President Obama again demonstrated his considerable ability to speak persuasively. His advocacy of his health care proposals was powerful and convincing, in my opinion. He explained the details of his proposals, the reasons for them and the way they will work. And he debunked the lies that have been circulating about health care reform proposals. He provided practical and moral reasons for supporting his proposals.
Oh, that's right, it's a health care reform/Obama thread. Well, there are two key points that jump to mind, to wit:
1. Yes, the man is an awesome speaker. That ability clearly had much to do with getting him to the Oval Office in the first place.
2. Whether he realizes it or not, putting limits on private insurance companies such as not allowing them to deny coverage for preexisting conditions, not allowing coverage caps, etc., definitely WILL produce government-only insurance in fairly short order. There isn't an insurance company on the planet--greedy or not, and I don't dispute the greed factor--that can survive hits like that. Net result: Private companies go broke, government coverage becomes the Last Plan Standing.
My qualifications to Comment: Twelve years professionally as a commercial insurance underwriter--yeah, folks, I wore pinstriped suits and neckties, believe it or not.
I am far, far less qualified than you concerning insurance, but I would ask what you think of the current Medicare/private insurance options available for seniors. I believe that IS a mix of both public and private options, correct?
The thing is...insurance companies in Canada still make huge profits...some people buy extra health insurance like those who do not have coverage through work (I had to buy dental insurance when I had a job that did not cover it)
No but we don't want it to be all one side speaking. I do believe we are fighting for the soul and character of our country. Don't want people to think everyone's against Obama and his plan. He's doing what the majority elected him to do.
However i do agree with Lrohner on many things...now turning from CNN to Criminal Minds.
The hard core 'haters' and those who just don't care and are not political won't change, but I have seen a few people influenced, .
Anyway, politically speaking, Obama did very well. A back to campaign-level speech. How anyone can say the man is not eloquent and needs a teleprompter is beyond me. He is possibly the best spoken president we've had (or at least that I can remember).
He also continues to reach out to Republicans of common sense...who want to solve problems, not hog the media spotlight with outrageous fear-based vitriol.
Rep. Wilson of South Carolina (R) is the heckler (lol...just in!).
Don't they have rules in Congress against that kind of thing? I'm never heard a President be heckled there before. I know some people did not applaud Bush at times but I don't recall anyone heckling him.
Uninvited, I'm not disbelieving you--I'm sure you're only reporting accurately what you've read. I'm disbelieving what's been reported, though. Example: Take a few terminal cancer cases with no cap, multiply those few times multimillion dollar treatment costs, and you can run even a large company into the ground in short order.
Unless Canadian doctors and hospitals provide such things for free as a public service.... Philanthropists one and all...?
Bottom line there is that I'm not a fan of Medicare, either. I'm 65 and qualified but not a member and don't intend to be. Have no health care coverage and am considerably irritated about Obama's plan to tax me for not having any--especially since I don't go to Emergency Rooms, either. (Did once, back in my rodeo days, but paid cash for the visit--did not go there as an indigent.)
I also consider it highly unlikely that increasing health care will avoid increasing the deficit. Obama can talk about how improving efficiency can save enough to pay for the whole thing, but talk is cheap. Or in his case, exorbitantly expensive.
The Republicans didn't help themselves much, sitting on their hands and scowling, except for John McCain who came through with a big smile when Obama endorsed one of his campaign proposals. Congressman Joe Wilson didn't help their cause by shouting from the crowd at Obama, "That's a lie," when Obama denied that his proposal provided coverage for illegal aliens. Neither did the GOP congressman from Louisiana, Charles Boustany, who is a Birther who responded to a scam offering a British title of Lord in return for cash according to Kieth Olberman.
What happened to respect for the Office of the President? It reminds me of the time back in the 80's when I went to my daughter's high school talent show. The principal came out and the kids starting booing! I couldn't believe the lack of respect!
It is interesting that the conservatives always point to Clinton as the President who committed the worst sins of all because of his affair with Monica. Yet, so many conservatives have been taken down for similar trists including with young men. In California, a Right Wing Republican was caught on tape talking about his affairs during a committee hearing.
Yet, I have to be consistent, I thought it was personal issues with Clinton, and so I think the same for any of the Republicans who go through the same thing.
But in terms of disrespect for the President, I think "I am not a crook", "we did not trade arms for hostages" and George W. Bush in general did much to cause it. Clinton helped as well, but please remember that out of the last forty years, Democrats have held the office twelve of those years. Obama will make 16 out of 44.
