangaroo_Jase. Oh, I've now written a hub on Ad Hominem attacks and next time someone does something like this, I will refer them to it. Problem solved!

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