Well I DVR'd the speech and watched until I knew I couldn't take anymore, what I got was the government will force us to have a health insurance plan or pay a tax/fine, More Government interference in a free peoples lives!
Government will dictate to private companies how they can run their business, more government control over industry!
I didn't vote for Obama, but nights like this make me wish I had. He shows great leadership skills at every opportunity and doesn't forget he's the President of all Americans, even the wackos who shout slanderous statements at him from the cheap seats.
There was only one public appearance I ever saw that I felt was off--that was with the Flu 'epidemic' speech segueing into concerns about the economy. HE did not write it--apparent. And it was poorly done...I felt a cover.
You can seriously tell with Obama when his thoughts/feelings are behind his words--a good thing. Clinton, ie, was always very practiced.
Sure great speech making skills, nobody ever said he couldn't read what someone else wrote. He has the Al Gore talent of telling sad stories and almost makes you believe he is sincere, I especially liked the "Chappaquiddick Teddy" remembrance moment.
My favorite part was when he reminded us that in 1965 some believed medicare would lead to a government takeover of health care, uhhhhhhhhh, that is what it is leading to, just because it took 44 years doesn't mean it ain't happening.
I'm sure the Obamabots are just giddy with his speech, too bad we have to pay through the nose for one mans legacy!
Arizonans can't vote for Alaska's governor. Alaska, as far as I know, has 0 nuclear weapons. Most of her damage was confined to the environment. It could have been much worse. What's the tally for her latest legal bills?
No but Arizonans can vote for a Presidential ticket with the Governor of Alaska attached, her legal bills have anything to do with her governance before the media BS and the liberal attack dogs? The environment is just fine, you bought into the global warming too? Whatever happened to the global cooling scam from the 70's? Kool-Aid anyone?
Haha... This just in. The Democratic opposition of the Republican heckler from South Carolina has just made $42,000 in support money. Is website is being flooded with donations!
Ooooo, that screaming was a bad move. He may have a beer with the Pres, but he won't be re-elected. See, ya'll? Glenn Beckisms just don't work in real life so much... Even if you think you are 'witty' doing so on hubpage forums.
What nobody seems to realize is that the ONLY times a president addresses congress is 1) in a time of war and 2) the state of the union address. NO president has ever addressed congress over their "pet" bill. Which only shows, in even more stark relief, how little support he has over it.
And Joe Wilson is the only one with any balls in that whole room.
Ah, but you're wrong there. He whose true name I am now forbidden to speak is like the punching bag I always wanted as a child but never got. You've got to be a fan of anyone who can keep taking those beatings and come back for more.
Overall, I thought Obama's address on healthcare was well spoken and well received. He is obviously trying hard to pull everyone together rather than discounting worthy opposition. I, too, LOVED when he said those who spread lies and fear will be called out! Woo hoo!
It appeared that on many of his points both Democrats and Republicans stood and clapped. He even managed a standing ovation from the Republicans only on the subject of reforms aimed at malpractice suits.
After his careful laying out of all the REAL points in his plan and debunking the myths, I believe you'd have to be either a mule or an ostrich to oppose it.
The speech was a mistake. The defiant, partisan tone, the generalisms with no details and no explanaitons of contradiction are not likely to win anyone to his side who wasn't there before the speech. Poll numbers will fall within a week.
Individuals would be required to carry basic health insurance. Those who can't afford it would get a hardship waiver.
_Businesses would be required to offer their workers health care or chip in to help cover the cost. Ninety-five percent of small businesses would be exempt because of their size and narrow profit margin.
_Medical malpractice reform is not a "silver bullet," but practicing "defensive medicine" can lead to unnecessary costs; demonstration projects will be reviewed to see what changes to medical malpractice insurance would work best.
_It would be against the law for insurance companies to deny coverage because of a pre-existing condition.
_Promised to protect Medicare and reassured the elderly that Medicare funds would not be used to overhaul health care.
_A public option, or alternative to private insurance, needs to be available to the uninsured to "keep insurance companies honest."
_The public option would not be subsidized by taxpayers, but would be self-sufficient and rely on the premiums it collects; the Congressional Budget Office estimates that fewer than 5 percent of Americans would sign up.
Still, when in Congress you should show a modicum of respect for the system you obviously support or you would not be a congressman. I'm sure there are all sorts of procedures dealing with things like that. He was quite able to voice his opposition before or after the speech.
He spoke fluently and clearly clarifying any rumors or lies I also noticed that the some of the Republicans were quite shrewd and it appeared to me that they acted like small children were they not supposed to be representing there states? One party yelled out liar only chidlren seem to do this to gain attention personally he should have kept his childish yapper shut.
Blue dog....Joe Wilson has balls...HHMM...I thought he was actually a eunuch that strapped on a pair of titanium balls to overshadow the presidents true intentions.....Republican idealogue is old hat, and it seems your hat wreakes of blood for oil dripping down your face like a cream pie melting in the dark breeze of war mongering and proliferating more of the same OLD HAT Idealogue. Educate us on the "NEW WORLD ORDER"....PLEEEZZZ
I had questions that weren't answered by the speech.
1) 'Affordable' is a relative term. What I consider affordable might not be the same as what John McCain or Barack Obama consider affordable. If I'm going to be required to purchase private health insurance, I want to know what that's going to get me and how much it will cost, like, a dollar number. When I was still at the bank my share of the insurance cost was $50 a week in premiums--that was for a $2500 deductible and 80/20 after that. A SINGLE trip to the ER left me with over $5,000 in bills AFTER insurance paid. I don't want to pay a penny for another such policy, but if its going to cost me hundreds per month, I might as well leave the country now.
2) If I can't afford it I'll get a tax credit? Hello? That helps me how exactly? I have to wait an entire year for that. Insurance premiums are due monthly.
3) Malpractice litigation reform. Rilly? I live in Michigan. When No Fault insurance was instituted to keep the courts from clogging with liability lawsuits, it was supposed to save the state and its residents a ton of money. Now, (partly because of health care costs), those cost are absorbed by the state and its citizens. So the insurance companies are protected, and we have some of the most expensive auto insurance in the state. I'm not convinced that blocking or limiting malpractice insurance will bring MY costs down. I think it'll protect doctors and insurance companies and taxpayers will absorb those costs, just like happened with No Fault.
4) This country is NOT full of wonderful people who do the right thing when called upon. There is a fairly huge asshole contingent in the U.S. and it's growing. Lots of people care about themselves, period, and not just that, they're proud of it. Mean and stupid and proud.
5) I see nothing good on the horizon. I'm sorry, I just don't. Jobs are not coming back. This 'jobless recovery' will be at least 5 years bumping along the bottom. Michigan is $3.5 BILLION in the hole for 2010.
I'm really sick of the health care debate. Really, really sick of it. I have the sinking sense that this will just end up being a HUGE giveaway to the insurance companies who caused this mess in the first place.
I know that was his point, and the point is taken, believe me, but I'm down to WIIFM now and all I'm saying is, we're stretched to the breaking point in this household already. I've taken a big hit in pay, I don't have $400 or $500 or $800 or whatever to fork over to a private insurance company each month. You can't get blood out of a stone.
Wow, Pam... Here you come in being all articulate. lol
Well, I do not think it is as bad as all that. Things will get better. And are getting better...just slowly. The speech was aimed to clear up some misconceptions and unite. To that end, I feel it was a success.
PGrundy states (4) "This country is NOT full of wonderful people who do the right thing when called upon. There is a fairly huge asshole contingent in the U.S. and it's growing. Lots of people care about themselves, period, and not just that, they're proud of it. Mean and stupid and proud."
i think the President should act like a president and ignore his detractors. obviously they must have some power or why would he bother? having a throwdown during a speech to Congress about a completely different topic just seemed kind of odd to me...
i also thought the time for getting mileage from Teddy Kennedy should be past now...i mean all that's left are fumes at this point.
I'm from Canada and boy oh boy you Americans are in for "change" that's for sure.
If this health care goes through your economy may bring ours which is fine right now, down with your economy.
We kicked our liberal socialists out of office 2 years ago. Thank God. Sorry I mentioned Him.lol
Listen I love Americans.I have to, you protect us , but I still can't believe this wonderful speaking ,saying nothing, smooth community organizer is your President. This guy has the ability to look you in the eye and shoot you. Pretty cold dude for sure.
He has you folks believing that the government is the answer. Show me where and when any government has been able to run anything without f---- it up.
Look north Americans.Find out the truth about government run health care. Right now they have almost succeeded in killing my sister in law. She has 2 months left because she waits and waits at one of the best hospitals in the world in Toronto to get treated for her cancer.Just to finish her off financially they now have her paying HER MONEY at the tune of $3000 monthly for drugs that will kill her more slowly. Did you get that? Everything cannot be covered.It is simple not affordable. They killed my aunt 10 years ago. She went to the U.S. after it was too late. They went broke trying to save her too.My uncle went back to work after retiring at 47 and set financially. He was 65 and is now 74 and still working.It's sad.
You know George Bush was not the sharpest knife in the drawer but you knew where he stood. I liked his directness.
This Obama is simply a liar and and way too arrogant. Last but not least he is a complete marxist without a doubt.Left of Castro who is one of his heroes it seems.
This guy is only about one thing and that is control of as much of your life as he can get away with.Marxism to a tee.
When will he stop blaming George Bush for your country's ills?
What do you call your $1 coins? You're the first Canadian I've heard say anything that looney. I thought all the wing nuts were on this side of the border. Obama is a moderate democrat and a strong supporter of our democratic, free enterprise system. He is trying his best to save it from self-destructing as a result of the unfettered greed of the Wall Street banksters, the for profit health insurance and drug companies and so forth. And he believes the government should be concerned for the needs of the people it is supposed to be representing.
Duck, I was born at St Davids in Austin, live in Round Rock! Had a girlfriend from Spring once, but have never lived in Houston, you do what you think you need to but claiming something that isn't true just makes you more of a liar!
1. ATexan, I have never held myself out as a heart surgeon -- or a rocket scientist. My point is that the Republicans are on the wrong side of this issue. Obstructing healthcare reform is not going to be tolerated. Obama is reaching across the aisles and asking for constructive ideas to shape the legislation.
I would have thought that "you" could find a more credible spokesperson for "your" side is all.
2. Uh oh. The "l" word is now on the table. There's only one place for this line of argument to go from here. And you all know what it is:
Liar, liar, PANTS ON FIRE!!
Which will inevitably lead back to a discussion of balls -- who has them, who doesn't, and who owns whose
You may find this hard to believe but nobody consulted me about who would give the rebuttal. The L wird is directed at Duck because he is under the mistaken impression that I am someone else, I suggested he tweak his IP tracker, what else can I do.
If Obama had been right about any of his economic predictions then maybe I would give this public option a chance, but he has been wrong time and again. I can't get behind this!
A Texan, There's a difference between lying -- which implies malicious intent -- and being mistaken. If Blue Dog is incorrect in believing you and Manlypoetryman are the same person, then it's an honest mistake. I could see perhaps chiding him for insufficient research or jumping to false conclusions. But calling him a "liar"??? That term does not fit the circumstances.
As to Obama's public option. As long as you can keep your current coverage and it will not be impacted, where is the harm in making a public option available? There are many, many people in this country who are unable to get coverage through the private health insurance companies. If these people are able to be covered by a public option then the risk is spread wider (with fewer uninsured receiving services but the cost shifting to the insured). Net result? Everyone's costs go down. Why can't you get behind something that has no downside? Unless you are the president of an insurance company unbenownst to us (and please do NOT call me a "liar" if that is not true!)
Have you read any of this about Manlypoetryman? He is under the wrong impression but he certainly thinks he can cause some damage to me by his false claims, that would imply malicious intent, but whatever he chooses to do.
No I am not the president of an Insurance company, this is about numbers, if an employer is paying into an insurance plan at say 9% of his profits and the penalty is only 8% then why carry the insurance? The employee will just go to a public option, thats the problem. It puts Insurance Companies at risk of failure if a tax subsidized plan is there.
as i just posted elsewhere, take your white flag and shove it. your ongoing hostilities toward ryan and several others here are meager attempts at hiding your own cowardice. your special skills and special talents are false bravado. your racist views can only be concealed through the use of fake and false identities. you are nothing but a little person. i repeat: a natural born loser. quite manly of you.
I love this - it seems that we have time traveled back to the Civil War - also, the very people who hate the liberals and the progressives and buy in to the right wing propaganda, are the same people that are in desperate need of health care - both physically and mentally.
There is a hint of capitalism and communism in this proposed healthcare system. Ergo,if adopted, USA will have a socialistic healthcare system, which defies the true and humane principle of providing total healthcare to the people. But no matter what we say, it will be done.
I simply do not understand why people are fighting health care reform. I have heard the arguments against it and I keep saying how is that worse than being held hostage by the insurance companies? My insurance cost...
I simply do not understand why people are fighting health care reform. I have heard the arguments against it and I keep saying how is that worse than being held hostage by the insurance companies? My insurance cost...
http://www.marketwire.com/press-release … 303313.htmAn independent study of compliant and non- compliant insurance companies has found that compliance with the new health care reform laws could lead to bankruptcy...
I'm not going to lie - I have some pretty serious issues with the health care reform bill that just passed, not the least being that it is not NEARLY socialist enough for my tastes. (I support Medicare for All, at least...